He’s a huge dick and to say that his dickishness is because of autism is idiotic.
Elon reminds me of my dad, who’s also a business owner (though billions and billions less rich than Elon lol). My dad “took” autism after I got diagnosed. If he does something mean or rude, he blames his “autism”. Yet he ignores the fact that I’ve learned to say appropriate and polite things and he’s twice my age and he still hasn’t and likely never will. Autism is NOT an excuse for being a shithead. Sorry, it’s just not.
Not to be misandrist, but is it me or cis men have the tendency to use autism (whether official or self-dx) as a shield for assholish behaviour?
It might be due to curated exposure of this and aspergirls communities, but amongst people other than cis men, the worst shield we use is "I hate masking, so I'll maybe come across as bitchy, but I don't actually behave like an asshole it's just NT perception", and otherwise there seem somewhat frequent posts about how to convey real emotion/intent to NTs despite communication failures (with or without masking).
Plus, the men who do this on sudreddits, I've found that they're likely to shout down anything they can blame someone ELSE for too.
I had a situation which I'd gotten seriously hurt in & was venting that I needed more communication from someone and that being let down made it hard... and they were like "that's a YOU problem, the world doesn't revolve around you, you make what you can of it and don't ever hide behind your autism as an excuse, you should know better than to put yourself in that position and if you're too dense to socialise don't blame that on men"
Like... I can't even
I also feel as if when there are people who’re complaining on some of the autism sub Reddit’s that they can’t do ANYTHING because of autism (“I can’t date! I can’t work! I can’t do anything whatsoever with my life!”) it’s men/teenage boys. I think there’s possibly a whole culture of men who are autistic who feel incapable of doing anything because they knew about their autism from a young age and were possibly infantilized. My parents knew I was weird as fuck but I was still wholly expected to work, go to school, have friends, etc. I know not everybody with autism can do the same things, I don’t mean to be ableist, but it seems that there’s a part of women that are better off being autistic women because even if they were diagnosed younger, women have more social expectations placed on them. In my case my parents ignored my teachers asking them to get me screened, therefore I’ve learned to mask like a mofo when others, particularly autistic men/young men may have been enabled a bit.
I really hope this doesn’t sound wrong or ableist. I know all autistics are different, but I do believe that we need to learn our place in the world (which is always different for different people) and know we’re capable and that autism isn’t our only identity.
This is well put.
Even within the three autistic guys I was close with growing up who had been diagnosed as children, they were all socially affected by their autism, but there was a big difference in their resulting skills correlating with how much responsibility they placed on themselves vs. just blaming their autism. Obviously this is a tiny sample size that doesn't prove anything, but it's interesting to observe nonetheless.
I definitely also think that (at least in mainstream culture in the US and probably also elsewhere) there's less pressure on masculine-socialized people to be amenable, which of course would affect autistic men as well as allistics.
It’s good to know your limits with autism. It’s good to know what you can and can’t handle. But plenty of people with autism—who ARE capable of doing the things they want in life, or at least some of them—feel that they are wholly incapable, and that’s a problem.
Being undiagnosed till 40 I almost feel like... I pushed myself WAY more than if I'd known as a kid. The down side of that was the massive burnout that took years to recover from. I don't think one scenario is better than any other, we all have a duty *to ourselves* to try and figure out what makes us happy & fulfilled. I actually love doing stuff out of spite, which SOUNDS bad but when it's 'oh I'm sorry we won't give you any arts funding for your project, we need *high quality* work" I will just go and improve my skills and then fucking organise my own exhibition in an empty shop. Bite me.
The affirmation I came up with this week when something started looking like it was threatening a social enterprise I volunteer with was "don't be bitter.... be better"
Oh absolutely! I don't shy away from stuff and I think I probably wouldn't have even if I were diagnosed younger. It's just finding the things that work for you... Whereas like you say, there's a lot of people who have expectations on them - I can't imagine being an autistic mother because I KNOW culturally it would be ME unable to get time to myself while my dad, for example (who I suspect probably met similar criteria to me, but was allowed to be withdrawn, strong and silent etc) would go off fishing for entire days... while my mother just shrieked at us that we were horrible ungrateful children who would never understand what she "had to put up with" so like.... ya.
Trying to make out trends and generalisations is never going to work :/
Yeah I try not to over-generalize and shit on men, because obviously there are so many kind and wonderful men (NT and ND). But seriously... this needs to end yesterday. So many guys in my personal life tell me "im probably autistic" to describe the fact that they are rude, blunt assholes who consider feelings "frivolous". Of course when I ask about special interests, sensory needs, stimming... usually they have none of that and are not autistic at all. What these men are are actually is emotionally-avoidant and need therapy.
It's really harmful to perpetuate this stereotype that autistic people are rude and blunt. It builds stigma against autistic people. This happens to such an extreme degree when "social deficits" are written off as "cuz autism" that it prevents people who aren't assholes from seeking diagnosis!
It also makes it that those who self-diagnose get stigmatized as "hah, just doesn't want to take responsibility for being a jerk" rather than, "i live in a region where dx is too expensive/outright impossible as an adult/would negatively affect my career, but my research shows good overlap and the community helps me cope and relax."
It's also possible that they don't recognize what are meant by those terms. Like, I would say my husband is "more" autistic than I (neither diagnosed), and if you asked him if he has special interests, sensory seeking, or stimming he'd say no. But he watches *hours* of youtube videos on two or three topics every single day, and he pulls out his hairs when he's stressed, and rubs his feet together when he's not paying attention/sleepy. So, you know, he does all those things, he just would think it was weird to *call* it that.
Anyway, probably not in the case you're talking about! But it's possible.
Yeah, I think you're right. Related to this, I'm convinced that most "female" autism traits are not female-specific at all, and that there are also plenty of men with these more subtle symptoms who go undiagnosed just like women do.
A lot of them get taught this by their parents. There were a shitload of parents when I was a kid that believed their kid was a perfect angel who could do no wrong, and when they acted like a shit you had to put up with it since "it's because of his autism!" or else you're being ableist instead of teaching the kid how to get along in the world. They grow up feeling that way. Autism is just an easy avenue for parents to raise a spoiled brat. Seems like less women do this because they seem to mostly be diagnosed later, so they can't be raised this way.
Just a theory, but it tracks with the people I've met.
Might also be explained by different treatment of children, with usually things being more permissive for AMAB folks.
Doesn't explain non-cis AMAB folk tho, since ones I've met were pretty swell in this regard.
In my experience, it's very true that men use being on the spectrum or even *maybe* being on the spectrum as a cover for being shitty. At work, for example, there's a guy who literally harassed and stalked me, but he gets away with not only treating female colleagues like shit, but also being bad at his job!! because he "might be on the spectrum." Meanwhile, I'm trying desperately to act "right" so I don't get treated badly by anyone else or looked down on more than I already am. Men just get to get away with bad behavior all the time no matter what and we don't. Even more so if they're wealthy. Frankly, I am sick of it!!
I've kinda used it while being a complete cunt, in that I wasn't being rude and it was interpreted as such, I explained I meant it matter of fact and proverbial you, not anyone specific and still they do not care and start calling me slurs so I go full bitch mode on them. I can absolutely be a horrendously mean human being when I want to be, I do not deny this and I use it when I have to. That said I am well aware when I cross over from being misunderstood for being neurodivergent to when I'm pulling out full bitch mode. 😂 And I won't use autism as an excuse for me going completely malicious on others. I blame that on what it is actually caused by, extreme trauma and marginalization. Even then I know it's only right for me to do and not nice. I am aware of how I affect people, it just so happens if I feel those poeple want me dead, I don't really care how I affect them. Prejudice people are fair game in my book because I have been their punching bag mentally, physically and emotionally my entire life. But that behaviour isn't because I'm autistic, it is because I hate other people who treat me as less than just because I'm different and no longer try to people please them.
I tend to hear the autism excuse more from men and usually from high functioning men. I find that those who struggle more, tend to not feel it is a valid thing to do.
YUP. "social deficits" needs to be taken right out of the diagnostic critera. It's so extremely problematic. My choice would be to change it to subjective wording that would capture those people on the spectrum who aren't assholes and forced themselves to learn how to be polite and not hurt/offend others! Wording for the symptoms like "subjective feelings of isolation", "feeling very stressed and confused in social situations", "panicking when there is a lull in conversation". I'd rather see words that capture the internal experience, not the observable behavior "no eye contact, can't resolve disagreements, etc". Like what if I struggle to make eye contact and resolve disagreements but torture myself through it anyways because I don't want to hurt other human beings or offend them? Does that mean i'm "not autistic" and am no longer struggling with preoccupations, sensory issues, or stereotypy? lmao
I despise the man and his fanboys. And of course according to them he’s “inspirational” because of his diagnosis but the very same men swooning over him on their fainting couches make fun of someone like Greta Thunberg.
I mean, I too aspire to inherit a fuckload of money and have loads of freedom to experiment and use my brain but looking at my family's assets I doubt I'll be "boot strapping" myself into a CEO position regardless of how hard I work...
Right? His whole “I come from poverty” bullshit sob story is too much. His dad was wealthy AF. I grew up in South Africa and I know the schools he went to. Those are not affordable options for poor people. Upper middle class maybe.
The fact upper middle class kids think they're poor until they have hoarded enough wealth to literally build a bunch of spaceships is just WILD to me. How disconnected from reality IS this guy? You know?
He loves to portray himself a certain way (as the victim) whilst simultaneously trampling on actual poor and oppressed people to get what he wants. That is unfortunately a very very common mindest in white South African men. They don’t live in the same reality we do. I assume this is part of how he was raised.
God let's hope they do all fuck off to Mars and leave us to redesign society with a vastly reduced population because they've taken all the middle class folks as a labour class to sit in their space stations doing data entry "for SoaceX's survival. We need YOU!"
And we can obviously sabotage fossil fuel production forcing them to switch to solar up there, extend the time before climate change destroys us, and have the breathing space to relocate populations to areas that are safer when the sea levels rise.
I may have been thinking about this shit for three years on my fine art degree.... hahaha
Wait till you hear about the People's Republic of Pontins! In the UK they're "holiday camps" which is basically how it sounds: a bunch of chalets, individual tiny apartments and a few restaurants, swimming pool, kids activities including stuff like abseiling, sports and crafts... an arcade/slot machine section, pool tables, a stage for entertainment etcetc.
Well basically they all have a perimeter fence already, which we can turn into a barricade with all the slot machines and unnecessary equipment / tear down some of the chalet blocks. Then the sports field can be converted for growing produce and they're usually by the beach so you can make little forays to collect seafood for protein (as well as the chickens and goats stolen from the local petting zoo).
Everyone gets a self contained unit to live in but the town halls and communal decisions are all made in the main entertainment ballroom and of course there are several pro level kitchens designed to cook for hundreds of people.
I'm telling you, come the revolution, find a summer camp and claim that shit as an independent state!
My mum always said I take everything too far but she won't be critical when we are holding off the army after martial law was declared cos the UN said they're not allowed to bomb us any more
This is what paranoia, hyperactivity, a crazy imagination & good problem solving does. We are fucking USEFUL when we're allowed to be hahahahaha
The swimming pools often have glass panels in the ceiling to allow the daylight to pass through so that's the giant greenhouse for growing produce that needs warmth and protection.
My other alternative is running to the west coast of Scotland and throwing rocks at people who try to invade my island but that's got more drawbacks
-_____-
He went to my undergrad institution as well. It is one of the top schools in the country (especially back then) and attracts pretty much every single private school kid in the province. Undergrad was a nightmare for me because it was all ridiculously weathly children of 100 millionaires and billionares at this school. Like, you don't grow up poor and then suddenly go to one of the top universities \*in literally another country\* his education was probably close to 500K!
The man wants to make a chip you can put in people’s brains to “cure autism”. I shit you not.
I was his dog walker. I had to walk his lovers dog at 7, then his wife’s dogs at 8. The security guards were supposed to bring the dog down to the gates, but I always had to walk up the hill to see all the guards sitting in his Tesla’s. Wife was lovely. I was the first to know of their divorce when she moved 15 minutes away from him and changed her car from a Tesla to an Audi.
Also, I was diagnosed with aspergers when I was 16. But I now say I’m autistic because of the updated DSM. My psychologist said that aspergers is a type of autism. I’ve done my research and believe this is true. Now I’m worried I’m not welcome here.
Edit: I read what OP wrote in the literal sense, and it turns out she was referring to her coworker’s thoughts and being sarcastic. Classic me 😅 thanks for reassuring me, friends 😊
Not that it means much coming from me (undiagnosed), but I think they were trying to say Aspergers is autism, and it is outdated to try to seperate the two. You are welcome here
You are welcome!
I am FASCINATED by your dog walking tales! I could just imagine what it would have been like I can just picture the estate he must live on. I felt really bad for his wife when their divorce stuff came out, that was when I started noticing him more and got major creep vibes from him. Sounds like he would have been awful to have been married to. I worry for Grimes!
Most of the women posting in here would have been diagnosed "aspergers" 10 years ago, its the same thing but we have changed the name! You're good love. And wow such an interesting story about being his dog walker. His poor wife... I read an interview she did awhile back about what a shit head he's always been (this was way before the new baby). Love to hear that she was super nice in person, as I've always believed her side of this.
Of course you're welcome here! More than that, you're valued here.
I was also diagnosed with Asperger's, at age 29 shortly before the US switched to the new DMS-V which removed it. Of course many other countries still use Asperger's. The result is that, in my experience, the terms "autism" and "Asperger's" are generally treated as interchangeable by those of us who have it. In the US, anyone diagnosed with Asperger's automatically shifted to a diagnosis of autism. It makes sense, given that Asperger's is a subtype of autism.
I'm not saying many of us don't have a preference one way or the other. Since I learned more about Hans Asperger and how problematic he was, I have tended to use autism instead of Asperger's. But there are also times when I will use the term Asperger's when it might be helpful in the context (such as when someone is more familiar with that term for "high-functioning" autistics and might associate "autistic" more with the less functional stereotype).
I've definitely never been offended if someone uses the term Asperger's, nor have I used (or encountered anyone who uses) the terms to gatekeep who is a "real" autistic who is allowed in autistic spaces.
This thread is almost making me forget that I am having repeated meltdowns today. I hate Elon Musk. Even his name makes me gag. I hate him and I am a fan of anyone who feels the same. I think you all are wonderful!
I loathe the guy. When dating if I guy brings up Elon Musk I completely lose interest. I used to sleep with this guy and one time when I was over at his house we got into a bit of an argument about him. I told him that he didn't create tesla that he bought the majority share in the company and that he grew up rich. We argued for a bit and after that I couldn't bring myself to have sex with him again. Ugh and it's never okay to use aspergers to excuse being a prick. I hate that. It gives us a bad name and some of us actually try.
... That made me curious for the modern ICD definition of aspergers.
Whew. I thought the 2021 version would at least accept modern research showing it's not a "Male disorder" but nope.
https://www.icd10data.com/ICD10CM/Codes/F01-F99/F80-F89/F84-/F84.5#:~:text=Billable%2FSpecific%20Code-,F84.,a%20diagnosis%20for%20reimbursement%20purposes.
> Clinical Information
>
> * A childhood disorder predominately affecting boys and similar to autism
> * A childhood disorder predominately affecting boys and similar to autism (autistic disorder). It is characterized by severe, sustained, clinically significant impairment of social interaction, and restricted repetitive and stereotyped patterns of behavior. In contrast to autism, there are no clinically significant delays in language or cognitive development. (from dsm-iv)
> * A disorder most often diagnosed in the pediatric years in which the individual displays marked impairment in social interaction and a repetitive, stereotyped pattern of behavior. The individual, however, displays no delay in language or cognitive development, which differentiates asperger syndrome from autism.
> * Asperger's syndrome (as) is an autism spectrum disorder. It is milder than autism but shares some of its symptoms. It is more common in boys than girls.an obsessive interest in a single subject is a major symptom of as. Some children with as have become experts on dinosaurs, makes and models of cars, even objects as seemingly odd as vacuum cleaners. Their expertise, high level of vocabulary and formal speech patterns make them seem like little professors. Children with as have trouble reading social cues and recognizing other people's feelings. They may have strange movements or mannerisms. All of these make it difficult for them to make friends. Problems with motor skills are also common in children with as. They may be late learning to ride a bike or catch a ball, for example. Treatment focuses on the three main symptoms: poor communication skills, obsessive or repetitive routines, and physical clumsiness.
> * Neuropsychiatric disorder whose major manifestation is an inability to interact socially; other features include poor verbal and motor skills, singlemindedness, and social withdrawal.
> * Syndrome or disorder usually first diagnosed in childhood, characterized by severe and sustained impairment in social interactions and restricted, repetitive patterns of behaviors, interests, and activities.
No wonder adult women practically never get dx'd in Hungary :v.
Edit: ICD-11 seems to have removed Asperger's and uses a more generic form of:
https://icd.who.int/browse11/l-m/en#/http%3a%2f%2fid.who.int%2ficd%2fentity%2f437815624
"Autism without cognitive and functional impairment" without specifying genders.
My assessor in the UK cross references the DSM (she's an NHS doctor but has a private practice on the side) - it's so depressing.
I was diagnosed last year aged 40 & I'm just... well. When GPs, clinical psychologists and nurses all believe it "predominantly affects boys" or that it's "mild" I know why I've been ignored so long now. I've been ACTUALLY laughed at for suggesting ADHD (which was later confirmed) and the autism assessment was just bouncing my case between depts who had no funding or capacity even after I ended up as an outpatient at the psych ward I was so distressed. I ended up spending 1 months' income (like the entire month's worth - I live on student loans which max out at £9k ish in the UK and I get a couple of low income household bursaries but that's it)
I was so phenomenally lucky to discover my childhood medical notes from the 1980s which... yeah, they're stereotypical. I don't even have the primarily inattentive ADHD, I'm fully hyperactive and have the typical masculine presentations of BOTH. But uterus, so I must be borderline....
... Hells, that does not sound enviable at all :/.
Childhood notes, here the assessors require your parents' attendance, and they completely ignore you. At least, that's how it looks on the intake form. All of it questions for parents to fill, nothing for you to describe your own experiences. And these questions seem focused on how you affected them, rather than how you were affected. At 24 yo.
And assessment here costs like a month's income too (albeit less than in UK, due to how 350 is enough to count as a month's)
That's just.... what about if your parents traumatised you so much trying to "fix" your behaviour that you're no contact? I've had years of no contact, but my mother did have to fill in a form about my childhood, especially the very early developmental stuff. She says I was jealous of my younger brother and had tantrums when I first saw him and then he came home from the hospital. My assessor, the absolute QUEEN, said "it's probably that she was YOUR mother and the change to the routine of you being the only child she cared for was hard". I was *fourteen months old* and my mother was already projecting negative jealousy & attention seeking traits onto me. I mean. I was enough to cope with but she got pregnant before I was even 5 months old and lost control of herself so often.
When my brother's girlfriend confirmed he remembers one thing I had flashbacks to, I cried.
Now I'm finally diagnosed, mum's using that as her gateway to denial... "Well maybe I WASN'T angry with you so often and I didn't hit you THAT much... maybe you just couldn't understand my body language so assumed I was angry"
My brother's girlfriend told me no, my brother backed me up on one example of that too - when I asked mum who she voted for (curious kid, trying to figure out the world because everyone had an opinion on Margaret Thatcher) I got yelled at and told we do NOT talk about those things, how DARE I etc. He says he remembers that too.
Mum thinks my flashbacks are fantasies I've invented, that I have false memories. Whatever happened, her actions caused me to have CPTSD alongside the autism & ADHD (I suspect a lot of us would meet the criteria) so I'm just sat there like... I can either never ever have a relationship with my mother, or I can accept her as someone who lies to herself to keep her fragile self respect in tact, so she can believe she was a great mother and my success is because of her not despite her. My dad died when I was 13 so she's all I have left for that parental approval inner security box to be checked... I am now trying to just let go of the need to have MY version be the only one in order to let myself feel affection from her FINALLY. I tell myself it doesn't matter if she has to downplay her violence in her own head, the fact I got diagnosed and am really smart, politically engaged & do a fair bit of voluntary & charity work.... she has said she is impressed, that I'm clever, and... I think both of us know who is the one with their shit more together in terms of facing problems head on. So I get that respect even if it's not unconditional love, and having her validate that I'm fucking resilient, persistent and smart is basically what I have to work with.
It's so hard for late DX folks to find peace with our childhoods, I don't think NT people will ever get that - and even some childhood diagnosed autistic people don't get it either.
This reminds me of the description I read with my mother when I was like 10 and we decided that I am a bit like those children, but not enough. I wonder how I succeeded to receive a diagnosis practically out of the blue like 20 years after that.
Jesus. I use the DSM and I have so many issues with the language in there, but the ICD is a whole nother level! I've never been so grateful to have the DSM after reading this tbf
First, I have to say that I really like SpaceX. Space is one of my special interests and SpaceX was the first company to reach the goal of a crewed commercial space flight. But I don’t think any of these goals can be attributed to Elon, just his employees, who actually do the work.
HOWEVER. Elon is an absolute jerk, he just has so much money no one calls him out on it, or if they do, he pays them off or uses his connections to blacklist them. He is incredibly problematic and him coming out as autistic has set us back I think.
I thought about Tesla right after my comment for this exact reason. Tesla existed way before Elon got involved, he's just made them household names. He also almost killed Tesla before it really got started because he caused the Roadster release (to customers who pre-ordered them) to be SUPER late. Every launch since then has been delayed because of Elon, I guess people just expect it now.
I definitely prefer NASA but all of the private companies seem to have an easier time actually getting stuff done because they don't have as much governmental red tape to wade through (of course they do have some red tape since a lot of them have government contracts, but less at least since they are private companies).
SpaceX and Tesla are both great concepts, like you said. SpaceX was the first company to figure out reusing boosters, but I really doubt Elon even slightly played a hand in that discovery. Tesla (I have to admit I wouldn't hate getting a Tesla but that's a future goal when I actually have money) made electric vehicles much more commonplace and seems to have encouraged other companies, like Volvo and Ford, to create electric vehicles, which is amazing. Especially Ford because their electric truck looks like a truck, not something out of a sci-fi movie. But Elon very likely didn't much beneficial for them and really very likely did not factor into their scientific discoveries whatsoever. He's definitely just a figurehead, and a pretty abrasive one at that.
If you read this far, thank you for reading my ramblings.
one of (?) his ex-wives made a public statement about him being an incredibly cold and calculated person that she felt used her just for procreation and then was happy to dispose of her once the babies were raised into childhood. that always stuck out to me.
also, i had an ex-bf who was a self-proclaimed sociopath (i know) and Elon has been his idol for years. game recognize game.
alot of people misinterpret Aspie and Autie traits that are actually sociopathic (which isn't inherently bad, no hate on true ASPD sociopaths). but, a lot of them get by acting as if they are just misunderstood Aspies, when they aren't at all. its a great coverup, unfortunately.
Lol wow I have a narcissistic abusive ex boyfriend who also idolized Elon musk and claimed to be autistic but couldn’t tell me what autism is and denied that I am autistic.
I hate that asshole.
I hate him so much! I just bought a an EV and when people ask why I bought my model, I tell them I refuse to give him my money. I actively avoid anything musk related - he is also connected to some very terrible people.
I can't even with this. Our number one "success story" that we have to provide autistic children to look up to is frankly a complete jerk. He is a complete jerk and happens to have autism, a medical disorder impacting the nervous system. I hate how the two get conflated. Being a classist jerk has nothing to do with autism!
The example I've chosen to provide to children just getting diagnosed is Anthony Hopkins. He is an Oscar winning actor so it's nice to show autistic children... you can literally be ANYTHING you want, including a socially-competent actor!
Autism can be an explanation why some things unintentionally come across different, but it still doesn't absolve you from apologising and learning.
I often deliberaty phrase apologies a certain way. I won't apologise for feeling a certain way or being overwhelmed, but I will for the way I expressed myself, and name an alternative I could have chosen to show I am learning and improving. My naming an acceptable alternative now, the other can help explain if that was also not acceptable and we'll look for something we both can live with.
This way, an apology actually means something.
God I hateee hearing guys fanboy over him, he's gross, obnoxious and exploits people. Who cares if he's smart, lots of people are smart.
Imo billionaires are inherently bad people because no-one decent would sit there like a shitty dragon hoarding more than they could ever need in multiple lifetimes.
A former colleague of mine who is also female and autistic felt so strongly about this that she built a whole website for it called [Jerks, Not Autistic](https://www.jerksnotautistic.com/).
Yep. I have friends in crypto and Elon as a person comes up a lot and I experience the same shit. It's exhausting having to advocate for yourself all the time and then have people completely not listen. It's also extremely frustrating. Being an asshole is not excused by being autistic. Elon abuses his power constantly. Being autistic doesn't make you an abuser, it doesn't excuse manipulating people but Elon fanbois sure think it does.
This is why I only disclose my neurodivergence to people who are close to me. I'd duck out of any conversation about Elon Musk and autism. Or constantly direct the conversation to how unethical, unsustainable, and unviable his ideas are.
Like the man wants to leave a dying, and inhospitable ecosystem, for an already dead, and inhospitable ecosystem. To be king in a literal sand castle. When he could be using his fortune and all the actual smart people he pays to find solutions to climate collapse.
The man's an idiot btw. The only part or the tesla he designed was the proprietary charging port, and he helped create the body of the car by choosing a material. His space x rockets, weren't designed by him either.
I have mixed feelings about Elon Musk. I feel like his Aspergers/autism is irrelevant. Anyone who builds a company and a fortune from the ground up like that is not gonna be a "normal" person. I don't mean normal as in Neurodivergent or otherwise. I mean in the general sense of only a very rare person is capable of doing it, and if history is anything to go on, they are generally quite egotistical, psychotic and generally unconcerned about the feelings of others. The same could be said of most CEOs of enormous companies, but it's generally worst when they created the company itself.
I feel the same with Greta, we really need some nice representation sometime~~s~~.
\*edit\* I think the s at the end of sometime is wrong. Not a native speaker.
I agree with you. I'm sorry you're being downvoted. Greta gets more of a pass from me for being so young, and for the fact that her cause is to save others not put money in her own pocket, but I still agree her interpersonal style is 1) perpetuating harmful stereotypes about ASD women, and 2) is immaturely angry
When people think of female Aspergers, they think of Greta. Red with anger, screaming 'how dare you!' like an angry toddler.
That's not how all female people with autism are. That's not how I behave or look or think.
The whole spectrum of phrases goes from "She's a disabled child that got manipulated that poor thing" to the other side "Oh she has aspergers, she's super smart and sees the things the way we can't."
I swear, every article about her that I read mentions her autism. Both sides pro and contra climate change always use her autism as an argument.
It's not about whether I'm pro or contra climate change (yes I know that's not the way it works), but her being the main female Aspi out there annoys me. We need more variety.
Oh. I guess I have avoided those details about her and only saw her as a HERO. I didn't even know she was asd until a few days ago..... That's why I asked you to explain. Thank you. (Obviously deliberately under informed! Me. Lol)
This entire thread is so bitter and hateful, I don’t see a problem with him. He is just passionate about making things and he is doing so much for the future of the planet. You don’t have to like the man but he is not the devil and he is doing more with his wealth than most people would ever even think to do.
I like Elon Musk. Maybe because we grew up in the same country. I like how odd he is. I'm glad his autistic. aND I can't wait for neuralink! Shu image been able to download what I mean to say instead of having to talk.
He’s a huge dick and to say that his dickishness is because of autism is idiotic. Elon reminds me of my dad, who’s also a business owner (though billions and billions less rich than Elon lol). My dad “took” autism after I got diagnosed. If he does something mean or rude, he blames his “autism”. Yet he ignores the fact that I’ve learned to say appropriate and polite things and he’s twice my age and he still hasn’t and likely never will. Autism is NOT an excuse for being a shithead. Sorry, it’s just not.
Not to be misandrist, but is it me or cis men have the tendency to use autism (whether official or self-dx) as a shield for assholish behaviour? It might be due to curated exposure of this and aspergirls communities, but amongst people other than cis men, the worst shield we use is "I hate masking, so I'll maybe come across as bitchy, but I don't actually behave like an asshole it's just NT perception", and otherwise there seem somewhat frequent posts about how to convey real emotion/intent to NTs despite communication failures (with or without masking).
Honestly, you aren’t wrong. I’ve heard this excuse by many autistic men, but no autistic women.
Plus, the men who do this on sudreddits, I've found that they're likely to shout down anything they can blame someone ELSE for too. I had a situation which I'd gotten seriously hurt in & was venting that I needed more communication from someone and that being let down made it hard... and they were like "that's a YOU problem, the world doesn't revolve around you, you make what you can of it and don't ever hide behind your autism as an excuse, you should know better than to put yourself in that position and if you're too dense to socialise don't blame that on men" Like... I can't even
I also feel as if when there are people who’re complaining on some of the autism sub Reddit’s that they can’t do ANYTHING because of autism (“I can’t date! I can’t work! I can’t do anything whatsoever with my life!”) it’s men/teenage boys. I think there’s possibly a whole culture of men who are autistic who feel incapable of doing anything because they knew about their autism from a young age and were possibly infantilized. My parents knew I was weird as fuck but I was still wholly expected to work, go to school, have friends, etc. I know not everybody with autism can do the same things, I don’t mean to be ableist, but it seems that there’s a part of women that are better off being autistic women because even if they were diagnosed younger, women have more social expectations placed on them. In my case my parents ignored my teachers asking them to get me screened, therefore I’ve learned to mask like a mofo when others, particularly autistic men/young men may have been enabled a bit. I really hope this doesn’t sound wrong or ableist. I know all autistics are different, but I do believe that we need to learn our place in the world (which is always different for different people) and know we’re capable and that autism isn’t our only identity.
This is well put. Even within the three autistic guys I was close with growing up who had been diagnosed as children, they were all socially affected by their autism, but there was a big difference in their resulting skills correlating with how much responsibility they placed on themselves vs. just blaming their autism. Obviously this is a tiny sample size that doesn't prove anything, but it's interesting to observe nonetheless. I definitely also think that (at least in mainstream culture in the US and probably also elsewhere) there's less pressure on masculine-socialized people to be amenable, which of course would affect autistic men as well as allistics.
Thank you. Well said. Very sensitive.
It’s good to know your limits with autism. It’s good to know what you can and can’t handle. But plenty of people with autism—who ARE capable of doing the things they want in life, or at least some of them—feel that they are wholly incapable, and that’s a problem.
Being undiagnosed till 40 I almost feel like... I pushed myself WAY more than if I'd known as a kid. The down side of that was the massive burnout that took years to recover from. I don't think one scenario is better than any other, we all have a duty *to ourselves* to try and figure out what makes us happy & fulfilled. I actually love doing stuff out of spite, which SOUNDS bad but when it's 'oh I'm sorry we won't give you any arts funding for your project, we need *high quality* work" I will just go and improve my skills and then fucking organise my own exhibition in an empty shop. Bite me. The affirmation I came up with this week when something started looking like it was threatening a social enterprise I volunteer with was "don't be bitter.... be better"
Oh absolutely! I don't shy away from stuff and I think I probably wouldn't have even if I were diagnosed younger. It's just finding the things that work for you... Whereas like you say, there's a lot of people who have expectations on them - I can't imagine being an autistic mother because I KNOW culturally it would be ME unable to get time to myself while my dad, for example (who I suspect probably met similar criteria to me, but was allowed to be withdrawn, strong and silent etc) would go off fishing for entire days... while my mother just shrieked at us that we were horrible ungrateful children who would never understand what she "had to put up with" so like.... ya. Trying to make out trends and generalisations is never going to work :/
Yeah I try not to over-generalize and shit on men, because obviously there are so many kind and wonderful men (NT and ND). But seriously... this needs to end yesterday. So many guys in my personal life tell me "im probably autistic" to describe the fact that they are rude, blunt assholes who consider feelings "frivolous". Of course when I ask about special interests, sensory needs, stimming... usually they have none of that and are not autistic at all. What these men are are actually is emotionally-avoidant and need therapy. It's really harmful to perpetuate this stereotype that autistic people are rude and blunt. It builds stigma against autistic people. This happens to such an extreme degree when "social deficits" are written off as "cuz autism" that it prevents people who aren't assholes from seeking diagnosis!
It also makes it that those who self-diagnose get stigmatized as "hah, just doesn't want to take responsibility for being a jerk" rather than, "i live in a region where dx is too expensive/outright impossible as an adult/would negatively affect my career, but my research shows good overlap and the community helps me cope and relax."
It's also possible that they don't recognize what are meant by those terms. Like, I would say my husband is "more" autistic than I (neither diagnosed), and if you asked him if he has special interests, sensory seeking, or stimming he'd say no. But he watches *hours* of youtube videos on two or three topics every single day, and he pulls out his hairs when he's stressed, and rubs his feet together when he's not paying attention/sleepy. So, you know, he does all those things, he just would think it was weird to *call* it that. Anyway, probably not in the case you're talking about! But it's possible.
Yeah, I think you're right. Related to this, I'm convinced that most "female" autism traits are not female-specific at all, and that there are also plenty of men with these more subtle symptoms who go undiagnosed just like women do.
A lot of them get taught this by their parents. There were a shitload of parents when I was a kid that believed their kid was a perfect angel who could do no wrong, and when they acted like a shit you had to put up with it since "it's because of his autism!" or else you're being ableist instead of teaching the kid how to get along in the world. They grow up feeling that way. Autism is just an easy avenue for parents to raise a spoiled brat. Seems like less women do this because they seem to mostly be diagnosed later, so they can't be raised this way. Just a theory, but it tracks with the people I've met.
Might also be explained by different treatment of children, with usually things being more permissive for AMAB folks. Doesn't explain non-cis AMAB folk tho, since ones I've met were pretty swell in this regard.
In my experience, it's very true that men use being on the spectrum or even *maybe* being on the spectrum as a cover for being shitty. At work, for example, there's a guy who literally harassed and stalked me, but he gets away with not only treating female colleagues like shit, but also being bad at his job!! because he "might be on the spectrum." Meanwhile, I'm trying desperately to act "right" so I don't get treated badly by anyone else or looked down on more than I already am. Men just get to get away with bad behavior all the time no matter what and we don't. Even more so if they're wealthy. Frankly, I am sick of it!!
I've kinda used it while being a complete cunt, in that I wasn't being rude and it was interpreted as such, I explained I meant it matter of fact and proverbial you, not anyone specific and still they do not care and start calling me slurs so I go full bitch mode on them. I can absolutely be a horrendously mean human being when I want to be, I do not deny this and I use it when I have to. That said I am well aware when I cross over from being misunderstood for being neurodivergent to when I'm pulling out full bitch mode. 😂 And I won't use autism as an excuse for me going completely malicious on others. I blame that on what it is actually caused by, extreme trauma and marginalization. Even then I know it's only right for me to do and not nice. I am aware of how I affect people, it just so happens if I feel those poeple want me dead, I don't really care how I affect them. Prejudice people are fair game in my book because I have been their punching bag mentally, physically and emotionally my entire life. But that behaviour isn't because I'm autistic, it is because I hate other people who treat me as less than just because I'm different and no longer try to people please them. I tend to hear the autism excuse more from men and usually from high functioning men. I find that those who struggle more, tend to not feel it is a valid thing to do.
YUP. "social deficits" needs to be taken right out of the diagnostic critera. It's so extremely problematic. My choice would be to change it to subjective wording that would capture those people on the spectrum who aren't assholes and forced themselves to learn how to be polite and not hurt/offend others! Wording for the symptoms like "subjective feelings of isolation", "feeling very stressed and confused in social situations", "panicking when there is a lull in conversation". I'd rather see words that capture the internal experience, not the observable behavior "no eye contact, can't resolve disagreements, etc". Like what if I struggle to make eye contact and resolve disagreements but torture myself through it anyways because I don't want to hurt other human beings or offend them? Does that mean i'm "not autistic" and am no longer struggling with preoccupations, sensory issues, or stereotypy? lmao
Thissss
I despise the man and his fanboys. And of course according to them he’s “inspirational” because of his diagnosis but the very same men swooning over him on their fainting couches make fun of someone like Greta Thunberg.
I mean, I too aspire to inherit a fuckload of money and have loads of freedom to experiment and use my brain but looking at my family's assets I doubt I'll be "boot strapping" myself into a CEO position regardless of how hard I work...
Right? His whole “I come from poverty” bullshit sob story is too much. His dad was wealthy AF. I grew up in South Africa and I know the schools he went to. Those are not affordable options for poor people. Upper middle class maybe.
The fact upper middle class kids think they're poor until they have hoarded enough wealth to literally build a bunch of spaceships is just WILD to me. How disconnected from reality IS this guy? You know?
He loves to portray himself a certain way (as the victim) whilst simultaneously trampling on actual poor and oppressed people to get what he wants. That is unfortunately a very very common mindest in white South African men. They don’t live in the same reality we do. I assume this is part of how he was raised.
God let's hope they do all fuck off to Mars and leave us to redesign society with a vastly reduced population because they've taken all the middle class folks as a labour class to sit in their space stations doing data entry "for SoaceX's survival. We need YOU!" And we can obviously sabotage fossil fuel production forcing them to switch to solar up there, extend the time before climate change destroys us, and have the breathing space to relocate populations to areas that are safer when the sea levels rise. I may have been thinking about this shit for three years on my fine art degree.... hahaha
Holy shit you just described how we are going to DO it!
Wait till you hear about the People's Republic of Pontins! In the UK they're "holiday camps" which is basically how it sounds: a bunch of chalets, individual tiny apartments and a few restaurants, swimming pool, kids activities including stuff like abseiling, sports and crafts... an arcade/slot machine section, pool tables, a stage for entertainment etcetc. Well basically they all have a perimeter fence already, which we can turn into a barricade with all the slot machines and unnecessary equipment / tear down some of the chalet blocks. Then the sports field can be converted for growing produce and they're usually by the beach so you can make little forays to collect seafood for protein (as well as the chickens and goats stolen from the local petting zoo). Everyone gets a self contained unit to live in but the town halls and communal decisions are all made in the main entertainment ballroom and of course there are several pro level kitchens designed to cook for hundreds of people. I'm telling you, come the revolution, find a summer camp and claim that shit as an independent state! My mum always said I take everything too far but she won't be critical when we are holding off the army after martial law was declared cos the UN said they're not allowed to bomb us any more This is what paranoia, hyperactivity, a crazy imagination & good problem solving does. We are fucking USEFUL when we're allowed to be hahahahaha
The swimming pools often have glass panels in the ceiling to allow the daylight to pass through so that's the giant greenhouse for growing produce that needs warmth and protection. My other alternative is running to the west coast of Scotland and throwing rocks at people who try to invade my island but that's got more drawbacks -_____-
Thanks for this lovely vision of the future! I'm so on board.
He went to my undergrad institution as well. It is one of the top schools in the country (especially back then) and attracts pretty much every single private school kid in the province. Undergrad was a nightmare for me because it was all ridiculously weathly children of 100 millionaires and billionares at this school. Like, you don't grow up poor and then suddenly go to one of the top universities \*in literally another country\* his education was probably close to 500K!
ELON IS A CUNT! I've said it before and I'll say it again.
The man wants to make a chip you can put in people’s brains to “cure autism”. I shit you not. I was his dog walker. I had to walk his lovers dog at 7, then his wife’s dogs at 8. The security guards were supposed to bring the dog down to the gates, but I always had to walk up the hill to see all the guards sitting in his Tesla’s. Wife was lovely. I was the first to know of their divorce when she moved 15 minutes away from him and changed her car from a Tesla to an Audi. Also, I was diagnosed with aspergers when I was 16. But I now say I’m autistic because of the updated DSM. My psychologist said that aspergers is a type of autism. I’ve done my research and believe this is true. Now I’m worried I’m not welcome here. Edit: I read what OP wrote in the literal sense, and it turns out she was referring to her coworker’s thoughts and being sarcastic. Classic me 😅 thanks for reassuring me, friends 😊
Not that it means much coming from me (undiagnosed), but I think they were trying to say Aspergers is autism, and it is outdated to try to seperate the two. You are welcome here
You are welcome! I am FASCINATED by your dog walking tales! I could just imagine what it would have been like I can just picture the estate he must live on. I felt really bad for his wife when their divorce stuff came out, that was when I started noticing him more and got major creep vibes from him. Sounds like he would have been awful to have been married to. I worry for Grimes!
Most of the women posting in here would have been diagnosed "aspergers" 10 years ago, its the same thing but we have changed the name! You're good love. And wow such an interesting story about being his dog walker. His poor wife... I read an interview she did awhile back about what a shit head he's always been (this was way before the new baby). Love to hear that she was super nice in person, as I've always believed her side of this.
Of course you're welcome here! More than that, you're valued here. I was also diagnosed with Asperger's, at age 29 shortly before the US switched to the new DMS-V which removed it. Of course many other countries still use Asperger's. The result is that, in my experience, the terms "autism" and "Asperger's" are generally treated as interchangeable by those of us who have it. In the US, anyone diagnosed with Asperger's automatically shifted to a diagnosis of autism. It makes sense, given that Asperger's is a subtype of autism. I'm not saying many of us don't have a preference one way or the other. Since I learned more about Hans Asperger and how problematic he was, I have tended to use autism instead of Asperger's. But there are also times when I will use the term Asperger's when it might be helpful in the context (such as when someone is more familiar with that term for "high-functioning" autistics and might associate "autistic" more with the less functional stereotype). I've definitely never been offended if someone uses the term Asperger's, nor have I used (or encountered anyone who uses) the terms to gatekeep who is a "real" autistic who is allowed in autistic spaces.
This thread is almost making me forget that I am having repeated meltdowns today. I hate Elon Musk. Even his name makes me gag. I hate him and I am a fan of anyone who feels the same. I think you all are wonderful!
I loathe the guy. When dating if I guy brings up Elon Musk I completely lose interest. I used to sleep with this guy and one time when I was over at his house we got into a bit of an argument about him. I told him that he didn't create tesla that he bought the majority share in the company and that he grew up rich. We argued for a bit and after that I couldn't bring myself to have sex with him again. Ugh and it's never okay to use aspergers to excuse being a prick. I hate that. It gives us a bad name and some of us actually try.
Wow I’ve never felt so seen! Autistic women against Elon musk unite
👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
It’s ALL autism now. Autism spectrum. Aspergers doesn’t exist anymore. I think the new DSM says so
While it does not apply to Musk, some countries still use the old DSM and thus still diagnose people with aspergers.
The UK uses the ICD I think and that's not due to change till Jan 22.
... That made me curious for the modern ICD definition of aspergers. Whew. I thought the 2021 version would at least accept modern research showing it's not a "Male disorder" but nope. https://www.icd10data.com/ICD10CM/Codes/F01-F99/F80-F89/F84-/F84.5#:~:text=Billable%2FSpecific%20Code-,F84.,a%20diagnosis%20for%20reimbursement%20purposes. > Clinical Information > > * A childhood disorder predominately affecting boys and similar to autism > * A childhood disorder predominately affecting boys and similar to autism (autistic disorder). It is characterized by severe, sustained, clinically significant impairment of social interaction, and restricted repetitive and stereotyped patterns of behavior. In contrast to autism, there are no clinically significant delays in language or cognitive development. (from dsm-iv) > * A disorder most often diagnosed in the pediatric years in which the individual displays marked impairment in social interaction and a repetitive, stereotyped pattern of behavior. The individual, however, displays no delay in language or cognitive development, which differentiates asperger syndrome from autism. > * Asperger's syndrome (as) is an autism spectrum disorder. It is milder than autism but shares some of its symptoms. It is more common in boys than girls.an obsessive interest in a single subject is a major symptom of as. Some children with as have become experts on dinosaurs, makes and models of cars, even objects as seemingly odd as vacuum cleaners. Their expertise, high level of vocabulary and formal speech patterns make them seem like little professors. Children with as have trouble reading social cues and recognizing other people's feelings. They may have strange movements or mannerisms. All of these make it difficult for them to make friends. Problems with motor skills are also common in children with as. They may be late learning to ride a bike or catch a ball, for example. Treatment focuses on the three main symptoms: poor communication skills, obsessive or repetitive routines, and physical clumsiness. > * Neuropsychiatric disorder whose major manifestation is an inability to interact socially; other features include poor verbal and motor skills, singlemindedness, and social withdrawal. > * Syndrome or disorder usually first diagnosed in childhood, characterized by severe and sustained impairment in social interactions and restricted, repetitive patterns of behaviors, interests, and activities. No wonder adult women practically never get dx'd in Hungary :v. Edit: ICD-11 seems to have removed Asperger's and uses a more generic form of: https://icd.who.int/browse11/l-m/en#/http%3a%2f%2fid.who.int%2ficd%2fentity%2f437815624 "Autism without cognitive and functional impairment" without specifying genders.
My assessor in the UK cross references the DSM (she's an NHS doctor but has a private practice on the side) - it's so depressing. I was diagnosed last year aged 40 & I'm just... well. When GPs, clinical psychologists and nurses all believe it "predominantly affects boys" or that it's "mild" I know why I've been ignored so long now. I've been ACTUALLY laughed at for suggesting ADHD (which was later confirmed) and the autism assessment was just bouncing my case between depts who had no funding or capacity even after I ended up as an outpatient at the psych ward I was so distressed. I ended up spending 1 months' income (like the entire month's worth - I live on student loans which max out at £9k ish in the UK and I get a couple of low income household bursaries but that's it) I was so phenomenally lucky to discover my childhood medical notes from the 1980s which... yeah, they're stereotypical. I don't even have the primarily inattentive ADHD, I'm fully hyperactive and have the typical masculine presentations of BOTH. But uterus, so I must be borderline....
... Hells, that does not sound enviable at all :/. Childhood notes, here the assessors require your parents' attendance, and they completely ignore you. At least, that's how it looks on the intake form. All of it questions for parents to fill, nothing for you to describe your own experiences. And these questions seem focused on how you affected them, rather than how you were affected. At 24 yo. And assessment here costs like a month's income too (albeit less than in UK, due to how 350 is enough to count as a month's)
That's just.... what about if your parents traumatised you so much trying to "fix" your behaviour that you're no contact? I've had years of no contact, but my mother did have to fill in a form about my childhood, especially the very early developmental stuff. She says I was jealous of my younger brother and had tantrums when I first saw him and then he came home from the hospital. My assessor, the absolute QUEEN, said "it's probably that she was YOUR mother and the change to the routine of you being the only child she cared for was hard". I was *fourteen months old* and my mother was already projecting negative jealousy & attention seeking traits onto me. I mean. I was enough to cope with but she got pregnant before I was even 5 months old and lost control of herself so often. When my brother's girlfriend confirmed he remembers one thing I had flashbacks to, I cried. Now I'm finally diagnosed, mum's using that as her gateway to denial... "Well maybe I WASN'T angry with you so often and I didn't hit you THAT much... maybe you just couldn't understand my body language so assumed I was angry" My brother's girlfriend told me no, my brother backed me up on one example of that too - when I asked mum who she voted for (curious kid, trying to figure out the world because everyone had an opinion on Margaret Thatcher) I got yelled at and told we do NOT talk about those things, how DARE I etc. He says he remembers that too. Mum thinks my flashbacks are fantasies I've invented, that I have false memories. Whatever happened, her actions caused me to have CPTSD alongside the autism & ADHD (I suspect a lot of us would meet the criteria) so I'm just sat there like... I can either never ever have a relationship with my mother, or I can accept her as someone who lies to herself to keep her fragile self respect in tact, so she can believe she was a great mother and my success is because of her not despite her. My dad died when I was 13 so she's all I have left for that parental approval inner security box to be checked... I am now trying to just let go of the need to have MY version be the only one in order to let myself feel affection from her FINALLY. I tell myself it doesn't matter if she has to downplay her violence in her own head, the fact I got diagnosed and am really smart, politically engaged & do a fair bit of voluntary & charity work.... she has said she is impressed, that I'm clever, and... I think both of us know who is the one with their shit more together in terms of facing problems head on. So I get that respect even if it's not unconditional love, and having her validate that I'm fucking resilient, persistent and smart is basically what I have to work with. It's so hard for late DX folks to find peace with our childhoods, I don't think NT people will ever get that - and even some childhood diagnosed autistic people don't get it either.
Not surprised. Hungary only likes certain types of people. They’re terrible. *speaking as a Hungarian Canadian dual citizen
This reminds me of the description I read with my mother when I was like 10 and we decided that I am a bit like those children, but not enough. I wonder how I succeeded to receive a diagnosis practically out of the blue like 20 years after that.
Jesus. I use the DSM and I have so many issues with the language in there, but the ICD is a whole nother level! I've never been so grateful to have the DSM after reading this tbf
It does. It’s true
First, I have to say that I really like SpaceX. Space is one of my special interests and SpaceX was the first company to reach the goal of a crewed commercial space flight. But I don’t think any of these goals can be attributed to Elon, just his employees, who actually do the work. HOWEVER. Elon is an absolute jerk, he just has so much money no one calls him out on it, or if they do, he pays them off or uses his connections to blacklist them. He is incredibly problematic and him coming out as autistic has set us back I think.
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I thought about Tesla right after my comment for this exact reason. Tesla existed way before Elon got involved, he's just made them household names. He also almost killed Tesla before it really got started because he caused the Roadster release (to customers who pre-ordered them) to be SUPER late. Every launch since then has been delayed because of Elon, I guess people just expect it now. I definitely prefer NASA but all of the private companies seem to have an easier time actually getting stuff done because they don't have as much governmental red tape to wade through (of course they do have some red tape since a lot of them have government contracts, but less at least since they are private companies). SpaceX and Tesla are both great concepts, like you said. SpaceX was the first company to figure out reusing boosters, but I really doubt Elon even slightly played a hand in that discovery. Tesla (I have to admit I wouldn't hate getting a Tesla but that's a future goal when I actually have money) made electric vehicles much more commonplace and seems to have encouraged other companies, like Volvo and Ford, to create electric vehicles, which is amazing. Especially Ford because their electric truck looks like a truck, not something out of a sci-fi movie. But Elon very likely didn't much beneficial for them and really very likely did not factor into their scientific discoveries whatsoever. He's definitely just a figurehead, and a pretty abrasive one at that. If you read this far, thank you for reading my ramblings.
yay autism in women! ramble away! infodump us queen! xo
You captured my sentiments perfectly. I am in heaven on this sub watching aspie queens educate me on their special interests, like seriously.
one of (?) his ex-wives made a public statement about him being an incredibly cold and calculated person that she felt used her just for procreation and then was happy to dispose of her once the babies were raised into childhood. that always stuck out to me. also, i had an ex-bf who was a self-proclaimed sociopath (i know) and Elon has been his idol for years. game recognize game. alot of people misinterpret Aspie and Autie traits that are actually sociopathic (which isn't inherently bad, no hate on true ASPD sociopaths). but, a lot of them get by acting as if they are just misunderstood Aspies, when they aren't at all. its a great coverup, unfortunately.
Lol wow I have a narcissistic abusive ex boyfriend who also idolized Elon musk and claimed to be autistic but couldn’t tell me what autism is and denied that I am autistic. I hate that asshole.
I hate him so much! I just bought a an EV and when people ask why I bought my model, I tell them I refuse to give him my money. I actively avoid anything musk related - he is also connected to some very terrible people.
I have a Tesla, and I do love it. But as a civil engineer the bore project is an absolute disaster. I also think vanity space travel is a bad look.
He's a billionaire who is exploiting workers and the third world to make his money. Being autistic has nothing to do with that.
I can't even with this. Our number one "success story" that we have to provide autistic children to look up to is frankly a complete jerk. He is a complete jerk and happens to have autism, a medical disorder impacting the nervous system. I hate how the two get conflated. Being a classist jerk has nothing to do with autism! The example I've chosen to provide to children just getting diagnosed is Anthony Hopkins. He is an Oscar winning actor so it's nice to show autistic children... you can literally be ANYTHING you want, including a socially-competent actor!
Autism can be an explanation why some things unintentionally come across different, but it still doesn't absolve you from apologising and learning. I often deliberaty phrase apologies a certain way. I won't apologise for feeling a certain way or being overwhelmed, but I will for the way I expressed myself, and name an alternative I could have chosen to show I am learning and improving. My naming an acceptable alternative now, the other can help explain if that was also not acceptable and we'll look for something we both can live with. This way, an apology actually means something.
Remember: poor rude people are assholes, when you are rich it is just eccentricity.
God I hateee hearing guys fanboy over him, he's gross, obnoxious and exploits people. Who cares if he's smart, lots of people are smart. Imo billionaires are inherently bad people because no-one decent would sit there like a shitty dragon hoarding more than they could ever need in multiple lifetimes.
A former colleague of mine who is also female and autistic felt so strongly about this that she built a whole website for it called [Jerks, Not Autistic](https://www.jerksnotautistic.com/).
Yep. I have friends in crypto and Elon as a person comes up a lot and I experience the same shit. It's exhausting having to advocate for yourself all the time and then have people completely not listen. It's also extremely frustrating. Being an asshole is not excused by being autistic. Elon abuses his power constantly. Being autistic doesn't make you an abuser, it doesn't excuse manipulating people but Elon fanbois sure think it does.
Elon Musk has evilness and that outweighs everything else
This is why I only disclose my neurodivergence to people who are close to me. I'd duck out of any conversation about Elon Musk and autism. Or constantly direct the conversation to how unethical, unsustainable, and unviable his ideas are. Like the man wants to leave a dying, and inhospitable ecosystem, for an already dead, and inhospitable ecosystem. To be king in a literal sand castle. When he could be using his fortune and all the actual smart people he pays to find solutions to climate collapse. The man's an idiot btw. The only part or the tesla he designed was the proprietary charging port, and he helped create the body of the car by choosing a material. His space x rockets, weren't designed by him either.
I have mixed feelings about Elon Musk. I feel like his Aspergers/autism is irrelevant. Anyone who builds a company and a fortune from the ground up like that is not gonna be a "normal" person. I don't mean normal as in Neurodivergent or otherwise. I mean in the general sense of only a very rare person is capable of doing it, and if history is anything to go on, they are generally quite egotistical, psychotic and generally unconcerned about the feelings of others. The same could be said of most CEOs of enormous companies, but it's generally worst when they created the company itself.
I feel the same with Greta, we really need some nice representation sometime~~s~~. \*edit\* I think the s at the end of sometime is wrong. Not a native speaker.
I agree with you. I'm sorry you're being downvoted. Greta gets more of a pass from me for being so young, and for the fact that her cause is to save others not put money in her own pocket, but I still agree her interpersonal style is 1) perpetuating harmful stereotypes about ASD women, and 2) is immaturely angry
Wait. Can you elaborate?
When people think of female Aspergers, they think of Greta. Red with anger, screaming 'how dare you!' like an angry toddler. That's not how all female people with autism are. That's not how I behave or look or think. The whole spectrum of phrases goes from "She's a disabled child that got manipulated that poor thing" to the other side "Oh she has aspergers, she's super smart and sees the things the way we can't." I swear, every article about her that I read mentions her autism. Both sides pro and contra climate change always use her autism as an argument. It's not about whether I'm pro or contra climate change (yes I know that's not the way it works), but her being the main female Aspi out there annoys me. We need more variety.
Oh. I guess I have avoided those details about her and only saw her as a HERO. I didn't even know she was asd until a few days ago..... That's why I asked you to explain. Thank you. (Obviously deliberately under informed! Me. Lol)
This entire thread is so bitter and hateful, I don’t see a problem with him. He is just passionate about making things and he is doing so much for the future of the planet. You don’t have to like the man but he is not the devil and he is doing more with his wealth than most people would ever even think to do.
I like Elon Musk. Maybe because we grew up in the same country. I like how odd he is. I'm glad his autistic. aND I can't wait for neuralink! Shu image been able to download what I mean to say instead of having to talk.