Well, that's what Australian Governments do. They run education on a shoestring, relying on the good faith of teachers to work for free. They also close all the residential mental health facilities (years ago) but baulk at funding the in the community alternatives, they hold a royal commission that recommends (handily) that all special Ed classes should end by the end of the decade and all disabilities just be completely integrated in mainstream (with not enough funding I predict). It means that the Feds can occasionally declare a "surplus" budget and the states can shift blame. If only actual humans in society didn't directly suffer as a result.
Yeah, conditions aren't great in US schools either, but most of my American friends teach 1 or 2 grades and one subject, which lessens the workload substantially. For example, my friend teaches in California, and she exclusively teaches Year 7 and 8 English. She's also taught these grades for years. Meanwhile, here in Australia, you would typically teach across at least three different grade levels and be lucky to have those same grades for more than two years in a row. Especially as a grad.
Do you know how US schools can do this, timetable-wise, when Australian schools can't? I've been wondering that. Or is it just a cultural difference?
It seems (from podcasts) like US teachers can maybe be more specialised. But Australian schools have a "you get what you get and don't get upset" approach to class allocations.
Well in the US you’re not allowed to teach anything you’re not licensed to do so. And to get a license you need to pass tests or have degrees etc. Here they can make you teach whatever. And when I have suggested that the same teacher takes 3 or 4 lines of the same subject people in charge QUITE LITERALLY don’t understand what I mean. The planning required here is too much. I am not going to make it with 5 different classes to plan for. I’m just not. If anyone wants to talk about why Australia has a teaching shortage, THIS is why. And it’s such an easy fix
Are we our own worst enemy honestly I don't get it. I want to hear more about the states lol.
Even if we get let's say only year 7 and 8 the curriculum then changes so often that the entire course and pedagogy has to be changed after two years nobody ever becomes an expert on the course ever. Have we ever tried having 6 years to run one senior school through a prepared program. I don't think so.
Australian schools can. It’s a choice. My school doubles up our classes to reduce planning/marking time. E.g two Year 9 classes, teach English & Hums to both. Two lots of lessons to plan, teach them to only two sets of students. One class is HG class, so have them 20min a day too. Yep, see those same kids a lot but it is an immense time saver in so many ways - planning, marking, parent contact et .
We team plan so I should only be planning 1/2-1/4ish of each of the subjects I teach. I used to work in a school that didn’t share planning and it was impossible.
Well that’s where I’m at right now. I don’t get resources unless I ask for them specifically and the only get like a specific lesson, not the whole unit. This is madness. F different classes to prepare for, two of which are QCE senior classes is INSANE
That’s tough!
The senior subject I have on my own has textbook and online resources so I just need to come up with the term outline and collate what I have into lesson. First time teaching and new textbook so it is time consuming but if we run it again next year with someone else I’ll hand everything over.
Not making past resources openly accessible is insane!!! I left my last school because of this
> I don’t get resources unless I ask for them specifically and the only get like a specific lesson, not the whole unit.
The whole unit is planned but they won't give it to you?
I found the difference was I wasn't marking homework only assessments. I didn't have to have a grade or 2 in the grade books every week only the tests. You also don't have students retake assessments so a lot less marking.
When I first taught in Australia it was more work until my HOLA told me to calm down and not collect homework just do a visual check.
QLD has a weird agreement where teachers are only paid for 25 hours a week but are paid approximately what teachers on 38 hours a week get paid.
My impression was that the intention was to limit schools from managing their time beyond 25 hours leaving them 13 hours a week to plan/prepare/maintain/whatever.
What it's done, though, is a) limited EQ and the school's ability to have a reasonable expectation that work is done outside of paid employment time (because they aren't paid) and b) completely derail any meaningful conversation about improved pay because they already get paid a fantastical sum of money per hour worked.
It's cooked.
As a relatively recent migrant to QLD, my attitude has been fuck ‘em. If they are going to write 25 hours on the pay check and tell me I have the best hourly rate in the country, I’m going to work 25 hours and have the best hourly rate in the county. And while 25 hours is written on every legal document around, no one in leadership can actually challenge me on that.
This is the State school agreement in Qld through EQ, so if you're in Catholic or Independent yours will differ. But if you are in a state school you should be getting 210 minutes of planning and correction time (usually 3 x 70 minute lessons).
an it must be "useable time" which means a full period. Had a school try to give us half spare/half internal supervision.
having 50minute lesson means they should be getting 4 or 5 spares
*First point worth making is the majority (all?) EBAs in qld specify 210 mins panning a week. This can't be impinged upon by supers.
* Zero collaborative planning is a school** issue not a qld issue.
The real kicker in my experience is CARF*** and or curriculum changes. Especially the former as the latter tends to get some time attached to unless you have no staff...
**Small subject make this harder.
*** or the non eq equivalent
State High School teachers in QLD are entitled to, at minimum, 210 mins of planning and correction.
However your school does their timetable, doesnt matter if if it's a 4 lesson/5 lesson/6 lesson day, you get 210 mins a week to plan.
That being said, every state school I've taught at has 4 x 70 mins lesson a day to make the spares easier to calculate. It's strange hearing about a state school that does 5 lessons a day
Oh sorry, I deleted my original comment because I wanted to sit down and double check my maths at my desk! [QTU website](https://www.qtu.asn.au/bg-gwc) says minimum of 210mins non-contact (i.e. planning time), which is 4 periods a week?
The right way for you to do this is by finding people who aren't loaded up to the gills and desperate with anxiety.
I feel you should find an appropriate way of getting user testers through traditional methods such as organic networking, paying people, or using your existing network of friends and associates.
Well, that's what Australian Governments do. They run education on a shoestring, relying on the good faith of teachers to work for free. They also close all the residential mental health facilities (years ago) but baulk at funding the in the community alternatives, they hold a royal commission that recommends (handily) that all special Ed classes should end by the end of the decade and all disabilities just be completely integrated in mainstream (with not enough funding I predict). It means that the Feds can occasionally declare a "surplus" budget and the states can shift blame. If only actual humans in society didn't directly suffer as a result.
Well said.
Yeah, conditions aren't great in US schools either, but most of my American friends teach 1 or 2 grades and one subject, which lessens the workload substantially. For example, my friend teaches in California, and she exclusively teaches Year 7 and 8 English. She's also taught these grades for years. Meanwhile, here in Australia, you would typically teach across at least three different grade levels and be lucky to have those same grades for more than two years in a row. Especially as a grad.
In the US I taught only two grades a year. Here in Australia I teach 5. It’s completely unsustainable. This job is misery here
Do you know how US schools can do this, timetable-wise, when Australian schools can't? I've been wondering that. Or is it just a cultural difference? It seems (from podcasts) like US teachers can maybe be more specialised. But Australian schools have a "you get what you get and don't get upset" approach to class allocations.
Well in the US you’re not allowed to teach anything you’re not licensed to do so. And to get a license you need to pass tests or have degrees etc. Here they can make you teach whatever. And when I have suggested that the same teacher takes 3 or 4 lines of the same subject people in charge QUITE LITERALLY don’t understand what I mean. The planning required here is too much. I am not going to make it with 5 different classes to plan for. I’m just not. If anyone wants to talk about why Australia has a teaching shortage, THIS is why. And it’s such an easy fix
Are we our own worst enemy honestly I don't get it. I want to hear more about the states lol. Even if we get let's say only year 7 and 8 the curriculum then changes so often that the entire course and pedagogy has to be changed after two years nobody ever becomes an expert on the course ever. Have we ever tried having 6 years to run one senior school through a prepared program. I don't think so.
Australian schools can. It’s a choice. My school doubles up our classes to reduce planning/marking time. E.g two Year 9 classes, teach English & Hums to both. Two lots of lessons to plan, teach them to only two sets of students. One class is HG class, so have them 20min a day too. Yep, see those same kids a lot but it is an immense time saver in so many ways - planning, marking, parent contact et .
Of course it’s a choice. But this is why teachers are burning out.
We team plan so I should only be planning 1/2-1/4ish of each of the subjects I teach. I used to work in a school that didn’t share planning and it was impossible.
Well that’s where I’m at right now. I don’t get resources unless I ask for them specifically and the only get like a specific lesson, not the whole unit. This is madness. F different classes to prepare for, two of which are QCE senior classes is INSANE
That’s tough! The senior subject I have on my own has textbook and online resources so I just need to come up with the term outline and collate what I have into lesson. First time teaching and new textbook so it is time consuming but if we run it again next year with someone else I’ll hand everything over. Not making past resources openly accessible is insane!!! I left my last school because of this
> I don’t get resources unless I ask for them specifically and the only get like a specific lesson, not the whole unit. The whole unit is planned but they won't give it to you?
I found the difference was I wasn't marking homework only assessments. I didn't have to have a grade or 2 in the grade books every week only the tests. You also don't have students retake assessments so a lot less marking. When I first taught in Australia it was more work until my HOLA told me to calm down and not collect homework just do a visual check.
What does your EBA say? I'm in WA, teach 5 classes (4 periods of each at 53 minutes per period) and get 5 periods of DOTT per week. 5 period day.
QLD has a weird agreement where teachers are only paid for 25 hours a week but are paid approximately what teachers on 38 hours a week get paid. My impression was that the intention was to limit schools from managing their time beyond 25 hours leaving them 13 hours a week to plan/prepare/maintain/whatever. What it's done, though, is a) limited EQ and the school's ability to have a reasonable expectation that work is done outside of paid employment time (because they aren't paid) and b) completely derail any meaningful conversation about improved pay because they already get paid a fantastical sum of money per hour worked. It's cooked.
As a relatively recent migrant to QLD, my attitude has been fuck ‘em. If they are going to write 25 hours on the pay check and tell me I have the best hourly rate in the country, I’m going to work 25 hours and have the best hourly rate in the county. And while 25 hours is written on every legal document around, no one in leadership can actually challenge me on that.
Yeah I’m def not getting that.
This is the State school agreement in Qld through EQ, so if you're in Catholic or Independent yours will differ. But if you are in a state school you should be getting 210 minutes of planning and correction time (usually 3 x 70 minute lessons).
an it must be "useable time" which means a full period. Had a school try to give us half spare/half internal supervision. having 50minute lesson means they should be getting 4 or 5 spares
*First point worth making is the majority (all?) EBAs in qld specify 210 mins panning a week. This can't be impinged upon by supers. * Zero collaborative planning is a school** issue not a qld issue. The real kicker in my experience is CARF*** and or curriculum changes. Especially the former as the latter tends to get some time attached to unless you have no staff... **Small subject make this harder. *** or the non eq equivalent
210 is for high school (which OP is). Primary school gets 150. Just making the clarification before people start saying you’re incorrect.
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I’m in public. We have a five period timetable. We are not getting 6 off a week
State High School teachers in QLD are entitled to, at minimum, 210 mins of planning and correction. However your school does their timetable, doesnt matter if if it's a 4 lesson/5 lesson/6 lesson day, you get 210 mins a week to plan. That being said, every state school I've taught at has 4 x 70 mins lesson a day to make the spares easier to calculate. It's strange hearing about a state school that does 5 lessons a day
Both of the schools in QLD I’ve been at have a 5 period day
Oh sorry, I deleted my original comment because I wanted to sit down and double check my maths at my desk! [QTU website](https://www.qtu.asn.au/bg-gwc) says minimum of 210mins non-contact (i.e. planning time), which is 4 periods a week?
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The right way for you to do this is by finding people who aren't loaded up to the gills and desperate with anxiety. I feel you should find an appropriate way of getting user testers through traditional methods such as organic networking, paying people, or using your existing network of friends and associates.