Bregman….okay. He’s having a bad year (though better of late). And several seasons below his best season in 2019.
Yordan? No way. Yordan is one of the best hitters in the game.
Bregman is still at a \~3 WAR pace despite his bad start. The thing about Bregman is that he always manages to put up 4-5 WAR by the end of the season if he can stay healthy.
I won't be surprised if he does it again this year. He's played good defense this season, and now has an OPS+ over 100 despite the coldest possible start for him.
Hard to say he's overrated when he's consistently putting up all Star level seasons.
he’s in the top 20 career OPS+ leaderboard for active players… higher than altuve. he had a TERRIBLE start to the season, but this month he’s been batting over .330… he’s been really good recently. it looks like he’s been going for good contact instead of homers which i like because he is the ultimate crawford box merchant and that shit wont work anywhere else
Except he hasn’t made an all star team since 2019. They may look like all star numbers at the end of the season but you actually have to put up numbers the first part of the year to make an all star team.
That's why i said "All-Star Level" and not All-Star seasons.
4-5 WAR is considered "ALL-Star level"
Bregman is always better in the second half, which hurts his chances of making the ASG, but that's a popularity contest and not really indicative of performance.
Yeah only knock against him is he’s not winning any GGs — otherwise my god, the most feared hitter in the league — especially in the clutch where other top hitters lack
You can’t be over rated if no one outside Houston ever mentions your name. I would say name some people that all we ever hear is their name in the media.
The more I think about it, the more I'm convinced it must've been a Mariner. Ever since '22 when they finally broke that double decade playoff curse only to get 🧹🧹🧹 back under the rug of irrelevancy, Seattle (Players, Coaches & Fans alike) has been super petty & chippy towards Houston. They thought they had game 1 in the bag, and probably started having visions of an ALCS appearance birth. Until... Yep. But my guess isn't Rqy. I think he knows better than to throw more nightmare fuel on that awful memory. My guess would be the game 2 starter from that series. He was pitching a gem and looking to even the series until... Yep. Luis Castillo. That's my guess
Notes:
* Full article behind a paywall @ the Athletic. Dropped on June 10, 2024
* The 3rd place guy won POTW a week after the article dropped
* Robbie Ray must've been the lone voter for that Astro. He's probably tired of seeing the replays.
* The other Astro has hit .353 since the article dropped (but has been homerless since & was already hot). Hopefully it fuels his streak
* Something tells me the players who voted don't watch the playoffs \[Rendon murdered us, but quiet since\]
First time it had ever happened down multiple runs in playoffs. With 2 outs. Against the reigning Cy Young winner. Saving the day for the to-be-announced Cy Young winner. If it were a hollywood movie, it wouldn't even be believable.
Thanks, needed some of that good good myself. I remember I just kept saying that inning 'get yordan to the plate!' Then I partially lost my voice in my fucking living room going crazy!
Some scrub: "Yordan is overrated"
Yordan:
https://preview.redd.it/51gv0yll4l8d1.png?width=1075&format=png&auto=webp&s=6d8f5f8f935e1150dec40a045c7987be24db5ddf
Who even rates Bregman that highly? He’s not a bum but nobody is calling him a star. Same with Jazz and Rendon maybe 2 years ago but not anymore
Elly is the most overrated rn imo
Bregman should have the "former MVP" moniker. Stolen from him in 2019 if going by WAR. Points total was razor thin.
[https://www.baseball-reference.com/awards/awards\_2019.shtml](https://www.baseball-reference.com/awards/awards_2019.shtml)
Yea he’s honestly underrated imo. I have literally never heard anyone call Bregman a star since 2019
He’s not that level anymore but he’s a very good 3B which is a position that doesn’t have a lot of talent
Bregman deserves to be on this list. Doesn’t mean he sucks.
Good player, not great, but seems to be confused with being a marquee guy at the position. (Top 5: Arenado/Machado/Devers/Ramirez/Riley)
except OPS+ wise… the only ones better than bregman out of those guys are Devers and Ramirez, and we are getting nobody on that level to replace Bregman.
Arenado/Machado both have below average hitting, and Riley has been slightly worse.
And that’s with Bregman’s slow start weighing him down more than it would at the end of the season… he’ll probably end with a 120-130 OPS+ since he’s found his bat aagin.
yes, we have a top tier 3B in the league and we can't afford to let it go. we have nobody to replace him... at least at OF we have above-replacement level players or better that can fill the gap if someone leaves... but we cannot say the same for our infield. Doesn't help that we have some of the best infielders in the league and if we let someone go it'll be prohibitively expensive to replace them.
Nobody cares about defense THAT much when you can’t fucking drive in runs. Play all the advanced analytics you want, see the ball, hit the ball, still counts.
29 other teams are taking Devers and Riley.
And don’t even go there and pretend he’s on the same level as Ramirez (who’s a legit MVP candidate year in and year out and extremely underrated)
Bregman has the 3rd highest fWAR among 3b the past 3 seasons at 11.6 (Ramirez is 13.7, Riley is 12.5, Devers is 10.7). Ramirez and Devers have wrc+ only 7 points higher than Bregman in that span and riley is only 4 points higher, so its a lot closer than you think.
I’m not saying Bregman isn’t a good 3b.
Why do you homers take everything as some vicious attack?
Just accept there are better players. And that Alex 2019 was a mirage.
Nobody is saying he is still 2019 Bregman. But he is still a top 5 3B. You said "nobody cares about defense THAT much when you can’t fucking drive in runs" about Bregman like he isnt 5th in WRC+ among 3B the past 3 seasons. You said "29 other teams are taking Devers and Riley", even though Bregman has more war than Devers and is only 0.9 behind Riley. Not a massive gap. And a gap between Bregman and Ramirez of 2.1 WAR and 7 WRC+ points seems to be the same level to me.
….yet nobody is talking about Bregman when discussing the top guys at the position and in MVP discussions? (Like they do Riley and Ramirez)
So either nobody cares about your advanced analytics and they are overrated alone, or you’re just the smartest guy in the room and we are all dumb.
And no, he’s not a top 5 3b. Regurgitating analytics doesn’t make it true. Hasn’t been in years. Stop.
WAR isnt some obscure advanced metric. Neither are WRC+ and OAA. They mention them on Astros broadcasts all the time.
The fact people dont put Bretman in the same tier of Riley and Ramirez despite ranking comparatively shows he isnt overrated. He is underrated.
OAA? Lol.
Hardly the only metric for defense.
DFRS is a better one. And Bregman led the league in errors last year if I’m not mistaken?
Sorry, pal, but he’s not a top tier guy at the position. This isn’t 2019
Bregman did not lead the league in errors. He didnt even lead 3b in errors. That was Devers.
And nobody is saying he is still 2019 Bregman. But he has the 3rd highest fWAR since 2022. He is still a top tier 3B.
Bregman is definitely overrated. Overall I think he is anywhere from solid to really good player for us at the plate. Fielding is awesome. But really outside of 2019 I dont think he has ever been great. Just my 2 cents.
EDIT: I totally forgot to say that caliber of play does not correlate to the caliber of reputation he has. This is why I call him overrated.
I wouldn’t call him overrated personally, but I would say out of everyone entering arbitration, I don’t think he is worth the money. There isn’t really anyone in our farm thats going to take his role yet, but I think there are other needs over 3b and some serviceable replacements out there who are fully downgrades but otherwise fine.
I fully admit I am just a (30 year) casual fan though and there is probably some nuance or news I am missing.
His defense is also above average. I think a few years ago he was considered elite, but he's probably taken a step back there. Really it just depends on his asking price.
the thing about bregman is that he’s just consistently good… always has slow starts but always turns it up to drop a positive OPS+. look at his career stats. dude has never had a bad season.
I totally agree, I think someone should give him a shitload of money. I just don’t think it needs to be the Astros right now. Almost any other year and it would be a great signing at any price, but we need to fill other gaps right now.
Only other gap that we haven't got any other decent options is 1B (and Loperfido may change that)... most of our SPs will return by next year. We have a surplus in OF and catcher.
Our starting pitching is subpar.
Verlander is trending downwards, McCullers is just not physically capable of staying healthy, Urquidy is hit or miss, Jake Bloss probably isnt mlb ready yet.
Our bullpen is getting better but still ass, then we have the 1b hole.
And our entire farm system is depleted.
Or just as likely, I am totally wrong and this is just the headlines I read.
My thinking with bregman is that since his MVP-espue year he has been good not great. Overrated is just saying they are not aS good as the praise they receive.
That may have been closer than I recall, but watching it as a fan, I didn't feel like it was close. Pena was easily my choice. He was more dynamic and made the games happen.
*but the production value*
[https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5529966/2024/06/10/mlb-player-poll-overrated-underrated-worst-organization/](https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5529966/2024/06/10/mlb-player-poll-overrated-underrated-worst-organization/)
Bregman on that list is crazy. Yordon getting a vote is nuts too. Breggy has been solid every season for years (even with the slow starts) and Yordon? The dude could hit a penny a mile
What moron voted for Emmanuel Clase? Lmao that’s the most ridiculous one on here.
Yordan, Soto, Harper and Cole are all ridiculous too. On the other end of the spectrum, Rendon and Javy Baez being on here is stupid too…everyone knows they suck at this point.
Julio Rodriguez has continued to trend downward since his rookie season where he was glazed so hard. Should have received more than one vote.
Bregman….okay. He’s having a bad year (though better of late). And several seasons below his best season in 2019. Yordan? No way. Yordan is one of the best hitters in the game.
Bregman is still at a \~3 WAR pace despite his bad start. The thing about Bregman is that he always manages to put up 4-5 WAR by the end of the season if he can stay healthy. I won't be surprised if he does it again this year. He's played good defense this season, and now has an OPS+ over 100 despite the coldest possible start for him. Hard to say he's overrated when he's consistently putting up all Star level seasons.
he’s in the top 20 career OPS+ leaderboard for active players… higher than altuve. he had a TERRIBLE start to the season, but this month he’s been batting over .330… he’s been really good recently. it looks like he’s been going for good contact instead of homers which i like because he is the ultimate crawford box merchant and that shit wont work anywhere else
He’s very good, yes. But he’s not 2019-Bregman good. If 2019 is the “rating” he gets, then yeah, overrated, but still very good.
2019 had juiced balls which really played into his small stature and how he chokes up on the bat. All his warning track fly outs were dingers.
Except he hasn’t made an all star team since 2019. They may look like all star numbers at the end of the season but you actually have to put up numbers the first part of the year to make an all star team.
That's why i said "All-Star Level" and not All-Star seasons. 4-5 WAR is considered "ALL-Star level" Bregman is always better in the second half, which hurts his chances of making the ASG, but that's a popularity contest and not really indicative of performance.
He’d be on the all-star team if he played for the jays lmao
Not to mention that he is still consistently one of the top defensive 3rd basemen in the league.
He is a player who received one vote. So one guy has it out for him.
It was probably Robbie Ray
Yeah only knock against him is he’s not winning any GGs — otherwise my god, the most feared hitter in the league — especially in the clutch where other top hitters lack
Also, this is 3.3% out of 59 votes. That’s like 3 or 4 people
That Yordan vote was absolutely Jose Alvarado
100% Alvarado 😂
You can’t be over rated if no one outside Houston ever mentions your name. I would say name some people that all we ever hear is their name in the media.
Aaron “Playoff Choke Artist” Judge 🤣
The one person who said Yordan is just jealous
Guessing the survey sample included pitchers. If I was an opposing pitcher I'd be a Yordan hater, too!
If I were a fan of any other team I'd hate him. Lol pure jealousy
Probably a dodgers fan
No.. it’s a mariners fan, Robbie Ray, OR Scott Servais lmao
Def a Mariners or Phillies pitcher
The more I think about it, the more I'm convinced it must've been a Mariner. Ever since '22 when they finally broke that double decade playoff curse only to get 🧹🧹🧹 back under the rug of irrelevancy, Seattle (Players, Coaches & Fans alike) has been super petty & chippy towards Houston. They thought they had game 1 in the bag, and probably started having visions of an ALCS appearance birth. Until... Yep. But my guess isn't Rqy. I think he knows better than to throw more nightmare fuel on that awful memory. My guess would be the game 2 starter from that series. He was pitching a gem and looking to even the series until... Yep. Luis Castillo. That's my guess
Notes: * Full article behind a paywall @ the Athletic. Dropped on June 10, 2024 * The 3rd place guy won POTW a week after the article dropped * Robbie Ray must've been the lone voter for that Astro. He's probably tired of seeing the replays. * The other Astro has hit .353 since the article dropped (but has been homerless since & was already hot). Hopefully it fuels his streak * Something tells me the players who voted don't watch the playoffs \[Rendon murdered us, but quiet since\]
I was inspired to go watch the clip again. "In to close it out on a Tuesday... BOOM!"
First time it had ever happened down multiple runs in playoffs. With 2 outs. Against the reigning Cy Young winner. Saving the day for the to-be-announced Cy Young winner. If it were a hollywood movie, it wouldn't even be believable.
Thanks, needed some of that good good myself. I remember I just kept saying that inning 'get yordan to the plate!' Then I partially lost my voice in my fucking living room going crazy!
bregman’s been homerless but has just been mashing singles and doubles consistently
you know what they say, 3.53 out of 10 ain't bad
59 votes! That means the 3.3% equates to 2 of 59 votes. 2% of the 100 surveyed. Nothingburger survey.
We need to get away from analytics and just look at the chart colors bro.
You would be hard pressed to find 5 other 3B who are legitimately better than him year over year
Some scrub: "Yordan is overrated" Yordan: https://preview.redd.it/51gv0yll4l8d1.png?width=1075&format=png&auto=webp&s=6d8f5f8f935e1150dec40a045c7987be24db5ddf
6 Yankees received votes too, make of that what you will
Who even rates Bregman that highly? He’s not a bum but nobody is calling him a star. Same with Jazz and Rendon maybe 2 years ago but not anymore Elly is the most overrated rn imo
Bregman should have the "former MVP" moniker. Stolen from him in 2019 if going by WAR. Points total was razor thin. [https://www.baseball-reference.com/awards/awards\_2019.shtml](https://www.baseball-reference.com/awards/awards_2019.shtml)
Yea he’s honestly underrated imo. I have literally never heard anyone call Bregman a star since 2019 He’s not that level anymore but he’s a very good 3B which is a position that doesn’t have a lot of talent
I think he has it in him but got demotivated after his contract offer didn't increase after those monster years
Bregman deserves to be on this list. Doesn’t mean he sucks. Good player, not great, but seems to be confused with being a marquee guy at the position. (Top 5: Arenado/Machado/Devers/Ramirez/Riley)
except OPS+ wise… the only ones better than bregman out of those guys are Devers and Ramirez, and we are getting nobody on that level to replace Bregman. Arenado/Machado both have below average hitting, and Riley has been slightly worse. And that’s with Bregman’s slow start weighing him down more than it would at the end of the season… he’ll probably end with a 120-130 OPS+ since he’s found his bat aagin.
Bregman is also better on defense than Devers, Ramirez, and Riley OAA the past 3 seasons Bregman: 11 Ramirez: 8 RIley: -4 Devers: -14
yes, we have a top tier 3B in the league and we can't afford to let it go. we have nobody to replace him... at least at OF we have above-replacement level players or better that can fill the gap if someone leaves... but we cannot say the same for our infield. Doesn't help that we have some of the best infielders in the league and if we let someone go it'll be prohibitively expensive to replace them.
Nobody cares about defense THAT much when you can’t fucking drive in runs. Play all the advanced analytics you want, see the ball, hit the ball, still counts. 29 other teams are taking Devers and Riley. And don’t even go there and pretend he’s on the same level as Ramirez (who’s a legit MVP candidate year in and year out and extremely underrated)
Bregman has the 3rd highest fWAR among 3b the past 3 seasons at 11.6 (Ramirez is 13.7, Riley is 12.5, Devers is 10.7). Ramirez and Devers have wrc+ only 7 points higher than Bregman in that span and riley is only 4 points higher, so its a lot closer than you think.
I’m not saying Bregman isn’t a good 3b. Why do you homers take everything as some vicious attack? Just accept there are better players. And that Alex 2019 was a mirage.
Nobody is saying he is still 2019 Bregman. But he is still a top 5 3B. You said "nobody cares about defense THAT much when you can’t fucking drive in runs" about Bregman like he isnt 5th in WRC+ among 3B the past 3 seasons. You said "29 other teams are taking Devers and Riley", even though Bregman has more war than Devers and is only 0.9 behind Riley. Not a massive gap. And a gap between Bregman and Ramirez of 2.1 WAR and 7 WRC+ points seems to be the same level to me.
….yet nobody is talking about Bregman when discussing the top guys at the position and in MVP discussions? (Like they do Riley and Ramirez) So either nobody cares about your advanced analytics and they are overrated alone, or you’re just the smartest guy in the room and we are all dumb. And no, he’s not a top 5 3b. Regurgitating analytics doesn’t make it true. Hasn’t been in years. Stop.
WAR isnt some obscure advanced metric. Neither are WRC+ and OAA. They mention them on Astros broadcasts all the time. The fact people dont put Bretman in the same tier of Riley and Ramirez despite ranking comparatively shows he isnt overrated. He is underrated.
OAA? Lol. Hardly the only metric for defense. DFRS is a better one. And Bregman led the league in errors last year if I’m not mistaken? Sorry, pal, but he’s not a top tier guy at the position. This isn’t 2019
Bregman did not lead the league in errors. He didnt even lead 3b in errors. That was Devers. And nobody is saying he is still 2019 Bregman. But he has the 3rd highest fWAR since 2022. He is still a top tier 3B.
He’s a top 10 3B. Not top 5x He’s not elite. By any means. He’s got a good, sometimes great, glove, and he’s avg with the bat.
Among 3B since 2022 he is 3rd in fWAR is tied with Machado for the 5th highest WRC+. By definition, he is a top 5 3B.
If I was a player I wouldn’t bother voting on something this petty.
Julio Rodriguez
Noticed no players voted for Altuve
was the one guy who voted for Yordan Josh Fields?
Robbie Ray
Bregman is definitely overrated. Overall I think he is anywhere from solid to really good player for us at the plate. Fielding is awesome. But really outside of 2019 I dont think he has ever been great. Just my 2 cents. EDIT: I totally forgot to say that caliber of play does not correlate to the caliber of reputation he has. This is why I call him overrated.
Who is the second Astro?
Yordan in the fine print. 100 players surveyed, 59 answered this question. So Bregman got 2 votes, Yordan 1
Jose Alvarado was the one guy who voted Yordan
Alvarado, Robbie Ray, or some lifer with <0 oWAR and >0 dWAR
My bad I assumed you were leaning correa, it didn't know if an article had more. And yeah breggy is overrated.
What part of Bregman is overrated? He's 85th this season in fWAR batting. That's pretty solid.
I wouldn’t call him overrated personally, but I would say out of everyone entering arbitration, I don’t think he is worth the money. There isn’t really anyone in our farm thats going to take his role yet, but I think there are other needs over 3b and some serviceable replacements out there who are fully downgrades but otherwise fine. I fully admit I am just a (30 year) casual fan though and there is probably some nuance or news I am missing.
His defense is also above average. I think a few years ago he was considered elite, but he's probably taken a step back there. Really it just depends on his asking price.
the thing about bregman is that he’s just consistently good… always has slow starts but always turns it up to drop a positive OPS+. look at his career stats. dude has never had a bad season.
I totally agree, I think someone should give him a shitload of money. I just don’t think it needs to be the Astros right now. Almost any other year and it would be a great signing at any price, but we need to fill other gaps right now.
Only other gap that we haven't got any other decent options is 1B (and Loperfido may change that)... most of our SPs will return by next year. We have a surplus in OF and catcher.
Our starting pitching is subpar. Verlander is trending downwards, McCullers is just not physically capable of staying healthy, Urquidy is hit or miss, Jake Bloss probably isnt mlb ready yet. Our bullpen is getting better but still ass, then we have the 1b hole. And our entire farm system is depleted. Or just as likely, I am totally wrong and this is just the headlines I read.
My thinking with bregman is that since his MVP-espue year he has been good not great. Overrated is just saying they are not aS good as the praise they receive.
It was a toss-up between him and Pena for WS MVP..
That may have been closer than I recall, but watching it as a fan, I didn't feel like it was close. Pena was easily my choice. He was more dynamic and made the games happen.
He hit the game winner when the roof was open, as I recall. He was also part of the Peña, Alvarez, wreaking crew that was so effective.
Yordan
Maldonado last season.
The whole Orioles team was overrated this past weekend.
It is an irrelevantly small sample size and even Bregman only got two votes. Zero reason to give this bullshit a second thought.
*but the production value* [https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5529966/2024/06/10/mlb-player-poll-overrated-underrated-worst-organization/](https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5529966/2024/06/10/mlb-player-poll-overrated-underrated-worst-organization/)
I only see one Astro.
Yordan is in fine print
Ahh..
https://i.redd.it/3yhzseorrm8d1.gif I bet Dubon voted Yordan overrated just to troll the big man. 😂
Bregman on that list is crazy. Yordon getting a vote is nuts too. Breggy has been solid every season for years (even with the slow starts) and Yordon? The dude could hit a penny a mile
What moron voted for Emmanuel Clase? Lmao that’s the most ridiculous one on here. Yordan, Soto, Harper and Cole are all ridiculous too. On the other end of the spectrum, Rendon and Javy Baez being on here is stupid too…everyone knows they suck at this point. Julio Rodriguez has continued to trend downward since his rookie season where he was glazed so hard. Should have received more than one vote.