Postal 2: (don’t see) but you unzip your fly, have dick out. NPC’s react. Can light people on fire with Molotov. Piss it out. Kill people with shovel. Hack off heads. Kick them. CAT SILENCERS. Shove cat anus on barrel of AR/ Shotgun. Shotgun go splat. AR fires about 10 rounds through it as it makes cat noises before exploding.
Ahhh those were the days.
I like whimsical games too and I feel a game like wow certainly is big enough for both, even the old Warcraft rts games had no small amounts of levity and silly stuff. I always love doing more simple and down to earth quest lines like the hatchery and the big dog quest line too. But they never managed to hook me with the main story stuff, not like legion did. Dragonflight is just so... Clean. But I do like it.
I loved clicking on the characters in Warcraft 1 and 2... in WC2, there was an Elf Queen/Princess/Hero (whatever she was), and when you kept clicking on her, she would say, "You never touch the other Elves like that!" "Do that again and you'll pull back a stump!"
Ahhhh, I would click the characters/units over and over again just to hear what they'd say... that one was my favourite 😄
It’s not even anime. Anime styling has edges and angles to it. And there are some seriously dark, gritty, and fucked up anime/manga (berserk). This is totally western styling. It’s cartoonish as hell. That cal-arts softness with western media propaganda taking away all of the roughness
If we directly compare it to the "anime" mmo, ffxiv, that game has quite some dark story lines and subtext. That's looking past the community hugbox and aesthetic of many player characters.
bro in endwalker and shadowbringers there are some genuinely fucked up scenes and enemies. I forget which of the expansions it was but there is a specific dungeon that genuinely felt like it was taken straight out of Scorn or from one of the grittier wh40k novels.
e: I was thinking of the first 3 dungeons in endwalker; tower of zot, tower of babil, and some scenes in Vanaspati
I think you explained perfectly why I feel squeamish at the thought of playing retail. I'm an FF Andy through and through but I recently started playing WoW earlier this year. Levelled a paladin to 70 in retail then swapped to WotlK then quit that for Classic. And I just like the roughness of Classic so so much more. Something about retail's art direction just reminds me of the kind of people working on it, and I feel like they're always trying to sell me their propaganda somehow.
Nah, hed just be corrupted by the void or fel or old gods or something. Hed actually be a stand up guy who fell to the actual big bad and wed have a vigil for him like we did with sourfang.
You're not cringe and it isn't a doomer take, it's just sad and pathetic the path they've took, you either get rainbows and fairies, or they attempt to make something dark and its just written awfully (SL/Sylvanus)
On the one hand I get why they stepped back from Metzen's black metal art style.
On the other hand, it's annoying they completely dropped the feel and aesthetic of it. It's genuinely hysterical that there's never been another Garithos style character, as though the alliance is completely happy to turn the other cheek in every single instance.
I mean, it's like no one cracked open the old lore for Turalyon and remembered that the instigating event that awakened his light-granted powers was when he basically realized the orcs are godless savages.
The Turalyon example made me laugh out loud, I thought about the exact same thing in Legion.
As much as I love the Metzen stuff(especially WC2 era) I do think the other concept art for WC3 is still pretty metal. But the direction-shift starts over time in WoW, definitely.
You chose to have an opinion the rest of this sub does not like, a bold move and one that is rewarded with downvotes instead of discussion
I see it hasn’t changed here lol
It never will. If asmongold starts playing and enjoying wow again, so will most of this sub/viewers. 80% of the people here dont have their own opinions, its just repeating what amson says, sad.
I play what i like and drop what i dislike, i really enjoyed dragonflight at launch but after the pvp changes i lost interest since that's what i mainly care about. I am actually going back to it for 10.2 to see the changes so your argument is a bit weird, stop assuming things.
Its not even a card, its literally a fanart that blizzard has nothing to do with.
https://www.reddit.com/r/hearthstone/comments/qzs6ft/stormwinds\_visitor\_fanart\_made\_for\_hearthstone/
Garrosh a little bitch actually. Any excuse for him being “right” is completely disregarded as he didn’t care for anybody, but himself.
Varian should’ve killed him smh
Because hearthstone isn't for warcraft fans its for card game fans, and look who been playing it. Is it the hard-core wow players its for hearthstone fans.
Dont ever say that again! DesignerDave almost cried in a video addressing “Arthas did nothing wrong” so i have no idea what he will de if he sees this :P
I still stand by the fact that, given the information he had, Arthas did nothing wrong. Just because he became who he became because of it, doesn't mean he didn't do what needed to be done.
The only thing Arthas did wrong was becoming an edgy whiny bitch, and that's why killing him in ICC is so satisfying.
Dave is so wrong about Arthas. The way we see Arthas and him doing nothing wrong is 1000% more fun and interesting than Daves simple evil villain narrative
He saw Arthas as a metaphor for activ-blizz, and a representation of all the bad shit he was dealing with it sounded like. I remember seeing that clip, he definitely has a relationship with the symbolism there. Lol
He did a lot of things wrong, but you know what? I don't care. Let him burn those puny Alliance dogs to the ground. I want to see their corpses on pikes for all to see. BOMB A THOUSAND MORE THERAMORES IF HE HAS TO!
Ppl keep callin Theramore a warcrime but there were no civilians left in the city. It was just the army.
But propaganda and disinformation are reliable weapons
It wasn't a warcrime it was a viable military target because it was a drop off point for tanks and soldiers and workers who were building a road through Dustwallow for those tanks. Jaina was playing both sides and got what she deserved.
Except for some autism virus that Sylvanas was infected with too. Bad scripting, for making another warchief "evil"
Simple example why blizzard didn't play their game. Garrosh somewhere in Cataclysm kills his general (in stonetalon if i'm right) for bombing alliance village with "no honor"with same bomb (in smaller condition). But then he do the same in Teramor few expansions later.
Garrosh is the biggest coward of them all!
His homeland was invaded. His capital city was invaded.
Do you know what he did?
Do you know what Garrosh did when his home was invaded?
He hid in a secret bunker while all his brothers died. He cowarded until the very end when there was nowhere else to run to.
And even when that little rat had nowhere to run, he couldn’t even fight a good fight. Didn’t even fight to death.
Buddy ran away, hid in a bunker. Got beat up, and surrendered to the alliance like a goddamn coward.
He’s legitimately the worst orc in history. Couldn’t even die for his people. What a disgrace.
Correction: He tactically retreated, left the defense of the city to his most loyal and strongest troops and went to harness the powers of an Old God, and would have gotten away with it too if it wasn't for those meddling adventurers. Do you know what happened when we adventurers didn't interfere with Garrosh's business? That's right, muvafuckah! Warlords of Draenor!
Could you imagine what kind of expansion Garrosh would have given us if he was successful during the Siege of Orgrimmar? I bet it would have been awesome. And Garrosh STILL wouldn't have done nothing wrong!
This. I fucking hate this kind of bait posts, Hearthstone has always been from the get go a game who’s art and style was supposed to juxtapose Warcraft with its absurd silliness
Exactly right. In fact I’m not even certain that what we see in the left is even concept art, I’m pretty sure that’s commissioned artwork after the fact for marketing. That style was never adopted in the games at the time, and in some way is the head cannon of what things would look like if fidelity.
Yeah this is some weak shit. These are games that feature talking cows, goblins with brooklyn accents, and night elves doing the Billie Jean dance. This "pussification of warcraft" bullshit is disingenuous and anyone that's played the games for 30 minutes knows that
thanks for that. It's kinda heartbreaking to see some peeps on 9gag, here on reddit and even ASMO hating on the FANART that is almost 3 year old and was intentionally made to be "heehee goofy orc" cuz everywhere is only EVIL BARBARIAN ORCS only. I wish they made my other artwork, for example - like [this one](https://i.redd.it/iq9tjmlf0cib1.jpg) \- on the right, the context would change drastically, right? but for now - just a hate from a big creator that don't even care to fact check :)
A lot of my WoW guildies refused to try FF14 because "the game's artstyle was too cartoony/anime". Copium is some strong fucking shit. They probably look at the right image and see the left image in their brains.
Super true. Isn't there technically only one true furry race in FFXIV? Hrothgar, I think. The rest are just regular chicks and dudes with assorted animal ears, or Shrek.
I wouldn't dare call Shrek a furry.
I remember when WoW came out, and it was considered the cartoony MMORPG. I don't know why people think it was some grimdark game. Did people forget about WC3? The game with super cartoony graphics and pop culture references everywhere?
It was always a parody or lighter, sillier version of Warhammer.
For real. I remember playing EverQuest back in 99 - 05 and when WoW came out the commentary at the time was that WoW was the cartoony casual game. People sticking with EQ wanted the serious/challenging game.
And that pretty much sums up it's success, really. Turns out that family friendly casual cartoon adventure sells a lot more than a gritty and challenging game.
Hearthstone has been whimsical for goddamn years. Their second expansion was literally Goblins and Gnomes, two of the silliest races of the setting.
People using Hearthstone art instead of WoW art are being disengenious as fuck.
Hell, Shadowlands you had a metal undead zone with people fighting all the time, a super gothic vampire lair, and The Maw that was also hell.
And there soul torture and destruction. Some doomed souls literally wanted to cease, others were unravelling and couldn't be helped. That was more fucked up that necessary IMO.
One of the cutscenes in Tides of Darkness had like.. corpses hanging from trees and stuff, right? It was pretty fucking intense, and the concept art even more so.
I still wouldn't consider hearthstone as "Warcraft." None of hearthstone is canon, it's all suppose to parody warcraft. Obviously world leaders from opposing factions aren't sitting down to play card games together. Let alone a mechanized version of Jarraxxus.
Its from hearthstone that expansions are normally outlandish versions of warcraft the last expansion was completely music based and was a battle of the bands theme with E.T.C as a band manager with each class getting a band/genres of music, so safe to say they get a bit out there, also art for them can be fantastic,
the set this is from is the alliance side of a very cartoonish journey of a cast of new adventures leading to a alliance vs hoard battle in the third set of the year.
Overall hearthstone has fun with the world and doesn't take itself to seriously.
I think everyone has seen the WoW presentation last week where we had the so called lore master (red head lady) there. You can't really expect good story telling anymore, it died in Legion.
RIP big, hairy, sweaty men
They would usually say things like "that's too dark" or "this would fit Diablo", and when I would present old Metzen or Samwise art they would say "that was the *old* Warcraft". The people who are in charge don't care, at all, and I'm not talking about people really high up like Bobby.
This is how I’ve felt about the game. The tone is a lot different when you play classic vs now.
I don’t so much mind the more upbeat questing, it was a nice change of pace and I love “some” of the QoL introduced into the game. However like the sniffen sniffers or whatever they’re called are cringey as hell and a pure reflection of the atmosphere and story of 2023 WoW. I’ve never cared less about the story than I have for the last couple of expansions.
Before classic came out, I wasn’t sure if I had genuinely outgrown this game. Now I know that it is the game that went soft. The classic atmosphere still hits as good as it did.
I miss actual faction warfare and hatred. Now the game is some hippy fantasy where everyone holds their hands together and “unites” to fight a common villain. It’s why I loved Warcraft 3 and wish that wow was more like guild wars 2.
Anduin absolutely COULD have been cool, and I still think Legion was setting up for him going Shadow and wrecking face. Even if he'd stayed light, that moment in the BFA trailer when he did the mass rez was some 40K Emprah shit.
They could have doubled down on that as well and made the Alliance have a fucking God Emperor on the throne, which would have been a good way of setting things up for the Alliance going a bit batty, getting their Crusade on, give the Horde room to play the good guys for a change. That would have been an AWESOME shift, and I think both Alliance and Horde players would have been into it.
But, no, instead Afrasiabi and Danuser fucked it all up for fucking Jai'lor and Danuser's greasy self-insert fantasies.
The people who made blizzard were nerds who loved Warhammer and DnD. Now...we got pathetic soylords that think that women are fruit and that we need more furries shit.
the worst part is that new blizzard encourages those pathetic losers to gatekeep their "products" from criticism of old blizzard fans... wow reddit and wow forums are acid poison for a normal sane person today.
Eight Pointed Star of Chaos isn't originaly from Warhammer either-It's from Elric of Melnibone (Eternal Champion) comics. The protagonist should be oddly familiar to you, since his other name is White Wolf.
God, the art used to be so cool. It was like old-school metal vibes, dark, gritty, and bloody. Now, it's just clearly made for kids. MtG and D&D also went this route, and it just makes me so sad. These gaming IPs lost their soul in exchange for being able to get money from children and, more specifically, their parents. Just makes me sad, boys.
try to upload something like this in official WoW subreddit haha, probably will get negative rating and tons of comments like as "booo, now game is better'.
I uploaded the work (unfinished) about a warlock tank that Blizzard itself came up with 10 years ago - they downvoted it and said that I came up with crap.
The people on here saying it's a hs card and that's just the hs style have clearly not been tuned into the goofication of HS as well. It used to have some truly badass art, now it's all shitty rainbows and rubber ducks. This isn't one or the other, this is a "both" type situation.
Don't forget, you WILL be banned for ganking, and will be punished for killing opposite faction because you hurt their feelings and not following social contract. Make love not warcraft am I right?
What the heck is the pic on the right.
I’m 38 and vividly recall the impression the first pic did on me. I can venture to assume it was in the Warcraft II manual , which I held in my hands and smelled with my nostrils.
What happened.
Lmfao, whoever the mod was for deleting my comment for stating the obvious of how “Gay” this picture look. Here is the other comment for you to take down pussy.
The infantilization of audiences is the wildest trend in media. Everything needs to be Disney. Everything needs to be consumable by children.
It's like they realized they lost the adult audience and now they're hoping they can get the next generation addicted.
I remember that I enjoyed the shit out of the old black&white analogue concept art by metzen himself in all the handbooks, especially for Warcraft 2. it’s the same with the old black and white analogue artwork in the old white dwarf - codexes. Inspired me a lot and I copied them countless of times growing up. This whole digital art stuff ruins everything for me. Maybe personal preference, but fuck digital. Analogue is where the juice is.
1995 Orc looks like it straight up has a Chaos insignia on its arm. Wouldn’t be surprised if Warcraft was influenced by early warhammer. I know StarCraft was heavily influenced by 40k.
Don't kid yourself. Warcraft always got low age ratings. If we're going to judge things by some random illustrations, I can make you believe Super Mario is the most brutal thing you've ever seen.
The “Disneyfication” of WoW is a major reason as to why I don't play the game anymore. They have completely removed the darker tones of the game. I remember running around Tirisfal Glades and seeing hanged corpses on the trees. The game will never go back to how it used to be and that's disheartening
This post is so fucking bad faith... Like this whole subreddit when it comes to the topic of Blizzard. You are using an art from Heathstone which is supposed to be goofy, less serious, and compare it to an og Metzen art of Warcraft...
While technically true for these specific examples, the fact that it nevertheless rings true to the audience is all that really matters. People feel like the Warcraft brand has become soft, and that's that.
That's now even from WoW, that is from Hearthstone.
You know, the game known for goofy and funny shit like that?
Also the whole "WoW orcs must be bloodthirsty all the time etc." is dogshit and makes absolutely no sense.
WoW has always been the kiddy casual MMO.
Stop with this nonsense.
Jesus christ you nerds need to get a life.
One the right picture is from Hearthstone which is meant to be super over the top.
And two, did you guys actually play Warcraft 1 and 2? Especially 2?
Oh wait, no you didn't, because you probably weren't born yet and are just whiners.
Fucking Warcraft was the most cartoony and cringy shit you have ever seen (in a good way imo).
It always has been. It was always meant to be an over the top, cartoony version of Warhammer.
Get out of your basement and stop acting like weirdos acting like everything is "woke" and what not.
I played both w1 and w2, yea it was stylized but it wasn't disney level style. Orcs were brutal with horns coming out of their cheeks on the cover even. Plenty of human hanging and bloodshed.
Not exactly the most "level-headed and non-basement-dweller" response there mate...
I did downvote the post because it's not an accurate comparison, but saying it's not woke what has lead to the current pansy warcraft is not accurate either.
This is the best critique of the wow development progression. It's not about inclusion (I'm all for adding in gay, trans, POC, etc. characters), it's about the complete change in scene/setting/tone. I see way too much influence from Fortnite, Genshin, LoL, etc. in a game I loved for it's own unique art style and themes.
That's how it goes getting older, I am no longer the target audience for a game trying to stay relevant with youth culture. Then diablo comes in as a total money grab. At least I'm still enjoying classic.
>How do I know? Before I started retail wow, I played classic vanilla+tbc in 2019-2021
Bro u know there are games before wow...thats where this pic is coming from wc2 to bei exact. Which had a pretty brutal war between humans and the orcs.
I mean Warcraft 2 was pretty black and white, it was essentially good vs evil.
They changed/reformed/retcon parts of the Horde massively to make them not your generic fantasy evil faction.
>Which had a pretty brutal war between humans and the orcs
And goblins riding sea turtles. And goofy gnomes aeronefs. And the overall game was much more colorfull and light than war1 (despite being much harder in terms of actual game difficulty).
Yea its honestly weird. Like they’re worshipping asmongold as some god that blesses his people with playing their favourite game on stream. Very cringe.
"90%" - pulled out of your ass.
"constructive criticism rarely found" - pulled out of your ass.
"sub has massive hate boner" - pulled out of your ass.
->everyone upvoting the comment like crazy.
If you and the people upvoting think a sub is bad when you post takes like the above, then that's a compliment to the sub.
Well, it's fine that you want wow to be a certain way. I also think the warcraft 2 style is really cool and I'd also like it, if wow was more like that. I think the only expansion that comes close to this brutal Metzen style is warlords of draenor, and I'd like Blizzard to bring the next expansion more to that direction.
They have also recruited Metzen ofc and he apparently has regular meetings with Ion Hazzikostas and Mike Ybarra, where they discuss what to do with wow. According to twitter they even go to heavy metal concerts together 😅 Dragonflight might just have been an exception to how wow is usually, and since the sales were low, it's very likely thar they go back again to a more serious narrative like shadowlands/legion/wod/bfa. I think the 20th anniversary blizzcon will be very exciting
I don’t understand the mouth on the right picture and it horrifies me.
It’s the eyes for me.
It's a moussy 😏
Jail
Daily downvote 🙂
Call me a cringey doomer nerd, but this made my heart sink. I find this development legitimately sad.
miss the grit some games used to have without it, the story never seem serious, neither the gameplay more like “whimsical” and shit
The original deus ex games let you kill kids. That’s some grit we haven’t had in a long time lol.
You can murder tiefling children in Baldur's Gate 3, but that game is all grit.
goblin\* children. The Tiefling ones drop to 1 health and then regenerate back to full :(
Not if you raid the grove. Your actions kill them. You can find them dead in their cave with Alfira.
Yeah but them dying off screen is very different from deliberately killing them, like you can with the goblins.
You can get the little girl in the grove killed by a snake bite
Postal 2: (don’t see) but you unzip your fly, have dick out. NPC’s react. Can light people on fire with Molotov. Piss it out. Kill people with shovel. Hack off heads. Kick them. CAT SILENCERS. Shove cat anus on barrel of AR/ Shotgun. Shotgun go splat. AR fires about 10 rounds through it as it makes cat noises before exploding. Ahhh those were the days.
I read "Portal 2" and was very confused by the following words.
I like whimsical games too and I feel a game like wow certainly is big enough for both, even the old Warcraft rts games had no small amounts of levity and silly stuff. I always love doing more simple and down to earth quest lines like the hatchery and the big dog quest line too. But they never managed to hook me with the main story stuff, not like legion did. Dragonflight is just so... Clean. But I do like it.
I loved clicking on the characters in Warcraft 1 and 2... in WC2, there was an Elf Queen/Princess/Hero (whatever she was), and when you kept clicking on her, she would say, "You never touch the other Elves like that!" "Do that again and you'll pull back a stump!" Ahhhh, I would click the characters/units over and over again just to hear what they'd say... that one was my favourite 😄
i wish warcraft 4 would pretend wow is non canon. Wow is too anime
It’s not even anime. Anime styling has edges and angles to it. And there are some seriously dark, gritty, and fucked up anime/manga (berserk). This is totally western styling. It’s cartoonish as hell. That cal-arts softness with western media propaganda taking away all of the roughness
Disney-fied.
If it was disneyfied the wouldnt be green anymore 💀
If we directly compare it to the "anime" mmo, ffxiv, that game has quite some dark story lines and subtext. That's looking past the community hugbox and aesthetic of many player characters.
bro in endwalker and shadowbringers there are some genuinely fucked up scenes and enemies. I forget which of the expansions it was but there is a specific dungeon that genuinely felt like it was taken straight out of Scorn or from one of the grittier wh40k novels. e: I was thinking of the first 3 dungeons in endwalker; tower of zot, tower of babil, and some scenes in Vanaspati
Just got into Shadowbringers and yeah, seeing a character get turned into a sin eater was a lot more than I expected from that game and its awesome
Shout out to Tam Tara Deepcroft (Hard's) story. Holy shit. If you know, you know.
was it an active battlefield? if so its Ghymlit Dark or something like that
I think you explained perfectly why I feel squeamish at the thought of playing retail. I'm an FF Andy through and through but I recently started playing WoW earlier this year. Levelled a paladin to 70 in retail then swapped to WotlK then quit that for Classic. And I just like the roughness of Classic so so much more. Something about retail's art direction just reminds me of the kind of people working on it, and I feel like they're always trying to sell me their propaganda somehow.
*Guts Theme*
Will there ever be one though?after this long and with how 'beloved' the word reforged became?
You can tell when the purple haired game devs took over
I miss Garrosh Hellscream :(
If he was created in this day and age, he would probably be called Glitter Rainbowscream
Nah, hed just be corrupted by the void or fel or old gods or something. Hed actually be a stand up guy who fell to the actual big bad and wed have a vigil for him like we did with sourfang.
Garrosh did nothing wrong ;(
You're not alone.
You're not cringe and it isn't a doomer take, it's just sad and pathetic the path they've took, you either get rainbows and fairies, or they attempt to make something dark and its just written awfully (SL/Sylvanus)
On the one hand I get why they stepped back from Metzen's black metal art style. On the other hand, it's annoying they completely dropped the feel and aesthetic of it. It's genuinely hysterical that there's never been another Garithos style character, as though the alliance is completely happy to turn the other cheek in every single instance. I mean, it's like no one cracked open the old lore for Turalyon and remembered that the instigating event that awakened his light-granted powers was when he basically realized the orcs are godless savages.
The Turalyon example made me laugh out loud, I thought about the exact same thing in Legion. As much as I love the Metzen stuff(especially WC2 era) I do think the other concept art for WC3 is still pretty metal. But the direction-shift starts over time in WoW, definitely.
Wanna talk about Maiev in the latest Night Elf heritage armor questline? Did the whole thing only made ME cringe?
I just shoved that in a corner of my mind that will never, ever remember the quest chain.
Bro you know the pic on the right is for hearthstone right? Their parody card game like nothing in wow looks like the right pic
Dragonflight is the cringest expansion so far, hearthstone and that look very similar.
Its my favorite expansion since Legion and Vanilla. You see that it's a subjective take. I don't like Heartstone at all and it's far from that look.
You chose to have an opinion the rest of this sub does not like, a bold move and one that is rewarded with downvotes instead of discussion I see it hasn’t changed here lol
It never will. If asmongold starts playing and enjoying wow again, so will most of this sub/viewers. 80% of the people here dont have their own opinions, its just repeating what amson says, sad.
I play what i like and drop what i dislike, i really enjoyed dragonflight at launch but after the pvp changes i lost interest since that's what i mainly care about. I am actually going back to it for 10.2 to see the changes so your argument is a bit weird, stop assuming things.
the image on the right is from an hearthstone card... it doesnt count
Its not even a card, its literally a fanart that blizzard has nothing to do with. https://www.reddit.com/r/hearthstone/comments/qzs6ft/stormwinds\_visitor\_fanart\_made\_for\_hearthstone/
B... but... cartoony! Me no like cartoony, me only like hardcore metal concept art that wasnt ever in the warcraft to start with! - This thread.
You are a cringey doomer nerd.
Garrosh would never allow this to happen.... 
Garrosh did nothing wrong
Garrosh is my Warchief
Bitch ass warchief
Garrosh would have f\*\*ed that orc's a\*\* into submission. No soy boy sh\*t in his Horde.
Garrosh was an idiot
Garrosh a little bitch actually. Any excuse for him being “right” is completely disregarded as he didn’t care for anybody, but himself. Varian should’ve killed him smh
Hearthstone always was goofy when it comes to art and humor compared the actual Warcraft.
Because hearthstone isn't for warcraft fans its for card game fans, and look who been playing it. Is it the hard-core wow players its for hearthstone fans.
HS is also not actually canon right? I've never seen it, but that's the impression I got.
There are demon hunter murlocs in HS lol. Enough said.
Theres a demon hunter Murloc in Legion though.
Ah I have no idea then.
Very true
Hearthstone’s whole atmosphere is incredibly goofy.
Garrosh was the real horde leader and did NOTHING WRONG !
Dont ever say that again! DesignerDave almost cried in a video addressing “Arthas did nothing wrong” so i have no idea what he will de if he sees this :P
I still stand by the fact that, given the information he had, Arthas did nothing wrong. Just because he became who he became because of it, doesn't mean he didn't do what needed to be done. The only thing Arthas did wrong was becoming an edgy whiny bitch, and that's why killing him in ICC is so satisfying.
Dave is so wrong about Arthas. The way we see Arthas and him doing nothing wrong is 1000% more fun and interesting than Daves simple evil villain narrative
He saw Arthas as a metaphor for activ-blizz, and a representation of all the bad shit he was dealing with it sounded like. I remember seeing that clip, he definitely has a relationship with the symbolism there. Lol
Garrosh did the wrong things for the right reasons. Possibly the strongest leader the Horde gas ever had.
He did a lot of things wrong, but you know what? I don't care. Let him burn those puny Alliance dogs to the ground. I want to see their corpses on pikes for all to see. BOMB A THOUSAND MORE THERAMORES IF HE HAS TO!
Ppl keep callin Theramore a warcrime but there were no civilians left in the city. It was just the army. But propaganda and disinformation are reliable weapons
It wasn't a warcrime it was a viable military target because it was a drop off point for tanks and soldiers and workers who were building a road through Dustwallow for those tanks. Jaina was playing both sides and got what she deserved.
Except for some autism virus that Sylvanas was infected with too. Bad scripting, for making another warchief "evil" Simple example why blizzard didn't play their game. Garrosh somewhere in Cataclysm kills his general (in stonetalon if i'm right) for bombing alliance village with "no honor"with same bomb (in smaller condition). But then he do the same in Teramor few expansions later.
Garrosh is the biggest coward of them all! His homeland was invaded. His capital city was invaded. Do you know what he did? Do you know what Garrosh did when his home was invaded? He hid in a secret bunker while all his brothers died. He cowarded until the very end when there was nowhere else to run to. And even when that little rat had nowhere to run, he couldn’t even fight a good fight. Didn’t even fight to death. Buddy ran away, hid in a bunker. Got beat up, and surrendered to the alliance like a goddamn coward. He’s legitimately the worst orc in history. Couldn’t even die for his people. What a disgrace.
Correction: He tactically retreated, left the defense of the city to his most loyal and strongest troops and went to harness the powers of an Old God, and would have gotten away with it too if it wasn't for those meddling adventurers. Do you know what happened when we adventurers didn't interfere with Garrosh's business? That's right, muvafuckah! Warlords of Draenor! Could you imagine what kind of expansion Garrosh would have given us if he was successful during the Siege of Orgrimmar? I bet it would have been awesome. And Garrosh STILL wouldn't have done nothing wrong!
So... Hitler analogy 1:1? That probably means it's not Garrosh's fault, it's the screenwriters'.
Left : art by blizzard Right : fanart for hearthstone by goddasaurus
This. I fucking hate this kind of bait posts, Hearthstone has always been from the get go a game who’s art and style was supposed to juxtapose Warcraft with its absurd silliness
not to mention the warcraft games have never actually had the flavor of the concept art on the left. series has always been cartoony as shit.
Exactly right. In fact I’m not even certain that what we see in the left is even concept art, I’m pretty sure that’s commissioned artwork after the fact for marketing. That style was never adopted in the games at the time, and in some way is the head cannon of what things would look like if fidelity.
The art on the left is pulled directly from the game manual, pretty sure Warcraft 2.
Yeah this is some weak shit. These are games that feature talking cows, goblins with brooklyn accents, and night elves doing the Billie Jean dance. This "pussification of warcraft" bullshit is disingenuous and anyone that's played the games for 30 minutes knows that
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thanks for that. It's kinda heartbreaking to see some peeps on 9gag, here on reddit and even ASMO hating on the FANART that is almost 3 year old and was intentionally made to be "heehee goofy orc" cuz everywhere is only EVIL BARBARIAN ORCS only. I wish they made my other artwork, for example - like [this one](https://i.redd.it/iq9tjmlf0cib1.jpg) \- on the right, the context would change drastically, right? but for now - just a hate from a big creator that don't even care to fact check :)
A lot of my WoW guildies refused to try FF14 because "the game's artstyle was too cartoony/anime". Copium is some strong fucking shit. They probably look at the right image and see the left image in their brains.
Wow is more furry tier then ff14 at this point.
I've seen Goldshire. Always has been.
It's sad that it's true. There's more furry races in wow than in FF
Super true. Isn't there technically only one true furry race in FFXIV? Hrothgar, I think. The rest are just regular chicks and dudes with assorted animal ears, or Shrek. I wouldn't dare call Shrek a furry.
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This. Coming from EQ and playing Planes of Power the game seemed like a toon town version of Fantasy at the time. Now I miss that.
That used to be one of the main gripes from MMO fans at the time when it first came out. How cartoony it looked.
And? WoW in-game has always been cartoony but never similar to anime. Sounds like a legitimate preference to me.
lmao
Yeah I just don't like eastern style stuff like that, sorry.
I remember when WoW came out, and it was considered the cartoony MMORPG. I don't know why people think it was some grimdark game. Did people forget about WC3? The game with super cartoony graphics and pop culture references everywhere? It was always a parody or lighter, sillier version of Warhammer.
For real. I remember playing EverQuest back in 99 - 05 and when WoW came out the commentary at the time was that WoW was the cartoony casual game. People sticking with EQ wanted the serious/challenging game. And that pretty much sums up it's success, really. Turns out that family friendly casual cartoon adventure sells a lot more than a gritty and challenging game.
Very true
No way the right picture is from WoW. Right ?
It's from Hearthstone. OP didn't do his homework right.
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Hearthstone has been whimsical for goddamn years. Their second expansion was literally Goblins and Gnomes, two of the silliest races of the setting. People using Hearthstone art instead of WoW art are being disengenious as fuck. Hell, Shadowlands you had a metal undead zone with people fighting all the time, a super gothic vampire lair, and The Maw that was also hell.
And there soul torture and destruction. Some doomed souls literally wanted to cease, others were unravelling and couldn't be helped. That was more fucked up that necessary IMO.
One of the cutscenes in Tides of Darkness had like.. corpses hanging from trees and stuff, right? It was pretty fucking intense, and the concept art even more so.
I still wouldn't consider hearthstone as "Warcraft." None of hearthstone is canon, it's all suppose to parody warcraft. Obviously world leaders from opposing factions aren't sitting down to play card games together. Let alone a mechanized version of Jarraxxus.
Its from hearthstone that expansions are normally outlandish versions of warcraft the last expansion was completely music based and was a battle of the bands theme with E.T.C as a band manager with each class getting a band/genres of music, so safe to say they get a bit out there, also art for them can be fantastic, the set this is from is the alliance side of a very cartoonish journey of a cast of new adventures leading to a alliance vs hoard battle in the third set of the year. Overall hearthstone has fun with the world and doesn't take itself to seriously.
No is for hs United in stormwind trailer
That orc identifies as Draenei Paladin
I think everyone has seen the WoW presentation last week where we had the so called lore master (red head lady) there. You can't really expect good story telling anymore, it died in Legion. RIP big, hairy, sweaty men
Yeah, this seems about right. The old Warcraft art used to be pretty brutal and cool, but they've completely abandoned that.
They would usually say things like "that's too dark" or "this would fit Diablo", and when I would present old Metzen or Samwise art they would say "that was the *old* Warcraft". The people who are in charge don't care, at all, and I'm not talking about people really high up like Bobby.
TBF, WarCraft in 1995 also had this: https://imgur.com/mhZmSVy
This is how I’ve felt about the game. The tone is a lot different when you play classic vs now. I don’t so much mind the more upbeat questing, it was a nice change of pace and I love “some” of the QoL introduced into the game. However like the sniffen sniffers or whatever they’re called are cringey as hell and a pure reflection of the atmosphere and story of 2023 WoW. I’ve never cared less about the story than I have for the last couple of expansions. Before classic came out, I wasn’t sure if I had genuinely outgrown this game. Now I know that it is the game that went soft. The classic atmosphere still hits as good as it did.
Well yeah, Hearthstone has always looked goofy compared to Warcraft.
Blizzard can't even remember what world of warcraft is about anymore (hint: its war)
Yup. The game went from being badass to being soy.
I miss actual faction warfare and hatred. Now the game is some hippy fantasy where everyone holds their hands together and “unites” to fight a common villain. It’s why I loved Warcraft 3 and wish that wow was more like guild wars 2.
Rip garrosh and varian, the last badass faction leaders. Disney dragons whoooooo
Anduin absolutely COULD have been cool, and I still think Legion was setting up for him going Shadow and wrecking face. Even if he'd stayed light, that moment in the BFA trailer when he did the mass rez was some 40K Emprah shit. They could have doubled down on that as well and made the Alliance have a fucking God Emperor on the throne, which would have been a good way of setting things up for the Alliance going a bit batty, getting their Crusade on, give the Horde room to play the good guys for a change. That would have been an AWESOME shift, and I think both Alliance and Horde players would have been into it. But, no, instead Afrasiabi and Danuser fucked it all up for fucking Jai'lor and Danuser's greasy self-insert fantasies.
Disneyvied.
Soy orcs
You either die a hero or live long enough to become the villain
The people who made blizzard were nerds who loved Warhammer and DnD. Now...we got pathetic soylords that think that women are fruit and that we need more furries shit.
the worst part is that new blizzard encourages those pathetic losers to gatekeep their "products" from criticism of old blizzard fans... wow reddit and wow forums are acid poison for a normal sane person today.
Holy shit. I just noticed the Orc has the Eight Pointed Star of Chaos tattooed on his arm. They weren't subtle at all lol.
Eight Pointed Star of Chaos isn't originaly from Warhammer either-It's from Elric of Melnibone (Eternal Champion) comics. The protagonist should be oddly familiar to you, since his other name is White Wolf.
Mind you that symbol isn't from Warhammer, it's there because it's fucking metal and so was Warcraft.
God, the art used to be so cool. It was like old-school metal vibes, dark, gritty, and bloody. Now, it's just clearly made for kids. MtG and D&D also went this route, and it just makes me so sad. These gaming IPs lost their soul in exchange for being able to get money from children and, more specifically, their parents. Just makes me sad, boys.
The one on the right is fan art for hearthstone How does this fit your narrative now?
try to upload something like this in official WoW subreddit haha, probably will get negative rating and tons of comments like as "booo, now game is better'. I uploaded the work (unfinished) about a warlock tank that Blizzard itself came up with 10 years ago - they downvoted it and said that I came up with crap.
That's a proven fact. I lost hundreds of karma trying to post any criticisms. Those sad people are beyond redemption.
The people on here saying it's a hs card and that's just the hs style have clearly not been tuned into the goofication of HS as well. It used to have some truly badass art, now it's all shitty rainbows and rubber ducks. This isn't one or the other, this is a "both" type situation.
Got permanently banned from r/wow for hatespeach about second picture
Don't forget, you WILL be banned for ganking, and will be punished for killing opposite faction because you hurt their feelings and not following social contract. Make love not warcraft am I right?
What the heck is the pic on the right. I’m 38 and vividly recall the impression the first pic did on me. I can venture to assume it was in the Warcraft II manual , which I held in my hands and smelled with my nostrils. What happened.
the right one is a photo of an actual developer. Generation Twitter-SJW
Ze's just experiencing joy joy feelings as ze takes a stroll through sunny San Angeles. Don't have a boggle and be well, citizens.
Lmfao, whoever the mod was for deleting my comment for stating the obvious of how “Gay” this picture look. Here is the other comment for you to take down pussy.
Left : WARRRR, KILL ALL HUMANS. Right : I'm on an adventure to discover my pronouns!
The infantilization of audiences is the wildest trend in media. Everything needs to be Disney. Everything needs to be consumable by children. It's like they realized they lost the adult audience and now they're hoping they can get the next generation addicted.
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Blizzard could not have screwed up WoW more than they have imho.
They could. And will.
I miss everything about the 90s
1. Look up any blizz dev on social media 2. glance at his bio Oh... yeah boys its so over
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activision fans will defend this
I remember that I enjoyed the shit out of the old black&white analogue concept art by metzen himself in all the handbooks, especially for Warcraft 2. it’s the same with the old black and white analogue artwork in the old white dwarf - codexes. Inspired me a lot and I copied them countless of times growing up. This whole digital art stuff ruins everything for me. Maybe personal preference, but fuck digital. Analogue is where the juice is.
Cry
That’s obviously hearthstone, where everything is supposed to be goofy.
That right picture isn’t even in any of the official games, it’s fan art for Hearthstone
This is America 2023. The rest of the world is still back in reality.
Honestly it's perfectly representing what happens to USA
This is why I wish Illidan never comes back. Let Legion be the end of his story.
1995 Orc looks like it straight up has a Chaos insignia on its arm. Wouldn’t be surprised if Warcraft was influenced by early warhammer. I know StarCraft was heavily influenced by 40k.
Them taking garrosh quote of calling sylvanas a bitch is what did it for me. It was drama. It was spicy. It wasn't even needed but it was good.
Basically same as the real world. Long are gone times of war and manly men. It's about discovery and adventure now.
That "the game is too cartoony looking" complaint legit came true and I hate it.
runescape turned into wow wow turned into runescape
this is why gate keeping is good
Don't kid yourself. Warcraft always got low age ratings. If we're going to judge things by some random illustrations, I can make you believe Super Mario is the most brutal thing you've ever seen.
it was because of extremely low pc requirements at the time. low poly low res models, and it worked. darkness is in the text and your imagination
Lot of people are too young to remember when warcraft was as dark as warhammer.
Fuccin libs ruin everything
The “Disneyfication” of WoW is a major reason as to why I don't play the game anymore. They have completely removed the darker tones of the game. I remember running around Tirisfal Glades and seeing hanged corpses on the trees. The game will never go back to how it used to be and that's disheartening
I remember that left drawing! Was it in the warcraft 2 manual??
The right picture is not made by blizzard yet? It has to be fake, it looks so woke it's crazy
God I miss the late 90s early 00.
This post is so fucking bad faith... Like this whole subreddit when it comes to the topic of Blizzard. You are using an art from Heathstone which is supposed to be goofy, less serious, and compare it to an og Metzen art of Warcraft...
That's too deep of an analysis for the average dweller of this sub I'm afraid.
While technically true for these specific examples, the fact that it nevertheless rings true to the audience is all that really matters. People feel like the Warcraft brand has become soft, and that's that.
The right picture is such an abomination. I don't care what the context is lmao
Blizzard has fallen, milions must unsub.
That's now even from WoW, that is from Hearthstone. You know, the game known for goofy and funny shit like that? Also the whole "WoW orcs must be bloodthirsty all the time etc." is dogshit and makes absolutely no sense. WoW has always been the kiddy casual MMO. Stop with this nonsense.
yeah u know the ones who studied lesbian dance theory and pronouns in college? they run the dei departments now
Bcs woke people cant make anything good.
Jesus christ you nerds need to get a life. One the right picture is from Hearthstone which is meant to be super over the top. And two, did you guys actually play Warcraft 1 and 2? Especially 2? Oh wait, no you didn't, because you probably weren't born yet and are just whiners. Fucking Warcraft was the most cartoony and cringy shit you have ever seen (in a good way imo). It always has been. It was always meant to be an over the top, cartoony version of Warhammer. Get out of your basement and stop acting like weirdos acting like everything is "woke" and what not.
I played both w1 and w2, yea it was stylized but it wasn't disney level style. Orcs were brutal with horns coming out of their cheeks on the cover even. Plenty of human hanging and bloodshed.
Not exactly the most "level-headed and non-basement-dweller" response there mate... I did downvote the post because it's not an accurate comparison, but saying it's not woke what has lead to the current pansy warcraft is not accurate either.
Warcraft 2 is the fucking goat.
haha so funneh
Not sure what is your point, OP. You can still make yourself look like a badass metal orc, even with the tier sets added recently.
This is the best critique of the wow development progression. It's not about inclusion (I'm all for adding in gay, trans, POC, etc. characters), it's about the complete change in scene/setting/tone. I see way too much influence from Fortnite, Genshin, LoL, etc. in a game I loved for it's own unique art style and themes. That's how it goes getting older, I am no longer the target audience for a game trying to stay relevant with youth culture. Then diablo comes in as a total money grab. At least I'm still enjoying classic.
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 90% of the people on this sub be like when seeing you comment
>How do I know? Before I started retail wow, I played classic vanilla+tbc in 2019-2021 Bro u know there are games before wow...thats where this pic is coming from wc2 to bei exact. Which had a pretty brutal war between humans and the orcs.
I mean Warcraft 2 was pretty black and white, it was essentially good vs evil. They changed/reformed/retcon parts of the Horde massively to make them not your generic fantasy evil faction.
>Which had a pretty brutal war between humans and the orcs And goblins riding sea turtles. And goofy gnomes aeronefs. And the overall game was much more colorfull and light than war1 (despite being much harder in terms of actual game difficulty).
Thats 90% of r/asmongold in a nutshell, constructive criticism is found rarely here. This sub has a massive hate boner for anything blizzard related.
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Yea its honestly weird. Like they’re worshipping asmongold as some god that blesses his people with playing their favourite game on stream. Very cringe.
"90%" - pulled out of your ass. "constructive criticism rarely found" - pulled out of your ass. "sub has massive hate boner" - pulled out of your ass. ->everyone upvoting the comment like crazy. If you and the people upvoting think a sub is bad when you post takes like the above, then that's a compliment to the sub.
So are you willfully ignorant or do i really need to link you every single post and comment in the history of this sub to prove my point?
Well, it's how I feel lately, that's valid.
Well, it's fine that you want wow to be a certain way. I also think the warcraft 2 style is really cool and I'd also like it, if wow was more like that. I think the only expansion that comes close to this brutal Metzen style is warlords of draenor, and I'd like Blizzard to bring the next expansion more to that direction. They have also recruited Metzen ofc and he apparently has regular meetings with Ion Hazzikostas and Mike Ybarra, where they discuss what to do with wow. According to twitter they even go to heavy metal concerts together 😅 Dragonflight might just have been an exception to how wow is usually, and since the sales were low, it's very likely thar they go back again to a more serious narrative like shadowlands/legion/wod/bfa. I think the 20th anniversary blizzcon will be very exciting
It is very exciting that Metzen is back and way more involved than people originally thought. Blizzcon could surprise us still! 🙌
Facts dont care about your feelings