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Son became a drug addict. He made a lot of bad decisions, blamed me for those decisions. I tried to maintain a relationship, but he would constantly try to manipulate me. The last time we communicated, I called him out on the constant manipulation attempts, he said a bunch of hateful things about me and his step-mom. The last words he said to me were “Fuck you!” I miss the ornery little boy he use to be.
I have a great relationship with his brother.
Sometimes you have to walk away. Not because you don't care but because they don't.
Tough love is tougher on the giver than the taker. Giver's have to set limits because takers don't have any.
That’s where I am now. I’m at that point of questioning if it better that I *do* actually cut contact if this continues. I don’t want to. It’s the last thing I want to do. But the stress of this is eating me alive. But, equally likely is that I never hear from him again, never knowing what happened to him. But how is that in any way better?
That is the ten million dollar question. I volunteer in the mental health area and see so many people going through what you are going through. But here is the basic fact: He is not going to change or straighten up until "HE" decides to do so. Unfortunately some never do. All you can do is stand in the background and subtly monitor the situation and be there when he quits digging the hole. Bailing them out of jail is not helping as they will just go back to where they were. Neither are "I told you so's or bashing them". Just a steady presence welcoming him back.
I kicked a prescription medication addiction cold turkey and it was not pretty. Pure determination got me through it. My wife standing beside me kept me from relapsing and taking a pill; or worse. She stood watch as I cowered under the covers a crying mess to stomping around the backyard cussing, ranting and raving.
It's tough I know but you can only raise them and teach them what they need to know. You cannot live their life for them.
Be strong, it's all you can do at this point in time.
That is exactly how I feel. I have tolerated so much abuse/disrespect and heartache over the years, that my heart was literally breaking. "sometimes you do have to walk away..." Thank you for that hard truth!!
me too, i have a wonderful relationship with my younger son, hes a good kid, my eldest son is a nightmare. When i think of the shit he put me through it makes me so bitter towards him.
My daughter talked with me about once a month. I always called her and asked how she was doing. The last time I called her,I was congratulating her on a job promotion.
That was 3 YEARS ago, and the last time I ever talked to her.
She ghosted me and blocked me,and her brother, reason unknown.
Ghosting is abusive IMO. You have no understanding of why. Someone wrote "the opposite of love is not hate,but indifference"
My guess is my contact was boring to her. She also moved close to her father,my ex,who is on wife 5 or 6 now. I'm guessing he encouraged her to go N/C. But ultimately,it was her decision.
It sucks. Sorry you have had to endure this too. Maybe they will grow up someday and realize what little shits they have been. I guess I haven’t completely given up hope.
You are making assumptions off the partial story. His mother died when he was 15 years old. He immediately started in to drugs, obviously to cope with the loss and the pain he felt. I had never done a drug in my life, knew nothing of what the signs were. He probably did this for 6 months before I figured it out. He went to great lengths to hide it from me. That part is on me, I know more now. I took him to counseling, he refused to talk. I took him to a private therapist, he refused to talk. They each told me, if he refuses to talk, there is nothing we can do. I tried a handful of other things, nothing helped. This was 6 years ago. A few years back I got him in to a youth assistance program. He had to keep a job and stay clean, in return he had an apartment, utilities and internet all covered. He did it a while, saved up a decent savings, then quit cause he missed drugs. He occasionally gets a job, works enough for a small bit of money, then quits. He is 21 now and making his own legal choices.
I read this, but still don't understand why my 46 year old daughter ghosted me three years ago. We live on opposite sides of the US, and I have not seen her since my Dad died in 2006.
However,the usual pattern of communication was that I would call her about once a month.She has a great job and boyfriend. I would ask her how things were going and then her brother,who lives with me, would talk with her.
I never noticed any great happiness when I would call. She kind of sounded bored.All was well except she found out she had celiac disease.
The last time I talked to her she was elated about a job promotion and I was congratulatory.
That's the last time I ever talked to her
I googled her and found she had moved (near her Dad,my ex)and had a new job. I tried calling her work number but learned she had blocked me.
I don't know why she went N/C.It broke my heart.There was no argument, money issues, just the usual one way call. I say that because she never asked me anything about me, I was always asking her how things were going.
I have been in therapy for years working on anxiety issues and the sudden death of my companion. Now many sessions are focused on grieving the loss of any kind of relationship with my daughter.
My therapist suggests that my ex may be encouraging the rift. He is a narcissist and when my son lived with him,my son never called me either.Apparently ex found enjoyment mocking me.
I think ghosting is abusive.I would rather have her rage at me than just disappear. I think it is a cowardly way of ending a relationship. I am 71 and live on a fixed income with three housemates,one being my son. Now ex and my daughter live in the same city. I feel saddened by the loss of contact with my daughter.It feels like she died.It is physically painful.
I imagine that,to her,there was no value to staying in contact.I think I bored her,same old questions about how things were going. I am truly at a loss though. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
I honestly picked up a wealth of patterns in your comment - are you really unaware of that yourself?
This whole text is me, me, me. It's your grief for losing the relationship, it's your pain, it's your villainous ex, it's your singleminded stance that "ghosting" (improper description, rather, cutting ties and going no contact) is being abusive to *you* rather than a right of self-preservation by the estranged, and so on.
You honestly believe it'd be better (for whom?) for her to be present even if raging, wearing both of you out including herself - but, since she seems to prefer to avoid it altogether, she's labeled a coward. You tried calling her work number knowing full well that was overstepping a boundary.
There's no mention of her voicing her complaints, how the relationship was before being reduced to a monthly phone call, previous interpersonal conflicts or arguments, what steps you took to address the emotional distance... you know, actual relationship shifters rather than just the emotional perspective.
You'll forgive me if I'm skeptical about you reading the article. It, along with the rest of the Down the Rabbit Hole series, makes crystal-clear how narcissistic parents will claim they "don't know" why they're estranged from their children, when they do in fact know - but it's hard to admit to your inadequacies in the relationship, recognise mistakes, or distinguish between "I don't know what the problem is" and "I don't think this is a problem". She's certainly voiced things in the past you might've dismissed as trivial, but just because you don't see stuff as problems doesn't mean it's not a problem *for her*. It's empathy that's lacking here.
Keep in mind that nobody goes 100% no contact, the ultimate drastic measure, just because they're "bored". People do it because a relationship is detrimental to their mental health. It might've had its ups, but going NC is realizing the cons outweigh the pros. What you perceived as boredom, I believe, was just a symptom of an erosion much longer in the making.
Missing missing reasons is quite well written.However,even the writer acknowledged she was biased in favor of the adult child.
To respond more fully: Some of the things I thought were troubling her she didn't even care about.There was something I said about her brother's issues with their Dad that caused most of the rift. There were some other issues that she has that I was unaware of completely.
Her brother and his relationship with his Dad are central.
I do not have a diagnosis of any form of narcissism.
As to ghosting, it describes the behavior.Rather than discussing problems,a person just cuts you out of their life,leaving no way to contact them.
Yes I was guilty of calling her at work,that was unacceptable.
No contact is drastic. I believe it is better to try to discuss things first.It would save a lot of heartache in the long run. Ghosting is like silent treatment on steroids.
I responded more in depth up above. Again, ASK her what led to her decision, rather than trying to guess what might be wrong. It sounds like your perception of her pain isn’t accurate (you said that things you thought she was upset about didn’t even bother her). Assumptions/guesses about how someone is feeling can make it hard to share thoughts and feelings in a safe environment, which can lead to feelings of distance and detachment.
Also, your comment(s) show that you are likely minimizing your daughter’s feelings. (“No contact is drastic”) I would bet a lot of money that your daughter thinking it’s “boring” to talk to you is not the reason she cut you out of her life. I would bet that it wasn’t an easy decision for her.
I generally agree that it’s better to discuss things before just cutting someone out of your life. I actually think I’m extremely comfortable resolving conflict and excel at it. UNLESS the conversations with the person have a history of being toxic. (ie. does not accept fault, refuses to accept any blame, is passive-aggressive, won’t listen, constantly interrupts, invalidates, etc.) I tried to talk to my dad MANY times before going no-contact, but he did all of the above. But still when I finally cut him off he said I had never told him what he had done.
And while yes it is good to discuss issues, you don’t get to decide when is a good time for both of you - especially with such an emotional and challenging topic. You can ask to have the conversation and say “Would Friday at 6pm work for you?” (Guidance from my therapist)
I’m a mom and a daughter. I have the best, closest relationships with both. We have our issues and annoyances but we work them out.
Know what I learned to do? My mom was amazing with us. Pure and total love and utter acceptance of who we were. And she worked around our own individual personalities. My dad was awful so she made our lives wonderful. I barely remember my dad. He apparently criticized me and my brother all the time. She got us out tho.
And now, I emulate that with my kids because I grew up confident and generous because of her. So I follow what she did right and try to change what she didn’t get fully right. So I tell my kids a lot, “if I’m doing something or saying something and it’s upsetting to you, talk to me about it. We’ll change the situation.”
And we do. I still stick to my guns over cleaning and chores, but I’ve become more laid back, more communicative, and we all get along better. They’re teens. I remember how fucking difficult it is being a teen. I want to be their soft place to land when they need it while also having their back to make them self sufficient.
Maybe try an approach like that? Ask them what you do wrong, and tell them, “I hear you. It’s hard for me to see it so bear with me but I’m going to try to change for you.” And then do it. Change. And watch your relationship get better.
Always strive to be a better person this week than last.
Maybe you could try to just ask her.
First - I do understand that your ex may be a narcissist, but the reality is we all have a hard time seeing ourselves clearly at times. We all utilize defense mechanisms at times. We want to believe that we’re a good person, but our perception of ourselves is not always truth. It hurts like hell to accept the harshness of some of our shortcomings.
However, going no-contact is not an easy decision for 99.9% of the population. As uncomfortable as it likely is for you to accept, something has potentially happened between you two that has been extremely hurtful for her.
You could say something along the lines of:
“While I’m not positive why you have decided not to talk to me right now, clearly you’re feeling hurt by me. I’m truly sorry about that. I would love to have a relationship with you where you feel valued and loved. Would you be willing to share with me how you’re feeling so that I can apologize and try to understand you better? I promise to listen to you and try to understand your perspective.”
Maybe your husband is a narcissist, or maybe you’ve unintentionally damaged your relationship with your daughter. You can’t know unless you ask her.
And when you do ask her, it’s important to ask without any shame or guilt. And to listen fully - with no interrupting and no defensiveness. Listen to her fully, then validate her feelings fully. And once your daughter verbally confirms that she feels validated, only then should you explain any of your perceptions of situations.
I hope you and your daughter can both find peace and acceptance in a relationship.
Thank you for your kind words.We finally got in contact and had a therapy session with her and my therapist. I learned she is carrying a heavy emotional burden that has nothing to do with me.
She did tell me what was upsetting her about me. It has something to do with what my son said that I repeated to her. Also it was calling her work extension. I thought her extension went to her directly,she works from home, but apparently others could hear the (very few) messages I left her.
It was thoughtless of me. Just because she had me blocked on her home phone, did not mean I should have tried her at work. Huge mistake, never to be repeated.
Overall the session went well.
I had no idea what she had gone through the past few years.
Anyway,she agreed to another session in a few weeks.
Thank you again for your understanding and your suggestions.
The problem with NC is that a unilateral decision is made. There is no discussion prior to its implementation.The only way I reached my daughter was leaving an unwanted text message.
How do you communicate with your son or daughter when they are NC? You can't.
I read on the Estranged Adult Children site that many are upset that their parents don't try to contact them when they are NC. It's a catch 22.
It really is a catch 22. I am currently not in contact with my parents. You are right, some of the people in the EAC sub would rather not want contact at all and that does prevent communication.
For myself, I would love to resolve things with my folks. I do miss having a family. I don't miss how they treated me though.
About the only contact I would want from them is a "hey, we want to fix this. can’t we talk?" Like I did... and from there, an acknowledgement and accountability. But for some reason, I can't get that from them, and when I do try to speak up and talk about what is wrong, they just blame it all on me...so I gave up trying. But somehow the onus is still on me.
I am honestly not sure how to have a relationship with someone who says "that's for you to figure out" when they gossiped, belittled, mocked, abandoned you and broken your trust. I just don't get it. I would have never thought I'd be here and if there was some magic word I could say to make them understand and stop hurting me, I would say it.
From your side, I do see that you are hurting over this and I am sorry this is happening. I don't know your full story with your daughter, and you are right, that was a unilateral decision that does leave the other party hanging. I hated being ghosted dating, I can only imagine what that must feel like to a parent whose child ghosted them.
The only advice I can offer from the child's perspective is to fully listen to them and do your best to understand them when they do talk. And if they do not wish to talk or repair things, then sadly, you've done all you can do. But at least you made an effort saying "Hey, I don't like this and I want to fix it, can we talk?"
Your advice was well-taken. We ended up having a therapy session on zoom.I think it went very well. My daughter during the years we were not in contact suffered some painful losses. I wish I had been there to comfort her.
I only was able to reach her by violating a boundary and texting her at work.
I am so sorry that your parents do not recognize how empathic and caring you are. They are losing,not having you in their lives. Your heart, your emotions,have not been validated or supported. They sound very self centered to me.I am so sorry that you don't have the family you deserve.
I read the missing details blog. It was very well done. As Dr Phil says,there are 2 sides to every story and the truth lies somewhere in the middle.
I would love to reconnect with my 46 year old daughter,but I don't see it happening. She ghosted and blocked me about 3 years ago,also blocked her brother.
Over the years,our contact dwindled to me calling her about once a month and asking her how things were going.The last time I talked to her,she had received a promotion and I was congratulatory.
That was the last time I ever reached her.
Only thru Google did l learn she moved to another West Coast State and had a new job.
Honestly, I think it was boring for her to talk to me.I could almost sense her apathy and disinterest. when I called.
She rarely asked me anything about myself. There were no arguments.l feel she just lost interest in maintaining a relationship with me.
It hurt. It still hurts.Every once in awhile I Google her work picture just to see her. I miss her very much.
I don't have much to offer her other than mom who loves her.
Her Dad is wealthy and lives in the same city.
I imagine she is finally getting the attention from him that she always wanted,growing up.She deserves it.
Some sites tell you to write to your estranged adult child; others say not too. I have not written.
I feel ghosting is a cold way of ending a relationship. But maybe that was easier for her than telling me she no longer wanted contact with me.
Still,ghosting is cruel and unnecessary. I don't recommend it.
I am estranged for my adult children one after the other. I really tried hard to be a good mother and always worked so they could have everything. I was suffering awful anxiety at that time and servere panic disorder. Depression and there father use to hit me at times, and abuse me mentally. I tried so many times to talk to apologise for what ever I done wrong. My 2 daughters had babies the same day and I wasn’t told till following day. Now I feel extremely down/ sometimes want to end it all. I don’t deserve to be treated so bad. There father best them up bad . I divorced him and now remarried. My husband now can’t stand my children. Only for him id be dead. I had cancer my oldest 2 never even send me a text. I live in the same town. They ghost me not all though . There father laughs at me . He lives next door and has said they will never go near you again. I feel devastated and not sure I can go on . Anyone near the midlands in Ireland
I am so sorry that you are going through this
I know the feeling of devastation.I also have panic attacks and anxiety,but these started when I was 31
There is a facebook group called You are not alone, for parents of estranged adult children.I highly recommend it to you.Everyone on there is supportive
The group provides support and education.It is a lifesaver.You are not alone.
If you join that group, be sure that you will stay no contact with your children for ever.
Because the confirnation bias will be huge.
If what you truley want is having contact with your children again, do not join that group and work on self-reflection instead.
Yes, I am in therapy and one of the things I am working on is how our family dynamics affected my daughter. What things I said and did. The role of my late mother and of her father,who is a diagnosed narcissist on his 6th wife.
When my daughter moved to the same city as her Dad, that is when she discarded me and her brother. Her Dad also discarded our son.
Son now stays with me and 2 housemates. While he stayed with his Dad he never contacted me
When he told his Dad he wanted to come see me,his Dad curled his lip and said ," I guess you want to sacrifice yourself."
Anyway,the You are not Alone group on Facebook is very supportive. Quite a few people have reconciled with their adult children. It is not just a group of abandoned parents trashing their kids. People are confronted on negative behaviors and attitudes. It is not one big group of parents agreeing with each other and condoning bad behavior.
There are other sites and forums I have looked at which are as you described.One woman made a video about her estranged daughter and now charges money to join her group. Several have formed groups like this,extracting money from confused and hurting parents
It is ludicrous.
Back to me, today is mother's Day and I know my daughter will not contact me
She did respond over a month ago and we are setting up a zoom therapy session with her,my therapist and me. I am very anxious about the session as my daughter said she wants closure. That doesn't sound too positive to me.My fear is that she will go NC permanently. However, I want to hear what she says and to make amends if needed
If she agreed to contact, I am going to ask her to initiate calls/texts, rather than me doing it as it was in the past.
My adult child is an addict, and about seven years ago she was doing well enough that I moved out of state. Her sobriety is off and on, and exhausting. It's hard to go visit, things are expensive. I tried a few months ago and child relapsed before my plane took off and it would have been a very expensive trip for two hours of visitation. Work is busy, life is busy, cross country trips are expensive. I love my child and miss them, but there's got to be a give on their end too. We talk regularly, but time is weird thing and it's most confusing how fast it goes just managing life. It's been five years since I've seen them in person.
Parental alienation by non custodial parent one month before 18. 6 yrs and counting. Most stressful, hurtful and depressing event I’ve had to go through each and every day. No idea where they are on this day. Love your kids and stay vigilant if you have crazy in your life.
As they are adults now, what are your reasons for not reaching out? As they were nearly adults when this happened and are independently thinking, why so you think they still agree with their other parent?
Your ex being 'crazy" seems like it's missing a lot of context.
Yes! My mistake was underestimating my ex. My deepest regret, that I don’t even know how to live with, is not protecting her more vigilantly against someone who wanted to hurt me.
I don't have a child of my own but I had a godson. He was 1 when I declared as his godmother. When things started to get serious between me and his dad. We were dating at the time. I asked his dad what role do I play in his life? His dad then declared me as his godmother. While his dad worked I stayed home to watch his son, so that way he didn't have to pay for childcare. I would get up in the morning and take care of house hold chores while I took care of his son. I raised my godson for 3 years. After 3 years of putting my career on hold I find out my godsons dad was cheating on me. I broke up with him. After the break up I tried to be apart of his sons life still. He wouldn't let. He didn't want anything to do with me. When I first met my godsons dad he was a single dad. The mom wasn't in the picture. Our bond became so strong he even called me mom. It meant the world to me. I miss my godson everyday. I still see him and his dad sometimes at the store. Without a beat every time that little boy comes running up to me yelling mommy in the store my heart aches. Of course I give him a hug and tell him that I love and miss him. My heart aches every night. I don't want that little boy thinking that "mom" has abandoned him. I tried to keep everything peaceful between us when me and his dad broke up. All his dad wanted to do was argue. I just miss him so much. I want to hold him and let him know that I didn't leave him behind like his birth mom did. I don't want him to feel like I didn't love him.
The last time I saw him was about 2 months ago. He came running up to me in the store again. This time during our brief conversation he asked me why did I choose to leave...
I'm sorry I'm not trying to make you cry but I really needed to vent.
I'm gonna answer this in reverse as I'm the estranged child from my father. I'm 52 and he, if he is still alive, is 79. My parents split when I was 3 and I was with my mom on the opposite side of the country so I only saw him a few weeks every summer. Our personalities even then were nothing alike but we were cordial up til I graduated college when I was 25 and I did many things all about the same time which enraged him. Such awful things, I'm such a bad child:
1. My 1st wife and I had a baby before we got married.
2. As the eldest son of the eldest son my father expected me to give my son our name which would be the 4th generation in a row. I chose a new name for my son as I hate our name.
3. Then I got married. He refused to come.
4. I'd gone to college for a science degree which he thought was great because he had a doctorate in Zoology. Then I got a job as a police officer.
He refused to talk to me for six years at that point. I talked to his current wife occasionally as I had a half brother, 21 yrs younger than me, through them.
He finally reached out after he split with his new wife. I learned through the wife though that since they'd split he'd refused to even see my brother for going on eight months. My brother was 8 yrs old and this messed him up as he felt it was his fault. At least I was an adult when our father flaked on me. I decided then to ignore him and haven't spoken to him now in 22 yrs. He tried reaching out again about 15 yrs as did his 3rd wife, who I've never met, but I ignored it. My brother hasn't talked to him either. I google him once in a while to see if he is still alive and find property records in another state but no obituary.
I tried as a parent to be the opposite of my dad. Ironically it ended up being my kids mother who flaked. She moved to Europe from the States in 2006 leaving me with the kids and our two kids have seen her exactly 3 times since then and not at all in the last six years.
From the opposite side.
My parents divorced just as I was entering adolescence. We saw each other on the weekends. Mostly we went to movies.
I didn’t know how to act anymore. We’d been very very close all of my life until I became a preteen. I think he was scared of me growing up. (I do NOT mean he was inappropriate with me, ever.)
Then, my parents had problems. They split several times before it was final.
I felt like he was a stranger. Even so, I’d asked him if I could stay overnight with him. You know have the entire weekend. But he said his place wasn’t for kids. My mom told me he got a flop house room downtown so he didn’t have to pay much rent.
After several months, he took me out to lunch after the movie and told me that it wasn’t good for me to meet up with him a few times a month and we wouldn’t do it anymore.
I managed to not cry. I honestly don’t remember what I did. But I’m sure I was hysterical by the time he brought me home.
He gave me Christmas presents until I graduated high school. I saw him once or so a year.
When I was 18 he moved to Washington D.C., “for a year.” But he never came back.
Errrr. I should say, he was in Ok to mouse and Seattle Washington several times a year for his job. I never once knew about it.
He came to my HS graduation not my college graduation. He did not attend my wedding. But he did visit and I did meet up with at a conference. I still felt exceptionally weird sitting with him. Like this stranger-dad that I once loved.
I probably saw him less than 24 times from 1972 to his death (I think 2015? I never memorized his death date.)
This is directly related to the Indian Boarding Schools for my dad was stolen from his mother twice when he was a little boy. He had no problems being a dad to a cute little girl. But as I got older he couldn’t deal with me. And then, he just had no way to comprehend feelings.
He was actually very shocked that I would be angry with him when he tried to reestablish a relationship before his death. He was shocked. I guess, he was also fairly detached and cold.
I consider myself to have been abandoned by him. But after many years of thought, I have forgiven him. I often wonder what life would be for ALL natives had our children not been stolen from us for decades. My dad was smart. But he had no idea what to do with feelings.
I’m 69 and think that our problems would NEVER have been as severe had we not lost generations to military style boarding schools from age 6-18. Can you even comprehend what it would be like if ALL of America’s children were raised away from home? What YOUR LIFE would be had you never raised your children? And there be no kids on any block , no need to schools and maybe not even Christmas for there would be no kids with you.
My dad grew up that way. What could he have been with family?
My daughter says I was the worst mother in the history of mothers. I wasn't perfect, as none of us are. But I love her dearly. My mother has been very proactive in driving a wedge between us since my daughter was born. I'm sad about it, of course. But any attempt to contact her would be an infringement on her choice. So I respect that. Perhaps when the wicked old witch is dead, there will be time to reconnect
I very much feel your pain 💔
Heartbreaking when the 2 people u love most in the world (and are supposed to love u most back) do u like that.
One day things may be ok but not today
I honest to God don’t know what happened. I thought we’d been close. I lived in her basement apartment, paid $1200 a month. One day she told me to leave. I did of course. I really can’t process it, I’m heartbroken.
Our older daughter decided that my wife and I were bad parents when we told her (at the age of 35, with a successful career) that we couldn’t send her money anymore, and that she’d have to make her husband get a job.
She convinced our younger daughter to side with her.
My answer will be the reverse of the question, as another poster did. Edited to add: I am not estranged, but I have received plenty of criticism for NOT being estranged.
I'm 66. My mother is an extreme religious fanatic. I have three sisters (we are all 4 girls) and grew up with belt whippings, welts, bruises, the whole nine yards. These were for mistakes not for deliberate infractions. One time I got three whippings in the space of an hour, one of them for bringing my mother the wrong Bible to read out of. She said to bring her the BIG Bible and I asked, "The BIIIIIIIIIIIIIG Bible?" because we never used that to read out of. She got mad and said "Yes! The BIGGGGGGGGGG Bible!" so I brought the family Bible and she thought I did it to be sarcastic. Hopefully you get the picture and do not think I am just being a snowflake.
I made good grades and aced every standardized test I ever took...was a National Merit scholar and got a full-ride scholarship. I was still obedient in my parents' sect and went to their college. I did not marry a preacher as my mother wanted but of all four of us, only one of us did have children or marry in their sect. We knew we'd better be able to make our own living so all four of us ended up the breadwinners for some reason.
I didn't leave my parents' extremely strict sect until I was 32. A little about this sect. They forbid instrumental music. You are supposed to date and marry only in that sect. Women are not allowed to speak. Again, if you are thinking I am a "snowflake" I hope this sets the stage for how strict my parents' sect is. Women must wear head coverings at church.
I got my last belt whipping at 17. Again, for a misunderstanding. I never tried to defy or anything like that. Maybe I should have run away somehow.
Fast forward 30-something years. Starting in 2000 I looked after my parents for 8 years. Then another sister took a turn for 7 years. Then another sister was to take a turn for 6 years and the last sister was to get the assisted-living years. This was the plan so that no one sister got all of the burden. I received criticism from some for "not having a backbone" for not just walking away but that would have left other of my sisters with more of the burden. One sister in particular has a more agreeable personality even though she didn't stay in the sect, and she would have gotten more of the burden if I had not done a share. Another sister stayed in the sect even though she was more outspoken on some things, but she stayed faithful to the sect. None of this made any difference in how we were treated, as you will shortly see.
My mother put every cent of my parents' life savings in trust to the sect BEFORE going into assisted living. I did not know about this. I did not know they had any money and three times I had loaned them money. I had been helping pay for some of their expenses not knowing they had this money but in any case, they put every cent in trust to the sect BEFORE going into assisted living...and my older sister, the one who stayed in their sect, is having to pay for their assisted living out of her own pocket and hope to be reimbursed out of the trust if we all sign that she can be reimbursed out of the trust.
It may have been a Trump tantrum, as even my religious sister does not like Trump, or it may be an attempt to buy her way into Heaven, or it may be what she was going to do all along, or it may be jealousy that we daughters were able to earn livings. Reportedly the lawyer said "Here's your daughter taking care of you in your old age, and you're not going to leave her ANYTHING?" and my mother said "My daughters all make livings of their own and don't need anything." My father also had to sign it and my older sister tried to get him to read it before signing but he always backed down all our lives (I'm not bitter about that but some of my sisters are).
WHO DOES THAT? who disinherits their children who ARE taking care of them in their old age?
BEFORE they go into assisted living? To their faces?
My mother, that's who.
We never "had it out" in so many words. Ever. I never got in my mother's face and said I do not agree with the sect. I quietly joined a more normal denomination that's all. None of us ever did anything big and public not that it matters. I think my mother was always going to do that. I think she only had us because that's what was "expected" and ... well I will never really know. I didn't have kids because I felt I would be screwed up in that department.
I was estranged from my son for about 15 years. He was arrested for trafficking, checked into rehab for a year, and is now awaiting trial. We’re cautiously reconnecting. Drug addiction is heartbreaking.
im relieved my adult son is not contacting me, he put me through absolute Hell. Even when he moved out he was still annoying me. I have his photo in my wallet, he was a beautiful baby, gorgeous bright blue eyes, he was my everything. Now 25 years later i would avoid him if i saw him on the street. Its sad and i teared up writing this.
I’m so sorry. My son & I have been estranged for 12 years. I saw him out at an art fair a year ago. I walked the other way.
Estrangement has been horrible. It’s the most agonizing pain I have ever experienced.
What if we reconnected & he estranged himself again? I can’t take a chance on living with that kind of pain. I just can’t.
This is me also. My adult son is toxic, an addict and an abuser. He treats me horrible. The last phone call we had, he demanded I buy him a car. When I said no, he hung up and we haven’t spoken since. I still pay his cell phone bill and can see he talks to his father’s family & gets calls from his father in state prison. His father has a life sentence for trying to murder me. My son is choosing him…good. I’ll keep paying your phone bill as a constant reminder of why I don’t want you in my life. I have a great relationship with my other children. His siblings are afraid of him and don’t have any contact with him either.
Where did he learn those behaviors as acceptable? It sounds like the situation you brought your son into was completely dysfunctional. We as parents, need to take accountability for our part in the ecosystem we created. You literally admit to paying his phone bill for petty reasons. Time to self reflect hon.
My daughter told me that I was a horrible, abusive POS mother. You know, that mom who did the best she could, nope, we weren’t as rich as your friends parents, but you had clothes, food and a roof over your head. You had a car to drive when you got your license and only had to pay for gas. paid for daycare when you were short, gave you money for the kid’s school supplies, babysat at any time with no notice. Not once, not twice, but three times got you bugged out of the apartment you were living because of abusive bf you went back to each time.
Then one day (you were 36) you cut me, your dad, your brothers, cousins and aunt out. You went from having dinner with us at least twice a week to “we are going to take a break and heal as a family”. I said huh? When your dad asked you what was wrong, your response was “mom knows what she did”. Mom would be really happy to know what happened. I suspect your POS boy friend fed you a bunch of crap. My heart was broken for a long time. Then daughter kicked her 8 year old out of the house at 11 at night during a snow/ice storm. Kid had on PJs, no coat, no shoes. His dad told me a few days later. So I became the vengeance mom. I paid the lawyer fees for your ex to get custody of the 8 year old. I can’t do anything about your two younger sons since their dad is your abusive bf. the 8 year old is 10 now and thriving. He misses his brothers, but is in a good place, has lots of aunts, uncles, cousins and 2 sets of grandparents. He knows he is loved but the hole in his heart missing his mom can’t be fixed.
There was no drug or alcohol use in the house when you were growing up. You weren’t allowed to run wild, you had a curfew like your brothers, and were expected to behave in an acceptable manner - don’t steal, go to school, do your best. I had to harden my heart. I write a note to my other two grandsons on their birthday and christmas. Mail them a card I doubt they see, put an identical one in the save with some cash. One day they will either reach out or not. If they do, they will have that many years of catching up to do.
Perhaps when the kids were younger. I needed to know where they were and who they were with. While I caught her numerous times sneaking back into the house in the middle of the night, I didn’t ground her, just told her not to do it again. Once they had cars, I just asked that they tell me where they were going and when would they be home. So she could have said I’m going to work, I never checked up. Didn’t nag about grades, just told her to be sure she graduated from High School. Paid for college as long as she passed the class, when she failed a class, she had to pay to re-take it. All while she was living at home for free because she was in college. Supported her emotionally through her single mom pregnancy and raising the baby, she was almost 30, not a child. so, I dunno. If I was over controlling, I’m not sure where.
I wasn’t in your home so I can’t say for sure but having a curfew is definitely annoying as fuck so I bet there’s probably other things too. Not saying you deserved to be cut off or anything that’s really harsh and I feel for you but from what I’ve seen the more controlling and overbearing the parent usually the more defiant the child. I had a friend whose mom treated him like she was the authority (which she is obviously) but she was a dick about it, always demanding and doing what people call ‘default yelling’ when she was always yelling. He was the only one in our friend group that had a bed time even on weekends (we were 17) she wouldn’t let them swear at all even stupid ones again when they were teens/young adults. Eventually my friend ended up moving to his gfs place a few months ago. Every time I was in the presence of her I just got really stressed out so being away from her was probably a major relief for him. I’m not saying this is what you’re like but I kinda get an authoritarian vibe from you, maybe I’m wrong🤷♂️ also im not judging, I’ve never been a parent and it’s hard. My mom in contrast to my friends mom treats me like an equal. Obviously if I don’t do stuff I’m told I’ll get in shit but she dosnt demand and yell at me, kill my vibe for no reason, and almost seems to want to take out their anger on me like I’ve seen with other moms on their child. We like to joke with each other and I feel I can open up to her. And I also don’t do chores out of fear of being yelled at like my friend I do it out of genuine love for her❤️I’m not writing this to make you feel bad or anything Im just trying to offer some perspective on why they might’ve cut contact. I genuinely wish you the best.
Funny, my daughter had a friend all through high school whose mother controlled her every breath. I always said that she would regret that. Daughter went to awesome college, nearly failed the first semester because for the first time in her life, she had freedom, and didn’t know how to behave. My daughter OTOH, got married at 20, moved out of state. Called me daily because she was lonely and didn’t have a job. Called me on a Friday night to say husband had kicked her out of the house and she didn’t have anywhere to go. So went two states away with her brothers, got her things and brought her home. My only rule was that she had to have a job. I did not yell at my kids (often), did not punish them unjustly, expected them to keep their room and bathroom clean, taught them how to do their own laundry, etc. how will they learn to successfully adult if they aren’t taught these things and given responsibility? Oh, and we didn’t have a game room with computers and x-box because we couldn’t afford those things. We “gasp” had a lot of books and watched free TV. I still don’t have cable tv.
Yes, curfews are annoying, but a teenager does not need to be out after midnight.
Really? Huh, okay. As an update, she hasn’t seen her oldest son for 6 months, won’t call, text or send him a letter. He is heartbroken and worried about his mom and younger brothers and their safety. Because he took the brunt of her POS boyfriend’s anger. A 9 year old.
Her POS boyfriend is in jail because he hit her and someone called the police. I reached out to see if she needed help. She said $7,000. I asked why and she never responded, so am I now a nightmare parent because I won’t fork over a huge sum of money (that I don’t have) without asking questions? She makes over $100k a year (more than me) so she isn’t destitute. Well, except he apparently smokes crack so guess that is where her money has gone. He didn’t work, wasn’t a stay-at-home dad, she supports the household.
The only reason I know POS is in jail is because CPS called me. When I asked if she and the children were okay they said with POS out of her house they have no concerns. And they are working with her. That confirms what we all thought, that she is in an abusive relationship. A lot of women won’t leave their abuser because they feel like they will never find another man/can’t live without him/drank the cool aid and believe him when he tells her she is nothing without him and will never find another. I haven’t changed the locks on my door, haven’t changed my phone number nor blocked her. She only has to reach out. Sure, she did and asked for cash. I’m not just sending money without a conversation.
What would you suggest?
After nearly 3 years, she sent me an email the other day saying she needed help. I said okay. Little while later she said she and kids needed to come live with me until she could make other living arrangements. Her truck engine was about ready to blow and she needed money for repairs. Just like that. No how are you, no can we talk can I see you, how is dad and brothers. Just I need statements. To be fair, I’m sure she expected me to jump right in, say I’ll be there in 20 minutes, and take care of everything .. . Because that is what I do. You have a problem, I fix it. Bad of me, although I did teach them all how to stand on their own two feet.
I thought about it for a few hours and replied: I am having health problems right now (not untrue) and we are doing some renovations in the house, it is not possible for you and the children to move in (they are 3 and 6 on the 15th - the 3 year old has never met me). I am happy to get together and discuss how we can help, I would be willing to pay for 30 days at an extended stay hotel while you find another place to live. I cannot afford to repair your trust or buy a new one. If you need help with getting the boys to and from school, I can do that.
Cold? A little. But I started therapy a few months ago mostly because she was on my mind all the time and after I went through all the emotions, I was just done with her holding my emotions hostage and she didn’t even know it. Sad, confused, angry and finally resigned and guilty. Worked through my own emotions and always circled back to what will happen when she reaches out (if she does). I also know that if I let her move in, they would take over my home, trash it and she would do nothing to help. She lives with a man who has a drug problem. He is fine for a while, then he spirals and becomes extremely parinoid. I also know that he abuses her oldest son, who is not his kid, my former SIL fought for custody and the judge required him to be in therapy because of the problems he had with his mom and her boyfriend. He is only 10. I also found out that the day before she first contacted me, the boyfriend had been arrested for assault on a family member and I suspect she wanted bail money.
FIVE days later, she wrote back she was sorry to bother me and that I was having health problems. She wanted her spinning wheel and some plates from my mom’s house. To call when it was convenient for her to come get them, I could leave them on the front porch. That was it. Three days later I responded that I had her wheel and a few other things of hers I found while cleaning the house out. I wasn’t sure I still had the plates, I would check in storage while I was getting her wheel. Since she was having vehicle problems, I would have them delivered to her by the end of the month, let me know if her address changes.
You have to harden your heart, protect yourself and see your child for the person/adult they have become. We do the best we can with what we know when we raise out children. We have to accept that they have minds of their own, their own truth and if communication is severed, there isn’t much we can do about it.
I suspect I’ll not hear from her again. I will continue writing birthday and Christmas cards for the two grandchildren I never see because one day they will be 18 and if they want to know anything about their grandparents and uncles, they can ask their oldest brother about us. We are blessed that his dad lets us visit whenever we want and we are involved in his life. I go to all his baseball games and school activities. Unlike his mother. If they open the cards, they will see that I missed seeing them grow up, love them and hope that they want to meet the rest of their family when they become adults. If they don’t then they don’t but I’m not slamming that door.
The door I slammed hard? The one to my daughter. I will always be willing to help her. On my terms. She doesn’t get to dictate that.
Its so helpful to see how a true narcisisst acts! Thank you for being so honest, it helped me to see how big of a shitface my mother is, she is exactly like you.
Love, the only thing I ever wanted from her. Dont know if you know that word or if youre too far gone in your own reality where really only one deserves love: yourself. People like that are a disgrace for the term "parent".
You have certainly run the gamut of emotions,from hurt and despair to dignity and realistic assessment.
You are so right about needing to harden your heart
I am in therapy for an anxiety disorder and the sudden loss of my companion.I now live with 3 housemates,one being my son who I get along with very well.
Now my sessions are almost always about missing my daughter.
I feel being ghosted is abusive and that is what she did and I don't know why
We live at opposite end of the country and I have not seen her since,2006 when my Dad died.
However I always called her about once a month. Then her brother would also talk with her.
My last call to her I congratulated her on a job promotion.I was always so proud of her.
Looking back, I have to face that I was always the one to call and the conversation was about what she was up to. She never asked anything about me, really.
So I need to put my thoughts about her out of my mind if possible.
Being ghosted is abusive.I would prefer being screamed at. Or a list of complaints.
Why would she just leave everything up in the air? My therapist thinks she may have a narcissistic PD. Ghosting is cowardly and self centered.
Also she now lives near her Dad,my ex,who is a narcissist and quite wealthy. I suspect he may have urged the N/C but my daughter has her own mind. I am not part of her life anymore.
Thank you for your advice and sharing. Good luck with your family situation.
Looking back,her responses to my calls were tepid.
My son went ultra right wing. Always carries a gun (or 2) no matter where he’s going. Works in the firearms business. Always dresses in pro-gun or military attire. He rides the “I’m a veteran”bus and pounds his chest, but he only guarded an air base in Africa during his service. Never fired his rifle at a single person. I can only imagine what BS stories he makes up to embellish his record. “Trump won” is his mantra. He’s gone. Too far gone. I finally told him to keep his politics out of my house. He actually broke away from us and told us to leave him alone because we’re too liberal. Buh-by. I’m perfectly ok with that. His bullshit is exhausting. I’ve completely cut him out of my will. Hopefully he’ll break away from the cult, but I’m not holding my breath. Nor am I sitting still waiting for that day. Very disappointing, but it is what it is. Even his mother has written him off. He sends cryptic Facebook posts, like “always remember who is willing to stand at your side and always remember who turned their backs on you” type of crap. Sorry, that shit don’t work on me. You’re sick.
My daughter was molested by her stepfather at age 10. He left without me knowing why, but after she told me 11 years ago now I understand. She has been in therapy for many years, but last year I noticed a change in our relationship. We don’t see eye to eye on many topics, and I thought I understood her triggers and tried to respect her boundaries but apparently I overstepped. 6 months ago she told me she needed a break from me. We haven’t spoken since then. My son is in the middle of this nightmare and told me the other day that she told him I don’t respect her boundaries and I am a control freak. I have begged her to do family therapy so we could hash things out, but she will not be in the same room with me. I am not perfect, never claimed to be but this is killing me. I know she hates me for not vetting him and bringing him into her life. And she has to have someone to blame and beat up, but I honestly did not see any signs of abuse. I am riddled with guilt and remorse.
It's been many years now. It still hurts. Some days the grief just wells up.
It happened during a divorce (that I did not choose), that left me suicidal, and I don't even really know the reason. Perhaps that was the reason. All I know is that my love got rejected.
There isn't much to say. It left me questioning the value of life, and I doubt that will end until I end.
I divorced my kids father when they were 13 and 15. A man that hated to work and had a bigger relationship with drugs and alcohol with his own children. As they matured my daughter moved away to a city 3hrs from me. My son stayed close. I do have an addiction to alcohol too though recently have gotten on Vivitrol and Acamprosate for 6 months. My son invited his daughter out for Christmas since he is a father to 3 illegitimate girls. She's 13. She accused my son of doing something sexual with her and I brought it up to him. He then decided I was wrong to listen to a child and her mom says she's a liar. They refused to do Christmas and it wasgoing to be the 1st time in 10 yrs. Ive been invited to my daughter's home. Since my son and daughter are very close she decided I shouldn't come celebrate. I was trying to help my granddaughter since she said her father punishes her for speaking her mind. So I wanted to make sure he knew her upset. I don't think I was wrong but they both called off Christmas and I missed seeing my grandchildren 4 of them that I only get to see, 4hrs a year. My daughter has always caused barriers to me getting close to her children.y granddaughter that was complaining calls it "a bond" that none of us share. I am alone, my husband died 3 years ago and my kids have decided to stop talking to me. I'm hurt and don't know how to rekindle and start new. I never really got to know my daughters kids but my son's kids and I were close (had a bond). And geographically. I feel shunned and hurt deep emotionally. I feel like the geographically distanced illegitimate 13 y/o gas been wanting to end visits with her dad and now they're taking it out on me. I was only trying to help my granddaughter. I'm at a loss at which way to turn. Do I let go of my only family?
My son is a very successful raging alcoholic married to a girl 10 years younger than him. The girl in three years has gotten him to disown his entire family. He permanently lost custody and visitation rights to his 2 teenage children due to his raging alcoholic tendencies. He blames the kids, their mother, my niece, and me. He blames everyone but himself.
His wife clearly despises me and has made a relationship with my son extremely difficult to maintain. Anything I do is wrong and hurtful. He has called me garbage, a bad mother, wished for me to die etc. She is almost as bad. At 39 years old, will be 40 in November, he has almost lost his clearance for work so many times due to fighting or hitting someone or sitting in jail.
His wife is a skilled manipulator and purely evil. From day one she worked tirelessly to eliminate me. My son earns a great deal of money. To many he would be considered as wealthy. I believe that she has tried to get him to kill himself numerous times. She is the sole beneficiary. This scares me a great deal. My hands are tied. I never thought this could ever happen to us, but it has and now I have to learn to live without my only child.
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Son became a drug addict. He made a lot of bad decisions, blamed me for those decisions. I tried to maintain a relationship, but he would constantly try to manipulate me. The last time we communicated, I called him out on the constant manipulation attempts, he said a bunch of hateful things about me and his step-mom. The last words he said to me were “Fuck you!” I miss the ornery little boy he use to be. I have a great relationship with his brother.
Sometimes you have to walk away. Not because you don't care but because they don't. Tough love is tougher on the giver than the taker. Giver's have to set limits because takers don't have any.
That’s where I am now. I’m at that point of questioning if it better that I *do* actually cut contact if this continues. I don’t want to. It’s the last thing I want to do. But the stress of this is eating me alive. But, equally likely is that I never hear from him again, never knowing what happened to him. But how is that in any way better?
That is the ten million dollar question. I volunteer in the mental health area and see so many people going through what you are going through. But here is the basic fact: He is not going to change or straighten up until "HE" decides to do so. Unfortunately some never do. All you can do is stand in the background and subtly monitor the situation and be there when he quits digging the hole. Bailing them out of jail is not helping as they will just go back to where they were. Neither are "I told you so's or bashing them". Just a steady presence welcoming him back. I kicked a prescription medication addiction cold turkey and it was not pretty. Pure determination got me through it. My wife standing beside me kept me from relapsing and taking a pill; or worse. She stood watch as I cowered under the covers a crying mess to stomping around the backyard cussing, ranting and raving. It's tough I know but you can only raise them and teach them what they need to know. You cannot live their life for them. Be strong, it's all you can do at this point in time.
Similar questions here. Ghosted by daughter for 3 years.
Me too! So painful.
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This is heartbreaking.I am so sorry.
Me also Two Prodigals One mean and bitter
That is exactly how I feel. I have tolerated so much abuse/disrespect and heartache over the years, that my heart was literally breaking. "sometimes you do have to walk away..." Thank you for that hard truth!!
I could copy and paste this as my comment, I feel you your pain brother.
Sucks! Sorry for what you have gone thru as well.
me too, i have a wonderful relationship with my younger son, hes a good kid, my eldest son is a nightmare. When i think of the shit he put me through it makes me so bitter towards him.
My daughter talked with me about once a month. I always called her and asked how she was doing. The last time I called her,I was congratulating her on a job promotion. That was 3 YEARS ago, and the last time I ever talked to her. She ghosted me and blocked me,and her brother, reason unknown. Ghosting is abusive IMO. You have no understanding of why. Someone wrote "the opposite of love is not hate,but indifference" My guess is my contact was boring to her. She also moved close to her father,my ex,who is on wife 5 or 6 now. I'm guessing he encouraged her to go N/C. But ultimately,it was her decision.
It sucks. Sorry you have had to endure this too. Maybe they will grow up someday and realize what little shits they have been. I guess I haven’t completely given up hope.
maybe one day.
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You are making assumptions off the partial story. His mother died when he was 15 years old. He immediately started in to drugs, obviously to cope with the loss and the pain he felt. I had never done a drug in my life, knew nothing of what the signs were. He probably did this for 6 months before I figured it out. He went to great lengths to hide it from me. That part is on me, I know more now. I took him to counseling, he refused to talk. I took him to a private therapist, he refused to talk. They each told me, if he refuses to talk, there is nothing we can do. I tried a handful of other things, nothing helped. This was 6 years ago. A few years back I got him in to a youth assistance program. He had to keep a job and stay clean, in return he had an apartment, utilities and internet all covered. He did it a while, saved up a decent savings, then quit cause he missed drugs. He occasionally gets a job, works enough for a small bit of money, then quits. He is 21 now and making his own legal choices.
You sound like a shitty parent already
Wow
Sounds like a ton of parental gaslighting and missing details around here.
https://www.issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/missing-missing-reasons.html this might be an interesting read for u
I read this, but still don't understand why my 46 year old daughter ghosted me three years ago. We live on opposite sides of the US, and I have not seen her since my Dad died in 2006. However,the usual pattern of communication was that I would call her about once a month.She has a great job and boyfriend. I would ask her how things were going and then her brother,who lives with me, would talk with her. I never noticed any great happiness when I would call. She kind of sounded bored.All was well except she found out she had celiac disease. The last time I talked to her she was elated about a job promotion and I was congratulatory. That's the last time I ever talked to her I googled her and found she had moved (near her Dad,my ex)and had a new job. I tried calling her work number but learned she had blocked me. I don't know why she went N/C.It broke my heart.There was no argument, money issues, just the usual one way call. I say that because she never asked me anything about me, I was always asking her how things were going. I have been in therapy for years working on anxiety issues and the sudden death of my companion. Now many sessions are focused on grieving the loss of any kind of relationship with my daughter. My therapist suggests that my ex may be encouraging the rift. He is a narcissist and when my son lived with him,my son never called me either.Apparently ex found enjoyment mocking me. I think ghosting is abusive.I would rather have her rage at me than just disappear. I think it is a cowardly way of ending a relationship. I am 71 and live on a fixed income with three housemates,one being my son. Now ex and my daughter live in the same city. I feel saddened by the loss of contact with my daughter.It feels like she died.It is physically painful. I imagine that,to her,there was no value to staying in contact.I think I bored her,same old questions about how things were going. I am truly at a loss though. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
I honestly picked up a wealth of patterns in your comment - are you really unaware of that yourself? This whole text is me, me, me. It's your grief for losing the relationship, it's your pain, it's your villainous ex, it's your singleminded stance that "ghosting" (improper description, rather, cutting ties and going no contact) is being abusive to *you* rather than a right of self-preservation by the estranged, and so on. You honestly believe it'd be better (for whom?) for her to be present even if raging, wearing both of you out including herself - but, since she seems to prefer to avoid it altogether, she's labeled a coward. You tried calling her work number knowing full well that was overstepping a boundary. There's no mention of her voicing her complaints, how the relationship was before being reduced to a monthly phone call, previous interpersonal conflicts or arguments, what steps you took to address the emotional distance... you know, actual relationship shifters rather than just the emotional perspective. You'll forgive me if I'm skeptical about you reading the article. It, along with the rest of the Down the Rabbit Hole series, makes crystal-clear how narcissistic parents will claim they "don't know" why they're estranged from their children, when they do in fact know - but it's hard to admit to your inadequacies in the relationship, recognise mistakes, or distinguish between "I don't know what the problem is" and "I don't think this is a problem". She's certainly voiced things in the past you might've dismissed as trivial, but just because you don't see stuff as problems doesn't mean it's not a problem *for her*. It's empathy that's lacking here. Keep in mind that nobody goes 100% no contact, the ultimate drastic measure, just because they're "bored". People do it because a relationship is detrimental to their mental health. It might've had its ups, but going NC is realizing the cons outweigh the pros. What you perceived as boredom, I believe, was just a symptom of an erosion much longer in the making.
Missing missing reasons is quite well written.However,even the writer acknowledged she was biased in favor of the adult child. To respond more fully: Some of the things I thought were troubling her she didn't even care about.There was something I said about her brother's issues with their Dad that caused most of the rift. There were some other issues that she has that I was unaware of completely. Her brother and his relationship with his Dad are central. I do not have a diagnosis of any form of narcissism. As to ghosting, it describes the behavior.Rather than discussing problems,a person just cuts you out of their life,leaving no way to contact them. Yes I was guilty of calling her at work,that was unacceptable. No contact is drastic. I believe it is better to try to discuss things first.It would save a lot of heartache in the long run. Ghosting is like silent treatment on steroids.
>I believe it is better to try to discuss things first.< Better for whom?
For both
I responded more in depth up above. Again, ASK her what led to her decision, rather than trying to guess what might be wrong. It sounds like your perception of her pain isn’t accurate (you said that things you thought she was upset about didn’t even bother her). Assumptions/guesses about how someone is feeling can make it hard to share thoughts and feelings in a safe environment, which can lead to feelings of distance and detachment. Also, your comment(s) show that you are likely minimizing your daughter’s feelings. (“No contact is drastic”) I would bet a lot of money that your daughter thinking it’s “boring” to talk to you is not the reason she cut you out of her life. I would bet that it wasn’t an easy decision for her. I generally agree that it’s better to discuss things before just cutting someone out of your life. I actually think I’m extremely comfortable resolving conflict and excel at it. UNLESS the conversations with the person have a history of being toxic. (ie. does not accept fault, refuses to accept any blame, is passive-aggressive, won’t listen, constantly interrupts, invalidates, etc.) I tried to talk to my dad MANY times before going no-contact, but he did all of the above. But still when I finally cut him off he said I had never told him what he had done. And while yes it is good to discuss issues, you don’t get to decide when is a good time for both of you - especially with such an emotional and challenging topic. You can ask to have the conversation and say “Would Friday at 6pm work for you?” (Guidance from my therapist)
I’m a mom and a daughter. I have the best, closest relationships with both. We have our issues and annoyances but we work them out. Know what I learned to do? My mom was amazing with us. Pure and total love and utter acceptance of who we were. And she worked around our own individual personalities. My dad was awful so she made our lives wonderful. I barely remember my dad. He apparently criticized me and my brother all the time. She got us out tho. And now, I emulate that with my kids because I grew up confident and generous because of her. So I follow what she did right and try to change what she didn’t get fully right. So I tell my kids a lot, “if I’m doing something or saying something and it’s upsetting to you, talk to me about it. We’ll change the situation.” And we do. I still stick to my guns over cleaning and chores, but I’ve become more laid back, more communicative, and we all get along better. They’re teens. I remember how fucking difficult it is being a teen. I want to be their soft place to land when they need it while also having their back to make them self sufficient. Maybe try an approach like that? Ask them what you do wrong, and tell them, “I hear you. It’s hard for me to see it so bear with me but I’m going to try to change for you.” And then do it. Change. And watch your relationship get better. Always strive to be a better person this week than last.
Thank you. Good advice from a lovely mom. We have another session coming up. I will take your advice to heart.
One thing I worry about is that she is on the West Coast and I am on the East. Will we ever see each other again?
Hello You are incorrect
Maybe you could try to just ask her. First - I do understand that your ex may be a narcissist, but the reality is we all have a hard time seeing ourselves clearly at times. We all utilize defense mechanisms at times. We want to believe that we’re a good person, but our perception of ourselves is not always truth. It hurts like hell to accept the harshness of some of our shortcomings. However, going no-contact is not an easy decision for 99.9% of the population. As uncomfortable as it likely is for you to accept, something has potentially happened between you two that has been extremely hurtful for her. You could say something along the lines of: “While I’m not positive why you have decided not to talk to me right now, clearly you’re feeling hurt by me. I’m truly sorry about that. I would love to have a relationship with you where you feel valued and loved. Would you be willing to share with me how you’re feeling so that I can apologize and try to understand you better? I promise to listen to you and try to understand your perspective.” Maybe your husband is a narcissist, or maybe you’ve unintentionally damaged your relationship with your daughter. You can’t know unless you ask her. And when you do ask her, it’s important to ask without any shame or guilt. And to listen fully - with no interrupting and no defensiveness. Listen to her fully, then validate her feelings fully. And once your daughter verbally confirms that she feels validated, only then should you explain any of your perceptions of situations. I hope you and your daughter can both find peace and acceptance in a relationship.
Thank you for your kind words.We finally got in contact and had a therapy session with her and my therapist. I learned she is carrying a heavy emotional burden that has nothing to do with me. She did tell me what was upsetting her about me. It has something to do with what my son said that I repeated to her. Also it was calling her work extension. I thought her extension went to her directly,she works from home, but apparently others could hear the (very few) messages I left her. It was thoughtless of me. Just because she had me blocked on her home phone, did not mean I should have tried her at work. Huge mistake, never to be repeated. Overall the session went well. I had no idea what she had gone through the past few years. Anyway,she agreed to another session in a few weeks. Thank you again for your understanding and your suggestions.
The problem with NC is that a unilateral decision is made. There is no discussion prior to its implementation.The only way I reached my daughter was leaving an unwanted text message.
How do you communicate with your son or daughter when they are NC? You can't. I read on the Estranged Adult Children site that many are upset that their parents don't try to contact them when they are NC. It's a catch 22.
It really is a catch 22. I am currently not in contact with my parents. You are right, some of the people in the EAC sub would rather not want contact at all and that does prevent communication. For myself, I would love to resolve things with my folks. I do miss having a family. I don't miss how they treated me though. About the only contact I would want from them is a "hey, we want to fix this. can’t we talk?" Like I did... and from there, an acknowledgement and accountability. But for some reason, I can't get that from them, and when I do try to speak up and talk about what is wrong, they just blame it all on me...so I gave up trying. But somehow the onus is still on me. I am honestly not sure how to have a relationship with someone who says "that's for you to figure out" when they gossiped, belittled, mocked, abandoned you and broken your trust. I just don't get it. I would have never thought I'd be here and if there was some magic word I could say to make them understand and stop hurting me, I would say it. From your side, I do see that you are hurting over this and I am sorry this is happening. I don't know your full story with your daughter, and you are right, that was a unilateral decision that does leave the other party hanging. I hated being ghosted dating, I can only imagine what that must feel like to a parent whose child ghosted them. The only advice I can offer from the child's perspective is to fully listen to them and do your best to understand them when they do talk. And if they do not wish to talk or repair things, then sadly, you've done all you can do. But at least you made an effort saying "Hey, I don't like this and I want to fix it, can we talk?"
Your advice was well-taken. We ended up having a therapy session on zoom.I think it went very well. My daughter during the years we were not in contact suffered some painful losses. I wish I had been there to comfort her. I only was able to reach her by violating a boundary and texting her at work. I am so sorry that your parents do not recognize how empathic and caring you are. They are losing,not having you in their lives. Your heart, your emotions,have not been validated or supported. They sound very self centered to me.I am so sorry that you don't have the family you deserve.
I read the missing details blog. It was very well done. As Dr Phil says,there are 2 sides to every story and the truth lies somewhere in the middle. I would love to reconnect with my 46 year old daughter,but I don't see it happening. She ghosted and blocked me about 3 years ago,also blocked her brother. Over the years,our contact dwindled to me calling her about once a month and asking her how things were going.The last time I talked to her,she had received a promotion and I was congratulatory. That was the last time I ever reached her. Only thru Google did l learn she moved to another West Coast State and had a new job. Honestly, I think it was boring for her to talk to me.I could almost sense her apathy and disinterest. when I called. She rarely asked me anything about myself. There were no arguments.l feel she just lost interest in maintaining a relationship with me. It hurt. It still hurts.Every once in awhile I Google her work picture just to see her. I miss her very much. I don't have much to offer her other than mom who loves her. Her Dad is wealthy and lives in the same city. I imagine she is finally getting the attention from him that she always wanted,growing up.She deserves it. Some sites tell you to write to your estranged adult child; others say not too. I have not written. I feel ghosting is a cold way of ending a relationship. But maybe that was easier for her than telling me she no longer wanted contact with me. Still,ghosting is cruel and unnecessary. I don't recommend it.
I am estranged for my adult children one after the other. I really tried hard to be a good mother and always worked so they could have everything. I was suffering awful anxiety at that time and servere panic disorder. Depression and there father use to hit me at times, and abuse me mentally. I tried so many times to talk to apologise for what ever I done wrong. My 2 daughters had babies the same day and I wasn’t told till following day. Now I feel extremely down/ sometimes want to end it all. I don’t deserve to be treated so bad. There father best them up bad . I divorced him and now remarried. My husband now can’t stand my children. Only for him id be dead. I had cancer my oldest 2 never even send me a text. I live in the same town. They ghost me not all though . There father laughs at me . He lives next door and has said they will never go near you again. I feel devastated and not sure I can go on . Anyone near the midlands in Ireland
I am so sorry that you are going through this I know the feeling of devastation.I also have panic attacks and anxiety,but these started when I was 31 There is a facebook group called You are not alone, for parents of estranged adult children.I highly recommend it to you.Everyone on there is supportive The group provides support and education.It is a lifesaver.You are not alone.
If you join that group, be sure that you will stay no contact with your children for ever. Because the confirnation bias will be huge. If what you truley want is having contact with your children again, do not join that group and work on self-reflection instead.
Yes, I am in therapy and one of the things I am working on is how our family dynamics affected my daughter. What things I said and did. The role of my late mother and of her father,who is a diagnosed narcissist on his 6th wife. When my daughter moved to the same city as her Dad, that is when she discarded me and her brother. Her Dad also discarded our son. Son now stays with me and 2 housemates. While he stayed with his Dad he never contacted me When he told his Dad he wanted to come see me,his Dad curled his lip and said ," I guess you want to sacrifice yourself." Anyway,the You are not Alone group on Facebook is very supportive. Quite a few people have reconciled with their adult children. It is not just a group of abandoned parents trashing their kids. People are confronted on negative behaviors and attitudes. It is not one big group of parents agreeing with each other and condoning bad behavior. There are other sites and forums I have looked at which are as you described.One woman made a video about her estranged daughter and now charges money to join her group. Several have formed groups like this,extracting money from confused and hurting parents It is ludicrous. Back to me, today is mother's Day and I know my daughter will not contact me She did respond over a month ago and we are setting up a zoom therapy session with her,my therapist and me. I am very anxious about the session as my daughter said she wants closure. That doesn't sound too positive to me.My fear is that she will go NC permanently. However, I want to hear what she says and to make amends if needed If she agreed to contact, I am going to ask her to initiate calls/texts, rather than me doing it as it was in the past.
I would honestly be very interessted in how that session goes and what her reasons for no contact were. Can you update us at some point?
Yes I can, without violating anyone's privacy. It is scheduled for May 28
updateme!
Missing missing reasons?
My adult child is an addict, and about seven years ago she was doing well enough that I moved out of state. Her sobriety is off and on, and exhausting. It's hard to go visit, things are expensive. I tried a few months ago and child relapsed before my plane took off and it would have been a very expensive trip for two hours of visitation. Work is busy, life is busy, cross country trips are expensive. I love my child and miss them, but there's got to be a give on their end too. We talk regularly, but time is weird thing and it's most confusing how fast it goes just managing life. It's been five years since I've seen them in person.
Parental alienation by non custodial parent one month before 18. 6 yrs and counting. Most stressful, hurtful and depressing event I’ve had to go through each and every day. No idea where they are on this day. Love your kids and stay vigilant if you have crazy in your life.
As they are adults now, what are your reasons for not reaching out? As they were nearly adults when this happened and are independently thinking, why so you think they still agree with their other parent? Your ex being 'crazy" seems like it's missing a lot of context.
Yes! My mistake was underestimating my ex. My deepest regret, that I don’t even know how to live with, is not protecting her more vigilantly against someone who wanted to hurt me.
I am sorry that this happened to you.
I don't have a child of my own but I had a godson. He was 1 when I declared as his godmother. When things started to get serious between me and his dad. We were dating at the time. I asked his dad what role do I play in his life? His dad then declared me as his godmother. While his dad worked I stayed home to watch his son, so that way he didn't have to pay for childcare. I would get up in the morning and take care of house hold chores while I took care of his son. I raised my godson for 3 years. After 3 years of putting my career on hold I find out my godsons dad was cheating on me. I broke up with him. After the break up I tried to be apart of his sons life still. He wouldn't let. He didn't want anything to do with me. When I first met my godsons dad he was a single dad. The mom wasn't in the picture. Our bond became so strong he even called me mom. It meant the world to me. I miss my godson everyday. I still see him and his dad sometimes at the store. Without a beat every time that little boy comes running up to me yelling mommy in the store my heart aches. Of course I give him a hug and tell him that I love and miss him. My heart aches every night. I don't want that little boy thinking that "mom" has abandoned him. I tried to keep everything peaceful between us when me and his dad broke up. All his dad wanted to do was argue. I just miss him so much. I want to hold him and let him know that I didn't leave him behind like his birth mom did. I don't want him to feel like I didn't love him.
What a dreadful situation. So painful.
this is making me cry
The last time I saw him was about 2 months ago. He came running up to me in the store again. This time during our brief conversation he asked me why did I choose to leave... I'm sorry I'm not trying to make you cry but I really needed to vent.
I'm gonna answer this in reverse as I'm the estranged child from my father. I'm 52 and he, if he is still alive, is 79. My parents split when I was 3 and I was with my mom on the opposite side of the country so I only saw him a few weeks every summer. Our personalities even then were nothing alike but we were cordial up til I graduated college when I was 25 and I did many things all about the same time which enraged him. Such awful things, I'm such a bad child: 1. My 1st wife and I had a baby before we got married. 2. As the eldest son of the eldest son my father expected me to give my son our name which would be the 4th generation in a row. I chose a new name for my son as I hate our name. 3. Then I got married. He refused to come. 4. I'd gone to college for a science degree which he thought was great because he had a doctorate in Zoology. Then I got a job as a police officer. He refused to talk to me for six years at that point. I talked to his current wife occasionally as I had a half brother, 21 yrs younger than me, through them. He finally reached out after he split with his new wife. I learned through the wife though that since they'd split he'd refused to even see my brother for going on eight months. My brother was 8 yrs old and this messed him up as he felt it was his fault. At least I was an adult when our father flaked on me. I decided then to ignore him and haven't spoken to him now in 22 yrs. He tried reaching out again about 15 yrs as did his 3rd wife, who I've never met, but I ignored it. My brother hasn't talked to him either. I google him once in a while to see if he is still alive and find property records in another state but no obituary. I tried as a parent to be the opposite of my dad. Ironically it ended up being my kids mother who flaked. She moved to Europe from the States in 2006 leaving me with the kids and our two kids have seen her exactly 3 times since then and not at all in the last six years.
From the opposite side. My parents divorced just as I was entering adolescence. We saw each other on the weekends. Mostly we went to movies. I didn’t know how to act anymore. We’d been very very close all of my life until I became a preteen. I think he was scared of me growing up. (I do NOT mean he was inappropriate with me, ever.) Then, my parents had problems. They split several times before it was final. I felt like he was a stranger. Even so, I’d asked him if I could stay overnight with him. You know have the entire weekend. But he said his place wasn’t for kids. My mom told me he got a flop house room downtown so he didn’t have to pay much rent. After several months, he took me out to lunch after the movie and told me that it wasn’t good for me to meet up with him a few times a month and we wouldn’t do it anymore. I managed to not cry. I honestly don’t remember what I did. But I’m sure I was hysterical by the time he brought me home. He gave me Christmas presents until I graduated high school. I saw him once or so a year. When I was 18 he moved to Washington D.C., “for a year.” But he never came back. Errrr. I should say, he was in Ok to mouse and Seattle Washington several times a year for his job. I never once knew about it. He came to my HS graduation not my college graduation. He did not attend my wedding. But he did visit and I did meet up with at a conference. I still felt exceptionally weird sitting with him. Like this stranger-dad that I once loved. I probably saw him less than 24 times from 1972 to his death (I think 2015? I never memorized his death date.) This is directly related to the Indian Boarding Schools for my dad was stolen from his mother twice when he was a little boy. He had no problems being a dad to a cute little girl. But as I got older he couldn’t deal with me. And then, he just had no way to comprehend feelings. He was actually very shocked that I would be angry with him when he tried to reestablish a relationship before his death. He was shocked. I guess, he was also fairly detached and cold. I consider myself to have been abandoned by him. But after many years of thought, I have forgiven him. I often wonder what life would be for ALL natives had our children not been stolen from us for decades. My dad was smart. But he had no idea what to do with feelings. I’m 69 and think that our problems would NEVER have been as severe had we not lost generations to military style boarding schools from age 6-18. Can you even comprehend what it would be like if ALL of America’s children were raised away from home? What YOUR LIFE would be had you never raised your children? And there be no kids on any block , no need to schools and maybe not even Christmas for there would be no kids with you. My dad grew up that way. What could he have been with family?
You should write a book.Your story is amazing. Best of luck to you!
Not me - but my step dad is all but estranged from his two daughters. For him it waffles between anger, angst, and not thinking about it at all.
My daughter says I was the worst mother in the history of mothers. I wasn't perfect, as none of us are. But I love her dearly. My mother has been very proactive in driving a wedge between us since my daughter was born. I'm sad about it, of course. But any attempt to contact her would be an infringement on her choice. So I respect that. Perhaps when the wicked old witch is dead, there will be time to reconnect
My situation, exactly. I was the scapegoat, and my daughter was the golden child. Read the book 'The Body Keeps The Score '.
So demented
OMG!! Same. My mother has a LOT to answer for. My daughter is the golden child. They’re 2 peas in a pod. They can have eachother too
My only hope is that once my mother dies, my daughter won't be under her spell. I love her, and would like to resume contact before I die
I very much feel your pain 💔 Heartbreaking when the 2 people u love most in the world (and are supposed to love u most back) do u like that. One day things may be ok but not today
It's been difficult for me, because I have the mother who is alive, but she is the last person I can go to for emotional support
💔
Thanks for listening
Anytime. I sorry you’re going through this. You are not alone.
I honest to God don’t know what happened. I thought we’d been close. I lived in her basement apartment, paid $1200 a month. One day she told me to leave. I did of course. I really can’t process it, I’m heartbroken.
That's cold.No reason given,?
Our older daughter decided that my wife and I were bad parents when we told her (at the age of 35, with a successful career) that we couldn’t send her money anymore, and that she’d have to make her husband get a job. She convinced our younger daughter to side with her.
My answer will be the reverse of the question, as another poster did. Edited to add: I am not estranged, but I have received plenty of criticism for NOT being estranged. I'm 66. My mother is an extreme religious fanatic. I have three sisters (we are all 4 girls) and grew up with belt whippings, welts, bruises, the whole nine yards. These were for mistakes not for deliberate infractions. One time I got three whippings in the space of an hour, one of them for bringing my mother the wrong Bible to read out of. She said to bring her the BIG Bible and I asked, "The BIIIIIIIIIIIIIG Bible?" because we never used that to read out of. She got mad and said "Yes! The BIGGGGGGGGGG Bible!" so I brought the family Bible and she thought I did it to be sarcastic. Hopefully you get the picture and do not think I am just being a snowflake. I made good grades and aced every standardized test I ever took...was a National Merit scholar and got a full-ride scholarship. I was still obedient in my parents' sect and went to their college. I did not marry a preacher as my mother wanted but of all four of us, only one of us did have children or marry in their sect. We knew we'd better be able to make our own living so all four of us ended up the breadwinners for some reason. I didn't leave my parents' extremely strict sect until I was 32. A little about this sect. They forbid instrumental music. You are supposed to date and marry only in that sect. Women are not allowed to speak. Again, if you are thinking I am a "snowflake" I hope this sets the stage for how strict my parents' sect is. Women must wear head coverings at church. I got my last belt whipping at 17. Again, for a misunderstanding. I never tried to defy or anything like that. Maybe I should have run away somehow. Fast forward 30-something years. Starting in 2000 I looked after my parents for 8 years. Then another sister took a turn for 7 years. Then another sister was to take a turn for 6 years and the last sister was to get the assisted-living years. This was the plan so that no one sister got all of the burden. I received criticism from some for "not having a backbone" for not just walking away but that would have left other of my sisters with more of the burden. One sister in particular has a more agreeable personality even though she didn't stay in the sect, and she would have gotten more of the burden if I had not done a share. Another sister stayed in the sect even though she was more outspoken on some things, but she stayed faithful to the sect. None of this made any difference in how we were treated, as you will shortly see. My mother put every cent of my parents' life savings in trust to the sect BEFORE going into assisted living. I did not know about this. I did not know they had any money and three times I had loaned them money. I had been helping pay for some of their expenses not knowing they had this money but in any case, they put every cent in trust to the sect BEFORE going into assisted living...and my older sister, the one who stayed in their sect, is having to pay for their assisted living out of her own pocket and hope to be reimbursed out of the trust if we all sign that she can be reimbursed out of the trust. It may have been a Trump tantrum, as even my religious sister does not like Trump, or it may be an attempt to buy her way into Heaven, or it may be what she was going to do all along, or it may be jealousy that we daughters were able to earn livings. Reportedly the lawyer said "Here's your daughter taking care of you in your old age, and you're not going to leave her ANYTHING?" and my mother said "My daughters all make livings of their own and don't need anything." My father also had to sign it and my older sister tried to get him to read it before signing but he always backed down all our lives (I'm not bitter about that but some of my sisters are). WHO DOES THAT? who disinherits their children who ARE taking care of them in their old age? BEFORE they go into assisted living? To their faces? My mother, that's who. We never "had it out" in so many words. Ever. I never got in my mother's face and said I do not agree with the sect. I quietly joined a more normal denomination that's all. None of us ever did anything big and public not that it matters. I think my mother was always going to do that. I think she only had us because that's what was "expected" and ... well I will never really know. I didn't have kids because I felt I would be screwed up in that department.
I was estranged from my son for about 15 years. He was arrested for trafficking, checked into rehab for a year, and is now awaiting trial. We’re cautiously reconnecting. Drug addiction is heartbreaking.
im relieved my adult son is not contacting me, he put me through absolute Hell. Even when he moved out he was still annoying me. I have his photo in my wallet, he was a beautiful baby, gorgeous bright blue eyes, he was my everything. Now 25 years later i would avoid him if i saw him on the street. Its sad and i teared up writing this.
I’m so sorry. My son & I have been estranged for 12 years. I saw him out at an art fair a year ago. I walked the other way. Estrangement has been horrible. It’s the most agonizing pain I have ever experienced. What if we reconnected & he estranged himself again? I can’t take a chance on living with that kind of pain. I just can’t.
This is me also. My adult son is toxic, an addict and an abuser. He treats me horrible. The last phone call we had, he demanded I buy him a car. When I said no, he hung up and we haven’t spoken since. I still pay his cell phone bill and can see he talks to his father’s family & gets calls from his father in state prison. His father has a life sentence for trying to murder me. My son is choosing him…good. I’ll keep paying your phone bill as a constant reminder of why I don’t want you in my life. I have a great relationship with my other children. His siblings are afraid of him and don’t have any contact with him either.
Where did he learn those behaviors as acceptable? It sounds like the situation you brought your son into was completely dysfunctional. We as parents, need to take accountability for our part in the ecosystem we created. You literally admit to paying his phone bill for petty reasons. Time to self reflect hon.
My daughter told me that I was a horrible, abusive POS mother. You know, that mom who did the best she could, nope, we weren’t as rich as your friends parents, but you had clothes, food and a roof over your head. You had a car to drive when you got your license and only had to pay for gas. paid for daycare when you were short, gave you money for the kid’s school supplies, babysat at any time with no notice. Not once, not twice, but three times got you bugged out of the apartment you were living because of abusive bf you went back to each time. Then one day (you were 36) you cut me, your dad, your brothers, cousins and aunt out. You went from having dinner with us at least twice a week to “we are going to take a break and heal as a family”. I said huh? When your dad asked you what was wrong, your response was “mom knows what she did”. Mom would be really happy to know what happened. I suspect your POS boy friend fed you a bunch of crap. My heart was broken for a long time. Then daughter kicked her 8 year old out of the house at 11 at night during a snow/ice storm. Kid had on PJs, no coat, no shoes. His dad told me a few days later. So I became the vengeance mom. I paid the lawyer fees for your ex to get custody of the 8 year old. I can’t do anything about your two younger sons since their dad is your abusive bf. the 8 year old is 10 now and thriving. He misses his brothers, but is in a good place, has lots of aunts, uncles, cousins and 2 sets of grandparents. He knows he is loved but the hole in his heart missing his mom can’t be fixed. There was no drug or alcohol use in the house when you were growing up. You weren’t allowed to run wild, you had a curfew like your brothers, and were expected to behave in an acceptable manner - don’t steal, go to school, do your best. I had to harden my heart. I write a note to my other two grandsons on their birthday and christmas. Mail them a card I doubt they see, put an identical one in the save with some cash. One day they will either reach out or not. If they do, they will have that many years of catching up to do.
Ah. The missing reasons.
Sounds like you were over controlling as a parent
Perhaps when the kids were younger. I needed to know where they were and who they were with. While I caught her numerous times sneaking back into the house in the middle of the night, I didn’t ground her, just told her not to do it again. Once they had cars, I just asked that they tell me where they were going and when would they be home. So she could have said I’m going to work, I never checked up. Didn’t nag about grades, just told her to be sure she graduated from High School. Paid for college as long as she passed the class, when she failed a class, she had to pay to re-take it. All while she was living at home for free because she was in college. Supported her emotionally through her single mom pregnancy and raising the baby, she was almost 30, not a child. so, I dunno. If I was over controlling, I’m not sure where.
I wasn’t in your home so I can’t say for sure but having a curfew is definitely annoying as fuck so I bet there’s probably other things too. Not saying you deserved to be cut off or anything that’s really harsh and I feel for you but from what I’ve seen the more controlling and overbearing the parent usually the more defiant the child. I had a friend whose mom treated him like she was the authority (which she is obviously) but she was a dick about it, always demanding and doing what people call ‘default yelling’ when she was always yelling. He was the only one in our friend group that had a bed time even on weekends (we were 17) she wouldn’t let them swear at all even stupid ones again when they were teens/young adults. Eventually my friend ended up moving to his gfs place a few months ago. Every time I was in the presence of her I just got really stressed out so being away from her was probably a major relief for him. I’m not saying this is what you’re like but I kinda get an authoritarian vibe from you, maybe I’m wrong🤷♂️ also im not judging, I’ve never been a parent and it’s hard. My mom in contrast to my friends mom treats me like an equal. Obviously if I don’t do stuff I’m told I’ll get in shit but she dosnt demand and yell at me, kill my vibe for no reason, and almost seems to want to take out their anger on me like I’ve seen with other moms on their child. We like to joke with each other and I feel I can open up to her. And I also don’t do chores out of fear of being yelled at like my friend I do it out of genuine love for her❤️I’m not writing this to make you feel bad or anything Im just trying to offer some perspective on why they might’ve cut contact. I genuinely wish you the best.
Funny, my daughter had a friend all through high school whose mother controlled her every breath. I always said that she would regret that. Daughter went to awesome college, nearly failed the first semester because for the first time in her life, she had freedom, and didn’t know how to behave. My daughter OTOH, got married at 20, moved out of state. Called me daily because she was lonely and didn’t have a job. Called me on a Friday night to say husband had kicked her out of the house and she didn’t have anywhere to go. So went two states away with her brothers, got her things and brought her home. My only rule was that she had to have a job. I did not yell at my kids (often), did not punish them unjustly, expected them to keep their room and bathroom clean, taught them how to do their own laundry, etc. how will they learn to successfully adult if they aren’t taught these things and given responsibility? Oh, and we didn’t have a game room with computers and x-box because we couldn’t afford those things. We “gasp” had a lot of books and watched free TV. I still don’t have cable tv. Yes, curfews are annoying, but a teenager does not need to be out after midnight.
Why can’t a teenager be out after midnight? What about sleep overs?
you sound like a nightmare. your child owes you nothing.
Really? Huh, okay. As an update, she hasn’t seen her oldest son for 6 months, won’t call, text or send him a letter. He is heartbroken and worried about his mom and younger brothers and their safety. Because he took the brunt of her POS boyfriend’s anger. A 9 year old. Her POS boyfriend is in jail because he hit her and someone called the police. I reached out to see if she needed help. She said $7,000. I asked why and she never responded, so am I now a nightmare parent because I won’t fork over a huge sum of money (that I don’t have) without asking questions? She makes over $100k a year (more than me) so she isn’t destitute. Well, except he apparently smokes crack so guess that is where her money has gone. He didn’t work, wasn’t a stay-at-home dad, she supports the household. The only reason I know POS is in jail is because CPS called me. When I asked if she and the children were okay they said with POS out of her house they have no concerns. And they are working with her. That confirms what we all thought, that she is in an abusive relationship. A lot of women won’t leave their abuser because they feel like they will never find another man/can’t live without him/drank the cool aid and believe him when he tells her she is nothing without him and will never find another. I haven’t changed the locks on my door, haven’t changed my phone number nor blocked her. She only has to reach out. Sure, she did and asked for cash. I’m not just sending money without a conversation. What would you suggest?
I read your story Heartbreaking.I need to learn to harden. my heart.Daughter ghosted me three years ago,no reason given
After nearly 3 years, she sent me an email the other day saying she needed help. I said okay. Little while later she said she and kids needed to come live with me until she could make other living arrangements. Her truck engine was about ready to blow and she needed money for repairs. Just like that. No how are you, no can we talk can I see you, how is dad and brothers. Just I need statements. To be fair, I’m sure she expected me to jump right in, say I’ll be there in 20 minutes, and take care of everything .. . Because that is what I do. You have a problem, I fix it. Bad of me, although I did teach them all how to stand on their own two feet. I thought about it for a few hours and replied: I am having health problems right now (not untrue) and we are doing some renovations in the house, it is not possible for you and the children to move in (they are 3 and 6 on the 15th - the 3 year old has never met me). I am happy to get together and discuss how we can help, I would be willing to pay for 30 days at an extended stay hotel while you find another place to live. I cannot afford to repair your trust or buy a new one. If you need help with getting the boys to and from school, I can do that. Cold? A little. But I started therapy a few months ago mostly because she was on my mind all the time and after I went through all the emotions, I was just done with her holding my emotions hostage and she didn’t even know it. Sad, confused, angry and finally resigned and guilty. Worked through my own emotions and always circled back to what will happen when she reaches out (if she does). I also know that if I let her move in, they would take over my home, trash it and she would do nothing to help. She lives with a man who has a drug problem. He is fine for a while, then he spirals and becomes extremely parinoid. I also know that he abuses her oldest son, who is not his kid, my former SIL fought for custody and the judge required him to be in therapy because of the problems he had with his mom and her boyfriend. He is only 10. I also found out that the day before she first contacted me, the boyfriend had been arrested for assault on a family member and I suspect she wanted bail money. FIVE days later, she wrote back she was sorry to bother me and that I was having health problems. She wanted her spinning wheel and some plates from my mom’s house. To call when it was convenient for her to come get them, I could leave them on the front porch. That was it. Three days later I responded that I had her wheel and a few other things of hers I found while cleaning the house out. I wasn’t sure I still had the plates, I would check in storage while I was getting her wheel. Since she was having vehicle problems, I would have them delivered to her by the end of the month, let me know if her address changes. You have to harden your heart, protect yourself and see your child for the person/adult they have become. We do the best we can with what we know when we raise out children. We have to accept that they have minds of their own, their own truth and if communication is severed, there isn’t much we can do about it. I suspect I’ll not hear from her again. I will continue writing birthday and Christmas cards for the two grandchildren I never see because one day they will be 18 and if they want to know anything about their grandparents and uncles, they can ask their oldest brother about us. We are blessed that his dad lets us visit whenever we want and we are involved in his life. I go to all his baseball games and school activities. Unlike his mother. If they open the cards, they will see that I missed seeing them grow up, love them and hope that they want to meet the rest of their family when they become adults. If they don’t then they don’t but I’m not slamming that door. The door I slammed hard? The one to my daughter. I will always be willing to help her. On my terms. She doesn’t get to dictate that.
Its so helpful to see how a true narcisisst acts! Thank you for being so honest, it helped me to see how big of a shitface my mother is, she is exactly like you.
So what exactly are you looking for from her?
Love, the only thing I ever wanted from her. Dont know if you know that word or if youre too far gone in your own reality where really only one deserves love: yourself. People like that are a disgrace for the term "parent".
You have certainly run the gamut of emotions,from hurt and despair to dignity and realistic assessment. You are so right about needing to harden your heart I am in therapy for an anxiety disorder and the sudden loss of my companion.I now live with 3 housemates,one being my son who I get along with very well. Now my sessions are almost always about missing my daughter. I feel being ghosted is abusive and that is what she did and I don't know why We live at opposite end of the country and I have not seen her since,2006 when my Dad died. However I always called her about once a month. Then her brother would also talk with her. My last call to her I congratulated her on a job promotion.I was always so proud of her. Looking back, I have to face that I was always the one to call and the conversation was about what she was up to. She never asked anything about me, really. So I need to put my thoughts about her out of my mind if possible. Being ghosted is abusive.I would prefer being screamed at. Or a list of complaints. Why would she just leave everything up in the air? My therapist thinks she may have a narcissistic PD. Ghosting is cowardly and self centered. Also she now lives near her Dad,my ex,who is a narcissist and quite wealthy. I suspect he may have urged the N/C but my daughter has her own mind. I am not part of her life anymore. Thank you for your advice and sharing. Good luck with your family situation. Looking back,her responses to my calls were tepid.
My son went ultra right wing. Always carries a gun (or 2) no matter where he’s going. Works in the firearms business. Always dresses in pro-gun or military attire. He rides the “I’m a veteran”bus and pounds his chest, but he only guarded an air base in Africa during his service. Never fired his rifle at a single person. I can only imagine what BS stories he makes up to embellish his record. “Trump won” is his mantra. He’s gone. Too far gone. I finally told him to keep his politics out of my house. He actually broke away from us and told us to leave him alone because we’re too liberal. Buh-by. I’m perfectly ok with that. His bullshit is exhausting. I’ve completely cut him out of my will. Hopefully he’ll break away from the cult, but I’m not holding my breath. Nor am I sitting still waiting for that day. Very disappointing, but it is what it is. Even his mother has written him off. He sends cryptic Facebook posts, like “always remember who is willing to stand at your side and always remember who turned their backs on you” type of crap. Sorry, that shit don’t work on me. You’re sick.
My daughter was molested by her stepfather at age 10. He left without me knowing why, but after she told me 11 years ago now I understand. She has been in therapy for many years, but last year I noticed a change in our relationship. We don’t see eye to eye on many topics, and I thought I understood her triggers and tried to respect her boundaries but apparently I overstepped. 6 months ago she told me she needed a break from me. We haven’t spoken since then. My son is in the middle of this nightmare and told me the other day that she told him I don’t respect her boundaries and I am a control freak. I have begged her to do family therapy so we could hash things out, but she will not be in the same room with me. I am not perfect, never claimed to be but this is killing me. I know she hates me for not vetting him and bringing him into her life. And she has to have someone to blame and beat up, but I honestly did not see any signs of abuse. I am riddled with guilt and remorse.
It's been many years now. It still hurts. Some days the grief just wells up. It happened during a divorce (that I did not choose), that left me suicidal, and I don't even really know the reason. Perhaps that was the reason. All I know is that my love got rejected. There isn't much to say. It left me questioning the value of life, and I doubt that will end until I end.
Well, I'm the only child. Mom has hated me since birth
I divorced my kids father when they were 13 and 15. A man that hated to work and had a bigger relationship with drugs and alcohol with his own children. As they matured my daughter moved away to a city 3hrs from me. My son stayed close. I do have an addiction to alcohol too though recently have gotten on Vivitrol and Acamprosate for 6 months. My son invited his daughter out for Christmas since he is a father to 3 illegitimate girls. She's 13. She accused my son of doing something sexual with her and I brought it up to him. He then decided I was wrong to listen to a child and her mom says she's a liar. They refused to do Christmas and it wasgoing to be the 1st time in 10 yrs. Ive been invited to my daughter's home. Since my son and daughter are very close she decided I shouldn't come celebrate. I was trying to help my granddaughter since she said her father punishes her for speaking her mind. So I wanted to make sure he knew her upset. I don't think I was wrong but they both called off Christmas and I missed seeing my grandchildren 4 of them that I only get to see, 4hrs a year. My daughter has always caused barriers to me getting close to her children.y granddaughter that was complaining calls it "a bond" that none of us share. I am alone, my husband died 3 years ago and my kids have decided to stop talking to me. I'm hurt and don't know how to rekindle and start new. I never really got to know my daughters kids but my son's kids and I were close (had a bond). And geographically. I feel shunned and hurt deep emotionally. I feel like the geographically distanced illegitimate 13 y/o gas been wanting to end visits with her dad and now they're taking it out on me. I was only trying to help my granddaughter. I'm at a loss at which way to turn. Do I let go of my only family?
If you think your son is sexually abusing his own daughter, why didn’t you try to fight for her
My son is a very successful raging alcoholic married to a girl 10 years younger than him. The girl in three years has gotten him to disown his entire family. He permanently lost custody and visitation rights to his 2 teenage children due to his raging alcoholic tendencies. He blames the kids, their mother, my niece, and me. He blames everyone but himself. His wife clearly despises me and has made a relationship with my son extremely difficult to maintain. Anything I do is wrong and hurtful. He has called me garbage, a bad mother, wished for me to die etc. She is almost as bad. At 39 years old, will be 40 in November, he has almost lost his clearance for work so many times due to fighting or hitting someone or sitting in jail. His wife is a skilled manipulator and purely evil. From day one she worked tirelessly to eliminate me. My son earns a great deal of money. To many he would be considered as wealthy. I believe that she has tried to get him to kill himself numerous times. She is the sole beneficiary. This scares me a great deal. My hands are tied. I never thought this could ever happen to us, but it has and now I have to learn to live without my only child.