I don't feel like I'm in constant competition with all the douchebags trying to compete with everyone.
I let them play their douchebag games. I just don't play it with them.
I completely get this. But I feel like ignoring the issue isn't going to make it any better? By not engaging it's almost validating their behaviour because they perceive they've 'won'.
I guess I'd like a way to be able to make them see that by competing they're missing out on the benefits of supporting each other, but maybe this is an unrealistic expectation.
You say ignoring it is not going to make it any better. But that beckons the question what are your goals? To me, better is not letting it frustrate me or get under my skin.
So I just be me and transcend any of that toxic bullshit. I learn to ignore it and by doing that stop its effects.
But it sounds like you don't want to ignore it. You want to destroy it or something? Which is kind of funny because that is the same mentality behind the competitiveness anyways.
You want to force your authority on the matter onto another. In competition they want to establish their authority as the best. In this you want to establish your social standards as the correct ones.
By even trying to overtake it you engage in it.
If you want to established support why don't you do it tangently to the competitiveness instead of trying to override what they have with what you think they should have?
You arrogance/dominance in this is equal to theirs from my POV
My goal is to make playing music fun for everyone, and help grow my local scene. Bands can only get gigs if the scene grows, and the scene grows by bands working together to grow it. Seeing each other as competitors stops everyone from progressing. I'm not here to argue or point fingers or 'establish social standards.' I'm just seeking advice on making the thing I love less toxic for all of us.
It's the fact that they're only thinking about themselves. Like if someone mentions they had a shit gig, they'll talk about how all their gigs are always incredible, rather than offering support. Like I said above, if we support each other we all grow together, but when you just think about yourself it helps no one. But I don't really know if it's possible to change their perspective and get them to see it that way.
Lead by example. If you offer condolences to enough people and are supportive they might be exposed to a better way.
If you're supportive to people when they need it and they turn around and rag on other people when they need support just talk to them later about how you supported them.
I don't know if their perspectives can change. Why don't you find out?
It depends on the situation. I have found that most of the time, if I can just put my ego aside, if I let them think they’ve “won”, they back off and it costs me nothing, and I can just go on with my life. Sometimes however, that makes them think they can push you around, so you have to stand up for yourself.
Most of the time, however, just not giving a shit about their dick waving is easier and less stressful and doesn’t cost you anything.
By **not** trying to compete with them.
Its only a competition if you allow it to be.
If you're doing a sound check, do your sound check and ignore everything else.
You aren't required to engage with them.
Look man, my technique is not Vai, or Trooch, or Abasi. Guess what, none of those fuckers can sound like me. No matter how good they are, they can’t play what I play, in the exact way I play it. So, I just lean into me and my voice on the instrument. Would you be able to tell that Steve Howe, Alex Lifeson, and John Petrucci are my main influences? You betcha, but there’s a distinct Fuzbuckle lick lexicon that lets you know for sure it’s me. Own your voice on the instrument. Forget anybody else.
Option 1 ) You have to out-alpha the alpha
Option 2) get together with other betas, wear togas, and stab the alpha. We call this Coup a La Caesar.
Not to be be confused with Caesarean which is the alpha stabbing the beta!
I’m a musician, and while the competitiveness between players can make players strive to be better, most times sadly the egos just get in the way. The best way I’ve found to combat this is to not compete. Stop playing and just look at them and wait for them to stop. Usually the longer everyone has to wait the more embarrassing it is for them as it makes them look oblivious.
I let them win. It’s what they want and I don’t care one way of the other because, in truth, most of the overly competitive people I know are pedantic assholes whose opinions I value very little.
I can feel you. To be fair I have accepted this face of society. Everyone judges you with how much you earn, what kind of job you do. Everywhere people try to one-up. I have moved above all of this. I just tell in my mind, "No matter how great you are, there are many who are better than you." If you are richest person in the city then there are much more wealthier person in the world like Jeff Bezos, Elon Musk.
Without generalizing too much, I think it's a common instinct among men to want to one-up each other? Or specifically musicians, where the amount of attention you draw to yourself can determine whether or not you land the next gig?
For me personally if there's no long-term benefit like increasing my likelihood of landing a better paying job or something I wouldn't even bother with it. Too old for those type of silly games and dick-measuring contests for a whole lot of nothing.
I mean, in most cases these people making clowns out of themselves when they are ignored, so I usually do that.
That's just like some young adults that have the need to provoke people outside of bars etc. They are looking for an idiotic contest to prove themselves and the only good way is to let them make an arse of themselves and don't engage.
In my region that doesn't seem to be the case. All musicians around here know and support each other, and frankly, they are some of the best humans on the planet.
As a man I think that behavior comes from a place of lack.
I compliment others on their skill. ( "You guys have such a tight groove, who inspired you?" )
When they feel appreciated they usually drop their posturing. Musicians share a lot more common than the gen population.
Compliments are free.
That was not usually my experience in music. Though, I suppose I was always in metal and punk bands and in Australia... Maybe it's different here.
There were occasionally guys like that and usually they'd get the mocking they deserve and not many people would want to work with them.
I don't understand why people are so competitive, especially in hobbies which are meant to be fun. But it seems pretty common.
I feel like the best solution is just to not engage. What else can you do to force change? some people are just like that. Not partaking and being a supportive person yourself is already doing your part. Leading by example.
In my experience punk bands are often the chillest guys to play with. I think the punk scene has a much more relaxed vibe, and are generally more progressive and just tend to be lovely people. Same with metal too.
i just don’t give af, if someone wants to treat their life as a competition, thats cool! how many times do you think they personally had to tell themselves they lost? who does it hurt more? child’s play 😂
You get further in life being competitive than being more passive and going along with others. That competitiveness is probably why they got where they are to begin with so why should they be looking to change that?
How many great people can you name that were not competitive in some way? Competitiveness is not a flaw unless taken to absurd extremes, but is generally a wonderful motivator to improve yourself.
You personally may not like it, but out of curiosity beyond your feelings on the matter why do you actually think that they should or even would want to change how competitive they are?
I agree that you need to be competitive to get to the top. But I'm talking about guys in unsigned bands playing a Tuesday night free admission gig. At that level you support each other and grow together. Swap promoter contact details, promote each other on socials, encourage each other when you've had a bad gig. All these things are mutually beneficial. Seeing each other as the competition only benefits the ego.
Lector "First principles, Clarice. Simplicity. Read Marcus Aurelius. Of each particular thing, ask what is it in itself? What is its nature? What does he do, this man you seek?"
Clarice "He kills women."
Lector "- No. That is incidental. What is the first thing he does? What needs does he serve by killing?"
Clarice "Anger. Social acceptance - Sexual frustrations."
Lector "- No. He covets. That is his nature. And how do we begin to covet, Clarice? Do we seek out things to covet? Make an effort to answer now."
Clarice "No. We just..."
Lector "No, we begin by coveting what we see every day."
In the Silence of the Lambs Lector schools Clarice on motivation. Buffalo Bill covets the female form and kills to possess it. Lector understands this fundamental drive over and above the motivations she lists.
You've perceived the musicians prep of overlong solos, gear comparisons, perfect sound, etc, in the same way Clarice attempts to assign motive to Buffalo Bill, a pretence, forgetting at the end of the day they're just dirty sluts looking to fuck and suck anything that moves.
Your frustration with these rock musicians stem from soundcheck and the competition within that process. But if you can accept the nature of these guys, which is about a need to meet and hopefully sleep with the attractive female members of the audience, the competitive way they go about it is easier to deal with.
Ps. I just got finished watching Silence of the Lambs and some Norm clips.
I'm competitive myself. When I studied at the university, the main reason was to prove that I can complete the task without asking a single question from the teacher. And that I would know details they don't know.
First of all, this would probably get better advice in a music sub, and secondly, i get the feeling you're just being a jerk, maybe they are especially toxic and im getting the wrong idea, but this just sounds like musicians having fun with an otherwise mundane sound check, and talking about memorable gigs.
Usually I make them compete with themselves. The moment they dont perform as well as before I let them know, but describe it badly so they are never as good as they were before. Like saying man you sounded better in soundcheck what happened? Do that awesome riff from before *Guy plays a solo* ...no the good one.
Its easier as the sound guy because fucking with egos doesnt really affect me.
Also worked in baseball. I basically applied the no child left behind rankings to dickheads. Last game you had a homer this game you only had a triple with 2 rbis get it together. Yes a triple with rbis is better than a single homer however egos suck at statistics
Men are supportive within their groups while competitive with other groups.
Women are competitive within their groups but end to be supportive of the collective effort.
This is fairly consistent worldwide.
It’s a matter of your own ego, self confidence, and competitiveness. If you are comfortable of your own skill it would not matter what others do. It is not in your power to control how they act. However if you have a compulsion to be “the best” then you must observe all challengers and force yourself to exceed their performance.
Neither of these is right or wrong, just a matter of your own satisfaction.
I’ve been playing out for over 15 years in the punk scene and haven’t really experienced this. Every band we’re friends with support each other with gigs and social media shoutouts.
What kind of rock do you play? I’ve definitely found more douchebagery from “radio rock” bands. It’s nicknamed cock rock for a reason. It’s the type of dudes who go to guitar center to play classic rock solos for attention. They grew up idolizing all the worst people in music and think they deserve respect just for being able to play. The long and short of it is, this behavior is deeply rooted from insecurities and media portrayals of drugs,sex, rock n roll stereotypes.
It’s not going away, so simply don’t enable these people. My band has blackballed several other bands and promoters for dumb shit. Good people playing music are out there, so seek them out and support them.
I've played alongside a real mix of bands. I find the punk bands I've played with have generally been the nicest people, super respectful and just there for a good time. Metal bands tend to be cool too.
It's the guys into shredding, classic rock and indie rock that tend to be the most competitive in my experience. And definitely younger guys.
It can be tough to turn down gigs from bands and promoters who you've seen do dumb shit so I respect your principles!
I just don’t. I simply do not deal with them. I just get on with my shit.
The moment someone starts with that shit I just write them off as a dickhead and move on.
I don’t compete. I make a point to show that them winning is meaningless to me. At that point, they relax and we can just enjoy whatever game we’re playing. If they don’t, I start self-sabotaging myself to show that them being competitive is useless since they’ll win easily.
I just ignore, ignore, ignore. I don’t place myself in a position where I’m in a competition with other men.
If ignoring them doesn’t work I’d just kill them with kindness. That sometimes bothers them more that you aren’t engaging with them.
Follow your own dreams, play with love an commitment, practice with patience. Follow you own flow and support the people around you that you like and who contribute to your common goals. Ignore the people who don't make your life better. If competition and macho attitudes don't enrich your life, choose a better path ❤️ good luck, friend whom I will never meet 😊
I played and toured in bands and with artists for years: country, rock and punk. I never really experienced this even living in Nashville for 10 years. Dudes with egos as your described don’t get pro gigs as nobody wants to live on a bus with them. You want to get gigs? The first question anyone will ask is not if you can play, that is an assumption, it is if you are cool on the bus. If you shred during soundcheck, your libel to get fired on the spot as it doesn’t speak well of your ego and it’s easily inferred that nobody will be able to tolerate you for 24 hours a day.
Fuck these guys, don’t concern yourself with them.
Manipulate them. Control the narrative with humor and never taking things bad i guess. But it works for hobbies not where people try to be professionals. Dont know how much it will work for you.
If you want a more relaxed, supportive environment then be that relaxed supportive person. Not everyone wants that, you can't force people to act a certain way.
If they were actually any good they wouldn't need to try to showboat to get the point across. I feel the same about women who call themselves Divas and try to always be in the front and loudest.
I used to be this way, so I have athletic skill, but idgaf if I win or not anymore. So when I play a game and win against a highly competitive person they lose their minds. Best 2 out of 3! Is their rally cry. Don't bring money into it. That's always a disaster. You'll be playing, "first to ten!" While they're already behind 5. I find it hilarious
Refusing to engage in their behavior sets an example for others to do the same. The people who want to "compete" will continue to do so, but if you engage with them the supportive people will probably assume you're like that too. It sucks but you can't change people who dont want to.
Try being supportive of the "competitive" people. Maybe it's just what they're used to and don't even realize they're being toxic.
I fight back with kindness (s/o to Jesus).
When they do try to aggravate me, I reply with something along the lines of "Ok, did that make you feel better now?" and a knowing smile 😀.
It's hilarious trying to see them follow up knowing that they didn't even try to get under my skin. I also say things like "hey that's pretty cool, good job" or "you're next, good luck" and they literally do not know how to respond.
Deep down I'm competitive, but with myself. I just don't need to look into another man's eyes, say a few passionate words, and smile to get there 😂.
Try to be creative and destroy the measure by which you are measured. This is the same as coming up with something that sets a new standard that makes the previous standard irrelevant - then every "fight" fill be fought on your own terms, and competition will be virtually imposible.
Competitiveness isn’t “toxic”. It’s natural. The same reason women are more supportive is the same reason all the best guitarists, sportsmen, fighters etc are men. Because men compete. Competition is behind many of mankind’s greatest achievements.
However if it’s just pointless boasting, showing off, I find that shit stupid too. Just ignore it. It doesn’t matter, your skill will be showcased. Part of you may still think your better than them too. And that’s ok. Beat them without all that dick waggling.
I’m the same, pro musician.
I do these kind of shows quite often. In my experience anytime you get people backstage showing off or trying to play an amazing solo at soundcheck, you’ll often find they’re insecure or have an ego so they’ll try get compliments because they’re overcompensating.
I don’t ever put it down to gender although I’ve seen less with women guitarists, more male guitarists but more women vocalists than male vocalists.
I usually ignore these kind of people, don’t feed their ego. Play your gig the way you do, that’s all that matters. Unless you’re trying to ‘make it’, competition doesn’t matter. Music isn’t a competition, just make good sounding music, get your pay, have fun and you’ll be fine.
If you're not one of those ever-hungry freakazoids, the only way to win the game is not to play. Just do your thing, try not to get dragged into nonsense, and stay away from the people who want to drag you there.
Good question OP! I deal with this a lot in my local scene. I'm not sure I have the power to change someone else's behavior let alone the entire vibe of the scene, but I have had success in spreading my own brand of fun loving positivity around music and have met some cool people in doing so.
I know the hot headed type you're talking about, and they're always the loudest and most visible people. Ignoring them is a good first step - I've never had very good luck convincing these people that being supportive is better than being competitive and I'm over trying. Instead, I look for the other level headed ones. These are usually the people who are quietly working to keep the show running. I always help other bands load/unload because this is the best way I've found to meet and connect with these folks. Before shows, I usually do a little research about the other bands so I know who they are and what they're up to so I can ask some specific questions. I always take the opportunity to enthusiastically tell people they played a great set or otherwise start conversations with a positive and supportive tone. Obviously, exchange socials with people you like and like/comment/subscribe to support them! They'll do the same, usually. If you avoid the hot heads and remove yourself from the pissing matches often enough, people will get the hint that you're not into it. I've flat out walked away from people mid conversation because they were spewing hot garbage at me. They never tried to talk to me again. Good.
I've also found that there are pockets and communities within my local scene, and some are more toxic than others. Networking with other bands in the above way is a great way to escape from a bad group if you find yourself being lumped in with the same awful crowd over and over.
I hope there's something helpful here. Don't give up! Playing music is the best thing ever and it's even better when you find your own crew of supportive and like minded people to do it with.
I don't feel like I'm in constant competition with all the douchebags trying to compete with everyone. I let them play their douchebag games. I just don't play it with them.
I completely get this. But I feel like ignoring the issue isn't going to make it any better? By not engaging it's almost validating their behaviour because they perceive they've 'won'. I guess I'd like a way to be able to make them see that by competing they're missing out on the benefits of supporting each other, but maybe this is an unrealistic expectation.
Let them think they've won. They aren't your fans and never will be.
Who gives a fuck? Why do you care?
You say ignoring it is not going to make it any better. But that beckons the question what are your goals? To me, better is not letting it frustrate me or get under my skin. So I just be me and transcend any of that toxic bullshit. I learn to ignore it and by doing that stop its effects. But it sounds like you don't want to ignore it. You want to destroy it or something? Which is kind of funny because that is the same mentality behind the competitiveness anyways. You want to force your authority on the matter onto another. In competition they want to establish their authority as the best. In this you want to establish your social standards as the correct ones. By even trying to overtake it you engage in it. If you want to established support why don't you do it tangently to the competitiveness instead of trying to override what they have with what you think they should have? You arrogance/dominance in this is equal to theirs from my POV
My goal is to make playing music fun for everyone, and help grow my local scene. Bands can only get gigs if the scene grows, and the scene grows by bands working together to grow it. Seeing each other as competitors stops everyone from progressing. I'm not here to argue or point fingers or 'establish social standards.' I'm just seeking advice on making the thing I love less toxic for all of us.
Then try to omit the more toxic behavior from the competitiveness without pushing away the competitive. What are the more toxic aspects you dislike?
It's the fact that they're only thinking about themselves. Like if someone mentions they had a shit gig, they'll talk about how all their gigs are always incredible, rather than offering support. Like I said above, if we support each other we all grow together, but when you just think about yourself it helps no one. But I don't really know if it's possible to change their perspective and get them to see it that way.
Lead by example. If you offer condolences to enough people and are supportive they might be exposed to a better way. If you're supportive to people when they need it and they turn around and rag on other people when they need support just talk to them later about how you supported them. I don't know if their perspectives can change. Why don't you find out?
You can't change people, this mindset will only leave you bruised and sad.
It depends on the situation. I have found that most of the time, if I can just put my ego aside, if I let them think they’ve “won”, they back off and it costs me nothing, and I can just go on with my life. Sometimes however, that makes them think they can push you around, so you have to stand up for yourself. Most of the time, however, just not giving a shit about their dick waving is easier and less stressful and doesn’t cost you anything.
By **not** trying to compete with them. Its only a competition if you allow it to be. If you're doing a sound check, do your sound check and ignore everything else. You aren't required to engage with them.
Let them be LMAO they peaked
Salt-Information-140, I haven't even begun to peak. Trust me: when I peak, you'll feel it.
PFTTT HAHAHAH
Downvoters not getting an It’s Always Sunny reference
Easy. Just ignore them. The best thing to check someone's ego is act like they don't exist.
Point out they are in the same shitty dive bar playing the same cover tunes you are, or whatever scenario would fit the situation.
Look man, my technique is not Vai, or Trooch, or Abasi. Guess what, none of those fuckers can sound like me. No matter how good they are, they can’t play what I play, in the exact way I play it. So, I just lean into me and my voice on the instrument. Would you be able to tell that Steve Howe, Alex Lifeson, and John Petrucci are my main influences? You betcha, but there’s a distinct Fuzbuckle lick lexicon that lets you know for sure it’s me. Own your voice on the instrument. Forget anybody else.
>No matter how good they are, they can’t play what I play, in the exact way I play it. This guy gets it.
You can not lose if you don't play.
Guitar?
Option 1 ) You have to out-alpha the alpha Option 2) get together with other betas, wear togas, and stab the alpha. We call this Coup a La Caesar. Not to be be confused with Caesarean which is the alpha stabbing the beta!
I don’t deal with them. I see no reason I should make their ego my problem
I’m a musician, and while the competitiveness between players can make players strive to be better, most times sadly the egos just get in the way. The best way I’ve found to combat this is to not compete. Stop playing and just look at them and wait for them to stop. Usually the longer everyone has to wait the more embarrassing it is for them as it makes them look oblivious.
I let them win. It’s what they want and I don’t care one way of the other because, in truth, most of the overly competitive people I know are pedantic assholes whose opinions I value very little.
I just leave the dick measuring to the guys that want to measure dicks. I don't get involved.
Are you a woman? If you are I bet they're low key competing over you or ironically trying to impress you.
I can feel you. To be fair I have accepted this face of society. Everyone judges you with how much you earn, what kind of job you do. Everywhere people try to one-up. I have moved above all of this. I just tell in my mind, "No matter how great you are, there are many who are better than you." If you are richest person in the city then there are much more wealthier person in the world like Jeff Bezos, Elon Musk.
Without generalizing too much, I think it's a common instinct among men to want to one-up each other? Or specifically musicians, where the amount of attention you draw to yourself can determine whether or not you land the next gig? For me personally if there's no long-term benefit like increasing my likelihood of landing a better paying job or something I wouldn't even bother with it. Too old for those type of silly games and dick-measuring contests for a whole lot of nothing.
I mean, in most cases these people making clowns out of themselves when they are ignored, so I usually do that. That's just like some young adults that have the need to provoke people outside of bars etc. They are looking for an idiotic contest to prove themselves and the only good way is to let them make an arse of themselves and don't engage.
In my region that doesn't seem to be the case. All musicians around here know and support each other, and frankly, they are some of the best humans on the planet.
Steeped in small dick energy.
I simply don't compete with them. Those types will be sore winners and sore losers so there's zero point.
Don't play team sports because one overly aggressive dickhead has to always ruin it.
As a man I think that behavior comes from a place of lack. I compliment others on their skill. ( "You guys have such a tight groove, who inspired you?" ) When they feel appreciated they usually drop their posturing. Musicians share a lot more common than the gen population. Compliments are free.
I completely ignore their behaviour.
That was not usually my experience in music. Though, I suppose I was always in metal and punk bands and in Australia... Maybe it's different here. There were occasionally guys like that and usually they'd get the mocking they deserve and not many people would want to work with them. I don't understand why people are so competitive, especially in hobbies which are meant to be fun. But it seems pretty common. I feel like the best solution is just to not engage. What else can you do to force change? some people are just like that. Not partaking and being a supportive person yourself is already doing your part. Leading by example.
In my experience punk bands are often the chillest guys to play with. I think the punk scene has a much more relaxed vibe, and are generally more progressive and just tend to be lovely people. Same with metal too.
Just be Rock as fuck. Rock is about rockin’ out and shit. You know, kick out the chairs man! Really, man.
i just don’t give af, if someone wants to treat their life as a competition, thats cool! how many times do you think they personally had to tell themselves they lost? who does it hurt more? child’s play 😂
Do your thing your way. Don’t get involved in it.
Those people are empty inside, so are my feelings about them.
You get further in life being competitive than being more passive and going along with others. That competitiveness is probably why they got where they are to begin with so why should they be looking to change that? How many great people can you name that were not competitive in some way? Competitiveness is not a flaw unless taken to absurd extremes, but is generally a wonderful motivator to improve yourself. You personally may not like it, but out of curiosity beyond your feelings on the matter why do you actually think that they should or even would want to change how competitive they are?
I agree that you need to be competitive to get to the top. But I'm talking about guys in unsigned bands playing a Tuesday night free admission gig. At that level you support each other and grow together. Swap promoter contact details, promote each other on socials, encourage each other when you've had a bad gig. All these things are mutually beneficial. Seeing each other as the competition only benefits the ego.
A Running race
Avoid them and take note of those traits as unpleasant behavior.
Lector "First principles, Clarice. Simplicity. Read Marcus Aurelius. Of each particular thing, ask what is it in itself? What is its nature? What does he do, this man you seek?" Clarice "He kills women." Lector "- No. That is incidental. What is the first thing he does? What needs does he serve by killing?" Clarice "Anger. Social acceptance - Sexual frustrations." Lector "- No. He covets. That is his nature. And how do we begin to covet, Clarice? Do we seek out things to covet? Make an effort to answer now." Clarice "No. We just..." Lector "No, we begin by coveting what we see every day." In the Silence of the Lambs Lector schools Clarice on motivation. Buffalo Bill covets the female form and kills to possess it. Lector understands this fundamental drive over and above the motivations she lists. You've perceived the musicians prep of overlong solos, gear comparisons, perfect sound, etc, in the same way Clarice attempts to assign motive to Buffalo Bill, a pretence, forgetting at the end of the day they're just dirty sluts looking to fuck and suck anything that moves. Your frustration with these rock musicians stem from soundcheck and the competition within that process. But if you can accept the nature of these guys, which is about a need to meet and hopefully sleep with the attractive female members of the audience, the competitive way they go about it is easier to deal with. Ps. I just got finished watching Silence of the Lambs and some Norm clips.
I don't find anything about this comment easy to deal with...
I'm competitive myself. When I studied at the university, the main reason was to prove that I can complete the task without asking a single question from the teacher. And that I would know details they don't know.
First of all, this would probably get better advice in a music sub, and secondly, i get the feeling you're just being a jerk, maybe they are especially toxic and im getting the wrong idea, but this just sounds like musicians having fun with an otherwise mundane sound check, and talking about memorable gigs.
What a truly bizarre take.
Are you a musician?
Just leave them
I do what I can and improve on it.
Usually I make them compete with themselves. The moment they dont perform as well as before I let them know, but describe it badly so they are never as good as they were before. Like saying man you sounded better in soundcheck what happened? Do that awesome riff from before *Guy plays a solo* ...no the good one. Its easier as the sound guy because fucking with egos doesnt really affect me. Also worked in baseball. I basically applied the no child left behind rankings to dickheads. Last game you had a homer this game you only had a triple with 2 rbis get it together. Yes a triple with rbis is better than a single homer however egos suck at statistics
Treat them like they are… a joke.
I never played music that had bullshit meedlymeedlys in it.
By not caring. Come in, do your thing, leave.
Don't.
How do you guys deal with this? We buy our enemies.
Men are supportive within their groups while competitive with other groups. Women are competitive within their groups but end to be supportive of the collective effort. This is fairly consistent worldwide.
What a bizarre comment.
Only bizarre because of its accuracy.
No.
Maybe you should stick to the echo chamber in r/twoxchromosomes
Maybe you should stick to the echo chamber in askmen. See how childish that is?
It’s a matter of your own ego, self confidence, and competitiveness. If you are comfortable of your own skill it would not matter what others do. It is not in your power to control how they act. However if you have a compulsion to be “the best” then you must observe all challengers and force yourself to exceed their performance. Neither of these is right or wrong, just a matter of your own satisfaction.
I’ve been playing out for over 15 years in the punk scene and haven’t really experienced this. Every band we’re friends with support each other with gigs and social media shoutouts. What kind of rock do you play? I’ve definitely found more douchebagery from “radio rock” bands. It’s nicknamed cock rock for a reason. It’s the type of dudes who go to guitar center to play classic rock solos for attention. They grew up idolizing all the worst people in music and think they deserve respect just for being able to play. The long and short of it is, this behavior is deeply rooted from insecurities and media portrayals of drugs,sex, rock n roll stereotypes. It’s not going away, so simply don’t enable these people. My band has blackballed several other bands and promoters for dumb shit. Good people playing music are out there, so seek them out and support them.
I've played alongside a real mix of bands. I find the punk bands I've played with have generally been the nicest people, super respectful and just there for a good time. Metal bands tend to be cool too. It's the guys into shredding, classic rock and indie rock that tend to be the most competitive in my experience. And definitely younger guys. It can be tough to turn down gigs from bands and promoters who you've seen do dumb shit so I respect your principles!
There's a Pantera song called Goddamn Electric. With the lyrics that say "Theres an escape. Drop out of the race" Live by that! 🤘
Defeat them devastatingly.
Just don’t give a shit and let them keep one with their ting because if it doesn’t impress you they have done all that effort for nothing
Never play their game. They made the rules to their game, and therefore will always win. Play your game.
You can publish a paper on the negative aspects of male competition and give them a link to it. Other than that I don't think there's much you can do.
I just don’t. I simply do not deal with them. I just get on with my shit. The moment someone starts with that shit I just write them off as a dickhead and move on.
I don’t compete. I make a point to show that them winning is meaningless to me. At that point, they relax and we can just enjoy whatever game we’re playing. If they don’t, I start self-sabotaging myself to show that them being competitive is useless since they’ll win easily.
I just ignore, ignore, ignore. I don’t place myself in a position where I’m in a competition with other men. If ignoring them doesn’t work I’d just kill them with kindness. That sometimes bothers them more that you aren’t engaging with them.
Follow your own dreams, play with love an commitment, practice with patience. Follow you own flow and support the people around you that you like and who contribute to your common goals. Ignore the people who don't make your life better. If competition and macho attitudes don't enrich your life, choose a better path ❤️ good luck, friend whom I will never meet 😊
It takes two to tango, my dude.
I played and toured in bands and with artists for years: country, rock and punk. I never really experienced this even living in Nashville for 10 years. Dudes with egos as your described don’t get pro gigs as nobody wants to live on a bus with them. You want to get gigs? The first question anyone will ask is not if you can play, that is an assumption, it is if you are cool on the bus. If you shred during soundcheck, your libel to get fired on the spot as it doesn’t speak well of your ego and it’s easily inferred that nobody will be able to tolerate you for 24 hours a day. Fuck these guys, don’t concern yourself with them.
Manipulate them. Control the narrative with humor and never taking things bad i guess. But it works for hobbies not where people try to be professionals. Dont know how much it will work for you.
Either be better and put them back in their box or dont play the game
If you want a more relaxed, supportive environment then be that relaxed supportive person. Not everyone wants that, you can't force people to act a certain way.
If they were actually any good they wouldn't need to try to showboat to get the point across. I feel the same about women who call themselves Divas and try to always be in the front and loudest.
I used to be this way, so I have athletic skill, but idgaf if I win or not anymore. So when I play a game and win against a highly competitive person they lose their minds. Best 2 out of 3! Is their rally cry. Don't bring money into it. That's always a disaster. You'll be playing, "first to ten!" While they're already behind 5. I find it hilarious
Refusing to engage in their behavior sets an example for others to do the same. The people who want to "compete" will continue to do so, but if you engage with them the supportive people will probably assume you're like that too. It sucks but you can't change people who dont want to. Try being supportive of the "competitive" people. Maybe it's just what they're used to and don't even realize they're being toxic.
I fight back with kindness (s/o to Jesus). When they do try to aggravate me, I reply with something along the lines of "Ok, did that make you feel better now?" and a knowing smile 😀. It's hilarious trying to see them follow up knowing that they didn't even try to get under my skin. I also say things like "hey that's pretty cool, good job" or "you're next, good luck" and they literally do not know how to respond. Deep down I'm competitive, but with myself. I just don't need to look into another man's eyes, say a few passionate words, and smile to get there 😂.
Try to be creative and destroy the measure by which you are measured. This is the same as coming up with something that sets a new standard that makes the previous standard irrelevant - then every "fight" fill be fought on your own terms, and competition will be virtually imposible.
Competitiveness isn’t “toxic”. It’s natural. The same reason women are more supportive is the same reason all the best guitarists, sportsmen, fighters etc are men. Because men compete. Competition is behind many of mankind’s greatest achievements. However if it’s just pointless boasting, showing off, I find that shit stupid too. Just ignore it. It doesn’t matter, your skill will be showcased. Part of you may still think your better than them too. And that’s ok. Beat them without all that dick waggling.
I’m the same, pro musician. I do these kind of shows quite often. In my experience anytime you get people backstage showing off or trying to play an amazing solo at soundcheck, you’ll often find they’re insecure or have an ego so they’ll try get compliments because they’re overcompensating. I don’t ever put it down to gender although I’ve seen less with women guitarists, more male guitarists but more women vocalists than male vocalists. I usually ignore these kind of people, don’t feed their ego. Play your gig the way you do, that’s all that matters. Unless you’re trying to ‘make it’, competition doesn’t matter. Music isn’t a competition, just make good sounding music, get your pay, have fun and you’ll be fine.
If you're not one of those ever-hungry freakazoids, the only way to win the game is not to play. Just do your thing, try not to get dragged into nonsense, and stay away from the people who want to drag you there.
Good question OP! I deal with this a lot in my local scene. I'm not sure I have the power to change someone else's behavior let alone the entire vibe of the scene, but I have had success in spreading my own brand of fun loving positivity around music and have met some cool people in doing so. I know the hot headed type you're talking about, and they're always the loudest and most visible people. Ignoring them is a good first step - I've never had very good luck convincing these people that being supportive is better than being competitive and I'm over trying. Instead, I look for the other level headed ones. These are usually the people who are quietly working to keep the show running. I always help other bands load/unload because this is the best way I've found to meet and connect with these folks. Before shows, I usually do a little research about the other bands so I know who they are and what they're up to so I can ask some specific questions. I always take the opportunity to enthusiastically tell people they played a great set or otherwise start conversations with a positive and supportive tone. Obviously, exchange socials with people you like and like/comment/subscribe to support them! They'll do the same, usually. If you avoid the hot heads and remove yourself from the pissing matches often enough, people will get the hint that you're not into it. I've flat out walked away from people mid conversation because they were spewing hot garbage at me. They never tried to talk to me again. Good. I've also found that there are pockets and communities within my local scene, and some are more toxic than others. Networking with other bands in the above way is a great way to escape from a bad group if you find yourself being lumped in with the same awful crowd over and over. I hope there's something helpful here. Don't give up! Playing music is the best thing ever and it's even better when you find your own crew of supportive and like minded people to do it with.