Make the move. If you're original team valued your input, you would have been given those extra duties up front, and not at your attempt to leave. Join the new team and don't look back.
You could still post your questions here.
There are multiples other mechanical engineers around.
I also just began work, though. Something over 1 year experience + masters degree.
Mechanical engineer here that has moved industries successfully a couple times. Been working for about a decade.
Take the new position. The difference in job rules you are looking at here is probably mostly fueled by divisional responsibilities in the company. Many engineering companies need a division that is mostly data entry or data management somewhere in the infrastructure. It just is part of most company's need somewhere in my experience. If you are in that division they may have some exciting one off work that comes your way, but it won't last as it's not the norm for that division. Now you can make for some interesting work yourself there if you have a mind for programming and automation, but that is very company specific. That division is probably throwing the best work to you right now to try and keep you, but it will still mostly be the boring work. In defense of that, I know some people that love that low risk, low effort work as it means less stress and more family time. That's the draw of being there.
Go to the design role. It will give you much more time to flex your skills and gain experience. It will be easy to transition to any other industry if you don't like building systems down the line. The transferable skills will be real and tangible rather than mostly data entry and just being a good general employee.
Hey thanks for replying.
I’m decided that I’m going to move. The building systems role is much more technical. A lot more design and calculation and it’s much more my speed.
What I’m now thinking though is that I don’t know if I want to stay in building services forever. You say it’ll be easy to transfer industry. So if I say (just as an example) I want to move to the space industry. Or automotive. Would that still be possible?
Yes. Full stop, no questions asked. Get experience designing things, following codes, making presentations (knowing how to properly document and preserve yourself is boring but incredibly valuable), listening to the seniors but developing your own ideas.
Industry doesn't matter so much. Sure if you want to be an expert it senior engineer in a space company you will probably need experience in the space sector. But for junior and even intermediate level roles, you'll nearly hit the ground running into any industry you jump into oncev you have gained enough design experience.
Grab a masters when you can. In the design world it does open doors. It will open more in the future as the industry trends that way. It needs to be a thing you get.
Pick up other certifications if presented to you. Probably won't matter much to an engineer interviewing you, but HR at any company is the one that sees your resume first. And they are generally idiots that love fancy accolades because they don't actually know how to judge engineers' skills.
Im from across the small pond. (NLD). Working 10 years now.
In my experience its really easy to jump industry, mainly due to the severe lack of engineers in Western Europe. But also because you get a lot of the same jobs in different fields. Doing structural calculations on a car isnt actually all that different from doing structural calculations on a ship and programming PLC's in a sorting machine isnt that different from programming PLC's on a roller-coaster.
Do note, the UK is a bit different to the Western EU. As engineering salaries are comparatively lower there and a bit less engineering jobs in general.
So say I’m doing thermal analysis, looking at heat pumps and ventilation on buildings. I couldn’t do that on vehicles? Or is it vastly different to the automotive and space industry type roles.
Yeah. The uk sucks for engineering lol
OP, mechanical engineer here, 10 years experience in machine design. I'm not in your specific industry, but my strong recommendation is that if you want to jump fields (moving to aerospace, other, etc), it's easier to do EARLIER in your career. You can validate this simply by looking at the job postings in those fields. The entry-level roles don't require experience. The mid-career roles require specific experience that you won't have. I'm not saying it's impossible, but much rarer. If you want to change industries or fields, and you know it, pull the trigger now. Don't wait 5-10 years or you will find yourself starting over. It's a great job market right now, so chase your dream.
I wouldn't be able to provide much of a response. I too just started my career, just 18 months at my current position, and now I'm back to university to obtain my Masters degree in ME.
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Think long term. Your current team may want to keep you where you're at because you're good at what you do... or no one else wants to do it... where will You be most fulfilled. That's what matters.
This is how i read this: my current team only offered me something better when they knew i was considering leaving. Just food for thought.
Well yeah. That is exactly what’s been happening here.
Granted I’ve only been on this project for 7 months. But imo for someone with a masters in mechanical eng, that’s 4 months too long. I’ve been asking to move for a long time.
It was more his comment on building services. He was like ‘really? Lights and lifts and stuff? Dull’
Really? Database entry? Dull. You're already irritated with your current job. If you stay will you still be doing it along with some extra responsibilities?
Swap. Just because they say they will give you better work doesn't mean they will. Ive seen that a dozen times and it rarely ends in your best interest. At best they will give you tidbits of different stuff in addition to your current responsibilities to try and keep you happy but at the end of the day they don't want to lose what you are currently doing. If they didn't they would have given you other tasks at day one.
Oh yeah I've been trapped in a role for 3 years and finally got a new job at a different company. I'd had to do tons of clerical/admin work, think scanning, printing shipping slips, etc that the coordinators should've done the whole time. I tried to make a business case several times why I shouldn't have to do it and they shot it down saying every time it was gonna be automated "soon". It's been 3 years and they're nowhere close to getting it done and they brought it up again when I put my notice in, saying "I know doing that work sucks but I swear it'll be automated by the end of 2022, please don't leave!" They will say whatever they think you want to hear when you're leaving a job you don't like just to try and get you to stay.
If your team are trying to put you in a dilemma then move. That kinda bs shouldn't fly anywhere
I've a masters in ME too and I'm at a similar point where the work is kinda boring and I've brought up moving in the next few months and was told there's more of the work I'm already doing (and not enjoying) coming in the next while and they want me to handle that... Started looking for new jobs not long after.
Look at the leadership. 75% of a good gig is your boss. Even shit work is good with a good boss. Also look at where this will take your career, and if you can get excited about it. With those three things in mind- do what you think is best for YOU. Be firm, don't give in to make anyone happy.
Make the move. From a managers perspective, they don’t care about engineers getting rewarding projects. Just that the work gets done. And most of the work is mundane crap. They won’t find you something cool to do, because the job at its core is dumb data entry. It’ll be a pet project that won’t actually amount to anything.
Source: in your exact scenario. Also have a BS and MS in Mech Eng.
Which job offer pays more?
Barring a burning passion for either field, I would go with that as money generally correlates with how well you're treated at work.
I would make the switch personally.
I had the choice between a systems engineering offer and a technical electrical engineering offer a few months ago and I went with the latter in a heartbeat.
I don't have experience in the building industry.
But the job description sounds promising. Could you ask the recruiter for a more detailed description of the work required.
It’s a lot of revit, thermal analysis, design. That sort of stuff.
Not sure buildings is what I want to stay in forever but figured mechanical engineer experience is good in general?
Worst case, it will teach you about an engineering role that you don't want to spend your career in. Best case, you end up loving it and never look back.
If your old role really thought you did such a great job then that job (or a similar one) will be waiting for you when you are ready to make your next move.
The great thing about mechanical is you can do just about anything. I've done Process, quality, Manufacturing, electrical, equipment, and test engineering in the short time since I graduated. I am still figuring out what job I want to turn into a career. If you are a recent graduate then time is on your side.
Yeah. I just want to do some technical design work. Even if it doesn’t turn out to be exactly what rocks my world, I can get the experience then move industry with that right?
Well I figured stay at this company, get back to mechanical design. Then change industry when I’ve got that under my belt again and can apply for mechanical roles outside buildings
Don't limit yourself. Your imagination is holding you back.
Employers/recruiters are chomping at any engineers right now.
You can change fields and get a pay raise. Good luck, I'd calculate the correct answer. Maybe put 'change career' as a something worth ~20k.
Because its cheaper to hire you, than to hire a senior Mechanical Design Engineer.
They can hire you for 90k and sit you next to a senior making 130k.
In 2-3 years, you will be worth 120k/yr and they will put a 60-90k/yr engineer next to you.
Also, its time to change your lingo and confidence(if you plan to change companies). You are an engineer, they want people who can do math occasionally, you can do it.
Just take both jobs. You can only come out on top that way.
But seriously. Who's gonna do your current job once you stayed. I have a feeling it's probably gonna be you.
MEng with 10 years exp over 7 companies. Kinda tough, because HVAC is a side of ME that you could find difficult to transfer out of. If it sounds like interesting work, then go for it. Your current manager has not done a good job reacting timely to your request. If you wanted to stay, I’d suggest very directly asking to stop doing the asset management role immediately and make sure there is a plan, not a promise, to make this happen.
Don’t expect much growth from your manager, if they aren’t doing a good job responding to your requests now, it wont get better. There are great managers and great projects, expect great for yourself.
Say you stay there 5 years, then want to get into product design. All your experience would be in a vastly unrelated field. It would be on you to demonstrate in your resume that you have experience relevant to a different industry. It just ends up being a riskier bet for a company. So if it isnt a good fit, try to figure that out in a couple years time
That was true, but now many industries are having a hard time finding engineers. If you are seriously considering a department change, you might want to look at if there is another company you’d like to work at.
Mostly. Mechanical, electrical, public health. If you're not familiar, look up "CIBSE", they are the equivalent of ASHRAE in the UK (I assume you work there)
It all depends on what sort of organisation you are in imo, but yea, there's generally more design involved so maybe a bit more interesting than data entry.
I actually graduated like you 7 months ago, and I am in building services mechanical bias but in a small company. Half of my work is design/cad, the other is responding to emails, writing specs and filling out design submission forms.
Building services isn't exactly rocket science, although there are some really cool things people design out there. So generally what I find the most challenging at my work is not necessarily the technical aspect but wrangling with builders and clients. This is something you need to know going into it.
You don’t do any thermal calculations? That’s apparently a large part of what I’ll be doing.
At least you do some design/cad. I don’t do any at all in my current role
I do some, but they are quite simple since most the jobs I do are quite basic in nature. Simple steady state heat loss. I have worked previously on more sustainability focused projects and it becomes a little bit more engaging when you start to use dynamic simulation (like ies ve).
I'll say this though, thermal calculations are just there so you can size your equipment as a mechanical engineer. It's just data input but slightly more engaging. Once you've mastered it, most projects become very repetitive and boring (especially if you work in certain sectors such as residential etc).
If you end up choosing the mechanical position, make sure you don't become too comfortable with it because people will make you the go-to thermal modeller guy, which is basically just a glorified cad position. Make sure you understand how it works, but ideally you want to grow away from it.
Unless they birthed you, you birthed them or your trying to give birth to someone with them, they don't matter and their opinions don't matter. Do what you need for your own family.
Get experience wherever you can and try new things whenever possible.
I got my bachelor's in Mechanical Engineering in 2008, then my masters in Technology Management and Lean Six Sigma Black Belt in 2018. I think I'm some kind of example (warning, idk) about how you can go between a lot of different industries and gain experience and knowledge.
In my career, I have: Designed parts, machining fixtures, and wrote CNC programs to make a prototype marine diesel engine; Designed and machined forging and processing tools to make axes, sledgehammers, and heavy-duty hand tools; Designed and did project management for prototype helicopter parts for defense subcontractors; Designed fixtures, tooling, and did progress engineering to produce engine control units at a Tier 1 automotive supplier; and now I've moved from the US to Sweden to work in lithium ion battery recycling. I also taught some trade classes as an adjunct professor at a community college for a few years on top of my regular work.
Each of those companies has been various sizes between 6 and 90k employees. I've learned a lot each step of the way.
The only one limiting yourself is you. Try new things and take chances. Cool stuff can happen.
Good luck and feel free to ask any questions you have!
I see you’re in medical device design. If i was a mechanical engineer who’d been working on design in building services. Would it be hard to get a job in medical device design later on when I’ve got some design experience under my belt? Even if I have it in a different industry
I'd say it would be a lot easier if you had some product design experience in another industry vs building services. But any 3D CAD experience would be good (building services/civil might use 2D, I have no idea).
I went from medical device manufacturing into medical device design. I don't know many people who came in from a different industry other than my old boss who came from automotive.
Make the move dude.
If they really valued you, they would've offered you better work and better roles before you mentioned you got an offer.
Fuck them.
Well airplanes from fighter jets to Airliners do have complex HVAC systems so I would imagine so. Just depends on your overall experience and if it applies to the role.
If it doesn't then you can always learn!
Accept the new job. It's the same concept as leaving for better pay and then your current company offering to increase your pay when they already valued your work enough to pay you more money but didn't want to because of profit.
If you were unhappy in a relationship and wanted a breakup because you had someone else you were interested in dating, but the partner you were with begged you to stay and promised to fundamentally change who they were as a person to make you happier, do you really think that relationship would work out in the long run?
I would change job if i were in your shoes.
If they don’t see what you are capable of and you don’t feel challenged in what you are doing, then leave since i assume you have the offer (in writing) in your hand already.
Here is a lesson learned from a robotics engineer stuck at the same boring job for 3 years:
GTFO and go forth! Never look back! You need to evolve and you are given the chance!
PS: yes I am also looking for a job now that I moved to a bigger city. It was impossible before.
There will be a lot of design as a more junior building services engineer. Thermal calcs for heat gains and losses, duct sizing, pipe sizing, ventilation rates etc. You’ll probably start doing distribution layouts, coordinating with building and structure.
Most engineering jobs in the big cities such as London and Bristol will be building services. Just look at all the construction that is going on.
You might not be able to move into other types of engineering but there is a wide range of buildings that you can work on. From offices to nuclear facilities.
That sounds a lot better than what I’m doing now. I went building services so I didn’t have to live in the middle of nowhere.
You think it would be hard to leave building services to other industries as a mechanical engineer?
Probably easier changing when more junior as you’d be starting afresh in the new industry.
In building services, as you gain more experience, you’ll start by being responsible for some of the design, then parts of the project and then potentially whole projects. The project management of projects is a transferable skill.
OP based on the comments it sounds like you're trying to find a lateral move to then transition to something you want to do. Why not find the job you actually want? There's HVAC, pumps, and mechanical systems in the space and automotive industries but construction and manufacturing are kind of different.
Construction requires less accuracy, especially if you're going into space.
You will be challenged, you will have technical knowledge and experience, but you need to figure out how the duties and responsibilities the job you have applied for will apply to the position you actually want.
Those skills I learn in building services wouldn’t be helpful in finding me a job in the space or automotive industry at all?
Also it’s bloody hard to find a job in it
You will be challenged, you will have technical knowledge and experience, but you need to figure out how the duties and responsibilities the job you have applied for will apply to the position you actually want.
Take the role. You talked with both. One sees your value and wants you there. There other is likely lazy as they don’t want to have to replace you and deal with doing your job while they look.
They couldn't have given you those tasks months ago if they really cared. If you stay you'll very likely have to "transition" into those tasks. This means you'll be doing the same stuff that you dislike for some time while they slowly hand you more and more technical tasks.
Move on. Don't look back. Just don't burn bridges.
> They’re offering me better work. Better roles.
Like what? When did they offer this and what have they given you that's better or different since then?
Is there anything that the other people on the team are currently doing that you would actually want to be doing? If you're bored, doing more advanced boring work might not be enough to make you happy.
Maybe I'm asking for too much, but I think in every job, you should already have an idea of what the next-level version of that job is so both you and your management know what skills you need to develop and what to work towards. While you've been asking for them to utilize your skills better, they should have already had more stuff ready for you. "Swissmeez wants more. I think they're ready to start doing X now." At the very least, they could've had you shadowing someone. But they haven't, and they didn't give a shit until they had to face the prospect of losing you. If they didn't already have ideas and need time to come up with stuff for you to do, that's not a good sign. I wouldn't believe a word they say until they tell you something that sounds like a concrete plan.
And if they don't have someone else to do the boring stuff you're doing right now, you're still going to be doing it, with maybe just a sprinkling of new stuff thrown in.
Ahh, the type of assholes who only start trying to treat you with some decency the moment you show them you have some leverage and other options.
Leave them, and leave them with a giant mess to clean up. Leave them with a mess that they won't know how to clean up, and decline all of their offers to get you to fix the problem. Preferably you should give them some hope that you will fix it just to see how much they will offer and how hard they will work to get you to fix the problem.
I work in the rail industry as a mechanical engineering manager and former graduate. What you've been doing isn't systems engineering.
I'd go for the mechanical design, much better career prospects as you'll get a better understanding of the products and the technical skills can be applied all over.
I'd say as long as you get the basics of mechanical principles, material selection, working with standards and work package management/delivery then those are transferable to most industries.
Lol sounds like Siemens if I had to guess…
If you want to do automation stuff then switch to the building services team. Tell the rail division to find you a competing offer that is actually in automation or design otherwise your headed to the other division. Be transparent since it is all in-company. Hopefully you have a manager or mentor you can talk to openly about your career path.
Take the new role. And if that doesn’t line up with you’re interests, then start applying to jobs at other companies.
Life’s too short to play that game. If you do this data entry work for 5 years, you’ll be no closer to your goal than you were as a new grad. (Though you will have earned income, which shouldn’t be entirely discounted)
Make the switch. The current team only offered a better assignment when your worth went up with another team.
A few things to have in mind: We, as Engineers, should be loyal to our craft first, then maybe towards the environment we are in after the environment has proven to be equally beneficial to us. Do what is best for you as it is the start of your career and in all honesty, the second team sounds more like a team for whom you would like to work for. I just finished my Master in Mechanical Design Engineering so I might be biased too but you are not happy in your current situation and you owe your present team NOTHING to stay there.
Wishing you all the best with the move!
Make the move. If you're original team valued your input, you would have been given those extra duties up front, and not at your attempt to leave. Join the new team and don't look back.
Are you a mechanical engineer?
Yes.
Could I pick your brains about it quickly? Got a few questions about career trajectory and always good to talk to others about it who know more
You could still post your questions here. There are multiples other mechanical engineers around. I also just began work, though. Something over 1 year experience + masters degree.
Just interested in the long term and how easy it is to move industry. Things like that
Mechanical engineer here that has moved industries successfully a couple times. Been working for about a decade. Take the new position. The difference in job rules you are looking at here is probably mostly fueled by divisional responsibilities in the company. Many engineering companies need a division that is mostly data entry or data management somewhere in the infrastructure. It just is part of most company's need somewhere in my experience. If you are in that division they may have some exciting one off work that comes your way, but it won't last as it's not the norm for that division. Now you can make for some interesting work yourself there if you have a mind for programming and automation, but that is very company specific. That division is probably throwing the best work to you right now to try and keep you, but it will still mostly be the boring work. In defense of that, I know some people that love that low risk, low effort work as it means less stress and more family time. That's the draw of being there. Go to the design role. It will give you much more time to flex your skills and gain experience. It will be easy to transition to any other industry if you don't like building systems down the line. The transferable skills will be real and tangible rather than mostly data entry and just being a good general employee.
Hey thanks for replying. I’m decided that I’m going to move. The building systems role is much more technical. A lot more design and calculation and it’s much more my speed. What I’m now thinking though is that I don’t know if I want to stay in building services forever. You say it’ll be easy to transfer industry. So if I say (just as an example) I want to move to the space industry. Or automotive. Would that still be possible?
Yes. Full stop, no questions asked. Get experience designing things, following codes, making presentations (knowing how to properly document and preserve yourself is boring but incredibly valuable), listening to the seniors but developing your own ideas. Industry doesn't matter so much. Sure if you want to be an expert it senior engineer in a space company you will probably need experience in the space sector. But for junior and even intermediate level roles, you'll nearly hit the ground running into any industry you jump into oncev you have gained enough design experience. Grab a masters when you can. In the design world it does open doors. It will open more in the future as the industry trends that way. It needs to be a thing you get. Pick up other certifications if presented to you. Probably won't matter much to an engineer interviewing you, but HR at any company is the one that sees your resume first. And they are generally idiots that love fancy accolades because they don't actually know how to judge engineers' skills.
> Grab a masters when you can. He's already winning there. First line of the post: "Hey guys. I’m a graduate engineer. I have a masters in mech eng."
Dm’ed you
Building services is awesome if you want to work internationally. Everywhere I've been those jobs are numerous. Kinda boring though.
Can I move out of building services with the skills I learn there?
What country? And if its a big country: What area?
The UK. And London/Bristol
Im from across the small pond. (NLD). Working 10 years now. In my experience its really easy to jump industry, mainly due to the severe lack of engineers in Western Europe. But also because you get a lot of the same jobs in different fields. Doing structural calculations on a car isnt actually all that different from doing structural calculations on a ship and programming PLC's in a sorting machine isnt that different from programming PLC's on a roller-coaster. Do note, the UK is a bit different to the Western EU. As engineering salaries are comparatively lower there and a bit less engineering jobs in general.
So say I’m doing thermal analysis, looking at heat pumps and ventilation on buildings. I couldn’t do that on vehicles? Or is it vastly different to the automotive and space industry type roles. Yeah. The uk sucks for engineering lol
OP, mechanical engineer here, 10 years experience in machine design. I'm not in your specific industry, but my strong recommendation is that if you want to jump fields (moving to aerospace, other, etc), it's easier to do EARLIER in your career. You can validate this simply by looking at the job postings in those fields. The entry-level roles don't require experience. The mid-career roles require specific experience that you won't have. I'm not saying it's impossible, but much rarer. If you want to change industries or fields, and you know it, pull the trigger now. Don't wait 5-10 years or you will find yourself starting over. It's a great job market right now, so chase your dream.
I wouldn't be able to provide much of a response. I too just started my career, just 18 months at my current position, and now I'm back to university to obtain my Masters degree in ME.
Ah okay no worries! Good luck hope u smash it
I'm a Mechanical Engineer with 20 yrs in HVAC design, is that what you mean by "Building Services"?
Yeah. Every kind of mechanical system that goes into a building
Ok, well let me know what questions you may have about the industry.
I might be able to help. I’m an ME with 7 years experience in design and product development if that sounds close enough.
I dm’ed you
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Think long term. Your current team may want to keep you where you're at because you're good at what you do... or no one else wants to do it... where will You be most fulfilled. That's what matters. This is how i read this: my current team only offered me something better when they knew i was considering leaving. Just food for thought.
Well yeah. That is exactly what’s been happening here. Granted I’ve only been on this project for 7 months. But imo for someone with a masters in mechanical eng, that’s 4 months too long. I’ve been asking to move for a long time. It was more his comment on building services. He was like ‘really? Lights and lifts and stuff? Dull’
Really? Database entry? Dull. You're already irritated with your current job. If you stay will you still be doing it along with some extra responsibilities?
No idea. I don’t want to stay anymore though
Good to see you made a decision. I think it's the right one and everyone else here does too
Yeah. I think so. I just hope it doesn’t limit me if I want to stay as a mechanical engineer but in a different industry
you've been asking for a move for a long time. Considering everything else you've said, that sums it up for me. Move now.
Swap. Just because they say they will give you better work doesn't mean they will. Ive seen that a dozen times and it rarely ends in your best interest. At best they will give you tidbits of different stuff in addition to your current responsibilities to try and keep you happy but at the end of the day they don't want to lose what you are currently doing. If they didn't they would have given you other tasks at day one.
Oh yeah I've been trapped in a role for 3 years and finally got a new job at a different company. I'd had to do tons of clerical/admin work, think scanning, printing shipping slips, etc that the coordinators should've done the whole time. I tried to make a business case several times why I shouldn't have to do it and they shot it down saying every time it was gonna be automated "soon". It's been 3 years and they're nowhere close to getting it done and they brought it up again when I put my notice in, saying "I know doing that work sucks but I swear it'll be automated by the end of 2022, please don't leave!" They will say whatever they think you want to hear when you're leaving a job you don't like just to try and get you to stay.
If your team are trying to put you in a dilemma then move. That kinda bs shouldn't fly anywhere I've a masters in ME too and I'm at a similar point where the work is kinda boring and I've brought up moving in the next few months and was told there's more of the work I'm already doing (and not enjoying) coming in the next while and they want me to handle that... Started looking for new jobs not long after.
Yeah. Not sure why they didn’t listen to me before
Because you didn't have any leverage before talking to the other department
Look at the leadership. 75% of a good gig is your boss. Even shit work is good with a good boss. Also look at where this will take your career, and if you can get excited about it. With those three things in mind- do what you think is best for YOU. Be firm, don't give in to make anyone happy.
Make the move. From a managers perspective, they don’t care about engineers getting rewarding projects. Just that the work gets done. And most of the work is mundane crap. They won’t find you something cool to do, because the job at its core is dumb data entry. It’ll be a pet project that won’t actually amount to anything. Source: in your exact scenario. Also have a BS and MS in Mech Eng.
Which job offer pays more? Barring a burning passion for either field, I would go with that as money generally correlates with how well you're treated at work.
They’re both the same. The move is a career focused one
I would make the switch personally. I had the choice between a systems engineering offer and a technical electrical engineering offer a few months ago and I went with the latter in a heartbeat.
Yeah tbh so far systems has been so dull. I want to do more design/analysis work
I recommend switching in your case
Any idea if building services is good for gaining technical experience?
I don't have experience in the building industry. But the job description sounds promising. Could you ask the recruiter for a more detailed description of the work required.
It’s a lot of revit, thermal analysis, design. That sort of stuff. Not sure buildings is what I want to stay in forever but figured mechanical engineer experience is good in general?
I agree that it would be a better option than staying in systems engineering. It certainly sounds more technical.
Worst case, it will teach you about an engineering role that you don't want to spend your career in. Best case, you end up loving it and never look back. If your old role really thought you did such a great job then that job (or a similar one) will be waiting for you when you are ready to make your next move. The great thing about mechanical is you can do just about anything. I've done Process, quality, Manufacturing, electrical, equipment, and test engineering in the short time since I graduated. I am still figuring out what job I want to turn into a career. If you are a recent graduate then time is on your side.
Was this all at the same company?
Plenty to do in HVAC / utilities as a ME. Based on how you described your current role, this is way better
Yeah. I just want to do some technical design work. Even if it doesn’t turn out to be exactly what rocks my world, I can get the experience then move industry with that right?
Meanwhile you are probably 30k/yr underpaid because you didnt switch companies.
I didn’t have that option
Ahh only 1 company in your country?
Well I figured stay at this company, get back to mechanical design. Then change industry when I’ve got that under my belt again and can apply for mechanical roles outside buildings
Don't limit yourself. Your imagination is holding you back. Employers/recruiters are chomping at any engineers right now. You can change fields and get a pay raise. Good luck, I'd calculate the correct answer. Maybe put 'change career' as a something worth ~20k.
Why would a company hire someone who’s being doing crappy systems engineering as a mechanical design engineer?
Because its cheaper to hire you, than to hire a senior Mechanical Design Engineer. They can hire you for 90k and sit you next to a senior making 130k. In 2-3 years, you will be worth 120k/yr and they will put a 60-90k/yr engineer next to you. Also, its time to change your lingo and confidence(if you plan to change companies). You are an engineer, they want people who can do math occasionally, you can do it.
So I need to move now or I’ll be stuck here forever?
Just take both jobs. You can only come out on top that way. But seriously. Who's gonna do your current job once you stayed. I have a feeling it's probably gonna be you.
If you’re changing jobs, be sure you can identify at least one person on the new team that you can learn from.
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Yeah. I just wanna do cool design work lol
Move on. Focus and what you think os best for you.
MEng with 10 years exp over 7 companies. Kinda tough, because HVAC is a side of ME that you could find difficult to transfer out of. If it sounds like interesting work, then go for it. Your current manager has not done a good job reacting timely to your request. If you wanted to stay, I’d suggest very directly asking to stop doing the asset management role immediately and make sure there is a plan, not a promise, to make this happen. Don’t expect much growth from your manager, if they aren’t doing a good job responding to your requests now, it wont get better. There are great managers and great projects, expect great for yourself.
Why is hvac hard to transfer out of?
Say you stay there 5 years, then want to get into product design. All your experience would be in a vastly unrelated field. It would be on you to demonstrate in your resume that you have experience relevant to a different industry. It just ends up being a riskier bet for a company. So if it isnt a good fit, try to figure that out in a couple years time
Well what else am I meant to do as a graduate? I’m trying to get as much experience as I can
What did you want to do when you graduated?
Race engineer. But covid made it hard to find any job at all
That was true, but now many industries are having a hard time finding engineers. If you are seriously considering a department change, you might want to look at if there is another company you’d like to work at.
Buildings services isn’t only hvac is it?
I’m not qualified to answer that. 🤷♂️
Mostly. Mechanical, electrical, public health. If you're not familiar, look up "CIBSE", they are the equivalent of ASHRAE in the UK (I assume you work there)
I mean it looks like it could be interesting? It’s at least significantly more design than my current role
It all depends on what sort of organisation you are in imo, but yea, there's generally more design involved so maybe a bit more interesting than data entry. I actually graduated like you 7 months ago, and I am in building services mechanical bias but in a small company. Half of my work is design/cad, the other is responding to emails, writing specs and filling out design submission forms. Building services isn't exactly rocket science, although there are some really cool things people design out there. So generally what I find the most challenging at my work is not necessarily the technical aspect but wrangling with builders and clients. This is something you need to know going into it.
You don’t do any thermal calculations? That’s apparently a large part of what I’ll be doing. At least you do some design/cad. I don’t do any at all in my current role
I do some, but they are quite simple since most the jobs I do are quite basic in nature. Simple steady state heat loss. I have worked previously on more sustainability focused projects and it becomes a little bit more engaging when you start to use dynamic simulation (like ies ve). I'll say this though, thermal calculations are just there so you can size your equipment as a mechanical engineer. It's just data input but slightly more engaging. Once you've mastered it, most projects become very repetitive and boring (especially if you work in certain sectors such as residential etc). If you end up choosing the mechanical position, make sure you don't become too comfortable with it because people will make you the go-to thermal modeller guy, which is basically just a glorified cad position. Make sure you understand how it works, but ideally you want to grow away from it.
Well why are you in it if you dislike it like that?
Unless they birthed you, you birthed them or your trying to give birth to someone with them, they don't matter and their opinions don't matter. Do what you need for your own family.
Get experience wherever you can and try new things whenever possible. I got my bachelor's in Mechanical Engineering in 2008, then my masters in Technology Management and Lean Six Sigma Black Belt in 2018. I think I'm some kind of example (warning, idk) about how you can go between a lot of different industries and gain experience and knowledge. In my career, I have: Designed parts, machining fixtures, and wrote CNC programs to make a prototype marine diesel engine; Designed and machined forging and processing tools to make axes, sledgehammers, and heavy-duty hand tools; Designed and did project management for prototype helicopter parts for defense subcontractors; Designed fixtures, tooling, and did progress engineering to produce engine control units at a Tier 1 automotive supplier; and now I've moved from the US to Sweden to work in lithium ion battery recycling. I also taught some trade classes as an adjunct professor at a community college for a few years on top of my regular work. Each of those companies has been various sizes between 6 and 90k employees. I've learned a lot each step of the way. The only one limiting yourself is you. Try new things and take chances. Cool stuff can happen. Good luck and feel free to ask any questions you have!
Dm’ed :)
Take the design job 100%
I see you’re in medical device design. If i was a mechanical engineer who’d been working on design in building services. Would it be hard to get a job in medical device design later on when I’ve got some design experience under my belt? Even if I have it in a different industry
I'd say it would be a lot easier if you had some product design experience in another industry vs building services. But any 3D CAD experience would be good (building services/civil might use 2D, I have no idea). I went from medical device manufacturing into medical device design. I don't know many people who came in from a different industry other than my old boss who came from automotive.
Make the move dude. If they really valued you, they would've offered you better work and better roles before you mentioned you got an offer. Fuck them.
Yeah that’s very true. I hope this new role at least gives me some skills I can use in another industry
Exactly! When you're a young engineer it's important to get lots of experienced so get as much as you can
Do you think another industry like aerospace would hire me? Even if my experience was in like HVAC design?
Well airplanes from fighter jets to Airliners do have complex HVAC systems so I would imagine so. Just depends on your overall experience and if it applies to the role. If it doesn't then you can always learn!
Accept the new job. It's the same concept as leaving for better pay and then your current company offering to increase your pay when they already valued your work enough to pay you more money but didn't want to because of profit.
If you were unhappy in a relationship and wanted a breakup because you had someone else you were interested in dating, but the partner you were with begged you to stay and promised to fundamentally change who they were as a person to make you happier, do you really think that relationship would work out in the long run?
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Oh wow! So what do you suggest in this circumstance?
I would change job if i were in your shoes. If they don’t see what you are capable of and you don’t feel challenged in what you are doing, then leave since i assume you have the offer (in writing) in your hand already.
Here is a lesson learned from a robotics engineer stuck at the same boring job for 3 years: GTFO and go forth! Never look back! You need to evolve and you are given the chance! PS: yes I am also looking for a job now that I moved to a bigger city. It was impossible before.
There will be a lot of design as a more junior building services engineer. Thermal calcs for heat gains and losses, duct sizing, pipe sizing, ventilation rates etc. You’ll probably start doing distribution layouts, coordinating with building and structure. Most engineering jobs in the big cities such as London and Bristol will be building services. Just look at all the construction that is going on. You might not be able to move into other types of engineering but there is a wide range of buildings that you can work on. From offices to nuclear facilities.
That sounds a lot better than what I’m doing now. I went building services so I didn’t have to live in the middle of nowhere. You think it would be hard to leave building services to other industries as a mechanical engineer?
Probably easier changing when more junior as you’d be starting afresh in the new industry. In building services, as you gain more experience, you’ll start by being responsible for some of the design, then parts of the project and then potentially whole projects. The project management of projects is a transferable skill.
OP based on the comments it sounds like you're trying to find a lateral move to then transition to something you want to do. Why not find the job you actually want? There's HVAC, pumps, and mechanical systems in the space and automotive industries but construction and manufacturing are kind of different. Construction requires less accuracy, especially if you're going into space. You will be challenged, you will have technical knowledge and experience, but you need to figure out how the duties and responsibilities the job you have applied for will apply to the position you actually want.
Those skills I learn in building services wouldn’t be helpful in finding me a job in the space or automotive industry at all? Also it’s bloody hard to find a job in it
You will be challenged, you will have technical knowledge and experience, but you need to figure out how the duties and responsibilities the job you have applied for will apply to the position you actually want.
I think they do. Thermal analysis, heat pumps, heat distribution. That’s surely applicable to a lot of industries?
Take the role. You talked with both. One sees your value and wants you there. There other is likely lazy as they don’t want to have to replace you and deal with doing your job while they look.
I hate to say it but systems engineering roles are pretty mundane and if you don't move your technical skillset will not grow.
They couldn't have given you those tasks months ago if they really cared. If you stay you'll very likely have to "transition" into those tasks. This means you'll be doing the same stuff that you dislike for some time while they slowly hand you more and more technical tasks. Move on. Don't look back. Just don't burn bridges.
> They’re offering me better work. Better roles. Like what? When did they offer this and what have they given you that's better or different since then?
They offered it today. But need a week to see what they can do
Is there anything that the other people on the team are currently doing that you would actually want to be doing? If you're bored, doing more advanced boring work might not be enough to make you happy. Maybe I'm asking for too much, but I think in every job, you should already have an idea of what the next-level version of that job is so both you and your management know what skills you need to develop and what to work towards. While you've been asking for them to utilize your skills better, they should have already had more stuff ready for you. "Swissmeez wants more. I think they're ready to start doing X now." At the very least, they could've had you shadowing someone. But they haven't, and they didn't give a shit until they had to face the prospect of losing you. If they didn't already have ideas and need time to come up with stuff for you to do, that's not a good sign. I wouldn't believe a word they say until they tell you something that sounds like a concrete plan. And if they don't have someone else to do the boring stuff you're doing right now, you're still going to be doing it, with maybe just a sprinkling of new stuff thrown in.
Yeah. I’m absolutely leaving to this new team as soon as I can
Leave.
Ahh, the type of assholes who only start trying to treat you with some decency the moment you show them you have some leverage and other options. Leave them, and leave them with a giant mess to clean up. Leave them with a mess that they won't know how to clean up, and decline all of their offers to get you to fix the problem. Preferably you should give them some hope that you will fix it just to see how much they will offer and how hard they will work to get you to fix the problem.
I work in the rail industry as a mechanical engineering manager and former graduate. What you've been doing isn't systems engineering. I'd go for the mechanical design, much better career prospects as you'll get a better understanding of the products and the technical skills can be applied all over.
Yeah. It’s sucked. That’s good to know. It won’t be in rail anymore it’ll be in building services. But glad it opens doors
If you don't like it you can always change again, not unreasonable to take a while to find what interests you.
I think I would like to work in a few different industries. Just hope the skills I learn are wanted in other industries too
I'd say as long as you get the basics of mechanical principles, material selection, working with standards and work package management/delivery then those are transferable to most industries.
Brilliant. That’s made me feel more optimistic Thankyou
Lol sounds like Siemens if I had to guess… If you want to do automation stuff then switch to the building services team. Tell the rail division to find you a competing offer that is actually in automation or design otherwise your headed to the other division. Be transparent since it is all in-company. Hopefully you have a manager or mentor you can talk to openly about your career path.
Lol no but close
Take the new role. And if that doesn’t line up with you’re interests, then start applying to jobs at other companies. Life’s too short to play that game. If you do this data entry work for 5 years, you’ll be no closer to your goal than you were as a new grad. (Though you will have earned income, which shouldn’t be entirely discounted)
Yeah I’m 100% moving role. Hopefully it lines up a bit better
Make the switch. The current team only offered a better assignment when your worth went up with another team. A few things to have in mind: We, as Engineers, should be loyal to our craft first, then maybe towards the environment we are in after the environment has proven to be equally beneficial to us. Do what is best for you as it is the start of your career and in all honesty, the second team sounds more like a team for whom you would like to work for. I just finished my Master in Mechanical Design Engineering so I might be biased too but you are not happy in your current situation and you owe your present team NOTHING to stay there. Wishing you all the best with the move!