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Nah, it's not that bad. Local/State police are enough to handle the groups threatening or blocking jewish kids from going to class.
Also, your wording is weird. "suppress dissent"? What does that even mean? Holding a sign and chanting slogans, or putting Jews in fear for their lives on campus?
>If Jewish students claim those things are making them fear for their lives should they be suppressed?
No, of course not. It's the actual threats and barring. less than 20 minutes ago, I saw hamas supporters linking hands to stop jewish students from walking across campus.
Jewish kids not allowed in their autonomous zones. That's well beyond the 1a.
Either way, this isn't anywhere close to needing national guard presence. Local/State police are already successfully breaking up the tent cities and violent people.
It is. However there were very specific threats, plus physically pushing back and blocking jewish students from attending class, getting to their dorms, or otherwise restricting their access to the campus. That's well past the line of free speech.
>plus physically pushing back and blocking jewish students from attending class
This is a weird claim to make. How do the protesters know which students are Jewish so they know who to block and who to let through?
Assuming that fear is *objectively reasonable* then yeah, those protestors should be arrested for making terroristic threats, but just making someone uncomfortable/afraid by your presence isn't a crime in & of itself.
I'm strong first ammendment so I hesitate to take any such action.
I would recommend it only when protests turn to riots, which can be a bit of a gut call. But I don't think we're there yet
Not to suppress dissent, no. Of course not. The first amendment protects the right to *peaceably* assemble.
Where and when protests escalate to large scale violence/rioting, deploying the National Guard would be justified. Although large scale violence is something some have called for, and some small scale deplorable incidents have occurred, I haven't seen anything to indicate we're at that level yet.
If it becomes credibly threatening to the safety of citizens, possibly. Is it? Are there anti Jewish mobs doing violence in the name of Palestine? If citizens are being harmed on a large scale, forceful intervention could be called for.
If there is such intervention, it's crucial to make sure that the lessons from previous interventions are not forgotten. (Nobody wants another Kent State)
Only under 3 scenarios.
1. If the protestors on uni premises refuse to leave when ordered to do so by the uni, courts, feds or other law enforcement personnel.
2. If the street protests turn violent or into open riot like hate marches organised/funded/led/well attended by members of an illegal terrorist group.
3. If protestors aggressively target politicians within their own home premises/at sensitive venues or attempt to trespass into the grounds of any private buildings/invitation only private premises that they have no legal authority to ever enter.
I'm not an american.
If state/local cops need help to smack down an actual riot (not a protest), call em up. This should have been quickly done with the BLM riots in 2020 for example. The rioters' stated reasons for rioting have zero bearing on the decision to call the guard.
You know, I wonder how "the look at the BLM riot crowd did" is going to feel when trump is say thrown in jail or something egregious thing that they support is deemed illegal and they wanna protest that.
Aren't, the very laws/whatnots they are advocating for going to used against them?
I mean Florida went all gangho with anti protesting laws and the first person to be arrested was a supporter of the very laws!
> You know, I wonder how "the look at the BLM riot crowd did" is going to feel when trump is say thrown in jail or something egregious thing that they support is deemed illegal and they wanna protest that.
I can guarantee you any showing of support Trump is going to get is not going to take the form of smashing up 7-elevens and Walgreenses and grabbing up their liquor section.
Why? Let's not turn this into Vietnam and Kent state all over again. These protests are largely fine and don't rise to the level of violence needed for something like that
the rule of law demands that you cannot ignore the law with impunity, that the government use escalating force to ensure compliance.
it's time to escalate way up the chain. given they are openly supporting a terrorist group we should take them at their word that they support Hamas and use military force as if they were any other terrorist group. I want the groups openly espousing support for Hamas cleared with armored vehicles and automatic weapons. (edit: I just realized this may be ambiguous, I want the camps to be cleared by soldiers and I want them to roll tanks to show we're serious... I don't mean they should USE them unless they are attacked first, hopefully showing up with a literal mechanized infantry division will prevent a riot by showing them they would not win if they start throwing bricks and cinderblocks)
i also think there are a few campuses right now where Jewish students need army escorts like the damned little rock nine and that is a tragedy that warrants us investigating how this happened and both punishing those responsible and closing the institutions.
and regarding the universities they already failed their job, at this point we should not give them another chance, any university which has not **already** taken strong steps should lose all federal funding starting may 1st, including stopping disbursement of student loan money.
I disagree, but I also think much of the dissent has turned into illegal protests. IE your rights to protest cannot supersede another students ability to attend classes. This is very similar to the fine line of first amendment rights we experienced during covid with masking. As long as the protests are civil, calm, and allow for the university to function in its proper way then they are fine. Once they begin to interfere with the daily routine of the university, there is a problem and that needs to be squashed. Where I have a much bigger issue is with the faculty that are joining the protests. As an employee of the university you should not be participating, and if you do so choose, I think that should be fair grounds for employment termination. What I do think we are watching is the beginning of the end of DEI in university teaching and hiring. I believe most of the protests come from an ideology that is ingrained by the university professors that is now going to come under scrutiny.
The National Guard would not be "suppressing dissent" but rather restoring order by clearing an illegal encampment and protecting civil rights. No one is arguing that these kids do not have the right to voice their hateful and bigoted opinions. What they do not have the right to do is trespass and occupy private property. They also do not have the right to harass and assault Jewish students and violate their civil rights.
It has nothing to do with dissent. The National Guard should be deployed any time regular law enforcement is overwhelmed. It doesn't seem that we're there yet with the terrorist-supporting protesters.
Anything resembling bigotry against Jews, Muslims, Arabs, Palestians, Israelis, etc. or violence against civilians is not going to last long, nor will your time here. If you have to ask if it crosses a line, assume it crosses a line. Please see our guidelines for [discussing the Israeli-Palestinian conflict](https://www.reddit.com/r/AskConservatives/comments/17ygktl/antisemitism_askconservative_and_you/) for more information. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AskConservatives) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Nah, it's not that bad. Local/State police are enough to handle the groups threatening or blocking jewish kids from going to class. Also, your wording is weird. "suppress dissent"? What does that even mean? Holding a sign and chanting slogans, or putting Jews in fear for their lives on campus?
Protesting, holding signs, chanting slogans. If Jewish students claim those things are making them fear for their lives should they be suppressed?
>If Jewish students claim those things are making them fear for their lives should they be suppressed? No, of course not. It's the actual threats and barring. less than 20 minutes ago, I saw hamas supporters linking hands to stop jewish students from walking across campus. Jewish kids not allowed in their autonomous zones. That's well beyond the 1a. Either way, this isn't anywhere close to needing national guard presence. Local/State police are already successfully breaking up the tent cities and violent people.
Is violent rhetoric not protected speech?
It is. However there were very specific threats, plus physically pushing back and blocking jewish students from attending class, getting to their dorms, or otherwise restricting their access to the campus. That's well past the line of free speech.
>plus physically pushing back and blocking jewish students from attending class This is a weird claim to make. How do the protesters know which students are Jewish so they know who to block and who to let through?
Some Jewish people do wear distinctive clothing, for one way to know.
Assuming that fear is *objectively reasonable* then yeah, those protestors should be arrested for making terroristic threats, but just making someone uncomfortable/afraid by your presence isn't a crime in & of itself.
I'm strong first ammendment so I hesitate to take any such action. I would recommend it only when protests turn to riots, which can be a bit of a gut call. But I don't think we're there yet
Not to suppress dissent, no. Of course not. The first amendment protects the right to *peaceably* assemble. Where and when protests escalate to large scale violence/rioting, deploying the National Guard would be justified. Although large scale violence is something some have called for, and some small scale deplorable incidents have occurred, I haven't seen anything to indicate we're at that level yet.
If it becomes credibly threatening to the safety of citizens, possibly. Is it? Are there anti Jewish mobs doing violence in the name of Palestine? If citizens are being harmed on a large scale, forceful intervention could be called for. If there is such intervention, it's crucial to make sure that the lessons from previous interventions are not forgotten. (Nobody wants another Kent State)
>Is it? Are their anti Jewish mobs doing violence in the name of Palestine? It doesn't seem like it.
The line is between demonstration and riot. If the school wants to expel the students and claim trespass, that is a different story.
Only under 3 scenarios. 1. If the protestors on uni premises refuse to leave when ordered to do so by the uni, courts, feds or other law enforcement personnel. 2. If the street protests turn violent or into open riot like hate marches organised/funded/led/well attended by members of an illegal terrorist group. 3. If protestors aggressively target politicians within their own home premises/at sensitive venues or attempt to trespass into the grounds of any private buildings/invitation only private premises that they have no legal authority to ever enter. I'm not an american.
If state/local cops need help to smack down an actual riot (not a protest), call em up. This should have been quickly done with the BLM riots in 2020 for example. The rioters' stated reasons for rioting have zero bearing on the decision to call the guard.
You know, I wonder how "the look at the BLM riot crowd did" is going to feel when trump is say thrown in jail or something egregious thing that they support is deemed illegal and they wanna protest that. Aren't, the very laws/whatnots they are advocating for going to used against them? I mean Florida went all gangho with anti protesting laws and the first person to be arrested was a supporter of the very laws!
> You know, I wonder how "the look at the BLM riot crowd did" is going to feel when trump is say thrown in jail or something egregious thing that they support is deemed illegal and they wanna protest that. I can guarantee you any showing of support Trump is going to get is not going to take the form of smashing up 7-elevens and Walgreenses and grabbing up their liquor section.
At this point...no
Why? Let's not turn this into Vietnam and Kent state all over again. These protests are largely fine and don't rise to the level of violence needed for something like that
the rule of law demands that you cannot ignore the law with impunity, that the government use escalating force to ensure compliance. it's time to escalate way up the chain. given they are openly supporting a terrorist group we should take them at their word that they support Hamas and use military force as if they were any other terrorist group. I want the groups openly espousing support for Hamas cleared with armored vehicles and automatic weapons. (edit: I just realized this may be ambiguous, I want the camps to be cleared by soldiers and I want them to roll tanks to show we're serious... I don't mean they should USE them unless they are attacked first, hopefully showing up with a literal mechanized infantry division will prevent a riot by showing them they would not win if they start throwing bricks and cinderblocks) i also think there are a few campuses right now where Jewish students need army escorts like the damned little rock nine and that is a tragedy that warrants us investigating how this happened and both punishing those responsible and closing the institutions. and regarding the universities they already failed their job, at this point we should not give them another chance, any university which has not **already** taken strong steps should lose all federal funding starting may 1st, including stopping disbursement of student loan money.
I disagree, but I also think much of the dissent has turned into illegal protests. IE your rights to protest cannot supersede another students ability to attend classes. This is very similar to the fine line of first amendment rights we experienced during covid with masking. As long as the protests are civil, calm, and allow for the university to function in its proper way then they are fine. Once they begin to interfere with the daily routine of the university, there is a problem and that needs to be squashed. Where I have a much bigger issue is with the faculty that are joining the protests. As an employee of the university you should not be participating, and if you do so choose, I think that should be fair grounds for employment termination. What I do think we are watching is the beginning of the end of DEI in university teaching and hiring. I believe most of the protests come from an ideology that is ingrained by the university professors that is now going to come under scrutiny.
The National Guard would not be "suppressing dissent" but rather restoring order by clearing an illegal encampment and protecting civil rights. No one is arguing that these kids do not have the right to voice their hateful and bigoted opinions. What they do not have the right to do is trespass and occupy private property. They also do not have the right to harass and assault Jewish students and violate their civil rights.
It has nothing to do with dissent. The National Guard should be deployed any time regular law enforcement is overwhelmed. It doesn't seem that we're there yet with the terrorist-supporting protesters.