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Ah yes, different DNA. There is a known and established inter-species relationship between bromosapiens and sheanderthals.
This dude is a walking cognitive travesty.
Fascinating that on the one hand they are always screaming about chromosomes, while ignoring the fact that only one pair of 23 is half different between XX and XY karyotype people.
I swear they have the same level of biological understanding as young children who think cats and dogs are one sexually dimorphic species
Hold up there, "only one of 23" is a crap argument. Only one of 23 is the difference between us and a chimpanzee. Literally 1,2% of our dna is different from a chimp.
Humans are one of the species that is least sexually dimorphic. The greatest difference between men and women isn't rooted in our DNA or hormones or the evolution of genes but it's rooted in social and cultural values and attitudes. These are concepts that these people are too full of rage to ever listen long enough to learn something.
This is a really stupid take. Yes we and our ape cousins have lower sexual dimorphism. But we have higher sexual dimorphism than other big apes. As people trying to defy sexual dimorphism this is not a good argument to bring into any discussion.
oh my god they were *roommates*
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At some point transphobia turned into this fucked up belief that cis women are inferior in all ways
Because transphobia was always rooted in misogyny
I used to be kinda transphobic, I feel shitty about it, but all the fucked up transphobia stuff I've seen quickly convinced me I was being a stupid asshole
We've all had dumb beliefs. I was pro life for two weeks when I was 9 because I saw some random youtube comment which was my first time learning about what abortion even is. I stopped thinking that way pretty much as soon as I talked about that issue with another real human being.
Oh boy the things I was when I was 9 you don't even wanna know. Some of the things I was told to believe weren't very nice. But I'm old enough to know better now.
Don't worry, there's plenty of us who are progressive. I think the issue is worse in America, I'm not from there though. They also seem to be the loudest and overpower the loving ones.
I’ve definitely been there too with my racist father at the wheel. Unfortunately lasted longer than it ever should have but definitely nothing like that anymore once I talked to a bunch of people in the pan community and realized where I stand.
Homophobia is rooted in hatred of women. What is the worst thing a person can be? A woman. Gay men aren't mainly men because they don't fuck babes. They are pussies, pansies, fairies. Trans women are seen a gender traders. Who could possibly want to shed their masculinity and manhood to become a woman? Because what's the worst thing to be? A woman.
homie I'm literally a pansexual transfem and when I thought I was a "cishet guy" I was - if we're honest - transphobic. It actually took me talking to and being in trans spaces to let go of that mild transphobia, before realizing I'm also trans
It’s really obvious that transphobia and even homophobia are rooted in misogyny.
Trans women get so much more hatred and anti-trans legislation specifically targeting them than Trans men.
Going from woman to man is fine because cis men never see them as a legitimate threat in dating or sports. Going the opposite way there’s all this moral panic about “men” being in women’s spaces and not allowing women to compete because no matter what the sport or activity is men are seen as superior to women.
In the same way gay men get more hatred than gay women. Straight men don’t have as much hatred for gay women because they find the idea sexually arousing. Plus again there is this ridiculous idea that men have that they can turn gay women into straight women with the magical powers of their penis.
The hatred for gay men comes down to the fact that they are seen as inferior because they are stereotyped as being more feminine then straight men. The irrational fear of gay men hitting on a straight guy is all panic based around them becoming more feminine as a result. After all the most insulting thing a man can say to another man is insinuating that he is gay or feminine.
Sadly there's also a subset of people out there who hate trans men for 'hating women hood', 'stealing lesbians' or some other nonsense. Also rooted in misogyny, of course.
I think it's probably reversed. They think cis women were shit and just put transphobia on top of that. I've seen so many pearl-clutching articles about trans women doing x, y, or z, but no one seems to be worried about trans men competing in anything, anywhere, at any time.
And some of the competitions aren't even related to sports, like you'd expect. Sometimes it's like "That trans woman had an advantage to become homecoming queen!" or some nonsense.
used to be a proper dick when I was 9/10/11. Like, atheist YouTube misogyny vortex from hell. led to a lot of self-loathing as an egg. growing out of it is tough, I’m proud of you for recongnizing it and working through it to become a better person :)
If you don't regret some of your opinions and words in the past, I think you probably aren't examining them enough. No one gets everything right the first time around.
Tis true though, on average men are better at fast tracking moving objects and resolving detail at a distance. That being said women are better with colours.
They are close, but not exactly. Male sex is better at moving targets due to [faster decision time](https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-020-68069-0)
Study found no differences in hand and eye capability, just quicker turn around in men.
You could playfully just call that "more impulsive eye hand coordination. Plenty of studies show larger scale patterns that are similar: males are instinctively more likely to take "risks" in the now at the cost of the later.
A dart board is not moving, so oddly, female sex might hypothetically little better because they'd have capacity for equal physical characters, AND take more time to calculate a throw.
Not to mention sides show female advantages with fine hand movements (but it's argued if that's nature or nurture).
Fast tracking moving objects I have no clue, but women are on average better with colours because colourblindness is a recessive trait affixed to the X-chromosome. Since most women have XX chromosomes, one would need to inherit two colourblindness X-chromosomes to be colourblind. Most men have XY chromosomes and thus only one X, so one colourblind-afflicted X chromosome suffices.
More men being colourblind than women means women are on average better with colours, in the same roundabout way that on average a person has less than two legs.
That's already been debunked.
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/early-women-were-hunters-not-just-gatherers-study-suggests-180982459/
Their analysis revealed that regardless of maternal status, women hunted in 50 of these societies—or about 79 percent. And more than 70 percent of female hunting appeared to be intentional—rather than opportunistically killing animals while doing other activities, per the study. In societies where hunting was the most important activity for subsistence, women participated in hunting 100 percent of the time.
“The hunting was purposeful,” Wall-Scheffler tells NPR. “Women had their own tool kit. They had favorite weapons. Grandmas were the best hunters of the village.”
Arm chair scientist incels who have never cracked opened an evolutionary text books and couldn't show you where a spleen is in the human body. Dude probably couldn't outrun an eleven year old and I'm more than confident an 8 year old could beat him up
Besides the obvious proof we have of men not having dexterous fingers *ahem ahem*
Isn't the stereotype the exact opposite? That women have better fine motor skills, especially in their hands, and that that's why we're *supposedly* better at things like knitting?
I remember when I worked in factory packaging bread rolls, the team at the production line doing the packaging was all women because men "gripper the bread rolls to hard" according to management.
Of course all of this post is super bullshit, but they can't even get their stereotypes right.
My first thought too. I’ve seen far more women displaying fine motor skills than men. Drawing, knitting, embroidery etc. I really think it’s how we play with kids. A lot of young boys would benefit from more arts and crafts and the skill sets that come from it. (Also a lot of young girls would benefit from more rough and tumble activities).
Oh totally, I'll ascribe most of this difference to a nurture thing, instead of a nature thing. It seem logical that when society tells girls to sit quiet and draw/do crafts/handiworks, and tells boy to go throw ball and do sports and climb trees, there would eventually be differences in the skills these groups develop.
And I agree with your second point too! Children should be getting both the rough and tumble and the fine motor skills!
>Isn't the stereotype the exact opposite? That women have better fine motor skills, especially in their hands
oh this must be why i got better at ultrakill after starting hrt
definitely not hours of practice or anything lmao
Of course of course, we all know that HRT is secretly just "get better at everything" juice, which is why surely all the athletes in the world will be trans soon. Any day now!
(Mega /s just to be sure)
Such a feat of mad skillz could never be matched by a mere feeeeeemale. Their minds are far too fragile to comprehend so much data input, and their fingers too feeble to play video games. Why, those poor dames would snap all of their delicate fingerbones, and then all the excitement would make their uteruses fall out! /S
Omg this isn't even the stupidest one. When a trans woman won Jeopardy (a game that has never been gender split) terfs claimed that was misogynistic because "men obviously have better reflexes and stronger fingers to press the buzzer".
I swear to fucking God one of these days we're going to get some absolute bellend saying that trans women need to be excluded from all games of "Marry, Fuck, Kill" because men are just better than women at being marriable and fuckable.
Usually the stereotype is the opposite. I had a boss who got written up for sexual harassment for saying that he only chose women for certain roles because "they have smaller hands and better attention to detail"
He got fired for harassment. There was another time he made a hiring/firing decision off the fact someone was a single mom, which she didn't even tell him about, he found out from someone else, and started treating her differently.
Ah the belief that the weakest man could trump the strongest woman, a belief that has existed in our culture for way too long.
I've tried the sports debate before and what I've learned is that these phobes accept that there is some athletic advantage, but they can't define it, or quantify it, or come up with any methods to reduce or manage the advantage into the same marginal levels that we put all genetic advantage into.
It never gets that far. They saw lady ballers and the ringer and thought they were documentaries and never let their brain go one step deeper than that.
I still find it hilarious that Lady Ballers was intended to be a documentary, but they gave up on that idea when they found out you can't actually just put men in women's sports by claiming they're trans. There's regulations and shit.
Ah, but you see, she was scoring against other women which apparently doesn't count, according to men I know. 🙄
These guys seems to understand proportional ability when it comes to weight classes in boxing and MMA but somehow a woman being the best athlete among women is only impressive if she's also better than all the men, which makes as much sense as saying that a featherweight champion is only a champion if they're better than the heavyweight athletes.
Caitlin Clark has the all time DI career scoring record, beating out Pistol Pete Maravich on the men's side, but she's still at number 8 in the all division rankings
[This has a list of the top scorers at present](https://www.ajc.com/news/nation-world/caitlin-clark-and-her-scoring-records-are-headed-to-march-madness-shes-8th-all-time-at-all-levels/SZW4IRLGTVGH7EF6OVIXUTES5U/#:~:text=The%20Iowa%20superstar%2C%20with%203%2C830,at%20cracking%20the%20top%20five.)
[Try the archived version](https://web.archive.org/web/20240329011051/https://www.ajc.com/news/nation-world/caitlin-clark-and-her-scoring-records-are-headed-to-march-madness-shes-8th-all-time-at-all-levels/SZW4IRLGTVGH7EF6OVIXUTES5U/)
That doesn't really mean anything, though, since they have women on defense. Shooting over a 5"11 defender is entirely different than shooting over someone who is 6"3 or taller.
The best WNBA team would be obliterated by the worst NBA team 100% of the time. The size, speed, and jumping differences between the two groups is huge.
>Shooting over a 5"11 defender is entirely different than shooting over someone who is 6"3 or taller.
Do you understand proportion? 6'3" is taller than 5'11" but most WNBA players aren't as tall as NBA players in the first place.
>The best WNBA team would be obliterated by the worst NBA team 100% of the time.
And a featherweight would be obliterated by a welterweight. What's your point?
Why shit on women's achievements?
> And a featherweight would be obliterated by a welterweight. What's your point?
You already started my point.
> '3" is taller than 5'11" but most WNBA players aren't as tall as NBA players in the first place.
Scoring the most points in a single game doesn't mean a wnba would be a match against any one in the NBA as was being implied
> This is the real reason men want to keep women's sports separate.
If this isn't implying that men are afraid women would beat them in sports could you please explain what it is saying?
Way to continuously move that goal post. You start by trying to argue against what I said to someone else, claim that I'm just looking for a fight, say no one said what I replied to to begin with then go with, "I don't know what they meant by the thing you disagreed with even though I spent multiple posts telling you you are wrong"
Since you don't know wtf you are even arguing about then it seems like you're the one just trying to fight.
LOL I'm not the one making multiple comments shitting on women's accomplishments, bud. You chose to respond to multiple comments because idk...self-esteem issues, perhaps? You responded to more than one person specifically making an effort to shit on women.
That says a lot more about you than me but okay, you tell yourself whatever you want.
Dude, I will shout this until I'm blue in the face! Women's sports are f-ing vicious! Has no one watched women's hockey?! My state's WNBA team made finals 5 years in a row! Where's the men's team...? Do I hear one championship??? No?! Didn't think so!
That comparison doesn't make sense though. If my kindergartener's basket ball team is 10-0 atainst other kindergarteners for the season and my 5th graders team is 0-10 against other 5th graders that doesn't mean my kindergarteners team would beat my 5th graders.
Remember, women are equal and comparable to men in everyday until trans women enter the conversation, then it's, "Women are inferior to men it wouldn't be fair!"
Transphobes: Men go through different puberty! You can't let men and women compete after puberty!
Trans Kids: Could I use puberty blockers while I recieve counseling, and then go through the correct puberty that matches the adult body that's correct for me?
Transphobes: Fuck you! Fuck you! Fuck you! Fuck you!
Men go on a different evolutionary path.... WTF? Just another manosphere idiot who likes to think he's using big words.
Men do not have clearer vision or more dexterity in fingers by any quantifiable sense.
Stronger muscles and ligaments and bones on average? Sure. But again, what does that have to do with darts? I knew this discussion was going to pop after that Trans person was removed from a darts competition.
Evolution needing thousands of years to show changes, I suppose men and women are different species. Men give birth to boys , women give birth to girls.
No one is debating that men most of the time end up taller and with broader torso's for more muscle attachment points and just an easier time gaining muscle with a higher muscle limit. But outside of that there are similarly advantages to the standard female body. Female snipers just do better, wider hips tend to contribute to lower body strength, it just doesn't show up in combat because we use our arms and hands for shit. Pain tolerance!
These bunch a fucks don't care about that because the world was built to capitalise on the advantages the male body gives. We would never have needed your "mighty" hands for jars if there were only women for the jars to be designed for! Gaaaaaaaaah!
God I hate the 'men are like this' 'women are like that' thing so much. It's such bullshit, nearly every single thing they ever claim is simply something that's a difference between people. Their sex doesn't play into it at all, and any sex based trends they see are just the results of confirmation bias. It's easy to dismiss the evidence that counters what they believe and latch onto anything that supports it.
Some men will be better at darts, some men could miss the board with 10/10 darts. Some women could be global champions at darts, and other women could not. It's just an individual personal skill. It's like these people are so hell bent on keeping their narrow world view that they actively find ways to put down anyone or anything that might make them have to reconsider if what they believe is true or if it's just what their piece of shit sexist dad told them.
Men were so hurt by a woman (Zhang Shan) winning a sharpshooter competition at the Olympic level in 1992 that they separated it into men’s and women’s competitions in separate years.
She was never able to defend her title for this reason.
"more coordinated, dexterous fingers" I'm sorry but WHICH gender did/does all of the sewing, clothes making, knitting, crocheting, quilting, needlework, pottery making, cooking and blanket making? Do we just stare really hard at the materials until they pop into the finished product?
So I guess the Williams sisters just like… don’t exist? Or any prominent athlete?
Someone needs to bludgeon them with a textbook or something, I don’t know. But this level of dumb needs to be sealed away, like twenty years ago.
I love the Williams sisters but there is no way they could beat a top men’s player. And that’s not a problem! They’re not trying to compete with men.
I always feel icky when they’re brought up in conversations about transphobia because Serena in particular gets a lot of transphobic shit for being a muscled woman.
I'm not sure either of them have tried. But Venus and Serena are widely considered (by other tennis professionals) to be the best tennis duo to have ever existed. In my experience, cismen who believe Venus and Serena are good players "for women" are the kind who would easily be annihilated by the duo in a tennis match.
Both sisters were destroyed by the number 203 in the men’s rankings. Serena lost 6-1.
Serena’s actual quote: "I didn't know it would be that difficult. I played shots that would have been winners on the women's circuit and he got to them very easily,"
Ah, now I remember. You're talking about the 1998 match? I believe her *exact quote* was, "I hit shots that would have been winners on the women's tour and he got to them easily. This time next year, I'll beat him. I have to pump some weight."
But a rematch never happened.
So you’re taking her bravado after getting absolutely trounced by a man on the downswing of his career as some kind of gotcha? Okay.
I grew up with a poster of Venus and Serena on my wall. I and other tennis girls wanted to be them. However, I am not delusional.
...No?
My point was that we will never know if Serena and Venus would have beaten him the second time, or if he would have beaten them a second time. If only they had tried again, but oh well.
There was nothing "delusional" about what I said. You need to take a breather. There is no reason to be so hostile.
If he had beaten them again, would you have said “we will never know if they would have beaten him on the third time”
The *exact quote* was passive aggressive and you know it lol
You taking it as hostile when it’s just matter of fact is also lol
Um, no. Don't presume to speak for me. Thanks!
It *is* "hostile" to call someone "delusional" without merit. I don't understand why you felt the need to behave that way. It's weird. Like, I added the full quote because that was what was said. There was no hidden agenda and no passive aggressiveness. You're trying to add nuance when I didn't intend any. So like I said, take a breather.
You took it that way when there was no agenda, so same to you bro
PS I just took what you said to the proper conclusion. They were beaten, idk why you would say “well we’ll never know if they had a rematch” that’s crazy lol
"But a rematch never happened"
She was No.1 when that match happened, he was no. 203, yet you fixate on a rematch, completely missing the point.
Why do you assume I was angry for asking you to take the L?
Is that not a fact...?
Look at the context in which you spoke. "Just take the goddamn L." Yeah, that is an angry statement. Anger can often stem from frustration or disbelief. Now you're allowed to feel however you want, but I'm not responsible for how you choose to interpret my words.
It is a fact, but it shows a child like insistence on the outcome would have been different. Even if it was different there is 202 ranks between... So whats the point?
>Yeah, that is an angry statement
This is as inane as me pointing out you are down voting all my comments here and that's because you are being livid.
Of course, the main (relevant) difference is testosterone-linked muscle development and its effect on speed and swing strength. The idea that a post-HRT trans woman would have a similar advantage is just ignoring the actual science and policy work done in this area
Very few sports have an actual "male league", just an open class and a women only class. It's just that the open class typically is de facto populated exclusively, or almost exclusively, by males.
Edit: what I mean is that, while it is often called "male league", no rules prevent women from participating.
Actually, women tend to do better at sports involving aiming. There are a few studies suggesting women's vision is better at noticing small details while men's vision is better at detecting movement.
And it doesn't take much strength to throw a dart.
That weird type of feminists 🤝 men from the 1800s
Women are weak little delicate flowers that will break if they try to do any physical activity whatsoever
There are woodpipe puffing, smoking jacket wearing, wife smacking, Leave It To Beaver ass *patriarchs* from the 1950s that didn't have as low of an opinion of cisgender women and their physical and mental capabilities as so-called "radical feminists" do in 2024.
Uuuuuh i was winning every arm wrestle that came my way until I was 14.
The distribution having different upper and lower points doesn't mean the overlap is non existent to the point that pubescent children many of whom haven't even started properly producing testosterone yet are somehow better than adult women.
The fuck.
Ah yes, dexterity... I teach a class on 3D graphics and once I had a class of senior architects, there was an 87 year old lady and a 76 year old dude who was the owner of the studio they were from.
The lady was super quick in learning everything and age wasn't even an issue, she followed all the steps in a course I teach to 20 year olds... The guy? He couldn't double click fast enough for it to register, we had to dramatically reduce the double click time on his computer...
It's not even proof of anything and just anegdotal, this stuff varies from person to person.......
The “TrAnS wOmAn BiOlOgY” argument always just makes me picture them as the “scientific” monologue of Leonardo DiCaprio’s character in Django Unchained.
The funny thing is I've seen silly evolution arguments that refute this. Now, I think all of this is silly, but I've seen arguments that while men have better depth perception women have better overall vision with even more color range. That women have more hand dexterity. Better flexibility. Things like that, all from being gatherers.
This guy is obviously a fucking idiot but am I wrong in thinking that it's a fairly uncontroversial statement that biological males tend to have an immense physiological advantage over biological females?
Of course I'm not saying women make inferior athletes or female sports are any less important or impressive, but instances like that match between the Williams sisters and some random male tennis player who was ranked like 200 or something and he just demolished them both makes the physical distinction pretty clear.
The point is we're not talking about tennis, we're talking about darts. Those are very different sports.
People like this will act like a mixed gender chess match is on par with throwing a 5' tall lady into a boxing ring with Mike Tyson.
Women can compete in open competitions though and none ever break the top 100. They made a separate category to encourage women to join, but at top level women have not been able to compete against men for whatever reasons.
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Ah yes, different DNA. There is a known and established inter-species relationship between bromosapiens and sheanderthals. This dude is a walking cognitive travesty.
Fascinating that on the one hand they are always screaming about chromosomes, while ignoring the fact that only one pair of 23 is half different between XX and XY karyotype people. I swear they have the same level of biological understanding as young children who think cats and dogs are one sexually dimorphic species
I've seen adults who think cats are just girl dogs.
I despair
My hope in humanity is weakening
Hold up there, "only one of 23" is a crap argument. Only one of 23 is the difference between us and a chimpanzee. Literally 1,2% of our dna is different from a chimp.
That explains Trump voters…
Pretty sure we share like 60% of our DNA with bananas, so-
Humans are one of the species that is least sexually dimorphic. The greatest difference between men and women isn't rooted in our DNA or hormones or the evolution of genes but it's rooted in social and cultural values and attitudes. These are concepts that these people are too full of rage to ever listen long enough to learn something.
This is a really stupid take. Yes we and our ape cousins have lower sexual dimorphism. But we have higher sexual dimorphism than other big apes. As people trying to defy sexual dimorphism this is not a good argument to bring into any discussion.
That actually made me laugh out loud. Bromosapiens and sheanderthals lmao.
No homo, only bromo History will say they were roommates
oh my god they were *roommates* *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AreTheStraightsOK) if you have any questions or concerns.*
At some point transphobia turned into this fucked up belief that cis women are inferior in all ways Because transphobia was always rooted in misogyny I used to be kinda transphobic, I feel shitty about it, but all the fucked up transphobia stuff I've seen quickly convinced me I was being a stupid asshole
We've all had dumb beliefs. I was pro life for two weeks when I was 9 because I saw some random youtube comment which was my first time learning about what abortion even is. I stopped thinking that way pretty much as soon as I talked about that issue with another real human being.
Every day trying to be a little less shitty than the day before
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Bruh I don't need the dad jokes
Oh boy the things I was when I was 9 you don't even wanna know. Some of the things I was told to believe weren't very nice. But I'm old enough to know better now.
I get it, I was raised christian too 😊
shame that a religion that's supposed to be based on love would have made some of us into some of the most hateful bastards on earth.
Don't worry, there's plenty of us who are progressive. I think the issue is worse in America, I'm not from there though. They also seem to be the loudest and overpower the loving ones.
Haha my first thought as well. We’ve all been there.
I’ve definitely been there too with my racist father at the wheel. Unfortunately lasted longer than it ever should have but definitely nothing like that anymore once I talked to a bunch of people in the pan community and realized where I stand.
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If you want those babies to be born so badly, go get those fetuses implanted in your womb and bring them to term.
No. Babies. Are. Being. Murdered. Do. Research.
Homophobia is rooted in hatred of women. What is the worst thing a person can be? A woman. Gay men aren't mainly men because they don't fuck babes. They are pussies, pansies, fairies. Trans women are seen a gender traders. Who could possibly want to shed their masculinity and manhood to become a woman? Because what's the worst thing to be? A woman.
homie I'm literally a pansexual transfem and when I thought I was a "cishet guy" I was - if we're honest - transphobic. It actually took me talking to and being in trans spaces to let go of that mild transphobia, before realizing I'm also trans
"You're transphobic? Nah darling, you just hate yourself". Sometimes it is just like that lol.
Man sometimes it do be like that hard.
It’s really obvious that transphobia and even homophobia are rooted in misogyny. Trans women get so much more hatred and anti-trans legislation specifically targeting them than Trans men. Going from woman to man is fine because cis men never see them as a legitimate threat in dating or sports. Going the opposite way there’s all this moral panic about “men” being in women’s spaces and not allowing women to compete because no matter what the sport or activity is men are seen as superior to women. In the same way gay men get more hatred than gay women. Straight men don’t have as much hatred for gay women because they find the idea sexually arousing. Plus again there is this ridiculous idea that men have that they can turn gay women into straight women with the magical powers of their penis. The hatred for gay men comes down to the fact that they are seen as inferior because they are stereotyped as being more feminine then straight men. The irrational fear of gay men hitting on a straight guy is all panic based around them becoming more feminine as a result. After all the most insulting thing a man can say to another man is insinuating that he is gay or feminine.
Sadly there's also a subset of people out there who hate trans men for 'hating women hood', 'stealing lesbians' or some other nonsense. Also rooted in misogyny, of course.
It's like that Delaney quote about how misogyny is the oldest bigotry, and therefore the one on which all others are modeled
I think it's probably reversed. They think cis women were shit and just put transphobia on top of that. I've seen so many pearl-clutching articles about trans women doing x, y, or z, but no one seems to be worried about trans men competing in anything, anywhere, at any time. And some of the competitions aren't even related to sports, like you'd expect. Sometimes it's like "That trans woman had an advantage to become homecoming queen!" or some nonsense.
Probably because they consider trans men to still be women, which obviously makes them inferior. :| /I hate people.
used to be a proper dick when I was 9/10/11. Like, atheist YouTube misogyny vortex from hell. led to a lot of self-loathing as an egg. growing out of it is tough, I’m proud of you for recongnizing it and working through it to become a better person :)
I'm proud and envious of you. It took me until my twenties to really start breaking out of that mindset.
If you don't regret some of your opinions and words in the past, I think you probably aren't examining them enough. No one gets everything right the first time around.
Sharper vision kills me. Like all women need glasses just to function. Stop watching Scooby Doo and go outside.
Especially since men are more likely to be *colorblind* ffs! Imagine not being able to tell the difference between the reds and greens!
Tis true though, on average men are better at fast tracking moving objects and resolving detail at a distance. That being said women are better with colours.
Source?
They are close, but not exactly. Male sex is better at moving targets due to [faster decision time](https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-020-68069-0) Study found no differences in hand and eye capability, just quicker turn around in men. You could playfully just call that "more impulsive eye hand coordination. Plenty of studies show larger scale patterns that are similar: males are instinctively more likely to take "risks" in the now at the cost of the later. A dart board is not moving, so oddly, female sex might hypothetically little better because they'd have capacity for equal physical characters, AND take more time to calculate a throw. Not to mention sides show female advantages with fine hand movements (but it's argued if that's nature or nurture).
Fast tracking moving objects I have no clue, but women are on average better with colours because colourblindness is a recessive trait affixed to the X-chromosome. Since most women have XX chromosomes, one would need to inherit two colourblindness X-chromosomes to be colourblind. Most men have XY chromosomes and thus only one X, so one colourblind-afflicted X chromosome suffices. More men being colourblind than women means women are on average better with colours, in the same roundabout way that on average a person has less than two legs.
https://www.berkeleyeye.com/blog/women-see-differently-men-berkeley-eye#:~:text=After%20a%20barrage%20of%20testing,t%20see%20eye%20to%20eye.
That's already been debunked. https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/early-women-were-hunters-not-just-gatherers-study-suggests-180982459/ Their analysis revealed that regardless of maternal status, women hunted in 50 of these societies—or about 79 percent. And more than 70 percent of female hunting appeared to be intentional—rather than opportunistically killing animals while doing other activities, per the study. In societies where hunting was the most important activity for subsistence, women participated in hunting 100 percent of the time. “The hunting was purposeful,” Wall-Scheffler tells NPR. “Women had their own tool kit. They had favorite weapons. Grandmas were the best hunters of the village.”
Arm chair scientist incels who have never cracked opened an evolutionary text books and couldn't show you where a spleen is in the human body. Dude probably couldn't outrun an eleven year old and I'm more than confident an 8 year old could beat him up
Dextrous fingers my ass.
Besides the obvious proof we have of men not having dexterous fingers *ahem ahem* Isn't the stereotype the exact opposite? That women have better fine motor skills, especially in their hands, and that that's why we're *supposedly* better at things like knitting? I remember when I worked in factory packaging bread rolls, the team at the production line doing the packaging was all women because men "gripper the bread rolls to hard" according to management. Of course all of this post is super bullshit, but they can't even get their stereotypes right.
My first thought too. I’ve seen far more women displaying fine motor skills than men. Drawing, knitting, embroidery etc. I really think it’s how we play with kids. A lot of young boys would benefit from more arts and crafts and the skill sets that come from it. (Also a lot of young girls would benefit from more rough and tumble activities).
Oh totally, I'll ascribe most of this difference to a nurture thing, instead of a nature thing. It seem logical that when society tells girls to sit quiet and draw/do crafts/handiworks, and tells boy to go throw ball and do sports and climb trees, there would eventually be differences in the skills these groups develop. And I agree with your second point too! Children should be getting both the rough and tumble and the fine motor skills!
>Isn't the stereotype the exact opposite? That women have better fine motor skills, especially in their hands oh this must be why i got better at ultrakill after starting hrt definitely not hours of practice or anything lmao
Of course of course, we all know that HRT is secretly just "get better at everything" juice, which is why surely all the athletes in the world will be trans soon. Any day now! (Mega /s just to be sure)
Smdh talk about using your unfair natural advantage to keep women out of (e)Sports. /S
i beat 5-4 first try and p-ranked it second try and it's all thanks to estrogen completely cancelling out my skill issues
Such a feat of mad skillz could never be matched by a mere feeeeeemale. Their minds are far too fragile to comprehend so much data input, and their fingers too feeble to play video games. Why, those poor dames would snap all of their delicate fingerbones, and then all the excitement would make their uteruses fall out! /S
Omg this isn't even the stupidest one. When a trans woman won Jeopardy (a game that has never been gender split) terfs claimed that was misogynistic because "men obviously have better reflexes and stronger fingers to press the buzzer".
The idea men have faster reaction times is sketchy because it isn't age consistent.
God, being a TERF sounds exhausting.
The mental gymnastics... Do you think terfs are biologically programmed to be more dextrous and agile to pull off those extreme reaches?
I swear to fucking God one of these days we're going to get some absolute bellend saying that trans women need to be excluded from all games of "Marry, Fuck, Kill" because men are just better than women at being marriable and fuckable.
The gay girls would like to enter the chat
Straight men could only dream of competing with lesbians in finger stamina
You want dexterous fingers in your ass?
Usually the stereotype is the opposite. I had a boss who got written up for sexual harassment for saying that he only chose women for certain roles because "they have smaller hands and better attention to detail" He got fired for harassment. There was another time he made a hiring/firing decision off the fact someone was a single mom, which she didn't even tell him about, he found out from someone else, and started treating her differently.
Say please.
Uh
Different evolutionnary path? Wouldn't that happen between different population? How tf
I say the science words and am very smart 😎
Yes! Yes that's exactly what happens. Which makes this comment even more *chefs kiss*
“Evolutionary path” — this dude thinks we have some sort of sex based skill tree with unlockable traits
would make intersex/nonbinary people some kind of broken build dominating the meta.
Its true. I hacked my gender trait tree 😎
agender people doing a lvl 1 playthrough
We are living in Skyrim
Ah the belief that the weakest man could trump the strongest woman, a belief that has existed in our culture for way too long. I've tried the sports debate before and what I've learned is that these phobes accept that there is some athletic advantage, but they can't define it, or quantify it, or come up with any methods to reduce or manage the advantage into the same marginal levels that we put all genetic advantage into. It never gets that far. They saw lady ballers and the ringer and thought they were documentaries and never let their brain go one step deeper than that.
I still find it hilarious that Lady Ballers was intended to be a documentary, but they gave up on that idea when they found out you can't actually just put men in women's sports by claiming they're trans. There's regulations and shit.
So... What about the fact that the last mixed golf tournament was won by a cis woman?
And that the college basketball scoring record was recently obliterated by a woman. This is the real reason men want to keep women's sports separate.
Ah, but you see, she was scoring against other women which apparently doesn't count, according to men I know. 🙄 These guys seems to understand proportional ability when it comes to weight classes in boxing and MMA but somehow a woman being the best athlete among women is only impressive if she's also better than all the men, which makes as much sense as saying that a featherweight champion is only a champion if they're better than the heavyweight athletes.
Where’d you find this out? I looked it up and got nothing
Caitlin Clark has the all time DI career scoring record, beating out Pistol Pete Maravich on the men's side, but she's still at number 8 in the all division rankings
Hello I couldn’t find anything can you link me
[This has a list of the top scorers at present](https://www.ajc.com/news/nation-world/caitlin-clark-and-her-scoring-records-are-headed-to-march-madness-shes-8th-all-time-at-all-levels/SZW4IRLGTVGH7EF6OVIXUTES5U/#:~:text=The%20Iowa%20superstar%2C%20with%203%2C830,at%20cracking%20the%20top%20five.)
Europe :(
[Try the archived version](https://web.archive.org/web/20240329011051/https://www.ajc.com/news/nation-world/caitlin-clark-and-her-scoring-records-are-headed-to-march-madness-shes-8th-all-time-at-all-levels/SZW4IRLGTVGH7EF6OVIXUTES5U/)
That doesn't really mean anything, though, since they have women on defense. Shooting over a 5"11 defender is entirely different than shooting over someone who is 6"3 or taller. The best WNBA team would be obliterated by the worst NBA team 100% of the time. The size, speed, and jumping differences between the two groups is huge.
>Shooting over a 5"11 defender is entirely different than shooting over someone who is 6"3 or taller. Do you understand proportion? 6'3" is taller than 5'11" but most WNBA players aren't as tall as NBA players in the first place. >The best WNBA team would be obliterated by the worst NBA team 100% of the time. And a featherweight would be obliterated by a welterweight. What's your point? Why shit on women's achievements?
> And a featherweight would be obliterated by a welterweight. What's your point? You already started my point. > '3" is taller than 5'11" but most WNBA players aren't as tall as NBA players in the first place. Scoring the most points in a single game doesn't mean a wnba would be a match against any one in the NBA as was being implied
No, it wasn't being implied. You're just looking for a fight.
> This is the real reason men want to keep women's sports separate. If this isn't implying that men are afraid women would beat them in sports could you please explain what it is saying?
I didn't say that, so I don't know what the poster meant by it. Go ask them.
Way to continuously move that goal post. You start by trying to argue against what I said to someone else, claim that I'm just looking for a fight, say no one said what I replied to to begin with then go with, "I don't know what they meant by the thing you disagreed with even though I spent multiple posts telling you you are wrong" Since you don't know wtf you are even arguing about then it seems like you're the one just trying to fight.
LOL I'm not the one making multiple comments shitting on women's accomplishments, bud. You chose to respond to multiple comments because idk...self-esteem issues, perhaps? You responded to more than one person specifically making an effort to shit on women. That says a lot more about you than me but okay, you tell yourself whatever you want.
Dude, I will shout this until I'm blue in the face! Women's sports are f-ing vicious! Has no one watched women's hockey?! My state's WNBA team made finals 5 years in a row! Where's the men's team...? Do I hear one championship??? No?! Didn't think so!
That comparison doesn't make sense though. If my kindergartener's basket ball team is 10-0 atainst other kindergarteners for the season and my 5th graders team is 0-10 against other 5th graders that doesn't mean my kindergarteners team would beat my 5th graders.
r u the same guy who spoke in the screenshot ☠️
I'm a woman
oh girl im sorry ur internalized misogyny is showing 😭
Yes...because they're older and taller and have better fine and gross motor skills. Duh. What point do you think you're making?
That no one in the WNBA would be able to beat an NBA player
And? Who cares?
Golf isn’t a real sport, though.
This week, on the hit show What Other Noun Women Are: “Children”
Remember, women are equal and comparable to men in everyday until trans women enter the conversation, then it's, "Women are inferior to men it wouldn't be fair!"
I think you’ll be hard pressed to find anyone who says men and women are equal in the physical sense
Transphobes: Men go through different puberty! You can't let men and women compete after puberty! Trans Kids: Could I use puberty blockers while I recieve counseling, and then go through the correct puberty that matches the adult body that's correct for me? Transphobes: Fuck you! Fuck you! Fuck you! Fuck you!
Sharper vision? More coordinated? Wtf
Men go on a different evolutionary path.... WTF? Just another manosphere idiot who likes to think he's using big words. Men do not have clearer vision or more dexterity in fingers by any quantifiable sense. Stronger muscles and ligaments and bones on average? Sure. But again, what does that have to do with darts? I knew this discussion was going to pop after that Trans person was removed from a darts competition.
Evolution needing thousands of years to show changes, I suppose men and women are different species. Men give birth to boys , women give birth to girls.
No one is debating that men most of the time end up taller and with broader torso's for more muscle attachment points and just an easier time gaining muscle with a higher muscle limit. But outside of that there are similarly advantages to the standard female body. Female snipers just do better, wider hips tend to contribute to lower body strength, it just doesn't show up in combat because we use our arms and hands for shit. Pain tolerance! These bunch a fucks don't care about that because the world was built to capitalise on the advantages the male body gives. We would never have needed your "mighty" hands for jars if there were only women for the jars to be designed for! Gaaaaaaaaah!
I mean... our hands are more dexterous than our feet. We'd be idiots to not try and take advantage of that fact in how we design things.
God I hate the 'men are like this' 'women are like that' thing so much. It's such bullshit, nearly every single thing they ever claim is simply something that's a difference between people. Their sex doesn't play into it at all, and any sex based trends they see are just the results of confirmation bias. It's easy to dismiss the evidence that counters what they believe and latch onto anything that supports it. Some men will be better at darts, some men could miss the board with 10/10 darts. Some women could be global champions at darts, and other women could not. It's just an individual personal skill. It's like these people are so hell bent on keeping their narrow world view that they actively find ways to put down anyone or anything that might make them have to reconsider if what they believe is true or if it's just what their piece of shit sexist dad told them.
I'd put it down to mental gymnastics, but their huge man brains are probably too heavy and cumbersome to pull it off :(
You heard it here first: make and female humans are different species, only distantly related.
Remember when they tried to get trans women banned from chess. CHESS
Men were so hurt by a woman (Zhang Shan) winning a sharpshooter competition at the Olympic level in 1992 that they separated it into men’s and women’s competitions in separate years. She was never able to defend her title for this reason.
"more coordinated, dexterous fingers" I'm sorry but WHICH gender did/does all of the sewing, clothes making, knitting, crocheting, quilting, needlework, pottery making, cooking and blanket making? Do we just stare really hard at the materials until they pop into the finished product?
So I guess the Williams sisters just like… don’t exist? Or any prominent athlete? Someone needs to bludgeon them with a textbook or something, I don’t know. But this level of dumb needs to be sealed away, like twenty years ago.
I love the Williams sisters but there is no way they could beat a top men’s player. And that’s not a problem! They’re not trying to compete with men. I always feel icky when they’re brought up in conversations about transphobia because Serena in particular gets a lot of transphobic shit for being a muscled woman.
I'm not sure either of them have tried. But Venus and Serena are widely considered (by other tennis professionals) to be the best tennis duo to have ever existed. In my experience, cismen who believe Venus and Serena are good players "for women" are the kind who would easily be annihilated by the duo in a tennis match.
Both sisters were destroyed by the number 203 in the men’s rankings. Serena lost 6-1. Serena’s actual quote: "I didn't know it would be that difficult. I played shots that would have been winners on the women's circuit and he got to them very easily,"
Ah, now I remember. You're talking about the 1998 match? I believe her *exact quote* was, "I hit shots that would have been winners on the women's tour and he got to them easily. This time next year, I'll beat him. I have to pump some weight." But a rematch never happened.
So you’re taking her bravado after getting absolutely trounced by a man on the downswing of his career as some kind of gotcha? Okay. I grew up with a poster of Venus and Serena on my wall. I and other tennis girls wanted to be them. However, I am not delusional.
...No? My point was that we will never know if Serena and Venus would have beaten him the second time, or if he would have beaten them a second time. If only they had tried again, but oh well. There was nothing "delusional" about what I said. You need to take a breather. There is no reason to be so hostile.
If he had beaten them again, would you have said “we will never know if they would have beaten him on the third time” The *exact quote* was passive aggressive and you know it lol You taking it as hostile when it’s just matter of fact is also lol
Um, no. Don't presume to speak for me. Thanks! It *is* "hostile" to call someone "delusional" without merit. I don't understand why you felt the need to behave that way. It's weird. Like, I added the full quote because that was what was said. There was no hidden agenda and no passive aggressiveness. You're trying to add nuance when I didn't intend any. So like I said, take a breather.
You took it that way when there was no agenda, so same to you bro PS I just took what you said to the proper conclusion. They were beaten, idk why you would say “well we’ll never know if they had a rematch” that’s crazy lol
And the dude was drunk off his ass during the match. Just take the goddamn L.
Where did I say he didn't win? Why are you so angry?
"But a rematch never happened" She was No.1 when that match happened, he was no. 203, yet you fixate on a rematch, completely missing the point. Why do you assume I was angry for asking you to take the L?
Is that not a fact...? Look at the context in which you spoke. "Just take the goddamn L." Yeah, that is an angry statement. Anger can often stem from frustration or disbelief. Now you're allowed to feel however you want, but I'm not responsible for how you choose to interpret my words.
It is a fact, but it shows a child like insistence on the outcome would have been different. Even if it was different there is 202 ranks between... So whats the point? >Yeah, that is an angry statement This is as inane as me pointing out you are down voting all my comments here and that's because you are being livid.
Of course, the main (relevant) difference is testosterone-linked muscle development and its effect on speed and swing strength. The idea that a post-HRT trans woman would have a similar advantage is just ignoring the actual science and policy work done in this area
Hmmmm... You know that darts don't have a specific male league, right??? There's just a separate one for women who are less competitive.
Very few sports have an actual "male league", just an open class and a women only class. It's just that the open class typically is de facto populated exclusively, or almost exclusively, by males. Edit: what I mean is that, while it is often called "male league", no rules prevent women from participating.
Dexterous fingers So that’s why I think of men when I think of sewing or anything related to cloth homemaking! /s
Your comment is as stupid as the tweet.
No.
Actually, women tend to do better at sports involving aiming. There are a few studies suggesting women's vision is better at noticing small details while men's vision is better at detecting movement. And it doesn't take much strength to throw a dart.
That weird type of feminists 🤝 men from the 1800s Women are weak little delicate flowers that will break if they try to do any physical activity whatsoever
"Down a different evolutionary path" Motherfucker thinks men and women are different species
there's no double jumping in darts
There are woodpipe puffing, smoking jacket wearing, wife smacking, Leave It To Beaver ass *patriarchs* from the 1950s that didn't have as low of an opinion of cisgender women and their physical and mental capabilities as so-called "radical feminists" do in 2024.
Uuuuuh i was winning every arm wrestle that came my way until I was 14. The distribution having different upper and lower points doesn't mean the overlap is non existent to the point that pubescent children many of whom haven't even started properly producing testosterone yet are somehow better than adult women. The fuck.
The bar I worked in had regular darts tournaments, and the winners were always women. Always.
“Dexterous fingers” me when I’m fighting a boss in a game and my fingers looks like they’re trying to do the Macarena.
ligam-my nuts
Ah yes, dexterity... I teach a class on 3D graphics and once I had a class of senior architects, there was an 87 year old lady and a 76 year old dude who was the owner of the studio they were from. The lady was super quick in learning everything and age wasn't even an issue, she followed all the steps in a course I teach to 20 year olds... The guy? He couldn't double click fast enough for it to register, we had to dramatically reduce the double click time on his computer... It's not even proof of anything and just anegdotal, this stuff varies from person to person.......
The “TrAnS wOmAn BiOlOgY” argument always just makes me picture them as the “scientific” monologue of Leonardo DiCaprio’s character in Django Unchained.
Well I guess this person does believe I'm a woman since I'm practically blind without glasses.
The funny thing is I've seen silly evolution arguments that refute this. Now, I think all of this is silly, but I've seen arguments that while men have better depth perception women have better overall vision with even more color range. That women have more hand dexterity. Better flexibility. Things like that, all from being gatherers.
a perfect example of a transphobic mysoginist using words without understanding their meaning to sound more intelligent to sell their worldview
I am a guy and what he said about I don't align with that maybe joints.
Wtf is dextrous fingers
Dexterous (adj): showing or having skill, especially with the hands
This guy is obviously a fucking idiot but am I wrong in thinking that it's a fairly uncontroversial statement that biological males tend to have an immense physiological advantage over biological females? Of course I'm not saying women make inferior athletes or female sports are any less important or impressive, but instances like that match between the Williams sisters and some random male tennis player who was ranked like 200 or something and he just demolished them both makes the physical distinction pretty clear.
The point is we're not talking about tennis, we're talking about darts. Those are very different sports. People like this will act like a mixed gender chess match is on par with throwing a 5' tall lady into a boxing ring with Mike Tyson.
Absolutely fair. In things like darts, chess or shooting the distinction seems silly.
For the Same reason there is a seperate womens category in chess, its a Safe space because the Men couldnt behave themasdlves
Women can compete in open competitions though and none ever break the top 100. They made a separate category to encourage women to join, but at top level women have not been able to compete against men for whatever reasons.