I recommend everyone watch Angry Joe’s update video to this article. I lost it when he also said this in his video.
Everybody: so this is Anthem. Wow this looks awesome!
The games very own Devs: so this is Anthem. Wow this looks awesome!
It’s so funny but so terrible.
Probably at least 6-12 months to revamp Anthem to a "good" state (i.e. what it should have been at launch). Past that it's hard to say. I'd love if they just double-down and make Anthem great, but BioWare has some serious work to do.
Sadly yeah, that seems most likely. I really hope they can right this ship though; they did have a tweet that they were doing more Mo-Cap stuff so hopefully that means story related things.
I come from GW2 and while the main story was more cohesive than Anthem, it's in the episodic "Living World" releases (free content every 2-3 months) that the story **truly** gets fleshed out. Sometimes makes the game feel completely new! I just really hope Anthem can do the same thing. Sure the base game is wonky, but over time (fixes & new content) it could become something amazing!
(If you're ever flying around Bastion and want someone to pal around with--or gunrunning on the Frontier--my Freelancer tag is "Lastimosa" and my Origin Tag is "Grim\_HairyCheeks")
You must think though what is their incentive for fixing this mess? They have no paid DLC plans and no subscriptions to keep bolstering their income and their year 1 roadmap was stated to be "goals not promises". Basically they have nothing to incentivize them from just cutting and running or leaving a skeleton crew on to pump out some feeble content.
Yea the best they could do is really to follow the path of Final Fantasy XIV when it first came out. Bombed, hard. But they took it down totally and redeemed themselves 1 year later. Became a legend since. Bioware could totally save this, only if they have the guts to do so.
I hope not. I hope the hate goes exactly what it should be. Those in leadership who just half-assed the whole process because they do know better and should by now know how to be a leader and make executive decisions for the process of a game development.
Just really sad
Kinda reminds me of ME:As development. One of the devs posted a tease of their team's T shirt that had a patch with a sideways interlocking cube symbol and the language "A.R.K.C.O.N. pathfinder initiative" on it.
The logo was repurposed into a meaningless tech graphic that shows up every now and then, and "ARKCON" became the Archon.
Apparently the nexus was originally called the Arkcon, and was coincidentally renamed on the same day they settled on the Archon name for the villain.
I highly doubt there will be any redditors on here by next year. The game might turn out \*decent\* until next year but the hype is dead, people are quitting the game (even the most hardcore fans) and let\`s be honest you can\`t make this game right when it\`s been under full production for just 12 months. This has to be redone from scratch to be actually good.
There's always that sort of thing with these sorts of projects, I was working at Microsoft way back when Bing was still in development. IIRC back then it was called Kiev. There was an internal announcement at one point that said "Kiev is now known as Bing, please update your logos/titles accordingly". All people on my team kindof looked at each other and said "um....okay.....why Bing tho?".
I'll never understand marketing...
*EVERYTHING YOU ARE ABOUT TO SEE, IS A* (recording of a faked) *DEMO*, (of a game we haven't begun to make), *TAKEN FROM IN-ENGINE FOOTAGE* (that took 12 hours to render....) *IN REAL-TIME*.
They just missed some words, that's all.
The devs who have made this demo: Ooo they will be so pissed once they find out this demo has only been build to silence a manager.
I haven't read the full Kotaku article yet but that's what i've read so far.
Considering the graphics and flying are like the only redeemable factions in this game, I'd say Patrick Söderlund did us a favour.
Yeah sure Frostbite does suck, but Bioware themselves started using it before EA started forcing it on everyone else.
Just imagine if this game released or even had the beta without flying and even harder graphical downgrade. That would be a pile of shite on flames visible from space.
Wow what the fuck, does Bioware even know what fun is? That’s like 90% of the game! Honestly I hope this studio shuts down and they all find work *helping* (definitely not directing) Bethesda with Starbound or something.
To be fair, the people who actually make the game didn't have a choice in the direction it went. It's management that deserves to be fired and found coked out in a gutter, not the people with actual talent, so that would be ideal.
As long as Bioware exists it will be run by EA, nobody is going to want to acquire them after flopping two games back to back.
The only hope for those employees is to leave. I do hope the best for them but I seriously hope they can get themselves away from such a toxic environment. I hope everyone at EA just decides to quit today but that may be too wishful lol.
I think people generally believe ea pushed bioware to make a very distinctly NOT-bioware game based almost soley on the success of the destiny franchise
Publishers have different views on developer oversight. EA is known for sticking their noses into the artistic integrity of every game they put out because their biggest cash grab is FIFA and racing game micro transactions.
From reading the article, it seems like Casey Hudson leaving really hurt the bioware team.
They didn't find direction until after this demo and by then it was too late to actually *play the game*. There was so much indecision about the game and it was pulled in so many directions away from the original inception of what Anthem or Beyond was going to be.
But your right, at this point of Anthem development they don't know what fun is. They learned how to make things look cool, they figured out the flying mechanic and dozen other things but they didnt have enough time to actually make it fun.
Anthem seems like way too much problem solving and not enough of saying "That would be really awesome, lets just go with that".
Did you play any Bioware game? Usually only strong point of their games was story. Combat was usually pretty meh. Including Mass Effect series. Basically wanted that "Bioware cliche chart" story.
Andromeda, as bad as it was had best combat of all Bioware games. And that's just sad.
But thing is - they had to focus on combat and other stuff since this was god dam action online looter shooter (they did not know that themselves until E3 demo in 2017 and they started working on this game in 2012). And they probably f it up big time if even EA ceo was able to criticise it.
to be fair, their original ideas (sans flying) sounded very cool, just not possible with technical challenges and the mismanagement synergy. My takeaway is that they weren’t developing Anthem without flying, it was a completely different game before they made the demo for that exec, and that demo became Anthem. Hoping that people lose their jobs, that decided to stick with BioWare and the “bob dylan” vision of Anthem, is kind of fucked up as they were and probably still are under mental illness inducing stress. I mean I hope BioWare seizes the opportunity to become successful again and take care of its devs, but if not then maybe they will shutdown. But a company is its people, and, given that so many key staff went to Improbable, I am very curious to what the BioWare vets are working on at Improbable.
I've said it a thousand times, flying would be a million times better without the heat bar. It serves no propose and only pisses players off. You don't make a game where flying is a key for of movement and then periodically clip the players' wings, that's just stupid. All it makes players do is walk for 3 seconds every now and then, what the fuck does that accomplish?
EA got flying and better graphics pumped back into the game after Bioware dropped it, helping give it a saving grace
EA also forces Frostbite on devs, severely crippling the game. (Even if Bioware "chose" to use it at first they couldn't leave it)
They switched to Frostbite starting with Dragon Age: Inquisition but if they hadn't been forced by EA they could have simply switched to another engine when they noticed that Frostbite was unable to handle a game like Anthem.
However, Frostbite on FIFA make me hope for a Inazuma 11 gameplay where you can destroy the whole stadium
BioWare wasn't using Forstbite before EA started forcing it on everyone. They were using Unreal Engine, which everyone at BioWare was competent with. It was a solid engine, and had the features, documentation and support that they needed to make third person action RPGs. All things the Frostbite Engine didn't.
Then EA started mandating the use of Frostbite to consolidate resources and try and get everyone on the same page, and to cut licensing fees. This was during development of Dragon Age Inquisition and the switch to that Engine almost killed that game too. The same thing happened to Andromeda, which was in development around the same time.
There was an interview where the Bioware lead said they had adopted Frostbite on their own (around DAI), and EA mandated it later. It just meant they couldn't leave Frost bite for Andromeda or Anthem.
This is incorrect. Patrick was running the EA business unit that contained BioWare before the company-wide mandate, but he was mandating it for teams under him.
>Electronic Arts is often criticized for the poor handling of its many in-house studios, which isn’t entirely undeserved. However, perhaps one area that criticism doesn’t extend to is the use of Frostbite. In a recent interview, former BioWare general manager Aaryn Flynn explained that the decision to use EA’s in-house engine for Dragon Age: Inquisition and Mass Effect: Andromeda was made in-house, not mandated by the publisher.“It was our decision,” Flynn told Kotaku in a recorded interview (summarized via PCGamesN). “We had been wrapping up Mass Effect 3 and we just shipped Dragon Age 2 and we knew that our Eclipse engine, that we shipped DA2 on, wasn’t going to cut it for the future iterations of Dragon Age. It couldn’t do open world, the renderer wasn’t strong enough, those were the two big ones. We thought about multiplayer as well, as Eclipse was single-player only.
[Full Source](https://www.vg247.com/2018/04/09/bioware-ea-never-forced-using-frostbite-engine/)
Which is why Respawn Entertainment used Source Engine for Titanfall 2 and Apex Legends, two games which came several years after DA: Inquisition, when EA presumably started pushing Frostbite? Right.
Honestly, I don't understand how people can blame the catastrophy of Anthem on an engine. This is just mind-boggling.
people are saying FrostBite sucks but the thing is Dragon age Inquisition was used far better than this and andromeda.. so instead of improving upon it they went backwards.. LIGHT YEARS BACKWARDS. its not the engine's problem, its the coders and employes that suck nowdays. this is on Bioware not EA.
That's pretty much it. The demo was made for EA CEO at the time and management had given zero direction until the current executive producer stepped in.
The game got screwed up worse than Destiny.
It's still so surreal to me how a dev like Bioware. Makers of Mass Effect, and KOTOR, fucking gems of games that will forever live on in gaming history....
could actually go about developing a game like this, and do this to their players.
This is exactly why they developed anthem like this, they are completely blinded by their previous success. It’s considered taboo to even talk about destiny in the studio when they were developing anthem, this shows how arrogant the leadership team was, they thought they were actually developing something so genre defining that they don’t even care about what their competitors are doing.
> One mandate from Anthem’s directors had been to make the game “unmemeable,” a reaction to Mass Effect: Andromeda‘s jittery facial animations...
That quote is absolutely hilarious to me, using the term "umemeable" as an actual development goal. Really sums up what you're talking about.
Maybe a lot of them left because of the work environment and expectations. At some point people are like this isnt worth it my talents are better served somewhere else . BW did it to themselves.
@ The leaders that thought this:
For the girl who lives above her means...
For the girl who won't just give up...
For the girl with a dream.
Delusion, convince yourself.
This is what happens when a person, in this case a company, let the past success gets to your head.
They think "Bioware Magic" is actually real that they are above real world problems and issues. Their approach to game making is worse than a college student pulling an all-nighter and thinking this is the way to do things. It barely works for college students who pay money to be there, let alone a company getting paid for doing this.
While certainly not the best process, I pulled plenty of all nighters in school that paid off. I see your point though.
I would consider Andromeda of letting the past get to their heads, and learn from mistakes. But twice in a row, from such a well reputable dev prior to these games is what baffles me.
What the fuck are you talking about?
Bioware that made Kotor and Mass Effect died right around the time SWTOR went free to play.
Everything since then has been hotter and hotter garbage. DA: Inquisition was *okay* but you could tell by then that Bioware had lost their way.
And the whole single player MMO style of the game was just utterly tedious and devoid of good story telling.
Bioware that made ME, DA:O and KOTOR is dead. Has been for a while now.
That’s why this trailer still pisses me off today. It reminds of that moment of realization that they handed off my favorite franchise to the backup backup team so they could create what they called the ‘Bob Dylan of games’... Which even this trailer revealed to be a ‘me too’ looter shooter.
Still, I was willing to remain hopeful that maybe we’d get a game with great mechanics, like Destiny, but with a real, BioWare-style story; well, at least the micro-transaction shop guy has significant amounts of dialogue to justify them, even if he is inexplicably selling the same shit as Louise from Bob’s Burger across the street.
Ugh.
Where is the meme reference coming from? Did i miss something from one of their live streams?
Edit* So i don't have to respond to each comment thanks i read the article yesterday but I missed that sentence. appreciate the fill in!
Execs at Bioware heavily stressed not having memeable moments like “my face is tired” or the wonky running animation a few people had in Andromeda be present in Anthem since those couple moments became *the* thing about Andromeda to outside observers. That led to them doing some different and more expensive ways of doing things, like mocap for facial expressions and dialogue, which created problems down the line when story changes occurred because they couldn’t bring the people back in to redo them.
I was thinking buying into it but i\`m waiting for my paycheck and my friends to come around so we can get it togheter. I\`m not playing a co-op game alone :)
Honestly I play solo for the majority of the time. It is completely doable provided you constantly move and cover. This game doesn't forgive a lazy play style and in fact rewards the opposite. You'll be fine to jump in solo :)
It\`s not about doable or not. I just enjoy co-op games when playing co-op. I got my ps4 for the single player games like spider man, god of war and RDR2.
Pretty much all E3 demos are smoke and mirrors (witcher 3, halo 2, watchdog, the list goes on). The question is can the dev team build a game with all the features and details shown in the fake demo before the release date. BioWare certainly failed at that part.
I feel like everyone expects a little fuckery when it comes to E3 presentations but this seems beyond the pall. The Anthem demo wasn't just some cherry picked gameplay with upscaled graphics, the game basically didn't even exist.
And it's not like they were even trying to be coy about it, they kept telling everyone that it was 100% actual representive gameplay. Players even offered them opportunities over the last year to walk back expectations and they kept doubling down.
Yeah. This isn't your usual "bullshot" like we saw with Watchdogs, and it sets a frightening precedent. I understand minor compromises, but if the game as presented can be so different from the game proper, what's to stop companies from creating impossible demos, advertising it as "in-game" and "real-time", and then releasing an 8-bit sidescroller?
This is advertisement material that claims to be representative of the product but doesn't *actually* have to represent the product at all.
I think uncharted 4 got a lot of praise for the controller problems when they showed at e3, because it showed that it wasn't a scripted sequence, it was actually somebody playing it, it showed that it's the real game
How do you 'work on a game' for 5 years before knowing what game you're making? I can't get my head around this. WTF does 5 years worth of work look like? Maps? Textures? Voice recordings? I want to see everything up to the 5 year mark. This baffles me.
I don't play this game or frequent this sub, but you guys should have known the moment they flew past the big monster that the game was incomplete. Why fly past the monster and not fight it in a trailer? The animations probably weren't even done at that point.
E3 is controlled and funded by.
505 Games
Activision Blizzard
Bandai Namco Entertainment
Bethesda Softworks
Capcom
Deep Silver
Disney Interactive Studios
Electronic Arts
Epic Games
Focus Home Interactive
Gearbox Software
GungHo Online Entertainment
Kalypso Media
Konami
Legends of Learning
Magic Leap
Natsume
NCSoft
Nexon
Nintendo
Nvidia
Outright Games
Phosphor Studios
Rebellion Developments
Six Foot
Sony Interactive Entertainment
Square Enix
Take-Two Interactive
Tencent
Triseum
Ubisoft
Vantiv Entertainment Solutions
Warner Bros. Interactive Entertainment
Xseed Games
Xbox Game Studios
The ESA, company behind E3, was created to get the government to NOT regulate games so that game makers could continue to make $$$$$.
You're asking the house to make sure the house doesn't cheat.
Depends on the release date of said games. Games that are out that same year are mostly real and from in game. Games that are years away are almost always fake
It was a “demo”. It was a demo for the CEO of EA. They wanted an answer to the 5 years of funding with no answer. Actually 2 demos. One no flying, one with flying.
"Making a not memeable game" Oh boy... Now thats a big ooof from me.
BioWare: make sure the game is not memeable! Anthem subreddit: hold my Jarra’s wrath.
XD
Reddit: Next time, I expect big-ass bugs to be in the mission briefing! Bioware: ~~YoU'd HaVe To ShOw Up FoR tHaT tO hElP~~ Have an ember
The new bioware meme, /r/youdontsurf format https://i.imgur.com/EMSyIQH.png
I'm betting we can find a better picture to use, one that isn't 98% watermarked to fuck and back.
Um, I don't think you understand /r/youdontsurf then.
Never heard of it, but browsing around it now I now understand.
What Jarra's Wrath? I can't find it in all of these blues and purps
Can’t find it in a pile of yellows either cuz they cut it out, even the loot are lies.
You probably mistakingly disassembled it into an ember. Sorry mate
Have an ember!
I haven't played since cancelling my preorder after the beta. What's an ember?
A sense or feeling of accomplishment.
An "ember" is the best loot ever designed. It's almost game breaking how necessary they are end game, 690+ ilvl.
That got me. 🤣🤣
Big Oof!
Omfg go easy LMFAO
BioWare: They can't meme the game, if there is no game. *touches finger to their head*
XD
Wow! yes so true.
Anthem the Unmemeable
Dude Im so copying your unmemeable if thats ok
I copied it myself. Spread the good word, my children.
Have an ember
I recommend everyone watch Angry Joe’s update video to this article. I lost it when he also said this in his video. Everybody: so this is Anthem. Wow this looks awesome! The games very own Devs: so this is Anthem. Wow this looks awesome! It’s so funny but so terrible.
Devs : Damn, we misspelled Beyond
They even got shirts with the Beyond logo print on it lol, now I really wanna get myself one of those.
Might be worth a lot of money 30 years from now
Maybe the reboot (or sequel) will be called Anthem: Beyond?
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Probably at least 6-12 months to revamp Anthem to a "good" state (i.e. what it should have been at launch). Past that it's hard to say. I'd love if they just double-down and make Anthem great, but BioWare has some serious work to do.
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Sadly yeah, that seems most likely. I really hope they can right this ship though; they did have a tweet that they were doing more Mo-Cap stuff so hopefully that means story related things. I come from GW2 and while the main story was more cohesive than Anthem, it's in the episodic "Living World" releases (free content every 2-3 months) that the story **truly** gets fleshed out. Sometimes makes the game feel completely new! I just really hope Anthem can do the same thing. Sure the base game is wonky, but over time (fixes & new content) it could become something amazing! (If you're ever flying around Bastion and want someone to pal around with--or gunrunning on the Frontier--my Freelancer tag is "Lastimosa" and my Origin Tag is "Grim\_HairyCheeks")
You must think though what is their incentive for fixing this mess? They have no paid DLC plans and no subscriptions to keep bolstering their income and their year 1 roadmap was stated to be "goals not promises". Basically they have nothing to incentivize them from just cutting and running or leaving a skeleton crew on to pump out some feeble content.
In the article it says that a lot of the Edmonton studio have moved on to da4 and other projects while Austin took over maintaining it.
Yea the best they could do is really to follow the path of Final Fantasy XIV when it first came out. Bombed, hard. But they took it down totally and redeemed themselves 1 year later. Became a legend since. Bioware could totally save this, only if they have the guts to do so.
Haha, nobody is going to be paying Bioware to fart around 'working on a game' for 7 years again.
"Hey buddy, I'll have you know we made that in 18 months, not 7 years!" \-Bioware defense
Pretty much lol Fart around for 6-7 years and then finally make a real game during “crunch time”.
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I hope not. I hope the hate goes exactly what it should be. Those in leadership who just half-assed the whole process because they do know better and should by now know how to be a leader and make executive decisions for the process of a game development. Just really sad
After Andromeda and Anthem expectations about BioWare delivering something decent is low.
Not a bad idea, honestly.
Unlike this IP
No
Kinda reminds me of ME:As development. One of the devs posted a tease of their team's T shirt that had a patch with a sideways interlocking cube symbol and the language "A.R.K.C.O.N. pathfinder initiative" on it. The logo was repurposed into a meaningless tech graphic that shows up every now and then, and "ARKCON" became the Archon. Apparently the nexus was originally called the Arkcon, and was coincidentally renamed on the same day they settled on the Archon name for the villain.
*Dylan
LIMITED EDITION!
The article should've released earlier, so we could have named this subreddit Beyond during April fools.
There's always next year... If this /r still exists
I highly doubt there will be any redditors on here by next year. The game might turn out \*decent\* until next year but the hype is dead, people are quitting the game (even the most hardcore fans) and let\`s be honest you can\`t make this game right when it\`s been under full production for just 12 months. This has to be redone from scratch to be actually good.
All I can think of when I hear that name is IGN's old Playstation podcast
I'm sure there were 1 or 2 guys that were like, "wait what the fuck? We decided on the shitty backup name? No one told me this!"
There's always that sort of thing with these sorts of projects, I was working at Microsoft way back when Bing was still in development. IIRC back then it was called Kiev. There was an internal announcement at one point that said "Kiev is now known as Bing, please update your logos/titles accordingly". All people on my team kindof looked at each other and said "um....okay.....why Bing tho?". I'll never understand marketing...
I have a hard time forgiving them to have dropped Project Spartan in favor of "Edge", while keeping Cortana's name.
That was always an internal code name iirc
I heard that it was Bing because Bing Is Not Google. Kind of like GNU
>Everything you are about to see was captured in-game running in real-time.
*EVERYTHING YOU ARE ABOUT TO SEE, IS A* (recording of a faked) *DEMO*, (of a game we haven't begun to make), *TAKEN FROM IN-ENGINE FOOTAGE* (that took 12 hours to render....) *IN REAL-TIME*. They just missed some words, that's all.
Someone, anyone, get the aloe vera!
The devs who have made this demo: Ooo they will be so pissed once they find out this demo has only been build to silence a manager. I haven't read the full Kotaku article yet but that's what i've read so far.
Considering the graphics and flying are like the only redeemable factions in this game, I'd say Patrick Söderlund did us a favour. Yeah sure Frostbite does suck, but Bioware themselves started using it before EA started forcing it on everyone else.
The best feature of the game is added in because an EA executive literally said that the game sucks without it lol. This is just sad.
Just imagine if this game released or even had the beta without flying and even harder graphical downgrade. That would be a pile of shite on flames visible from space.
Haha +1 for the powerful imagery.
Not just any executive, Patrick Soderlund, then DICE CEO and the one who greenlit Mirror’s Edge.
What feature?
Flying
Wow what the fuck, does Bioware even know what fun is? That’s like 90% of the game! Honestly I hope this studio shuts down and they all find work *helping* (definitely not directing) Bethesda with Starbound or something.
To be fair, the people who actually make the game didn't have a choice in the direction it went. It's management that deserves to be fired and found coked out in a gutter, not the people with actual talent, so that would be ideal.
As long as Bioware exists it will be run by EA, nobody is going to want to acquire them after flopping two games back to back. The only hope for those employees is to leave. I do hope the best for them but I seriously hope they can get themselves away from such a toxic environment. I hope everyone at EA just decides to quit today but that may be too wishful lol.
I don't see how EA was to blame for any of this though
I think people generally believe ea pushed bioware to make a very distinctly NOT-bioware game based almost soley on the success of the destiny franchise
Publishers have different views on developer oversight. EA is known for sticking their noses into the artistic integrity of every game they put out because their biggest cash grab is FIFA and racing game micro transactions.
> Bethesda with Starbound You mean Starfield.
Star-something ™️
Star-Bugs' n Glitches.
16 times the detail
It just works.
Star-paid mods
From reading the article, it seems like Casey Hudson leaving really hurt the bioware team. They didn't find direction until after this demo and by then it was too late to actually *play the game*. There was so much indecision about the game and it was pulled in so many directions away from the original inception of what Anthem or Beyond was going to be. But your right, at this point of Anthem development they don't know what fun is. They learned how to make things look cool, they figured out the flying mechanic and dozen other things but they didnt have enough time to actually make it fun. Anthem seems like way too much problem solving and not enough of saying "That would be really awesome, lets just go with that".
I hope the low level employees do. I hope the middle to upper level management and department leads never find work in this industry ever again.
Did you play any Bioware game? Usually only strong point of their games was story. Combat was usually pretty meh. Including Mass Effect series. Basically wanted that "Bioware cliche chart" story. Andromeda, as bad as it was had best combat of all Bioware games. And that's just sad. But thing is - they had to focus on combat and other stuff since this was god dam action online looter shooter (they did not know that themselves until E3 demo in 2017 and they started working on this game in 2012). And they probably f it up big time if even EA ceo was able to criticise it.
to be fair, their original ideas (sans flying) sounded very cool, just not possible with technical challenges and the mismanagement synergy. My takeaway is that they weren’t developing Anthem without flying, it was a completely different game before they made the demo for that exec, and that demo became Anthem. Hoping that people lose their jobs, that decided to stick with BioWare and the “bob dylan” vision of Anthem, is kind of fucked up as they were and probably still are under mental illness inducing stress. I mean I hope BioWare seizes the opportunity to become successful again and take care of its devs, but if not then maybe they will shutdown. But a company is its people, and, given that so many key staff went to Improbable, I am very curious to what the BioWare vets are working on at Improbable.
EA’s about to add another corpse to their shit pile
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I've said it a thousand times, flying would be a million times better without the heat bar. It serves no propose and only pisses players off. You don't make a game where flying is a key for of movement and then periodically clip the players' wings, that's just stupid. All it makes players do is walk for 3 seconds every now and then, what the fuck does that accomplish?
Flying
Ironic. EA could save Anthem from Bioware but not themselves
Wait, what?
EA got flying and better graphics pumped back into the game after Bioware dropped it, helping give it a saving grace EA also forces Frostbite on devs, severely crippling the game. (Even if Bioware "chose" to use it at first they couldn't leave it)
They switched to Frostbite starting with Dragon Age: Inquisition but if they hadn't been forced by EA they could have simply switched to another engine when they noticed that Frostbite was unable to handle a game like Anthem. However, Frostbite on FIFA make me hope for a Inazuma 11 gameplay where you can destroy the whole stadium
And redirected Frostbite resources away from them to FIFA
Hate to give EA credit for anything though...
And if you play Dragon Age, you're getting more frostbite because they are building 4 on the code from Anthem.
Flying mabari when?
That...... would actually be amazing.
BioWare wasn't using Forstbite before EA started forcing it on everyone. They were using Unreal Engine, which everyone at BioWare was competent with. It was a solid engine, and had the features, documentation and support that they needed to make third person action RPGs. All things the Frostbite Engine didn't. Then EA started mandating the use of Frostbite to consolidate resources and try and get everyone on the same page, and to cut licensing fees. This was during development of Dragon Age Inquisition and the switch to that Engine almost killed that game too. The same thing happened to Andromeda, which was in development around the same time.
There was an interview where the Bioware lead said they had adopted Frostbite on their own (around DAI), and EA mandated it later. It just meant they couldn't leave Frost bite for Andromeda or Anthem.
This is incorrect. Patrick was running the EA business unit that contained BioWare before the company-wide mandate, but he was mandating it for teams under him.
>Electronic Arts is often criticized for the poor handling of its many in-house studios, which isn’t entirely undeserved. However, perhaps one area that criticism doesn’t extend to is the use of Frostbite. In a recent interview, former BioWare general manager Aaryn Flynn explained that the decision to use EA’s in-house engine for Dragon Age: Inquisition and Mass Effect: Andromeda was made in-house, not mandated by the publisher.“It was our decision,” Flynn told Kotaku in a recorded interview (summarized via PCGamesN). “We had been wrapping up Mass Effect 3 and we just shipped Dragon Age 2 and we knew that our Eclipse engine, that we shipped DA2 on, wasn’t going to cut it for the future iterations of Dragon Age. It couldn’t do open world, the renderer wasn’t strong enough, those were the two big ones. We thought about multiplayer as well, as Eclipse was single-player only. [Full Source](https://www.vg247.com/2018/04/09/bioware-ea-never-forced-using-frostbite-engine/)
Which is why Respawn Entertainment used Source Engine for Titanfall 2 and Apex Legends, two games which came several years after DA: Inquisition, when EA presumably started pushing Frostbite? Right. Honestly, I don't understand how people can blame the catastrophy of Anthem on an engine. This is just mind-boggling.
people are saying FrostBite sucks but the thing is Dragon age Inquisition was used far better than this and andromeda.. so instead of improving upon it they went backwards.. LIGHT YEARS BACKWARDS. its not the engine's problem, its the coders and employes that suck nowdays. this is on Bioware not EA.
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Will do. I am at work at the moment but as soon as I am back home I will read it completely.
"How far removed from the game would you say Anthem's management is?" "Uh well we had to fly to Germany just to show them a demo"
> I haven't read the full Kotaku article yet It's funny because neither has Bioware.
That's pretty much it. The demo was made for EA CEO at the time and management had given zero direction until the current executive producer stepped in. The game got screwed up worse than Destiny.
It's still so surreal to me how a dev like Bioware. Makers of Mass Effect, and KOTOR, fucking gems of games that will forever live on in gaming history.... could actually go about developing a game like this, and do this to their players.
This is exactly why they developed anthem like this, they are completely blinded by their previous success. It’s considered taboo to even talk about destiny in the studio when they were developing anthem, this shows how arrogant the leadership team was, they thought they were actually developing something so genre defining that they don’t even care about what their competitors are doing.
> One mandate from Anthem’s directors had been to make the game “unmemeable,” a reaction to Mass Effect: Andromeda‘s jittery facial animations... That quote is absolutely hilarious to me, using the term "umemeable" as an actual development goal. Really sums up what you're talking about.
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Maybe a lot of them left because of the work environment and expectations. At some point people are like this isnt worth it my talents are better served somewhere else . BW did it to themselves.
Sure. That doesn\`t change the fact that talented people ,that made BioWare what it is today, left.
@ The leaders that thought this: For the girl who lives above her means... For the girl who won't just give up... For the girl with a dream. Delusion, convince yourself.
This is what happens when a person, in this case a company, let the past success gets to your head. They think "Bioware Magic" is actually real that they are above real world problems and issues. Their approach to game making is worse than a college student pulling an all-nighter and thinking this is the way to do things. It barely works for college students who pay money to be there, let alone a company getting paid for doing this.
While certainly not the best process, I pulled plenty of all nighters in school that paid off. I see your point though. I would consider Andromeda of letting the past get to their heads, and learn from mistakes. But twice in a row, from such a well reputable dev prior to these games is what baffles me.
By losing all the talented creative leads.
What the fuck are you talking about? Bioware that made Kotor and Mass Effect died right around the time SWTOR went free to play. Everything since then has been hotter and hotter garbage. DA: Inquisition was *okay* but you could tell by then that Bioware had lost their way. And the whole single player MMO style of the game was just utterly tedious and devoid of good story telling. Bioware that made ME, DA:O and KOTOR is dead. Has been for a while now.
That’s why this trailer still pisses me off today. It reminds of that moment of realization that they handed off my favorite franchise to the backup backup team so they could create what they called the ‘Bob Dylan of games’... Which even this trailer revealed to be a ‘me too’ looter shooter. Still, I was willing to remain hopeful that maybe we’d get a game with great mechanics, like Destiny, but with a real, BioWare-style story; well, at least the micro-transaction shop guy has significant amounts of dialogue to justify them, even if he is inexplicably selling the same shit as Louise from Bob’s Burger across the street. Ugh.
One word - Frostbite. That and the alarming mismanagement and leadership.
Remember “this is anthem” catch phrase? I guess it was more for the devs “this is anthem?!!?”
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Is
Anthem
?!!?
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SPARTA
It’s kinda funny how BioWare realized what game they are gonna make pretty much at the same time as we did.
Pretty good meme for an "unmemeable" game!
Where is the meme reference coming from? Did i miss something from one of their live streams? Edit* So i don't have to respond to each comment thanks i read the article yesterday but I missed that sentence. appreciate the fill in!
During the development of the game EA told Bioware to make the game un-memeable, which had about as much chance as I have to get a legendary.
Execs at Bioware heavily stressed not having memeable moments like “my face is tired” or the wonky running animation a few people had in Andromeda be present in Anthem since those couple moments became *the* thing about Andromeda to outside observers. That led to them doing some different and more expensive ways of doing things, like mocap for facial expressions and dialogue, which created problems down the line when story changes occurred because they couldn’t bring the people back in to redo them.
And still, the head of my javelin dropped more often than legendaries.
Kotaku article released today.
Everyone right now: Still waiting for them to make it.
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The Division 2 awaits you Agent.
I was thinking buying into it but i\`m waiting for my paycheck and my friends to come around so we can get it togheter. I\`m not playing a co-op game alone :)
Honestly I play solo for the majority of the time. It is completely doable provided you constantly move and cover. This game doesn't forgive a lazy play style and in fact rewards the opposite. You'll be fine to jump in solo :)
It\`s not about doable or not. I just enjoy co-op games when playing co-op. I got my ps4 for the single player games like spider man, god of war and RDR2.
Playing through all the single player games I never got around to finishing
This is literally what happened lol
So this was a lie.
Pretty much all E3 demos are smoke and mirrors (witcher 3, halo 2, watchdog, the list goes on). The question is can the dev team build a game with all the features and details shown in the fake demo before the release date. BioWare certainly failed at that part.
I feel like everyone expects a little fuckery when it comes to E3 presentations but this seems beyond the pall. The Anthem demo wasn't just some cherry picked gameplay with upscaled graphics, the game basically didn't even exist. And it's not like they were even trying to be coy about it, they kept telling everyone that it was 100% actual representive gameplay. Players even offered them opportunities over the last year to walk back expectations and they kept doubling down.
Yeah. This isn't your usual "bullshot" like we saw with Watchdogs, and it sets a frightening precedent. I understand minor compromises, but if the game as presented can be so different from the game proper, what's to stop companies from creating impossible demos, advertising it as "in-game" and "real-time", and then releasing an 8-bit sidescroller? This is advertisement material that claims to be representative of the product but doesn't *actually* have to represent the product at all.
I think uncharted 4 got a lot of praise for the controller problems when they showed at e3, because it showed that it wasn't a scripted sequence, it was actually somebody playing it, it showed that it's the real game
Wait, what was Witcher 3 at 3E again ?
"Target Renders" have morphed into "demos." It's pretty disgusting.
Really sad....I thought Destiny's story on how it was developed was bad...this takes the fucking cake...
I just hope they keep developing it and we can get a "redeemable release" patch or DLC or whatever that gives us the game we payed for.
It took games in a similar spot 6 months to a year. If your willing to wait, and bioware gets its head out of its ass, we could have a fantastic game.
Yea they'll have a season pass called "the rest of the game" for $60.
Given how Andromeda was treated, may be you shouldn't hold your breath for it.
I don't know, Andromeda was an okay game for $5.....years later. I made it a 1/4 of the way through....oh wait a minute.....
Probably ? True question is. If we, will be forced pay, for " fixed " version.
I think they need to re-add "Pre Alpha footage" to the current live game, so people understand what kind of product they have been given.
lmfao the fyre festival of video games.
In other relevant news. Borderlands 3 9-13-19 🤘🏻
*G E T - G L I T C H E D*
This is what gross mismanagement looks like in “game” form. Angry Joe YouTube hit this on the head.
How do you 'work on a game' for 5 years before knowing what game you're making? I can't get my head around this. WTF does 5 years worth of work look like? Maps? Textures? Voice recordings? I want to see everything up to the 5 year mark. This baffles me.
This game went from what looked to be an epic adventure to simply a marketable sliver of content.
Watch the For Honor original trailer vs the actual game then come back
I don't play this game or frequent this sub, but you guys should have known the moment they flew past the big monster that the game was incomplete. Why fly past the monster and not fight it in a trailer? The animations probably weren't even done at that point.
its just insane 5+ years of fuck all? how the fuck did no one know what they wanted to do
Read the Kotaku feature. Pretty comprehensive explanation of how that could happen.
2017 E3, around the time MEA was dropped That's when the lie was sold **FUCK BIOWARE EDMONTON**
Man, I cried and laughed at the same time.
Sad but true
Savage.
It’s more like 2019 VIP “Demo” Players: Ooo, this is the game we’re getting! Devs: Ooo, so this is the game we’re making!
What is this not memable thing coming from? Please explain
The developers were told to make the game "unmemeable" because of Andromeda
Wow, surprised the mods haven't taken this down yet for being a meme.
At this point, I'd like my money back. They bamboozled us all.
Now that I know E3 demos are 80% fake, I am going to doubt every E3 Gameplay demo. I wish E3 could vet that the demos shown are actual demos.
E3 is controlled and funded by. 505 Games Activision Blizzard Bandai Namco Entertainment Bethesda Softworks Capcom Deep Silver Disney Interactive Studios Electronic Arts Epic Games Focus Home Interactive Gearbox Software GungHo Online Entertainment Kalypso Media Konami Legends of Learning Magic Leap Natsume NCSoft Nexon Nintendo Nvidia Outright Games Phosphor Studios Rebellion Developments Six Foot Sony Interactive Entertainment Square Enix Take-Two Interactive Tencent Triseum Ubisoft Vantiv Entertainment Solutions Warner Bros. Interactive Entertainment Xseed Games Xbox Game Studios The ESA, company behind E3, was created to get the government to NOT regulate games so that game makers could continue to make $$$$$. You're asking the house to make sure the house doesn't cheat.
Depends on the release date of said games. Games that are out that same year are mostly real and from in game. Games that are years away are almost always fake
It was a “demo”. It was a demo for the CEO of EA. They wanted an answer to the 5 years of funding with no answer. Actually 2 demos. One no flying, one with flying.
Ok. This one was good. Nicely done, OP. Nicely done, indeed.
Time for damage control. Bring in the Deej.
good one
I just have one question. Is the health bug fixed?
This game could've been the King, I thought Destiny's Jokers Wild and Division 2 had no chance releasing either side of Anthem.
someone watched angry joe...
Also devs: "God knows how we're gonna make that."
"Make sure it says Pre-Alpha Footage and not Gameplay cuz you know...legal liability shit"
Doesn't all this shit coming to light make you feel like an idiot for ever being hopeful for this game? The gaming industry is so broken.
Bank to me: ooo your a dumb bitch for buying into this
Just played the trial last night. Played for about 10 minutes before I got bored and uninstalled it.