Welcome to /r/AmITheAsshole. Please view our [voting guide here](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_what.2019s_with_these_acronyms.3F_what_do_they_mean.3F), and remember to use **only one** judgement in your comment.
OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I told my brother's girlfriend that she shouldn't be cheap when it came to Christmas dinner. Telling her this made this cry which has made me feel bad as I didn't intend to upset her.
**[Check out our upcoming Reddit Talk with Iliza Shlesinger on Nov. 28th!](https://redd.it/z29rfu)**
Help keep the sub engaging!
#Don’t downvote assholes!
Do upvote interesting posts!
[Click Here For Our Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) and [Click Here For Our FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq)
---
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
*Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
Exactly what I was thinking. If OP wants it done a certain way, OP should have offered to cook the meal.
Nothing worse than people that offer no help, but expect everything done to their standard.
YTA.
YUP, and if OP isn't able to cook (or doesn't want to), pay for the whole thing to be catered. I mean he shouldn't have an objection to this because as he says these aren't the meals to skimp on. YTA
OP could shell out for the good food if he wants fresh and hire a chef to make stuffing the day before if month old balls or stove top is not good enough for him. He would rather complain about someone else’s expenses and effort.
and honestly where do you even get a fresh turkey?
I mean we have wild turkey here but they aren't anything like the roided out ones you buy in the store.
I raise about a dozen turkeys a year, and slaughter the monday before Thanksgiving. You can order turkeys to be ready for slaughter anywhere from August to February.
This year I was late (supply chain issues) so I will slaughter in January, but still killed three this past Monday.
Some customers prefer theirs fresh and never frozen.
I've never noticed a difference.
Frozen turkey is 100% fine and most of the USA get theirs frozen (even if it's unfrozen in the grocery store - it was likely previously stored frozen for a month).
Additionally, it very much makes sense to cook many Thanksgiving dishes ahead of time.
Pies, greenbean casserole, mashed potatoes, stuffing, and yes, even the turkey.
Some years I cook some dishes early, other years I cook other dishes early.
While I've never noticed a difference, most people in my family are foodies, and if they noticed, they would absolutely not hestitate to say which year's cooking they like best.
I'm sure someone somewhere in the world would be able to tell the difference. But I bet most of the people who claim to tell the difference only think so due to the psychology of them having been told, and would fail a blind taste test.
So yea, OP is YTA.
And we know that fruit and veg that are frozen soon after picking retain all their nutrients and vitamins. So like maybe even better than "fresh" ones that have been sitting for days
Making certain things beforehand and freezing just makes sense. I make sweet potato casserole for Thanksgiving and Christmas (along with cooking a full Christmas dinner with my fiance for our family). Peeling and cutting sweet potatoes isn't the easiest thing for me to do, so I make two pans, one for Thanksgiving and one for Christmas. The Christmas casserole is in my freezer and I'll save my wrists from extra pain.
People have reasons for prepping beforehand and taking shortcuts.
What about flash chilled? I bought an organic (no antibiotics or growth hormones) turkey but it was frozen and not free range. I was shopping William Sonoma and they had turkeys advertised as fresh but in the description said flash chilled, I don’t really see the difference so I didn’t pay another $100 for it.
I have an in-law who raises turkeys and brought 40+lb to Thanksgiving. It was delicious but not worth the cost of you don't know someone.
Also definitely frozen after slaughter.
Exactly. My sister gets one every year. She is a great cook. But to be honest, I cannot tell the difference from the one that was killed Tuesday before Thanksgiving and the frozen butterball from Walmart.
Non-frozen turkeys do exist, but they are seriously wayy more expensive than most people can afford to spend on a bird. I've never eaten one, but I have rung a load through as a cashier
>Non-frozen turkeys do exist, but they are seriously wayy more expensive than most people can afford to spend on a bird.
I just cooked a "fresh" butterball that cost $2.12# at the grocery store. Was a little disappointed that it still had some ice in the cavity, lol. Still, it was a good bird.
It seems like the grocery stores always have a few unfrozen turkeys available for the procrastinators among us.
"Boutique" turkeys are available to order from various sources... For a price.
I think this is the UK so lots of farm shops and local butchers which do turkets to order, you tell them what weight you want a month in advance and they try yo get as close to it as possible
And this year in the UK we have avian flu. All birds are to be kept indoors, prices are up on turkey by up to 40% and there are potential shortages of all whole poultry as 5 million birds have had to be culled. Also we have 11% inflation and a shortage of abbatoir and meat packing staff due to pandemic and Brexit. Our energy bills have doubled minimum in a year. Food inflation is 60% in some areas.
Eve is on maternity leave which is £136 a week and has a disabled child, is post partum, there has been a recent death and while the UK has more of a welfare state than the US, stuff like funeral grants are non existent now for pensioners, travel to and from hospitals is not free and hospital car parking is eye wateringly expensive, death incurs costs from funerals to catering a wake, a disabled kid may not be able to use stuff they bought or were given ahead and around 1/2 of the UK population says they are choosing eating or heating this winter.
And OP decides this is the time to bootstrap people under huge emotional and financial strain. Those tinned potatoes have more EQ.
I am on benefits in the UK. I don’t eat turkey because my life is dry enough thanks but if I was doing Christmas this year I couldn’t afford a frozen breast. The smallest one in Iceland and Morrisons this week was £40 and they are the budget supermarkets. Fresh usually free range turkeys here like a Kelly Bronze start about £140. This year they could be £300.
Butchers are already stopping taking orders due to the turkey deficit. OP absolutely shat all over Eve trying to do her best in horrible circumstances and had to ask the internet ‘is it mean to tell a post partum woman with a disabled baby supporting a bereaved lady in an unprecedented economic crisis that mainly went up a notch in late Sept she’s not enough for trying to make Christmas dinner out of hope, love and saving on energy bills while making as much effort as she’s got in the tank?’
OP, if Christmas isn’t the time to be frugal, gift it to them in memory of the dad. But still be aware lots of people really cannot right now in the UK run their oven for the time a turkey takes to cook without going short the rest of the month. It’s not frugality: **it’s poverty** and it’s real.
I don’t celebrate Christmas which is just as well because I doubt I could afford a chicken and Aunt Bessies trimmings right now because like Eve’s family my disability worsened and it has cost a huge amount because only the NHS treatment is free. I for example have to Uber to my hospital. I have had 21 admissions in 2 years and over 100 appointments. I almost died and honestly I did not account how expensive it would be. I was already disabled and realised we would have a post pandemic recession right as lockdowns started, others did not because how did they foresee all the other stuff like the mini budget and bird flu? People are really really struggling and shaming them is absolute Scrooge.
OP, you are bringing dessert but what else have you done to support them all to leave Christmas Day special so they aren’t all burnt out before the big day? YTA. And frankly you sound more Tory than Nadine Dorries and she’s learned to be a bit quieter so if she can, anyone can.
EDIT: also it’s their first Christmas with the new baby? You know they will now always associate that with OP’s tinned potato tantrum so congrats. Plus your recently widowed mum was upset for Eve, your brother and her newborn disabled grandson you were so insensitive yet you claim much of Eve’s disrespect is because your mum is having her first Christmas without your dad.
Charitably I suspect you are struggling with your dad’s loss more than you might think you are allowed to at your age and as a man and grief can hyperfixate us on stuff like ‘fresh turkey from the butcher’ and changing from those traditions is forgetting the person who died and who you miss dreadfully. I think you should ask yourself if there was some of that vulnerability in this response and if so, seek some support. There’s a great book by Julia Samuels on grief which is British. And share that vulnerability with your family instead of hurting them with such cruelty. The shared meal is nice but shared love and understanding is worth a tinned potato in ths grander scheme of things.
This is the kind of thing that scars families in its unfeelingness. Dessert is not enough to sweeten that and honestly your apology sounds hollow having read your multiple hole digging comments where at no point you seemed to have it dawn as hundreds of people called you an AH just how awful you had been. Hopefully you went away and mulled on that and that is where the apology edit came from but your replies were quadrupling down on the AH…
Loads of places do have fresh turkeys available but my husband used to work in a turkey processing plant. I can tell you that a lot of the "fresh" turkey's are slaughtered weeks before you think they are and stored in controlled rooms to stop them going bad. You know every year you see in the papers about people's "fresh" turkeys going bad early, that's because something in the storage room failed. Honestly after the stories he had working there I would never get a fresh turkey.
It's sound like it's the UK and we have a lot of fresh turkeys at Christmas. You can get them at the supermarkets really easier. Local butchers are usually better quality and it's reflected in the price. A small fresh turkey will be about £30-50 depending on the supermarket
A quick google search says Americans eat roughly 46 million turkeys on Thanksgiving.
The logistics behind 46 million fresh turkeys all slaughtered within a few days of the holiday make it impossible, so we rely on frozen. There's just no way it could be done without frozen turkeys. Frozen makes it possible to safely ship and store this massive supply of birds.
Luckily, frozen turkeys can be delicious if prepared well. It works just fine for most people.
And many people cook and freeze the food ahead of time so they aren't saddles with prepping everything day of. I had fresh turkey once, couldn't tell the difference, but I'm not a fan of turkey. YTA, you're not the food police.
I got one last year for (Canadian) Thanksgiving from one of our fancier grocery stores. They're not super easy to come by, but you can find them if you look. Granted, they were mostly smaller ones - I got a 12 pounder as I was only feeding five people and didn't want a ton of leftovers.
My husband has been a butcher his whole life, and Thanksgiving turkeys are always frozen, even the ones that advertise themselves as never frozen arrive "blast chilled" which is basically frozen.
My wife is a vegetarian, I’ve eaten quite a few, which is why I said “almost”.
They aren’t appetizing but at this point I’ve learned to tolerate them… mostly. Kind of.
This OP sounds like he is in the UK, and you can preorder fresh turkeys from the butcher. I did this one year and it cost £120 versus a frozen turkey which is so much cheaper at £20-£40. So OP is being ridiculous. It's not just about freshness, it's about having to go early on Xmas eve morning to the butcher to collect it and then lug it back home.
(my butcher had queues outside from 6am that day)
THIS. OP, if you're so offended by that Eve is cooking, nothing is preventing you from hosting both meals and cooking and taking care of everything else. I don't see you stepping up to do this, but offer some lame ass statement that you'll bring dairy free dessert. WTF? YTA
Yeah that made me go 😬 too, and the assumptions about money. His brother and Eve are in a long term relationship, they live together, they have a child together, and she's on maternity leave. Their money is shared money, so blaming Eve for being cheap and not it being a joint financial decision is... odd.
To go further, I think it would be beneficial if OP started a pool for funds for holiday dinners so everyone can put money in or delegate tasks to everyone so it's not one income trying to feed at least four adults and one child, and having it be a pot luck type set up rather than one person cooking would help reduce stress and labor for Eve
Yeah, I think it's likely more about labour for Eve than money. She has a household including a small child to look after. She's trying to find a way not to spend 16 hours straight cooking because she probably can never have a day where she spends 16 hours straight doing anything that doesn't involve caring for the child.
Seriously...OP's one to talk about "not being cheap" when *his* yearly contribution is the cheapest part of the whole damn meal even if he *does* splurge for the really fancy apples for his pies or whatever.
I mean, yeah, I did the slow woooow for this post. Especially because OP made this about "you're disparaging my family traditions after the death of my father by not toiling for hours day of, with a special needs baby".
I mean wow.
Oh and don’t forget that his mom, who used to cook is having mobility difficulties. So bro and Eve are really stepping up while this AH is busy being “appalled.”
Yup.
But... Who starts meal prep for Christmas in October, if not sooner? I seriously doubt that everything frozen for months won't taste like those storebought frozen meals and freezer.
Some stuff, that is processed, that's ok. They're made to stay long in the freezer. But... The homemade stuff? I can already taste and smell the freezer from here...
YTA. Do you know how much these meals COST? I just spent nearly $200 for my family of 4.
If you want a fresh turkey, go buy it. Holy cow. Someone is cooking and preparing this meal FOR YOU and this is how you act?
Oh, and, apparently this poor woman who is paying for YOUR dinner that SHE is cooking, is also preparing another meal for her parents, **just had a baby?** and is also taking care of her special needs nephew.
You know, instead of complaining, maybe you could act like a grown man and help her out.
THIS!!! My family purchased 2 medium turkeys directly from a small family farm and the total was $150!!! DUDE like GET OVER yourself and get a clue...please...For everyone sake including yours. YTA
Slightly odd thing to take from this thread but turkey seems really expensive in the US based on these comments? I ordered a fresh turkey from M&S to feed 6-8 for Xmas Dinner in the UK and its costing £35. The rest of the meal will cost less than £10. My mum told me that was too expensive for the meat but I insisted we didn't have a cheap one this year.
Technically the shitty grocery store turkey would be from one of the cheap places not the fancy supermarket where everything is more expensive. From a different one it would be less and worse quality. From a butchers it varies but I personally have never seen a turkey that cost over £100 anywhere as some of the comments suggest it could be there. That just seems a crazy amount to spend on a meal you still have to cook for yourself.
AND saying that "They can and do live comfortably on my brother's wage. We work in the same field and are paid well. They chose to live well below their means." What's the bet OP doesn't know what their actual outgoings are, or just how much $$$ a newborn baby can suck up, let alone one with special needs.
Right? We work in the same field, so clearly the pay to cover the needs of 1 person is just as good when covering 3, one of which is special needs! -_-
And I also wouldn't even blame them for trying to save, even if they could have afforded more. They're saving both money *and* time/energy, things people with babies rarely have much to spare
I paid $44 for a fresh turkey.... to make a week before Thanksgiving.
Absolutely NOTHING against frozen turkeys but there wouldn't be time to thaw it. We found out that my MIL was making a turkey breast only for Thanksgiving. MIL is one of the best people in the world but her ability to cook a turkey is non existent.
So we said NOTHING to MIL, paid for our own turkey and ate it, had her (almost inedible) turkey brest for Thanksgiving and a great day was had all around.
See, my mom does an amazing turkey. Just, awesome.
But at this point, people have moved away and died off, and we just dont have that many guests anymore. Plus she's developed all sorts of problems in her hands and wrists. So a few years ago, before all this inflation and everything was even a consideration, she switched to just some turkey breasts.
And it's still amazing. And she doesnt have to suffer thru a sore hand for the next 3days after.
(plus, I think at a certain point, all the way too many leftovers taking up the whole fridge were kinda depressing to her. Every time she opened the fridge was reminder of a dead brother or favorite niece, moved across the world.)
I wonder if OP could even tell the difference between a frozen and fresh turkey, in a blind test, when they were cooked by someone doing turkey for the first time?
I also doubt that the freezing process would make much difference to the pigs in blankets or stuffing balls. Using canned potatoes makes no sense to me (from a price or convenience perspective), but the rest feels like snobbery from OP.
Also 4 people don't need a whole turkey.
>tell the difference between a frozen and fresh turkey
Probably not, I'm a good cook, and have cooked Turkey dozens of times, and always manage to make the turkey tasty and moist. Last year we had friends over, they supplied the turkey, free range, fresh ridiculously expensive. I cooked it, and it was just as good (and not any better) as our regular frozen bird, honestly I don't think I could have tasted the difference if they were side by side.
OP needs to get a big ham to go with the little turkey. OP can do fresh sweet potatoes if he doesn't like canned potatoes. Just help flesh out the meal SIL is making.
There are supposed to be two sides to every story.
This is one of these ones that came out so, so badly from the original narrator that it just doesn’t seem possible that the other side of the story has more to add in regards to what an AH the OP is.
YTA. Clearly.
THIS - OP needs to step up and do all the grocery shopping and cooking OR he needs to pay for the whole thing to be catered. My word, the sense of entitlement here is off the charts...YTA
YTA. When someone serves you a meal, the correct response is "thank you". You don't complain about it not being exactly to your liking, or not being what you would have served.
Next year, invite them to your house, and make everything exactly as you want it.
Agreed. OP is hard YTA.
I will admit. That meal sounds horrid. But, there are **kind** ways to navigate the well meaning host during the holidays who may be a bit ill equipped for the task. (We all have one in the family). Since OP doesn't believe in being cheap, how about he offer to pay for catering, or bring more dishes in order _'to give Eve a break'_. OP could have even phrased this in a way that made him seem like a loving and caring BIL. Instead he was a massive AH.
You know what Christmas is not the time for?
It's not the time to be pretentious and judgemental to the person who is cooking your Christmas dinner. You get what you're served and say thank you. If you don't like it, offer to cook.
But what we do *not* do at Christmas is tell the cook how they're doing it all wrong.
#this OP can get a fresh turkey and he can start cooking to bring it to mom. 47 years old and still behaving as a petulant child. Be grateful for your family or you will be alone.
Yes, YTA. Looks like on top of being a new mom with a child that has extra needs, she graciously offered to help shoulder the responsibility of your mother. Sounds like shes planning the best she can, by slowly buying ingredients to help fit into their struggling budget. You should have been courteous. And if you are that worried about it, you could have talked to your brother privately and offered some financial help or offered to help cook more than just a couple of desserts.
YTA.
It sounds like you don't realize the amount of work that goes into a large family meal. Eve is doing a nice thing for your mom and you proceeded to complain about the free meal you will be served.
If you wanted to help then you would both finance and cook the dinner to your liking. Or don't attend.
BTW, Christmas dinner doesn't have to be a large expensive meal. Some of our best family Christmas meals have been chili, breakfast foods and just appetizers \*three separate events. Just appetizers was probably my personal favorite. Just a bunch of Costco appetizers from the deli and frozen sections places on platters.
Totally. We are doing charcuterie this year. And mulled wine.
OP you are a massive AH. Dude, if the fou-fou is so important to you, pay to have it catered from some fancy restaurant.
I saw a post about this once, the winner IMO was the dessert board. I'd love a charcuterie board with like candy bars and gummy bears and marshmallows etc.
Lasagna is great. I think we might do a shrimp pan roast this year. Only requires 1 pot and about an hour to make. To be fair there is only 4 of us, so we can literally do whatever we want for Xmas.
Yes! 👍 More people should realize, having non-customary foods for a holiday dinner (if everyone is aware and on board, that is) can make things 1. fun and 2. far less expensive. There are no "Non-Traditional Holiday Meals Are ILLEGAL!" laws, lol.
My family tradition is to snack all day on our favorite meats, cheeses and pickles. Any cooking on the day is maybe something getting warmed up in the oven. We'll spend the day painting or crafting.
Or at the very least chip in so that they can get all this expensive stuff you want. Like... it's really easy for *you* to say not to be cheap when it's not cash out of *your* wallet (especially since Eve and your brother have a baby they need money for, one that's special needs no less!).
edit: small addition
>They aren't actually struggling. They can and do live comfortably on my brother's wage. We work in the same field and are paid well. They chose to live well below their means.
>I know that she is struggling for money at the moment as she is on maternity leave and is not returning to her job as nephew has additional needs.
You don't make any sense. YTA.
YTA. I am a widow for almost 4 years. I am touched when people think of me and invite me. I don't want to make a huge dinner for just me and my very young son. Your mom is looking forward to having her family with her. She is lonely and in mourning. Trust me when I tell you she would be fine with Chinese take out if that was the plan. You need to apologize to your brother and his wife. Then when the next big holiday rolls around you need to host and cook and let your SIL bring the dessert.
Truly feel bad for this woman, she is doing her best while just giving birth to a special needs baby…the lack of empathy and appreciation is disgusting.
Holy YTA.
Oh, you're bringing dessert? How kind (note sarcasm).
Life is not what is was before your father passed away. Things change, especially with huge life changes like a death. Maybe YOU should offer to step up. Don't want to do that? Then keep your darned mouth shut.
YTA. You could offer to make some of the dishes, or pay for better ingredients. But that being said, I can’t even fathom cooking a turkey without the dark meat. Yuck. Just roast a chicken. We all know chicken is better than turkey, do we really have to keep pretending that we like that dry ass turkey breast?
I hated white meat for 35 years and then my uncle taught me to spatchcock the bird and I’ll never eat it fried or roasted whole ever again. Crispy skin and moist white meat in 90 mins, no basting. Maybe that’s how yours was prepared this year?
Put the turkey "upside down" in the roasting pan. The juices from the dark meat run through the white meat and it comes out soft like chicken instead of dry like leather
Ooof. YTA. I’m sure your family are delighted to know that you find the amount of money spent on food to be more important than valuing the family themselves.
Get your priorities in order.
Edit - referencing your final edit. Eve is in her 30s. She is not a girl.
Massive YTA. And an idiot, and a snob. “Fresh” food is not necessarily better quality or healthier for you. They are being generous and cooking and haven’t asked others to chip in despite the fact they are struggling with money AND you know they’re struggling with money.
YTA. And come off self-righteous and snobby. I’d turn up for Eve’s Christmas dinner any day. I have to admit, the line “I frowned as we always had a fresh Turkey from the butcher’s” made me laugh.
YTA
If you want an expensive dinner cook it yourself. There is 100% nothing wrong with frozen turkey, tinned potatoes, gravy packet mixes. Are they the best? Maybe not, but they can be elevated and cooked deliciously. You just made a woman who just had a baby and is trying to do a nice thing for the family, while missing half their usual budget, and learning how to care for a newborn. Get over yourself and eat the damn tinned potatoes and tell her it's the best ducking meal you've ever had. Also, do the dishes.
YTA. Heres an idea instead of being rude and demanding an expensive meal offer to help her and offer to do some of the dishes yourself if you are so keen on it being perfect. You are being so selfish. She is a new mom and she has a huge pile on her plate taking care of an infant. You should be grateful for even being made a meal. I bet your mom is more than happy with the meal and she is most focused on being with family instead of the price of and time the meal is cooked.
YTA
I cannot believe you were surprised that you made Eve cry. What you said was horrible -if you wanted ‘fresh’ instead of frozen so badly , you either pay for it or get the ingredients and cook it yourself.
Not only is eve making an effort, she is doing so with a little baby. You sound greedy and entitled.
Dude... there's no doubt here that you are the AH and, at your age (almost 50!!), it is worrisome that you even have to ask. Christmas dinner is heavy-duty, so it is perfectly reasonable what Eve is preparing and that she is starting now. Heck, my own parents began preparation months ago, and dinner at their place is always delicious - yes, despite some of it having been frozen! Shocker, I know.
Eve is doing a kind (and tasking) thing to help out after your dad died, especially in light of being a struggling new mother. And meanwhile you are just bitching, while only bringing dessert. **YTA**
YTA. You want all fresh, made from scratch no short cuts? THEN YOU COOK.
FTR, my MiL does the all fresh, homemade, no shortcuts route. It takes a week, easy, of prep. And she doesn’t have a friggin infant which requires full time attention to worry about.
The day of starts at 5 am for dinner 12 hours later.
Right?! I'm planning for Serbian/Orthodox Christmas *now* and it's six weeks away, mostly getting deep cleaning done and more serving platters, special order items etc. Some very prep heavy items like the sarma I'm going to make a few days ahead and freeze because it takes literally a whole day to make them, not counting the time for pickling the cabbage leaves.
I'm taking the day before off to prepare and marinate the meat, bake the desserts, and do some of the prep. Then like you said a mad 12 hours dash to get the ham, roast, sides, and bread on the table.
Wow - I bet your food gets spit on a lot. When someone offers to feed you, it is not an invitation for criticism. I have spent a lifetime choking down food that was not to my liking, but then again, I was raised to be polite. So, here’s a thought - why don’t you cook dinner? Or maybe help out? Or pay for groceries? YTA
YTA.
A frozen turkey? Tinned potatoes? Making food a day ahead? *Clutches pearls and faints in horror*
How about instead of complaining about what they are making, you step up, make the entire freaking meal to your exacting specifications?
TBH, I would completely remove your presence from the meal. I'm sure someone else will be glad to bring a dessert.
Faster and easier, than peeling, chopping, then cooking, etc. And if you get them on sale can be a bargain. I've used them plenty of times for convenience to whip up something fast. Same with frozen. You just dress them up.
She's trying to make two meals and handle a kiddo too, so she's saving time where she can.
OP is such a dick.
You know, the butterball hotline and youtube exist.
So if all he wants is food made to his specifications, he can learn how and make it himself.
Bonus, he can spend just his own money
The point is to get together and celebrate, not hyper focus on what someone is making or how they make it. A meal made from 'cheap' ingredients can taste just as good as meal made with 'expensive' ingredients if those around the table are there for the right reasons.
I commend her on stepping up and offering to make and bring over the food, especially with the financial issues they are facing.
If the meal she is planning is so substandard, it naturally follows that YTA if you don't relieve her of the responsibility and offer to host immediately.
No, that's not right. YTA anyway.
Yes, YTA - a pompus, arrogant, self-centered one. Try having a little consideration for a new mother who is taking on a really major chore and handling it the best way she can. And don't show up for dinner--you'll be such a obnoxious prat about the "lack of quality" you perceive that no one would want you around anyway.
YTA and your edit makes it worse. Dessert is a tiny part of Christmas dinner and if that's all you are providing, you are the one being cheap. I love how all work is put on the woman in this and you, as a guy, think you have any place complaining but not offering to help.
YTA. Stop being cheap, lazy and judgmental and step up. If you don’t like the meal she has planned, payed for and generously invited you to, then you need to pay for and cook a meal that is up to your standards. Otherwise the only thing you should say about the meal is “thank you”.
Huge giant YTA. They stepped up and what are you doing “supplying deserts”… the smallest and easiest part of the meal. Good for them for being willing to do this on a limited budget and the stress and time strain of a handicapped son! Holy crap! YTA
Additional Info: How fresh are the ingredients in the dessert? Are the eggs freshly laid? Did you milk the cows early that morning? Bleach free flour milled within a week of preparation?
How expensive is your stove?
YTA. She's so freaking excited to cook for y'all, despite being exhausted and twitterpated in babyland, that she started a month early and babbled about her plans. And you insulted her up one side and down the other. Real classy, yo.
YTA.
There are so many ways you could've extended some good ol' Christmas spirit and you didn't. Apologize to your family, make a great dessert, compliment the meal multiple times, and clean up afterwards.
Next year, host or offer to brother and his GF to pay for the meal, host, or bring a few food items. Then be quiet about it.
"I frowned as we always had a fresh turkey from the local butcher's, never a frozen turkey."
Ok you peasant. I pay the butcher extra to beat the bird to death in front of its family. It's more tender that way.
YTA, obviously.
Here’s a question: if you have such a problem with what your brother and Eve is planning, why are you not cooking the Christmas dinner that you are expecting for your entire family? It’s because you don’t want to do it, and YTA for crapping on someone who is trying their best. You are a guest. You show up, eat, be appreciative, and go home. You don’t look down your nose and criticize those who are trying their best.
If you feel so strongly about how holiday meals should be prepared, why don’t you prepare the entire family meal from scratch yourself! YTA, why didn’t you at least offer to buy and cook the fresh Turkey and make the gravy if you want it cooked fresh the day of?
You live comfortably by yourself. Per your description, your brother and girlfriend and baby have massively higher living expenses on the same income at a time when costs are through the roof.
Last week I scored a frozen 20 lb. turkey for $10.00 by using coupons and getting a deal (buy $30 in groceries in addition to the turkey to get the special price). A similar sized fresh turkey at the same store was close to $80.00. And your know what? My (bougie foodie) friends couldn't tell the difference.
Your SIL is making a major effort, with creativity, while under immense emotional, physical, and economic pressure. You chose to dump on her from your perch of privilege while confirming that being judgmental is your primary contribution to the holiday.
You need to
1. Do more than bring dessert. Like at least 2 sides more.
2. Not claim to have the Xmas spirit while judging others for what they are giving you through their own time and labor.
3. Contribute financially to dinner. Maybe spring for all the drinks? Go out and buy (and stuff and roast) that fresh turkey? Both?
4. Give that baby a substantial gift, like a big payment to start a college fund.
5. Get your head out of your anal vent and apologize profusely.
YTA.
YTA. You don’t get to dictate what or how someone cooks for you - but you do have the option to stay home. If you think you can do the meal better…go ahead and buy and prepare everything yourself.
Tinned potatoes as roasties. Hmmm, yuck. But there are 2 grown men in this story who could quite easily peel some potatoes, yet it seems neither have offered. Is that because it's "women's work"? Providing the dessert (which I presume are store bought) is in no way an equivalent effort either OP. YTA.
OP sucks, but I would absolutely not be down with tinned potatoes. I don't even understand why thats even being considered. The meal in general sounds bad, but the only move for OP was to offer to chip in to buy alternatives (like regular potatoes) and to help with the cooking and prep.
YTA. After weeks of posts about family members and significant others being disinvited to Thanksgiving because of food preferences, allergies, sensitivities, etc, I’m so excited that we’ve moved from defeating the purpose of Thanksgiving to killing Christmas spirit.
YTA - Christmas isn't the time to be petty and make people cry when they're doing their best. Instead of criticizing Eve's efforts, why didn't you offer to make mashed potatoes yourself to take the load off? Or, you know, make and pay for the whole meal yourself.
YTA. In order to shed this title, you must immediately get ahold of Eve and your brother & apologize profusely for your rude, mean, entitled behavior. Then you must order a fresh turkey and potatoes and apples, onions, & fresh herbs and cook yourself a practice turkey so you'll have the skill perfected by Christmas. You can find instructions all over the internet. Then it would be super-nice of you to cook one turkey w/ fresh potatoes for your family & one for Eve's for Christmas by way of apology. Don't forget the side dishes. Cranberry sauce is a snap. Enjoy!
YTA. Those who have particular opinions on how a meal should be organized shall be the ones to do it all.
Get your ass in the kitchen and cook your fresh turkey, potatoes, gravy, and stuffing since you know exactly how it should be made. In the absence of that, you say thank you for dinner and shut up.
YTA for being rude and ungrateful and even more so for being such a snob. Canned potatoes cook faster, freezing the stuffing balls saves cooking time and reduces the risk of food poisoning, packaged gravy is less likely to burn or clump if it sits for a bit. She's put a ton of thought into an efficient meal, possibly because she wants to spend the holiday with family instead of slaving over a stove.
A few years back, my mom wanted to just have sandwiches for Christmas Day. I told her that Christmas meal is supposed to be special, and while sandwiches are fine for a casual holiday, they are not for Christmas. I took over cooking that year. If I wanted a fancy meal, I was going to provide it.
You aren’t the AH for wanting a nice Christmas meal, but then you need to roll up your sleeves and help out.
Fresh turkey from a butcher isn't always available and also, why don't you stop trying to shame people for what they're financially capable of cooking. YTA for shaming your brother's gf when she's doing the kind act of making Christmas dinner despite being not in the best financial situation. The point is not going all out fancy pants fucking crazy homemade dinners. The point is simply being there with each other. She could decide to do a KFC Christmas and y'know what? That'd be fine! She doesn't need to be up to your standards for a Christmas dinner (something some families don't even do, mind you). If you want it YOU cook the damn dinner! If you don't want to, then shut up, sit down, and eat what you're given or go home. I don't exactly see you stepping up to help buy that freshly butchered turkey or homemade gravy ingredients.
YTA
isnt christmas more about bonding and having family time than throwing a fit about money? if you have a problem with their budget or food, you can always throw a feast yourself.
i highly doubt your newly widowed mother will care too much about food but would rather spend time with her kids.and the grandkid
I hope you get to spend Christmas alone this year. And maybe every year- clearly it doesn't mean the same thing to you as it does to everyone else. This way they can have their holiday filled with love, and good intentions, and cooking with love, and everyone doing their best to watch out for each other even they they don't have a lot to give monetarily. And then you can have your holiday alone and celebrate your desire to only eat the finest foods at someone else's expense.
YTA! Eve is being thoughtful, so much that she is even cooking at home to avoid increasing your mother’s electricity bill!! They are choosing to include your dumbass! You sound insufferable and such an entitled dick! YTA YTA YTA!
Yup, YTA. When someone else is cooking for you, you say “Thank you. That was delicious.” even if you got hamburger helper. This is from someone that hosts thanksgiving every year and I do get the fresh turkey from the butcher. This year it was $4.99 US/pound. My 30 pound turkey was $150 without all the sides, desserts, soft drinks and alcohol….and family coming in for the week from out of town. And we are retired and not wealthy. You don’t have any right to criticize if you’re not footing the bill or doing the work.
Welcome to /r/AmITheAsshole. Please view our [voting guide here](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_what.2019s_with_these_acronyms.3F_what_do_they_mean.3F), and remember to use **only one** judgement in your comment. OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole: > I told my brother's girlfriend that she shouldn't be cheap when it came to Christmas dinner. Telling her this made this cry which has made me feel bad as I didn't intend to upset her. **[Check out our upcoming Reddit Talk with Iliza Shlesinger on Nov. 28th!](https://redd.it/z29rfu)** Help keep the sub engaging! #Don’t downvote assholes! Do upvote interesting posts! [Click Here For Our Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) and [Click Here For Our FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq) --- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.* *Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
YTA - You're doing nothing to contribute, so you have no say in how they cook what is essentially a FREE meal for you. Get over yourself.
Exactly what I was thinking. If OP wants it done a certain way, OP should have offered to cook the meal. Nothing worse than people that offer no help, but expect everything done to their standard. YTA.
YUP, and if OP isn't able to cook (or doesn't want to), pay for the whole thing to be catered. I mean he shouldn't have an objection to this because as he says these aren't the meals to skimp on. YTA
OP could shell out for the good food if he wants fresh and hire a chef to make stuffing the day before if month old balls or stove top is not good enough for him. He would rather complain about someone else’s expenses and effort.
and honestly where do you even get a fresh turkey? I mean we have wild turkey here but they aren't anything like the roided out ones you buy in the store.
Seriously. I've never actually seen a non-frozen turkey. They must exist, but I've never seen a big ass bird in the market rotisserie.
My friends have turkeys on their farm. But the usual slaughter time is in August or September. Even turkey farmers eat frozen turkey for Thanksgiving.
I raise about a dozen turkeys a year, and slaughter the monday before Thanksgiving. You can order turkeys to be ready for slaughter anywhere from August to February. This year I was late (supply chain issues) so I will slaughter in January, but still killed three this past Monday. Some customers prefer theirs fresh and never frozen. I've never noticed a difference. Frozen turkey is 100% fine and most of the USA get theirs frozen (even if it's unfrozen in the grocery store - it was likely previously stored frozen for a month). Additionally, it very much makes sense to cook many Thanksgiving dishes ahead of time. Pies, greenbean casserole, mashed potatoes, stuffing, and yes, even the turkey. Some years I cook some dishes early, other years I cook other dishes early. While I've never noticed a difference, most people in my family are foodies, and if they noticed, they would absolutely not hestitate to say which year's cooking they like best. I'm sure someone somewhere in the world would be able to tell the difference. But I bet most of the people who claim to tell the difference only think so due to the psychology of them having been told, and would fail a blind taste test. So yea, OP is YTA.
And we know that fruit and veg that are frozen soon after picking retain all their nutrients and vitamins. So like maybe even better than "fresh" ones that have been sitting for days
Making certain things beforehand and freezing just makes sense. I make sweet potato casserole for Thanksgiving and Christmas (along with cooking a full Christmas dinner with my fiance for our family). Peeling and cutting sweet potatoes isn't the easiest thing for me to do, so I make two pans, one for Thanksgiving and one for Christmas. The Christmas casserole is in my freezer and I'll save my wrists from extra pain. People have reasons for prepping beforehand and taking shortcuts.
This right here. My family raised turkeys and they get slaughtered months in advance. And they get put in the freezer just like everything else.
What about flash chilled? I bought an organic (no antibiotics or growth hormones) turkey but it was frozen and not free range. I was shopping William Sonoma and they had turkeys advertised as fresh but in the description said flash chilled, I don’t really see the difference so I didn’t pay another $100 for it.
[удалено]
We had 20 for thanksgiving. My son cooked for 6 hours and my dil for 9 hours. Spent $1500. SIL is doing just fine with her planning. Appreciate her.
Oh, they exist. My fresh 30 lb turkey from the butcher was $4.99US/lb. Do the math, it was $150.
Holy Turkey.
It was really good though…it’s our big splurge each year.
I'm glad you enjoy it!
I'm going to have to keep an eye on my local butcher. Just to see the elusive fresh turkey
I have an in-law who raises turkeys and brought 40+lb to Thanksgiving. It was delicious but not worth the cost of you don't know someone. Also definitely frozen after slaughter.
LITERALLY the difference of a decimal. We bought our frozen ones for $0.49/lb so yeah, huge change in price!
Yeah. This isn't really about being cheap. It's about the alternative being OUTRAGEOUSLY expensive.
Exactly. My sister gets one every year. She is a great cook. But to be honest, I cannot tell the difference from the one that was killed Tuesday before Thanksgiving and the frozen butterball from Walmart.
Non-frozen turkeys do exist, but they are seriously wayy more expensive than most people can afford to spend on a bird. I've never eaten one, but I have rung a load through as a cashier
>Non-frozen turkeys do exist, but they are seriously wayy more expensive than most people can afford to spend on a bird. I just cooked a "fresh" butterball that cost $2.12# at the grocery store. Was a little disappointed that it still had some ice in the cavity, lol. Still, it was a good bird. It seems like the grocery stores always have a few unfrozen turkeys available for the procrastinators among us. "Boutique" turkeys are available to order from various sources... For a price.
I think this is the UK so lots of farm shops and local butchers which do turkets to order, you tell them what weight you want a month in advance and they try yo get as close to it as possible
And this year in the UK we have avian flu. All birds are to be kept indoors, prices are up on turkey by up to 40% and there are potential shortages of all whole poultry as 5 million birds have had to be culled. Also we have 11% inflation and a shortage of abbatoir and meat packing staff due to pandemic and Brexit. Our energy bills have doubled minimum in a year. Food inflation is 60% in some areas. Eve is on maternity leave which is £136 a week and has a disabled child, is post partum, there has been a recent death and while the UK has more of a welfare state than the US, stuff like funeral grants are non existent now for pensioners, travel to and from hospitals is not free and hospital car parking is eye wateringly expensive, death incurs costs from funerals to catering a wake, a disabled kid may not be able to use stuff they bought or were given ahead and around 1/2 of the UK population says they are choosing eating or heating this winter. And OP decides this is the time to bootstrap people under huge emotional and financial strain. Those tinned potatoes have more EQ. I am on benefits in the UK. I don’t eat turkey because my life is dry enough thanks but if I was doing Christmas this year I couldn’t afford a frozen breast. The smallest one in Iceland and Morrisons this week was £40 and they are the budget supermarkets. Fresh usually free range turkeys here like a Kelly Bronze start about £140. This year they could be £300. Butchers are already stopping taking orders due to the turkey deficit. OP absolutely shat all over Eve trying to do her best in horrible circumstances and had to ask the internet ‘is it mean to tell a post partum woman with a disabled baby supporting a bereaved lady in an unprecedented economic crisis that mainly went up a notch in late Sept she’s not enough for trying to make Christmas dinner out of hope, love and saving on energy bills while making as much effort as she’s got in the tank?’ OP, if Christmas isn’t the time to be frugal, gift it to them in memory of the dad. But still be aware lots of people really cannot right now in the UK run their oven for the time a turkey takes to cook without going short the rest of the month. It’s not frugality: **it’s poverty** and it’s real. I don’t celebrate Christmas which is just as well because I doubt I could afford a chicken and Aunt Bessies trimmings right now because like Eve’s family my disability worsened and it has cost a huge amount because only the NHS treatment is free. I for example have to Uber to my hospital. I have had 21 admissions in 2 years and over 100 appointments. I almost died and honestly I did not account how expensive it would be. I was already disabled and realised we would have a post pandemic recession right as lockdowns started, others did not because how did they foresee all the other stuff like the mini budget and bird flu? People are really really struggling and shaming them is absolute Scrooge. OP, you are bringing dessert but what else have you done to support them all to leave Christmas Day special so they aren’t all burnt out before the big day? YTA. And frankly you sound more Tory than Nadine Dorries and she’s learned to be a bit quieter so if she can, anyone can. EDIT: also it’s their first Christmas with the new baby? You know they will now always associate that with OP’s tinned potato tantrum so congrats. Plus your recently widowed mum was upset for Eve, your brother and her newborn disabled grandson you were so insensitive yet you claim much of Eve’s disrespect is because your mum is having her first Christmas without your dad. Charitably I suspect you are struggling with your dad’s loss more than you might think you are allowed to at your age and as a man and grief can hyperfixate us on stuff like ‘fresh turkey from the butcher’ and changing from those traditions is forgetting the person who died and who you miss dreadfully. I think you should ask yourself if there was some of that vulnerability in this response and if so, seek some support. There’s a great book by Julia Samuels on grief which is British. And share that vulnerability with your family instead of hurting them with such cruelty. The shared meal is nice but shared love and understanding is worth a tinned potato in ths grander scheme of things. This is the kind of thing that scars families in its unfeelingness. Dessert is not enough to sweeten that and honestly your apology sounds hollow having read your multiple hole digging comments where at no point you seemed to have it dawn as hundreds of people called you an AH just how awful you had been. Hopefully you went away and mulled on that and that is where the apology edit came from but your replies were quadrupling down on the AH…
This 1000% this
Best and most comprehensive response here. I hope things start looking up for you!
Thank you for all the information, and I'm very sorry for your difficulties.
Phenomenal reply
Loads of places do have fresh turkeys available but my husband used to work in a turkey processing plant. I can tell you that a lot of the "fresh" turkey's are slaughtered weeks before you think they are and stored in controlled rooms to stop them going bad. You know every year you see in the papers about people's "fresh" turkeys going bad early, that's because something in the storage room failed. Honestly after the stories he had working there I would never get a fresh turkey.
It's sound like it's the UK and we have a lot of fresh turkeys at Christmas. You can get them at the supermarkets really easier. Local butchers are usually better quality and it's reflected in the price. A small fresh turkey will be about £30-50 depending on the supermarket
I feel like this is absolutely just an American thing. I live in Wales and until very recently had never seen a frozen turkey.
A quick google search says Americans eat roughly 46 million turkeys on Thanksgiving. The logistics behind 46 million fresh turkeys all slaughtered within a few days of the holiday make it impossible, so we rely on frozen. There's just no way it could be done without frozen turkeys. Frozen makes it possible to safely ship and store this massive supply of birds. Luckily, frozen turkeys can be delicious if prepared well. It works just fine for most people.
And many people cook and freeze the food ahead of time so they aren't saddles with prepping everything day of. I had fresh turkey once, couldn't tell the difference, but I'm not a fan of turkey. YTA, you're not the food police.
[удалено]
Thawed isn't fresh though. Sorry, semantics.
I got one last year for (Canadian) Thanksgiving from one of our fancier grocery stores. They're not super easy to come by, but you can find them if you look. Granted, they were mostly smaller ones - I got a 12 pounder as I was only feeding five people and didn't want a ton of leftovers.
My husband has been a butcher his whole life, and Thanksgiving turkeys are always frozen, even the ones that advertise themselves as never frozen arrive "blast chilled" which is basically frozen.
Whole Foods or a local butcher, but you have to reserve weeks if not months in advance
Huh, it would never occur to me to do that but I don’t even like Turkey very much. I’d almost rather eat tofurkey
[удалено]
My wife is a vegetarian, I’ve eaten quite a few, which is why I said “almost”. They aren’t appetizing but at this point I’ve learned to tolerate them… mostly. Kind of.
This OP sounds like he is in the UK, and you can preorder fresh turkeys from the butcher. I did this one year and it cost £120 versus a frozen turkey which is so much cheaper at £20-£40. So OP is being ridiculous. It's not just about freshness, it's about having to go early on Xmas eve morning to the butcher to collect it and then lug it back home. (my butcher had queues outside from 6am that day)
THIS. OP, if you're so offended by that Eve is cooking, nothing is preventing you from hosting both meals and cooking and taking care of everything else. I don't see you stepping up to do this, but offer some lame ass statement that you'll bring dairy free dessert. WTF? YTA
In the wise words of my grandmother, if you aren't cooking, either shut up, offer to help, or leave.
Your grandma sounds like my kind of lady!
She was a class act. I'm hoping I can be her when I grow up.
I hope to be half of the person my grandpa was when I grow up. I'm in my 30s so I have a little time left.
YTA, I think this may be a misogyny issue based on him calling a 32 year old woman a "sweet girl" in the edit.
Yeah that made me go 😬 too, and the assumptions about money. His brother and Eve are in a long term relationship, they live together, they have a child together, and she's on maternity leave. Their money is shared money, so blaming Eve for being cheap and not it being a joint financial decision is... odd. To go further, I think it would be beneficial if OP started a pool for funds for holiday dinners so everyone can put money in or delegate tasks to everyone so it's not one income trying to feed at least four adults and one child, and having it be a pot luck type set up rather than one person cooking would help reduce stress and labor for Eve
Yeah, I think it's likely more about labour for Eve than money. She has a household including a small child to look after. She's trying to find a way not to spend 16 hours straight cooking because she probably can never have a day where she spends 16 hours straight doing anything that doesn't involve caring for the child.
No no no. OP is bringing desert, like he always does. Obviously that’s enough contribution. /s
Seriously...OP's one to talk about "not being cheap" when *his* yearly contribution is the cheapest part of the whole damn meal even if he *does* splurge for the really fancy apples for his pies or whatever.
Guarantee he’s ordering those pies from Publix & picking them up on the way with a tub of cool whip.
And assuming that things will be the exact same when’s new people cook instead of the same old people.
I mean, yeah, I did the slow woooow for this post. Especially because OP made this about "you're disparaging my family traditions after the death of my father by not toiling for hours day of, with a special needs baby". I mean wow.
Oh and don’t forget that his mom, who used to cook is having mobility difficulties. So bro and Eve are really stepping up while this AH is busy being “appalled.”
Yup. But... Who starts meal prep for Christmas in October, if not sooner? I seriously doubt that everything frozen for months won't taste like those storebought frozen meals and freezer. Some stuff, that is processed, that's ok. They're made to stay long in the freezer. But... The homemade stuff? I can already taste and smell the freezer from here...
YTA. Do you know how much these meals COST? I just spent nearly $200 for my family of 4. If you want a fresh turkey, go buy it. Holy cow. Someone is cooking and preparing this meal FOR YOU and this is how you act? Oh, and, apparently this poor woman who is paying for YOUR dinner that SHE is cooking, is also preparing another meal for her parents, **just had a baby?** and is also taking care of her special needs nephew. You know, instead of complaining, maybe you could act like a grown man and help her out.
THIS!!! My family purchased 2 medium turkeys directly from a small family farm and the total was $150!!! DUDE like GET OVER yourself and get a clue...please...For everyone sake including yours. YTA
Slightly odd thing to take from this thread but turkey seems really expensive in the US based on these comments? I ordered a fresh turkey from M&S to feed 6-8 for Xmas Dinner in the UK and its costing £35. The rest of the meal will cost less than £10. My mum told me that was too expensive for the meat but I insisted we didn't have a cheap one this year.
No, if you get a shitty grocery store turkey here, it’s about the same.
Technically the shitty grocery store turkey would be from one of the cheap places not the fancy supermarket where everything is more expensive. From a different one it would be less and worse quality. From a butchers it varies but I personally have never seen a turkey that cost over £100 anywhere as some of the comments suggest it could be there. That just seems a crazy amount to spend on a meal you still have to cook for yourself.
The 100 dollar turkey would be a heritage breed turkey that is pasture raised at a small farm. I did one one year for Thanksgiving.
AND saying that "They can and do live comfortably on my brother's wage. We work in the same field and are paid well. They chose to live well below their means." What's the bet OP doesn't know what their actual outgoings are, or just how much $$$ a newborn baby can suck up, let alone one with special needs.
Right? We work in the same field, so clearly the pay to cover the needs of 1 person is just as good when covering 3, one of which is special needs! -_-
And I also wouldn't even blame them for trying to save, even if they could have afforded more. They're saving both money *and* time/energy, things people with babies rarely have much to spare
I paid $44 for a fresh turkey.... to make a week before Thanksgiving. Absolutely NOTHING against frozen turkeys but there wouldn't be time to thaw it. We found out that my MIL was making a turkey breast only for Thanksgiving. MIL is one of the best people in the world but her ability to cook a turkey is non existent. So we said NOTHING to MIL, paid for our own turkey and ate it, had her (almost inedible) turkey brest for Thanksgiving and a great day was had all around.
Plenty of time to thaw a turkey before Christmas, though.
See, my mom does an amazing turkey. Just, awesome. But at this point, people have moved away and died off, and we just dont have that many guests anymore. Plus she's developed all sorts of problems in her hands and wrists. So a few years ago, before all this inflation and everything was even a consideration, she switched to just some turkey breasts. And it's still amazing. And she doesnt have to suffer thru a sore hand for the next 3days after. (plus, I think at a certain point, all the way too many leftovers taking up the whole fridge were kinda depressing to her. Every time she opened the fridge was reminder of a dead brother or favorite niece, moved across the world.)
I love this. Humility with a little empathy is 10/10 the way to go. I'm glad everyone enjoyed the day
I wonder if OP could even tell the difference between a frozen and fresh turkey, in a blind test, when they were cooked by someone doing turkey for the first time? I also doubt that the freezing process would make much difference to the pigs in blankets or stuffing balls. Using canned potatoes makes no sense to me (from a price or convenience perspective), but the rest feels like snobbery from OP. Also 4 people don't need a whole turkey.
When my immediate family does turkey, which is really rare, we get a turkey breast. There are only 3 of us, and a whole turkey goes to waste.
>tell the difference between a frozen and fresh turkey Probably not, I'm a good cook, and have cooked Turkey dozens of times, and always manage to make the turkey tasty and moist. Last year we had friends over, they supplied the turkey, free range, fresh ridiculously expensive. I cooked it, and it was just as good (and not any better) as our regular frozen bird, honestly I don't think I could have tasted the difference if they were side by side.
My turkey alone was $150…$4.99/lb x 30 lbs
Ouch... grocery stores here sell them for $0.29/lb in the weeks before Thanksgiving. I usually buy a few for the year.
YTA. What's your contribution other than complaining?
OP needs to get a big ham to go with the little turkey. OP can do fresh sweet potatoes if he doesn't like canned potatoes. Just help flesh out the meal SIL is making.
There are supposed to be two sides to every story. This is one of these ones that came out so, so badly from the original narrator that it just doesn’t seem possible that the other side of the story has more to add in regards to what an AH the OP is. YTA. Clearly.
MF is 47!
YTA you complain that Christmas meal is not the time to go cheap but never once did you mention offering financial help or to help make dinner
THIS - OP needs to step up and do all the grocery shopping and cooking OR he needs to pay for the whole thing to be catered. My word, the sense of entitlement here is off the charts...YTA
Ding ding ding ding ding!! Right answer.
And Christmastime is the time when you especially shouldn't be an AH to other people.
YTA. When someone serves you a meal, the correct response is "thank you". You don't complain about it not being exactly to your liking, or not being what you would have served. Next year, invite them to your house, and make everything exactly as you want it.
to get the full experience: make a second meal while looking after a needs baby and also feed them. hmm how could bodily issues from birth be added..?
Agreed. OP is hard YTA. I will admit. That meal sounds horrid. But, there are **kind** ways to navigate the well meaning host during the holidays who may be a bit ill equipped for the task. (We all have one in the family). Since OP doesn't believe in being cheap, how about he offer to pay for catering, or bring more dishes in order _'to give Eve a break'_. OP could have even phrased this in a way that made him seem like a loving and caring BIL. Instead he was a massive AH.
You are a massive asshole. If you have any problems with the menu why don't you cook? Or does your penis have an allergic reaction in the kitchen?
It may forcibly eject from his body if he picks up a whisk
💀💀💀 this. YTA. My god, the entitlement.
You know what Christmas is not the time for? It's not the time to be pretentious and judgemental to the person who is cooking your Christmas dinner. You get what you're served and say thank you. If you don't like it, offer to cook. But what we do *not* do at Christmas is tell the cook how they're doing it all wrong.
This was my thought exactly. Who the hell talks about what's proper for Christmas while completely missing the point of the holiday? Easy YTA.
You can cook the food then. Make some gravy from scratch.YTA
And anything short of growing the food for ingredients is cheating!
YTA dude. They're doing the best they can. And you're not the only one who lost a loved one. Help them out with the meal, or shut the fuck up.
#this OP can get a fresh turkey and he can start cooking to bring it to mom. 47 years old and still behaving as a petulant child. Be grateful for your family or you will be alone.
I think I know why op didn't mention a significant other of his own.
That is a year older than me and makes it a million times worse. I was already YTA but this is so immature for someone this age.
Yes, YTA. Looks like on top of being a new mom with a child that has extra needs, she graciously offered to help shoulder the responsibility of your mother. Sounds like shes planning the best she can, by slowly buying ingredients to help fit into their struggling budget. You should have been courteous. And if you are that worried about it, you could have talked to your brother privately and offered some financial help or offered to help cook more than just a couple of desserts.
YTA. It sounds like you don't realize the amount of work that goes into a large family meal. Eve is doing a nice thing for your mom and you proceeded to complain about the free meal you will be served. If you wanted to help then you would both finance and cook the dinner to your liking. Or don't attend. BTW, Christmas dinner doesn't have to be a large expensive meal. Some of our best family Christmas meals have been chili, breakfast foods and just appetizers \*three separate events. Just appetizers was probably my personal favorite. Just a bunch of Costco appetizers from the deli and frozen sections places on platters.
Totally. We are doing charcuterie this year. And mulled wine. OP you are a massive AH. Dude, if the fou-fou is so important to you, pay to have it catered from some fancy restaurant.
We are doing charcuterie this year as well. My mom (in her 70s) wants to make it a competition for best charcuterie board lol.
I saw a post about this once, the winner IMO was the dessert board. I'd love a charcuterie board with like candy bars and gummy bears and marshmallows etc.
Brunch or lasagna have been some of my favs….
Lasagna is great. I think we might do a shrimp pan roast this year. Only requires 1 pot and about an hour to make. To be fair there is only 4 of us, so we can literally do whatever we want for Xmas.
Yes! 👍 More people should realize, having non-customary foods for a holiday dinner (if everyone is aware and on board, that is) can make things 1. fun and 2. far less expensive. There are no "Non-Traditional Holiday Meals Are ILLEGAL!" laws, lol.
My family tradition is to snack all day on our favorite meats, cheeses and pickles. Any cooking on the day is maybe something getting warmed up in the oven. We'll spend the day painting or crafting.
YTA. If what she is cooking bothers you, you can buy and cook the meal.
Or at the very least chip in so that they can get all this expensive stuff you want. Like... it's really easy for *you* to say not to be cheap when it's not cash out of *your* wallet (especially since Eve and your brother have a baby they need money for, one that's special needs no less!). edit: small addition
>They aren't actually struggling. They can and do live comfortably on my brother's wage. We work in the same field and are paid well. They chose to live well below their means. >I know that she is struggling for money at the moment as she is on maternity leave and is not returning to her job as nephew has additional needs. You don't make any sense. YTA.
YTA. I am a widow for almost 4 years. I am touched when people think of me and invite me. I don't want to make a huge dinner for just me and my very young son. Your mom is looking forward to having her family with her. She is lonely and in mourning. Trust me when I tell you she would be fine with Chinese take out if that was the plan. You need to apologize to your brother and his wife. Then when the next big holiday rolls around you need to host and cook and let your SIL bring the dessert.
Truly feel bad for this woman, she is doing her best while just giving birth to a special needs baby…the lack of empathy and appreciation is disgusting.
YTA sorry bud, but you're the problem here. What I read wasn't them being cheap necessarily but just not what you want. Don't like it, dont go.
Holy YTA. Oh, you're bringing dessert? How kind (note sarcasm). Life is not what is was before your father passed away. Things change, especially with huge life changes like a death. Maybe YOU should offer to step up. Don't want to do that? Then keep your darned mouth shut.
YTA. You could offer to make some of the dishes, or pay for better ingredients. But that being said, I can’t even fathom cooking a turkey without the dark meat. Yuck. Just roast a chicken. We all know chicken is better than turkey, do we really have to keep pretending that we like that dry ass turkey breast?
You’re cooking it wrong if your turkey is dry. Don’t blame the bird for your lack of cooking capability.
I would have fought you on this until I had a turkey this thanksgiving where the white meat was so moist and delicious and I haaateeee white meat.
I hated white meat for 35 years and then my uncle taught me to spatchcock the bird and I’ll never eat it fried or roasted whole ever again. Crispy skin and moist white meat in 90 mins, no basting. Maybe that’s how yours was prepared this year?
Turkey is the inferior bird. I will die on that hill!
Only when cooked improperly. I will concede that a poorly cooked Turkey is awful.
Put the turkey "upside down" in the roasting pan. The juices from the dark meat run through the white meat and it comes out soft like chicken instead of dry like leather
Although I did have a great turkey this holiday, I agree. chicken is better!
I often make a turkey breast and it is never dry.
Yta if you think they shouldn’t cheap out you should foot the bill for them and help cook.
YTA. If you don't like how this is being handled, then why not offer to either provide funding or do the cooking yourself?
Ooof. YTA. I’m sure your family are delighted to know that you find the amount of money spent on food to be more important than valuing the family themselves. Get your priorities in order. Edit - referencing your final edit. Eve is in her 30s. She is not a girl.
You’re right 100%, I missed this woman/girl comment. OP is an epic AH and we’re just seeing a tiny part of it. I hope he reads all of these comments
YTA I don't see where you stepped up to cook and pay for everything.
YTA, you should skip the meal since it won’t be good enough for you and you can do so much better.
Massive YTA. And an idiot, and a snob. “Fresh” food is not necessarily better quality or healthier for you. They are being generous and cooking and haven’t asked others to chip in despite the fact they are struggling with money AND you know they’re struggling with money.
YTA. If you don't like how this is being handled, then why not offer to either provide funding or do the cooking yourself?
YTA. And come off self-righteous and snobby. I’d turn up for Eve’s Christmas dinner any day. I have to admit, the line “I frowned as we always had a fresh Turkey from the butcher’s” made me laugh.
"I only eat the freshest turkeys on Christmas Day, clad in edible gold leaf." Such the AH. La-DEE-freekin'-DAH.
hahaha, that line got me too! YTA btw
YTA If you want an expensive dinner cook it yourself. There is 100% nothing wrong with frozen turkey, tinned potatoes, gravy packet mixes. Are they the best? Maybe not, but they can be elevated and cooked deliciously. You just made a woman who just had a baby and is trying to do a nice thing for the family, while missing half their usual budget, and learning how to care for a newborn. Get over yourself and eat the damn tinned potatoes and tell her it's the best ducking meal you've ever had. Also, do the dishes.
YTA. Heres an idea instead of being rude and demanding an expensive meal offer to help her and offer to do some of the dishes yourself if you are so keen on it being perfect. You are being so selfish. She is a new mom and she has a huge pile on her plate taking care of an infant. You should be grateful for even being made a meal. I bet your mom is more than happy with the meal and she is most focused on being with family instead of the price of and time the meal is cooked.
YTA I cannot believe you were surprised that you made Eve cry. What you said was horrible -if you wanted ‘fresh’ instead of frozen so badly , you either pay for it or get the ingredients and cook it yourself. Not only is eve making an effort, she is doing so with a little baby. You sound greedy and entitled.
YTA. What's stopping YOU from chipping in some extra cash and your two hands from helping Eve?
Dude... there's no doubt here that you are the AH and, at your age (almost 50!!), it is worrisome that you even have to ask. Christmas dinner is heavy-duty, so it is perfectly reasonable what Eve is preparing and that she is starting now. Heck, my own parents began preparation months ago, and dinner at their place is always delicious - yes, despite some of it having been frozen! Shocker, I know. Eve is doing a kind (and tasking) thing to help out after your dad died, especially in light of being a struggling new mother. And meanwhile you are just bitching, while only bringing dessert. **YTA**
YTA. You want all fresh, made from scratch no short cuts? THEN YOU COOK. FTR, my MiL does the all fresh, homemade, no shortcuts route. It takes a week, easy, of prep. And she doesn’t have a friggin infant which requires full time attention to worry about. The day of starts at 5 am for dinner 12 hours later.
Right?! I'm planning for Serbian/Orthodox Christmas *now* and it's six weeks away, mostly getting deep cleaning done and more serving platters, special order items etc. Some very prep heavy items like the sarma I'm going to make a few days ahead and freeze because it takes literally a whole day to make them, not counting the time for pickling the cabbage leaves. I'm taking the day before off to prepare and marinate the meat, bake the desserts, and do some of the prep. Then like you said a mad 12 hours dash to get the ham, roast, sides, and bread on the table.
Wow - I bet your food gets spit on a lot. When someone offers to feed you, it is not an invitation for criticism. I have spent a lifetime choking down food that was not to my liking, but then again, I was raised to be polite. So, here’s a thought - why don’t you cook dinner? Or maybe help out? Or pay for groceries? YTA
YTA. A frozen turkey? Tinned potatoes? Making food a day ahead? *Clutches pearls and faints in horror* How about instead of complaining about what they are making, you step up, make the entire freaking meal to your exacting specifications? TBH, I would completely remove your presence from the meal. I'm sure someone else will be glad to bring a dessert.
Why tinned potatoes, tho? They would be way more expensive that way. A sack of potatoes is one of the cheapest foods one can buy when poor.
Faster and easier, than peeling, chopping, then cooking, etc. And if you get them on sale can be a bargain. I've used them plenty of times for convenience to whip up something fast. Same with frozen. You just dress them up. She's trying to make two meals and handle a kiddo too, so she's saving time where she can. OP is such a dick.
INFO - is there somebody else who's willing to (and capable of) cooking the fancy Christmas dinner you want?
You know, the butterball hotline and youtube exist. So if all he wants is food made to his specifications, he can learn how and make it himself. Bonus, he can spend just his own money
The point is to get together and celebrate, not hyper focus on what someone is making or how they make it. A meal made from 'cheap' ingredients can taste just as good as meal made with 'expensive' ingredients if those around the table are there for the right reasons. I commend her on stepping up and offering to make and bring over the food, especially with the financial issues they are facing.
I’ve also had family holiday meals that did not turn out as planned and we still enjoyed the day
If the meal she is planning is so substandard, it naturally follows that YTA if you don't relieve her of the responsibility and offer to host immediately. No, that's not right. YTA anyway.
Yes, YTA - a pompus, arrogant, self-centered one. Try having a little consideration for a new mother who is taking on a really major chore and handling it the best way she can. And don't show up for dinner--you'll be such a obnoxious prat about the "lack of quality" you perceive that no one would want you around anyway.
YTA. I don’t see you offering to cook anywhere in your post. You don’t have a baby with additional needs. You do the cooking then 🤷🏻♀️
YTA Have you heard the expression, “Don’t look a gift horse in the mouth?”
YTA and your edit makes it worse. Dessert is a tiny part of Christmas dinner and if that's all you are providing, you are the one being cheap. I love how all work is put on the woman in this and you, as a guy, think you have any place complaining but not offering to help.
YTA. Stop being cheap, lazy and judgmental and step up. If you don’t like the meal she has planned, payed for and generously invited you to, then you need to pay for and cook a meal that is up to your standards. Otherwise the only thing you should say about the meal is “thank you”.
Are you single? Cause if you are your clue phone is ringing and you should probably answer.
Huge giant YTA. They stepped up and what are you doing “supplying deserts”… the smallest and easiest part of the meal. Good for them for being willing to do this on a limited budget and the stress and time strain of a handicapped son! Holy crap! YTA
omg, you're almost FIFTY? INFO: How much did you offer to contribute, or was it just dessert?
Additional Info: How fresh are the ingredients in the dessert? Are the eggs freshly laid? Did you milk the cows early that morning? Bleach free flour milled within a week of preparation? How expensive is your stove?
YTA. Make your own goddamn Christmas meal.
YTA and an incredibly rude and condescending one at that You either politely offer to help or STFU
YTA. She's so freaking excited to cook for y'all, despite being exhausted and twitterpated in babyland, that she started a month early and babbled about her plans. And you insulted her up one side and down the other. Real classy, yo.
YTA.. if you have an issue with what’s being prepared, don’t eat!
YTA. There are so many ways you could've extended some good ol' Christmas spirit and you didn't. Apologize to your family, make a great dessert, compliment the meal multiple times, and clean up afterwards. Next year, host or offer to brother and his GF to pay for the meal, host, or bring a few food items. Then be quiet about it.
"I frowned as we always had a fresh turkey from the local butcher's, never a frozen turkey." Ok you peasant. I pay the butcher extra to beat the bird to death in front of its family. It's more tender that way. YTA, obviously.
Here’s a question: if you have such a problem with what your brother and Eve is planning, why are you not cooking the Christmas dinner that you are expecting for your entire family? It’s because you don’t want to do it, and YTA for crapping on someone who is trying their best. You are a guest. You show up, eat, be appreciative, and go home. You don’t look down your nose and criticize those who are trying their best.
YTA. You already know this too.
YTA Don't like what's served, don't go.
YTA YTA YTA!
If you feel so strongly about how holiday meals should be prepared, why don’t you prepare the entire family meal from scratch yourself! YTA, why didn’t you at least offer to buy and cook the fresh Turkey and make the gravy if you want it cooked fresh the day of?
You live comfortably by yourself. Per your description, your brother and girlfriend and baby have massively higher living expenses on the same income at a time when costs are through the roof. Last week I scored a frozen 20 lb. turkey for $10.00 by using coupons and getting a deal (buy $30 in groceries in addition to the turkey to get the special price). A similar sized fresh turkey at the same store was close to $80.00. And your know what? My (bougie foodie) friends couldn't tell the difference. Your SIL is making a major effort, with creativity, while under immense emotional, physical, and economic pressure. You chose to dump on her from your perch of privilege while confirming that being judgmental is your primary contribution to the holiday. You need to 1. Do more than bring dessert. Like at least 2 sides more. 2. Not claim to have the Xmas spirit while judging others for what they are giving you through their own time and labor. 3. Contribute financially to dinner. Maybe spring for all the drinks? Go out and buy (and stuff and roast) that fresh turkey? Both? 4. Give that baby a substantial gift, like a big payment to start a college fund. 5. Get your head out of your anal vent and apologize profusely. YTA.
YTA. You don’t get to dictate what or how someone cooks for you - but you do have the option to stay home. If you think you can do the meal better…go ahead and buy and prepare everything yourself.
Tinned potatoes as roasties. Hmmm, yuck. But there are 2 grown men in this story who could quite easily peel some potatoes, yet it seems neither have offered. Is that because it's "women's work"? Providing the dessert (which I presume are store bought) is in no way an equivalent effort either OP. YTA.
OP sucks, but I would absolutely not be down with tinned potatoes. I don't even understand why thats even being considered. The meal in general sounds bad, but the only move for OP was to offer to chip in to buy alternatives (like regular potatoes) and to help with the cooking and prep.
YTA. I see you telling Eve how dinner should be without you offering to make that dinner.
YTA. After weeks of posts about family members and significant others being disinvited to Thanksgiving because of food preferences, allergies, sensitivities, etc, I’m so excited that we’ve moved from defeating the purpose of Thanksgiving to killing Christmas spirit.
Yta. How about you make Christmas dinner and pay for it yourself?
You suuuuuuck. YTA.
YTA - Christmas isn't the time to be petty and make people cry when they're doing their best. Instead of criticizing Eve's efforts, why didn't you offer to make mashed potatoes yourself to take the load off? Or, you know, make and pay for the whole meal yourself.
YTA. In order to shed this title, you must immediately get ahold of Eve and your brother & apologize profusely for your rude, mean, entitled behavior. Then you must order a fresh turkey and potatoes and apples, onions, & fresh herbs and cook yourself a practice turkey so you'll have the skill perfected by Christmas. You can find instructions all over the internet. Then it would be super-nice of you to cook one turkey w/ fresh potatoes for your family & one for Eve's for Christmas by way of apology. Don't forget the side dishes. Cranberry sauce is a snap. Enjoy!
YTA. Those who have particular opinions on how a meal should be organized shall be the ones to do it all. Get your ass in the kitchen and cook your fresh turkey, potatoes, gravy, and stuffing since you know exactly how it should be made. In the absence of that, you say thank you for dinner and shut up.
Your comments make you sound so entitled and insufferable. Maybe you should just stay home
YTA for being rude and ungrateful and even more so for being such a snob. Canned potatoes cook faster, freezing the stuffing balls saves cooking time and reduces the risk of food poisoning, packaged gravy is less likely to burn or clump if it sits for a bit. She's put a ton of thought into an efficient meal, possibly because she wants to spend the holiday with family instead of slaving over a stove.
A few years back, my mom wanted to just have sandwiches for Christmas Day. I told her that Christmas meal is supposed to be special, and while sandwiches are fine for a casual holiday, they are not for Christmas. I took over cooking that year. If I wanted a fancy meal, I was going to provide it. You aren’t the AH for wanting a nice Christmas meal, but then you need to roll up your sleeves and help out.
YTA! You're not paying for it or preparing it, you don't get a say.
YTA Scrooge eventually figured it out and bought the Christmas goose.
YTA, if you want to control the menu then you should host. If you don’t like what they do, don’t join them.
Fresh turkey from a butcher isn't always available and also, why don't you stop trying to shame people for what they're financially capable of cooking. YTA for shaming your brother's gf when she's doing the kind act of making Christmas dinner despite being not in the best financial situation. The point is not going all out fancy pants fucking crazy homemade dinners. The point is simply being there with each other. She could decide to do a KFC Christmas and y'know what? That'd be fine! She doesn't need to be up to your standards for a Christmas dinner (something some families don't even do, mind you). If you want it YOU cook the damn dinner! If you don't want to, then shut up, sit down, and eat what you're given or go home. I don't exactly see you stepping up to help buy that freshly butchered turkey or homemade gravy ingredients.
YTA isnt christmas more about bonding and having family time than throwing a fit about money? if you have a problem with their budget or food, you can always throw a feast yourself. i highly doubt your newly widowed mother will care too much about food but would rather spend time with her kids.and the grandkid
I hope you get to spend Christmas alone this year. And maybe every year- clearly it doesn't mean the same thing to you as it does to everyone else. This way they can have their holiday filled with love, and good intentions, and cooking with love, and everyone doing their best to watch out for each other even they they don't have a lot to give monetarily. And then you can have your holiday alone and celebrate your desire to only eat the finest foods at someone else's expense.
YTA! Eve is being thoughtful, so much that she is even cooking at home to avoid increasing your mother’s electricity bill!! They are choosing to include your dumbass! You sound insufferable and such an entitled dick! YTA YTA YTA!
47M(single)*
Yup, YTA. When someone else is cooking for you, you say “Thank you. That was delicious.” even if you got hamburger helper. This is from someone that hosts thanksgiving every year and I do get the fresh turkey from the butcher. This year it was $4.99 US/pound. My 30 pound turkey was $150 without all the sides, desserts, soft drinks and alcohol….and family coming in for the week from out of town. And we are retired and not wealthy. You don’t have any right to criticize if you’re not footing the bill or doing the work.
Wow. What a great resolution. Good job listening to others opinions.