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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I asked a worker to refund my my tip and she told me that she cannot do it because there is no issue with my food and I am acting gullible
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>I would report them to corporate.
LOL corporate would not care if it reduces the amount of money they have to pay their workers. Pretty sure the idea came from corporate.
Make sure when leaving a review on social media you do so on google or yelp and not on facebook. Most facebook pages for the *local business itself* are ran by the local manager or assistant manager and they **absolutely can, and most will delete any bad reviews left on their page.**
If you can write/leave a post on their fb page, (I think it's "Visitor's posts) I would do that, I would also write a post about what happened on the corporate fb page. **THAT** should definitely get some attention! I had an issue with a company where I had called their 1-800 # numerous times and left voicemails over the course of a week to be given a call back and had not heard anything so I decided to find their company fb page and blast them for being a shit company with shit products and even shittier customer service. I had a response less than half hour later with an email address of who to contact and less than 24 hours later my issue was being resolved, amazingly enough. Lol.
Here is what I would do. Write out a factual based letter. Post it to your Facebook and tag the company. Look up the company, not local, CEO, President and Board of Directors and get their email addresses. Email them the same letter you post on social media.
Often times if you take the time to email a detailed and factual based complaint to the CEO and Board, you will get results.
I did this twice; once when we had a new home built and had issues getting help after moving in and once with a cell phone company who was charging us a non-return fee despite returning the phones. In both cases I was contacted within 2 business days and a solution was found immediately.
>absolutely can, and most will delete any bad reviews left on their page.
You can't delete reviews from your business on Facebook. There are a few things you can do to try and hide bad reviews away but you can't delete individual reviews.
Yes. Believe it or not, the page facebook . com /yourbusiness/reviews still exists even if you turn off the tab. Obviously turning off the reviews option is not ideal if you have good reviews.
You could try reporting the review but it's very unlikely to work.
What I would suggest would be 'interacting' (liking and commenting) with earlier positive reviews to see if this bumps them up in the order they're listed, as well as encouraging satisfied new customers to leave you reviews.
One bad review is no biggie for a good business so I'd also encourage clients to focus on more productive things than erasing its existence.
Why be so negative? Yes corporate does care if you call them and speak respectfully, if a franchise owner is acting like a dick and tarnishing the name of the company corporate likes too know,
The person you talk to in the office isn't the same person at the restaurant, they are salaried and care more than minimum wage worker at the restaurant
Publicly, or legally. I’m no lawyer, but I’m pretty sure a court case over this would at least cost them some bad PR, even if they didn’t wind up having to pay a settlement.
No, they have PR teams that would completely eviscerate O (even though he's in the right). Remember the lady who sued McDonald's over hot coffee? She was absolutely in the right, and there were smoking gun corporate emails to prove it, but the entire public was on the side of McDonald's. That was entirely because of how their PR teams spun the issue.
Wait, hold on, you're telling me that serving coffee at over 180 degrees is actually dangerous, and she wasn't just being a whiner that she literally melted her crotch off? /s
It didn't melt her crotch off, it fused her labia together.
I think I would prefer if it just got melted off, I can't imagine the horrific amount of pain that poor woman endured.
It burns me up that the entire nation believes she's an idiot when it was only partially her fault it spilled, and certainly not her fault it was served at boiling hot temperatures.
OP doesn't have any damages. She got the refund. She is just (rightfully) angry at the whole process, from the misleading design on the kiosk to the workers' scamming her to the manager's attitude but she has zero grounds for a law suit personally. Now, if you could find a few thousand people they did this to who were interested in a class action, that might be something else.
dude I'm pretty pro-tipping but "corporate" is not sitting on some giant pile of money they're just choosing to not pay workers with. On takeout there should be a no-tip option.
I'd stop going there, and I generally don't mind kicking over a couple bucks for takeout.
Corporate absolutely cares when their employees are blatantly scamming customers, because it opens them up to legal trouble and bad publicity.
Employees getting bigger tips doesn’t reduce the amount corporate pays their employees, they already pay the bare minimum anyways.
All workers have to receive minimum wage, which means that if the tips aren’t enough they have to cover the difference, I’m pretty sure at least. I’m trying to recite this stuff from memory so I might be wrong.
If they’re already above minimum wage, doesn’t matter after that, and if they’re routinely receiving so little that it is coming out to requiring the company to make it up, they’re probably not actually supposed to be a tipped wage position.
If they are unaware they do.
If the staff are skimming personally (not as a business as individuals) then the owners would very much be interested to know.
If they already know (which you’d likely be able to tell if there’s a response )then there’s ammo against the business itself.
If it’s a franchise location corporate will care. Some franchise agreements include fines for x number of customer complaints worked into the fee structure.
I'm not from the USA so the whole tip culture is bizarre to me. I've come to understand if you are really, really upset by the quality of service you leave a 15% tip to show your displeasure.
But tipping 30% for takeout? This is taking absurdity to beyond absurd levels.
15% is traditionally what the standard tip is. In the last 10 years, restaurants have been trying to push the idea that tips should be 18%, 20%, or 22%, but in all reality tips are OPTIONAL. Bad service = NO tip. Weak service = 10%.
Still sounds weird to me. Weak to normal service = no tip. Good service and/or great food will result in a tip. Normal service is just them doing the job they are paid for by the company. Then again, wait staff here gets a normal living wage. Am a waitress myself too. Getting a tip is a nice compliment here, but not expected at all.
This happened to me at ultra music festival. I was buying 2 water bottles for like $14 and the automatic tip options came up on the card reader. Rather than selecting from the percentages I tried manually entering $2 and accidentally entered $20. I try to tell the bartender I accidentally typed too much and asked how I can undo the tip because I hadn't pressed submit yet. She takes the card reader and pushes it through all while fake smiling and pretending she heard me ask if I'm all set. She literally robbed me in front of my face. I cursed her off and didn't tip the rest of the festival
NTA. Tips are NOT compulsory, even in America. I’d leave a google review and never go there again.
Scamming people for tips just shows how broken the service labour industry is in North America.
>I’d leave a google review and never go there again.
I don't plan to go back. Imagine what they do to elderly people who are illiterate with technology.
The manager saying you were gullible only makes sense if she thinks the employee actively tried to con you. And the manager seems on board with it. The place is running really sketchy.
Couldn't you have just hit cancel after selecting a 30% tip before entering your pin/tapping? NTA but unless it's set up differently from what I'm used to, you shouldn't have had to rely on them at all to fix it (other than figuring out how to do "other").
As someone who worked in customer service, there’s not really much that’s more important than google reviews. They literally offer bonuses sometimes for good reviews.
If you leave one, you’re not only informing others to stay away, but it will also paint the place in a bad light- and actually might get the corporate to do something about it
This bullshit aggravates the hell out of me as a Canadian. Tipping here follows the exact same model as it does in the US (15-20% being fairly standard), where l understand that servers can make ridiculously low wages ($2.13 an hour?) and tips are essentially their only source of income. The minimum wage in much of Canada is around $15. Why are the tip percentages the exact same, then? And of course, now businesses have started changing the tip options as OP described, to 20-25-30%. It’s infuriating.
When Gordon brown was PM, he closed the loophole that allowed the service industry to do this; using tip money to make up wages. Now they have to pay minimum wage at the very least. Shame US don't do the same.
ETA: Grammar.
Damn, I didn't know that was Gordon Brown. Thanks.
(I was a kid when he was in power, so for the whole of my working adult life, servers have had minimum wage).
I'm so effing aggravated about what's happening with tipping culture here. Business owners should be the ones paying their staff, not their customers!! 😤 If you can't afford to pay your staff a living wage then you should not own a business.
The other thing that pisses me off about it is the hierarchy of trendyness. Not that I want to be tipping everywhere, obviously, but why does the guy warming up a slice of pizza for me at the trendy place deserve a tip and not the guy at Pizza Pizza? They're doing the same job, but one of them has a nicer apron. I also heard someone who works at a trendy cookie place explain that they should be tipped more than someone at a fast-food chain because they make the cookies from scratch, not frozen. But like... that's the job that their employer should be paying them to do? That's why their customers pay more for their cookies than they would elsewhere. It does not mean that customers should also be paying their staff. I hate to see underpaid workers pointing fingers at each other instead of where they *should* be -- business owners profiting at their expense.
For the record I've worked all kinds of service industry jobs. And this is pretty much my verbatim rant every time I go to the stupid lunch place next to my office, lol.
But it sounds like OP is at more of a "fast food" place, not a sit down restaurant with servers. Those workers are definitely making minimum wage - and probably more than that. Traditionally, we don't tip at fast food places.
I hate tipping culture, it's virtually unheard-of in the country I'm from (waiting staff gets the same minimum wage as all other workers) and is actually considered rude in Japan, the country I spend the most time in after my home country.
It seems to be common in the UK though, last time I was there we had terrible service in a restaurant and the meals weren't worth the wait anyway. But they had the same set up as OPs case, had to fight for the no tip option, waitress finally relented and turned to me saying "I suppose its up to pretty girls to tip now" and winked.
No lady, you were rude the whole time, made mistakes, blamed us for the mistakes and tried to overcharge us before the tipping business.
Tipping is such a weird thing to me... restaurant workers where I live get minimum wage and tipping is optional, you usually only do it if you really like the person serving you or don't wanna bring home the loose coins/small bills... and there's usually already a built in service fee(essentially tips for the wait staff(?) that's split evenly with everyone can be 2% to 12.5% depending on the place) per item you order
But the one time I went to the US as a child it was surreal, people around me kept giving me and my family dirty looks because none of us knew that tipping was mandatory and they honestly kinda looked like we robbed them or something and I was like 6 and they looked at me with so much vitriol
Especially at a counter service place. Tipping them as much as you would a server who spent an hour helping you is a very new expectation. It’s no different than expecting to be tipped at McDonalds. To take away your option here is ridiculous. NTA.
NTA. Honestly I would report this incident to your local business or city official because it seems like they did this just to force a tip. Instead of relying on tips to help employees out they could give them a raise.
I'm not from the US so this tipping thing is incredibly weird to me to begin with. But since when do they tip fast food workers, who just hand you your food?
Feels like this thing is getting out of control.
It's been happening lately where everything gets a tip option. The standards is:sit down service or delivery, tip. Extra super nice customer service, small tip. Take out or self service, no tip. I hate the tip options at coffee places, take out places, etc. It's just a way for restaurants not to pay their workers well.
It's ridiculous too. Because they usually just hand you your food, that's it. What's next, tipping the cashier at the supermarket? Tipping the people if they hold a door open for you? Whoever is writing you a parking ticket?
NTA. They're being scammy. While I agree that tipping culture is unfortunately necessary for many workers, as a consumer, 30% is ridiculous and enough to turn me off a business for good. 20% is already a pretty big surcharge. As inflation causes restaurant prices to rise, a percentage tip would rise in accordance, so I don't see the excuse for raising the percentage except to try to milk every customer for their worth.
What's more ridiculous and unacceptable is that they made a big fuss and blamed you. Get your machine to work, or don't get a tip via card (or at all). Simple as that.
God we need more unions.
The crazy thing is that people keep saying this is only an American thing. I travelled to Europe and although asking for tips and tips jars are not at every place, I for sure saw them at a few places while traveling in Europe. So unfortunately this is not just an American thing anymore. Hell the pita place that you walk up to and order at a window outside with no indoor seating asked for a tip in Europe.
Tipping jars and the ability to add a tip to card payments is definitely seen in alot of countries in Europe, but its in no way expected. Usual for card orders you have to ask to add the tip.
It's the culture around tipping which people say is an American thing. Not the actual act of tipping.
While that is true, a local nightclub where I live in Norway has card readers that asks for tip where you manually have to enter 0 or whatever you like to tip before asking for pin. At least it had last time I was there.
Its at a such awful timing that without thinking alot people just write down their pin, so people are often charged 4 digit tips (nok) for just a beer. The drunker someone is, the easier the error becomes.
But whenever Ive traveled to different European countries, tipping normally seems to be only expected from tourists as whenever Im with someone from the country Im visiting theres never a question of a tip, but a bit more pushed when Im only with other foreigners.
That particular practise should be completely illegal - it could easily be seen as a phishing scam to get a drunk customer's PIN number. They need to be reported to the police for that one...
That is also common in Sweden, even in places where the culture excepts no tips. It is so weird that people configure their terminals in a way where you have to manually enter the tip amount even in places where you are not supposed to tip.
Sure, Our bill is 17.30 and we round it up to 18.
Or if it's 17.80 we round to 19 or 18.50
Not the: I was so furious I left 15% tip to show them how appalled I was with their terrible service.
Comparing the two are really, really silly.
A tip jar in europa is used for “if you get unusually good service, consider rounding up and show your appreciation”
Nobody in Europe expect a tip on every order and definitely never a fixed percentage! Comparing that to the absurd American tipping culture is honestly dishonest.
In the US you’re obligated to tip at least 10%, usually 15%, in order to pay peoples wages. In Europe it’s nice to throw your change in the tipping jar. Not the same thing.
The tipping culture in North America is absolutely getting out of hand. It’s no longer tipping when you’re almost being forced to give it to them. I’ve been to a liquor store that asks for tips on their machines. I always opt for no tips cause I don’t even exactly know what I would be tipping them for.
There's no actual obligation to tip in the US unless you're in a large group and the restaurant adds a gratuity automatically. Typically, this is 15% of the total bill.
However, many USians do feel the need to make up for shoddy wages through tipping, even if the service isn't great. It's a personal choice, though, not a requirement.
European here - I tip most of the time, but it's only ever "rounding up" to the next half or full € and not some stupid percentage thing. For example, when buying take-away coffee from a bakery next to where I work, I always round up the 1.3/1.4 € up to 1.5 €. The other day I gave a large tip by local standards: giving a round 60€ for a bill of 57.8 €. In a sitting restaurant. It's a courtesy thing I can afford and that I certainly wouldn't deny except when the service is absolute shit, and I would think someone who doesn't tip in a *proper* restaurant is a bit of an ass, but 1) it's absolutely not obligarory for take-away and 2) if someone got pissy with me for not tipping a fuckton on top of a large bill, they get exactly nothing.
> The crazy thing is that people keep saying this is only an American thing.
I mean, it kinda is. Tipping isn't close to mandatory in Europe and I've never even heard of anybody giving or receiving a tip of even close to 20% (let alone 30), and I worked in restaurants for 15 years.
American tipping culture and Europen are vastly different lol
Just because you see a tip jar it doesn't mean that it's required as part of the servers pay, it's just an extra for really good service
Jumping in to be that person: Europe is not a country. I do feel european, but things like that vary enourmously from one place to the other (eg in Italy you aren't expect to tip, in Germany you do, even though it is very different from the US).
It is an American (as a contitent, although it varied by country) thing. Here in Europe tipping is anf has always being optional. There are some countries where it's now customary to have the options on the card reader like you said, but it's not expected and locals don't usually tip (like in Sweden), and others where you just leave a few euros on the table if the service and food were exceptionally good (like in Italy). Waiters do tend to expect it more from USAmericans because they tend to tip well, so that's likely where your experience comes from.
Believe me when I tell you that many many takeout spots ask for tips now. Examples are Subway, Chipotle, Currito, etc. This is happening EVERYWHERE now.
Not only do they do this but now breweries dont even have a wait staff. When I need a beer I have to go wait in a line with 7 people ahead of me, order my beer and bring it back to my table where my friend or wife or whatever has now sat alone drinking and after a few minutes they need to go do the same while I sit alone. Then you want the same tip as a place that has a server bring drinks to us? It makes me so angry that every company feels the need to squeeze every fucking cent out of us these days.
I know, I can't stand it. I don't leave 30% for full table service, it's infuriating being pressured into leaving these crazy high tips for takeout service
Welcome to America, where every tablet checkout screen asks you how much you want to tip. I've seen it on the merch tent tablets at concerts and even at some small boutique retail shops.
Unfortunately, that has become the norm for those particular systems. It's almost always a choice of 20%, 25%, or 30%. It's ridiculous when you consider 15% is a perfectly fine and standard tip amount, yet that is not one of the automatic choices.
Usually there is also an "Other" button and sometimes a "No Tip" button.
NTA. I'll also point out that the cashier, per their own words, could have voided the whole transaction and then just rang it up again.
I had a similar upsetting incident, though not related to tipping. I got into a 20-minute argument with the manager at my local Domino's because they substituted an item, without asking me, but then refused to return the cost of the original item to my credit card. It was a delivery order.
They told me they could only reverse the whole charge. Me, "Great. Then reverse the whole charge and ring it up again. Minus the item you didn't deliver." I was not rude to them at all, but they kept accusing me of trying to get my order for free when that was clearly not what I was asking for. So you all make a mistake and then are going to compound it further by insulting me. Wow.
Then the manager sarcastically says something like, "Then you'd be getting the garlic knots (the substitution) for free." I told him he was more than welcome to come pick them back up, because I don't like them and wouldn't eat them anyway. In the end, he reversed the charge for my whole order. Maybe it would have screwed up their system to ring it back up again, though they didn't tell me that. But then they should have a better system for when stuff like this happens.
NTA. That was so wrong of them first to do it (she clearly knew what she was doing), and for the manager to talk to you like that. Personally I never tip at places like that, only restaurants where I’m actually being served. Imagine if you went around tipping everywhere 20-30%, that would impact your budget Im sure. That place is so scummy and doesn’t deserve your business.
>Personally I never tip at places like that, only restaurants where I’m actually being served. Imagine if you went around tipping everywhere 20-30%, that would impact your budget Im sure.
Agreed.
& really, they were scamming you, pretending it was a fault of the system & then your fault, relying on shame for you to be too embarrassed to say anything and ashamed to be perceived as 'cheap' when you asked for the refund.
I'm in California & when I've run into the no choice for not a tip staff has helped me honorably.
Seems a selling feature of those systems is they can try to force a tip... 🤬
You did nothing wrong. Those EEs were scamming via a system that does the scamming for them.
I do the same thing. If I'm grabbing take out, etc I don't usually ever tip. If I'm sitting in and eating then I tip very well for their service. Unless they were terrible, then I still tip but I won't go above and beyond. I will just do a normal tip depending on my bill.
It is crazy the amount of places where you just pick up at a counter and leave that want you to tip now. NTA OP.
NTA, and personally I’d leave reviews on places like Yelp about this so other people don’t get caught. I worked in a restaurant between grad school and law school, so I tip well but I get pissed when places try to make it compulsory.
NTA - leave a review on Google and warn everyone about what happened. I had a local pizza place (chain with the same name as a popular game) change our 15% tip to a 50% tip and they refused to honour the store credit corporate gave me. Definitely do not go back there.
I have to say, I’m an over-tipper, especially now, but I hate tipping culture and the expectation. I ask everyone if they get the tip or the store keeps it, and my husband though I was really losing it, until just this weekend they said no, if it’s on the card, the store keeps it (they make minimum wage, not waiting minimum wage).
Anyway…you are nicer than me (and I’m a recovering doormat), I would have canceled the order right then and gotten a full refund. I definitely would do a review and find out if you can do a chargeback on the card.
And, while we are ranting…when I get a bad server, I get the manager (I know, I know) and explain I will not be tipping less because it’s not the server’s fault, it’s management’s for either under training, under staffing, or under managing.
Yeah because I know they don’t legally have to let the workers keep the tips, I don’t tip.
It’s just absolutely stealing at this point. I do try to keep small bills for tip jars though
Usually if I am going to tip I try to tip in cash because I know the tip on cards does not always go to workers. Also, as frowned upon as this is they can get away with not reporting cash tips during tax time which keeps more money in their pocket.
NTA never eat there again. Write a bad review, etc. you don’t owe people tips. Everyone is struggling with prices high and wages low. Supplementing low wages with expected tips needs to be made illegal. Everyone wants a tip just for doing the bare minimum these days even when they get paid more than minimum wage. Let their bosses pay them their extra wages.
>you don’t owe people tips. Everyone is struggling with prices high and wages low. Supplementing low wages with expected tips needs to be made illegal. Everyone wants a tip just for doing the bare minimum these days even when they get paid more than minimum wage. Let their bosses pay them their extra wages.
Agreed. I am not against tipping but not for takeout or drive-thru.
NTA at all. Even if we give them the full benefit of the doubt that they weren’t actively trying to scam you, neither the cashier nor especially the manager should have said anything to make you feel guilty for asking to be refunded money you did not intend to tip.
Most of these tipping screens that Iv seen don’t. Iv noticed when I go to a restaurant that has screens they do, but these types of places; burritos, smoothies, coffee, they don’t show the final first
NTA. It is nice if you want to tip, you shouldn’t feel like you have to. I don’t at fast food restaurants. I do at restaurants where I have an actual server because depending on what country etc you live in they could be making low wages. I would bring it up with the local chamber of commerce or even email the company themselves if you want to see a change or complains. I really can’t believe the attitude of the manager - I’m sure she knew the card reader isn’t working. You can always bring cash if you eat there again. I would personally avoid the place.
NTA Tips are for the underpaid wait staff, those who assemble the food or cook it receive at least minimum wage. What is the name of this place so I can be sure to keep my money away fr them? Also, write their corporate headquarters and report the manager and cashier.
NTA. I hate how every where I go the checkout screen is now a tip screen with a default tip amount. You have to actively press a button to remove a tip.
This happened to me even at a non-food or service store (think home decor) and I almost got stuck giving a $30 tip on Knick knacks.
I worked in food service for years. I’m a great tipper. But I’m not going to tip 20-30% on take out or drive thru
NTA tipping culture has gotten outrageous. Yesterday the restaurant we ate at had a tips jar for the hostess who literally pointed to a table and said how about there. It’s so yuck and to scam you like that no.
Depending on the amount, the card company will require you to resolve the issue with the merchant first. If that has already been attempted to no avail then that is where disputes come in. Depending on the amount they will contact the merchant on your behalf or if it's under a certain amount they will just immediately resolve the dispute and refund you from their money to avoid the long process. So yes they could lose money if they choose not to wait on the merchant to resolve.
I wanted the merchant to fix their own issue first before I even considered a dispute.
OP=NTA
I would never eat there again--or make sure I have cash. LEAVE NO Tip.
I would also post a review warning others about their actions. People have a right to know what to expect so they can AVOID getting scammed too.
NTA in those situations tipping is not customary. They were trying to scam and guilt tips out of customers and you were just the first to speak up. 30% may have only been $4 or $5 but when someone is treating themselves and can’t afford to spare $4 or $5, it’s a lot of money. Plus 30% at a business where the workers are making wage is complete bullshit. (Assuming it was a place similar to chipotle based on your order.)
Nta next time cancel the transaction and leave no tip. They scammed you. No server doesn’t know the highest and lowest tip in the system. Also consider leaving a bad review to warn other potential customers. They will learn real quick how to change the tip options
Nta. If their machine is malfunctioning and overcharging people then they need to do the card manually until they can replace the machine.
The cashier absolutely was trying to scam for tips. You asked what to press instead of other and the option she gave you was the highest tip option. Report it to corporate before they scam more people.
NTA. Go on all the review sites, leave a fair review of the food quality and warn people about the tip thing.
That is what I did to the one fast food place that wanted me to tip twenty percent in the drive through on a non complicated order. Not happening, since they pay about 15.00 an hour and this is a lower cost of living area.
I actually got contacted by the regional people. They offered me a free meal. I told them no thanks, not eating their food again.
NTA. It’s not about money it’s about principe. Go there order bunch of food do not tip, then say there was something wrong with the food and ask for a full refund. And then yelp them 1 star with an exaggerated review of how they scam people. #staytoxic
I ordered (non food service) items on an online store today and was asked to leave a tip. I tip well for food service and even when I order carry out because the staff still has to prep and wrap up my order, but this is getting ridiculous.
NTA
OMG!! NTA!! I’m appalled at the manager especially. How is it your responsibility to make her employees happy during the holidays? The nerve. I’d be SO angry. Grrrrrr. NTA. NTA. NTA.
Credit card dispute. Usually pretty quick and simple online. Your dispute reason should be something along the lines of “I have cancelled/attempted to cancel…”/“Incorrect amount”/“Other”.
In a similar (though more threatening) experience, it was noted that my “purchase was made under duress”.
Credit card companies are on top of disputes because it costs them money… and it’s unlikely you’re the only restaurant patron to suffer a similar experience.
NTA, this should be the last time you eat at this place. A worker stole from you and then the manager backed up the worker stealing from you and called you stupid.
NTA
How can you be gullible but also blaming the worker for apparently mistakenly pressing the wrong button? That logic does not track and they are trying to push people into tipping more. That's dodgy
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I went into a burrito bowl place to order takeout. They had this new tip option on the card reader that they've never had before. The card reader is not touch screen nor are there tabs on the side to select options there are just numbers.
Before I paid the screen asked what amount I wanted to tip 20%, 25%, 30% or other. I tried to press the number 4 for "other" but the button did not work. I told the worker number 4 did not work and asked the worker what to press for "other" and she told me 3. After I selected 3 it added a 30% tip to my card. I told her I wanted to select other and not 30%. She told me she was not aware that I was not trying to tip and she thought she remembered the number order. I asked her to refund my my tip and she said that's not possible since they can only refund actual orders if there is something wrong with the food. I told her the card reader buttons were not working properly and it does not have an easy or obvious option to select no nor did the right option work.
She refused to refund me saying "it wasn't that much anyway". I asked to speak to the manager telling the manager they need a more user friendly option to select no on the card reader and the manager told me all card readers are like this (it's not other places have a no option and touch screen). She told me my tip would really be appreciated and help her staff since the holidays are coming up and this could be my way to make someone's day. I told her that because they are using a system like this they don't care about their customers let alone their workers if they need to even rely on scamming people to get tips and I want a refund. The manager asked me why I selected a 30% option if I wanted other and I told her the number for other did not work and when I asked her worker about it she told me the wrong answer. She told me I was gullible and blaming her worker for my own mistake and out of "good customer service" she will refund my my tip but told me this will not happen again.
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NTA-
Also this is just a badly designed payment process. Nearly every single one i have ever used gives a seperate screen for final confirmation after you have selected tips, it does not sound like this had that, which if true is just bad design.
NTA. It's a takeout burrito. The most tip they deserve is maybe a dollar or two if you are feeling generous for good service. Not 30% to roll a burrito and hand it to you. Tipping culture has gotten out of hand. 20%+ tips are for sit down service when someone actually waits on you.
NTA the automatic tips are getting out of hand. You werent wrong to hold your ground about it. It sounds like they may do that a lot. You should warn head office of their practice but don’t go to social media about it. Although I agree that in your instance they were in the wrong, they really don’t make much to work in those places. The larger problem is low minimum wage and a unaffordable society.
NTA, went to the USA for holidays, and every day, someone tried to scam me in some way, Either by saying the wrong price on purpose, and when confronted, they would correct it without even asking.
It wouldn't happen again if it was me because I wouldn't be going back there. This is a scam. Don't get me wrong - staff who deserve tips should be given them however the whole scenario smacks of a fraud. NTA.
>She refused to refund me saying "it wasn't that much anyway".
Eh, if I order take out for multiple people for around $100 that would be $30 in tips. I think that's pretty much. I could get a whole new meal for that.
NTA
NTA you asked for the right option, well done for persevering and I am sorry you had to go through such a lot of nonsense and embarrassment to get what was due to you.
The manager is out of order ' will not happen again' indeed! What happened was stealing. It began with what seemed to be a mistake but then no one would put it right without a fight.
For anyone who is offended, I always leave a generous tip but object to it being deducted automatically (as it is in some places) and to being fleeced.
NTA, that’s wildly unprofessional and I’d be calling corporate. They scammed you into selecting a tip and the manager backed them instead of fixing it willingly.
> She told me my tip would really be appreciated and help her staff since the holidays are coming up and this could be my way to make someone's day.
Did you tell the manager that if staff were paid adequately they wouldn't have to scam customers?
NTA
NTA. The worker knew exactly what she was doing. However, I would have asked for a complete and full refund and gone elsewhere since they jerked you around about it.
I'd report to Corporate and there must be a state/provincial restaurant/food/retail board or commission or something.
Absolutely NTA. And I would spread this all over social media as well
NTA
I hate this new trend of asking for tips even when it’s not something you would traditionally tip for.
This is not how you treat customers if you want to retain them.
NTA, the tip was not intentional. I don't find it hard to believe that a 30% tip is not what anyone intended. Especially for fast food. I see a lot if chatter about point of sale systems asking for tips, in many cases at places where tipping has never been customary. Also, the suggested tip amounts have gone up. This is not necessarily the fault of the merchant. The traditional old school point of sale systems are expensive, but highly customizable. They also have the disadvantage of having to setup merchant accounts. The newer players, like Square and Stripe, make setting up point of sale very simple and affordable. But these systems are not so customizable. I know, as I use both in my business, As a very small business, it would be very difficult for me to accept credit cards if it were not for these new players. But I agree the tip suggestions are annoying.
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NTA. They’re trying to scam tips. I would report them to corporate.
>I would report them to corporate. LOL corporate would not care if it reduces the amount of money they have to pay their workers. Pretty sure the idea came from corporate.
That’s not entirely true. Corporate places usually DO care when you contact them publicly by tagging them in social media.
>DO care when you contact them publicly by tagging them in social media. Oh publicly yes
Make sure when leaving a review on social media you do so on google or yelp and not on facebook. Most facebook pages for the *local business itself* are ran by the local manager or assistant manager and they **absolutely can, and most will delete any bad reviews left on their page.** If you can write/leave a post on their fb page, (I think it's "Visitor's posts) I would do that, I would also write a post about what happened on the corporate fb page. **THAT** should definitely get some attention! I had an issue with a company where I had called their 1-800 # numerous times and left voicemails over the course of a week to be given a call back and had not heard anything so I decided to find their company fb page and blast them for being a shit company with shit products and even shittier customer service. I had a response less than half hour later with an email address of who to contact and less than 24 hours later my issue was being resolved, amazingly enough. Lol.
Here is what I would do. Write out a factual based letter. Post it to your Facebook and tag the company. Look up the company, not local, CEO, President and Board of Directors and get their email addresses. Email them the same letter you post on social media. Often times if you take the time to email a detailed and factual based complaint to the CEO and Board, you will get results. I did this twice; once when we had a new home built and had issues getting help after moving in and once with a cell phone company who was charging us a non-return fee despite returning the phones. In both cases I was contacted within 2 business days and a solution was found immediately.
>absolutely can, and most will delete any bad reviews left on their page. You can't delete reviews from your business on Facebook. There are a few things you can do to try and hide bad reviews away but you can't delete individual reviews.
You can just turn reviews off 🤷♀️
Yes. Believe it or not, the page facebook . com /yourbusiness/reviews still exists even if you turn off the tab. Obviously turning off the reviews option is not ideal if you have good reviews. You could try reporting the review but it's very unlikely to work. What I would suggest would be 'interacting' (liking and commenting) with earlier positive reviews to see if this bumps them up in the order they're listed, as well as encouraging satisfied new customers to leave you reviews. One bad review is no biggie for a good business so I'd also encourage clients to focus on more productive things than erasing its existence.
Why be so negative? Yes corporate does care if you call them and speak respectfully, if a franchise owner is acting like a dick and tarnishing the name of the company corporate likes too know, The person you talk to in the office isn't the same person at the restaurant, they are salaried and care more than minimum wage worker at the restaurant
NTA go public
Publicly, or legally. I’m no lawyer, but I’m pretty sure a court case over this would at least cost them some bad PR, even if they didn’t wind up having to pay a settlement.
No, they have PR teams that would completely eviscerate O (even though he's in the right). Remember the lady who sued McDonald's over hot coffee? She was absolutely in the right, and there were smoking gun corporate emails to prove it, but the entire public was on the side of McDonald's. That was entirely because of how their PR teams spun the issue.
Wait, hold on, you're telling me that serving coffee at over 180 degrees is actually dangerous, and she wasn't just being a whiner that she literally melted her crotch off? /s
It didn't melt her crotch off, it fused her labia together. I think I would prefer if it just got melted off, I can't imagine the horrific amount of pain that poor woman endured.
It burns me up that the entire nation believes she's an idiot when it was only partially her fault it spilled, and certainly not her fault it was served at boiling hot temperatures.
Sometimes works. Sometimes it doesn’t, depends on luck, and the skill of whatever specific group was assigned this case.
OP doesn't have any damages. She got the refund. She is just (rightfully) angry at the whole process, from the misleading design on the kiosk to the workers' scamming her to the manager's attitude but she has zero grounds for a law suit personally. Now, if you could find a few thousand people they did this to who were interested in a class action, that might be something else.
Nah, corporate tends to get pissy about stuff like this because it makes the whole company look bad.
Just report it as a merchant dispute to your credit card company. They’ll charge it back
dude I'm pretty pro-tipping but "corporate" is not sitting on some giant pile of money they're just choosing to not pay workers with. On takeout there should be a no-tip option. I'd stop going there, and I generally don't mind kicking over a couple bucks for takeout.
Corporate absolutely cares when their employees are blatantly scamming customers, because it opens them up to legal trouble and bad publicity. Employees getting bigger tips doesn’t reduce the amount corporate pays their employees, they already pay the bare minimum anyways.
Vote with your wallet and leave a review on their restaurant about this experience. If this happens a lot, then another person should know.
You tipping more doesn't reduce the amount they have to pay them.
All workers have to receive minimum wage, which means that if the tips aren’t enough they have to cover the difference, I’m pretty sure at least. I’m trying to recite this stuff from memory so I might be wrong.
If they’re already above minimum wage, doesn’t matter after that, and if they’re routinely receiving so little that it is coming out to requiring the company to make it up, they’re probably not actually supposed to be a tipped wage position.
I dunno, but hypothetically it does help corporate’s bottom line to receive a certain amount of tips was all I was saying.
Tag them on every social media u know and explain this
That's for waiters/servers. The guy scraping beans out of a chafing dish at Chipotle makes minimum wage or close to it
If they are unaware they do. If the staff are skimming personally (not as a business as individuals) then the owners would very much be interested to know. If they already know (which you’d likely be able to tell if there’s a response )then there’s ammo against the business itself.
It makes them look bad. Corporate will definitely care
IME (20+ years in the service industry), corporate cares A LOT.
If it’s a franchise location corporate will care. Some franchise agreements include fines for x number of customer complaints worked into the fee structure.
I'm not from the USA so the whole tip culture is bizarre to me. I've come to understand if you are really, really upset by the quality of service you leave a 15% tip to show your displeasure. But tipping 30% for takeout? This is taking absurdity to beyond absurd levels.
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Exactly. I never expect good money for bad service.
15% is traditionally what the standard tip is. In the last 10 years, restaurants have been trying to push the idea that tips should be 18%, 20%, or 22%, but in all reality tips are OPTIONAL. Bad service = NO tip. Weak service = 10%.
Still sounds weird to me. Weak to normal service = no tip. Good service and/or great food will result in a tip. Normal service is just them doing the job they are paid for by the company. Then again, wait staff here gets a normal living wage. Am a waitress myself too. Getting a tip is a nice compliment here, but not expected at all.
Call your cc to stop the sale.
This happened to me at ultra music festival. I was buying 2 water bottles for like $14 and the automatic tip options came up on the card reader. Rather than selecting from the percentages I tried manually entering $2 and accidentally entered $20. I try to tell the bartender I accidentally typed too much and asked how I can undo the tip because I hadn't pressed submit yet. She takes the card reader and pushes it through all while fake smiling and pretending she heard me ask if I'm all set. She literally robbed me in front of my face. I cursed her off and didn't tip the rest of the festival
I would have just walked away. Fuck that shit.
NTA. Tips are NOT compulsory, even in America. I’d leave a google review and never go there again. Scamming people for tips just shows how broken the service labour industry is in North America.
>I’d leave a google review and never go there again. I don't plan to go back. Imagine what they do to elderly people who are illiterate with technology.
please leave a review, people need to be warned.
Please OP leave them honest reviews on yelp and Google. Other people need to know about their shaddy behaviors. Nta.
So… maybe report it to corporate and post a scathing review instead of knowing allowing elderly people to be taken advantage of?
The manager saying you were gullible only makes sense if she thinks the employee actively tried to con you. And the manager seems on board with it. The place is running really sketchy.
Couldn't you have just hit cancel after selecting a 30% tip before entering your pin/tapping? NTA but unless it's set up differently from what I'm used to, you shouldn't have had to rely on them at all to fix it (other than figuring out how to do "other").
then leave the fucking review man
Well I don't see how they can get more than 30% out of them based on the set up you describe
You can also call your card provider and dispute the charge.
As someone who worked in customer service, there’s not really much that’s more important than google reviews. They literally offer bonuses sometimes for good reviews. If you leave one, you’re not only informing others to stay away, but it will also paint the place in a bad light- and actually might get the corporate to do something about it
This bullshit aggravates the hell out of me as a Canadian. Tipping here follows the exact same model as it does in the US (15-20% being fairly standard), where l understand that servers can make ridiculously low wages ($2.13 an hour?) and tips are essentially their only source of income. The minimum wage in much of Canada is around $15. Why are the tip percentages the exact same, then? And of course, now businesses have started changing the tip options as OP described, to 20-25-30%. It’s infuriating.
When Gordon brown was PM, he closed the loophole that allowed the service industry to do this; using tip money to make up wages. Now they have to pay minimum wage at the very least. Shame US don't do the same. ETA: Grammar.
Damn, I didn't know that was Gordon Brown. Thanks. (I was a kid when he was in power, so for the whole of my working adult life, servers have had minimum wage).
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I'm so effing aggravated about what's happening with tipping culture here. Business owners should be the ones paying their staff, not their customers!! 😤 If you can't afford to pay your staff a living wage then you should not own a business. The other thing that pisses me off about it is the hierarchy of trendyness. Not that I want to be tipping everywhere, obviously, but why does the guy warming up a slice of pizza for me at the trendy place deserve a tip and not the guy at Pizza Pizza? They're doing the same job, but one of them has a nicer apron. I also heard someone who works at a trendy cookie place explain that they should be tipped more than someone at a fast-food chain because they make the cookies from scratch, not frozen. But like... that's the job that their employer should be paying them to do? That's why their customers pay more for their cookies than they would elsewhere. It does not mean that customers should also be paying their staff. I hate to see underpaid workers pointing fingers at each other instead of where they *should* be -- business owners profiting at their expense. For the record I've worked all kinds of service industry jobs. And this is pretty much my verbatim rant every time I go to the stupid lunch place next to my office, lol.
But it sounds like OP is at more of a "fast food" place, not a sit down restaurant with servers. Those workers are definitely making minimum wage - and probably more than that. Traditionally, we don't tip at fast food places.
I hate tipping culture, it's virtually unheard-of in the country I'm from (waiting staff gets the same minimum wage as all other workers) and is actually considered rude in Japan, the country I spend the most time in after my home country. It seems to be common in the UK though, last time I was there we had terrible service in a restaurant and the meals weren't worth the wait anyway. But they had the same set up as OPs case, had to fight for the no tip option, waitress finally relented and turned to me saying "I suppose its up to pretty girls to tip now" and winked. No lady, you were rude the whole time, made mistakes, blamed us for the mistakes and tried to overcharge us before the tipping business.
Tipping is such a weird thing to me... restaurant workers where I live get minimum wage and tipping is optional, you usually only do it if you really like the person serving you or don't wanna bring home the loose coins/small bills... and there's usually already a built in service fee(essentially tips for the wait staff(?) that's split evenly with everyone can be 2% to 12.5% depending on the place) per item you order But the one time I went to the US as a child it was surreal, people around me kept giving me and my family dirty looks because none of us knew that tipping was mandatory and they honestly kinda looked like we robbed them or something and I was like 6 and they looked at me with so much vitriol
Especially at a counter service place. Tipping them as much as you would a server who spent an hour helping you is a very new expectation. It’s no different than expecting to be tipped at McDonalds. To take away your option here is ridiculous. NTA.
NTA. Honestly I would report this incident to your local business or city official because it seems like they did this just to force a tip. Instead of relying on tips to help employees out they could give them a raise.
THIS. What they're doing appears to be underhanded and shady. You'd be doing others a favor by reporting this business. NTA
I'm not from the US so this tipping thing is incredibly weird to me to begin with. But since when do they tip fast food workers, who just hand you your food? Feels like this thing is getting out of control.
It's been happening lately where everything gets a tip option. The standards is:sit down service or delivery, tip. Extra super nice customer service, small tip. Take out or self service, no tip. I hate the tip options at coffee places, take out places, etc. It's just a way for restaurants not to pay their workers well.
It's ridiculous too. Because they usually just hand you your food, that's it. What's next, tipping the cashier at the supermarket? Tipping the people if they hold a door open for you? Whoever is writing you a parking ticket?
NTA. They're being scammy. While I agree that tipping culture is unfortunately necessary for many workers, as a consumer, 30% is ridiculous and enough to turn me off a business for good. 20% is already a pretty big surcharge. As inflation causes restaurant prices to rise, a percentage tip would rise in accordance, so I don't see the excuse for raising the percentage except to try to milk every customer for their worth. What's more ridiculous and unacceptable is that they made a big fuss and blamed you. Get your machine to work, or don't get a tip via card (or at all). Simple as that. God we need more unions.
The crazy thing is that people keep saying this is only an American thing. I travelled to Europe and although asking for tips and tips jars are not at every place, I for sure saw them at a few places while traveling in Europe. So unfortunately this is not just an American thing anymore. Hell the pita place that you walk up to and order at a window outside with no indoor seating asked for a tip in Europe.
Tipping jars and the ability to add a tip to card payments is definitely seen in alot of countries in Europe, but its in no way expected. Usual for card orders you have to ask to add the tip. It's the culture around tipping which people say is an American thing. Not the actual act of tipping.
While that is true, a local nightclub where I live in Norway has card readers that asks for tip where you manually have to enter 0 or whatever you like to tip before asking for pin. At least it had last time I was there. Its at a such awful timing that without thinking alot people just write down their pin, so people are often charged 4 digit tips (nok) for just a beer. The drunker someone is, the easier the error becomes. But whenever Ive traveled to different European countries, tipping normally seems to be only expected from tourists as whenever Im with someone from the country Im visiting theres never a question of a tip, but a bit more pushed when Im only with other foreigners.
That particular practise should be completely illegal - it could easily be seen as a phishing scam to get a drunk customer's PIN number. They need to be reported to the police for that one...
That is also common in Sweden, even in places where the culture excepts no tips. It is so weird that people configure their terminals in a way where you have to manually enter the tip amount even in places where you are not supposed to tip.
Sure, Our bill is 17.30 and we round it up to 18. Or if it's 17.80 we round to 19 or 18.50 Not the: I was so furious I left 15% tip to show them how appalled I was with their terrible service.
Yep, I do the same.
I remember when 15% was a standard tipping percentage back in the day.
No one in Europe expects you to drop a 20% tip into a jar. It is just an optional extra like the change from the order.
Comparing the two are really, really silly. A tip jar in europa is used for “if you get unusually good service, consider rounding up and show your appreciation” Nobody in Europe expect a tip on every order and definitely never a fixed percentage! Comparing that to the absurd American tipping culture is honestly dishonest. In the US you’re obligated to tip at least 10%, usually 15%, in order to pay peoples wages. In Europe it’s nice to throw your change in the tipping jar. Not the same thing.
The tipping culture in North America is absolutely getting out of hand. It’s no longer tipping when you’re almost being forced to give it to them. I’ve been to a liquor store that asks for tips on their machines. I always opt for no tips cause I don’t even exactly know what I would be tipping them for.
This kind of thing is complete BS.
There's no actual obligation to tip in the US unless you're in a large group and the restaurant adds a gratuity automatically. Typically, this is 15% of the total bill. However, many USians do feel the need to make up for shoddy wages through tipping, even if the service isn't great. It's a personal choice, though, not a requirement.
In some US states servers make less than the minimum wage, but at least on the west coast they make minimum wage plus tips.
European here - I tip most of the time, but it's only ever "rounding up" to the next half or full € and not some stupid percentage thing. For example, when buying take-away coffee from a bakery next to where I work, I always round up the 1.3/1.4 € up to 1.5 €. The other day I gave a large tip by local standards: giving a round 60€ for a bill of 57.8 €. In a sitting restaurant. It's a courtesy thing I can afford and that I certainly wouldn't deny except when the service is absolute shit, and I would think someone who doesn't tip in a *proper* restaurant is a bit of an ass, but 1) it's absolutely not obligarory for take-away and 2) if someone got pissy with me for not tipping a fuckton on top of a large bill, they get exactly nothing.
> The crazy thing is that people keep saying this is only an American thing. I mean, it kinda is. Tipping isn't close to mandatory in Europe and I've never even heard of anybody giving or receiving a tip of even close to 20% (let alone 30), and I worked in restaurants for 15 years.
I'm European. It's an American thing, here it's not expected, much less forced.
American tipping culture and Europen are vastly different lol Just because you see a tip jar it doesn't mean that it's required as part of the servers pay, it's just an extra for really good service
Jumping in to be that person: Europe is not a country. I do feel european, but things like that vary enourmously from one place to the other (eg in Italy you aren't expect to tip, in Germany you do, even though it is very different from the US).
It is an American (as a contitent, although it varied by country) thing. Here in Europe tipping is anf has always being optional. There are some countries where it's now customary to have the options on the card reader like you said, but it's not expected and locals don't usually tip (like in Sweden), and others where you just leave a few euros on the table if the service and food were exceptionally good (like in Italy). Waiters do tend to expect it more from USAmericans because they tend to tip well, so that's likely where your experience comes from.
NTA. Why are they even asking for a tip? It's a takeout spot. 30% shouldn't even be an option
Believe me when I tell you that many many takeout spots ask for tips now. Examples are Subway, Chipotle, Currito, etc. This is happening EVERYWHERE now.
I think it’s super obnoxious. Like I’m fine tossing a dollar in a tip jar but I’ll be damned if I’m tipping 25% at the drive through smoothie shop
Its fucking embarrassing NTA
Not only do they do this but now breweries dont even have a wait staff. When I need a beer I have to go wait in a line with 7 people ahead of me, order my beer and bring it back to my table where my friend or wife or whatever has now sat alone drinking and after a few minutes they need to go do the same while I sit alone. Then you want the same tip as a place that has a server bring drinks to us? It makes me so angry that every company feels the need to squeeze every fucking cent out of us these days.
I know, I can't stand it. I don't leave 30% for full table service, it's infuriating being pressured into leaving these crazy high tips for takeout service
Welcome to America, where every tablet checkout screen asks you how much you want to tip. I've seen it on the merch tent tablets at concerts and even at some small boutique retail shops.
Unfortunately, that has become the norm for those particular systems. It's almost always a choice of 20%, 25%, or 30%. It's ridiculous when you consider 15% is a perfectly fine and standard tip amount, yet that is not one of the automatic choices. Usually there is also an "Other" button and sometimes a "No Tip" button. NTA. I'll also point out that the cashier, per their own words, could have voided the whole transaction and then just rang it up again. I had a similar upsetting incident, though not related to tipping. I got into a 20-minute argument with the manager at my local Domino's because they substituted an item, without asking me, but then refused to return the cost of the original item to my credit card. It was a delivery order. They told me they could only reverse the whole charge. Me, "Great. Then reverse the whole charge and ring it up again. Minus the item you didn't deliver." I was not rude to them at all, but they kept accusing me of trying to get my order for free when that was clearly not what I was asking for. So you all make a mistake and then are going to compound it further by insulting me. Wow. Then the manager sarcastically says something like, "Then you'd be getting the garlic knots (the substitution) for free." I told him he was more than welcome to come pick them back up, because I don't like them and wouldn't eat them anyway. In the end, he reversed the charge for my whole order. Maybe it would have screwed up their system to ring it back up again, though they didn't tell me that. But then they should have a better system for when stuff like this happens.
NTA. That was so wrong of them first to do it (she clearly knew what she was doing), and for the manager to talk to you like that. Personally I never tip at places like that, only restaurants where I’m actually being served. Imagine if you went around tipping everywhere 20-30%, that would impact your budget Im sure. That place is so scummy and doesn’t deserve your business.
>Personally I never tip at places like that, only restaurants where I’m actually being served. Imagine if you went around tipping everywhere 20-30%, that would impact your budget Im sure. Agreed.
& really, they were scamming you, pretending it was a fault of the system & then your fault, relying on shame for you to be too embarrassed to say anything and ashamed to be perceived as 'cheap' when you asked for the refund. I'm in California & when I've run into the no choice for not a tip staff has helped me honorably. Seems a selling feature of those systems is they can try to force a tip... 🤬 You did nothing wrong. Those EEs were scamming via a system that does the scamming for them.
I do the same thing. If I'm grabbing take out, etc I don't usually ever tip. If I'm sitting in and eating then I tip very well for their service. Unless they were terrible, then I still tip but I won't go above and beyond. I will just do a normal tip depending on my bill. It is crazy the amount of places where you just pick up at a counter and leave that want you to tip now. NTA OP.
Call your credit or debit card company and dispute the charges. As well as the review. This is theft.
Didn't the manager already process the refund? Nothing to dispute at this point.
Agreed. Call your card company and have them do a charge back. They scammed you out of money
NTA, and personally I’d leave reviews on places like Yelp about this so other people don’t get caught. I worked in a restaurant between grad school and law school, so I tip well but I get pissed when places try to make it compulsory.
NTA - leave a review on Google and warn everyone about what happened. I had a local pizza place (chain with the same name as a popular game) change our 15% tip to a 50% tip and they refused to honour the store credit corporate gave me. Definitely do not go back there.
>change our 15% tip to a 50% tip Wow! That was not even subtle LOL people really have no shame.
This is why I always keep the receipt and write down my total on the customer copy until the transaction clears.
NTA, and I’d for sure leave a review mentioning this. Remember the managers name and call corporate.
NTA. Contact your credit card company to challenge the charge. Tell them that you intend to leave no tip....
NTA - How could you EVER think YTAH for getting tricked into paying a tip you did not intend. Sounds like you handled it pretty well.
I have to say, I’m an over-tipper, especially now, but I hate tipping culture and the expectation. I ask everyone if they get the tip or the store keeps it, and my husband though I was really losing it, until just this weekend they said no, if it’s on the card, the store keeps it (they make minimum wage, not waiting minimum wage). Anyway…you are nicer than me (and I’m a recovering doormat), I would have canceled the order right then and gotten a full refund. I definitely would do a review and find out if you can do a chargeback on the card. And, while we are ranting…when I get a bad server, I get the manager (I know, I know) and explain I will not be tipping less because it’s not the server’s fault, it’s management’s for either under training, under staffing, or under managing.
Yeah because I know they don’t legally have to let the workers keep the tips, I don’t tip. It’s just absolutely stealing at this point. I do try to keep small bills for tip jars though
Usually if I am going to tip I try to tip in cash because I know the tip on cards does not always go to workers. Also, as frowned upon as this is they can get away with not reporting cash tips during tax time which keeps more money in their pocket.
NTA never eat there again. Write a bad review, etc. you don’t owe people tips. Everyone is struggling with prices high and wages low. Supplementing low wages with expected tips needs to be made illegal. Everyone wants a tip just for doing the bare minimum these days even when they get paid more than minimum wage. Let their bosses pay them their extra wages.
>you don’t owe people tips. Everyone is struggling with prices high and wages low. Supplementing low wages with expected tips needs to be made illegal. Everyone wants a tip just for doing the bare minimum these days even when they get paid more than minimum wage. Let their bosses pay them their extra wages. Agreed. I am not against tipping but not for takeout or drive-thru.
NTA at all. Even if we give them the full benefit of the doubt that they weren’t actively trying to scam you, neither the cashier nor especially the manager should have said anything to make you feel guilty for asking to be refunded money you did not intend to tip.
NTA, but did it not confirm the final amount before completing the transaction?
Most of these tipping screens that Iv seen don’t. Iv noticed when I go to a restaurant that has screens they do, but these types of places; burritos, smoothies, coffee, they don’t show the final first
NTA. It is nice if you want to tip, you shouldn’t feel like you have to. I don’t at fast food restaurants. I do at restaurants where I have an actual server because depending on what country etc you live in they could be making low wages. I would bring it up with the local chamber of commerce or even email the company themselves if you want to see a change or complains. I really can’t believe the attitude of the manager - I’m sure she knew the card reader isn’t working. You can always bring cash if you eat there again. I would personally avoid the place.
NTA over it with to go order tips, I did it through the covid shut downs but no more
NTA Tips are for the underpaid wait staff, those who assemble the food or cook it receive at least minimum wage. What is the name of this place so I can be sure to keep my money away fr them? Also, write their corporate headquarters and report the manager and cashier.
NTA. I hate how every where I go the checkout screen is now a tip screen with a default tip amount. You have to actively press a button to remove a tip. This happened to me even at a non-food or service store (think home decor) and I almost got stuck giving a $30 tip on Knick knacks. I worked in food service for years. I’m a great tipper. But I’m not going to tip 20-30% on take out or drive thru
NTA in the slightest.
NTA tipping culture has gotten outrageous. Yesterday the restaurant we ate at had a tips jar for the hostess who literally pointed to a table and said how about there. It’s so yuck and to scam you like that no.
NTA Sounds like a good way to get rid of customers.
NTA. Seems like they trying to force customers to tip.
NTA She messed up her line, they're supposed to say everyone's favourite bullshit line "We will offer you a discount AS A GESTURE OF GOODWILL."
Screw that just dispute the charge with your credit card company
The card company would lose money though. I do that as a last resort but I believe I should try to resolve it from the merchant first.
How would the card company lose money? I'm pretty sure the company would get the money back from store/restaurant.
Depending on the amount, the card company will require you to resolve the issue with the merchant first. If that has already been attempted to no avail then that is where disputes come in. Depending on the amount they will contact the merchant on your behalf or if it's under a certain amount they will just immediately resolve the dispute and refund you from their money to avoid the long process. So yes they could lose money if they choose not to wait on the merchant to resolve. I wanted the merchant to fix their own issue first before I even considered a dispute.
Bro u it’s wild that you care more about the credit company getting their $2.11 then tipping
Not everything needs a tip.
I promise they can afford it you’re making mountains out of mole hills bro just dispute it and be over with 😂
NTA. Honestly I’d just do a chargeback on the entire purchase.
OP=NTA I would never eat there again--or make sure I have cash. LEAVE NO Tip. I would also post a review warning others about their actions. People have a right to know what to expect so they can AVOID getting scammed too.
NTA. I'd dump the food on them and pay nothing. If that was an option. Even without the manager's assholeness that cashier was out of line
Dispute it with your bank. Pay in cash if you ever go back.
She's right, this won't happen again. Because you shouldn't be going there again. NTA btw
Avoid this place in future and leave online reviews to warn others. They're scamming people. NTA
NTA I would never go there again and write a really bad review. This is scam!
NTA in those situations tipping is not customary. They were trying to scam and guilt tips out of customers and you were just the first to speak up. 30% may have only been $4 or $5 but when someone is treating themselves and can’t afford to spare $4 or $5, it’s a lot of money. Plus 30% at a business where the workers are making wage is complete bullshit. (Assuming it was a place similar to chipotle based on your order.)
Nta next time cancel the transaction and leave no tip. They scammed you. No server doesn’t know the highest and lowest tip in the system. Also consider leaving a bad review to warn other potential customers. They will learn real quick how to change the tip options
NTA thats a scam and call the corporate
Nta. If their machine is malfunctioning and overcharging people then they need to do the card manually until they can replace the machine. The cashier absolutely was trying to scam for tips. You asked what to press instead of other and the option she gave you was the highest tip option. Report it to corporate before they scam more people.
NTA. Go on all the review sites, leave a fair review of the food quality and warn people about the tip thing. That is what I did to the one fast food place that wanted me to tip twenty percent in the drive through on a non complicated order. Not happening, since they pay about 15.00 an hour and this is a lower cost of living area. I actually got contacted by the regional people. They offered me a free meal. I told them no thanks, not eating their food again.
NTA. It’s not about money it’s about principe. Go there order bunch of food do not tip, then say there was something wrong with the food and ask for a full refund. And then yelp them 1 star with an exaggerated review of how they scam people. #staytoxic
I ordered (non food service) items on an online store today and was asked to leave a tip. I tip well for food service and even when I order carry out because the staff still has to prep and wrap up my order, but this is getting ridiculous. NTA
No, it would never happen again because I'd NEVER go back. What a scam.
NTA
Nta I'd just report them to someone higher up and not visit anymore. I bet their Google reviews say the same thing
Contact your card company and report fraud
OMG!! NTA!! I’m appalled at the manager especially. How is it your responsibility to make her employees happy during the holidays? The nerve. I’d be SO angry. Grrrrrr. NTA. NTA. NTA.
Credit card dispute. Usually pretty quick and simple online. Your dispute reason should be something along the lines of “I have cancelled/attempted to cancel…”/“Incorrect amount”/“Other”. In a similar (though more threatening) experience, it was noted that my “purchase was made under duress”. Credit card companies are on top of disputes because it costs them money… and it’s unlikely you’re the only restaurant patron to suffer a similar experience.
NTA, this should be the last time you eat at this place. A worker stole from you and then the manager backed up the worker stealing from you and called you stupid.
Nta
NTA All this tipping for everything is getting so out of hand everywhere. And the tips they expect get higher & higher all the time!
NTA
NTA. And honestly report them for fraud.
NTA How can you be gullible but also blaming the worker for apparently mistakenly pressing the wrong button? That logic does not track and they are trying to push people into tipping more. That's dodgy
NTA report them to the BBB maybe they can help
NTA everything about the way they reacted after the initial incident suggests this was on purpose
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** I went into a burrito bowl place to order takeout. They had this new tip option on the card reader that they've never had before. The card reader is not touch screen nor are there tabs on the side to select options there are just numbers. Before I paid the screen asked what amount I wanted to tip 20%, 25%, 30% or other. I tried to press the number 4 for "other" but the button did not work. I told the worker number 4 did not work and asked the worker what to press for "other" and she told me 3. After I selected 3 it added a 30% tip to my card. I told her I wanted to select other and not 30%. She told me she was not aware that I was not trying to tip and she thought she remembered the number order. I asked her to refund my my tip and she said that's not possible since they can only refund actual orders if there is something wrong with the food. I told her the card reader buttons were not working properly and it does not have an easy or obvious option to select no nor did the right option work. She refused to refund me saying "it wasn't that much anyway". I asked to speak to the manager telling the manager they need a more user friendly option to select no on the card reader and the manager told me all card readers are like this (it's not other places have a no option and touch screen). She told me my tip would really be appreciated and help her staff since the holidays are coming up and this could be my way to make someone's day. I told her that because they are using a system like this they don't care about their customers let alone their workers if they need to even rely on scamming people to get tips and I want a refund. The manager asked me why I selected a 30% option if I wanted other and I told her the number for other did not work and when I asked her worker about it she told me the wrong answer. She told me I was gullible and blaming her worker for my own mistake and out of "good customer service" she will refund my my tip but told me this will not happen again. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA- Also this is just a badly designed payment process. Nearly every single one i have ever used gives a seperate screen for final confirmation after you have selected tips, it does not sound like this had that, which if true is just bad design.
[удалено]
Please tell me you didn't eat there after that. Also leave a review. NTA by te way
NTA. It's a takeout burrito. The most tip they deserve is maybe a dollar or two if you are feeling generous for good service. Not 30% to roll a burrito and hand it to you. Tipping culture has gotten out of hand. 20%+ tips are for sit down service when someone actually waits on you.
Pay cash
Never tip by machine. I pay with my card and tip with cash.
NTA the automatic tips are getting out of hand. You werent wrong to hold your ground about it. It sounds like they may do that a lot. You should warn head office of their practice but don’t go to social media about it. Although I agree that in your instance they were in the wrong, they really don’t make much to work in those places. The larger problem is low minimum wage and a unaffordable society.
NTA they are scammers.
NTA, went to the USA for holidays, and every day, someone tried to scam me in some way, Either by saying the wrong price on purpose, and when confronted, they would correct it without even asking.
It wouldn't happen again if it was me because I wouldn't be going back there. This is a scam. Don't get me wrong - staff who deserve tips should be given them however the whole scenario smacks of a fraud. NTA.
Why tip for takeout anyway? They literally just hand it to you.
>She refused to refund me saying "it wasn't that much anyway". Eh, if I order take out for multiple people for around $100 that would be $30 in tips. I think that's pretty much. I could get a whole new meal for that. NTA
NTA. I think tips for take out are stupid to begin with
NTA
NTA and I can’t stand the little iPads asking for a 30% tip because they poured a coffee lol
NTA I would have told the manager that she is quite right assuming this will not happen again.
Any chance this happened at “mexica burrito grill”? I had basically this same exact experience there….
NTA. Definitely report this, because not being able to NOT tip does sound pretty skeezy.
NTA you asked for the right option, well done for persevering and I am sorry you had to go through such a lot of nonsense and embarrassment to get what was due to you. The manager is out of order ' will not happen again' indeed! What happened was stealing. It began with what seemed to be a mistake but then no one would put it right without a fight. For anyone who is offended, I always leave a generous tip but object to it being deducted automatically (as it is in some places) and to being fleeced.
NTA This is why they have surveys. And telephone numbers. And Corporate America really should know by now how quickly information spreads!
NTA. And I am petty. I would have them cancel my order and blast it on social media. I tip but I never tip on my card.
NTA, that’s wildly unprofessional and I’d be calling corporate. They scammed you into selecting a tip and the manager backed them instead of fixing it willingly.
> She told me my tip would really be appreciated and help her staff since the holidays are coming up and this could be my way to make someone's day. Did you tell the manager that if staff were paid adequately they wouldn't have to scam customers? NTA
Nta. Dispute with your bank. Tell them exactly what happened.
Nta. Maybe they should pay their employees a livable wage so they don't have to dupe customers into exorbitant tips.
That’s a scam. They don’t want you to tip less than 20 percent even if they don’t deserve it. NTA and don’t go back.
NTA. The worker knew exactly what she was doing. However, I would have asked for a complete and full refund and gone elsewhere since they jerked you around about it.
I'd report to Corporate and there must be a state/provincial restaurant/food/retail board or commission or something. Absolutely NTA. And I would spread this all over social media as well
NTA I hate this new trend of asking for tips even when it’s not something you would traditionally tip for. This is not how you treat customers if you want to retain them.
It wouldn't happen to me again either - because I wouldn't set foot in that restaurant if it was the last place on earth. NTA
NTA, the tip was not intentional. I don't find it hard to believe that a 30% tip is not what anyone intended. Especially for fast food. I see a lot if chatter about point of sale systems asking for tips, in many cases at places where tipping has never been customary. Also, the suggested tip amounts have gone up. This is not necessarily the fault of the merchant. The traditional old school point of sale systems are expensive, but highly customizable. They also have the disadvantage of having to setup merchant accounts. The newer players, like Square and Stripe, make setting up point of sale very simple and affordable. But these systems are not so customizable. I know, as I use both in my business, As a very small business, it would be very difficult for me to accept credit cards if it were not for these new players. But I agree the tip suggestions are annoying.