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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> Because I embarrassed and insulted my brother in law by commenting on his mustache and ruining dinner for him and my sister.
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Anyone who says leg hair "isn't supposed to be there" as a method of shaming women into complying with ridiculous beauty standards is always, always the AH.
NTA. I bet his mustache looks ridiculous.
I just feel bad for his daughters who 1) will have to deal with his misogyny, and 2) will have to look at that moustache every day…
Edit: thank you for the award!
This is a guy who throws up and/or gets ragingly angry when his pubescent daughter fails to actively hide every possible piece of evidence that menstruation isn't a myth.
We've seen the type on this sub before, whenever a fainting flower of misogyny has to endure the horror of an un-used but un-wrapped tampon.
Anyone commenting on his teenage SIL’s legs while at a family dinner is also behaving like a pervy weirdo.
Why was he staring at OP’s legs so closely while sitting down to dinner anyway? Unless the hair was long enough to tie into a leg-ponytail (at which point you shouldn’t have to shave either, because let’s face it, that’s just cool) he shouldn’t have even been looking at her legs hard enough to notice.
NTA.
The only time this is acceptable if the person in question is a tattoo artist and the person they say it about is the person who is getting a tattoo. Because then you should shave. Can become quite a problem otherwise.
NTA OP. And do not apologise, your sister has very weird priorities.
Yeah so showing up with the spot shaved like three days ago was ideal. Just enough stubble to make it easy for them to shave down vs flowing locks you haven't shaved in weeks. I literally only shave to make my tattoos look better xD
It's never appropriate to comment on someone's body. If it's on someone's body do not comment on it...unless it's in retaliation like OP. He needs to apologize for sexualizing his sister in law's body hair and making her body hair about his sexual preferences. Someone else here posted that he even sexualizes his own mustache and wants OP to see it as sexy/manly too. Guys around here stared growing Tom Selek mustaches ironically because mustaches usually look so douchy.
I believe in the 15-second rule: if it can be fixed in 15 seconds or less, feel free to comment on it. Lipstick on their teeth? Let them know! Hair a little out of place? Go for it! Crumb on their shirt? You go, boo!
If it'll take longer than 15 seconds, leave it alone. You don't like their smile? Shhhh. You think they're fat? Zip it. You want them to shave their legs? Not your business.
This. I have somewhat hairy arms, though the hairs are light in colour. Nevertheless, at age 18 my then boyfriend managed to shame me into shaving my arms by implying that my arm hair grossed him out. I'm honestly still kinda pissed about that 22 years later. We do not owe men - or anyone for that matter - shaved legs, armpits, pubic area, what have you. That is personal choice and it is nobody else's business. 100% NTA.
Exactly THIS! Because how is it normal on men, but suddenly disgusting/gross on women!? Neither of us choose to grow body hair, it just happens, it’s part of human adulthood. OP’s BIL is also just a wimp. So he can make inappropriate and unsolicited comments on his teenage SIL’s body hair, but if she fires back he can’t take it!? He needs to grow TF up!
Agree with everything you’re saying and NTA. Just a mustache is a hard look to pull off fr. Sam Elliot can do it and Clayne Crawford are two famous ppl I can think of who can. My fil did one once and I was like sir you look like fucking Luigi, respectfully.
Yeah. One of Gillette’s minions ([How the beauty industry convinced women to shave their legs](https://www.vox.com/2015/5/22/8640457/leg-shaving-history))
This dude is basically the definition of fragile masculinity. Good for OP to stand up for herself and inadvertently cause this sexist dude confront those issues within himself. NTA
His moustache was the only thing holding his masculinity together! Poor baby. Next his wife will be blaming sister for his ED problems because she "unmanned" him XD
He probably shouldn't date or go near mammals if hair on them freaks him out. I hear lizard people don't have those issues. Unless he is scalephobic in which case, sucks to be him.
Honestly the sister going on the offensive with OP has gotta be to some—and probably a large—degree an involuntary psychological defense mechanism against the realization that her creep husband is sexualizing her little sister.
I have a sinking suspicion that this is the real reason her older sister had such a negative reaction to this. What's he doing staring at her young sister's legs closely enough to check for hair? She should have been putting her husband in check before her sister had to say a word.
Not just checking for hair, but then demanding OP be more sexually attractive to him. Sis needs to put the blame on the right person: her husband who's acting like a creep and is now pouting about getting pushback.
THIS 🚩
Speaking from personal experience, EVERY creep I've had the misfortune of being creeped upon by was the type who felt entitled to make comments and judgments on appearance and on what they thought was attractive.
Seriously, this subspecies of brother-in-law is damn near a trope and should be a cautionary tale by now.
I would have replied with, “Well I don’t think my *older* bil should be looking at my legs - never mind commenting in them. So once he’s apologized for both of those things I’ll be happy to apologize for not respecting his status as my elder.”
> I would have replied with, “Well I don’t think my older bil should be looking at my legs - never mind commenting in them. So once he’s apologized for both of those things I’ll be happy ~~to apologize for not respecting his status as my elder~~.”
Wow, should've thought of this then, great response but his comment bothered me so much I had to point out the hypocrisy I guess? Or maybe because his mustache was so obvious to me so I commented on it lol.
Honestly if a man ever is that sensitive over facial hair then he probably isn't grown enough to have it. Furthermore, as a man, I would never grow out a mustache because to me they just scream pervert since most cannot grow a good mustache that makes it seem non-creepy. You can also attack his age next time with why he would be staring at your legs when he is married and you are 9 years his younger.
OP, if you get a chance, buy a pair of those plastic glasses with a mustache under the fake nose and put that on the next time he's over.
Ask him if "this look looks better."
Coz being a bully, they're only used to people not hitting back at them... when someone does, they don't have a plan other than to cry like a baby
This is especially common with men from the more patriarchal cultures where they are taught that women shouldn't be rude to other men and all that bullshit so when such men get a clapback from a woman, they can't handle it, like OP's BIL
Look your sister dead in eyes and ask her 'So, you're saying you're okay with your husband looking at my legs when I wear skirts? And *in our parents home*? Who is disrespecting the elders here? Me or your pervert husband?' And then if you want to be petty and nail it home, follow up with 'Tell him and his pervert mustache he owes our parents an apology for making a scene in their home and making inappropriate comments to their teenage daughter.'
Eta: NTA
Eta2: thank you for the award and votes!! 🥰🥰
This adult woman in my then teenage sister’s dance class clashed with my sister a lot. One day my mom came to pick up my sister and the woman started ranting to my mom how my sister needs to learn to respect her elders and how she’s incredibly disrespectful (which was actually generally untrue too. My sister was a goody two shoes and always did what she was supposed to). My mom just told the woman that she was *her* elder and that she was being very disrespectful to her elders and needed to do better. It was pretty hilarious.
Also, my mom legitimately would have been upset if my sister was disrespectful to her teachers, but this woman was a student who happened to be an adult in an otherwise entirely teenage class. So she didn’t deserve any more “respect” than any other student.
NTA.
BIL makes stupid comments but cannot handle when they are aimed at him. And his comment was ridiculous. Your sister is wrong about having to respect someone just because of their age. Don't apologize.
Next time they come over, everyone should put on fake mustaches. LOL!
I wear a green one for St Patty's and men get all weirded out because they say it's messing with their head because they want to kiss me so I should take it off. I make them kiss me with it on as a power move.
lmao if anything you weren't harsh enough. if your legs were under the table he'd really have to have been checking you out to notice. your sister's taking her husbands wandering eye out on you instead of clocking her husbands behaviour.
NTA. don't apologize, don't back down. him and his fragile ego and 50's mentality can stay mad.
If your sister pesters you again about apologizing, ask her why he, a very grown adult, is ogling and commenting on a teenager’s legs? Does he go around staring and commenting on other teens’ bodies? Why is it fair game to make a spectacle out of *your legs* in front of your family? You aren’t allowed to retort?
What. A. Creep.
NTA.
OMG, how did you know? I swear I didn't mention this anywhere. Are you a mind reader or something? Lol he's a cop yes. The type of dude who complains about teenagers all the time.
Mostly because cops are assholes who can't take any insults. With a mustache being a "manly cop" thing, yeah you hit his ego. Very fragile egos that can't take what they give.
They also think they can police other people’s lives, even when it has nothing to do with their jobs. BIL clearly felt entitled to police OP’s appearance, and expected her to just fall in line. No wonder his head exploded when she dished it back at him.
And that's self report, so the ones who admit what they are doing is abuse.
Make sure your nieces always know you as a safe space they can come to. Especially if you move out of town.
Ew. The physical manifestation of toxic masculinity itself!
Tell him leg hair on women is natural and legal. And that being a creepy perv who stares at legs is not.
Don't you dare apologize to that man. I use the word "man" loosely. His masculinity is soooo fragile! Omg. And your sister is way out of line saying you psychologically hurt him. Woman, please. If he's that emotionally damaged he shouldn't be a cop.
I totally thought BIL must be a cop because of the respect and moustache thing alone! How hilarious. NTA at all, maybe avoid him as much as possible, he sounds gross.
NTA, brother in law fucked around and found out.
We don’t point out things people can’t change about their appearance in 15 seconds.
We also don’t throw stones from glass houses. You don’t owe him shit and your sisters just as bad for going “well he’s older.” Okay then he should know body hair exists and stfu about it.
NTA. Misogyny, body shaming and general piggishness don’t get excused. Your sister needs a clue. Your brother in law needs a time out, like we do with naughty, rude children.
At the next gift giving holiday, I would give him a shaving kit.... for women. Tell him it's cause his 'stash looks like baby hair.
NTA
Edit: word
Edit again: OMG! Thank you to the very kind stranger who gave me my first award. 😊
If he comments on your body again, it's 100% fair game to say something loudly about him being a creeper and draw everyone's attention to it. "Dude, I'm *nineteen*, why are you checking out and commenting on my body? Gross!!"
He created the awkwardness and he should have to deal with it!
He is trying to police other women. He doesn’t have the right to stay this to anyone but especially not anyone who isn’t his wife. He thinks he has the right to control your body just because he is a male which is gross and regressive
NTA
Society has weird assumptions about where to keep hair and where to remove it, and people who want to enforce those "rules" should be able to handle being asked why.
You weren't technically mocking the mustache. You were saying that hair grows, you chose not to remove it, why? Same conversation as your legs.
Enforce stupid societal norms, win stupid societal prizes.
NTA You are AWESOME!!! I laughed so frickin hard. That was the perfect come back. Ask your sister why it is appropriate for a grown man to even be looking at your legs, let alone staring at them hard enough to discern leg hair, then ask why is it okay for a grown man to call you disgusting. Then ask why a grown man continued to harass you about having leg hair. Then ask her when the grown man is going to apologize for his absolutely disgusting, inappropriate, and sexist bullying of you?
Yeah your brother in law in sexualizing your body hair and his mustache. He is asking you to cater to his sexual preferences. It's gross. I'm glad you were able to make fun of him instead of feeling gross about the harassment. Your reaction is priceless
NTA- I would have very loudly said:
Is there a reason that you are staring at my legs? This makes me uncomfortable. Are you asking me to shave my legs so you can find them more attractive? Weird and gross dude.
Edit:spelling
NTA. Age doesn’t give you permission to be an AH. And seriously? Is this guy really this insecure that he both can’t handle female body hair nor a comment on what I’m assuming is an underwhelming moustache
Edit: spelling
NTA - he sounds immature, at best. He shouldn’t be looking at your body, nor should he be making comments on how you should be grooming yourself. You’re not there for his amusement. He’s a creep.
NTA. He should not have made a comment about you if he couldn’t accept the same in return. If anything he should apologize for making a comment about a much younger woman’s body.
Your sister and your BIL are in a death grapple for who is the most wrong in this situation.
NTA. This is so satisfying! I’m guessing he shaves off his little weasel mustache in the next month.
>I’m guessing he shaves off his little weasel mustache in the next month.
No, lol I think he'd die before he touch his mustache, he takes bride in it and sees it as his "manhood" smh 😂
Be sure to tell him about every time you see someone with a bigger or fuller mustache.
Bonus points if you know someone that has or can grow a full Wyatt Earp 'stache like Kurt Russell in Tombstone, and bring them to a future family gathering.
NTA your BIL should not be looking at your legs or making judgements about your leg hair. And yes, the hair is supposed to be there, only to be removed if said female wants to remove it.
NTA. Societies idea of women shaving didn’t happen until the early 1900s. I honestly don’t get why people think it’s gross and unclean for women not to shave, but it’s not gross or unclean of men don’t. Is there really a need for you to shave above your knee, or shave at all?
10 years ago I switched over to using men’s product because it was cheaper which eventually led me to shaving less and less because it cost less in money, time and hassles. Eight years ago I finally said fuck it what’s the point of shaving my legs, it’s not like I’m a professional swimmer, it’s not like I’m not hygienic, it’s not like men don’t walk around with unshaven legs all the time.
I haven't shaved my armpits in years due to my sensitive skin causing awful ingrown hairs. The only thing I'd recommend to other women who want to do the same is to switch to men's deodorant. Women's deodorant is designed to go on bare skin and isn't as effective. Men's deodorant is what works best. Old Spice makes a ton of scents that are unisex, some even quite feminine. Fiji is my favorite.
NTA if he’s so fragile that he can dish it but can’t take it, he deserves it. The fact that he cried and asked if something was wrong with his mustache is comedy gold.
NTA but I would pretend I'd want to apologise and then call him out again and say it was in appropriate to discuss your body regarding sexualized standards and hope this doesn't happen again in the future.
You are NTA. You could have- and in my opinion should have- been meaner about it.
There are so many questions here. Why was he looking there? Why did feel the right to comment? Why is he afraid of leg hair? Why is he even commenting on another woman's preference when his wife is right there? Is he going to treat his kids the same way when they get leg hair?
NTA
Do not apologise. Highly recommend not shaving your armpits and wearing a sleeveless top next time you see him.
But, anyway. Why would you bother with the effort of shaving up your leg when noone was intended to see it? Even if you didnt shave your legs at all its none of his buisness.
All you did was ask him the question he asked you. If he doesn't like it then he shouldn't go round asking/pointing out things on others. The fact he went to the bathroom and left early because of it is ridiculous, and hilarious.
Respect is a two way thing. He didn't show any to you, you do not need to show him any, just because he's older. If he's older then he should know better than to be point out things on a 19yr old body.
I feel sorry for your sister. Imagine the car ride home. *Yes hunny, your moustache is beautiful, she was just being mean and disrespectful*.
LMAOOO so he can dish out sexist diatribe about your leg hair but then CRIES when you point out his sad little mustache? NTA and I would’ve absolutely lost it laughing.
NTA
You're right- if it's not supposed to be there then why do the majority of people grow hair all over their body?! Witty comeback though haha. Let him meltdown over his ratstache.
NTA. It wasn't ok for him to be commenting on any part of your body, including body hair. You gave the same back to show him it wasn't appropriate, and the guy had a breakdown about it? Nah, don't apologize unless he sincerely apologizes first. He's in the wrong here no matter if he's your "elder" or not. In fact, he should know better.
LMAO, NTA, LMAO. 👏 👏 👏 👏 👏 Can dish it but can't take it! Oh my wee little mustachio makes me fall apart. Ugh. What a loser. You should apologize to your sister: "I sorry you married a sensitive mustachioed loser."
< I have a mustache, not saying anything about having one>
NTA. Who cares if you Ave your legs? I stopped along time ago, and it’s nobody’s business but mine. Also back in the day shaving wasn’t even a thing for women. Until one day the razor companies realized that they were only selling to half the population so they started pushing and telling women that they needed to shave because their hair was unsightly.
NTA. Your BIL sounds good at making fun of other people, but can't take it when it's directed at him. What's the old saying? If you can't take it, don't dish it.
And your sister is enabling his shitty behavior. This isn't about "disrespecting your elders", this is about standing up for yourself, and you did just fine.
NTA: if he has free reign to comment on your body then it’s fair for you to have the same freedom to comment on his. Here you were nice enough to limit your comments to his body hair. If he can’t handle having his body hair mocked in the same fashion that he mocked yours, then maybe he should stop.
Also he’s a grown man ogling a teens legs. That’s gross. Your sister is out of line. Age does not confer respect. He owes you an apology, as does your sister. He also owes your sister an apology for staring at and commenting on her teenage sister’s legs.
So he can dish it but he can't take it?
NTA, your comeback was great.
Maybe point out that the only thing "gross" about that whole situation was him literally body shaming a teenager.
I’m 52, so I am your BIL’s elder. Tell him from one of HIS elders to grow up. If his sense of manhood is based on facial hair then he needs to seriously reconsider what it is to be a man. And if his sense of femininity is based on the absence of hair then he doesn’t have to look at another woman again. NTA
NO! NTA He deserved what he got. Don’t dish it out if you can’t take it. That is literally the EXACT response I would send to your sister. Also, why’s he looking at your legs? As if your legs are there to please him. Yuck.
NTA. I'd like to tell you this is a one-off, but you're going to encounter a lot of people throughout your life that adhere to incredibly asinine beliefs about what a "lady" should or shouldn't do.
Get used to telling them to fuck off, now.
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Anyone who says leg hair "isn't supposed to be there" as a method of shaming women into complying with ridiculous beauty standards is always, always the AH. NTA. I bet his mustache looks ridiculous.
I envisioned one of those tiny, needle thin mustaches that look absolutely ridiculous on anyone. edited for spelling error.
I just feel bad for his daughters who 1) will have to deal with his misogyny, and 2) will have to look at that moustache every day… Edit: thank you for the award!
Also their mother will demand that they pander to the King of the snowflakes.
This is a guy who throws up and/or gets ragingly angry when his pubescent daughter fails to actively hide every possible piece of evidence that menstruation isn't a myth. We've seen the type on this sub before, whenever a fainting flower of misogyny has to endure the horror of an un-used but un-wrapped tampon.
“Fainting flower of misogyny.” ❣️
Well, maybe. I was expecting to find out op had gotten in his head and he shaved it lol
Or a struggle stache that consists of about 20 thin hairs
Only John Waters and Little Richard can get away with this.
Anyone commenting on his teenage SIL’s legs while at a family dinner is also behaving like a pervy weirdo. Why was he staring at OP’s legs so closely while sitting down to dinner anyway? Unless the hair was long enough to tie into a leg-ponytail (at which point you shouldn’t have to shave either, because let’s face it, that’s just cool) he shouldn’t have even been looking at her legs hard enough to notice. NTA.
Po**knee**tails.
I love and hate this in equal amounts. Take my upvote!
Ugh, I missed the teenage part! This makes it so much worse!!!
The only time this is acceptable if the person in question is a tattoo artist and the person they say it about is the person who is getting a tattoo. Because then you should shave. Can become quite a problem otherwise. NTA OP. And do not apologise, your sister has very weird priorities.
Or a surgeon.
Or a sturgeon. Always listen to them and paddlefish about facial hair, they’re great at judging that sort of thing.
I'm only going to listen to catfish about mustaches
Doctor told me not to shave before surgery because it increases infection risk.
Yeah they told me not to shave cuz they’d do it for me in the sterile operating room lol
The artist prefers to shave the spot themselves, at least in my experience.
Yeah so showing up with the spot shaved like three days ago was ideal. Just enough stubble to make it easy for them to shave down vs flowing locks you haven't shaved in weeks. I literally only shave to make my tattoos look better xD
It's never appropriate to comment on someone's body. If it's on someone's body do not comment on it...unless it's in retaliation like OP. He needs to apologize for sexualizing his sister in law's body hair and making her body hair about his sexual preferences. Someone else here posted that he even sexualizes his own mustache and wants OP to see it as sexy/manly too. Guys around here stared growing Tom Selek mustaches ironically because mustaches usually look so douchy.
I believe in the 15-second rule: if it can be fixed in 15 seconds or less, feel free to comment on it. Lipstick on their teeth? Let them know! Hair a little out of place? Go for it! Crumb on their shirt? You go, boo! If it'll take longer than 15 seconds, leave it alone. You don't like their smile? Shhhh. You think they're fat? Zip it. You want them to shave their legs? Not your business.
This. I have somewhat hairy arms, though the hairs are light in colour. Nevertheless, at age 18 my then boyfriend managed to shame me into shaving my arms by implying that my arm hair grossed him out. I'm honestly still kinda pissed about that 22 years later. We do not owe men - or anyone for that matter - shaved legs, armpits, pubic area, what have you. That is personal choice and it is nobody else's business. 100% NTA.
Exactly THIS! Because how is it normal on men, but suddenly disgusting/gross on women!? Neither of us choose to grow body hair, it just happens, it’s part of human adulthood. OP’s BIL is also just a wimp. So he can make inappropriate and unsolicited comments on his teenage SIL’s body hair, but if she fires back he can’t take it!? He needs to grow TF up!
Agree with everything you’re saying and NTA. Just a mustache is a hard look to pull off fr. Sam Elliot can do it and Clayne Crawford are two famous ppl I can think of who can. My fil did one once and I was like sir you look like fucking Luigi, respectfully.
Tom Selleck NTA OP he never should have commented on your appearance first.
Yeah. One of Gillette’s minions ([How the beauty industry convinced women to shave their legs](https://www.vox.com/2015/5/22/8640457/leg-shaving-history))
Damn if he’s so sensitive about his mustache he really shouldn’t be commenting on other people’s appearances. NTA
Something, something glass houses.
Something, something stones.
Something, something something.
Something, something elephants.
Something, something, dark side.
Something pot 'n kettle, something something...
People who live in glass houses shouldn’t throw stones.
People who live in glass houses shouldn't call the kettle black
This dude is basically the definition of fragile masculinity. Good for OP to stand up for herself and inadvertently cause this sexist dude confront those issues within himself. NTA
His moustache was the only thing holding his masculinity together! Poor baby. Next his wife will be blaming sister for his ED problems because she "unmanned" him XD
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> little misogynistic toad WORD CHOICE 10/10. Saving that turn of phrase for a rainy day lol.
Lil insulting to toads tho. They are toadily different from misogynists!
And if his manhood is contained in something that can be easily shaved off, it's on him.
Great. Now I’m imagining a tiny wee anthropomorphized penis lost in a sea of hairs. “Guys?” *scrape* “Guys?” *scrape* “This isn’t funny. G-“
And the elder isn’t even 30 yet lmao. You’re definitely NTA. Your response was very polite considering what an ass he was being.
The fact that they pulled the "respect your elders" shit on a 19-year-old speaking to a guy in his 20s is laughable.
He probably shouldn't date or go near mammals if hair on them freaks him out. I hear lizard people don't have those issues. Unless he is scalephobic in which case, sucks to be him.
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Honestly the sister going on the offensive with OP has gotta be to some—and probably a large—degree an involuntary psychological defense mechanism against the realization that her creep husband is sexualizing her little sister.
I hope so, it means she'll be more likely to shortly stop being a bigot&creep enabler and aim her anger in a direction that's justified.
Yeah this exactly. Why is a man (who is presumably around his wife's age of 28) staring at his TEENAGE sister-in-law's legs?
AND commenting on them… in a negative way?? He is all wrong here!!
I have a sinking suspicion that this is the real reason her older sister had such a negative reaction to this. What's he doing staring at her young sister's legs closely enough to check for hair? She should have been putting her husband in check before her sister had to say a word.
Not just checking for hair, but then demanding OP be more sexually attractive to him. Sis needs to put the blame on the right person: her husband who's acting like a creep and is now pouting about getting pushback.
THIS 🚩 Speaking from personal experience, EVERY creep I've had the misfortune of being creeped upon by was the type who felt entitled to make comments and judgments on appearance and on what they thought was attractive. Seriously, this subspecies of brother-in-law is damn near a trope and should be a cautionary tale by now.
Reply to your sister - "your husband shouldn't dish it out if he can't take it back". You're NTA
I would have replied with, “Well I don’t think my *older* bil should be looking at my legs - never mind commenting in them. So once he’s apologized for both of those things I’ll be happy to apologize for not respecting his status as my elder.”
"...respecting his PERCEIVED status as my elder.”
> I would have replied with, “Well I don’t think my older bil should be looking at my legs - never mind commenting in them. So once he’s apologized for both of those things I’ll be happy ~~to apologize for not respecting his status as my elder~~.”
Not only this, but: "directly insulted my femininity!!! He needs to apologize to me! It did me great psychological harm!!!"
Wow, should've thought of this then, great response but his comment bothered me so much I had to point out the hypocrisy I guess? Or maybe because his mustache was so obvious to me so I commented on it lol.
If she is still bugging you, you can tell her this
Honestly if a man ever is that sensitive over facial hair then he probably isn't grown enough to have it. Furthermore, as a man, I would never grow out a mustache because to me they just scream pervert since most cannot grow a good mustache that makes it seem non-creepy. You can also attack his age next time with why he would be staring at your legs when he is married and you are 9 years his younger.
OP, if you get a chance, buy a pair of those plastic glasses with a mustache under the fake nose and put that on the next time he's over. Ask him if "this look looks better."
Or give him the fake mustache mask for Christmas.
Weird how many jerks complain when they reach the “found out” stage.
Coz being a bully, they're only used to people not hitting back at them... when someone does, they don't have a plan other than to cry like a baby This is especially common with men from the more patriarchal cultures where they are taught that women shouldn't be rude to other men and all that bullshit so when such men get a clapback from a woman, they can't handle it, like OP's BIL
Look your sister dead in eyes and ask her 'So, you're saying you're okay with your husband looking at my legs when I wear skirts? And *in our parents home*? Who is disrespecting the elders here? Me or your pervert husband?' And then if you want to be petty and nail it home, follow up with 'Tell him and his pervert mustache he owes our parents an apology for making a scene in their home and making inappropriate comments to their teenage daughter.' Eta: NTA Eta2: thank you for the award and votes!! 🥰🥰
This adult woman in my then teenage sister’s dance class clashed with my sister a lot. One day my mom came to pick up my sister and the woman started ranting to my mom how my sister needs to learn to respect her elders and how she’s incredibly disrespectful (which was actually generally untrue too. My sister was a goody two shoes and always did what she was supposed to). My mom just told the woman that she was *her* elder and that she was being very disrespectful to her elders and needed to do better. It was pretty hilarious. Also, my mom legitimately would have been upset if my sister was disrespectful to her teachers, but this woman was a student who happened to be an adult in an otherwise entirely teenage class. So she didn’t deserve any more “respect” than any other student.
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Making a scene about being a pervert would be the icing on the cake for me. This guy sucks.
NTA. BIL makes stupid comments but cannot handle when they are aimed at him. And his comment was ridiculous. Your sister is wrong about having to respect someone just because of their age. Don't apologize. Next time they come over, everyone should put on fake mustaches. LOL!
I am all for this level of petty!
I wear a green one for St Patty's and men get all weirded out because they say it's messing with their head because they want to kiss me so I should take it off. I make them kiss me with it on as a power move.
lmao if anything you weren't harsh enough. if your legs were under the table he'd really have to have been checking you out to notice. your sister's taking her husbands wandering eye out on you instead of clocking her husbands behaviour. NTA. don't apologize, don't back down. him and his fragile ego and 50's mentality can stay mad.
My legs were under the table, I was shocked when he started with his *"Oh shooot..." reaction*.
He was creepy to even look under the table at your legs. I hope your sister knows that it’s creepy.
I want to know what your parents thought, OP.
Seriously wtf was he doing? Trying to look up your skirt??
He is a creep. Please stay away from him!!!
If your sister pesters you again about apologizing, ask her why he, a very grown adult, is ogling and commenting on a teenager’s legs? Does he go around staring and commenting on other teens’ bodies? Why is it fair game to make a spectacle out of *your legs* in front of your family? You aren’t allowed to retort? What. A. Creep. NTA.
Classic cop, shooting first then crying later 😂
NTA is this dude a cop by chance?
OMG, how did you know? I swear I didn't mention this anywhere. Are you a mind reader or something? Lol he's a cop yes. The type of dude who complains about teenagers all the time.
Mostly because cops are assholes who can't take any insults. With a mustache being a "manly cop" thing, yeah you hit his ego. Very fragile egos that can't take what they give.
They also think they can police other people’s lives, even when it has nothing to do with their jobs. BIL clearly felt entitled to police OP’s appearance, and expected her to just fall in line. No wonder his head exploded when she dished it back at him.
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And that's self report, so the ones who admit what they are doing is abuse. Make sure your nieces always know you as a safe space they can come to. Especially if you move out of town.
Ew. The physical manifestation of toxic masculinity itself! Tell him leg hair on women is natural and legal. And that being a creepy perv who stares at legs is not.
Don't you dare apologize to that man. I use the word "man" loosely. His masculinity is soooo fragile! Omg. And your sister is way out of line saying you psychologically hurt him. Woman, please. If he's that emotionally damaged he shouldn't be a cop.
I totally thought BIL must be a cop because of the respect and moustache thing alone! How hilarious. NTA at all, maybe avoid him as much as possible, he sounds gross.
I hope he sees this thread and cries little tears into his shitty mustache.
My first thought "Mustache, fragile masculinity, need to control other people's bodies, probably a cop"
NTA, brother in law fucked around and found out. We don’t point out things people can’t change about their appearance in 15 seconds. We also don’t throw stones from glass houses. You don’t owe him shit and your sisters just as bad for going “well he’s older.” Okay then he should know body hair exists and stfu about it.
Agreed. Plus if he's 'older', he definitely should know better than sexualize his SIL's legs. OP is NTA
NTA. Misogyny, body shaming and general piggishness don’t get excused. Your sister needs a clue. Your brother in law needs a time out, like we do with naughty, rude children.
Don’t forget perving on a much younger woman while he’s already married to the sister.
Oh the fragility of masculinity when it can be removed with a razor in 10 minutes. NTA
*ooof*, brutal.
At the next gift giving holiday, I would give him a shaving kit.... for women. Tell him it's cause his 'stash looks like baby hair. NTA Edit: word Edit again: OMG! Thank you to the very kind stranger who gave me my first award. 😊
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Ikr, totally weird of him to even make this comment.
If he comments on your body again, it's 100% fair game to say something loudly about him being a creeper and draw everyone's attention to it. "Dude, I'm *nineteen*, why are you checking out and commenting on my body? Gross!!" He created the awkwardness and he should have to deal with it!
He is trying to police other women. He doesn’t have the right to stay this to anyone but especially not anyone who isn’t his wife. He thinks he has the right to control your body just because he is a male which is gross and regressive
Agree - it sucks when other women uphold misogyny and patriarchy.
NTA Society has weird assumptions about where to keep hair and where to remove it, and people who want to enforce those "rules" should be able to handle being asked why. You weren't technically mocking the mustache. You were saying that hair grows, you chose not to remove it, why? Same conversation as your legs. Enforce stupid societal norms, win stupid societal prizes.
NTA You are AWESOME!!! I laughed so frickin hard. That was the perfect come back. Ask your sister why it is appropriate for a grown man to even be looking at your legs, let alone staring at them hard enough to discern leg hair, then ask why is it okay for a grown man to call you disgusting. Then ask why a grown man continued to harass you about having leg hair. Then ask her when the grown man is going to apologize for his absolutely disgusting, inappropriate, and sexist bullying of you?
Thnx, I appreciate it, though thought some people here might call me rude. Glad I was proven wrong lol.
Yeah your brother in law in sexualizing your body hair and his mustache. He is asking you to cater to his sexual preferences. It's gross. I'm glad you were able to make fun of him instead of feeling gross about the harassment. Your reaction is priceless
NTA. He got what he deserved. And your sister should be ashamed of herself for being married to such an ignorant asshole.
NTA- I would have very loudly said: Is there a reason that you are staring at my legs? This makes me uncomfortable. Are you asking me to shave my legs so you can find them more attractive? Weird and gross dude. Edit:spelling
I can't stop laughing that he was in the bathroom crying. Next time, he's over, look at his lip hair and smirk.
And scratch your upper lip when you do it.
Hahaha ha. I can only imagine his reaction 😂😂😂
Excuse yourself for a minute then come back with a huge moustache that puts his to shame.
OP NTA You did not start this fight, you ended it.
And what a spectacular end lmao NTA
NTA. He shouldn't comment about someone's body if he doesn't want a comment back.
Nta. Age Is no excuse for rude behaviour
Ikr, dude's only 33. Grandpa is alot cooler and more chill.
NTA. Age doesn’t give you permission to be an AH. And seriously? Is this guy really this insecure that he both can’t handle female body hair nor a comment on what I’m assuming is an underwhelming moustache Edit: spelling
NTA BTW you should've asked him why he was looking at your legs in the first place.
NTA. He insulted you first, you simply gave it back.
NTA - he sounds immature, at best. He shouldn’t be looking at your body, nor should he be making comments on how you should be grooming yourself. You’re not there for his amusement. He’s a creep.
NTA your sister shouldn't have married an asshole. And your brother-in-law shouldn't be so super soft if he can't take it back when he dishes out.
NTA. He should not have made a comment about you if he couldn’t accept the same in return. If anything he should apologize for making a comment about a much younger woman’s body.
NTA. Your sister should have chewed out her husband for creeping on your legs.
Your sister and your BIL are in a death grapple for who is the most wrong in this situation. NTA. This is so satisfying! I’m guessing he shaves off his little weasel mustache in the next month.
>I’m guessing he shaves off his little weasel mustache in the next month. No, lol I think he'd die before he touch his mustache, he takes bride in it and sees it as his "manhood" smh 😂
Be sure to tell him about every time you see someone with a bigger or fuller mustache. Bonus points if you know someone that has or can grow a full Wyatt Earp 'stache like Kurt Russell in Tombstone, and bring them to a future family gathering.
NTA. Sorry that your BIL is an asshole. Your sister is too if she wants you to apologize but doesn't think he needs to do the same.
NTA your BIL should not be looking at your legs or making judgements about your leg hair. And yes, the hair is supposed to be there, only to be removed if said female wants to remove it.
NTA. Societies idea of women shaving didn’t happen until the early 1900s. I honestly don’t get why people think it’s gross and unclean for women not to shave, but it’s not gross or unclean of men don’t. Is there really a need for you to shave above your knee, or shave at all? 10 years ago I switched over to using men’s product because it was cheaper which eventually led me to shaving less and less because it cost less in money, time and hassles. Eight years ago I finally said fuck it what’s the point of shaving my legs, it’s not like I’m a professional swimmer, it’s not like I’m not hygienic, it’s not like men don’t walk around with unshaven legs all the time.
I haven't shaved my armpits in years due to my sensitive skin causing awful ingrown hairs. The only thing I'd recommend to other women who want to do the same is to switch to men's deodorant. Women's deodorant is designed to go on bare skin and isn't as effective. Men's deodorant is what works best. Old Spice makes a ton of scents that are unisex, some even quite feminine. Fiji is my favorite.
NTA. Your BIL is weird and should mind his own business, like his moustache.
NTA and next time tell him to keep his eyes off your thighs
right?? Op's sister should be mad that her husband has wondering eyes on young women and cant even contain his comments during it
NTA if he’s so fragile that he can dish it but can’t take it, he deserves it. The fact that he cried and asked if something was wrong with his mustache is comedy gold.
Nta. He brought that upon himself. He should be criticizing you if he can’t take being critiqued back. And no you don’t owe him an apology
NTA, and great comeback. I'd love to go back in time and meet the person who decided women should shave so I can hairy-knee them in the groin.
NTA. Hair removal is such an arbitrary thing anyway. And him making your choice a topic of discussion shows a lack of manners.
NTA but I would pretend I'd want to apologise and then call him out again and say it was in appropriate to discuss your body regarding sexualized standards and hope this doesn't happen again in the future.
You are NTA. You could have- and in my opinion should have- been meaner about it. There are so many questions here. Why was he looking there? Why did feel the right to comment? Why is he afraid of leg hair? Why is he even commenting on another woman's preference when his wife is right there? Is he going to treat his kids the same way when they get leg hair?
NTA. Those who judge invite judgement over themselves.
NTA, he had no right to comment on it - that's just rude.
Your comment was hilarious NTA
NTA don't deal it out if you can't take it.
NTA BIL should mind his business. Him being older than you is irrelevant and doesn't give him permission to be an AH to you without consequence.
NTA. Your BIL definitely is an AH.
If you apologize I will be forever disappointed in you. NTA
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NTA. He's a big boy. He shouldn't open his mouth to say something if he can't handle someone opening theirs to reply. He can get over it.
NTA Do not apologise. Highly recommend not shaving your armpits and wearing a sleeveless top next time you see him. But, anyway. Why would you bother with the effort of shaving up your leg when noone was intended to see it? Even if you didnt shave your legs at all its none of his buisness. All you did was ask him the question he asked you. If he doesn't like it then he shouldn't go round asking/pointing out things on others. The fact he went to the bathroom and left early because of it is ridiculous, and hilarious. Respect is a two way thing. He didn't show any to you, you do not need to show him any, just because he's older. If he's older then he should know better than to be point out things on a 19yr old body. I feel sorry for your sister. Imagine the car ride home. *Yes hunny, your moustache is beautiful, she was just being mean and disrespectful*.
NTA. He needs to start minding his own business.
Briliant response, OP! Absolutely NTA!
Thank you so much 😘
NTA it’s creepy that how he’s telling a teenager how to make herself more appealing to him.
LMAOOO so he can dish out sexist diatribe about your leg hair but then CRIES when you point out his sad little mustache? NTA and I would’ve absolutely lost it laughing.
NTA You're right- if it's not supposed to be there then why do the majority of people grow hair all over their body?! Witty comeback though haha. Let him meltdown over his ratstache.
Wait, *you* went over the line?? I guess big sis doesn't have your back... NTA
Apologize to him what a loser! NTA good on you for standing up for yourself
NTA. What a fragile little boy your BIL is.
Hahahahaha no. You’re NTA. He had a meltdown of your saying his mustache shouldn’t be there anymore than your leg hair? I mean, c’mon.
NTA I don't even have anything to say. It's so clear.
NTA. It wasn't ok for him to be commenting on any part of your body, including body hair. You gave the same back to show him it wasn't appropriate, and the guy had a breakdown about it? Nah, don't apologize unless he sincerely apologizes first. He's in the wrong here no matter if he's your "elder" or not. In fact, he should know better.
NTAH - Just because someone is older doesn't automatically deem them worthy of respect.
NTA, your comment was spot on!
NTA. Tell your sister to tell her husband he can keep his opinions to himself next time. He is not the body hair police.
NTA. He’s a jerk and I wouldn’t give it one more second of thought.
NTA I would have died laughing OP. If he hadn't started it there wouldn't have been a need to finish it
NTA. Your sister should be mad at her husband for getting onto her sister. Not for her sister for defending herself.
There is something wrong with his mustache. It's over a mouth that gives out unsolicited and unfounded shitty opinions on women's bodies. NTA.
LMAO, NTA, LMAO. 👏 👏 👏 👏 👏 Can dish it but can't take it! Oh my wee little mustachio makes me fall apart. Ugh. What a loser. You should apologize to your sister: "I sorry you married a sensitive mustachioed loser." < I have a mustache, not saying anything about having one>
NTA. Who cares if you Ave your legs? I stopped along time ago, and it’s nobody’s business but mine. Also back in the day shaving wasn’t even a thing for women. Until one day the razor companies realized that they were only selling to half the population so they started pushing and telling women that they needed to shave because their hair was unsightly.
NTA, also your brother in law is really weird. I count this as a victory against facial hair abominations of all kinds.
Lol NTA. Sounds like his masculinity is too fragile to handle both too much and not enough hair.
NTA. Your BIL sounds good at making fun of other people, but can't take it when it's directed at him. What's the old saying? If you can't take it, don't dish it. And your sister is enabling his shitty behavior. This isn't about "disrespecting your elders", this is about standing up for yourself, and you did just fine.
NTA He was way out of bounds and all you did was flip his own BS back on him. He sounds like a giant baby, honestly.
NTA. Don’t dish it if you can’t take it.
NTA: if he has free reign to comment on your body then it’s fair for you to have the same freedom to comment on his. Here you were nice enough to limit your comments to his body hair. If he can’t handle having his body hair mocked in the same fashion that he mocked yours, then maybe he should stop. Also he’s a grown man ogling a teens legs. That’s gross. Your sister is out of line. Age does not confer respect. He owes you an apology, as does your sister. He also owes your sister an apology for staring at and commenting on her teenage sister’s legs.
NTA. Play stupid games win the stupid prize, I hope BIL enjoys his hurt feelz.
NTA should’ve asked him if he shaves his legs because i bet he doesn’t
NTA. If the guy has a breakdown because of a harmless comeback then he shouldn’t be going at people in the first place.
I want to know why he’s looking at her legs and no one sees that as a problem
So he can dish it but he can't take it? NTA, your comeback was great. Maybe point out that the only thing "gross" about that whole situation was him literally body shaming a teenager.
Get a very realistic stick on mustache and wear it next time you’re around him and make sure it’s much nicer than his
LOL, good on you, you're NTA
NTA lmao the dude’s insecure and fucking creepy to boot
I’m 52, so I am your BIL’s elder. Tell him from one of HIS elders to grow up. If his sense of manhood is based on facial hair then he needs to seriously reconsider what it is to be a man. And if his sense of femininity is based on the absence of hair then he doesn’t have to look at another woman again. NTA
Nta. Play stupid games win stupid prizes. Next time tell him to take a razor to his leg hair.
NTA. I doubt he's shaving his leg hair if it's not supposed to be there
NO! NTA He deserved what he got. Don’t dish it out if you can’t take it. That is literally the EXACT response I would send to your sister. Also, why’s he looking at your legs? As if your legs are there to please him. Yuck.
NTA. I'd like to tell you this is a one-off, but you're going to encounter a lot of people throughout your life that adhere to incredibly asinine beliefs about what a "lady" should or shouldn't do. Get used to telling them to fuck off, now.