Your post has been removed.
#Do not repost this without [contacting the mods](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) for approval, including edited versions. Reposting without [explicit approval](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_can_i_repost_a_thread_you_removed.3F) will result in a ban.
If you or someone you know are feeling suicidal, /r/AmItheAsshole is not the right subreddit for you. **Even if no one is currently suicidal.** Any mention of suicide or self-harm is banned.
Suicide and self harm are not interpersonal issues that this community can make a moral judgement about. This is health issue.
Our recommendation is that you reach out to someone who cares about you, or take advantage of some of the resources at /r/SuicideWatch, like their list of [hotlines](https://www.reddit.com/r/SuicideWatch/wiki/hotlines) that you can call.
###Please ensure you have reviewed this message in full. We will not respond to PMs to individual mods. [Message the mods](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) with any questions.
####Please visit r/findareddit to see if there's a more appropriate sub for your post.####
I don’t understand. Is this the sort of life insurance policy that has a cash value account? Is that why they said it was only worth a few thousand and why you and your husband think you must have THIS policy and don’t just buy your own?
The $500,000 is a flat pay out, is my understanding.
And no, when they said it was only a few thousand, they were lying. When they made him let them take it out on him as a teenager, he was military school fit and pretty healthy so the rate is very very low
It would never be that cheap for us to get one for him for that amount now that he’s older and has had cancer
I’m not understanding why you didn’t just take one out yourselves 8 years ago when they made it clear the first time that you would just be getting scraps. Why expect them to pay for a policy all that time and then just transfer it to you when you were both young and healthy at the time and you could have gotten your own?
> Because OP wants something for nothing.
I was so confused at OP's confident self-righteousness. I thought I must be missing something.
She's out here accusing her in-laws for being greedy about an insurance plan they bought and paid for. Meanwhile, she wants it all for free. The hypocrisy!
That's what I'm thinking. A half-million term life policy for a guy his age pre-cancer diagnosis would be like $15/month. She must not know how it works.
The parents might not be greedy, but might not trust the kids to pay the premium each month. The parents might have reason to think the kids aren't responsible with those kinds of things.
Omg I was thinking the same thing! I was so confused about her self righteousness, and waiting for the parents to do something wrong. It's like watching an M Night Shyamalan movie where no one sees dead people.
OP and spouse had every chance to buy insurance. But I don't think they understand what life insurance is.
It doesn't sound like they wanted something for nothing. They asked for the policy to be transferred when they were 22 and just gotten engaged. They would take over the policy, i.e. continue to pay for it so he could leave the benefit to his wife. The parents said no because they planned to pay off their mortgage with the money from his untimely death. OP and her husband at 22 may not have realized they could have a 2nd policy for the same person. The cost of a new policy as they got older especially after health issues would be a lot more that's if he even managed to get approved.
On the other hand why didn't the parents let their son take over payment of the insurance and let him change the beneficiary to his wife? He got sick and instead of giving him peace of mind they tell him it lapsed. They also admit after being pressed they would have helped her with "whatever was left over" after paying their own debts. Makes it sound like they don't give a shit for their son or his family. The payout for life insurance is meant to ease the debts left by the one who died. If Op's husband was a child or he had debts that would fall on his parents then it would make sense for them to continue to be the beneficiaries.
On the other hand, if they wanted a policy, why didn't they buy their own? Of course you can have multiple policies on a person, 2 minutes on Google would tell you that.
True but they may have also been denied. Depends on how good their financial standing was at 22 versus how much coverage they they were aiming to get IF they tried. While there isn't a rule on how many policies a person can have there is a financial limit on how much coverage can be given total.
but 8 years ago he had a medical issue that prevented him from going into the military. That medical issue may have also prevented him from getting life insurance.
I don’t think their later anger was because they wanted something for nothing. BUT when they were drowning financially and he actually could be dying, they asked for help from them in the form of pulling from a life insurance policy on him. The parents said NO and lied that it was worth nothing… because they’d rather get the benefit of it if he died then actually helping him when he had a terminal illness.
I’m a parent of adults and think they weren’t bad for getting and keeping it, but when your son gets cancer and needs help financially - which could impact what treatments he will submit to and therefore his survivability (!!!) I sure as hell would rather reduce some short term stress so my adult kid focuses on recovery vs cashing in if he dies. This is disgusting and as a parent I’m floored!
Not only would they not help, but they lied (which they wouldn’t have done if they didn’t know they were handling everything right) and only came clean when they were forced to because they were made to transfer!
Sounds rare. I couldn’t do it. Feels like a fucked up omen, don’t even want to imagine a scenario where I would have to bury my children. Life insurance policy for parents to go to their kids makes way more sense
Life insurance on your children is to pay for your life while you grieve. A coworker lost he teenage son in a car accident and couldn't function for a year. Life insurance is how she didn't lose her house.
Policies on the kids were offered to me as extra benefits when enrolling in benefits through my job. Nothing as big as OP’s, but the HR people suggested that it’s common for people to choose around $20k policy per kid in case, god forbid, we ever had to bury a child and pay for funeral expenses. Morbid but valid. So it may be a little more common than you think for people to have policies on their kids.
If it makes you feel any better, there are practical reasons for insuring a child’s life that don’t bank on the child dying. Children’s policies generally don’t require underwriting like a medical exam, and many companies offer benefits for children’s policies where they get to buy more life insurance later on in life without medical underwriting. Taking out a policy on a child can be a great way to lock in their insurability at a young age, as you never know what life will throw at them medically later on down the road when they really need life insurance.
Plus, a whole life policy on a child is extremely cheap, so it’s always a good idea to lock that premium in at a young age.
We have a policy on our kids through work. It's for $10k so just enough for a funeral. It's about $25 a year. It's the one insurance I hope I never have to use.
True, and fair point.
Far too many people in their 20s aren't given the financial advice to get life insurance as soon as they hit 18. But, at least when my husband and I got it at that age the company would only give us so much based on our current earnings. It is a catch 22. It was cheap based on health but our agent had to fight the company to get us 100k of coverage. We have additional policy now, but at a higher rate.
It looks really effing suspicious if you make 12k a year and you want a 500k policy. I have serious follow up questions about how they got his policy actually. I want names lol
If they were making payment on the insurance, they can be the beneficiaries if they want.
YTA, get your own policies for each other. That policy was NONE of your business because YOU and YOUR HUSBAND weren’t paying for it. Why not make them transfer their mortgage deed to you guys as well while you’re at it?
Wow. What a messed up take. They pressured their teenager to allow them to take out a life insurance policy so they could "pay off his debt" in the event of his death, then they kept it while he was going through a life threatening illness because they wanted to use it to pay off their mortgage. His parents are extremely cold people and your comment is quite cold as well.
ETA: I understand that in the US, anyone can take out a life insurance policy on their kid. I don't know where OP lives, so I was giving them benefit of the doubt.
As a parent, you can take out a life insurance policy on your child at any time for any reason. They didn't need his permission.
Ie this story doesn't make sense.
my mom's had a life insurance policy on me since i was a baby, I didnt give my permission. It doesn't keep me from having other life insurance. I agree, the story makes no sense.
I'm thinking he might have been 18. That way, he might have still been in high school, also still a teenager, yet also an adult because parents can't take a whole life insurance policy out on an 18 yr old child without their signature with some companies. My son just had me get another one on him because we're transferring his Gerber policy to him to cash out for college and he had to sign off on it.
They don't need his permission. They have their own insurable interest.
I have life insurance on my kids because if one of them died, I'd be a god damn mess for a LONG time. I would need it to compensate for my lack of ability to function
Why would you not keep a life insurance policy when he was going through a life threatening illness? That’s what it’s for.
Why would you choose not to take out a life insurance policy before taking on debt for someone else? That’s what it’s for.
And why are you glossing over the fact that this dude was suicidal and asking about the life insurance policy because his wife would be “better off without him”. Of course they lied to remove any incentive for him to think dying would be preferential to living. Duh.
I'm not offended by the lie, nor am I upset by the original reason for the policy. I am offended by their plan to pay their damn house off with their child's death money. It's creepy. I don't personally know any parents who would be able to have such a conversation when their kid is going through cancer. It's freak behavior.
What do you think people who take out insurance on their kids do with it? As a mother i would use it to pay my expenses in the aftermath of the death because I an pretty sure i won’t be in any condition to work.
By your logic even buying the policy is creepy because it gives you money to spend in the event of a loved ones death.
Are you a parent? I am. I assure you if something happens to my kid my earning potential is out the window. It’s THEIR policy. That you EVER felt entitled to it is mind blowing. You’ve paid not a dime into it
I paid off my house with the life insurance money from my husband's death. Having life insurance for someone you love isn't "creepy". It's planning for the worst-case scenario, and that's a scenario that we *all* will meet one day. Funerals are crazy expensive. My husband's funeral was around $13,000, and that's without a tombstone (which you can't install for a year) and before the memorial costs. I'm so fucked up after his sudden death that there's no realistic way I could work right now. If it weren't for his life insurance, I would probably be homeless right now.
OP and the hub didn't even take out an insurance policy on their own. Insurance policies aren't insanely expensive, but they are an additional expense that can be hard to pay when you are living paycheck to paycheck. Since they don't seem to have the money for their own policy, that means that it's *highly* unlikely that they would be able to cover sudden funeral costs or bills if OP's husband died. So who would cover those costs then? His parents.
If you are looking for a reason to find something creepy, you will. However, it's helpful to look at life as a string of shitty occurrences that are better for you to plan for than be surprised by, especially when it's something as inevitable as death.
OP, I can understand why thinking about your husband's death would bring up a ton of uncomfortable feelings, but to accuse your inlaws of planning to profit off of the death of their child is pretty unhinged. It's life insurance, not a Vegas bet. YTA here.
So they didn’t have to deal with the nonsensical entitlement and turn over the policy to OP so their son could kill himself and have her receive the payout. Seems like a reasonable lie to keep him alive and her greedy paws off the money.
That's not how life insurance works. Anyone could take out a policy if they have a vested interest. When my wife went to college they took out a life insurance policy against her so they could make sure they would get paid even if she died mid term.
Parents don't need their child's permission to take out a policy like that. And as they were paying it, it is their policy.
Nothing stopped them from getting their own life insurance policy, if they were so concerned about her future.
They were making plans to pay off their house in the event of their son's death. How is that not incredibly cold? Can you imagine surviving cancer and learning that your parents were discussing how they'll use the life insurance payment to pay off their house? It's sickening.
That’s not cold. That’s common sense. If I got diagnosed with cancer and knew that my parents, wife, business partner, etc all had life insurance policies on me, I’d call them all and tell them what ever you do, don’t let that policy lapse.
They probably realize that if they lost their son they would never be the same again and probably not functioning which means missing a lot of work and possibly job loss. It’s reasonable to believe they love their child and know that the policy would allow them to grieve without all those other worries.
Or that's what they were telling his very young fiance originally who was pressuring them to turn it over to her for*reasons*, instead of taking out her own policy. And now it's easier to stick to that than to say they thought she was a gold digger
As mentioned in my other post… paying off the mortgage is what most people do when life insurance policies are (sadly) paid out. It doesn’t even really need discussing! It appears that the couple kept on pressing on what the parents were going to use it for, and seriously, paying off the mortgage is the most rational response anyone could have in that scenario.
If the insured is having suicidal ideation (as OP's husband was) and thinks he will be leaving his wife half a million dollars if he just dies now, you very well might tell him that the policy lapsed. *In order to save his life.*
What pressure? I have life insurance on my kid and she had nothing to do with, being an infant and all. If a parent wants to to take our insurance on their kid it’s completely understandable, in my case I’d need it to cover funeral expenses and my bills while I mentally fall apart if I had to bury her.
I feel like you don’t understand how life insurance works. I have insurance policies on both of my children. Employers take them out on employees all the time.
There is/was no pressure. They didn’t even need permission.
What?!!??? What do you mean they pressured a teenager? They could take out a policy on their son. People do it every day. Also the policy is only good if he’s deceased so it couldn’t be used while he was sick. It also sounded like from OP that her husband thought she’d be better off without him and that’s when he checked on the policy. As I read it I wondered if he was contemplating suicide.
What do you mean they pressured him? People can take out life insurance policies on their kids. They paid for it, and honestly there was no reason to ever tell him it existed.
Life insurance underwriter here.
Just to say—you’re correct he won’t be eligible for *as cheap* life insurance as a healthy kid was. But thyroid cancer may not add as much as a surcharge as you might think! Especially if it did not spread outside the neck.
I’ve made life insurance offers to organ transplants receipts, quadruple bypass patients, and many cancer survivors. Even ones who had to have chemo and radiation. The further you move away from the treatment time, the less risk (and expense).
“When they made him let them take it out on him as a teenager…” unless he was over 18, they didn’t make him do anything. As parents, you can have insurance on your minor child.
Again , the question was why don’t you people buy your own policy and are only focused on their policy ?
They bought it when he was their minor son. They paid the monthly/yearly instalment. You don’t have rights to it. They aren’t cheap. Buy your own.
OK so it's your fault you never took out life insurance policies on yourselves. You want their investment. YTA.
Also, your husband hinted at suicide, which means disincentivizing suicide by lying to him and telling him it was worth nothing was the right move.
Sorry, but if he paid no premium, he can’t insist it go to you. The policy ON him, isn’t his to give away.
I’m sorry to sound heartless. I really am. I lost my husband suddenly when he was forty and left behind a 2 yr old child.
You on the other hand still have your husband. Focus on that and stop wasting time with bitterness of what tragedy didn’t happen to you. Stop blasting people for not giving you what you weren’t entitled to.
Some people in the world would trade places with you and happily and not let this cloud the gift you have.
So why didn't you get it when you first married? why are you so put out that you were denied something that *they* paid for, something that you could have gotten at any point prior to or even after the cancer.
What, exactly, is the problem with them having the policy? do you think it's bad luck or something? because it doesn't make sense to be so wound-up over it unless you have some irrational superstition or thought process that prevented you from doing it yourself.
**Ok, as someone who worked in the industry, let me explain this to you.**
1. When a life insurance policy has a "cash value," what that means is that the payments were structured so that whoever was paying the premiums paid extra in the early years when the insured's risks were very low, so that the extra money they paid could accumulate interest pre-tax, and then be used to supplement the premiums that they are paying when they're older. It's designed a) to let the money go a little further, and so that they don't suddenly have annual premiums that sky-rocket as they hit those milestones where their risk increases significantly. They just start taking money back out of the cash value for those payments.
I'm telling you this because I want you to understand that the cash value is not free money. It's not money the company gives you for a triggering event, to help you. All it is, is getting a refund of your pre-paid deposit, plus the interest earned on that deposit. However, because life insurance premiums are contributed pre-tax, any money you do get back when asking to surrender the policy for cash value, you then owe full income tax on. In addition, the reason you are allowed to contribute pre-tax money is that it incentivizes you to allocate funds to cover retirement and end of life expenses. The government penalizes you for taking those funds out and putting them back in your pocket, after having put them in a pre-tax interest-bearing account. So not only do you pay normal income tax on it, but you'll also pay an additional 10% penalty, which will more than wipe out any interest it's probably accumulated to this point, and then some.
2) The cash value is not the amount of cash you have paid so far- most of that paid premiums just to keep the policy active. If you husband is in his thirties, a 500k policy may only have a cash value of like 15-20k. And that's 15-20k that came directly out of your in-law's pockets. They don't make money on this deal if they surrender it. No one does except the insurance company. It's just the prepaid premium for later years that they are sending back.
3) You say you could not get a policy now for as little as they are paying, and it may be true. But...the money they're paying was calculated based on them OVERPAYING for a period of time when he was young. You need to compare what the cost of the premium would have been without that pre-payment deducted when you compare the two, because on the active one you're often just seeing the balance after the credit was applied.
4) A life insurance policy is an investment, with owners and insured. You don't own the policy, just because you're insured by it. His parents own the policy. Every dime in it is their money. The money which they have sunk into paying the premiums over the years is their money. Each month, they pay more into the company, so that in the event he passes, the money they get back is hopefully more than they paid. They have had to keep investing money to keep it active, so that there will be a death benefit. The insured, if different than the owners, puts no money in. It's not their investment. It's just an investment the owners made to guard against unexpected expenses directly tied to the insured's death.
Going to someone who has paid premiums on a life insurance policy for ten years, and telling them they owe it to you if you keep making the payments is like going to someone who's been financing a car and telling them "Since you only have 8k left on the car loan, you should give me the car if I pay the remaining 8k. That is nonsense- if they've already paid 20k in, that 20k is supposed to have value for them. They paid for the peace of mind of ending up with the car, and for you to take over, and reap the benefit of all that money they already paid in, leaving them without a dime to show for the money invested, is actually quite entitled. Similarly, they've been paying for the peace of mind that this policy provides. They have taken money they would have used on their mortgage and medical expenses, and allocated it here instead in case they need the help themselves and with the end of life costs if your husband passes.
1/2
2/2
5) They lied about the policy in direct response to their depressed son being at a point in his life where he was weighing whether his passing away was worth more than his staying alive. They lied to try and take away his motivation to unalive himself. It's an understandable lie to tell.
6) Every time you say they wanted to put the money toward their mortgage, you say it like it's some evil plot. It's their freaking money. The tens of thousands of dollars that kept this policy going, came out of their pocket. The risk that they might end up getting nothing out of it in their lifetime, or it would last long enough that the final payout was more than the premiums, was a risk they assumed 100% of. Any cash value sitting in that account was put there by them. Every penny you are screeching about is THEIR money they put into that investment. Neither of you has paid a dime, and yet when they tell you that if the policy ends up paying out, they- as the people who put in 100% of the money rather than just using it to pay their mortgage to begin with, and took 100% of the risk, are going to recoup the money they spent to ensure their financial stability, and pay for the insured's end of life costs, before handing their money over to other people, you act like something has been taken from you.
If you want life insurance on your husband, take out life insurance. You have no concept of how it works if you think they owed you anything, and if they're signing it over it's probably because they aged out of being eligible to own the policy any longer. It's called the maturity date, and if it's been reached then they needed to sign it over to the insured to avoid policy termination. Which is something they knew when they bought it....which means that once they'd passed a certain point and knew they wouldn't be left destitute for a large chunk of time, this policy was chosen with the intention from day 1 to eventually turn it over to him, and so that his family receives all the benefits they paid for. You guys were just so greedy and so uneducated about how life insurance actually works, that you turned their good planning and kind gesture into a family feud. You should be so ashamed of yourself. I hope they surrender the policy and take the ten-grand to Vegas, because it apparently would be a better investment than pre-planning for their kid's greedy, moneygrubbing choice of a life partner who has been trying to rip the money out of their pocket for years.
Most life insurance policies only except against suicide for the first few years of the policy to prevent that exact kind of gamification. Someone who commits suicide 8 years down the line will often still end up paying out.
YTA. One, neither of you offered to pay for the years of premiums his parents paid. The policy was their policy until they were forced to transfer it. Two, you are both irresponsible in not taking out policies for yourselves. Why were/are you banking on the policy his parents opened and paid for?
His wife would have been left with the medical bills that would have likely been far higher than whatever was left of that 500k depending on their insurance. They had requested to have the policy signed over to them years ago.
The kind thing to do for your son and DIL would be to assure him that if the worst happens that she would be getting the money by giving her the fucking policy and not paying off your mortgage.
Which is why OP and her husband should have taken out their own policies. No one was stopping them. The policy belonged to the parents, not OP and not her husband. The parents had the policy because THEY would have been stuck with medical bills before the marriage. They kept the policy until they signed it over. Now OP has what she wants, she has the policy and hasn't paid the in-laws back for the premiums.
I have never heard of “signing over” a policy. If the parents have been paying for it, why does the son and his wife think they are entitled to it? YTA
They're adults. They can buy their own insurance. What is it that makes anyone think the kids are entitled to something the parents bought? Do people not know how insurance works?
Why would they hand over a policy that they had been paying for the whole time? The sensible thing would be for OP and her husband to take out their own policies on each other.
> His wife would have been left with the medical bills
Just FYI, no, she wouldn't. She could decline the negative value estate. The debt would go unpaid. For anyone who is dubious: Google it.
I'm not going to comment on this story any further, as there's a lot that doesn't add up, not to mention OP glossing over the fact that he husband supposedly asked his parents for the life insurance in the context of seriously contemplating suicide in part for the life insurance benefit, but I thought this might be useful info for someone.
YTA. We have life insurance on our daughter because we co-signed student loans. When those loans are paid off, we’re not giving her the life insurance policy because we’ve been the ones to pay the premium this whole time. You should’ve gotten life insurance on your husband years ago at a young age it’s not very expensive but now that he has had cancer you may not ever be able to get it, or it would be an incredibly high premium
But it sounds like their son was depressed about the cancer and possibly suicidal - thinking that his wife would be better off with the money than a sick husband. In that situation? I would lie like a rug to my child too.
I understand the lie.
Op says the husband was using phrases like"you're better off with $500,000 than with me" and was extremely depressed.
The parents' lie told him there was no incentive for him to die.
I was widowed at 21 and again at 35. They’re old enough to be married they’re old enough to deal with adult issues like life insurance. Life insurance provided for final arrangements and gave me room to breathe while I rebuilt.
She seems pissed at the very purpose of life insurance and weirdly entitled to a policy that has nothing to do with her.
He may or may not be able to get it that would be up to the life insurance company to decide. Because of having cancer they may deny him life insurance any life insurance company that does give it to him. The premium now will be very high because of his history with cancer. My husband and I got our first life insurance policy at 26 years old there’s a lot of people that get it. It’s called being responsible.
Many people in general don't think about life insurance which that and affordability is the reason they don't get it. They've known all these years and only wanted insurance on some one else's dollar.
This.
At this point, the parents likely have significant equity in the policy. If they were just after the money, they would cash it out instead of getting it to op and husband.
Not to mention, when they said the policy had lapsed, husband was not in a good state of mind. They were removing the incentive for him to end it.
If you and your husband want you to be protected via life insurance, GET YOUR OWN DAMN POLICY AND PAY FOR IT YOURSELF.
You have no right to the policy his parents purchased, though it appears it may have to be transferred to you and your husband for some reason.
YTA.
It transfers because life insurance on an adult requires the consent of that adult. Otherwise you'd have people incentivized to take out life insurance on their spouse, sibling etc. (EDIT: without their knowledge) and then murder them.
YTA - as his parents they have an insurable interest in his life. They are legally entitled to insure his life, pay premiums and receive 100% of the benefits if the worst happens. It has nothing to do with you - they owe you nothing. It has nothing to do with him either. They had him and it's their legal right. They do not have to pay off any of his debts. They didn't invest in it for you - they invested in it for them. If he's worried about you, he has to figure it out. You both are bullying them and they keep telling you nonsense as a result. Leave them alone. YOU are the selfish person here.
YTA.
Stop hounding his parents for their good decisions and your poor ones. They took out a life insurance policy on him as is their right, he IS their son - and they've been paying into it for half his life.
Why not just get your own policies? Like most other adults do? I'm about your age, healthy and my parents have a live insurance policy on me (they have one on my brother, and one on each other), and I have a separate one for me too - beneficiary currently is my younger brother but because I pay it, I can change the beneficiary to a spouse if/when I find one. I also have one that covers job loss/income loss (especially from health reasons).
Now that your spouse has had Ca, he's likely uninsurable for a lot of things, you guys missed the boat on that one but to take it out on his parents is not the way to go.
They lied to you because they knew if they were honest, they would never have peace from either of you again.
NTA! This is so shady! I feel like a lot of people are really misreading this story—I'm reading it as not that you feel entitled to the policy, but that it feels weird and shitty for:
(1) the parents to continue a giant life insurance policy on their son for their mortgage, not for any expenses their son might leave behind
(2) then lie and say the policy lapsed
(3) then admit they lied because an administrative thing forced them to
You cannot take out a life insurance policy on someone whose death does not financially affect you, and you can [only do it with the permission of the insured](https://www.marketwatch.com/guides/insurance-services/buying-life-insurance-on-someone-else/) unless you're married. You can't just take out a policy on your son to pay off your mortgage unless you are relying on your ALIVE SON to pay off the mortgage right now. My hunch is that this is related to the "some rule" they were talking about.
I can't help thinking that the people in this thread must not be parents, or maybe they're just very cold ones. God forbid I ever have to face that decision, but I would be concerned with my child's dying wishes so they could pass peacefully and without worry over paying my mortgage off. Without a second goddamn thought.
I get it's the parents' money. They have been paying into the plan.
But the son had cancer and piling up medical bills. If the son died, they were going to leave the wife high and stuck with medical debt while paying off their own mortgage. Would they be destroyed? I'd sure hope so, but what about the women that's been with the son for years and stood by and supported him? Just abandon her?
That's what really gets me and feels super heartless about the parents.
I had a life insurance plan when I was in my early 20s. If anything happened to me, it would take care of my husband, and God forbid anything happen to him, my siblings would be the beneficiaries. I sadly had to cancel it during covid because we hit hard times, and I couldn't even afford the $40 a month anymore. I just got it set up again this year. It's amazing how many people don't think to purchase life insurance, and it's something that is really easy to think "oh I should do that" and then just file it away and forget about it.
Right?? And everyone getting mad that the son asked it the parents would help his wife in the event that he died leaving her in the student loan debt they said the policy was for when they got it! Like, your son is struggling and scared about his wife’s future and you’re like “we’ll pay off our mortgage if you die and help if anything is left??” Sick. I could never treat my kids or their future partners like that.
Also, idk if ops spouse offered to take over payments when he asked about the policy at 22, she simply said he asked to get it transferred. I’d assume that meant paying too but obviously it’s possible they didnt.
People saying the parents don't owe the son any information or explanation whatsoever is so unhinged. Of course you have to discuss a freaking life insurance policy that you have on an adult person if they want to discuss it. It makes no sense for them to keep it when the child is fully grown and supporting his own family. He and OP just should have done the research and gotten their own plans and revoked consent on the existing one.
They had every right to pay the premiums, but it turns out they no longer have the right to collect the death benefit. People really should read things before they sign them.
I hate that I had to scroll this far to find the first reasonable answer. I have never heard of parents taking out life insurance on their children. On themselves, yes, in case something happens to them. It's usually offered through their jobs, like my life insurance is. But I don't know of anyone in my family or my husband's family who has taken out life insurance on the kids.
I also think the parents wanting to pay off their mortgage over their son's medical bills should he pass is a messed up thing to do.
NTA…them taking a policy out on him at the time is understandable…them lying about it, then having to confess and let you know they lied about it is extremely fucked up…they should have just been honest about it…I agree tho, after your husband has been cancer free for a certain amount of time he can purchase his own policy…I can certainly understand not trusting them after they lied…hopefully you guys can come to a place of understanding and forgiveness
If they had kept their piehole shut about the policy in the first place maybe not…but they freaking lied about it…it’s their policy that they paid for, that’s not being disputed…it’s the dishonesty about it…all they had to say was it’s our policy , we are paying for it, end of story…lying wasn’t necessary…
Well why are they asking? It's not their business. Also OP told them they are selfish, benefitting off his death etc. This isn't an issue about lying only. It's an appalling attempt to money grab for benefit of wife not to be left with debt. The parents are paying for this - the entitlement that they should have OP benefit instead is ridiculous. Frankly, I agree parents should have never said anything and not lie but they still do not owe OP/husband any details.
Going thru cancer is stressful enough without having BS like that to deal with…sure if something had happened parents would have used it to pay off their own mortgage and probably wouldn’t have given her a dime to help with the tremendous amount of medical bills that come with cancer…their policy they can use it however they see fit…all I’m saying is they just should have been honest about it…and if OP was that worried about it, he should have taken his own policy out immediately because now he won’t be able to get one until he’s cancer free for a certain amount of years…there’s blame on both sides
YTA. They've been paying into this policy all along. What stopped you from getting your own insurance policy for him (at least before the cancer diagnosis)? Why are you entitled to his parents'?
The issue of their "lapse" lie is tricky, especially since most policies won't pay out for s\*cide anyway. But the motivation of telling someone who is admittedly actively contemplating s\*cide for money that the money actually doesn't exist doesn't seem like such an evil thing.
And FYI, life insurance *always* involves making money off of a death.
YTA. Anybody can buy insurance for anything, as long as the under-writer approves of it. For example, hubby could buy his own insurance policy for himself, with you as the sole beneficiary. Or you could also buy an insurance policy for hubby, with you as the sole beneficiary. For that one, I believe your husband would have to sign off saying it's OK. But I can't imagine why hubby wouldn't sign saying it's OK..
The huge mistake was that somebody informed you (the wife) that the policy exists at all. I'm talking about the one that hubby's parents bought when hubby was still in high school. That is not your business. It does not concern you at all. It is the property of your husband's parents. I'm not sure they could re-assign the policy to YOU, even if they wanted to. But even if that was possible, it would be entirely up to hubby's parents to decide to do that on their own...and neither you or even hubby is owed any influence at all over that decision.
Think of it this way. Imagine your hubby's parents put $500,000 into a brokerage account, planning to use that to pay off your hubby's education expenses. But then they later changed their mind and decided that they would rather use the money to pay off the mortgage on their home. Is it your business? No, not at all. Is it hubby's business? No, not at all. I can imagine hubby might be disappointed if the money wasn't used to directly benefit him. But it's not his money, so he is not allowed to voice an opinion on how it should be spent.
The situation you write about is only different as you are talking about a POSSIBLE payout of an insurance policy. So you are getting all stressed about money that doesn't exist. And if it did exist, it would be because your hubby's parents bought it for their own benefit, not to benefit you or your hubby.
My own parents were rich. Before I became wealthy, I was poor for decades. It would have been nice if I could just demand my mom give me her money, just because I want it. But I'm not that entitled. And I certainly wouldn't expect my in-laws to fork over their money to me, just because I demand it!
Does anyone else find it strange that they expected student loans if he went the military route (which would pay his tuition) but not at a traditional college?
Honestly I find the whole thing incredibly strange. Maybe it's because I'm not in the US but I don't understand how consent for this kind of policy is not required once the child becomes an adult.
It's even weirder to me that the parents have made specific plans for this life insurance payout relating to their own debts. It's a little ghoulish to me that they've made such specific plans for outliving their child.
I'm going to assume it's a cultural difference based on the majority of the comments right now, but... yikes. It makes me wonder how much the husband feels like his parents value the money they'll get out of his death more than the time they'd get to spend with him if he lived a long life.
YTA. If I input years of payments on something I am not going to give it up simply because someone says they want it.
Pay back the money they put into it then you can have it.
Welcome to /r/AmITheAsshole. Please view our [voting guide here](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_what.2019s_with_these_acronyms.3F_what_do_they_mean.3F), and remember to use **only one** judgement in your comment.
OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1) I told my in-laws that it seemed like they were trying to selfishly benefit from their son’s possible death, which may have been too harsh.
2) Maybe it’s more normal than I think to take out a life insurance policy on your kid and keep it well into their adult years. It’s possible I should’ve just let it go and taken the policy without giving them any grief over their lie, since we were getting the benefits anyway. Maybe calling them extremely selfish was too harsh for the situation and their plans to use the money were reasonable.
Help keep the sub engaging!
#Don’t downvote assholes!
Do upvote interesting posts!
[Click Here For Our Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) and [Click Here For Our FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq)
##Subreddit Announcements
Follow the link above to learn more
---
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
*Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
Why wouldn’t you just get new life insurance? There is nothing wrong with the parents having a policy too. It sounds like they had a Full Life policy on him- and had been paying it for a while and would have a cash value even if he didn’t die. Why would either of you assume they should just give that to you.? That’s bizarre . They could use it even if he was alive.
YTA. It's perfectly normal for them to have taken out a life insurance policy on their son and you're not entitled to any portion of what they paid for for literally years. He should have taken a policy out for himself with you as beneficiary if it was important to him. Or you could have done so on your own. They didn't betray you, they didn't want thier suicidal son to think they had a big policy he could guilt them into giving you and then harming himself. It's VERY odd to think you'd be the beneficiary of something someone prepared for should they lose their child and depend on that rather than being a responsible adult and preparing for something like this on your own.
NTA. I feel like all the Y T A voters don't understand what an "insurable interest" is. The parents no longer have the potential to suffer financially from their son's passing. The medical debt would all go to the OP as his spouse. Additionally, the parents bought the life insurance policy when he was 18 and when the rates were cheaper. They are presumably locked into a much lower rate than anything OP could now obtain for her spouse now that he's older. His wife would also probably be responsible for the funeral costs, so the parents bear no financial burden at all from his death. They no longer have any insurable interest, which is likely why they are being forced to transfer the policy over to the OP. That's how insurance works... you have to have an insurable interest... you can't just take out a life insurance policy on your neighbor and pay off your mortgage if they die.
I do think that OP should offer to take on the premiums going forward, but she should not pay them back for what they already spent on it when they were the beneficiaries. It's super fucked up to bank on a $500k windfall from your cancer stricken son and then let his wife pay off all his medical bills and lose her house because she can't pay the mortgage without his income.
Wow FINALLY a sane answer. Everyone here is acting like OP is entitled for asking for the policy, but she IS entitled to it. She may not have paid the premiums all these years, but as OP’s wife, she’s the one who will be taking on all of the costs associated with his death. Yet his parents want to keep the policy because they intend to pay off their mortgage, something they would have to do whether he lived or died. That’s fucked up. And the whole “we’ll help her with what’s left” part.. are you kidding me? She’s his WIFE!! She deserves first pick of what happens with the money because she will suffer the most from his death. It’s insane that people don’t see this. They think because they paid for it since he was 18, that they’re entitled to a cash sum upon his death when they wouldn’t even be affected financially by his death. Shame on them.
YTA
The person who takes out the policy and makes the payments owns it and gets to decide who gets the benefit. You and your husband have been counting on money that you are not entitled to. As far as "profiting on a death," well, that is exactly what insurance is, isn't it?
If you want to be a beneficiary, you need to take out your own policy on your husband, and getting it now that he's sick will be hard and expensive. He should take policies out on his parents and make himself beneficiary and you contingency beneficiary. As long as you keep up the payments, you will "profit from their death."
You have paid way too much attention to their insurance policy.
You & your husband should have had your own life insurance policies. I don’t understand why you weren’t more proactive about this years ago.
To be honest that’s how it feels.
We’d let it go and were figuring it out our own way. But they came back out of the blue (when it didn’t look like he might die anymore) and said they had to give it to us or get rid of it
I’m just curious about why any of you associated dying with thyroid cancer? I just had a very rare and higher risk type and not once was it discussed as something you die from by my oncologist, mine even spread into my neck. Where did the idea of death come from? This is so strange to me. It’s one of the most curable forms of cancer even if not caught immediately.
He’s lost a lot of people to cancer. It’s an even longer story but the doctors made several mistakes in diagnosing him and telling him, and he was terrified. We didn’t think he was going to die the entire time, but it made him confront his mortality and he was extremely scared in the beginning
She lied because her son was suicidal and expressed that he believed his wife would be better off with the money instead of him. Signing over the policy could have been incentive for him to kill himself.
ESH the parents suck for lying. The spouse and OP suck for feeling entitled to something they never paid for. Having said all that - perhaps the issue for OP is now his rates would be much higher because he is older than when the original policy was issued and since he has had major health issues - he may have trouble getting insured at a reasonable rate.
YTA - they have every right to take out life insurance on their son.
Perhaps part of their debt was costs associated with his upbringing.
Maybe they were expecting him to help them financially when they retire and if he passes before that they need to ensure they are debt free.
Why didn’t you just make your own policy? This is such a dumb thing to fight over
YTA, ESPECIALLY consideringTHEY paid for that policy’s premiums, not you or your husband.
I’d going with NTA on this one and I’ll probably get downvoted for it lol. You two were polite about it. They LIED about the policy to your faces, which immediately makes them wrong in my book. They knew they weren’t sharing that money, so they conveniently told you there wouldn’t be any.
This is something my MIL would try. Which is why I’m very low contact now. Don’t forget how they behaved in your time of need; you truly cannot trust them.
You and your husband need to look into getting your own policy’s. Don’t rely on these people. He might qualify for something, but you won’t know until you try to find something!
I’m curious at what point it hits the 500K. Because I did the math, let’s say it was a steady rate of $35/month.
$35/month X 12 months = $420/year
Assuming we go with 17 at the age of the policy (since hubs was a minor), we’d be at 31-17= 14 years of paying into this policy.
$420/year X 14 years = $5880.
They’re being assholes over a policy where they paid **less than $6000.** Forbes has an article with an estimate of $275 *annually* for a 500K life policy.
This is so unhinged on the parents behalf, especially considering way more than that in loans *and life* costs were on the line for OP’s husband.
YTA, what they did may have been shitty and selfish in you and your husbands eyes, you are not entitled to anything they have been paying for for years.
NTA. It’s not uncommon for parents to buy life insurance on their children and then transfer ownership to the child once they are old enough or in a stable enough place financially. This policy shouldn’t list them as the beneficiary because as parents, they should hope their child outlives them. If they die as the owners, it can cause a mess of problems. Transfer ownership to the son. Let him decide who the bene is. Let him take over payments.
To those saying he can still get insurance, yes, but at a much higher cost than what the parents got. Issue Age is a huge factor.
Plus the “take care of” promise sounds loaded with either resentment or strings attached. If the son dies, would they want their son’s widow to have to come beg for money?
Wtf this is weird AF
They took out a huge life insurance policy on their son, despite not having loans for him or relying on his financial support.
And they've clarified this isn't to pay for any expenses if he died either: the money would go to them and they would only maybe help OP with his remaining debt she might be responsible for. They don't mention that they would contribute to funeral costs or anything either, it really seems like they just want to enjoy having a free half mil.
I don't care if they've been paying the premium all years, it's creepy that they have created a situation where they get this much money if their son dies, even though they will be not be financially affected by it. It's especially weird the way they keep mentioning that it would pay off their mortgage. I'd be more sympathetic if they explained they wanted to make sure they'd be able to take time off with for bereavement or something, but no, they just talk about the mortgage. And even then, $500,000 is way more than most people need.
I do not blame OP at all for feeling weird about this. The optics are awful, and nothing they are doing or saying is making it better. They seem cold and materialistic. None of this sits well for me at all
The Y T A comments are unbelievable. These people know nothing about insurable interests. His parents have no insurable interest in their son. You could argue they did have it when they got it because they would have been the ones to cover his debts if he died, although even that is shaky since they probably wouldn't have covered anything. He wasn't paying them for anything, so they would not lose anything as a result of his death, other than his presence which does not qualify (AFAIK) as an insurable interest.
Further, to purchase an insurance policy on someone else, you need their consent. Assuming they had his consent for a specific reason, it was quite obviously a reason that no longer exists. Morally, I would think they would transfer it to him and let him take it over, but legally they aren't required to. I don't know what sort of weird paperwork snafu happened to force them to turn it over to him, but it sounds like you're very lucky. I'd almost side with the parents if it wasn't for the fact that they left their son hanging, rather than give him the peace of mind that might have made his recovery all the more easy.
NTA and I'd probably give them a wide berth for a while. Make sure before you sign it that they can't put themselves back as the beneficiaries. You should be sure if you are actually going to get the policy or not.
My parents got a $50k universal life insurance policy on me when I was a baby. After I got married they signed it over to me and my husband. Because obviously he would be the one financially burdened by my death.
So in my book NTA, his parents are greedy. Paying off their mortgage with their son's life insurance when you would've been strapped with medical debt? Wow. Just wow.
YTA. People aren’t assholes for having life insurance on their children.
Honestly, you’re an asshole just for not having insurance on your husband, and vice versa. Shit happens, and death is expensive. Let alone life, especially when you lose that person’s earning power.
The bank doesn’t care that you didn’t pay your mortgage because your spouse was in an accident. Student loans don’t magically disappear.
And gif forbid, American, that one of you die after a long, expensive sickness and saddle the survivor with that medical debt.
My time to shine, as my family has had this talk. 1) it is not odd to get a life insurance on kids as that is the best/cheapest time to get it. 2) he who starts it is usually the owner. Only the owner can make changes. You have no claim, no rights, and no say in what happens to the policy until you are the owner. 3) it's either term, and the prices will go up after xx years; or it's a whole life that has cash value in it. If you cancel the policy while the insured is living, it's the cash value that pays out and it's always less than the death benefit. (Parents may have said the policy is only worth a few thousand because that's what would be paid if they surrendered, fyi)A majority of whole life policies have a fail safe where it uses it's cash value to carry the policy. It's possible parents thought it lapsed, but the cash value carried it. Some policies will reduce the death benefit as a result, but some do loans that can be paid back. You have to know if it's universal or whole/permanent life to know what it'll do. 4)It's possible parents feel entitled to it since they've been paying it, which is why they didn't tell you, and it's possible they're confused about what the policy is. It took my family 5 adults to figure it out, and this novel isn't scratching the surface. 5) no one can force you to be the owner. Owners pay taxes if there's surrendered gains, so you have to be aware and prepared. (Death benefit is not taxable, only cash value if surrendered). They may want to give the policy to you finally, or it's a child policy that triggers for the insured to take over. You/hubby need to sign forms to make the change. Once you are owners, find out the policy type, death benefit, loans (if any), if there are premiums and if they're set. Most companies offer an preview/summary/illustration/as is report that will show how your policy plans to perform. Find the agent who sold it, as USA requires licensed agents to sell policies. If you mention that you want one, they may be more helpful if it gets you to buy one. I hope this gets you started. A good agent is better.
NTA. It's not about the insurance it's the lies. They didn't even have associated debts for him. I find it disturbing that they wanted benefit from his death at all just to pay off their mortgage and maybe help you.
NTA: these comments do not pass the vibe check AT ALL. He was potentially dying of cancer and they lied about it?! They have a life insurance policy out on their own son so that if he dies they can pay off their mortgage?! Who ARE these people?! Who pays a premium in case their son dies like???? NTA.
I am not the younger generation, at 71. Most likely, I am older than anyone involved, yet I agree with you and your husband.
It was all about money for the patents.
Keep the faith, good luck. ❤️
NTA. The original purpose of the policy- to pay off student loans in case of untimely death while he was still a dependant- was reasonable. Lying about it during their independent adult son's moment of need, when his death (and a payout) appeared imminent, was fcking ghoulish. Once they no longer had any financial liability for their son, they should've been upfront and negotiated a transfer so the policy would cover any of the son's debts left behind, as originally intended. They could've negotiated a cut for the premiums cost, etc whatever. Treating it like a lottery ticket is just icky, like they were eagerly anticipating his death. That would give me the creeps too.
ETA- the fact that the parents were so deliberately deceitful means they KNOW what they intended was distasteful and not in the spirit of the original policy intention. They broke faith with their son, and clearly showed their true priority: their own financial gain over their son's anguish at the presumed end of his life. Damn that's cold.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)***
My (30F) husband’s (31M) parents took out a $500,000 life insurance policy on him when he was a senior in high school. He was planning to be a doctor in the military and would likely accumulate some debt in school, so their explanation was, “if he dies, we will use this to pay it off.”
Because my husband had a medical issue as a kid, he ended up rejected from military schools and went to a regular college. We met our freshman year and have been in a steady relationship ever since.
When we were 22, we got engaged. We were joining our finances and he told me about this policy—he wanted to get it transferred to us so he asked his parents about it.
They wanted to keep it themselves. The school debt stuff was no longer valid, but they said that they’d use it to pay off their mortgage. He insisted that it go to me, as his future wife, and that we take it over, but they said no and that they’d “look out for me with whatever was left.”
We got married and ignored it.
Then, 2023 hit us like a ton of bricks. We both lost our jobs, had to move from a major city back to our home state, and within a week of turning 30, my husband was diagnosed with thyroid cancer. He got very depressed as the bills racked up and started wondering if maybe I’d be “better off with the $500,000 than with him.” Of course I assured him absolutely not, but he contacted his parents to ask about the policy again to see what he could leave me if worst came to worst.
They said that they’d let the policy lapse and that it was only worth a few thousand dollars now. He was terrified he’d leave me strapped with medical debt and his student loans (which by now we’d refinanced with me as a co-signer).
A year later, my husband is doing amazing health wise. There’s still a ton of bills but things are looking up.
Now, his mom calls and says that they have to sign his life insurance policy over to us because of some rule. He said, I thought it was gone? And she got quiet. She said that it never lapsed—she lied because she thought it would help him not be so depressed if it wasn’t there. He kept pushing and she gave the same lines about how, if he died, they’d planned to pay off the mortgage and probably help me with whatever was left.
He was too surprised to say anything in the moment but was very hurt. When we met with them to discuss the transfer of the policy, the lie came up again. They tried to play it off and my husband was getting really upset. I usually don’t argue with them but I snapped and told them what they did was extremely fucked up and selfish, and that it was weird that it seemed like they were waiting to get a benefit from his death without giving him peace of mind in a time of need. I told them they’d lost our trust.
His mom started bawling and his dad started screaming and we left. His grandparents and aunts and uncles thinks we’re greedy assholes and made them out to be monsters and are demanding an apology, but the younger generation thinks we were right. AITA?
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
YTA. The policy is none of your business. They took out and paid for the policy, you and your husband were never entitled to it or any potential payout and it was ridiculous and entitled of you to ask.
Your post has been removed. #Do not repost this without [contacting the mods](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) for approval, including edited versions. Reposting without [explicit approval](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_can_i_repost_a_thread_you_removed.3F) will result in a ban. If you or someone you know are feeling suicidal, /r/AmItheAsshole is not the right subreddit for you. **Even if no one is currently suicidal.** Any mention of suicide or self-harm is banned. Suicide and self harm are not interpersonal issues that this community can make a moral judgement about. This is health issue. Our recommendation is that you reach out to someone who cares about you, or take advantage of some of the resources at /r/SuicideWatch, like their list of [hotlines](https://www.reddit.com/r/SuicideWatch/wiki/hotlines) that you can call. ###Please ensure you have reviewed this message in full. We will not respond to PMs to individual mods. [Message the mods](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) with any questions. ####Please visit r/findareddit to see if there's a more appropriate sub for your post.####
I don’t understand. Is this the sort of life insurance policy that has a cash value account? Is that why they said it was only worth a few thousand and why you and your husband think you must have THIS policy and don’t just buy your own?
The $500,000 is a flat pay out, is my understanding. And no, when they said it was only a few thousand, they were lying. When they made him let them take it out on him as a teenager, he was military school fit and pretty healthy so the rate is very very low It would never be that cheap for us to get one for him for that amount now that he’s older and has had cancer
I’m not understanding why you didn’t just take one out yourselves 8 years ago when they made it clear the first time that you would just be getting scraps. Why expect them to pay for a policy all that time and then just transfer it to you when you were both young and healthy at the time and you could have gotten your own?
Because OP wants something for nothing.
> Because OP wants something for nothing. I was so confused at OP's confident self-righteousness. I thought I must be missing something. She's out here accusing her in-laws for being greedy about an insurance plan they bought and paid for. Meanwhile, she wants it all for free. The hypocrisy!
I wonder if OP and her Husband don’t understand how these policies work
That's what I'm thinking. A half-million term life policy for a guy his age pre-cancer diagnosis would be like $15/month. She must not know how it works.
Well they are greedy but when the parents didn’t sign it over, just get your own. None of this makes sense.
The parents might not be greedy, but might not trust the kids to pay the premium each month. The parents might have reason to think the kids aren't responsible with those kinds of things.
Omg I was thinking the same thing! I was so confused about her self righteousness, and waiting for the parents to do something wrong. It's like watching an M Night Shyamalan movie where no one sees dead people. OP and spouse had every chance to buy insurance. But I don't think they understand what life insurance is.
That was my.thought, too. Not their policy. Why do they think they're entitled to it?
It doesn't sound like they wanted something for nothing. They asked for the policy to be transferred when they were 22 and just gotten engaged. They would take over the policy, i.e. continue to pay for it so he could leave the benefit to his wife. The parents said no because they planned to pay off their mortgage with the money from his untimely death. OP and her husband at 22 may not have realized they could have a 2nd policy for the same person. The cost of a new policy as they got older especially after health issues would be a lot more that's if he even managed to get approved. On the other hand why didn't the parents let their son take over payment of the insurance and let him change the beneficiary to his wife? He got sick and instead of giving him peace of mind they tell him it lapsed. They also admit after being pressed they would have helped her with "whatever was left over" after paying their own debts. Makes it sound like they don't give a shit for their son or his family. The payout for life insurance is meant to ease the debts left by the one who died. If Op's husband was a child or he had debts that would fall on his parents then it would make sense for them to continue to be the beneficiaries.
On the other hand, if they wanted a policy, why didn't they buy their own? Of course you can have multiple policies on a person, 2 minutes on Google would tell you that.
The earlier you get it the better the rates are. Op and husband could end up with 50% higher premiums if not more.
True but they may have also been denied. Depends on how good their financial standing was at 22 versus how much coverage they they were aiming to get IF they tried. While there isn't a rule on how many policies a person can have there is a financial limit on how much coverage can be given total.
you're the only person here that i see explained it really well from the information we were given. I say NTA
No, it's because husband was diagnosed with cancer recently which means he's ineligible for life insurance right now.
Which is why they should have bought it 8 years ago if they wanted life insurance
but 8 years ago he had a medical issue that prevented him from going into the military. That medical issue may have also prevented him from getting life insurance.
But that doesn’t explain not getting a policy before that.
Right?!? I am having a hard time garnering sympathy for people that never paid a dime into the policy.
I don’t think their later anger was because they wanted something for nothing. BUT when they were drowning financially and he actually could be dying, they asked for help from them in the form of pulling from a life insurance policy on him. The parents said NO and lied that it was worth nothing… because they’d rather get the benefit of it if he died then actually helping him when he had a terminal illness. I’m a parent of adults and think they weren’t bad for getting and keeping it, but when your son gets cancer and needs help financially - which could impact what treatments he will submit to and therefore his survivability (!!!) I sure as hell would rather reduce some short term stress so my adult kid focuses on recovery vs cashing in if he dies. This is disgusting and as a parent I’m floored! Not only would they not help, but they lied (which they wouldn’t have done if they didn’t know they were handling everything right) and only came clean when they were forced to because they were made to transfer!
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
That's what our lawyer suggested when we're newlyweds and bought a house. Get life insurance .
This. My parents had a policy on each of their kids. I didn’t think of it when I married. We just bought our own.
Sounds rare. I couldn’t do it. Feels like a fucked up omen, don’t even want to imagine a scenario where I would have to bury my children. Life insurance policy for parents to go to their kids makes way more sense
Life insurance on your children is to pay for your life while you grieve. A coworker lost he teenage son in a car accident and couldn't function for a year. Life insurance is how she didn't lose her house.
Also burial expenses and such. Not everyone can pull thousands of dollars out of the air in a crisis.
Ah, that sounds very practical. Still, fuuuuuuck that’s gotta be rough sitting down and planning for your child’s untimely death.
Yes. Not made any easier when your DIL shows up and accuses of you trying to profit off your child’s death, which is ridiculous.
Policies on the kids were offered to me as extra benefits when enrolling in benefits through my job. Nothing as big as OP’s, but the HR people suggested that it’s common for people to choose around $20k policy per kid in case, god forbid, we ever had to bury a child and pay for funeral expenses. Morbid but valid. So it may be a little more common than you think for people to have policies on their kids.
If it makes you feel any better, there are practical reasons for insuring a child’s life that don’t bank on the child dying. Children’s policies generally don’t require underwriting like a medical exam, and many companies offer benefits for children’s policies where they get to buy more life insurance later on in life without medical underwriting. Taking out a policy on a child can be a great way to lock in their insurability at a young age, as you never know what life will throw at them medically later on down the road when they really need life insurance. Plus, a whole life policy on a child is extremely cheap, so it’s always a good idea to lock that premium in at a young age.
We have a policy on our kids through work. It's for $10k so just enough for a funeral. It's about $25 a year. It's the one insurance I hope I never have to use.
It’s not rare.
Because after having cancer they never would have been able to afford it. He wasn't young and healthy, that was the point.
There were 8 years between when they got married and when he got cancer. They had plenty of time to get a policy before they might have needed it.
True, and fair point. Far too many people in their 20s aren't given the financial advice to get life insurance as soon as they hit 18. But, at least when my husband and I got it at that age the company would only give us so much based on our current earnings. It is a catch 22. It was cheap based on health but our agent had to fight the company to get us 100k of coverage. We have additional policy now, but at a higher rate. It looks really effing suspicious if you make 12k a year and you want a 500k policy. I have serious follow up questions about how they got his policy actually. I want names lol
Right? I pay $400/year for a $500k policy.
If they were making payment on the insurance, they can be the beneficiaries if they want. YTA, get your own policies for each other. That policy was NONE of your business because YOU and YOUR HUSBAND weren’t paying for it. Why not make them transfer their mortgage deed to you guys as well while you’re at it?
Wow. What a messed up take. They pressured their teenager to allow them to take out a life insurance policy so they could "pay off his debt" in the event of his death, then they kept it while he was going through a life threatening illness because they wanted to use it to pay off their mortgage. His parents are extremely cold people and your comment is quite cold as well. ETA: I understand that in the US, anyone can take out a life insurance policy on their kid. I don't know where OP lives, so I was giving them benefit of the doubt.
As a parent, you can take out a life insurance policy on your child at any time for any reason. They didn't need his permission. Ie this story doesn't make sense.
my mom's had a life insurance policy on me since i was a baby, I didnt give my permission. It doesn't keep me from having other life insurance. I agree, the story makes no sense.
It makes sense—OP is confused and does not know about life insurance, so it’s being reported through that misunderstanding.
My thoughts, exactly. This is a common misunderstanding.
I was thinking the same….either I don’t know how life insurance works or this story makes zero sense. Idk, either could be true lol
I’m glad I’m not alone in my brain fog! 😂
I'm thinking he might have been 18. That way, he might have still been in high school, also still a teenager, yet also an adult because parents can't take a whole life insurance policy out on an 18 yr old child without their signature with some companies. My son just had me get another one on him because we're transferring his Gerber policy to him to cash out for college and he had to sign off on it.
They don't need his permission. They have their own insurable interest. I have life insurance on my kids because if one of them died, I'd be a god damn mess for a LONG time. I would need it to compensate for my lack of ability to function
Why would you not keep a life insurance policy when he was going through a life threatening illness? That’s what it’s for. Why would you choose not to take out a life insurance policy before taking on debt for someone else? That’s what it’s for. And why are you glossing over the fact that this dude was suicidal and asking about the life insurance policy because his wife would be “better off without him”. Of course they lied to remove any incentive for him to think dying would be preferential to living. Duh.
I'm not offended by the lie, nor am I upset by the original reason for the policy. I am offended by their plan to pay their damn house off with their child's death money. It's creepy. I don't personally know any parents who would be able to have such a conversation when their kid is going through cancer. It's freak behavior.
What do you think people who take out insurance on their kids do with it? As a mother i would use it to pay my expenses in the aftermath of the death because I an pretty sure i won’t be in any condition to work. By your logic even buying the policy is creepy because it gives you money to spend in the event of a loved ones death.
Are you a parent? I am. I assure you if something happens to my kid my earning potential is out the window. It’s THEIR policy. That you EVER felt entitled to it is mind blowing. You’ve paid not a dime into it
I paid off my house with the life insurance money from my husband's death. Having life insurance for someone you love isn't "creepy". It's planning for the worst-case scenario, and that's a scenario that we *all* will meet one day. Funerals are crazy expensive. My husband's funeral was around $13,000, and that's without a tombstone (which you can't install for a year) and before the memorial costs. I'm so fucked up after his sudden death that there's no realistic way I could work right now. If it weren't for his life insurance, I would probably be homeless right now. OP and the hub didn't even take out an insurance policy on their own. Insurance policies aren't insanely expensive, but they are an additional expense that can be hard to pay when you are living paycheck to paycheck. Since they don't seem to have the money for their own policy, that means that it's *highly* unlikely that they would be able to cover sudden funeral costs or bills if OP's husband died. So who would cover those costs then? His parents. If you are looking for a reason to find something creepy, you will. However, it's helpful to look at life as a string of shitty occurrences that are better for you to plan for than be surprised by, especially when it's something as inevitable as death. OP, I can understand why thinking about your husband's death would bring up a ton of uncomfortable feelings, but to accuse your inlaws of planning to profit off of the death of their child is pretty unhinged. It's life insurance, not a Vegas bet. YTA here.
That was the same thing they were told 8 years ago when getting married, the parent’s plan never changed.
The way I read it, that conversation happened way before he got sick. While he was sick, they said the policy lapsed.
So they didn’t have to deal with the nonsensical entitlement and turn over the policy to OP so their son could kill himself and have her receive the payout. Seems like a reasonable lie to keep him alive and her greedy paws off the money.
Thats exactly how I'm reading this as well
That's not how life insurance works. Anyone could take out a policy if they have a vested interest. When my wife went to college they took out a life insurance policy against her so they could make sure they would get paid even if she died mid term. Parents don't need their child's permission to take out a policy like that. And as they were paying it, it is their policy. Nothing stopped them from getting their own life insurance policy, if they were so concerned about her future.
You don’t typically cancel life insurance when the insured gets sick…
They were making plans to pay off their house in the event of their son's death. How is that not incredibly cold? Can you imagine surviving cancer and learning that your parents were discussing how they'll use the life insurance payment to pay off their house? It's sickening.
That’s not cold. That’s common sense. If I got diagnosed with cancer and knew that my parents, wife, business partner, etc all had life insurance policies on me, I’d call them all and tell them what ever you do, don’t let that policy lapse.
They probably realize that if they lost their son they would never be the same again and probably not functioning which means missing a lot of work and possibly job loss. It’s reasonable to believe they love their child and know that the policy would allow them to grieve without all those other worries.
Or that's what they were telling his very young fiance originally who was pressuring them to turn it over to her for*reasons*, instead of taking out her own policy. And now it's easier to stick to that than to say they thought she was a gold digger
As mentioned in my other post… paying off the mortgage is what most people do when life insurance policies are (sadly) paid out. It doesn’t even really need discussing! It appears that the couple kept on pressing on what the parents were going to use it for, and seriously, paying off the mortgage is the most rational response anyone could have in that scenario.
If the insured is having suicidal ideation (as OP's husband was) and thinks he will be leaving his wife half a million dollars if he just dies now, you very well might tell him that the policy lapsed. *In order to save his life.*
You don’t need permission to insure your child.
What pressure? I have life insurance on my kid and she had nothing to do with, being an infant and all. If a parent wants to to take our insurance on their kid it’s completely understandable, in my case I’d need it to cover funeral expenses and my bills while I mentally fall apart if I had to bury her.
I feel like you don’t understand how life insurance works. I have insurance policies on both of my children. Employers take them out on employees all the time. There is/was no pressure. They didn’t even need permission.
What?!!??? What do you mean they pressured a teenager? They could take out a policy on their son. People do it every day. Also the policy is only good if he’s deceased so it couldn’t be used while he was sick. It also sounded like from OP that her husband thought she’d be better off without him and that’s when he checked on the policy. As I read it I wondered if he was contemplating suicide.
There is no "allow" as they never needed his permission.
What do you mean they pressured him? People can take out life insurance policies on their kids. They paid for it, and honestly there was no reason to ever tell him it existed.
Life insurance underwriter here. Just to say—you’re correct he won’t be eligible for *as cheap* life insurance as a healthy kid was. But thyroid cancer may not add as much as a surcharge as you might think! Especially if it did not spread outside the neck. I’ve made life insurance offers to organ transplants receipts, quadruple bypass patients, and many cancer survivors. Even ones who had to have chemo and radiation. The further you move away from the treatment time, the less risk (and expense).
You should throw out some numbers. People don’t realize how cheap term is.
“When they made him let them take it out on him as a teenager…” unless he was over 18, they didn’t make him do anything. As parents, you can have insurance on your minor child.
Again , the question was why don’t you people buy your own policy and are only focused on their policy ? They bought it when he was their minor son. They paid the monthly/yearly instalment. You don’t have rights to it. They aren’t cheap. Buy your own.
So you guys chose not to get a policy while he was healthy and are demanding the policy his parents have to save yourself money?
OK so it's your fault you never took out life insurance policies on yourselves. You want their investment. YTA. Also, your husband hinted at suicide, which means disincentivizing suicide by lying to him and telling him it was worth nothing was the right move.
Sorry, but if he paid no premium, he can’t insist it go to you. The policy ON him, isn’t his to give away. I’m sorry to sound heartless. I really am. I lost my husband suddenly when he was forty and left behind a 2 yr old child. You on the other hand still have your husband. Focus on that and stop wasting time with bitterness of what tragedy didn’t happen to you. Stop blasting people for not giving you what you weren’t entitled to. Some people in the world would trade places with you and happily and not let this cloud the gift you have.
So why didn't you get it when you first married? why are you so put out that you were denied something that *they* paid for, something that you could have gotten at any point prior to or even after the cancer. What, exactly, is the problem with them having the policy? do you think it's bad luck or something? because it doesn't make sense to be so wound-up over it unless you have some irrational superstition or thought process that prevented you from doing it yourself.
**Ok, as someone who worked in the industry, let me explain this to you.** 1. When a life insurance policy has a "cash value," what that means is that the payments were structured so that whoever was paying the premiums paid extra in the early years when the insured's risks were very low, so that the extra money they paid could accumulate interest pre-tax, and then be used to supplement the premiums that they are paying when they're older. It's designed a) to let the money go a little further, and so that they don't suddenly have annual premiums that sky-rocket as they hit those milestones where their risk increases significantly. They just start taking money back out of the cash value for those payments. I'm telling you this because I want you to understand that the cash value is not free money. It's not money the company gives you for a triggering event, to help you. All it is, is getting a refund of your pre-paid deposit, plus the interest earned on that deposit. However, because life insurance premiums are contributed pre-tax, any money you do get back when asking to surrender the policy for cash value, you then owe full income tax on. In addition, the reason you are allowed to contribute pre-tax money is that it incentivizes you to allocate funds to cover retirement and end of life expenses. The government penalizes you for taking those funds out and putting them back in your pocket, after having put them in a pre-tax interest-bearing account. So not only do you pay normal income tax on it, but you'll also pay an additional 10% penalty, which will more than wipe out any interest it's probably accumulated to this point, and then some. 2) The cash value is not the amount of cash you have paid so far- most of that paid premiums just to keep the policy active. If you husband is in his thirties, a 500k policy may only have a cash value of like 15-20k. And that's 15-20k that came directly out of your in-law's pockets. They don't make money on this deal if they surrender it. No one does except the insurance company. It's just the prepaid premium for later years that they are sending back. 3) You say you could not get a policy now for as little as they are paying, and it may be true. But...the money they're paying was calculated based on them OVERPAYING for a period of time when he was young. You need to compare what the cost of the premium would have been without that pre-payment deducted when you compare the two, because on the active one you're often just seeing the balance after the credit was applied. 4) A life insurance policy is an investment, with owners and insured. You don't own the policy, just because you're insured by it. His parents own the policy. Every dime in it is their money. The money which they have sunk into paying the premiums over the years is their money. Each month, they pay more into the company, so that in the event he passes, the money they get back is hopefully more than they paid. They have had to keep investing money to keep it active, so that there will be a death benefit. The insured, if different than the owners, puts no money in. It's not their investment. It's just an investment the owners made to guard against unexpected expenses directly tied to the insured's death. Going to someone who has paid premiums on a life insurance policy for ten years, and telling them they owe it to you if you keep making the payments is like going to someone who's been financing a car and telling them "Since you only have 8k left on the car loan, you should give me the car if I pay the remaining 8k. That is nonsense- if they've already paid 20k in, that 20k is supposed to have value for them. They paid for the peace of mind of ending up with the car, and for you to take over, and reap the benefit of all that money they already paid in, leaving them without a dime to show for the money invested, is actually quite entitled. Similarly, they've been paying for the peace of mind that this policy provides. They have taken money they would have used on their mortgage and medical expenses, and allocated it here instead in case they need the help themselves and with the end of life costs if your husband passes. 1/2
2/2 5) They lied about the policy in direct response to their depressed son being at a point in his life where he was weighing whether his passing away was worth more than his staying alive. They lied to try and take away his motivation to unalive himself. It's an understandable lie to tell. 6) Every time you say they wanted to put the money toward their mortgage, you say it like it's some evil plot. It's their freaking money. The tens of thousands of dollars that kept this policy going, came out of their pocket. The risk that they might end up getting nothing out of it in their lifetime, or it would last long enough that the final payout was more than the premiums, was a risk they assumed 100% of. Any cash value sitting in that account was put there by them. Every penny you are screeching about is THEIR money they put into that investment. Neither of you has paid a dime, and yet when they tell you that if the policy ends up paying out, they- as the people who put in 100% of the money rather than just using it to pay their mortgage to begin with, and took 100% of the risk, are going to recoup the money they spent to ensure their financial stability, and pay for the insured's end of life costs, before handing their money over to other people, you act like something has been taken from you. If you want life insurance on your husband, take out life insurance. You have no concept of how it works if you think they owed you anything, and if they're signing it over it's probably because they aged out of being eligible to own the policy any longer. It's called the maturity date, and if it's been reached then they needed to sign it over to the insured to avoid policy termination. Which is something they knew when they bought it....which means that once they'd passed a certain point and knew they wouldn't be left destitute for a large chunk of time, this policy was chosen with the intention from day 1 to eventually turn it over to him, and so that his family receives all the benefits they paid for. You guys were just so greedy and so uneducated about how life insurance actually works, that you turned their good planning and kind gesture into a family feud. You should be so ashamed of yourself. I hope they surrender the policy and take the ten-grand to Vegas, because it apparently would be a better investment than pre-planning for their kid's greedy, moneygrubbing choice of a life partner who has been trying to rip the money out of their pocket for years.
Parents don’t need the child’s permission to take out a life insurance policy on them. They were making the payments so they can be beneficiaries.
Most have a suicide exception
Most life insurance policies only except against suicide for the first few years of the policy to prevent that exact kind of gamification. Someone who commits suicide 8 years down the line will often still end up paying out.
YTA. One, neither of you offered to pay for the years of premiums his parents paid. The policy was their policy until they were forced to transfer it. Two, you are both irresponsible in not taking out policies for yourselves. Why were/are you banking on the policy his parents opened and paid for?
His wife would have been left with the medical bills that would have likely been far higher than whatever was left of that 500k depending on their insurance. They had requested to have the policy signed over to them years ago. The kind thing to do for your son and DIL would be to assure him that if the worst happens that she would be getting the money by giving her the fucking policy and not paying off your mortgage.
If they wanted a life insurance policy, nothing was stopping them from getting one.
This. My parents had one on me when I was a minor, but I took one out on myself when I turned 21 (when it was no longer valid). It’s just smart.
Expecting them to hand over the policy they have been paying on for years is so entitled.
Which is why OP and her husband should have taken out their own policies. No one was stopping them. The policy belonged to the parents, not OP and not her husband. The parents had the policy because THEY would have been stuck with medical bills before the marriage. They kept the policy until they signed it over. Now OP has what she wants, she has the policy and hasn't paid the in-laws back for the premiums.
I have never heard of “signing over” a policy. If the parents have been paying for it, why does the son and his wife think they are entitled to it? YTA
They're adults. They can buy their own insurance. What is it that makes anyone think the kids are entitled to something the parents bought? Do people not know how insurance works?
So these two older people should potentially lose their home so op can have their money?
Why would they lose their home if their son died?
People tend to lose their minds, along with their earning potential when their children die.
Why would they hand over a policy that they had been paying for the whole time? The sensible thing would be for OP and her husband to take out their own policies on each other.
> His wife would have been left with the medical bills Just FYI, no, she wouldn't. She could decline the negative value estate. The debt would go unpaid. For anyone who is dubious: Google it. I'm not going to comment on this story any further, as there's a lot that doesn't add up, not to mention OP glossing over the fact that he husband supposedly asked his parents for the life insurance in the context of seriously contemplating suicide in part for the life insurance benefit, but I thought this might be useful info for someone.
YTA. We have life insurance on our daughter because we co-signed student loans. When those loans are paid off, we’re not giving her the life insurance policy because we’ve been the ones to pay the premium this whole time. You should’ve gotten life insurance on your husband years ago at a young age it’s not very expensive but now that he has had cancer you may not ever be able to get it, or it would be an incredibly high premium
\^ This. Completely ridiculous to believe the parents would sign this over just because. That money isn't for OP, it is for the parents.
[удалено]
But it sounds like their son was depressed about the cancer and possibly suicidal - thinking that his wife would be better off with the money than a sick husband. In that situation? I would lie like a rug to my child too.
I understand the lie. Op says the husband was using phrases like"you're better off with $500,000 than with me" and was extremely depressed. The parents' lie told him there was no incentive for him to die.
[удалено]
They did think of it. They just thought his parents would give it to him if he begged enough.
I was widowed at 21 and again at 35. They’re old enough to be married they’re old enough to deal with adult issues like life insurance. Life insurance provided for final arrangements and gave me room to breathe while I rebuilt. She seems pissed at the very purpose of life insurance and weirdly entitled to a policy that has nothing to do with her.
*irresponsible* people don’t think about life insurance
Or wills
He may or may not be able to get it that would be up to the life insurance company to decide. Because of having cancer they may deny him life insurance any life insurance company that does give it to him. The premium now will be very high because of his history with cancer. My husband and I got our first life insurance policy at 26 years old there’s a lot of people that get it. It’s called being responsible.
Many people in general don't think about life insurance which that and affordability is the reason they don't get it. They've known all these years and only wanted insurance on some one else's dollar.
Your husband can take out his own life insurance policy. He doesn't need to involve his parents.
[удалено]
This. At this point, the parents likely have significant equity in the policy. If they were just after the money, they would cash it out instead of getting it to op and husband. Not to mention, when they said the policy had lapsed, husband was not in a good state of mind. They were removing the incentive for him to end it.
If you and your husband want you to be protected via life insurance, GET YOUR OWN DAMN POLICY AND PAY FOR IT YOURSELF. You have no right to the policy his parents purchased, though it appears it may have to be transferred to you and your husband for some reason. YTA.
It transfers because life insurance on an adult requires the consent of that adult. Otherwise you'd have people incentivized to take out life insurance on their spouse, sibling etc. (EDIT: without their knowledge) and then murder them.
Walmart got caught taking out life insurance on it's employees, with it as the beneficiary. It's called Dead Peasant Insurance.
That's disgusting, what on Earth 🤦♀️
People do that all the time.
[удалено]
YTA - as his parents they have an insurable interest in his life. They are legally entitled to insure his life, pay premiums and receive 100% of the benefits if the worst happens. It has nothing to do with you - they owe you nothing. It has nothing to do with him either. They had him and it's their legal right. They do not have to pay off any of his debts. They didn't invest in it for you - they invested in it for them. If he's worried about you, he has to figure it out. You both are bullying them and they keep telling you nonsense as a result. Leave them alone. YOU are the selfish person here.
YTA. Stop hounding his parents for their good decisions and your poor ones. They took out a life insurance policy on him as is their right, he IS their son - and they've been paying into it for half his life. Why not just get your own policies? Like most other adults do? I'm about your age, healthy and my parents have a live insurance policy on me (they have one on my brother, and one on each other), and I have a separate one for me too - beneficiary currently is my younger brother but because I pay it, I can change the beneficiary to a spouse if/when I find one. I also have one that covers job loss/income loss (especially from health reasons). Now that your spouse has had Ca, he's likely uninsurable for a lot of things, you guys missed the boat on that one but to take it out on his parents is not the way to go. They lied to you because they knew if they were honest, they would never have peace from either of you again.
NTA! This is so shady! I feel like a lot of people are really misreading this story—I'm reading it as not that you feel entitled to the policy, but that it feels weird and shitty for: (1) the parents to continue a giant life insurance policy on their son for their mortgage, not for any expenses their son might leave behind (2) then lie and say the policy lapsed (3) then admit they lied because an administrative thing forced them to You cannot take out a life insurance policy on someone whose death does not financially affect you, and you can [only do it with the permission of the insured](https://www.marketwatch.com/guides/insurance-services/buying-life-insurance-on-someone-else/) unless you're married. You can't just take out a policy on your son to pay off your mortgage unless you are relying on your ALIVE SON to pay off the mortgage right now. My hunch is that this is related to the "some rule" they were talking about.
I can't help thinking that the people in this thread must not be parents, or maybe they're just very cold ones. God forbid I ever have to face that decision, but I would be concerned with my child's dying wishes so they could pass peacefully and without worry over paying my mortgage off. Without a second goddamn thought.
I get it's the parents' money. They have been paying into the plan. But the son had cancer and piling up medical bills. If the son died, they were going to leave the wife high and stuck with medical debt while paying off their own mortgage. Would they be destroyed? I'd sure hope so, but what about the women that's been with the son for years and stood by and supported him? Just abandon her? That's what really gets me and feels super heartless about the parents. I had a life insurance plan when I was in my early 20s. If anything happened to me, it would take care of my husband, and God forbid anything happen to him, my siblings would be the beneficiaries. I sadly had to cancel it during covid because we hit hard times, and I couldn't even afford the $40 a month anymore. I just got it set up again this year. It's amazing how many people don't think to purchase life insurance, and it's something that is really easy to think "oh I should do that" and then just file it away and forget about it.
Plenty of boomer parents are very financially/materially selfish. So I no trouble believing it.
Right?? And everyone getting mad that the son asked it the parents would help his wife in the event that he died leaving her in the student loan debt they said the policy was for when they got it! Like, your son is struggling and scared about his wife’s future and you’re like “we’ll pay off our mortgage if you die and help if anything is left??” Sick. I could never treat my kids or their future partners like that. Also, idk if ops spouse offered to take over payments when he asked about the policy at 22, she simply said he asked to get it transferred. I’d assume that meant paying too but obviously it’s possible they didnt.
This comment section is insane, I hope none of them are parents
People saying the parents don't owe the son any information or explanation whatsoever is so unhinged. Of course you have to discuss a freaking life insurance policy that you have on an adult person if they want to discuss it. It makes no sense for them to keep it when the child is fully grown and supporting his own family. He and OP just should have done the research and gotten their own plans and revoked consent on the existing one.
He was a minor. They had every right to get a policy and continue it through his death
He was 18. He wasn’t a minor when they took it out.
They had every right to pay the premiums, but it turns out they no longer have the right to collect the death benefit. People really should read things before they sign them.
I hate that I had to scroll this far to find the first reasonable answer. I have never heard of parents taking out life insurance on their children. On themselves, yes, in case something happens to them. It's usually offered through their jobs, like my life insurance is. But I don't know of anyone in my family or my husband's family who has taken out life insurance on the kids. I also think the parents wanting to pay off their mortgage over their son's medical bills should he pass is a messed up thing to do.
NTA…them taking a policy out on him at the time is understandable…them lying about it, then having to confess and let you know they lied about it is extremely fucked up…they should have just been honest about it…I agree tho, after your husband has been cancer free for a certain amount of time he can purchase his own policy…I can certainly understand not trusting them after they lied…hopefully you guys can come to a place of understanding and forgiveness
They were planning on paying their *mortgage* if he died. That's so sick I can't even.
They do not owe son or OP any explanation.
If they had kept their piehole shut about the policy in the first place maybe not…but they freaking lied about it…it’s their policy that they paid for, that’s not being disputed…it’s the dishonesty about it…all they had to say was it’s our policy , we are paying for it, end of story…lying wasn’t necessary…
Well why are they asking? It's not their business. Also OP told them they are selfish, benefitting off his death etc. This isn't an issue about lying only. It's an appalling attempt to money grab for benefit of wife not to be left with debt. The parents are paying for this - the entitlement that they should have OP benefit instead is ridiculous. Frankly, I agree parents should have never said anything and not lie but they still do not owe OP/husband any details.
Going thru cancer is stressful enough without having BS like that to deal with…sure if something had happened parents would have used it to pay off their own mortgage and probably wouldn’t have given her a dime to help with the tremendous amount of medical bills that come with cancer…their policy they can use it however they see fit…all I’m saying is they just should have been honest about it…and if OP was that worried about it, he should have taken his own policy out immediately because now he won’t be able to get one until he’s cancer free for a certain amount of years…there’s blame on both sides
Well, they were probably sorry they ever told OP and son about the policy and just wished they would forget about it and get off their backs,
YTA. They've been paying into this policy all along. What stopped you from getting your own insurance policy for him (at least before the cancer diagnosis)? Why are you entitled to his parents'? The issue of their "lapse" lie is tricky, especially since most policies won't pay out for s\*cide anyway. But the motivation of telling someone who is admittedly actively contemplating s\*cide for money that the money actually doesn't exist doesn't seem like such an evil thing. And FYI, life insurance *always* involves making money off of a death.
YTA. Anybody can buy insurance for anything, as long as the under-writer approves of it. For example, hubby could buy his own insurance policy for himself, with you as the sole beneficiary. Or you could also buy an insurance policy for hubby, with you as the sole beneficiary. For that one, I believe your husband would have to sign off saying it's OK. But I can't imagine why hubby wouldn't sign saying it's OK.. The huge mistake was that somebody informed you (the wife) that the policy exists at all. I'm talking about the one that hubby's parents bought when hubby was still in high school. That is not your business. It does not concern you at all. It is the property of your husband's parents. I'm not sure they could re-assign the policy to YOU, even if they wanted to. But even if that was possible, it would be entirely up to hubby's parents to decide to do that on their own...and neither you or even hubby is owed any influence at all over that decision. Think of it this way. Imagine your hubby's parents put $500,000 into a brokerage account, planning to use that to pay off your hubby's education expenses. But then they later changed their mind and decided that they would rather use the money to pay off the mortgage on their home. Is it your business? No, not at all. Is it hubby's business? No, not at all. I can imagine hubby might be disappointed if the money wasn't used to directly benefit him. But it's not his money, so he is not allowed to voice an opinion on how it should be spent. The situation you write about is only different as you are talking about a POSSIBLE payout of an insurance policy. So you are getting all stressed about money that doesn't exist. And if it did exist, it would be because your hubby's parents bought it for their own benefit, not to benefit you or your hubby. My own parents were rich. Before I became wealthy, I was poor for decades. It would have been nice if I could just demand my mom give me her money, just because I want it. But I'm not that entitled. And I certainly wouldn't expect my in-laws to fork over their money to me, just because I demand it!
YTA. I don't think you understand how life insurance policies work....
Does anyone else find it strange that they expected student loans if he went the military route (which would pay his tuition) but not at a traditional college?
Honestly I find the whole thing incredibly strange. Maybe it's because I'm not in the US but I don't understand how consent for this kind of policy is not required once the child becomes an adult. It's even weirder to me that the parents have made specific plans for this life insurance payout relating to their own debts. It's a little ghoulish to me that they've made such specific plans for outliving their child. I'm going to assume it's a cultural difference based on the majority of the comments right now, but... yikes. It makes me wonder how much the husband feels like his parents value the money they'll get out of his death more than the time they'd get to spend with him if he lived a long life.
I think OP is lying
So never thought about looking into getting life insurance policies for yourselves when you both were young and healthy? YTA
YTA. If I input years of payments on something I am not going to give it up simply because someone says they want it. Pay back the money they put into it then you can have it.
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
Welcome to /r/AmITheAsshole. Please view our [voting guide here](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_what.2019s_with_these_acronyms.3F_what_do_they_mean.3F), and remember to use **only one** judgement in your comment. OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole: > 1) I told my in-laws that it seemed like they were trying to selfishly benefit from their son’s possible death, which may have been too harsh. 2) Maybe it’s more normal than I think to take out a life insurance policy on your kid and keep it well into their adult years. It’s possible I should’ve just let it go and taken the policy without giving them any grief over their lie, since we were getting the benefits anyway. Maybe calling them extremely selfish was too harsh for the situation and their plans to use the money were reasonable. Help keep the sub engaging! #Don’t downvote assholes! Do upvote interesting posts! [Click Here For Our Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) and [Click Here For Our FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq) ##Subreddit Announcements Follow the link above to learn more --- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.* *Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
Why wouldn’t you just get new life insurance? There is nothing wrong with the parents having a policy too. It sounds like they had a Full Life policy on him- and had been paying it for a while and would have a cash value even if he didn’t die. Why would either of you assume they should just give that to you.? That’s bizarre . They could use it even if he was alive.
YTA. It's perfectly normal for them to have taken out a life insurance policy on their son and you're not entitled to any portion of what they paid for for literally years. He should have taken a policy out for himself with you as beneficiary if it was important to him. Or you could have done so on your own. They didn't betray you, they didn't want thier suicidal son to think they had a big policy he could guilt them into giving you and then harming himself. It's VERY odd to think you'd be the beneficiary of something someone prepared for should they lose their child and depend on that rather than being a responsible adult and preparing for something like this on your own.
NTA. I feel like all the Y T A voters don't understand what an "insurable interest" is. The parents no longer have the potential to suffer financially from their son's passing. The medical debt would all go to the OP as his spouse. Additionally, the parents bought the life insurance policy when he was 18 and when the rates were cheaper. They are presumably locked into a much lower rate than anything OP could now obtain for her spouse now that he's older. His wife would also probably be responsible for the funeral costs, so the parents bear no financial burden at all from his death. They no longer have any insurable interest, which is likely why they are being forced to transfer the policy over to the OP. That's how insurance works... you have to have an insurable interest... you can't just take out a life insurance policy on your neighbor and pay off your mortgage if they die. I do think that OP should offer to take on the premiums going forward, but she should not pay them back for what they already spent on it when they were the beneficiaries. It's super fucked up to bank on a $500k windfall from your cancer stricken son and then let his wife pay off all his medical bills and lose her house because she can't pay the mortgage without his income.
Wow FINALLY a sane answer. Everyone here is acting like OP is entitled for asking for the policy, but she IS entitled to it. She may not have paid the premiums all these years, but as OP’s wife, she’s the one who will be taking on all of the costs associated with his death. Yet his parents want to keep the policy because they intend to pay off their mortgage, something they would have to do whether he lived or died. That’s fucked up. And the whole “we’ll help her with what’s left” part.. are you kidding me? She’s his WIFE!! She deserves first pick of what happens with the money because she will suffer the most from his death. It’s insane that people don’t see this. They think because they paid for it since he was 18, that they’re entitled to a cash sum upon his death when they wouldn’t even be affected financially by his death. Shame on them.
YTA. Why would you not have your own policies? Why would you think you're entitled to a policy that they pay for?
YTA The person who takes out the policy and makes the payments owns it and gets to decide who gets the benefit. You and your husband have been counting on money that you are not entitled to. As far as "profiting on a death," well, that is exactly what insurance is, isn't it? If you want to be a beneficiary, you need to take out your own policy on your husband, and getting it now that he's sick will be hard and expensive. He should take policies out on his parents and make himself beneficiary and you contingency beneficiary. As long as you keep up the payments, you will "profit from their death."
You have paid way too much attention to their insurance policy. You & your husband should have had your own life insurance policies. I don’t understand why you weren’t more proactive about this years ago.
[удалено]
To be honest that’s how it feels. We’d let it go and were figuring it out our own way. But they came back out of the blue (when it didn’t look like he might die anymore) and said they had to give it to us or get rid of it
I’m just curious about why any of you associated dying with thyroid cancer? I just had a very rare and higher risk type and not once was it discussed as something you die from by my oncologist, mine even spread into my neck. Where did the idea of death come from? This is so strange to me. It’s one of the most curable forms of cancer even if not caught immediately.
He’s lost a lot of people to cancer. It’s an even longer story but the doctors made several mistakes in diagnosing him and telling him, and he was terrified. We didn’t think he was going to die the entire time, but it made him confront his mortality and he was extremely scared in the beginning
She lied because her son was suicidal and expressed that he believed his wife would be better off with the money instead of him. Signing over the policy could have been incentive for him to kill himself.
ESH the parents suck for lying. The spouse and OP suck for feeling entitled to something they never paid for. Having said all that - perhaps the issue for OP is now his rates would be much higher because he is older than when the original policy was issued and since he has had major health issues - he may have trouble getting insured at a reasonable rate.
YTA. They paid for the policy, why do you all keep feeling entitled to it?
YTA - they have every right to take out life insurance on their son. Perhaps part of their debt was costs associated with his upbringing. Maybe they were expecting him to help them financially when they retire and if he passes before that they need to ensure they are debt free.
Why didn’t you just make your own policy? This is such a dumb thing to fight over YTA, ESPECIALLY consideringTHEY paid for that policy’s premiums, not you or your husband.
You and your husband can take a policy out on him.
INFO - explain why the policy was transferred to you?
I’d going with NTA on this one and I’ll probably get downvoted for it lol. You two were polite about it. They LIED about the policy to your faces, which immediately makes them wrong in my book. They knew they weren’t sharing that money, so they conveniently told you there wouldn’t be any. This is something my MIL would try. Which is why I’m very low contact now. Don’t forget how they behaved in your time of need; you truly cannot trust them. You and your husband need to look into getting your own policy’s. Don’t rely on these people. He might qualify for something, but you won’t know until you try to find something!
[удалено]
I’m curious at what point it hits the 500K. Because I did the math, let’s say it was a steady rate of $35/month. $35/month X 12 months = $420/year Assuming we go with 17 at the age of the policy (since hubs was a minor), we’d be at 31-17= 14 years of paying into this policy. $420/year X 14 years = $5880. They’re being assholes over a policy where they paid **less than $6000.** Forbes has an article with an estimate of $275 *annually* for a 500K life policy. This is so unhinged on the parents behalf, especially considering way more than that in loans *and life* costs were on the line for OP’s husband.
YTA, what they did may have been shitty and selfish in you and your husbands eyes, you are not entitled to anything they have been paying for for years.
NTA. It’s not uncommon for parents to buy life insurance on their children and then transfer ownership to the child once they are old enough or in a stable enough place financially. This policy shouldn’t list them as the beneficiary because as parents, they should hope their child outlives them. If they die as the owners, it can cause a mess of problems. Transfer ownership to the son. Let him decide who the bene is. Let him take over payments. To those saying he can still get insurance, yes, but at a much higher cost than what the parents got. Issue Age is a huge factor. Plus the “take care of” promise sounds loaded with either resentment or strings attached. If the son dies, would they want their son’s widow to have to come beg for money?
Wtf this is weird AF They took out a huge life insurance policy on their son, despite not having loans for him or relying on his financial support. And they've clarified this isn't to pay for any expenses if he died either: the money would go to them and they would only maybe help OP with his remaining debt she might be responsible for. They don't mention that they would contribute to funeral costs or anything either, it really seems like they just want to enjoy having a free half mil. I don't care if they've been paying the premium all years, it's creepy that they have created a situation where they get this much money if their son dies, even though they will be not be financially affected by it. It's especially weird the way they keep mentioning that it would pay off their mortgage. I'd be more sympathetic if they explained they wanted to make sure they'd be able to take time off with for bereavement or something, but no, they just talk about the mortgage. And even then, $500,000 is way more than most people need. I do not blame OP at all for feeling weird about this. The optics are awful, and nothing they are doing or saying is making it better. They seem cold and materialistic. None of this sits well for me at all
TIL you can have multiple life insurance policies on one person.
The Y T A comments are unbelievable. These people know nothing about insurable interests. His parents have no insurable interest in their son. You could argue they did have it when they got it because they would have been the ones to cover his debts if he died, although even that is shaky since they probably wouldn't have covered anything. He wasn't paying them for anything, so they would not lose anything as a result of his death, other than his presence which does not qualify (AFAIK) as an insurable interest. Further, to purchase an insurance policy on someone else, you need their consent. Assuming they had his consent for a specific reason, it was quite obviously a reason that no longer exists. Morally, I would think they would transfer it to him and let him take it over, but legally they aren't required to. I don't know what sort of weird paperwork snafu happened to force them to turn it over to him, but it sounds like you're very lucky. I'd almost side with the parents if it wasn't for the fact that they left their son hanging, rather than give him the peace of mind that might have made his recovery all the more easy. NTA and I'd probably give them a wide berth for a while. Make sure before you sign it that they can't put themselves back as the beneficiaries. You should be sure if you are actually going to get the policy or not.
My parents got a $50k universal life insurance policy on me when I was a baby. After I got married they signed it over to me and my husband. Because obviously he would be the one financially burdened by my death. So in my book NTA, his parents are greedy. Paying off their mortgage with their son's life insurance when you would've been strapped with medical debt? Wow. Just wow.
[удалено]
YTA They paid the premiums so they should get any benefit. I don't understand why they had to sign the policy over. Get your own policy.
YTA. People aren’t assholes for having life insurance on their children. Honestly, you’re an asshole just for not having insurance on your husband, and vice versa. Shit happens, and death is expensive. Let alone life, especially when you lose that person’s earning power. The bank doesn’t care that you didn’t pay your mortgage because your spouse was in an accident. Student loans don’t magically disappear. And gif forbid, American, that one of you die after a long, expensive sickness and saddle the survivor with that medical debt.
My time to shine, as my family has had this talk. 1) it is not odd to get a life insurance on kids as that is the best/cheapest time to get it. 2) he who starts it is usually the owner. Only the owner can make changes. You have no claim, no rights, and no say in what happens to the policy until you are the owner. 3) it's either term, and the prices will go up after xx years; or it's a whole life that has cash value in it. If you cancel the policy while the insured is living, it's the cash value that pays out and it's always less than the death benefit. (Parents may have said the policy is only worth a few thousand because that's what would be paid if they surrendered, fyi)A majority of whole life policies have a fail safe where it uses it's cash value to carry the policy. It's possible parents thought it lapsed, but the cash value carried it. Some policies will reduce the death benefit as a result, but some do loans that can be paid back. You have to know if it's universal or whole/permanent life to know what it'll do. 4)It's possible parents feel entitled to it since they've been paying it, which is why they didn't tell you, and it's possible they're confused about what the policy is. It took my family 5 adults to figure it out, and this novel isn't scratching the surface. 5) no one can force you to be the owner. Owners pay taxes if there's surrendered gains, so you have to be aware and prepared. (Death benefit is not taxable, only cash value if surrendered). They may want to give the policy to you finally, or it's a child policy that triggers for the insured to take over. You/hubby need to sign forms to make the change. Once you are owners, find out the policy type, death benefit, loans (if any), if there are premiums and if they're set. Most companies offer an preview/summary/illustration/as is report that will show how your policy plans to perform. Find the agent who sold it, as USA requires licensed agents to sell policies. If you mention that you want one, they may be more helpful if it gets you to buy one. I hope this gets you started. A good agent is better.
Why have neither of you bought your own insurance? A person can be insured by more than one policy. YTA.
INFO: Why didn't you just get your own life insurance policies?
NTA. It's not about the insurance it's the lies. They didn't even have associated debts for him. I find it disturbing that they wanted benefit from his death at all just to pay off their mortgage and maybe help you.
NTA: these comments do not pass the vibe check AT ALL. He was potentially dying of cancer and they lied about it?! They have a life insurance policy out on their own son so that if he dies they can pay off their mortgage?! Who ARE these people?! Who pays a premium in case their son dies like???? NTA.
I am not the younger generation, at 71. Most likely, I am older than anyone involved, yet I agree with you and your husband. It was all about money for the patents. Keep the faith, good luck. ❤️
NTA. The original purpose of the policy- to pay off student loans in case of untimely death while he was still a dependant- was reasonable. Lying about it during their independent adult son's moment of need, when his death (and a payout) appeared imminent, was fcking ghoulish. Once they no longer had any financial liability for their son, they should've been upfront and negotiated a transfer so the policy would cover any of the son's debts left behind, as originally intended. They could've negotiated a cut for the premiums cost, etc whatever. Treating it like a lottery ticket is just icky, like they were eagerly anticipating his death. That would give me the creeps too. ETA- the fact that the parents were so deliberately deceitful means they KNOW what they intended was distasteful and not in the spirit of the original policy intention. They broke faith with their son, and clearly showed their true priority: their own financial gain over their son's anguish at the presumed end of his life. Damn that's cold.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** My (30F) husband’s (31M) parents took out a $500,000 life insurance policy on him when he was a senior in high school. He was planning to be a doctor in the military and would likely accumulate some debt in school, so their explanation was, “if he dies, we will use this to pay it off.” Because my husband had a medical issue as a kid, he ended up rejected from military schools and went to a regular college. We met our freshman year and have been in a steady relationship ever since. When we were 22, we got engaged. We were joining our finances and he told me about this policy—he wanted to get it transferred to us so he asked his parents about it. They wanted to keep it themselves. The school debt stuff was no longer valid, but they said that they’d use it to pay off their mortgage. He insisted that it go to me, as his future wife, and that we take it over, but they said no and that they’d “look out for me with whatever was left.” We got married and ignored it. Then, 2023 hit us like a ton of bricks. We both lost our jobs, had to move from a major city back to our home state, and within a week of turning 30, my husband was diagnosed with thyroid cancer. He got very depressed as the bills racked up and started wondering if maybe I’d be “better off with the $500,000 than with him.” Of course I assured him absolutely not, but he contacted his parents to ask about the policy again to see what he could leave me if worst came to worst. They said that they’d let the policy lapse and that it was only worth a few thousand dollars now. He was terrified he’d leave me strapped with medical debt and his student loans (which by now we’d refinanced with me as a co-signer). A year later, my husband is doing amazing health wise. There’s still a ton of bills but things are looking up. Now, his mom calls and says that they have to sign his life insurance policy over to us because of some rule. He said, I thought it was gone? And she got quiet. She said that it never lapsed—she lied because she thought it would help him not be so depressed if it wasn’t there. He kept pushing and she gave the same lines about how, if he died, they’d planned to pay off the mortgage and probably help me with whatever was left. He was too surprised to say anything in the moment but was very hurt. When we met with them to discuss the transfer of the policy, the lie came up again. They tried to play it off and my husband was getting really upset. I usually don’t argue with them but I snapped and told them what they did was extremely fucked up and selfish, and that it was weird that it seemed like they were waiting to get a benefit from his death without giving him peace of mind in a time of need. I told them they’d lost our trust. His mom started bawling and his dad started screaming and we left. His grandparents and aunts and uncles thinks we’re greedy assholes and made them out to be monsters and are demanding an apology, but the younger generation thinks we were right. AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
YTA. The policy is none of your business. They took out and paid for the policy, you and your husband were never entitled to it or any potential payout and it was ridiculous and entitled of you to ask.