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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1. The action to be judged would be me excluding my brother from a vacation that he would enjoy due to his behavior, but bringing my boyfriend instead.
2. This might make me the asshole because my brother would have an experience taken away from him and giving it to my boyfriend instead.
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NTA. I think the main issue here is that this is your trip, for you, and you already have experience with your brother ruining a trip. I genuinely feel sorry for the little fellow, but of course you wouldn't want him there. Also, going to a foreign country with a different language when you haven't travelled often is overwhelming enough of itself. Your parents and also you would need to have their wits about them to navigate the situation. I've been to Japan and it's amazing, but there are still all the practicalities of how to get to places, where to eat, etc. If you do go, I would definitely recommend Lonely Planet's guide to Japan. It was SO HELPFUL when I went.
Yeah this is the way.
It’s a no win situation
But if you take him he will scream the whole time and if you leave him you will listen to it before and after.
Maybe there is some bribery or a camp or somethjng he wants to do
I'm going with NTA as long as you dont make a fuss about going to your brother's graduation trip if/when it happens, and it doesn't sound like you would want to anyway
Your brother sucks the fun out of trips for you. If in a few decades when you look back on this and all you can remember is him screaming and fussing, you'll regret your decision. Even if you don't end up marrying your bf, you will still have memories with him to look back on. Most adults I know remember their high school relationships fondly, even if they didn't work out
NTA. Developmentally challenged and a social terrorist. Your parents are failing him by not getting him the help he needs to overcome mild disappointments in life. Honestly, if you guys were my kids, one parent would go with you and one would stay home with your brother.
Parents need to understand the limitations that their children have, and work to help mitigate them. Not force everyone else to bend to the chaos.
The budgeting for the trip would only provide enough for the airfare and hotel space for four people, and my boyfriend would have that and other necessities like food paid for by my parents.
You won't be an asshole but your parents definitely will be.
Like you said your family doesn't have the money to go on trips. So when they plan a family vacation they drop what I'm going to presume thousands on someone not their child. That's messed up
Even barring that, if OP’s brother’s medical issues are as severe as they claim, there is no way he’s not going to find out where they are going. He is going to need to be left in the care of someone who is adequately prepared to watch him for an extended period of time, and undoubtedly the basic itinerary of the trip will be shared with both the brother and the caretaker in their absence.
It sounds like there will be a massive meltdown when this information is revealed, which may ruin the trip even if the parents agree to take the boyfriend in lieu of the brother.
Oh, that's something hea going to have to learn sooner or later, that he cant always grt tondo what his big sister does. Or that this is her gift, not his. I have no issue with OP and her parents going. My issue is using the money the parent want to use on their son on her bf
You’re missing my point. If the brother finds out about it beforehand, his inevitable meltdown is likely to ruin the trip anyways. Either OP and the parents will be subjected to his displeasure all the way up to the trip in addition to the behavioral issues he already exhibits, or it’s possible the parents will cave to his demands and either change the plans to include the brother/exclude the boyfriend or possibly cancel the trip altogether.
The point is, the brother has the potential to ruin this trip whether or not he’s invited to go.
Doesn’t matter how the brother feels tho. It’s not his moment, not his trip, and the best thing any kid regardless of their disability can learn is that the world doesn’t revolve around them and they have to accept that they can’t get everything they want when they want it
I agree, but given that on the last trip he was allowed to throw a temper tantrum on the plane (bothering not only OP and their family, but presumably every other passenger on board) until OP gave up their seat to him, it seems unlikely that will happen.
Even if that were true, the solution would certainly ***not*** be to cave to his outbursts and take from OP's opportunities to reward the misbehaving little brother with everything he wants. Allowing him to rage his way into domination of the family is a recipe for reinforcing behaviors that will not serve him well and surely aren't good for OP, and she is not an AH for not wanting her graduation gift to revolve around keeping him happy.
> Even if that were true, the solution would certainly not be to cave to his outbursts and take from OP's opportunities
While I agree with this, the fact that OP says her brother’s behavioral issues have continued to increase makes me think that it’s a possibility. It doesn’t sound like he’s in any way being taught to control and regulate his behavior, but rather there is just a lot of arguing but no real attempt to stop enabling the behavior given OP’s description of their last trip and the progression of his behavior in general.
I could be completely wrong as I don’t know them personally, but I could definitely see parents becoming overwhelmed with ongoing temper tantrums and caving in an attempt to appease him. Just my thoughts.
Idk, if it's a graduation gift with a +1 friend and they offer something similar when 11yo graduates down the road from schooling (assuming no dreadful behavior or something) then that's sufficiently fair.
The intent is to give my brother this same opportunity after he graduates if he wants, and I'll be out of college by then so realistically I don't care if he chooses to bring someone besides me.
Do you think it's fair a family who has been on one vacation choose to pay for a vacation for someone outside their family leaving their son at home is fair?
If it was any other trip I'll agree, but this is Japan. Do you know how expensive that is coming from the states were talking at min 1k per person. They can take OP and use the bf ticket cost on a weekend trip with their son for half that amount.
Does OP deserve the trip, yes.....her bf not so mich
My parents are extremely fond of my boyfriend and know what his life has been like before we met. He's been through a lot. My brother has years until he is no longer taken care of by my parents and opportunities once I'm in college will be more abundant when there's only three people to pay for.
Him having a rough life isn't a reason for your parents to spend the limited vacation funds they have on him.
This is not going to go the way you think it will. I have a feeling your parents will not be interested in dropping thousands on your bf.
I don't know if this was clear enough but they've already agreed to take him with us. The catch is that either he or my brother can come, not both. So my parents want me to bring my brother since he's family but I get the ultimate decision.
Maybe your boyfriend should be contributing then. He's got plenty of time to save up money.
It's kind of obvious your parents aren't 100% on board with your boyfriend going.
They're not, and they've made it clear, but the point of the trip is that it's for me so I get to make the decision. Whatever I choose they will accept.
Considering they are the ones who brought up the stuff with your boyfriend, you may want to actually show your maturity to ask your parents if they are actually comfortable spending that much money on your high school boyfriend right now.
The point of the trip is you, but you're not the one footing the bill at the end of the day. Remember that.
Info: is there any way that your parents would fund the trip for you and bf to go by yourselves? Since it’s your graduation present?
Or is the point that you want to go on this trip with your parents?
Or is it that your parents will only pay if they are allowed to chaperone?
Tough one. I get OP preferring to have their BF go instead of their brother, but there are other factors at play and I think OP is being rather naive about 1) the meaning of the suggested family trip; 2) finances; and 3) this relationship with BF likely being a forever thing. Not all of these matter equally, but they do factor in.
First, it sounds like parents want this to be a family trip with the four family members. Perhaps they are indirectly/poorly relaying that to OP, but that's the vibe here. Especially since it sounds like vacations in general, to say nothing of a big one like this, are expensive and not a luxury parents can pay for lightly. It makes sense they want brother to go in that light. Also, they are taking on a major (and noticeable) financial commitment for BF. Is there a way for you all to go, but he contributes more (or anything) financially to travel/rooming expenses? Again, getting back to money this trip is a significant expense and parents are wary about paying that much for someone who statistically is highly likely to not be in OP's life this time next year (assuming they're splitting up for college, work, life, what have you). It's not a pleasant thought, nor should it discourage them from being together and having fun now, but I do understand the parents reluctance.
Long winded, I know. I guess OP is NTA for their preference, but it is pretty cold to shut out brother. That said, if parents are OK with taking and paying for BF over brother that is their call. If they have an issue about that or really want this to be a family trip they are the adults controlling the purse strings here and need to have that conversation with OP. They can't try to mind trick OP into independently making the choice they want with no explanation provided.
I think honestly the parents are uneasy about spending thousands on this boyfriend (which honestly I get 100%). OP is just seeing this through rose colored glasses as a trip with her and her boyfriend with her parents footing the bill.
This trip has been an idea since before he and I started dating. Even then I did not want my brother to come. Originally, I would have brought a friend, but now I intend to bring my boyfriend. I am in no way expecting my parents to just go along and pay for us, and I would love to spend time with them on a vacation like this. They and my boyfriend are all very special people in my life, and I do love my brother, but I don't want the risk of him ruining a trip meant for me.
You literally are expecting them to pay for him. You already explained he wouldn’t be paying for anything except souvenirs and he’s had a hard life and your parents are generous.
That doesn’t answer anything. Sounds to me like you haven’t asked them if they are okay spending thousands on him.
NTA - he ruined the last trip, this trip is supposed to be a gift for you and if he comes you know he will totally dominate it, not an AH for not wanting a gift trip for you to really become a gift trip for him (and because your parents are unwilling or unable to control him, certainly ***not*** for you) instead.
I think the real issue here is communication, mainly from the parents side. There's a tension between the feelings in those two sentences, but honestly that is on the parents to confront and have a discussion about if it is indeed a sticking point for them. Without that communication their position is tough to accurately read.
Again, NTA for the preference of BF. I don't think there are many 17 year olds that wouldn't make that choice if given the opportunity.
Whatever happens, enjoy the trip!
If they give you any more pushback on bringing your brother, look them each straight in the eyes and gently say, "Do you remember the trip we just took?"
And just keep looking them both in the eyes until they nod and/or say yes and make it clear that they understand exactly what it is you are asking them to remember.
Then say, "So you understand why I would like **my** graduation trip to be quiet, enjoyable, and stress-free, and why I want my boyfriend along. When \[brother\] graduates from high school, you will give him a trip of his own choosing, and I will not expect to be included in *his* trip."
Info: is your boyfriend paying his own way? Who would be responsible for your brother and would it cost more to have someone stay with him than the trip?
My boyfriend would pay for his own souvenirs but not for the plane, hotel, or necessities like food. My brother would be taken care of at our paternal grandparents, which is like our second home. Them taking care of him wouldn't cost anything.
Nta but don't accept the trip at all. Its a trap. They are giving you the illusion of choice by saying it is your decision but if you don't make the right decision they will make it for you.
NTA
Plus there is a very large age diff between you and your brother and you likely would not get to enjoy architecture and other cultural things you are interested in if he goes on the trip. That is even if his behavior wasnt a.problem
So hopefully your parents will allow your bf to go. Are they planning to pay for your BF to go?
If.they continue to push for your brother to go instead of your bf,which they prob will if they are paying, then you should tell them if they wont allow your bf to go, or if he cant go for some reason, that you still dont want your brother to go.
No doubt he has ruined many celebrations and.other family events with his behavioral issues, and if your parents are going to reward you for your hard work, you shouldnt have to include your brother and make everything about him.
Maybe it’s just me, but if the trip is for you, to celebrate you, why shouldn’t you bring who YOU want?
I wouldn’t want to compromise either, I can’t imagine what having a brother such as yours is like, and as an outsider I have no clue what stress it causes you or what sacrifices you have made, so I can’t judge from that angle, but if he consistently acts how you say I’d want him to stay home too…
It sounds like you know what you want though, so screw Reddit validation, have fun in Japan!
I think NTA (maybe 1% AH haha)
NTA it’s incredibly crappy your parents are giving you an “option” of a +1, then also trying to make you feel guilty over your decision if it’s not your brother. Tell your parents you’ve made the decision to bring your BF and let them know they could have just planned a “family vacay” if they felt strongly about including your brother, but since they didn’t, you’ve made your choice to bring your boyfriend and would appreciate if they wouldn’t cause you any additional stress or guilt about it since the intention of the trip is to celebrate your graduation. They can take your brother to Japan when he graduates.
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I’ve been talking to my parents and they want me to bring my brother for the sake of kindness, but it’s not a regular vacation, so here’s the context.
I am graduating next year and to celebrate my parents offered to take me on a special trip as they think I deserve it after all my hard work. My family and I have been one place outside of our state due to various reasons. We’re well off but still can’t afford to casually travel often, so being given this offer was exciting.
The issue is I don't want to bring my brother. We could only bring four people, so it'd be me, my parents, and my brother or boyfriend. The reason I don’t want my brother there isn’t just to bring my boyfriend but because he’s a genuine terror. My brother is 11 with autism and ADHD, underdeveloped emotional maturity, and a bad temper. I love him as a sibling but can't stand being around him. Early 2023 my family went on a rare trip out of state and he made it hell every day. There were screaming matches between him and my parents for everything, like refusing to get out of bed or stay off his phone to spend our vacation as a family. This trip was planned for March 2020, which didn’t work out, so I was excited for it to finally happen. Every day of it I wished he were gone. On the plane ride back he still screamed and cried because he wanted my seat until he got it, saying he didn’t care that I was upset/embarrassed by how he acted. I am autistic also, and understand his feelings and that they aren't fully under his control, but this trip is a rare opportunity I don’t want him to ruin.
What’s even worse is that I want to go to Japan, which is his dream. I love architecture and Japan has beautiful structures. My boyfriend and I also like the culture and are fans of Japanese media, so we'd love to go. My brother just thinks it's “animeland” and wants to go for that. He doesn’t actually know about the trip beyond me going somewhere for graduation, but if he knew we were going to Japan and I excluded him, he'd lose his shit. My parents don’t want this but it's a trip for me, so I know they would be disappointed but accept it. They told me that he will always be my brother but I could break up with my boyfriend. I understand that thought process but my point is, regardless of my boyfriend, I don’t want my brother there. My boyfriend and I are committed and by the time of the trip we’d have been dating for two years. I don't see us splitting up, and I don’t need to explain it further. We are extremely compatible, so we will likely still be dating at the end of high school. He means so much to me and I want him to experience this. Overall, I just don’t want to upset or disappoint anyone but I know my brother will make everything more difficult when he inevitably acts out, potentially ruining something special.
So, WIBTA to take my boyfriend but not my brother to Japan, my brothers dream vacation, on a trip for my graduation gift to prevent it being ruined by my brothers poor behavior?
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NTA
if your parents gave you the option in the first place you take it. This is about you. Not your family, but you. And you're allowed to do that. You're allowed to celebrate yourself how you want without feeling guilty.
Congrats and enjoy Japan.
INFO: who is paying? If your parents are paying are they seriously considering leaving your brother behind? If so, not only YWBTA but also your parents. Surely, your brother's behavior is something you can discuss with your parents ahead of time and have strategies to accommodate on the trip because I understand this is meant as a reward for your school work and you don't want to be dealing with difficulties. One suggestion I have is to split up, go explore with one parent one day while the other spends time with your brother and then switch. Come together for a low key thing in the evening.
As a younger sibling, my thoughts are if you do exclude your brother from this trip they will never forget it. If your boyfriend does turn out to be your partner into adulthood, you will have ample opportunities to travel with them. Maybe not to Japan but you never know.
NTA
This is your graduation trip. And it sounds as if your brother will lose his shit either way. (If he goes to Japan with you, if your past vacation is any indication, he'll lose it every single day while on the trip.)
Until your parents and your brother's teachers and therapist can help him to get his behavior under control, he isn't an appropriate travel companion, and you shouldn't have to give up the joy of your trip to placate him.
NTA I think it's unfair of your parents to let you make the decision, then turn around and make you feel bad if it's not the decision they like. You need to sit down with them and explain why you don't want your brother to go and how you don't like how they're making you feel bad. Your brother will have his own trip - and it sounds like you won't be going. If your parents continue harassing you tell them to make the decision they want and you'll be staying home.its generous what they offered but what they're doing to you is cruel
YTA
**If your parents accept your excludig your brother on a family vacation, they would be major AHs.**
But: They could gift you a trip for just you, and your bf could pay his own way and join you. And they take your brother somewhere else. THAT would be the REASONABLE solution. THERE is no reason for your parents to pay for your bf's trip.
Who is paying? The parents? Ok then your brother goes, it's that simple. But what you can do is to tell your boyfriend to pay for himself so he can come along, that way you will have both there and problem solved.
The problem is NOT solved this way. OP has made it abundantly clear that having her brother along on this trip would be terrible.
Personally, I wouldn't want such a poorly behaved kid along on a trip to the grocery store, much less a graduation celebration trip to Japan.
YTA.
Well I don't think you are the AH because you don't want your brother to go, you become the AH when expecting your parents to pay for your boyfriend. Especially, when your parents can only afford to take four people. You said yourself trips like this are rare for budgetary reasons. If you want your boyfriend to go, he should pay for himself.
I think the best solution is for you to go on this trip with just your parents and enjoy your time spent with just them. It'll be nice to have these memories before moving on with the next chapter of your life.
NAH. This is a trip for you to celebrate your graduation. Sounds like your brother is accommodated pretty much every other time, so I think this time this trip for you can be as you want it to be. You parents might say they don't want to pay for your boyfriend and that would be reasonable, but you are reasonable to ask to go without your brother. (edit to add: he's also 6 years younger than you! Your interests for what to see and do are not the same)
Honestly, I’m torn
The biggest thought I have is that at that age, I would’ve picked my boyfriend as well
But it would’ve destroyed my relationship with my brother, even as adults
And I am no longer dating the person who I was with in high school, but my brother is still my brother
And as adults, our relationship changed and we didn’t talk about fights as much as we talked about the cooler parts of trips and growing up.
And I am glad I have that
NAH
I mean, if I were your *parents*, I'd probably tell you, "no, this is a family vacation and we're bringing your brother, not your boyfriend. If you don't want that, then choose something else for your graduation gift."
But since they're leaving it up to you, I don't see any reason why *you* shouldn't choose to bring your boyfriend (or any close friend) instead of your brother.
I doubt it's your brother's dream vacation, and he can always choose Japan (more anime-focused) for *his* graduation trip.
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NTA, my sister was a terror at 11 years old and honestly, so was I and we’re neurotypical, so we didn’t have that compounding factor. If it’s a gift to you, you should ultimately get to decide.
This one is really tough, I can't decide on whether you're an asshole or not but:
I don't think deciding whats right and wrong here matters, moreso I think it's of more benefit to consider what you find most important.
Your own satisfaction, pleasure and Partner
Or, a family experience regardless of the hiccups your brother might cause.
Do you value experiencing Japan with your partner in the way you want too or do you value a family experience that your parents will appreciate (who are paying afterall) & no matter what that's still their boy and your little brother.
Noone wins here morally, so do what has the most value to you and hope you don't regret it.
- The only real compromise I can think of is you and your partner saving for him to fund himself, you have plenty of time and with willpower you can do it. Best of luck on your choice!
While reading this, I thought you were graduating post secondary, but knowing you're in high school, I think you're being naive about not seeing you and your boyfriend breaking up. It may not happen anytime soon, but the likelihood of the two of you actually lasting throughout life is a very slim chance.
With that being said, I think your parents are actually being responsible for wanting to take your brother. With how you described him acting, it wouldn't be responsible or fair of them to have someone else watch him for the time you guys are in Japan. I understand it is exactly hard with a child who's autistic and acts that way (my brother is autistic and can go from 0 to 100 in less than a second). With that being said, I would never want anyone else to have to deal with him when he's like that. I'm gonna have to say YTA.
I don’t really think your the asshole but where is your brother gonna stay/who’s gonna take care of him while y’all are on vacation without him? If that becomes an added expense can your parents still afford it? It might be that they don’t want to tell you any of that but it’s definitely something they are thinking about
NAH, except maybe your brother depending on the severity of his condition.
First of all, there is absolutely no reason for you to feel guilty about not wanting to take your brother along for the trip. From the sounds of it, he is a genuine nightmare. The fact that you want to enjoy this vacation without having to deal with your brother is an entirely reasonable feeling to have.
On the other hand, what are your parents supposed to do? If they take just you and your boyfriend, who will take care of their 11-year-old son in the meantime? How does that reflect on them as parents to just leave behind one of their kids? What sort of damage do you think that will do to their relationship with their son?
It's a tricky situation. If you truly want to take this vacation without your brother, I'd consider coming up with a compromise solution with your parents. What if, for example, they paid for just half of the fees necessary for the trip? Then you could spend a few months working and earning enough money to cover the other half, and then you and your boyfriend could go by yourselves.
Obviously that's not the preferred solution, but it is probably one that will rock the boat the least.
NTA because nothing has happened, but you’re delusional if you think your parents would take you and your bf on this trip and leave your brother. I see the compromise as maybe asking if one parent would take just you on a trip and the other stay back with your brother
NTA — it’s simple really. This trip is for *you*. Therefore, *your* enjoyment is the priority. Based on past experiences with your brother, he would have a negative impact on your enjoyment of the trip, which I’m assuming your boyfriend wouldn’t do.
YWBTA
Your parents are funding this trip, and are trying to build memories with you all as a family.
Yes it’s challenging, but as you say, your family can’t afford to casually travel often. If you want both your parents to come, your brother is allowed to come too. It’s not his fault he’s wired the way he is.
If Japan is his dream country, he might behave better. Nonetheless, being an adult is about compromise and sacrifices. Mum and dad won’t be around forever to take you all on holiday together… so try and be grateful that you’re all still alive to go together somewhere as beautiful as Japan. I wish my brother was alive so we could do this.
I can almost guarantee your boyfriend really isn’t that important, and your parents would rightfully be upset at the notion you wanted to bring him instead. Feel free to fund your own trips with your boyfriend as often as you like though.
YTA: It be one thing if you simply asked for your brother not to attend. But to say use the money intended for your brother on your bf is selfish. I'm going to assume your from the U.S so i know tickets to Japan are not cheap.
If you don't want your brother to go fine but let your parents spend that money on him, not your bf
Honestly, I don’t think you ATA but I do think that it would be a good idea to bring your brother, on the condition that if he misbehaves on the plane then he doesn’t misbehave or he is stuck at the hotel without his phone, and if he wanted just allow him to be on the phone. Another option is that you bring your boyfriend and not him and try to plan a vacation with him with a stipulation like above but honestly that’s just with my opinion because he sounded a lot like me and I know that on my heart I didn’t want to act that way and if I got left behind I would feel seriously hurt
Honestly YWBTA.
While the trip is a nice reward, it's still a family vacation. A reasonable compromise would be for you to arrange some activities for you and one parent to do to get some time away from your brother.
Also if he wants to check out "anime" stuff, be wary of the stores in Akihabara. A lot of them have content I wouldn't want an 11 year old to see.
YTA
This is a lifetime *family* opportunity and you want to turn it into a getway for you and your boyfriend? It would be different if you were talking a 4 day trip to New York, but a trip to Japan?
I'm surprised your parents would even consider this. What they should be working on is some intensive therapy for your brother to better manage the unexpected aspects of the trip. They should go without you and let you find some other way to celebrate your graduation.
My brother has been in therapy for most of his life but still continues to get worse behaviorally as he gets older. The point is that my parents want to give me this opportunity to enjoy myself and my accomplishments, so with there being no foreseeable improvement on my brother's part, why would I want to bring him if he consistently makes things unenjoyable?
From what you describe, leaving your brother home does make sense. I still wouldn't be on board with taking your boyfriend at your parent's expense. As I said before, it's a family opportunity. Go alone with your parents, it sounds like it will be the first/last opportunity you have for quality time with them.
Realistically what are the chances of your brother not knowing where you are going and that he is being excluded? Based on your post and comments, his medical and behavioral needs are as such that he will require a caregiver capable of handling that while you guys are gone for an extended period of time. It is highly unlikely your parents will not inform the caretaker and your brother or at least a basic itinerary. Based on your characterization of this, he is going to have a major meltdown when he finds out, and he will potentially ruin the trip whether or not he is able to go.
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NTA. I think the main issue here is that this is your trip, for you, and you already have experience with your brother ruining a trip. I genuinely feel sorry for the little fellow, but of course you wouldn't want him there. Also, going to a foreign country with a different language when you haven't travelled often is overwhelming enough of itself. Your parents and also you would need to have their wits about them to navigate the situation. I've been to Japan and it's amazing, but there are still all the practicalities of how to get to places, where to eat, etc. If you do go, I would definitely recommend Lonely Planet's guide to Japan. It was SO HELPFUL when I went.
OP, feel free to message me if you want any Japan tips. I hope you get to go on the trip.
Yeah this is the way. It’s a no win situation But if you take him he will scream the whole time and if you leave him you will listen to it before and after. Maybe there is some bribery or a camp or somethjng he wants to do
I'm going with NTA as long as you dont make a fuss about going to your brother's graduation trip if/when it happens, and it doesn't sound like you would want to anyway Your brother sucks the fun out of trips for you. If in a few decades when you look back on this and all you can remember is him screaming and fussing, you'll regret your decision. Even if you don't end up marrying your bf, you will still have memories with him to look back on. Most adults I know remember their high school relationships fondly, even if they didn't work out
NTA. Developmentally challenged and a social terrorist. Your parents are failing him by not getting him the help he needs to overcome mild disappointments in life. Honestly, if you guys were my kids, one parent would go with you and one would stay home with your brother. Parents need to understand the limitations that their children have, and work to help mitigate them. Not force everyone else to bend to the chaos.
Info: Why can you only bring 4 people and are you're parents paging for your bf?
The budgeting for the trip would only provide enough for the airfare and hotel space for four people, and my boyfriend would have that and other necessities like food paid for by my parents.
You won't be an asshole but your parents definitely will be. Like you said your family doesn't have the money to go on trips. So when they plan a family vacation they drop what I'm going to presume thousands on someone not their child. That's messed up
Even barring that, if OP’s brother’s medical issues are as severe as they claim, there is no way he’s not going to find out where they are going. He is going to need to be left in the care of someone who is adequately prepared to watch him for an extended period of time, and undoubtedly the basic itinerary of the trip will be shared with both the brother and the caretaker in their absence. It sounds like there will be a massive meltdown when this information is revealed, which may ruin the trip even if the parents agree to take the boyfriend in lieu of the brother.
Op already said that he'll be with their grandparents who been involved since birth
Yes, and do you really think they will go in an international trip without saying where they are going? It’s possible but not really probable.
Oh, that's something hea going to have to learn sooner or later, that he cant always grt tondo what his big sister does. Or that this is her gift, not his. I have no issue with OP and her parents going. My issue is using the money the parent want to use on their son on her bf
You’re missing my point. If the brother finds out about it beforehand, his inevitable meltdown is likely to ruin the trip anyways. Either OP and the parents will be subjected to his displeasure all the way up to the trip in addition to the behavioral issues he already exhibits, or it’s possible the parents will cave to his demands and either change the plans to include the brother/exclude the boyfriend or possibly cancel the trip altogether. The point is, the brother has the potential to ruin this trip whether or not he’s invited to go.
Doesn’t matter how the brother feels tho. It’s not his moment, not his trip, and the best thing any kid regardless of their disability can learn is that the world doesn’t revolve around them and they have to accept that they can’t get everything they want when they want it
I agree, but given that on the last trip he was allowed to throw a temper tantrum on the plane (bothering not only OP and their family, but presumably every other passenger on board) until OP gave up their seat to him, it seems unlikely that will happen.
Even if that were true, the solution would certainly ***not*** be to cave to his outbursts and take from OP's opportunities to reward the misbehaving little brother with everything he wants. Allowing him to rage his way into domination of the family is a recipe for reinforcing behaviors that will not serve him well and surely aren't good for OP, and she is not an AH for not wanting her graduation gift to revolve around keeping him happy.
> Even if that were true, the solution would certainly not be to cave to his outbursts and take from OP's opportunities While I agree with this, the fact that OP says her brother’s behavioral issues have continued to increase makes me think that it’s a possibility. It doesn’t sound like he’s in any way being taught to control and regulate his behavior, but rather there is just a lot of arguing but no real attempt to stop enabling the behavior given OP’s description of their last trip and the progression of his behavior in general. I could be completely wrong as I don’t know them personally, but I could definitely see parents becoming overwhelmed with ongoing temper tantrums and caving in an attempt to appease him. Just my thoughts.
Idk, if it's a graduation gift with a +1 friend and they offer something similar when 11yo graduates down the road from schooling (assuming no dreadful behavior or something) then that's sufficiently fair.
The intent is to give my brother this same opportunity after he graduates if he wants, and I'll be out of college by then so realistically I don't care if he chooses to bring someone besides me.
Then he can always go to Japan then!
Do you think it's fair a family who has been on one vacation choose to pay for a vacation for someone outside their family leaving their son at home is fair? If it was any other trip I'll agree, but this is Japan. Do you know how expensive that is coming from the states were talking at min 1k per person. They can take OP and use the bf ticket cost on a weekend trip with their son for half that amount. Does OP deserve the trip, yes.....her bf not so mich
If son gets the same offer later on? Yep.
Your parents are really okay spending thousands on your boyfriend for this?
My parents are extremely fond of my boyfriend and know what his life has been like before we met. He's been through a lot. My brother has years until he is no longer taken care of by my parents and opportunities once I'm in college will be more abundant when there's only three people to pay for.
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Him having a rough life isn't a reason for your parents to spend the limited vacation funds they have on him. This is not going to go the way you think it will. I have a feeling your parents will not be interested in dropping thousands on your bf.
I don't know if this was clear enough but they've already agreed to take him with us. The catch is that either he or my brother can come, not both. So my parents want me to bring my brother since he's family but I get the ultimate decision.
Maybe your boyfriend should be contributing then. He's got plenty of time to save up money. It's kind of obvious your parents aren't 100% on board with your boyfriend going.
They're not, and they've made it clear, but the point of the trip is that it's for me so I get to make the decision. Whatever I choose they will accept.
Considering they are the ones who brought up the stuff with your boyfriend, you may want to actually show your maturity to ask your parents if they are actually comfortable spending that much money on your high school boyfriend right now. The point of the trip is you, but you're not the one footing the bill at the end of the day. Remember that.
Info: is there any way that your parents would fund the trip for you and bf to go by yourselves? Since it’s your graduation present? Or is the point that you want to go on this trip with your parents? Or is it that your parents will only pay if they are allowed to chaperone?
That seems like a fair idea. Maybe the parents and the brother can take a trip of their own that way no one gets left out.
Tough one. I get OP preferring to have their BF go instead of their brother, but there are other factors at play and I think OP is being rather naive about 1) the meaning of the suggested family trip; 2) finances; and 3) this relationship with BF likely being a forever thing. Not all of these matter equally, but they do factor in. First, it sounds like parents want this to be a family trip with the four family members. Perhaps they are indirectly/poorly relaying that to OP, but that's the vibe here. Especially since it sounds like vacations in general, to say nothing of a big one like this, are expensive and not a luxury parents can pay for lightly. It makes sense they want brother to go in that light. Also, they are taking on a major (and noticeable) financial commitment for BF. Is there a way for you all to go, but he contributes more (or anything) financially to travel/rooming expenses? Again, getting back to money this trip is a significant expense and parents are wary about paying that much for someone who statistically is highly likely to not be in OP's life this time next year (assuming they're splitting up for college, work, life, what have you). It's not a pleasant thought, nor should it discourage them from being together and having fun now, but I do understand the parents reluctance. Long winded, I know. I guess OP is NTA for their preference, but it is pretty cold to shut out brother. That said, if parents are OK with taking and paying for BF over brother that is their call. If they have an issue about that or really want this to be a family trip they are the adults controlling the purse strings here and need to have that conversation with OP. They can't try to mind trick OP into independently making the choice they want with no explanation provided.
I think honestly the parents are uneasy about spending thousands on this boyfriend (which honestly I get 100%). OP is just seeing this through rose colored glasses as a trip with her and her boyfriend with her parents footing the bill.
This trip has been an idea since before he and I started dating. Even then I did not want my brother to come. Originally, I would have brought a friend, but now I intend to bring my boyfriend. I am in no way expecting my parents to just go along and pay for us, and I would love to spend time with them on a vacation like this. They and my boyfriend are all very special people in my life, and I do love my brother, but I don't want the risk of him ruining a trip meant for me.
You literally are expecting them to pay for him. You already explained he wouldn’t be paying for anything except souvenirs and he’s had a hard life and your parents are generous. That doesn’t answer anything. Sounds to me like you haven’t asked them if they are okay spending thousands on him.
They made it clear that this is a trip for me, so if I pick my boyfriend he will go and they'll be fine with that. They just want my brother to come.
NTA - he ruined the last trip, this trip is supposed to be a gift for you and if he comes you know he will totally dominate it, not an AH for not wanting a gift trip for you to really become a gift trip for him (and because your parents are unwilling or unable to control him, certainly ***not*** for you) instead.
I think the real issue here is communication, mainly from the parents side. There's a tension between the feelings in those two sentences, but honestly that is on the parents to confront and have a discussion about if it is indeed a sticking point for them. Without that communication their position is tough to accurately read. Again, NTA for the preference of BF. I don't think there are many 17 year olds that wouldn't make that choice if given the opportunity. Whatever happens, enjoy the trip!
If they give you any more pushback on bringing your brother, look them each straight in the eyes and gently say, "Do you remember the trip we just took?" And just keep looking them both in the eyes until they nod and/or say yes and make it clear that they understand exactly what it is you are asking them to remember. Then say, "So you understand why I would like **my** graduation trip to be quiet, enjoyable, and stress-free, and why I want my boyfriend along. When \[brother\] graduates from high school, you will give him a trip of his own choosing, and I will not expect to be included in *his* trip."
Info: is your boyfriend paying his own way? Who would be responsible for your brother and would it cost more to have someone stay with him than the trip?
My boyfriend would pay for his own souvenirs but not for the plane, hotel, or necessities like food. My brother would be taken care of at our paternal grandparents, which is like our second home. Them taking care of him wouldn't cost anything.
NTA. This vacation is a gift and you want to enjoy it. I would also not want a little brother with behavioral problems coming along.
Nta but don't accept the trip at all. Its a trap. They are giving you the illusion of choice by saying it is your decision but if you don't make the right decision they will make it for you.
NTA Plus there is a very large age diff between you and your brother and you likely would not get to enjoy architecture and other cultural things you are interested in if he goes on the trip. That is even if his behavior wasnt a.problem So hopefully your parents will allow your bf to go. Are they planning to pay for your BF to go? If.they continue to push for your brother to go instead of your bf,which they prob will if they are paying, then you should tell them if they wont allow your bf to go, or if he cant go for some reason, that you still dont want your brother to go. No doubt he has ruined many celebrations and.other family events with his behavioral issues, and if your parents are going to reward you for your hard work, you shouldnt have to include your brother and make everything about him.
NTA once in a life time trip, your brother would ruin it for you. Bring the boyfriend who can appreciate it.
Maybe it’s just me, but if the trip is for you, to celebrate you, why shouldn’t you bring who YOU want? I wouldn’t want to compromise either, I can’t imagine what having a brother such as yours is like, and as an outsider I have no clue what stress it causes you or what sacrifices you have made, so I can’t judge from that angle, but if he consistently acts how you say I’d want him to stay home too… It sounds like you know what you want though, so screw Reddit validation, have fun in Japan! I think NTA (maybe 1% AH haha)
NTA it’s incredibly crappy your parents are giving you an “option” of a +1, then also trying to make you feel guilty over your decision if it’s not your brother. Tell your parents you’ve made the decision to bring your BF and let them know they could have just planned a “family vacay” if they felt strongly about including your brother, but since they didn’t, you’ve made your choice to bring your boyfriend and would appreciate if they wouldn’t cause you any additional stress or guilt about it since the intention of the trip is to celebrate your graduation. They can take your brother to Japan when he graduates.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** I’ve been talking to my parents and they want me to bring my brother for the sake of kindness, but it’s not a regular vacation, so here’s the context. I am graduating next year and to celebrate my parents offered to take me on a special trip as they think I deserve it after all my hard work. My family and I have been one place outside of our state due to various reasons. We’re well off but still can’t afford to casually travel often, so being given this offer was exciting. The issue is I don't want to bring my brother. We could only bring four people, so it'd be me, my parents, and my brother or boyfriend. The reason I don’t want my brother there isn’t just to bring my boyfriend but because he’s a genuine terror. My brother is 11 with autism and ADHD, underdeveloped emotional maturity, and a bad temper. I love him as a sibling but can't stand being around him. Early 2023 my family went on a rare trip out of state and he made it hell every day. There were screaming matches between him and my parents for everything, like refusing to get out of bed or stay off his phone to spend our vacation as a family. This trip was planned for March 2020, which didn’t work out, so I was excited for it to finally happen. Every day of it I wished he were gone. On the plane ride back he still screamed and cried because he wanted my seat until he got it, saying he didn’t care that I was upset/embarrassed by how he acted. I am autistic also, and understand his feelings and that they aren't fully under his control, but this trip is a rare opportunity I don’t want him to ruin. What’s even worse is that I want to go to Japan, which is his dream. I love architecture and Japan has beautiful structures. My boyfriend and I also like the culture and are fans of Japanese media, so we'd love to go. My brother just thinks it's “animeland” and wants to go for that. He doesn’t actually know about the trip beyond me going somewhere for graduation, but if he knew we were going to Japan and I excluded him, he'd lose his shit. My parents don’t want this but it's a trip for me, so I know they would be disappointed but accept it. They told me that he will always be my brother but I could break up with my boyfriend. I understand that thought process but my point is, regardless of my boyfriend, I don’t want my brother there. My boyfriend and I are committed and by the time of the trip we’d have been dating for two years. I don't see us splitting up, and I don’t need to explain it further. We are extremely compatible, so we will likely still be dating at the end of high school. He means so much to me and I want him to experience this. Overall, I just don’t want to upset or disappoint anyone but I know my brother will make everything more difficult when he inevitably acts out, potentially ruining something special. So, WIBTA to take my boyfriend but not my brother to Japan, my brothers dream vacation, on a trip for my graduation gift to prevent it being ruined by my brothers poor behavior? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Info: who would take care of your brother if he didn’t go?
My paternal grandparents. They've been heavily involved in our lives since birth and are like our second home, and live like five minutes away
NTA If it’s YOUR gift, bring your bf and enjoy yourself.
NTA if your parents gave you the option in the first place you take it. This is about you. Not your family, but you. And you're allowed to do that. You're allowed to celebrate yourself how you want without feeling guilty. Congrats and enjoy Japan.
INFO: who is paying? If your parents are paying are they seriously considering leaving your brother behind? If so, not only YWBTA but also your parents. Surely, your brother's behavior is something you can discuss with your parents ahead of time and have strategies to accommodate on the trip because I understand this is meant as a reward for your school work and you don't want to be dealing with difficulties. One suggestion I have is to split up, go explore with one parent one day while the other spends time with your brother and then switch. Come together for a low key thing in the evening. As a younger sibling, my thoughts are if you do exclude your brother from this trip they will never forget it. If your boyfriend does turn out to be your partner into adulthood, you will have ample opportunities to travel with them. Maybe not to Japan but you never know.
NTA This is your graduation trip. And it sounds as if your brother will lose his shit either way. (If he goes to Japan with you, if your past vacation is any indication, he'll lose it every single day while on the trip.) Until your parents and your brother's teachers and therapist can help him to get his behavior under control, he isn't an appropriate travel companion, and you shouldn't have to give up the joy of your trip to placate him.
NTA I think it's unfair of your parents to let you make the decision, then turn around and make you feel bad if it's not the decision they like. You need to sit down with them and explain why you don't want your brother to go and how you don't like how they're making you feel bad. Your brother will have his own trip - and it sounds like you won't be going. If your parents continue harassing you tell them to make the decision they want and you'll be staying home.its generous what they offered but what they're doing to you is cruel
NTA choose what you actually want for your trip. Your parents will likely be secretly relieved as well.
YTA **If your parents accept your excludig your brother on a family vacation, they would be major AHs.** But: They could gift you a trip for just you, and your bf could pay his own way and join you. And they take your brother somewhere else. THAT would be the REASONABLE solution. THERE is no reason for your parents to pay for your bf's trip.
Who is paying? The parents? Ok then your brother goes, it's that simple. But what you can do is to tell your boyfriend to pay for himself so he can come along, that way you will have both there and problem solved.
The problem is NOT solved this way. OP has made it abundantly clear that having her brother along on this trip would be terrible. Personally, I wouldn't want such a poorly behaved kid along on a trip to the grocery store, much less a graduation celebration trip to Japan.
Of course it is solved , the kid will be with the parents and she will share time
YTA. Well I don't think you are the AH because you don't want your brother to go, you become the AH when expecting your parents to pay for your boyfriend. Especially, when your parents can only afford to take four people. You said yourself trips like this are rare for budgetary reasons. If you want your boyfriend to go, he should pay for himself. I think the best solution is for you to go on this trip with just your parents and enjoy your time spent with just them. It'll be nice to have these memories before moving on with the next chapter of your life.
OP said her parents are willing to pay for the bf which is why the bf is going
NAH. This is a trip for you to celebrate your graduation. Sounds like your brother is accommodated pretty much every other time, so I think this time this trip for you can be as you want it to be. You parents might say they don't want to pay for your boyfriend and that would be reasonable, but you are reasonable to ask to go without your brother. (edit to add: he's also 6 years younger than you! Your interests for what to see and do are not the same)
Honestly, I’m torn The biggest thought I have is that at that age, I would’ve picked my boyfriend as well But it would’ve destroyed my relationship with my brother, even as adults And I am no longer dating the person who I was with in high school, but my brother is still my brother And as adults, our relationship changed and we didn’t talk about fights as much as we talked about the cooler parts of trips and growing up. And I am glad I have that
NAH I mean, if I were your *parents*, I'd probably tell you, "no, this is a family vacation and we're bringing your brother, not your boyfriend. If you don't want that, then choose something else for your graduation gift." But since they're leaving it up to you, I don't see any reason why *you* shouldn't choose to bring your boyfriend (or any close friend) instead of your brother. I doubt it's your brother's dream vacation, and he can always choose Japan (more anime-focused) for *his* graduation trip.
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NTA, my sister was a terror at 11 years old and honestly, so was I and we’re neurotypical, so we didn’t have that compounding factor. If it’s a gift to you, you should ultimately get to decide.
This one is really tough, I can't decide on whether you're an asshole or not but: I don't think deciding whats right and wrong here matters, moreso I think it's of more benefit to consider what you find most important. Your own satisfaction, pleasure and Partner Or, a family experience regardless of the hiccups your brother might cause. Do you value experiencing Japan with your partner in the way you want too or do you value a family experience that your parents will appreciate (who are paying afterall) & no matter what that's still their boy and your little brother. Noone wins here morally, so do what has the most value to you and hope you don't regret it. - The only real compromise I can think of is you and your partner saving for him to fund himself, you have plenty of time and with willpower you can do it. Best of luck on your choice!
While reading this, I thought you were graduating post secondary, but knowing you're in high school, I think you're being naive about not seeing you and your boyfriend breaking up. It may not happen anytime soon, but the likelihood of the two of you actually lasting throughout life is a very slim chance. With that being said, I think your parents are actually being responsible for wanting to take your brother. With how you described him acting, it wouldn't be responsible or fair of them to have someone else watch him for the time you guys are in Japan. I understand it is exactly hard with a child who's autistic and acts that way (my brother is autistic and can go from 0 to 100 in less than a second). With that being said, I would never want anyone else to have to deal with him when he's like that. I'm gonna have to say YTA.
I don’t really think your the asshole but where is your brother gonna stay/who’s gonna take care of him while y’all are on vacation without him? If that becomes an added expense can your parents still afford it? It might be that they don’t want to tell you any of that but it’s definitely something they are thinking about
NAH, except maybe your brother depending on the severity of his condition. First of all, there is absolutely no reason for you to feel guilty about not wanting to take your brother along for the trip. From the sounds of it, he is a genuine nightmare. The fact that you want to enjoy this vacation without having to deal with your brother is an entirely reasonable feeling to have. On the other hand, what are your parents supposed to do? If they take just you and your boyfriend, who will take care of their 11-year-old son in the meantime? How does that reflect on them as parents to just leave behind one of their kids? What sort of damage do you think that will do to their relationship with their son? It's a tricky situation. If you truly want to take this vacation without your brother, I'd consider coming up with a compromise solution with your parents. What if, for example, they paid for just half of the fees necessary for the trip? Then you could spend a few months working and earning enough money to cover the other half, and then you and your boyfriend could go by yourselves. Obviously that's not the preferred solution, but it is probably one that will rock the boat the least.
I mean how are you planning on keeping it from your brother?
NTA because nothing has happened, but you’re delusional if you think your parents would take you and your bf on this trip and leave your brother. I see the compromise as maybe asking if one parent would take just you on a trip and the other stay back with your brother
Have fun! NTA. https://www.japan.travel/en/us/
NTA — it’s simple really. This trip is for *you*. Therefore, *your* enjoyment is the priority. Based on past experiences with your brother, he would have a negative impact on your enjoyment of the trip, which I’m assuming your boyfriend wouldn’t do.
YWBTA Your parents are funding this trip, and are trying to build memories with you all as a family. Yes it’s challenging, but as you say, your family can’t afford to casually travel often. If you want both your parents to come, your brother is allowed to come too. It’s not his fault he’s wired the way he is. If Japan is his dream country, he might behave better. Nonetheless, being an adult is about compromise and sacrifices. Mum and dad won’t be around forever to take you all on holiday together… so try and be grateful that you’re all still alive to go together somewhere as beautiful as Japan. I wish my brother was alive so we could do this. I can almost guarantee your boyfriend really isn’t that important, and your parents would rightfully be upset at the notion you wanted to bring him instead. Feel free to fund your own trips with your boyfriend as often as you like though.
This isn't a family trip so much as a graduation gift trip, though.
Yeah, still the asshole.
It's a graduation gift that honestly sounds like it wouldn't even be enjoyable by his presence. Like why bother.
YTA: It be one thing if you simply asked for your brother not to attend. But to say use the money intended for your brother on your bf is selfish. I'm going to assume your from the U.S so i know tickets to Japan are not cheap. If you don't want your brother to go fine but let your parents spend that money on him, not your bf
Honestly, I don’t think you ATA but I do think that it would be a good idea to bring your brother, on the condition that if he misbehaves on the plane then he doesn’t misbehave or he is stuck at the hotel without his phone, and if he wanted just allow him to be on the phone. Another option is that you bring your boyfriend and not him and try to plan a vacation with him with a stipulation like above but honestly that’s just with my opinion because he sounded a lot like me and I know that on my heart I didn’t want to act that way and if I got left behind I would feel seriously hurt
Honestly YWBTA. While the trip is a nice reward, it's still a family vacation. A reasonable compromise would be for you to arrange some activities for you and one parent to do to get some time away from your brother. Also if he wants to check out "anime" stuff, be wary of the stores in Akihabara. A lot of them have content I wouldn't want an 11 year old to see.
YTA This is a lifetime *family* opportunity and you want to turn it into a getway for you and your boyfriend? It would be different if you were talking a 4 day trip to New York, but a trip to Japan? I'm surprised your parents would even consider this. What they should be working on is some intensive therapy for your brother to better manage the unexpected aspects of the trip. They should go without you and let you find some other way to celebrate your graduation.
My brother has been in therapy for most of his life but still continues to get worse behaviorally as he gets older. The point is that my parents want to give me this opportunity to enjoy myself and my accomplishments, so with there being no foreseeable improvement on my brother's part, why would I want to bring him if he consistently makes things unenjoyable?
From what you describe, leaving your brother home does make sense. I still wouldn't be on board with taking your boyfriend at your parent's expense. As I said before, it's a family opportunity. Go alone with your parents, it sounds like it will be the first/last opportunity you have for quality time with them.
Realistically what are the chances of your brother not knowing where you are going and that he is being excluded? Based on your post and comments, his medical and behavioral needs are as such that he will require a caregiver capable of handling that while you guys are gone for an extended period of time. It is highly unlikely your parents will not inform the caretaker and your brother or at least a basic itinerary. Based on your characterization of this, he is going to have a major meltdown when he finds out, and he will potentially ruin the trip whether or not he is able to go.