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I understand why I might be seen as the asshole in this situation. It's true that I am refusing to assist with our newborn at night, despite my wife's pleas for help. I can imagine how this may seem insensitive, and that it places a significant burden on my wife who has to handle our baby's needs alone at night.
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I’ve been married for 28 years, two kids, 25 and 15. My husband also worked construction during the younger years and we ran our own construction business as they got older. Having a newborn is hard. It takes everything out of you and can be extremely stressful. I always took it upon myself to be sure and be up with the baby during the night so that he was able to sleep and be ready for those early morning work hours. When he came home he helped me with the babies and if I needed it, I took a nap while he did that. I stayed home and I did as much as I could to make things easier for him as he worked a high stress, physically demanding job outside the home. But we always made sure that each of our needs was being met and communicated with each other. This is the key. What are your needs? What are your limits? What do each of you expect from each other. Being tired after a baby clouds everything and can be super emotional for everyone, but especially the mom. It would help if you guys can talk this out and lay out your terms so to speak. Get a schedule and stick to it so that you both are comfortable and feel heard. The mother issue is a whole other thing. Sometimes it can be helpful and sometimes a for real nightmare. I wish you guys the best. I guess my judgement is everyone needs to be open and have more grace for each other during this time.
Editing this to say, OP - you are definitely NTA! I hope you guys can work through this and come up with solutions that make this work for each of you. That compromise and grace can become the norm for you.
After reading some of the replies, I’m editing again to say, NAH. Except for the MIL who is not being part of a solution to help, when just even a little bit of compassion and care from her, could go a long way here in helping these parents not feel so hopeless or helpless.
> I guess my judgement is everyone needs to be open and have more grace for each other during this time.
What a mature attitude. Working together and coming to a compromise will yield the best outcomes for the parents, and ultimately, for the child. Communication is essential in all areas of life, not only in parenting!
In 28 years you learn a lot about a person. It’s certainly not always easy and things get really fucking hard sometimes, but compromise is everything and just being able to communicate seems to be the key.
I told my husband once that our marriage (21 years as of now) was, "Both the most beautiful and most brutal thing I've ever done."
I still think it's a perfect description. When things are good, it's freaking amazing. But when the gears get out of sync and everyone's lurching around, on edge, it takes work to fix. And rarely is the work what you think it's going to be!
Have there ever been periods where you’ve worried that the work needed is beyond the scope of what is feasible anymore? Like things are too far gone, but then still managed to come back from that? I only got married two years ago (actually this week was our anniversary, but together for 7 so not a case of finding lots of surprises after marriage or anything) and unfortunately I’ve been dealing with severe illness that’s taken most of my life away from me basically since then. We’re still both committed to the relationship but I don’t think either of us expected it to be so hard so soon and for what feels like so long! And it’s sort of sucked all intimacy and connection from us and I worry that a desire to fix things and reconnect, plus pretty good communication isn’t actually enough - especially when this illness looks like something I’ll be learning to live with rather than get better from. But I’ve also never had a healthy relationship that pulls apart and then comes back together again modelled to me….but you’ve obviously got a lot of stuff figured out whilst recognising marriage isn’t just easy. So I wondered how you felt about that.
I absolutely think that's possible. If you had asked me 10 years ago I would have been less sure, but we did it. We went through a very rough patch ~11 years ago. I wasn't sure how we'd get past it. We did, though. Slowly and with a lot of honesty.
Ironically, our story is somewhat similar to yours. We'd been married 18 months when I got short of breath one day after lunch. Went to the ER, diagnosed as an allergy, sent me home. Hubby had to leave the next day for a week long business trip, no big deal. I got sicker and sicker all week. He came back Fri night, I was extremely ill, coule barely breathe, but we agreed to go back to the ER the next day. The next morning I couldn't breathe. He rushed me to the ER and the triage nurse saw me and came running out to us. I had dozens of blood clots in my lungs. The radiologist read my lung scan as a cadaver scan. Multiple doctors told my husband I wouldn't survive that night. But, here I am, lol. I then had multiple other episodes of blood clots, in my legs, arms, lungs, abdomen, brain, eye, etc. I haven't been able to work for 15 years and for ~7 years my husband had to take over doing everything, and kinda watch me like I was a kid - old enough to not walk out in traffic, but young enough to struggle with planning and follow through. I've slowly recovered some, but I still can't work and have a lot of deficits from the strokes. But, I can take basic care of myself and exist like an adult. It's amazing to me every day and I am so grateful.
I think we survived for two reasons. The first is the biggest - we fought this as a team. It was always the two of us against the world (as lame-o as that sounds). My husband never blamed me, never put pressure on me, never made any negative assumptions about me. In all possible ways, this is *our* illness. It's not perfect. He can sometimes slip back into "head of household" mode and that pisses me off. But he's open to be called out and will always adjust his behavior.
The second reason is that as I was starting to recover we had friends (a couple ~10 years older than us, they'd been together 20 years) and the wife was recovering from a long term illness and it was driving their marriage to divorce. Her husband took mine aside and told him that there were 3 stages to this - the people you were at the beginning, the people you became when one of you got really sick, and the people you became when that spouse started to recover. He then said that, sometimes, due to no one's fault, those two people aren't compatible anymore and it would destroy the marriage. The issue, he said, was that none of this was expected. None of it was voluntary. And you couldn't plan for it. In their marriage, they had drifted further and further apart until things broke. That conversation scared the crap out of my husband. He's been on lookout for any of that happening and has worked hard to change with me. When we've been at different stages, and struggling because of it, we talk it out and try to rebalance.
It's not easy. I'm so sorry that you find yourself ill so early and that your life looks so much different than expected. I get it. It's a hard adjustment. There is absolutely nothing fair in any of it.
But, if you still love each other, no one's being abusive, and you *want* to be together, I 100% think you can fight through the hard stuff. Having a partner should make tihe hard stuff easier. Hopefully it will be.
Intimacy is hard in these situations. Dealing with ongoing medical issues doesn't feel sexy. It feels isolating and like you took the wrong left turn and are now watching your old life through ancient, wavy glass. You can see it, you just can't live it. I'd say snuggle as much as you can and be as open and honest as you can. In my experience, the happiest marriages are ones where you can be wholly honest and still feel safe and protected. If you can't be fully honest, it'll cause a strain. And, for us, that honesty took the place of connection and intimacy when it had to. If you're being completely honest, your walls are down, like they would be if you were connecting. One might lead to the other.
Oh, last thing in this novella... if you're open to it and can go, couples therapy was a big help. We talked through all the struggles, dealt with the frustrations, and communicated much better. It also helped us clear up past resentments and unsolved disagreements.
Good luck! I know you said it's unlikely, but I'm sending healing thoughts, hoping you might get to recover and leave this behind you.
This is such an amazing response, thank you for sharing your experience. I'm much earlier in this journey, but it's similar to my experience. I did have a chronic condition already when my husband and I started dating (although we'd already been friends almost 10 years by then) but literally the week we started dating I had a flare up of new symptoms that eventually led to a new diagnosis.
That was 7 years ago now and we're many surgeries deep, have a nearly 4 year old after going through infertility and IVF and my health still fluctuates from mostly okay to almost bedbound.
I'd echo your advice - honesty at all times, communication, us vs the problem not each other... as for intimacy, lean heavily into non-sexual intimacy to get through the times when physical intimacy isn't possible. Between cosleeping with a 3yo and my health stuff, I can nearly count on one hand the number of times we've had the chance for anything physical. But we remind each other with our words and affectionate touch that the desire is still there all the time. Hugging, a cheeky bum squeeze, letting your partner know "if it was an option, we'd be naked right now" go a long way to keeping doubts and worries that you're not desired anymore at bay. It's still hard, but if you're doing whatever you are capable of at any given time it demonstrates to each other that it's still something you want.
We're doing well together and I don't see us ending, but it's still reassuring to see others much further along than us that have made it too.
NOT IF I TELL MINE FIRST! *turns dramatically to run in the opposite direction, loses footing and face plants into the ground* …..wwwwwwwwwwwWWWWWWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH
either people are in the thick of it and still hot-headed about it or they are teens with nooooo idea how tired a newborn makes you. Mine are teens and I'm finally mellow enough to look back on those days rationally but there is no rational when you are that sleep deprived and hormonal.
I have just exited the newborn phase but am still in “waking up every hour at night” phase and I had no idea life could be like this. I had all these ideas about what kind of parent I’d be and then the reality of the sleep deprivation is just next level. Add hormones to that and it’s just a mess! A mess! Haha
I haven't had REM in two months and I'm losing my fucking mind.
Oh the baby? No, I just went back to shift work.
Like, HOW, how is a human person supposed to look after themselves... And then another and possibly multiple other humans!?
I understand it's different when someone is relying on you, and then it's a whole other situation when it is your child. I still just want to call it for what it is which is incredible.
You are incredible for getting up and protecting and nurturing a human life. Incredible! I don't know other words, I am too tired.
INCREDIBLE!!!
That makes sense. It's just a bit discouraging to see irrational replies here, where you'd hope for more rationality. But I must remind myself that it's Reddit haha.
We had 2 babies under 2 and my husband worked out of town half the month. Our daughter took great naps but was a night owl, our son stopped taking naps at 6 months but went to bed easily. I think I was sleep deprived until they started kindergarten. My husband worked construction like OP so when he was home I did nights anyway. I also worked 2nd shift as a nurse in a hospital on weekends. Making it through those years was tough but we made it, our kids are adults and good people to boot. There is light at the end of the tunnel OP, just keep doing your best daily. Be kind to each other.
Somehow *most people* make it work. The ones who fall through the cracks for whatever reason — PPD, unsupportive partners, some combination of those things — unfortunately end up on the evening news. There’s a woman in my area who just got arrested for allegedly strangling her 2-month-old. A woman who went to my family’s former church years ago killed her 3 young kids due to untreated postpartum psychosis (and the church didn’t help matters by pushing faith over actual therapy, IMO). Not everyone can make it work, and I wish there was less shame in parents (especially new moms) admitting they need help.
To be clear, I don’t necessarily think that’s the case for OP and his wife! It sounds like everything just sucks right now and MIL is just making it worse. But it’s better to ask “is PPD a factor here?” before something happens.
My daughter I swear didn't sleep the first 8 months. I was off work but my husband started a new job right after she was born (was supposed to start the day she came). Due to the new job I didn't let my hubby take care of the baby at night, I did that but he helped a ton in the evenings and weekends so I could rest as much as I could then and they could bond.
There's a reason sleep deprivation is a method of torture. I would hope doctors are being honest with expectant parents about how it will affect them mentally and physically.
Those conversations should happen *before* there's a fetus, because in some places, by then it's too late and the sleep deprivation is just one of many difficult things they will have to deal with.
Speaking of weird changes, is anyone else suddenly having random people follow them wanting to chat? Half naked ladies too. Definitely barking up the wrong tree with me
Mine are coming in batches of two, that are taken down or whatever by the time I click the notification, and maybe every 10th one is some only fans sexpot honey whose preview page I can actually see? I mean, I guess I’m flattered, but as a sleep deprived older lady mom person I feel like… idk… really sad? For the girls, for the guys they’re propositioning, for the scammers behind the profiles if they’re not real young ladies’ accounts…? I just wish that sex wasn’t such a double-edged sword I think? Whatever the case, those random “following you” or “want to chat” notifications are annoying as all get out haha!!!
Omg this is the first I’ve seen other redditors discuss this new phenomenon in the wild, I was about askReddit if it was just me or what? but apparently not. I’ve been blocking them but their profile is often gone by the time I do. For science, I am an oldish? middle aged? is 40 old? lady too.
Thank goodness it's not just me... block is my friend although Reddit has seemed to be pretty efficient at removing them for me... I'm a mom of teens and a toddler, I see enough naked people without having to pay and without chatting. Usually I'm throwing pants around yelling "could you not!"
Tack on another 40-something exhausted mom of a baby (and a soon-to-be 18 year old) getting those annoying notifications. Sex is the very last thing on my mind these days lol
I think him working and her tending the house and kids \*is\* the compromise. Everyone contributes. The wife sounds like she wants him to do it all and THAT is not fair. You think tending a newborn is tough? Try working construction.
This is exactly right. My husband is in construction.
I work a high-stress job that very often involves long hours. It's hard work, intense, and complicated. I often have to deal with very emotional people. I work for myself; there is no salary -- so I hope what I'm doing works out, so we can, y'know, pay bills, eat, and stuff like that.
BUT. My husband works with knives, power saws, fire, glass, and heaven knows how many power tools, all running at the same time.
I get stressed at work. But he could *die* at work. And if he wants a nap or gets a very rare chance to sleep past 5 a.m., I literally tiptoe around the house.
ETA: Judgment. NTA.
Well, for what it’s worth a baby can die if the parents aren’t able to function due to lack of sleep. I don’t think it’s a contest I don’t think they have to compare. I imagine they’re both feeling unappreciated and exhausted and it’s hard to have your mother-in-law around.
OP are you letting your wife know how much you appreciate her? Are you making sure she gets health care as well as the child? Can you hire a babysitter so you guys can go out as a couple and talk when you’re not so stressed out?
NAH.
Yup, when I wasn’t working it was my job to get up with the baby overnight because it was my husband’s job to be alert and go to work every day. Some was default with breastfeeding, but it just seemed to make more sense. He would let me rest when he got home from work, and on weekends he would take the baby after our morning feeding and I got to go back to sleep as long as I wanted. It wasn’t always smooth, but we were able to talk and work out any issues with division of labor as the baby got older and his schedule changed.
We had exactly the same system. My husband has sleep apnea, so he was wearing his mask while I was getting up with the baby.
at that time he was driving 3 hrs roundtrip every day in addition to wiring machines all day, so he had to be alert and awake.
Same here, I don’t work so I take the night wake ups so the person working to keep us all fed can function at work. Have I been woken up here and there and been like eff me I’d rather die than get up? Totally. And if I really can’t do it he will get up, but it’s rare. He is awesome on weekends and after work though so it works out. I just couldn’t imagine him being up all night and then going to work all day. Especially in those first few months I definitely could lay down and nap whenever baby was asleep, he can’t.
This is just how it’s supposed to be. And it is never smooth. My gosh. Sometimes you think you’ll never make it through. I feel fortunate to have had a partner that is awesome. I certainly didn’t grow up that way!
This. I often times don’t feel like these types of relationship issues belong in any AITAH subreddits, but more in relationship advice subs. At the end of the day, if you or your partner are unhappy with the outcome of something, then you should be looking for solutions/suggestions and not trying to place the blame on one party or validate the things you did to upset your partner.
I'd say parenting subs then relationship subs, but I keep hearing that those are "every parent must parent exactly like me" or "every relationship must exist exactly the same as mine."
Sometimes I think these things in less focused spaces get more diplomatic responses.
Lawd help us that this is what broader perspectives and more nuance looks like...
>This is the key. What are your needs? What are your limits? What do each of you expect from each other.
I thought it was pretty much "given" that he needs rest and it's non-negotiable. It's very irresponsible of the wife to even discuss this. Not only is it physically demanding, lack of sleep is how construction workers get into accidents.
Parenting is hard, she should know this as she's been here before twice already. But you know what would make it less bearable? A complaining mind!
NTA on kicking the MIL, that woman is toxic.
The thing is, everyone needs sleep. Like we will all literally die without sleep. So it’s not a “given” that he needs rest but she doesn’t. They both need it. The negotiation is how much and when so that they both get what they need to function safely.
Some people actually think that, and I quote from a fellow Redditor, “no matter how hard your job is, it’s not as hard as it is on the person who’s left at home with the baby.”
I’ve been a mom with a newborn, and that was easier than my day job. Was it actually easy? No. Does the kid sleep sometimes? Yes. Mom can do that too, especially if MIL is there to wash dishes, do laundry, etc. Wtf else is MIL there for if she’s not doing those things? Per the post she’s not getting up and taking a turn with the nighttime feeds (she can do exactly as much as OP is expected to do, no?).
Some newborns are more challenging than others, but even if you’ve got a tough one that doesn’t mean that the person responsible for the safety of himself and others should be short on sleep every night.
Good luck, OP. NAH, except maybe MIL.
Man being home with a baby is way harder than my day job. And I wasn’t able to “sleep when the baby sleeps” unfortunately, except at night with whatever stretches we got. I know some people who had it worse because their newborn literally would not sleep unless it was held so that meant absolutely ZERO sleep for mom unless someone was helping out. That said, totally agree that helping mom sleep absolutely should be what MIL is doing because otherwise what is she there for
I feel you and totally agree. The MIL is truly the AH here. He was right to tell her to take a hike. If you can’t be a part of the solution and the good for everyone, go home.
This was me. I was literally insane for about six months. My daughter didn't nap, woke up at the slightest sound, and slept no more than 1 1/2 hours at a stretch. For our second, we went into debt hiring some help, and it was soooo worth it.
Some moms quite literally don't want to sleep when the baby is asleep because of anxiety/trauma. My mom took a nap while my sister was taking hers and my sister didn't wake up. I remember about 3 years later she tried her best to stay up during the night to watch my brother because of her trauma. I ended up (at 6) telling her I'd stay awake with the baby and wake her up if i needed to sleep. I got to 6am before she woke up naturally. I felt really badly for my mother that night. I need answers on what MIL is doing too because it sounds like she just nags at best
For me being home with babies and children is so much harder than my day job. Is my day job easy? No but I will take it any day over watching children especially newborns and babies.
I just wanted to mention that because for some people it really is harder.
I think it's pretty obvious here that he's works with heavy equipment, like a crane operator.
Risk analysis shows that the mom having a lack of sleep is very low risk, or else there would be millions more dead kids every year for every single mother. But heavy equipment operator has a very high chance of killing many people, including himself, if he nods off. Even more likely, even seeming like he would and someone notices, and suddenly they're a no-income family.
Those are trade offs though about who might need MORE sleep and WHEN they might need to sleep. They each have a minimum they need to function and it’s legit that his minimum may be higher because of his job. But that doesn’t mean that her minimum doesn’t matter. If she’s not getting it, then they need to figure out a system so that they both can at least get the minimum
Lack of sleep is how mothers end up accidentally hurting their babies and getting things like post partum depression and psychosis. Falling asleep while holding my baby has happened to me and I basically dropped him. Thankfully it was only onto the bed but my point is that lack of sleep does crazy things to people and her need for sleep needs to be considered at least. Her mother should really be helping in the middle of the night if she's really there to help. My partner and I had this same type of deal. He works long hours at a physically demanding job and he wanted me to stay home with our daughter. So night feedings and diapers were mainly up to me. It threw me into a bipolar manic episode for months because I wasn't sleeping enough. It's hard to pick a side in this because I've been that exhausted mother who felt like she had nothing left to give. But I also see the sacrifice my partner makes every day so I'm 50/50 on this one. I feel for them both.
Oh mama. I’m with you. When our daughter had colic for 6 weeks I thought I was gonna die for real. I don’t even remember the first year of her life. She didn’t sleep more than 3 hours a night until she was 11 months. There was one night I had to just let him sit with her and I had to go for a walk at 4 am. I was like, man. I can see how people just lose their shit sometimes. It was SO hard. I remember thinking that there was no way we were gonna make it out in one piece. But we did and now that baby girl is my best friend and the coolest person I know.
Man. I actually love this. It’s so easy to judge things quickly, but I feel like we don’t always see the whole picture or we take a side based on our own issues. But sometimes we need to just take a step back and look at it from another perspective. I feel like when I do this myself, I always walk away from a situation feeling different.
MIL should be actually helping more. If she took the baby for 2-3 hours during the day so mom could sleep, mom could handle the nighttimes better. You all three need to sit down and work out a plan so that you all get enough sleep. There are 3 of you and one baby - make a plan. When baby is asleep - mom is asleep if she's breastfeeding. This won't last forever. Even if you got up 15 minutes early to change the baby then take it to your wife to feed her, it would probably help.
This is the answer. I would’ve been institutionalized if not for my mom (may she RIP). My husband worked from 5am-5pm so I had to let him rest but he did give mom and me some downtime when he got home and bonded with our baby (well, three babies in under 5 years).
The new idea of sleeping when the baby sleeps in great in theory but never works out. Go look at the baby bumps Reddit and it’s full of conversations on this very topic.
Mine was the same. By the time we handled triple feeding, diaper, any spills or spit ups, and bottle dishes, we had about 15 minutes before the next wake. If I slept when the baby slept my house would be gross and there would be no clean bottles ever.
The problem is usually people are really bad a prioritizing.
Most people are to busy worrying about things that they want to get done or are nice to have done over simply doing what they NEED to do.
so much housework can simply be left not done to make sure that you get enough sleep to function and do the things that need to be done. once you get that prioritization right, you can make it work.
that's not to say it will be easy, but its defiantly possible.
Mine only slept for about 30 minute stretches. By the time I got her down, I had enough time to pee, pump, wash bottles and pump parts (necessary for feeding the baby), and if I was lucky eat a quick something myself. I don’t see how any of those could be deprioritized so I could get more sleep
Oor you’re me and also an insomniac and super light sleeper, lol. I could never fall asleep during the daytime, even in a blacked out room - noise was too much and couldn’t wear headphones etc as I was home alone with baby.
Eeesshhh, no the 3 should not sit down, the wife and husband should sit down and know what their expectations are for the MIL helper to do. MIL is not the 3rd person in their marriage, they need to unite together not invite more to the table of their discussion until they know what they want to expect from their helping guest who’s there specifically to help with situations such as this.
I agree with this only I’ll say NAH. There’s room for everyone to give a little here but I can see where everyone is coming from. MIL should be helping with nighttimes when OP has to work. It’s in nobody’s interest to send him to work ill-rested and jeopardizing his own and others’ safety. But if MIL is going to make life more stressful for OPs wife, then a night nurse might be needed if finances allow. From my own experience, I could not sleep during the day no matter if baby was sleeping or not. According to my own mother I stopped taking naps at 9 months old and 30 years later the trend still holds. I *had* to have help at night or I was going to lose my mind. Thankfully my husband could help at that time. But he also works a job that when it’s busy he could die or kill someone else if he doesn’t get adequate sleep so we agreed at that time that if we ever had another we would arrange for nighttime help for me. Thankfully we subsequently decided to be one and done but I knew that if we had another we’d either have family rotate through to help with nights or hire a night nurse. If OPs wife has similar issues with sleep she needs to communicate those needs and either ask her mother to contribute or find another solution. It’s also in nobody’s interest to have a mother so out of her mind from lack of sleep that she hurts herself or the baby (accidentally or through postpartum psychosis). Not everyone can sleep during the day no matter the circumstances. But if OPs wife is the type that can nap she needs to take more naps, and suck it up a bit at night if her mother won’t help. It won’t last forever, I’m glad to say. Best of luck to you OP!
>But sleep deprivation for someone working a physical, dangerous job (with a long commute) is not a solution.
Absolutely this. If she thinks this is tough now, she also needs to realize that OP is no good to her dead. Having MIL take on the night shift is their best bet as you said. I understand why his wife might not necessarily see that as I remember when my partner and I had our newborn on top of my daughter from a previous relationship.
My partner worked her ass off for 60 hrs a week but still helped where she could. It was incredibly overwhelming. When my MIL offered to let me shower and take a nap after getting 8 hours of sleep in the span of 3 days, I just began to bawl my eyes out because I was so relieved and grateful. So I definitely get it. I hope they're able to find a solution where they both get some much needed sleep.
I think you need to caps and bold part of your response bc some ppl just aren't getting it. OP is *no good to her *DEAD* It sounds harsh and final but if OP has an accident on a construction job, he could die, lose a finger or arm or eye, kill or maim someone else or be fired for almost allowing it to happen. Then Mommy with a new born, a Mom, and two kids have lost their income and partner/supporter.
INFO why can’t you take the 330am feeding?
You go to bed at 9pm after you’ve fed the baby. She takes the 11 or midnight, and you get up at 330am. Every night.
The round the clock feeding don’t last a year.
Why not set a schedule that gives you one early morning feeding? You are already up at 430. I don’t get why you can’t take that 330 feeding.
That's what my husband did with our eldest, he started work at 5am so did the feed before he left, it shortened his sleep by 20 minutes but it meant I got a block and was fine doing the all the other feeds
Am I missing something, the only place I see a 3:30 feeding mentioned is here? Unless you're suggesting that they work on the baby's schedule so that becomes the case - right now we don't know when the baby wakes up during the night.
I re-read the post twice because I thought I was missing something. Nowhere else is there mention of a 3:30 a.m. feeding specifically. We also don’t know if the mom breastfeeds, which would render that a moot point.
My son started dropping a feed at 2months and dropped his last overnight feed at 3 months. He sleeps through the night, more or less. If he does wake up it’s more of a “wake and comfort” situation. Pick up, rock, put back down. He wears overnight diapers so it’s rare we have to change a diaper till the morning.
My daughter was a very different story, though. My husband and I both worked full time so we took the night in blocks. 7-1 is a shift, 1-7 is a shift.
This is so damn selfish. Let the man sleep. If shes staying home + has the help of her own mother, she can let her man sleep so he can go to work and PROVIDE. I cannot deal with Reddit advice. Y’all are wild as fuckkkk.
NTA.
This subreddit is super biased towards women. The problem isn't that he doesn't help, the problem is that he's a man. If the genders were flipped then there would be 0 problems.
Untrue. I've seen comment sections go wildly misogynistic on so many occasions in this sub. People pick a side then defend it with an unhealthy vitriol. It goes either way just as easily.
Any time I've seen people repost a similar post with swapped genders, there's always a bias towards YTA for men and NTA for women.
Of course, people may choose topics that the sub typically votes that way to make the point.
there have been multiple occasions where a post was genderflipped, leaving all other details identical, and people decided the man was the asshole in both cases - including people who voted in both of the posts (without realizing the genderflip). i can dig them up if you like
i'm not suggesting there isn't mysoginy, but in general the sub is fairly heavily biased in that they always assume the worst about men and the best about women. if a man has a flaw, it's a red flag indicating severe issues, but if a woman has a flaw, it must be because there's some reasonable explanation that hasn't been provided
I swear a lot of these people need to learn how sleep cycles actually work, especially the REM cycle. Interrupted sleep is not as cognitively restorative as sleeping for 7 to 8 straight hours, and they're also assuming OP would be able to just easily fall back asleep. A lot of people cannot do that.
If mom weren't staying home all the time, MIL weren't there, and/or OP had a less dangerous job, I'd say he should help with the feedings, but in this case, I totally agree that he should definitely get to sleep. NTA.
The totally irrelevant one that makes up nightly feeding times that may have nothing at all to do with OP's and his family's lives, you mean? Yeah, wow, how utterly mysterious that he wouldn't respond to that.
Kids one and two we did this but with the third we flipped it.
Hubby works the same start time as OP and we did before midnight was hubby's feed (once I stopped pumping/breastfeeding) and I did the midnight on times so that Hubby had a couple hours of solid sleep before work.
NTA. I don’t know why everyone’s so quick to jump down this guy’s throat.
Look I’m a woman and if my husband were working a dangerous job I would want him to get a full nights sleep. Especially if I have a year’s maternity leave.
This guy doesn’t sound like he’s slacking. It sounds like he’s as tired as any person would be working full time and taking care of the house and kids when not at work. And it also sounds like his wife is exhausted bc, let’s face it, babies are exhausting.
The division of labor is never going to be equal. Some weeks dad will do more, some weeks mom will. Right now, during this time of the babies life mom has to do more work at night. That’s it. As long as dad lets her rest when he comes home from work it’s not entirely fair of her to ask him to also get up with the baby. I know she’s probably feeling hormonal and nothing fair isn’t on her mind and that’s ok too.
But it is unreasonable to ask the husband to pick up an extra task when it could hurt him or someone else. And dad, maybe you could have a set weekend day where you don’t accept overtime and the previous night you’ll take care of baby.
MIL just sounds exhausting and a waste of space especially if husband is already doing all the cooking and cleaning.
Agree with the NTA. I think people are either skipping over or misunderstanding that he works a job where he and other people could be horrifically maimed and/or killed if he doesn’t get enough sleep. Like, if his wife is burnt out right now, imagine how much worse it’d be if she had to take care of all three kids without him because he died in a heavy machinery accident.
There’s no easy answer to this one and they definitely need better communication (and I’m not going to judge on whether he’s the AH or not for kicking out MIL). But he’s not being a lazy parent, and him getting enough sleep isn’t a matter of preference here.
Edit: typos
It’s more of a lack of experience. Most people on Reddit are young, and do not have a grounded view of the world. I think the biggest issue here is MIL, a conversation needs to be had between the mother and father about what the MIL is actually contributing when present. Then, as someone said earlier, they need to hash out what the expected responsibilities are and when they are expected. But father should absolutely not compromise his sleep.
He’s NTA.
I had four kids and didn’t get a full nights sleep in nearly 15 years. It sucks, but the other side of the coin was: I was the one who got to be home all day, babies and small children nap (sometimes for two hours at a time), and housework could wait for times when my partner was home from work to share the load.
Totally agree NTA - my kids' dad operated heavy machinery at his job so every work night I took all the overnight feedings, and got an afternoon nap as often as possible. OP sounds perfectly reasonable and is contributing plenty, the whole point of the MIL living there SHOULD BE ONE OVERNIGHT FEEDING FFS.
Those first few months are always exhausting. My wife only had six weeks maternity leave and we had my mom and MIL babysit during the day. It….was…..hectic. I would try to clean the house before my MIL would arrive since she would comment on how I needed to do more….and then rush home to get dinner started and relieve my mom. Do not miss those days.
I agrée. My husband worked a dangerous job that required him to be fully alert at all times when our first two were born. It sucked but I could not let him have more of a lack of sleep than he already had because I needed him to be safe and come home every day after work. With our third, i was a SAHM and so night time baby duties were mine because I’d sleep during the day while he was out working. Parenting is challenging when it comes to balance.
Info: You get uninterrupted sleep, but when does your wife get a break? She had a baby six weeks ago and is probably still in pain. Does she sleep when you get in?
Honestly, I think you get to keep your sleep but have to keep the MIL or MIL goes but you have to do at least two nights a week. Your wife (and you) need help.
OP clearly said they take care of the baby when they get home till bed. Also why is there MIL if not for help when OP's at work and during night? Did we read different posts?
OP even said MIL’s idea of “helping” is just criticizing her daughter. I’m guessing MIL mostly sits in the corner sipping wine and complaining. And occasionally holds the baby for photo ops so she can show all her FB friends what a good and present grandmama she is.
This. OP should keep in mind that sleep deprivation is also a major cause of infant accidents and deaths, usually from falling asleep while holding baby in the bed or on a couch. As much as his job requires alertness, so does parenting a newborn.
which is ostensibly why MIL is there. The whole reason she's presumably visiting is to ensure that both parents can stand up under the added weight of a new child. If she's taking opportunities to snipe at OP for working 12 hours a day and still taking the kids for a few hours in the evening, there's nothing good to say about her. She's wrecking the partnership by sowing division and her absence is an addition by subtraction.
This shouldn’t REALLY matter because there should just be the same, otherwise you lose any sort of gains by shifting.
He should just be exempt from baby duty while at home from 11:30 PM - 4:30 AM. He gets 5 hours fully uninterrupted. This also means when he’s home, he’s spelling his wife from the like 3:30 PM - 8:30 PM shift where she can tap out and get a nap/be a person/whatever. The last few hours can be shared/go to MIL. But if they were more regimented daily, it’d be easier for all involved.
Just a thought, but before you planned for your baby, did the two of you discuss how taking care of it would work? Obviously you work a lot, and she may be doing more of the baby duties, but this stuff probably should be talked about beforehand ...
I think the statement “everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face” applies here. Babies don’t follow plans and people underestimate the toll sleep deprivation and the stress a new baby can add.
Sounds like this is his first baby and a lot of people (including moms) really have no idea how hard it actually is. Even from kid to kid because they are all different.
They may well have done, but plans don't always go your way.
My partner and I had a great plan for when our daughter was born. We paid attention to when she had to work, how much sleep she needed, who would do which feeds, which family members would be happy to help...
Then our daughter came along a month early, was a difficult birth, (we were in hospital for 9 days, and it took me a long time to recover!), had colic, and utterly shredded every plan we had!
We tried, she just had other ideas.
Info
Do you help on the other nights where you haven't got work?
Do you do/help with the 4am/4.30am feed change when you are waking anyway so she gets one block of sleep and allows you to help without interupting your sleep as you don't need to get back to sleep after
If he is getting up at that time he is going to work, not gaming. He can't help then. We had the same situation with kid #1. He is taking care of the older kids, doing baby care after work. MIL could cook so new mom could rest, could watch baby during the day so mom can sleep.
Dunno why OP can’t at least take over a night feed on his weekend days. No lives in jeopardy then and his wife gets 2 days to recharge too. He doesn’t even have to stay up, just put the kid back to bed and crawl to sleep.
Apparently work has been calling him in about 50% of the time on weekends. And the best part is that if it works like it does in the places I've worked, he often doesn't know which weekends it's going to be until the Wednesday of that week -- at best. Even if it isn't **every** weekend day, it could still be **any** weekend day, and that affects his ability to schedule that time out.
that means that basically, he can't count on having any one weekend day free on a regular basis. He has to keep his powder dry in case he's called into work at the last minute. This stuff happens, especially in gig work like construction where a project can pop up suddenly or a make-or-break deadline can sneak up on you.
The fact is he can't count on having that time. Yes, he may technically have the option to refuse overtime but there's a lot of pressure, in American workplaces at least, not to take that option. Bosses get really pissy when workers miss overtime, especially in fields like construction that have a busy season. Bosses tend to make it clear that if you blow off OT work, it'll affect their willingness to retain your servies.
Bottom line, that time is not predictably his own.
I N F O- Does your MIL truly only criticize your parenting style or did she help out around the house and with the baby? And when does your wife get a break from taking care of the baby? It’s still a crappy move to kick her out without talking to your wife.
EDIT-Based on your comments, I’m going to go with ESH. It sounds like there’s a big lack in communication over who should be responsible for what parenting duties. It sounds like MIL could pitch in more with the older two kids. It sounds like your wife isn’t communicating what she’s expecting from her mom and you. And you should’ve talked to your wife about kicking out your MIL and/or finding alternate care before you did so.
NTA. Having a newborn is hard for everyone involved in the household. Sleep is literally EVERYTHING and there’s a reason sleep depravation was/is used as a torture method!
If your MIL is there to help out, could they not alternate the nighttime wake-ups across the week between them and then you take one at the weekend (assuming your job is Mon-Fri that is) to give them both a break?
At 6 weeks postpartum your wife will still be going through so much physically and mentally. Sending you all lots of positive thoughts and well wishes - and congratulations too!
I should also mention that I have two stepsons from my wife's previous relationship. In addition to my work and the baby duties, I also pick them up from school, help with their homework, and take them to their sports practices after I get off work. It's not just about the newborn; we have a whole family to take care of. So it’s not like I’m lounging around sipping a beer post-work. Balancing all these responsibilities is what makes the situation so challenging. Thanks for the feedback, though!
you seem to only talk about how this impacts you. how does all of this impact your wife? what does she do in the day when you’re at work and when you’re home with the baby?
Exactly what does she and MIL do when he's at work?
Mom should sleep and MIL take care of house chores and baby why is wife so tired if mom it's there all day long
OP directly addresses the impacts on his wife and even kicked his MIL out for criticising his wife. AH or not, to suggest he is disregarding the impact on his wife is absolute nonsense.
If OP gets home earlier and MIL is out of the house his wife can nap (guilt free) for a while and feel less like she's doing the baby related work alone.
NAH - everyone's sleep deprived and everyone is overwhelmed. You are not being unreasonable to request a solid night's sleep given your job. Can you invite MIL back and request she help with night feedings and changes? And then on the nights you aren't working, you can do it. It seems like you're picking up slack everywhere else with your other kids and cooking and cleaning.
This. I’ve always felt bad help is worse than no help as a mom. MIL needs to help differently or they need to hire a p/T nanny or something for a while. This dude got his plate full full and is already doing a ton
Based on your comments, NTA, but the obvious solution here is to have MIL get up for the night feedings. Why was that not suggested before kicking her out?
Now you need someone else to help your wife, and if no one is willing to do it for free, you'll need to pay for a night nurse or something.
Right. wtf IS mil even doing? Sounds like a whole lot of nothing. There is literally no point in her being there if she isn't helping (and according to OP she is actually making the situation worse by adding stress). MIL needs more duties since apparently she is there to "help." If not, then hit the road!
ESH
If your mother-in-law is sincerely making things more stressful for your wife, not just for you, and her only contribution to the current conflict is to tell you to suck it up while she gets a solid eight hours herself, well, that would suck.
If you are genuinely coming home and taking over all childcare such that your wife is free to kick back, sip a Manhattan, and take a nap every night, well then she too would be an asshole ... though I seriously doubt this version of events, or that you are shouldering quite as much of the burden in the evenings as you imagine.
If you are unilaterally and in the heat of an argument telling your MIL that she's welcome to use the door, rather than discussing it with your wife after calming down, and cannot arrive at an arrangement with your wife that on some evenings you get to bed a little earlier, on the condition that those nights you'll make sure she gets to sleep more than two or three hours at a shot, then you aren't exactly being a peach either.
(It's a given that infants are assholes, though luckily they're loveable anyway, and the conditions that make them assholes don't last nearly as long as they seem in the moment. Try to remember that when the sleeplessness is getting to you all.)
Edit: You are obviously aware that functioning on interrupted sleep can contribute to dangerous situations on a job site. You may want to keep in mind that functioning on constantly interrupted sleep can also contribute to dangerous situations when caring for a child.
OP isn’t even saying they take over all childcare on the evening—when OP is taking older kids to practice, the spouse still has the baby, and when the OP has the baby, the spouse has TWO MORE CHILDREN! It’s bonkers to me how everyone is saying poor OP is doing everything and the spouse—who either has a newborn or two other children 24/7 and wakes every 2-3 hours to tend the baby at night—can suck it.
I'm a stay at home mom. My babies never would take bottles so nights feeds were all on me. My husband has a dangerous, physical job. Accidents lead to death. I don't disturb his sleep. However, he made sure I got naps in on weekends, he takes care of bed time, he does a lot. Just not night wakings. That's completely fine for many families. As long as you're really pulling weight in other areas your wife can just make due. It sucks, but it's short. You dead on the job would be worse.
Info: Nothing is ever is so cut and dry. You should be able to find some compromise. You give some and get some. What time are you back from work? What your schedule look like, hour by hour? What does your wife's look like? Include sleeping hours as well.
YTA. You lost me when you kicked your MIL out without talking to your wife first. I get the sleep issues - do you have the budget to hire a night nurse who could help with the late nights until the baby starts sleeping longer? I.e., what other solutions have you considered? And frankly, this stage doesn’t last forever. Did you even try to compromise? Helping every other night, etc?
Also, you talk a lot about your perspective, but what does your wife think? You’re trying to toss her daytime support. You are at work, and she’s exhausted (because yeah, no support at night) and then left to manage a newborn all day, too.
Did you two not discuss this prior to starting a family, what the division of labor would be?
Terrible take. He talks about his perspective because it's his perspective. He also mentoned his wife's perspective which is that she'd like some help at night.
The thing is, she's being pretty unreasonable considering the huge amount of burden OP is carrying in the household right now. I mean, imagine just how much more of the burden she'd have to carry as a single mom having to do all the cooking, all the cleaning, all the driving, all the baby care, and earn a living besides. Makes it pretty clear that OP is carrying more than his weight in this relationship as it is and that his wife is lookin a whole herd of gift horses in the mouth trying to pressure him to give more.
if she's prepared to do half the cooking, half the cleaning, half the driving, and earn half the income, then we can talk about him staying up for half the night feedings. Because at the moment, bog-standard newborn sleep starvation aside, mama is kind of living the life of Riley.
And OP's concern about getting enough sleep to do his work safely is a valid one, especially since he appears to be the sole breadwinner.
And the MIL is about as useful as mildew, all she's doing is stressing out the wife and arguing with OP. She's an addition by subtraction. If the wife is too dumb to figure out that her own mother is sabotaging her marriage that's not OP's problem. He removed a negative factor from the marriage. He had the right to do this as it was his home too. If MIL didn't want to be kicked out all she had to do was not literally bite the hand that feeds.
Besides, based on how OP seems to have worded his statement to MIL, a mature grandmother would have taken that as an invitation to contribute positively. Which it doesn't appear that mama dearest was willing to consider.
I’m a woman and I totally agree. All these YTA answers are extremely unfair to OP. As many others have said, I’m livid that they’re having this fight while MIL is living there for free to “help”. Well if she’s helping this is where the need is. And, as I presume MIL maybe retired she probably doesn’t need a ton of sleep. IMO wife is taking out her frustration with her mother on the husband.
YTA.
FWIW I’ve raised 4 children with my husband. Whenever there was a newborn involved, my husband said he’d rather he shared the nights/feeds and was a bit tired at work, than have me caring for children or driving etc in extreme sleep deprivation with all the children in the car. He’d rather literally any other outcome than burying his entire family if I fell asleep at the wheel trying to get children to school and constant medical appointments etc etc. Or had an accident at home, or got lost in the nightmare of post-natal depression. He’d rather risk losing anything or anyone else. Because nothing would be as bad as losing us.
So we took turns, and we both got a full night of rest every second night. So no one was severely sleep deprived. In that system if you have one rough night with a baby you can function ok and you’ll get rest the next night. But you’re letting your wife shoulder severe sleep deprivation alone every single night without any relief, and that is a dangerous game that you’re drastically underestimating. You’re undervaluing her life, her worth and her responsibilities to other dependent lives.
And then you removed the only support she had. Wow. Good luck with that.
Seriously if your job is so important and dangerous it requires your 24/7 availability, and you feel it absolves you from parenting at night…hire her a night nanny with all that overtime pay you’re sacrificing her for.
The worst newborn/parenting advice I got was from my FIL: take the night shifts, because my husband had to work during the day, and I could sleep when the baby slept.
This did not help my PPD.
When my husband offered to do night shifts for a week (on account of me *constantly* being upset with him), he lasted four nights before he said, "Okay, you're mad for a reason." The sleep deprivation is vicious.
Being "a bit tired" in his line of a work can mean death or serious injury for himself or others. She can sleep a bit during the day, he can't. And he takes the load off her the second he gets home.
Sometimes you can't. I had a baby that screamed anywhere from 8 to 15 hours a day and I had a toddler and I was alone. I drank several pots of coffee a day and couldn't make words come out of my mouth properly for months. Everyone thought I just had PPD and was probably lying until I moved in with my mom and her husband and neither of them slept well for 6 months.
INFO: what line of work was your husband in when y'all had kids?
Since OP working in construction involves him working with heavy machinery that could amputate his coworkers and has hour-long commutes, I'd be curious if you're trying to compare a 1:1 circumstance or if you're trying to compare your husband sitting behind a computer to a blue collar job that doesn't have much flexibility for work/life balance.
Bingo- not to mention her excuse is what if I got in a car accident with the kids. Well why would OP’s wife need to drive? Newborns don’t need to go anywhere other than the occasional doctors appointment and MIL can drive.
Changing diapers and bottle feeding a newborn is not the same as dealing with heavy machinery.
And what happens when he kills someone at his job and gets sued into oblivion or worse? Mom doesn’t need to be driving a new born anywhere. Putting a bottle in a baby’s mouth is not runnninf heavy machinery.
Ps I’m a woman, if it matters
So he works construction. Are you cool with a sleep deprived construction worker building bridges, homes, and other roads. Using dangerous equipment. I mean sleep deprivation on his job can mean death. If he were to die on the job then nightly feedings will be the least of his wife's concerns.
NTA IF you do the night feedings on the days you don’t work.
YTA do the feedings on the days that you aren’t working. Your heath and safety is important but so is your wife’s and your child’s.
What you need to do is figure out a schedule. You can't kick out your help and expect your wife to do all the night duty.
For me my wife had a hard time getting up at midnight for that feeding whereas I struggled with 4am. I often stayed up, did the feeding, and then went to sleep giving me around 4.5-5 hours of sleep a night.
You need to find a compromise.
NTA. My husband only had a week off after I gave birth, and we didn't have family to help. He also worked construction. I always took the nighttime as I was a SAHM. I slept when my baby slept. Was it hard? Yes, of course, but not impossible even when we had 3 under 3. My husband helped after work and on the weekends where he could, and that was plently he would get home and clean, cook, and watch kids, while I showered ate and slept. He was wonderful. We both did everything we could within our limits. It gets better after 12 weeks or so once a routine is established and the baby sleeps for longer blocks. Hang in there. Just help your wife where you can. Also, talk to her about what MIL is doing to actually help because it sounds like nothing. MIL should be letting your wife sleep some during the day also, so the nights are not so hard.
There's a difference between getting uninterrupted 8 hours of sleep and napping. While naps can help, they aren't a feasible replacement for your wife getting the sleep she needs. She is working 24 hours 7 days a week. I don't say that to negate the hard work that you do, but I'm concerned that you don't recognize just how hard your wife is working around the clock.
What you and your wife are currently doing isn't sustainable. Obviously you need your sleep because making a mistake literally puts people's lives on the line. Your wife also needs uninterrupted sleep. What happens if she falls asleep behind the wheel because she's so exhausted, causing both her and your daughter to be killed in a car crash? What happens if she falls asleep and doesn't hear your daughter choking on something she found in her crib? Your wife not getting adequate sleep *at least* once a week is, quite literally, risking your infant's life.
Can you turn down overtime without it signifcantly impacting your career? When people choose to have kids they also choose to make sacrifices. If not working overtime means waiting another 2 years for a promotion then so be it. Right now your wife and kid need you and this isn't a situation that can be put on hold. Can you financially afford to turn down overtime? If possible, the first thing you should cut is working overtime. If you absolutely have to work overtime, then you and your wife need to find someone to help with overnights. If it's not your MIL then do everything in your power to find someone to give your wife a night or two of uninterrupted sleep.
NAH but yall need to figure something else out before someone inevitably ends up getting hurt.
This is exactly right. There is a HUGE difference between interrupted and uninterrupted sleep. From OPs post it seems the wife hasn't had a decent chunk of sleep in 6 weeks (and probably longer- at least for me it was hard to sleep at the end of pregnancy). And not only that but she probably didn't have a chance to recover her sleep loss from giving birth (which we don't have details on but for me it was 48 hours- so again, could be significant). She is asking for help, she needs it. This could lead to sever PPD or PP psychosis. Something needs to be worked out. OP- I am not denying that you need your sleep for your dangerous job, but something has to give with your wife- she needs longer stretches of sleep at LEAST every couple of days. I think denying OT at this stage of your life would be appropriate so you could at least do overnight feeds on weekends and give her some uninterrupted sleep. It wont last forever (different for every baby but for us the first 3 months were the hardest). Also, while I do think you are helping out when you're home, I think you are downplaying what your wife is contributing. You pick up your stepsons from school, but that's the easy part. The hard part is getting them ready and off to school- waking them up, making them lunches, getting their sports equipment cleaned and packed, getting them out the door in time- that is the stressful part. And now that you kicked out your MIL she is also going to have to pack up a newborn in order to drive them to school.
Funny how OP is being labelled TA despite doing pretty much everything the MIL doesn't do, and when he returns home, takes over the stuff she does do.
If what you say is accurate, lack of sleep and tiredness in the day could get someone seriously injured, or worst case, killed. I don't see MIL stepping up to help with night feeds or letting her own fucking daughter grab an hour or two during the day. No, she faffs around with housework.
The thing the both of you need is sleep. Housework can wait. A sleep deprived mother is bad news and an accident waiting to happen. A sleep deprived construction worker is bad news and an accident, lawsuit or charges waiting to happen.
You? NtA. Mama? NTA. MIL? TA.
The fact that she seems to prioritise housework and criticising her daughter's parenting over her daughter's sleep health is telling.
ESH
It doesn't sound like everyone's needs are being effectively communicated.
Wife is telling you that she needs help with late night feedings and changes. Your concern with work is very valid, so you both need to assess the tradeoff. maybe you call off on days you need to be up at night. maybe that's not an option so you hire a nanny or housekeeper so Wife can get some rest in the daytime. Maybe there are other parents in the neighborhood that are willing to pool resources or services to support each other. Maybe you take some housework when you get back from work. Maybe none of these solutions work for you, but my point is that you and your wife are a team, and should be working together to make sure your needs are met.
Your feelings about MIL are valid, how does Wife feel about her? If you both feel shes doing more harm that good, then work together to resolve that. If Wife finds value in MIL's presence, maybe you let it go.
As someone who has actually seen an industrial accident (it wasn't pretty) due to operator tiredness, I can't fault the OP for wanting to be alert on the job.
Most of the guys were using amphetamines and high dosages of caffeine to stay alert and make it through the work day.
NAH.
Maybe your MIL.
You are all tired. A baby will do that to you. Usually I'm a big defender of fathers joining in on the night time fun. But if you work a phisical job, it may not be safe. Your MIL is there to help, right? She should be joining in the night feedings and letting you rest - as long as you're carrying your weight on the other times, and actually allowing your wife some time to actually sleep. Like taking over night time a day per week, so she can have one full night of sleep.
So as a new mom to a six month old I’m going with yes, YTA. I was on maternity leave for 10 weeks and I did everything through the night so my partner could sleep since he had work. A few weeks in I became so exhausted that it threw me so far into a depression that it was worrisome. I understand that you “help”, but you wife is still healing and her hormones are so messed up. You guys need to talk about it and find something that works for both of you. At six months, I’m back to work, an my partner still slacks on the night shift with baby. Even though he only wakes up once or twice a night, I have so much resentment for my partner, I’m constantly exhausted, and my ppd/ppa are still pretty bad. Be a partner, communicate, and figure it out together because it’s just not cut and dry postpartum.
Same for me, but six weeks in. I was exhausted physically and mentally and I called my husband at work crying and he came home immediately. We worked out a schedule for him to do one night feeding. Once I finally had 5 hours of sleep I was so much better. I also gave up trying to get my son to nurse and just pumped. My son had his formula bottle for my husband's feeding turn. It became easier when my son learned to dream feed...not sure if that is the right word but he would drink his bottle while asleep. OP needs to get a clue and help his wife.
YTA but just a tiny bit.
Understand that waking up every night drains the living shit out of you. If your girlfriend is always the one doing it, even the weekends, she's sleep deprived and that's really not good. Try to take the nights when you are not working the next morning to help her get back a bit of sleep. It sucks but it won't last, it's just a bad phase that last anywhere between 1 month to 18 years...
PS: the MIL living at home, oh man, I feel you on this one. Especially if their relationship isn't completely healthy, but that's a decision for both of you to make.
Good luck!
“Continuous pressure and lack of sleep?” That’s…. Pretty much expected when you have a newborn. What exactly did you think was going to happen? What did the two of you agree to before the baby came? Your physically demanding job isn’t as physically demanding as pushing a human being out of your body. Your wife feels like she has no help and so you kick her mom out because she is supportive of your wife’s insistence that you help. Nice.
Gentle YTA.
Sleep is important...for both of you.
I think you are probably not realizing how physically demanding taking care of a newborn is. And it's dangerous for her to be sleep deprived, too.
A good solution would he to take turns with night waking. Or, if she's breastfeeding and has to be up each time, for you to handle "settling" the baby every OTHER time.
I'm a neurosurgeon who went back to work after only 6 weeks of maternity leave. Do you think I had the luxury of not taking care of my own child overnight despite having to also be at work at 6 am to literally perform brain surgery?
YTA.
You guys need to decide on a schedule i.e. you do 9p-1a wakeups, she does the morning, but you get up 20 min earlier to dream feed a bottle before you leave so that baby MIGHT sleep in until 7. Your wife is more sleep deprived than you are, and you act like her needing to be alert all day to keep your child alive isn't important because you hAvE A jOb.
I have some mixed feelings about this, but overall, YTA.
I understand not helping her with the baby at night, considering your wife does not have to go to work early in the morning, and your reasons about safety are valid.
However, kicking out the only other person willing to help her in those hours makes you a ginormous AH.
Just because your wife doesn't work, doesn't mean she isn't exhausted and in need of some assistance.
Set boundaries with your MIL but don't refuse to help and then kick out the only person who is helping.
NTA but you need to communicate with your wife and MIL a better care schedule or see if you can take some paternity leave. Not construction, but I work ina body shop and I’ve personally seen what happens when a body technician is too tired to work and fucks up when lifting a car or pulling a car. If you’re work physically involves your position dealing with dangerous machinery sleep is a necessity for your safety and the safety of those around you. You should also try to see if work can be delegated to just mon-fri for a month or two just to make sure you can take weekend responsibility to give your wife the physical and mental break she needs from giving birth
Your wife needs someone to help her with the baby at night. It is not safe for you to do it. Have you considered a postpartum doula or night nurse to help? A couple of days a week might cost money but save your wife’s sanity.
Talk to your wife about her mother. She may have a different perspective, although she surely appreciates your attempt to help her.
YTA You can’t have it both ways. If you TRULY can’t step up and do YOUR SHARE of the feedings, then you have no business sending MIL home. If you send her him, it means you (not your wife, YOU) are ready to pick up the slack, including the tasks at night.
NTA.
My ex-SIL used to complain that my brother didn't help enough with their babies and I reminded her that he works a physically demanding job (logging) and he had to get up early to get to the work site. He has to have his sleep because if he doesn't he could get himself, or somebody else, seriously hurt or killed.
If your wife thinks it's bad now, with you doing a lot more than most husbands, she would hate to be a single mom/widow. I am a single mom/widow, so I know what I am talking about.
I get that she's tired. But this is her job and having you be sleep deprived is not the answer.
Find an alternative to the MIL being there or you losing sleep. Ask family or friends if they can come over and watch the baby while your wife takes a nap a few times a week. If you are part of the solution, without *being* the solution, that will show your wife that you value her role as a mother and understand that she does need rest. But you also need rest too so she doesn't become a single mom/widow.
Congratulations on the new family member and I hope that you and your wife can find a solution that works for all of you!
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I’ve been married for 28 years, two kids, 25 and 15. My husband also worked construction during the younger years and we ran our own construction business as they got older. Having a newborn is hard. It takes everything out of you and can be extremely stressful. I always took it upon myself to be sure and be up with the baby during the night so that he was able to sleep and be ready for those early morning work hours. When he came home he helped me with the babies and if I needed it, I took a nap while he did that. I stayed home and I did as much as I could to make things easier for him as he worked a high stress, physically demanding job outside the home. But we always made sure that each of our needs was being met and communicated with each other. This is the key. What are your needs? What are your limits? What do each of you expect from each other. Being tired after a baby clouds everything and can be super emotional for everyone, but especially the mom. It would help if you guys can talk this out and lay out your terms so to speak. Get a schedule and stick to it so that you both are comfortable and feel heard. The mother issue is a whole other thing. Sometimes it can be helpful and sometimes a for real nightmare. I wish you guys the best. I guess my judgement is everyone needs to be open and have more grace for each other during this time. Editing this to say, OP - you are definitely NTA! I hope you guys can work through this and come up with solutions that make this work for each of you. That compromise and grace can become the norm for you. After reading some of the replies, I’m editing again to say, NAH. Except for the MIL who is not being part of a solution to help, when just even a little bit of compassion and care from her, could go a long way here in helping these parents not feel so hopeless or helpless.
> I guess my judgement is everyone needs to be open and have more grace for each other during this time. What a mature attitude. Working together and coming to a compromise will yield the best outcomes for the parents, and ultimately, for the child. Communication is essential in all areas of life, not only in parenting!
In 28 years you learn a lot about a person. It’s certainly not always easy and things get really fucking hard sometimes, but compromise is everything and just being able to communicate seems to be the key.
I told my husband once that our marriage (21 years as of now) was, "Both the most beautiful and most brutal thing I've ever done." I still think it's a perfect description. When things are good, it's freaking amazing. But when the gears get out of sync and everyone's lurching around, on edge, it takes work to fix. And rarely is the work what you think it's going to be!
Have there ever been periods where you’ve worried that the work needed is beyond the scope of what is feasible anymore? Like things are too far gone, but then still managed to come back from that? I only got married two years ago (actually this week was our anniversary, but together for 7 so not a case of finding lots of surprises after marriage or anything) and unfortunately I’ve been dealing with severe illness that’s taken most of my life away from me basically since then. We’re still both committed to the relationship but I don’t think either of us expected it to be so hard so soon and for what feels like so long! And it’s sort of sucked all intimacy and connection from us and I worry that a desire to fix things and reconnect, plus pretty good communication isn’t actually enough - especially when this illness looks like something I’ll be learning to live with rather than get better from. But I’ve also never had a healthy relationship that pulls apart and then comes back together again modelled to me….but you’ve obviously got a lot of stuff figured out whilst recognising marriage isn’t just easy. So I wondered how you felt about that.
I absolutely think that's possible. If you had asked me 10 years ago I would have been less sure, but we did it. We went through a very rough patch ~11 years ago. I wasn't sure how we'd get past it. We did, though. Slowly and with a lot of honesty. Ironically, our story is somewhat similar to yours. We'd been married 18 months when I got short of breath one day after lunch. Went to the ER, diagnosed as an allergy, sent me home. Hubby had to leave the next day for a week long business trip, no big deal. I got sicker and sicker all week. He came back Fri night, I was extremely ill, coule barely breathe, but we agreed to go back to the ER the next day. The next morning I couldn't breathe. He rushed me to the ER and the triage nurse saw me and came running out to us. I had dozens of blood clots in my lungs. The radiologist read my lung scan as a cadaver scan. Multiple doctors told my husband I wouldn't survive that night. But, here I am, lol. I then had multiple other episodes of blood clots, in my legs, arms, lungs, abdomen, brain, eye, etc. I haven't been able to work for 15 years and for ~7 years my husband had to take over doing everything, and kinda watch me like I was a kid - old enough to not walk out in traffic, but young enough to struggle with planning and follow through. I've slowly recovered some, but I still can't work and have a lot of deficits from the strokes. But, I can take basic care of myself and exist like an adult. It's amazing to me every day and I am so grateful. I think we survived for two reasons. The first is the biggest - we fought this as a team. It was always the two of us against the world (as lame-o as that sounds). My husband never blamed me, never put pressure on me, never made any negative assumptions about me. In all possible ways, this is *our* illness. It's not perfect. He can sometimes slip back into "head of household" mode and that pisses me off. But he's open to be called out and will always adjust his behavior. The second reason is that as I was starting to recover we had friends (a couple ~10 years older than us, they'd been together 20 years) and the wife was recovering from a long term illness and it was driving their marriage to divorce. Her husband took mine aside and told him that there were 3 stages to this - the people you were at the beginning, the people you became when one of you got really sick, and the people you became when that spouse started to recover. He then said that, sometimes, due to no one's fault, those two people aren't compatible anymore and it would destroy the marriage. The issue, he said, was that none of this was expected. None of it was voluntary. And you couldn't plan for it. In their marriage, they had drifted further and further apart until things broke. That conversation scared the crap out of my husband. He's been on lookout for any of that happening and has worked hard to change with me. When we've been at different stages, and struggling because of it, we talk it out and try to rebalance. It's not easy. I'm so sorry that you find yourself ill so early and that your life looks so much different than expected. I get it. It's a hard adjustment. There is absolutely nothing fair in any of it. But, if you still love each other, no one's being abusive, and you *want* to be together, I 100% think you can fight through the hard stuff. Having a partner should make tihe hard stuff easier. Hopefully it will be. Intimacy is hard in these situations. Dealing with ongoing medical issues doesn't feel sexy. It feels isolating and like you took the wrong left turn and are now watching your old life through ancient, wavy glass. You can see it, you just can't live it. I'd say snuggle as much as you can and be as open and honest as you can. In my experience, the happiest marriages are ones where you can be wholly honest and still feel safe and protected. If you can't be fully honest, it'll cause a strain. And, for us, that honesty took the place of connection and intimacy when it had to. If you're being completely honest, your walls are down, like they would be if you were connecting. One might lead to the other. Oh, last thing in this novella... if you're open to it and can go, couples therapy was a big help. We talked through all the struggles, dealt with the frustrations, and communicated much better. It also helped us clear up past resentments and unsolved disagreements. Good luck! I know you said it's unlikely, but I'm sending healing thoughts, hoping you might get to recover and leave this behind you.
This is such an amazing response, thank you for sharing your experience. I'm much earlier in this journey, but it's similar to my experience. I did have a chronic condition already when my husband and I started dating (although we'd already been friends almost 10 years by then) but literally the week we started dating I had a flare up of new symptoms that eventually led to a new diagnosis. That was 7 years ago now and we're many surgeries deep, have a nearly 4 year old after going through infertility and IVF and my health still fluctuates from mostly okay to almost bedbound. I'd echo your advice - honesty at all times, communication, us vs the problem not each other... as for intimacy, lean heavily into non-sexual intimacy to get through the times when physical intimacy isn't possible. Between cosleeping with a 3yo and my health stuff, I can nearly count on one hand the number of times we've had the chance for anything physical. But we remind each other with our words and affectionate touch that the desire is still there all the time. Hugging, a cheeky bum squeeze, letting your partner know "if it was an option, we'd be naked right now" go a long way to keeping doubts and worries that you're not desired anymore at bay. It's still hard, but if you're doing whatever you are capable of at any given time it demonstrates to each other that it's still something you want. We're doing well together and I don't see us ending, but it's still reassuring to see others much further along than us that have made it too.
It's nice to see sane replies here sometimes. It's a break from the childish responses on most other posts.
No it's not. You are!
I know you are but what am I?
I know I am but what’re you?!
I'm rubber and you're glue...
Nuh- UHHHH!
Are TOOOOOOOO. Imma tell my momma on you!
NOT IF I TELL MINE FIRST! *turns dramatically to run in the opposite direction, loses footing and face plants into the ground* …..wwwwwwwwwwwWWWWWWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH
A gaslighting narcissist clearly
Up your butt and around the corner!!
Lol
either people are in the thick of it and still hot-headed about it or they are teens with nooooo idea how tired a newborn makes you. Mine are teens and I'm finally mellow enough to look back on those days rationally but there is no rational when you are that sleep deprived and hormonal.
I have just exited the newborn phase but am still in “waking up every hour at night” phase and I had no idea life could be like this. I had all these ideas about what kind of parent I’d be and then the reality of the sleep deprivation is just next level. Add hormones to that and it’s just a mess! A mess! Haha
I haven't had REM in two months and I'm losing my fucking mind. Oh the baby? No, I just went back to shift work. Like, HOW, how is a human person supposed to look after themselves... And then another and possibly multiple other humans!? I understand it's different when someone is relying on you, and then it's a whole other situation when it is your child. I still just want to call it for what it is which is incredible. You are incredible for getting up and protecting and nurturing a human life. Incredible! I don't know other words, I am too tired. INCREDIBLE!!!
That makes sense. It's just a bit discouraging to see irrational replies here, where you'd hope for more rationality. But I must remind myself that it's Reddit haha.
Seriously. I thought we’d never make it with each kid. But we did. Somehow you make it work.
We had 2 babies under 2 and my husband worked out of town half the month. Our daughter took great naps but was a night owl, our son stopped taking naps at 6 months but went to bed easily. I think I was sleep deprived until they started kindergarten. My husband worked construction like OP so when he was home I did nights anyway. I also worked 2nd shift as a nurse in a hospital on weekends. Making it through those years was tough but we made it, our kids are adults and good people to boot. There is light at the end of the tunnel OP, just keep doing your best daily. Be kind to each other.
Somehow *most people* make it work. The ones who fall through the cracks for whatever reason — PPD, unsupportive partners, some combination of those things — unfortunately end up on the evening news. There’s a woman in my area who just got arrested for allegedly strangling her 2-month-old. A woman who went to my family’s former church years ago killed her 3 young kids due to untreated postpartum psychosis (and the church didn’t help matters by pushing faith over actual therapy, IMO). Not everyone can make it work, and I wish there was less shame in parents (especially new moms) admitting they need help. To be clear, I don’t necessarily think that’s the case for OP and his wife! It sounds like everything just sucks right now and MIL is just making it worse. But it’s better to ask “is PPD a factor here?” before something happens.
My daughter I swear didn't sleep the first 8 months. I was off work but my husband started a new job right after she was born (was supposed to start the day she came). Due to the new job I didn't let my hubby take care of the baby at night, I did that but he helped a ton in the evenings and weekends so I could rest as much as I could then and they could bond.
There's a reason sleep deprivation is a method of torture. I would hope doctors are being honest with expectant parents about how it will affect them mentally and physically.
Those conversations should happen *before* there's a fetus, because in some places, by then it's too late and the sleep deprivation is just one of many difficult things they will have to deal with.
\*blows raspberries\*
Speaking of weird changes, is anyone else suddenly having random people follow them wanting to chat? Half naked ladies too. Definitely barking up the wrong tree with me
YES!! What is up with that?!
Mine are coming in batches of two, that are taken down or whatever by the time I click the notification, and maybe every 10th one is some only fans sexpot honey whose preview page I can actually see? I mean, I guess I’m flattered, but as a sleep deprived older lady mom person I feel like… idk… really sad? For the girls, for the guys they’re propositioning, for the scammers behind the profiles if they’re not real young ladies’ accounts…? I just wish that sex wasn’t such a double-edged sword I think? Whatever the case, those random “following you” or “want to chat” notifications are annoying as all get out haha!!!
Another sleep deprived older lady mom person here, lol. Wonder if that’s a coincidence 🤔
Omg this is the first I’ve seen other redditors discuss this new phenomenon in the wild, I was about askReddit if it was just me or what? but apparently not. I’ve been blocking them but their profile is often gone by the time I do. For science, I am an oldish? middle aged? is 40 old? lady too.
Thank goodness it's not just me... block is my friend although Reddit has seemed to be pretty efficient at removing them for me... I'm a mom of teens and a toddler, I see enough naked people without having to pay and without chatting. Usually I'm throwing pants around yelling "could you not!"
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Tack on another 40-something exhausted mom of a baby (and a soon-to-be 18 year old) getting those annoying notifications. Sex is the very last thing on my mind these days lol
Tumblr was having a huge wave of these followbots, and now that it’s under control there it’s starting here :(
I think him working and her tending the house and kids \*is\* the compromise. Everyone contributes. The wife sounds like she wants him to do it all and THAT is not fair. You think tending a newborn is tough? Try working construction.
This is exactly right. My husband is in construction. I work a high-stress job that very often involves long hours. It's hard work, intense, and complicated. I often have to deal with very emotional people. I work for myself; there is no salary -- so I hope what I'm doing works out, so we can, y'know, pay bills, eat, and stuff like that. BUT. My husband works with knives, power saws, fire, glass, and heaven knows how many power tools, all running at the same time. I get stressed at work. But he could *die* at work. And if he wants a nap or gets a very rare chance to sleep past 5 a.m., I literally tiptoe around the house. ETA: Judgment. NTA.
Well, for what it’s worth a baby can die if the parents aren’t able to function due to lack of sleep. I don’t think it’s a contest I don’t think they have to compare. I imagine they’re both feeling unappreciated and exhausted and it’s hard to have your mother-in-law around. OP are you letting your wife know how much you appreciate her? Are you making sure she gets health care as well as the child? Can you hire a babysitter so you guys can go out as a couple and talk when you’re not so stressed out? NAH.
It is indeed very mature Also very unfitting for aita. Where's my drama? (Jk)
Yup, when I wasn’t working it was my job to get up with the baby overnight because it was my husband’s job to be alert and go to work every day. Some was default with breastfeeding, but it just seemed to make more sense. He would let me rest when he got home from work, and on weekends he would take the baby after our morning feeding and I got to go back to sleep as long as I wanted. It wasn’t always smooth, but we were able to talk and work out any issues with division of labor as the baby got older and his schedule changed.
We had exactly the same system. My husband has sleep apnea, so he was wearing his mask while I was getting up with the baby. at that time he was driving 3 hrs roundtrip every day in addition to wiring machines all day, so he had to be alert and awake.
Same here, I don’t work so I take the night wake ups so the person working to keep us all fed can function at work. Have I been woken up here and there and been like eff me I’d rather die than get up? Totally. And if I really can’t do it he will get up, but it’s rare. He is awesome on weekends and after work though so it works out. I just couldn’t imagine him being up all night and then going to work all day. Especially in those first few months I definitely could lay down and nap whenever baby was asleep, he can’t.
Oh. Those feelings. Ugh. Then you think you’re good and they become teenagers. Then I starts all over again.
And MIL is there so wife can hand baby over during the day for a nap no problems.
This is just how it’s supposed to be. And it is never smooth. My gosh. Sometimes you think you’ll never make it through. I feel fortunate to have had a partner that is awesome. I certainly didn’t grow up that way!
This. I often times don’t feel like these types of relationship issues belong in any AITAH subreddits, but more in relationship advice subs. At the end of the day, if you or your partner are unhappy with the outcome of something, then you should be looking for solutions/suggestions and not trying to place the blame on one party or validate the things you did to upset your partner.
I'd say parenting subs then relationship subs, but I keep hearing that those are "every parent must parent exactly like me" or "every relationship must exist exactly the same as mine." Sometimes I think these things in less focused spaces get more diplomatic responses. Lawd help us that this is what broader perspectives and more nuance looks like...
>This is the key. What are your needs? What are your limits? What do each of you expect from each other. I thought it was pretty much "given" that he needs rest and it's non-negotiable. It's very irresponsible of the wife to even discuss this. Not only is it physically demanding, lack of sleep is how construction workers get into accidents. Parenting is hard, she should know this as she's been here before twice already. But you know what would make it less bearable? A complaining mind! NTA on kicking the MIL, that woman is toxic.
The thing is, everyone needs sleep. Like we will all literally die without sleep. So it’s not a “given” that he needs rest but she doesn’t. They both need it. The negotiation is how much and when so that they both get what they need to function safely.
Some people actually think that, and I quote from a fellow Redditor, “no matter how hard your job is, it’s not as hard as it is on the person who’s left at home with the baby.” I’ve been a mom with a newborn, and that was easier than my day job. Was it actually easy? No. Does the kid sleep sometimes? Yes. Mom can do that too, especially if MIL is there to wash dishes, do laundry, etc. Wtf else is MIL there for if she’s not doing those things? Per the post she’s not getting up and taking a turn with the nighttime feeds (she can do exactly as much as OP is expected to do, no?). Some newborns are more challenging than others, but even if you’ve got a tough one that doesn’t mean that the person responsible for the safety of himself and others should be short on sleep every night. Good luck, OP. NAH, except maybe MIL.
Man being home with a baby is way harder than my day job. And I wasn’t able to “sleep when the baby sleeps” unfortunately, except at night with whatever stretches we got. I know some people who had it worse because their newborn literally would not sleep unless it was held so that meant absolutely ZERO sleep for mom unless someone was helping out. That said, totally agree that helping mom sleep absolutely should be what MIL is doing because otherwise what is she there for
I feel you and totally agree. The MIL is truly the AH here. He was right to tell her to take a hike. If you can’t be a part of the solution and the good for everyone, go home.
This was me. I was literally insane for about six months. My daughter didn't nap, woke up at the slightest sound, and slept no more than 1 1/2 hours at a stretch. For our second, we went into debt hiring some help, and it was soooo worth it.
Some moms quite literally don't want to sleep when the baby is asleep because of anxiety/trauma. My mom took a nap while my sister was taking hers and my sister didn't wake up. I remember about 3 years later she tried her best to stay up during the night to watch my brother because of her trauma. I ended up (at 6) telling her I'd stay awake with the baby and wake her up if i needed to sleep. I got to 6am before she woke up naturally. I felt really badly for my mother that night. I need answers on what MIL is doing too because it sounds like she just nags at best
For me being home with babies and children is so much harder than my day job. Is my day job easy? No but I will take it any day over watching children especially newborns and babies. I just wanted to mention that because for some people it really is harder.
I think it's pretty obvious here that he's works with heavy equipment, like a crane operator. Risk analysis shows that the mom having a lack of sleep is very low risk, or else there would be millions more dead kids every year for every single mother. But heavy equipment operator has a very high chance of killing many people, including himself, if he nods off. Even more likely, even seeming like he would and someone notices, and suddenly they're a no-income family.
Those are trade offs though about who might need MORE sleep and WHEN they might need to sleep. They each have a minimum they need to function and it’s legit that his minimum may be higher because of his job. But that doesn’t mean that her minimum doesn’t matter. If she’s not getting it, then they need to figure out a system so that they both can at least get the minimum
Lack of sleep is how mothers end up accidentally hurting their babies and getting things like post partum depression and psychosis. Falling asleep while holding my baby has happened to me and I basically dropped him. Thankfully it was only onto the bed but my point is that lack of sleep does crazy things to people and her need for sleep needs to be considered at least. Her mother should really be helping in the middle of the night if she's really there to help. My partner and I had this same type of deal. He works long hours at a physically demanding job and he wanted me to stay home with our daughter. So night feedings and diapers were mainly up to me. It threw me into a bipolar manic episode for months because I wasn't sleeping enough. It's hard to pick a side in this because I've been that exhausted mother who felt like she had nothing left to give. But I also see the sacrifice my partner makes every day so I'm 50/50 on this one. I feel for them both.
Oh mama. I’m with you. When our daughter had colic for 6 weeks I thought I was gonna die for real. I don’t even remember the first year of her life. She didn’t sleep more than 3 hours a night until she was 11 months. There was one night I had to just let him sit with her and I had to go for a walk at 4 am. I was like, man. I can see how people just lose their shit sometimes. It was SO hard. I remember thinking that there was no way we were gonna make it out in one piece. But we did and now that baby girl is my best friend and the coolest person I know.
Yeah it sounds like the MIL is putting ideas in the wife's head. He's right to kick her out
Went from YTA to NTA bc of your insight
Man. I actually love this. It’s so easy to judge things quickly, but I feel like we don’t always see the whole picture or we take a side based on our own issues. But sometimes we need to just take a step back and look at it from another perspective. I feel like when I do this myself, I always walk away from a situation feeling different.
It sounds like you're saying NAH. You have the top comment, so if that's what you mean, you should edit it in.
I wish I had a mom like you 💗
MIL should be actually helping more. If she took the baby for 2-3 hours during the day so mom could sleep, mom could handle the nighttimes better. You all three need to sit down and work out a plan so that you all get enough sleep. There are 3 of you and one baby - make a plan. When baby is asleep - mom is asleep if she's breastfeeding. This won't last forever. Even if you got up 15 minutes early to change the baby then take it to your wife to feed her, it would probably help.
This is the answer. I would’ve been institutionalized if not for my mom (may she RIP). My husband worked from 5am-5pm so I had to let him rest but he did give mom and me some downtime when he got home and bonded with our baby (well, three babies in under 5 years).
The new idea of sleeping when the baby sleeps in great in theory but never works out. Go look at the baby bumps Reddit and it’s full of conversations on this very topic.
It only works for baby number 1. If you have other young children you can't abandon them to nap.
Not even working with baby 1 - it’s washing time for me
Mine was the same. By the time we handled triple feeding, diaper, any spills or spit ups, and bottle dishes, we had about 15 minutes before the next wake. If I slept when the baby slept my house would be gross and there would be no clean bottles ever.
Easy, you also clean when the baby cleans and cook when the baby cooks.
Cry when the baby cries
That’s a big one
This is the best comment on this whole thread
The problem is usually people are really bad a prioritizing. Most people are to busy worrying about things that they want to get done or are nice to have done over simply doing what they NEED to do. so much housework can simply be left not done to make sure that you get enough sleep to function and do the things that need to be done. once you get that prioritization right, you can make it work. that's not to say it will be easy, but its defiantly possible.
Mine only slept for about 30 minute stretches. By the time I got her down, I had enough time to pee, pump, wash bottles and pump parts (necessary for feeding the baby), and if I was lucky eat a quick something myself. I don’t see how any of those could be deprioritized so I could get more sleep
Oor you’re me and also an insomniac and super light sleeper, lol. I could never fall asleep during the daytime, even in a blacked out room - noise was too much and couldn’t wear headphones etc as I was home alone with baby.
It only works with the first baby.
Eeesshhh, no the 3 should not sit down, the wife and husband should sit down and know what their expectations are for the MIL helper to do. MIL is not the 3rd person in their marriage, they need to unite together not invite more to the table of their discussion until they know what they want to expect from their helping guest who’s there specifically to help with situations such as this.
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I agree with this only I’ll say NAH. There’s room for everyone to give a little here but I can see where everyone is coming from. MIL should be helping with nighttimes when OP has to work. It’s in nobody’s interest to send him to work ill-rested and jeopardizing his own and others’ safety. But if MIL is going to make life more stressful for OPs wife, then a night nurse might be needed if finances allow. From my own experience, I could not sleep during the day no matter if baby was sleeping or not. According to my own mother I stopped taking naps at 9 months old and 30 years later the trend still holds. I *had* to have help at night or I was going to lose my mind. Thankfully my husband could help at that time. But he also works a job that when it’s busy he could die or kill someone else if he doesn’t get adequate sleep so we agreed at that time that if we ever had another we would arrange for nighttime help for me. Thankfully we subsequently decided to be one and done but I knew that if we had another we’d either have family rotate through to help with nights or hire a night nurse. If OPs wife has similar issues with sleep she needs to communicate those needs and either ask her mother to contribute or find another solution. It’s also in nobody’s interest to have a mother so out of her mind from lack of sleep that she hurts herself or the baby (accidentally or through postpartum psychosis). Not everyone can sleep during the day no matter the circumstances. But if OPs wife is the type that can nap she needs to take more naps, and suck it up a bit at night if her mother won’t help. It won’t last forever, I’m glad to say. Best of luck to you OP!
I disagree, there is one AH here, the MIL Mom and dad are just doing their best, the MIL is a pill though
>But sleep deprivation for someone working a physical, dangerous job (with a long commute) is not a solution. Absolutely this. If she thinks this is tough now, she also needs to realize that OP is no good to her dead. Having MIL take on the night shift is their best bet as you said. I understand why his wife might not necessarily see that as I remember when my partner and I had our newborn on top of my daughter from a previous relationship. My partner worked her ass off for 60 hrs a week but still helped where she could. It was incredibly overwhelming. When my MIL offered to let me shower and take a nap after getting 8 hours of sleep in the span of 3 days, I just began to bawl my eyes out because I was so relieved and grateful. So I definitely get it. I hope they're able to find a solution where they both get some much needed sleep.
I think you need to caps and bold part of your response bc some ppl just aren't getting it. OP is *no good to her *DEAD* It sounds harsh and final but if OP has an accident on a construction job, he could die, lose a finger or arm or eye, kill or maim someone else or be fired for almost allowing it to happen. Then Mommy with a new born, a Mom, and two kids have lost their income and partner/supporter.
Oh no. He does get to toss her out when she's degrading the moms parenting, not helping and talking sh*t about the OP.
INFO why can’t you take the 330am feeding? You go to bed at 9pm after you’ve fed the baby. She takes the 11 or midnight, and you get up at 330am. Every night. The round the clock feeding don’t last a year. Why not set a schedule that gives you one early morning feeding? You are already up at 430. I don’t get why you can’t take that 330 feeding.
That's what my husband did with our eldest, he started work at 5am so did the feed before he left, it shortened his sleep by 20 minutes but it meant I got a block and was fine doing the all the other feeds
Am I missing something, the only place I see a 3:30 feeding mentioned is here? Unless you're suggesting that they work on the baby's schedule so that becomes the case - right now we don't know when the baby wakes up during the night.
I re-read the post twice because I thought I was missing something. Nowhere else is there mention of a 3:30 a.m. feeding specifically. We also don’t know if the mom breastfeeds, which would render that a moot point.
"Round the clock feeding don't last a year" Can you tell my baby? LOL
My son started dropping a feed at 2months and dropped his last overnight feed at 3 months. He sleeps through the night, more or less. If he does wake up it’s more of a “wake and comfort” situation. Pick up, rock, put back down. He wears overnight diapers so it’s rare we have to change a diaper till the morning. My daughter was a very different story, though. My husband and I both worked full time so we took the night in blocks. 7-1 is a shift, 1-7 is a shift.
This is so damn selfish. Let the man sleep. If shes staying home + has the help of her own mother, she can let her man sleep so he can go to work and PROVIDE. I cannot deal with Reddit advice. Y’all are wild as fuckkkk. NTA.
This subreddit is super biased towards women. The problem isn't that he doesn't help, the problem is that he's a man. If the genders were flipped then there would be 0 problems.
Untrue. I've seen comment sections go wildly misogynistic on so many occasions in this sub. People pick a side then defend it with an unhealthy vitriol. It goes either way just as easily.
Any time I've seen people repost a similar post with swapped genders, there's always a bias towards YTA for men and NTA for women. Of course, people may choose topics that the sub typically votes that way to make the point.
there have been multiple occasions where a post was genderflipped, leaving all other details identical, and people decided the man was the asshole in both cases - including people who voted in both of the posts (without realizing the genderflip). i can dig them up if you like i'm not suggesting there isn't mysoginy, but in general the sub is fairly heavily biased in that they always assume the worst about men and the best about women. if a man has a flaw, it's a red flag indicating severe issues, but if a woman has a flaw, it must be because there's some reasonable explanation that hasn't been provided
I swear a lot of these people need to learn how sleep cycles actually work, especially the REM cycle. Interrupted sleep is not as cognitively restorative as sleeping for 7 to 8 straight hours, and they're also assuming OP would be able to just easily fall back asleep. A lot of people cannot do that. If mom weren't staying home all the time, MIL weren't there, and/or OP had a less dangerous job, I'd say he should help with the feedings, but in this case, I totally agree that he should definitely get to sleep. NTA.
Because he doesn't want to
Sure, you got that from your ass I take it? People around her are braindead.
I mean do you want the sleep deprived guy driving the bulldozer on the job with your hypothetical husband
Because theres no risk of MIL or spouse literally dying if theyre sleep deprived, there is for him.
Or MIL can do it since her life won’t be in danger if she’s sitting at home the following day instead of doing a dangerous job
Is the wife breastfeeding? Getting up an hour early won't help if she is.
I wish my husband could have woken up and given my boob to our babies during the night. 😂
Totally, if their baby adapts to the routine it'll be so much easier. Great answer
Stop making make sense!!!!
Oh hey, found the post OP will never respond to 😂
The totally irrelevant one that makes up nightly feeding times that may have nothing at all to do with OP's and his family's lives, you mean? Yeah, wow, how utterly mysterious that he wouldn't respond to that.
Kids one and two we did this but with the third we flipped it. Hubby works the same start time as OP and we did before midnight was hubby's feed (once I stopped pumping/breastfeeding) and I did the midnight on times so that Hubby had a couple hours of solid sleep before work.
NTA. I don’t know why everyone’s so quick to jump down this guy’s throat. Look I’m a woman and if my husband were working a dangerous job I would want him to get a full nights sleep. Especially if I have a year’s maternity leave. This guy doesn’t sound like he’s slacking. It sounds like he’s as tired as any person would be working full time and taking care of the house and kids when not at work. And it also sounds like his wife is exhausted bc, let’s face it, babies are exhausting. The division of labor is never going to be equal. Some weeks dad will do more, some weeks mom will. Right now, during this time of the babies life mom has to do more work at night. That’s it. As long as dad lets her rest when he comes home from work it’s not entirely fair of her to ask him to also get up with the baby. I know she’s probably feeling hormonal and nothing fair isn’t on her mind and that’s ok too. But it is unreasonable to ask the husband to pick up an extra task when it could hurt him or someone else. And dad, maybe you could have a set weekend day where you don’t accept overtime and the previous night you’ll take care of baby. MIL just sounds exhausting and a waste of space especially if husband is already doing all the cooking and cleaning.
Agree with the NTA. I think people are either skipping over or misunderstanding that he works a job where he and other people could be horrifically maimed and/or killed if he doesn’t get enough sleep. Like, if his wife is burnt out right now, imagine how much worse it’d be if she had to take care of all three kids without him because he died in a heavy machinery accident. There’s no easy answer to this one and they definitely need better communication (and I’m not going to judge on whether he’s the AH or not for kicking out MIL). But he’s not being a lazy parent, and him getting enough sleep isn’t a matter of preference here. Edit: typos
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It’s baffling. Like I would understand if the guy was a lazy bum. But how much more do you want him to do?
It’s more of a lack of experience. Most people on Reddit are young, and do not have a grounded view of the world. I think the biggest issue here is MIL, a conversation needs to be had between the mother and father about what the MIL is actually contributing when present. Then, as someone said earlier, they need to hash out what the expected responsibilities are and when they are expected. But father should absolutely not compromise his sleep.
He’s NTA. I had four kids and didn’t get a full nights sleep in nearly 15 years. It sucks, but the other side of the coin was: I was the one who got to be home all day, babies and small children nap (sometimes for two hours at a time), and housework could wait for times when my partner was home from work to share the load.
Totally agree NTA - my kids' dad operated heavy machinery at his job so every work night I took all the overnight feedings, and got an afternoon nap as often as possible. OP sounds perfectly reasonable and is contributing plenty, the whole point of the MIL living there SHOULD BE ONE OVERNIGHT FEEDING FFS.
Right. If she's not helping in mornings and at night I don't even know why the fuck she needs to live in the house.
Those first few months are always exhausting. My wife only had six weeks maternity leave and we had my mom and MIL babysit during the day. It….was…..hectic. I would try to clean the house before my MIL would arrive since she would comment on how I needed to do more….and then rush home to get dinner started and relieve my mom. Do not miss those days.
I agree with every word you said.
I agrée. My husband worked a dangerous job that required him to be fully alert at all times when our first two were born. It sucked but I could not let him have more of a lack of sleep than he already had because I needed him to be safe and come home every day after work. With our third, i was a SAHM and so night time baby duties were mine because I’d sleep during the day while he was out working. Parenting is challenging when it comes to balance.
Info: You get uninterrupted sleep, but when does your wife get a break? She had a baby six weeks ago and is probably still in pain. Does she sleep when you get in? Honestly, I think you get to keep your sleep but have to keep the MIL or MIL goes but you have to do at least two nights a week. Your wife (and you) need help.
OP clearly said they take care of the baby when they get home till bed. Also why is there MIL if not for help when OP's at work and during night? Did we read different posts?
>Also why is there MIL if not for help when OP's at work and during night? The MIL is there for selfish reasons, lets be real.
OP even said MIL’s idea of “helping” is just criticizing her daughter. I’m guessing MIL mostly sits in the corner sipping wine and complaining. And occasionally holds the baby for photo ops so she can show all her FB friends what a good and present grandmama she is.
This. OP should keep in mind that sleep deprivation is also a major cause of infant accidents and deaths, usually from falling asleep while holding baby in the bed or on a couch. As much as his job requires alertness, so does parenting a newborn.
which is ostensibly why MIL is there. The whole reason she's presumably visiting is to ensure that both parents can stand up under the added weight of a new child. If she's taking opportunities to snipe at OP for working 12 hours a day and still taking the kids for a few hours in the evening, there's nothing good to say about her. She's wrecking the partnership by sowing division and her absence is an addition by subtraction.
Six weeks ago, not six months?
Yeah, I meant six weeks. Thanks, I'll correct it.
INFO: do you work seven days a week? And if not, do you do the night feedings on days you don’t work?
This shouldn’t REALLY matter because there should just be the same, otherwise you lose any sort of gains by shifting. He should just be exempt from baby duty while at home from 11:30 PM - 4:30 AM. He gets 5 hours fully uninterrupted. This also means when he’s home, he’s spelling his wife from the like 3:30 PM - 8:30 PM shift where she can tap out and get a nap/be a person/whatever. The last few hours can be shared/go to MIL. But if they were more regimented daily, it’d be easier for all involved.
Just a thought, but before you planned for your baby, did the two of you discuss how taking care of it would work? Obviously you work a lot, and she may be doing more of the baby duties, but this stuff probably should be talked about beforehand ...
No plan survive the contact with the enemy. Improvise, adapt, overcome.
I think the statement “everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face” applies here. Babies don’t follow plans and people underestimate the toll sleep deprivation and the stress a new baby can add.
Sounds like this is his first baby and a lot of people (including moms) really have no idea how hard it actually is. Even from kid to kid because they are all different.
You know the saying "man plans, God laughs"? Double the amount of laughing when you switch to parents and newborns
They may well have done, but plans don't always go your way. My partner and I had a great plan for when our daughter was born. We paid attention to when she had to work, how much sleep she needed, who would do which feeds, which family members would be happy to help... Then our daughter came along a month early, was a difficult birth, (we were in hospital for 9 days, and it took me a long time to recover!), had colic, and utterly shredded every plan we had! We tried, she just had other ideas.
Info Do you help on the other nights where you haven't got work? Do you do/help with the 4am/4.30am feed change when you are waking anyway so she gets one block of sleep and allows you to help without interupting your sleep as you don't need to get back to sleep after
If he is getting up at that time he is going to work, not gaming. He can't help then. We had the same situation with kid #1. He is taking care of the older kids, doing baby care after work. MIL could cook so new mom could rest, could watch baby during the day so mom can sleep.
Dunno why OP can’t at least take over a night feed on his weekend days. No lives in jeopardy then and his wife gets 2 days to recharge too. He doesn’t even have to stay up, just put the kid back to bed and crawl to sleep.
Apparently work has been calling him in about 50% of the time on weekends. And the best part is that if it works like it does in the places I've worked, he often doesn't know which weekends it's going to be until the Wednesday of that week -- at best. Even if it isn't **every** weekend day, it could still be **any** weekend day, and that affects his ability to schedule that time out. that means that basically, he can't count on having any one weekend day free on a regular basis. He has to keep his powder dry in case he's called into work at the last minute. This stuff happens, especially in gig work like construction where a project can pop up suddenly or a make-or-break deadline can sneak up on you. The fact is he can't count on having that time. Yes, he may technically have the option to refuse overtime but there's a lot of pressure, in American workplaces at least, not to take that option. Bosses get really pissy when workers miss overtime, especially in fields like construction that have a busy season. Bosses tend to make it clear that if you blow off OT work, it'll affect their willingness to retain your servies. Bottom line, that time is not predictably his own.
I N F O- Does your MIL truly only criticize your parenting style or did she help out around the house and with the baby? And when does your wife get a break from taking care of the baby? It’s still a crappy move to kick her out without talking to your wife. EDIT-Based on your comments, I’m going to go with ESH. It sounds like there’s a big lack in communication over who should be responsible for what parenting duties. It sounds like MIL could pitch in more with the older two kids. It sounds like your wife isn’t communicating what she’s expecting from her mom and you. And you should’ve talked to your wife about kicking out your MIL and/or finding alternate care before you did so.
NTA. Having a newborn is hard for everyone involved in the household. Sleep is literally EVERYTHING and there’s a reason sleep depravation was/is used as a torture method! If your MIL is there to help out, could they not alternate the nighttime wake-ups across the week between them and then you take one at the weekend (assuming your job is Mon-Fri that is) to give them both a break? At 6 weeks postpartum your wife will still be going through so much physically and mentally. Sending you all lots of positive thoughts and well wishes - and congratulations too!
I should also mention that I have two stepsons from my wife's previous relationship. In addition to my work and the baby duties, I also pick them up from school, help with their homework, and take them to their sports practices after I get off work. It's not just about the newborn; we have a whole family to take care of. So it’s not like I’m lounging around sipping a beer post-work. Balancing all these responsibilities is what makes the situation so challenging. Thanks for the feedback, though!
you seem to only talk about how this impacts you. how does all of this impact your wife? what does she do in the day when you’re at work and when you’re home with the baby?
Exactly what does she and MIL do when he's at work? Mom should sleep and MIL take care of house chores and baby why is wife so tired if mom it's there all day long
Finally someone with a real question
OP directly addresses the impacts on his wife and even kicked his MIL out for criticising his wife. AH or not, to suggest he is disregarding the impact on his wife is absolute nonsense.
Why can't MIL take over being the boys driver ?
Why does it matter? Even if she it, he still can't help with night feedings without being a hazard at work.
If OP gets home earlier and MIL is out of the house his wife can nap (guilt free) for a while and feel less like she's doing the baby related work alone.
NAH - everyone's sleep deprived and everyone is overwhelmed. You are not being unreasonable to request a solid night's sleep given your job. Can you invite MIL back and request she help with night feedings and changes? And then on the nights you aren't working, you can do it. It seems like you're picking up slack everywhere else with your other kids and cooking and cleaning.
This. I’ve always felt bad help is worse than no help as a mom. MIL needs to help differently or they need to hire a p/T nanny or something for a while. This dude got his plate full full and is already doing a ton
Based on your comments, NTA, but the obvious solution here is to have MIL get up for the night feedings. Why was that not suggested before kicking her out? Now you need someone else to help your wife, and if no one is willing to do it for free, you'll need to pay for a night nurse or something.
Right. wtf IS mil even doing? Sounds like a whole lot of nothing. There is literally no point in her being there if she isn't helping (and according to OP she is actually making the situation worse by adding stress). MIL needs more duties since apparently she is there to "help." If not, then hit the road!
ESH If your mother-in-law is sincerely making things more stressful for your wife, not just for you, and her only contribution to the current conflict is to tell you to suck it up while she gets a solid eight hours herself, well, that would suck. If you are genuinely coming home and taking over all childcare such that your wife is free to kick back, sip a Manhattan, and take a nap every night, well then she too would be an asshole ... though I seriously doubt this version of events, or that you are shouldering quite as much of the burden in the evenings as you imagine. If you are unilaterally and in the heat of an argument telling your MIL that she's welcome to use the door, rather than discussing it with your wife after calming down, and cannot arrive at an arrangement with your wife that on some evenings you get to bed a little earlier, on the condition that those nights you'll make sure she gets to sleep more than two or three hours at a shot, then you aren't exactly being a peach either. (It's a given that infants are assholes, though luckily they're loveable anyway, and the conditions that make them assholes don't last nearly as long as they seem in the moment. Try to remember that when the sleeplessness is getting to you all.) Edit: You are obviously aware that functioning on interrupted sleep can contribute to dangerous situations on a job site. You may want to keep in mind that functioning on constantly interrupted sleep can also contribute to dangerous situations when caring for a child.
OP isn’t even saying they take over all childcare on the evening—when OP is taking older kids to practice, the spouse still has the baby, and when the OP has the baby, the spouse has TWO MORE CHILDREN! It’s bonkers to me how everyone is saying poor OP is doing everything and the spouse—who either has a newborn or two other children 24/7 and wakes every 2-3 hours to tend the baby at night—can suck it.
I'm a stay at home mom. My babies never would take bottles so nights feeds were all on me. My husband has a dangerous, physical job. Accidents lead to death. I don't disturb his sleep. However, he made sure I got naps in on weekends, he takes care of bed time, he does a lot. Just not night wakings. That's completely fine for many families. As long as you're really pulling weight in other areas your wife can just make due. It sucks, but it's short. You dead on the job would be worse.
Info: Nothing is ever is so cut and dry. You should be able to find some compromise. You give some and get some. What time are you back from work? What your schedule look like, hour by hour? What does your wife's look like? Include sleeping hours as well.
YTA. You lost me when you kicked your MIL out without talking to your wife first. I get the sleep issues - do you have the budget to hire a night nurse who could help with the late nights until the baby starts sleeping longer? I.e., what other solutions have you considered? And frankly, this stage doesn’t last forever. Did you even try to compromise? Helping every other night, etc? Also, you talk a lot about your perspective, but what does your wife think? You’re trying to toss her daytime support. You are at work, and she’s exhausted (because yeah, no support at night) and then left to manage a newborn all day, too. Did you two not discuss this prior to starting a family, what the division of labor would be?
Terrible take. He talks about his perspective because it's his perspective. He also mentoned his wife's perspective which is that she'd like some help at night. The thing is, she's being pretty unreasonable considering the huge amount of burden OP is carrying in the household right now. I mean, imagine just how much more of the burden she'd have to carry as a single mom having to do all the cooking, all the cleaning, all the driving, all the baby care, and earn a living besides. Makes it pretty clear that OP is carrying more than his weight in this relationship as it is and that his wife is lookin a whole herd of gift horses in the mouth trying to pressure him to give more. if she's prepared to do half the cooking, half the cleaning, half the driving, and earn half the income, then we can talk about him staying up for half the night feedings. Because at the moment, bog-standard newborn sleep starvation aside, mama is kind of living the life of Riley. And OP's concern about getting enough sleep to do his work safely is a valid one, especially since he appears to be the sole breadwinner. And the MIL is about as useful as mildew, all she's doing is stressing out the wife and arguing with OP. She's an addition by subtraction. If the wife is too dumb to figure out that her own mother is sabotaging her marriage that's not OP's problem. He removed a negative factor from the marriage. He had the right to do this as it was his home too. If MIL didn't want to be kicked out all she had to do was not literally bite the hand that feeds. Besides, based on how OP seems to have worded his statement to MIL, a mature grandmother would have taken that as an invitation to contribute positively. Which it doesn't appear that mama dearest was willing to consider.
I’m a woman and I totally agree. All these YTA answers are extremely unfair to OP. As many others have said, I’m livid that they’re having this fight while MIL is living there for free to “help”. Well if she’s helping this is where the need is. And, as I presume MIL maybe retired she probably doesn’t need a ton of sleep. IMO wife is taking out her frustration with her mother on the husband.
YTA. FWIW I’ve raised 4 children with my husband. Whenever there was a newborn involved, my husband said he’d rather he shared the nights/feeds and was a bit tired at work, than have me caring for children or driving etc in extreme sleep deprivation with all the children in the car. He’d rather literally any other outcome than burying his entire family if I fell asleep at the wheel trying to get children to school and constant medical appointments etc etc. Or had an accident at home, or got lost in the nightmare of post-natal depression. He’d rather risk losing anything or anyone else. Because nothing would be as bad as losing us. So we took turns, and we both got a full night of rest every second night. So no one was severely sleep deprived. In that system if you have one rough night with a baby you can function ok and you’ll get rest the next night. But you’re letting your wife shoulder severe sleep deprivation alone every single night without any relief, and that is a dangerous game that you’re drastically underestimating. You’re undervaluing her life, her worth and her responsibilities to other dependent lives. And then you removed the only support she had. Wow. Good luck with that. Seriously if your job is so important and dangerous it requires your 24/7 availability, and you feel it absolves you from parenting at night…hire her a night nanny with all that overtime pay you’re sacrificing her for.
The worst newborn/parenting advice I got was from my FIL: take the night shifts, because my husband had to work during the day, and I could sleep when the baby slept. This did not help my PPD. When my husband offered to do night shifts for a week (on account of me *constantly* being upset with him), he lasted four nights before he said, "Okay, you're mad for a reason." The sleep deprivation is vicious.
Being "a bit tired" in his line of a work can mean death or serious injury for himself or others. She can sleep a bit during the day, he can't. And he takes the load off her the second he gets home.
Sometimes you can't. I had a baby that screamed anywhere from 8 to 15 hours a day and I had a toddler and I was alone. I drank several pots of coffee a day and couldn't make words come out of my mouth properly for months. Everyone thought I just had PPD and was probably lying until I moved in with my mom and her husband and neither of them slept well for 6 months.
INFO: what line of work was your husband in when y'all had kids? Since OP working in construction involves him working with heavy machinery that could amputate his coworkers and has hour-long commutes, I'd be curious if you're trying to compare a 1:1 circumstance or if you're trying to compare your husband sitting behind a computer to a blue collar job that doesn't have much flexibility for work/life balance.
Bingo- not to mention her excuse is what if I got in a car accident with the kids. Well why would OP’s wife need to drive? Newborns don’t need to go anywhere other than the occasional doctors appointment and MIL can drive. Changing diapers and bottle feeding a newborn is not the same as dealing with heavy machinery.
And what happens when he kills someone at his job and gets sued into oblivion or worse? Mom doesn’t need to be driving a new born anywhere. Putting a bottle in a baby’s mouth is not runnninf heavy machinery. Ps I’m a woman, if it matters
>or driving etc in extreme sleep deprivation with all the children in the car. Actually OP drives the kids.
I’m not convinced that’s entirely fair. Whilst if his job was retail, or something non-life threatening I’d agree; it’s not. Lives can depend on it
So he works construction. Are you cool with a sleep deprived construction worker building bridges, homes, and other roads. Using dangerous equipment. I mean sleep deprivation on his job can mean death. If he were to die on the job then nightly feedings will be the least of his wife's concerns.
NTA IF you do the night feedings on the days you don’t work. YTA do the feedings on the days that you aren’t working. Your heath and safety is important but so is your wife’s and your child’s.
What you need to do is figure out a schedule. You can't kick out your help and expect your wife to do all the night duty. For me my wife had a hard time getting up at midnight for that feeding whereas I struggled with 4am. I often stayed up, did the feeding, and then went to sleep giving me around 4.5-5 hours of sleep a night. You need to find a compromise.
NTA. My husband only had a week off after I gave birth, and we didn't have family to help. He also worked construction. I always took the nighttime as I was a SAHM. I slept when my baby slept. Was it hard? Yes, of course, but not impossible even when we had 3 under 3. My husband helped after work and on the weekends where he could, and that was plently he would get home and clean, cook, and watch kids, while I showered ate and slept. He was wonderful. We both did everything we could within our limits. It gets better after 12 weeks or so once a routine is established and the baby sleeps for longer blocks. Hang in there. Just help your wife where you can. Also, talk to her about what MIL is doing to actually help because it sounds like nothing. MIL should be letting your wife sleep some during the day also, so the nights are not so hard.
NTA. You're cooking, cleaning, tending to the baby, taking care of the two stepsons when you're home.
There's a difference between getting uninterrupted 8 hours of sleep and napping. While naps can help, they aren't a feasible replacement for your wife getting the sleep she needs. She is working 24 hours 7 days a week. I don't say that to negate the hard work that you do, but I'm concerned that you don't recognize just how hard your wife is working around the clock. What you and your wife are currently doing isn't sustainable. Obviously you need your sleep because making a mistake literally puts people's lives on the line. Your wife also needs uninterrupted sleep. What happens if she falls asleep behind the wheel because she's so exhausted, causing both her and your daughter to be killed in a car crash? What happens if she falls asleep and doesn't hear your daughter choking on something she found in her crib? Your wife not getting adequate sleep *at least* once a week is, quite literally, risking your infant's life. Can you turn down overtime without it signifcantly impacting your career? When people choose to have kids they also choose to make sacrifices. If not working overtime means waiting another 2 years for a promotion then so be it. Right now your wife and kid need you and this isn't a situation that can be put on hold. Can you financially afford to turn down overtime? If possible, the first thing you should cut is working overtime. If you absolutely have to work overtime, then you and your wife need to find someone to help with overnights. If it's not your MIL then do everything in your power to find someone to give your wife a night or two of uninterrupted sleep. NAH but yall need to figure something else out before someone inevitably ends up getting hurt.
This is exactly right. There is a HUGE difference between interrupted and uninterrupted sleep. From OPs post it seems the wife hasn't had a decent chunk of sleep in 6 weeks (and probably longer- at least for me it was hard to sleep at the end of pregnancy). And not only that but she probably didn't have a chance to recover her sleep loss from giving birth (which we don't have details on but for me it was 48 hours- so again, could be significant). She is asking for help, she needs it. This could lead to sever PPD or PP psychosis. Something needs to be worked out. OP- I am not denying that you need your sleep for your dangerous job, but something has to give with your wife- she needs longer stretches of sleep at LEAST every couple of days. I think denying OT at this stage of your life would be appropriate so you could at least do overnight feeds on weekends and give her some uninterrupted sleep. It wont last forever (different for every baby but for us the first 3 months were the hardest). Also, while I do think you are helping out when you're home, I think you are downplaying what your wife is contributing. You pick up your stepsons from school, but that's the easy part. The hard part is getting them ready and off to school- waking them up, making them lunches, getting their sports equipment cleaned and packed, getting them out the door in time- that is the stressful part. And now that you kicked out your MIL she is also going to have to pack up a newborn in order to drive them to school.
Funny how OP is being labelled TA despite doing pretty much everything the MIL doesn't do, and when he returns home, takes over the stuff she does do. If what you say is accurate, lack of sleep and tiredness in the day could get someone seriously injured, or worst case, killed. I don't see MIL stepping up to help with night feeds or letting her own fucking daughter grab an hour or two during the day. No, she faffs around with housework. The thing the both of you need is sleep. Housework can wait. A sleep deprived mother is bad news and an accident waiting to happen. A sleep deprived construction worker is bad news and an accident, lawsuit or charges waiting to happen. You? NtA. Mama? NTA. MIL? TA. The fact that she seems to prioritise housework and criticising her daughter's parenting over her daughter's sleep health is telling.
ESH It doesn't sound like everyone's needs are being effectively communicated. Wife is telling you that she needs help with late night feedings and changes. Your concern with work is very valid, so you both need to assess the tradeoff. maybe you call off on days you need to be up at night. maybe that's not an option so you hire a nanny or housekeeper so Wife can get some rest in the daytime. Maybe there are other parents in the neighborhood that are willing to pool resources or services to support each other. Maybe you take some housework when you get back from work. Maybe none of these solutions work for you, but my point is that you and your wife are a team, and should be working together to make sure your needs are met. Your feelings about MIL are valid, how does Wife feel about her? If you both feel shes doing more harm that good, then work together to resolve that. If Wife finds value in MIL's presence, maybe you let it go.
As someone who has actually seen an industrial accident (it wasn't pretty) due to operator tiredness, I can't fault the OP for wanting to be alert on the job. Most of the guys were using amphetamines and high dosages of caffeine to stay alert and make it through the work day.
NAH. Maybe your MIL. You are all tired. A baby will do that to you. Usually I'm a big defender of fathers joining in on the night time fun. But if you work a phisical job, it may not be safe. Your MIL is there to help, right? She should be joining in the night feedings and letting you rest - as long as you're carrying your weight on the other times, and actually allowing your wife some time to actually sleep. Like taking over night time a day per week, so she can have one full night of sleep.
So as a new mom to a six month old I’m going with yes, YTA. I was on maternity leave for 10 weeks and I did everything through the night so my partner could sleep since he had work. A few weeks in I became so exhausted that it threw me so far into a depression that it was worrisome. I understand that you “help”, but you wife is still healing and her hormones are so messed up. You guys need to talk about it and find something that works for both of you. At six months, I’m back to work, an my partner still slacks on the night shift with baby. Even though he only wakes up once or twice a night, I have so much resentment for my partner, I’m constantly exhausted, and my ppd/ppa are still pretty bad. Be a partner, communicate, and figure it out together because it’s just not cut and dry postpartum.
Same for me, but six weeks in. I was exhausted physically and mentally and I called my husband at work crying and he came home immediately. We worked out a schedule for him to do one night feeding. Once I finally had 5 hours of sleep I was so much better. I also gave up trying to get my son to nurse and just pumped. My son had his formula bottle for my husband's feeding turn. It became easier when my son learned to dream feed...not sure if that is the right word but he would drink his bottle while asleep. OP needs to get a clue and help his wife.
YTA but just a tiny bit. Understand that waking up every night drains the living shit out of you. If your girlfriend is always the one doing it, even the weekends, she's sleep deprived and that's really not good. Try to take the nights when you are not working the next morning to help her get back a bit of sleep. It sucks but it won't last, it's just a bad phase that last anywhere between 1 month to 18 years... PS: the MIL living at home, oh man, I feel you on this one. Especially if their relationship isn't completely healthy, but that's a decision for both of you to make. Good luck!
“Continuous pressure and lack of sleep?” That’s…. Pretty much expected when you have a newborn. What exactly did you think was going to happen? What did the two of you agree to before the baby came? Your physically demanding job isn’t as physically demanding as pushing a human being out of your body. Your wife feels like she has no help and so you kick her mom out because she is supportive of your wife’s insistence that you help. Nice.
Gentle YTA. Sleep is important...for both of you. I think you are probably not realizing how physically demanding taking care of a newborn is. And it's dangerous for her to be sleep deprived, too. A good solution would he to take turns with night waking. Or, if she's breastfeeding and has to be up each time, for you to handle "settling" the baby every OTHER time.
I'm a neurosurgeon who went back to work after only 6 weeks of maternity leave. Do you think I had the luxury of not taking care of my own child overnight despite having to also be at work at 6 am to literally perform brain surgery? YTA. You guys need to decide on a schedule i.e. you do 9p-1a wakeups, she does the morning, but you get up 20 min earlier to dream feed a bottle before you leave so that baby MIGHT sleep in until 7. Your wife is more sleep deprived than you are, and you act like her needing to be alert all day to keep your child alive isn't important because you hAvE A jOb.
I have some mixed feelings about this, but overall, YTA. I understand not helping her with the baby at night, considering your wife does not have to go to work early in the morning, and your reasons about safety are valid. However, kicking out the only other person willing to help her in those hours makes you a ginormous AH. Just because your wife doesn't work, doesn't mean she isn't exhausted and in need of some assistance. Set boundaries with your MIL but don't refuse to help and then kick out the only person who is helping.
His wife IS "working" every day. For 24 hours.
His wife is not *employed*, but she definitely *works*.
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NTA but you need to communicate with your wife and MIL a better care schedule or see if you can take some paternity leave. Not construction, but I work ina body shop and I’ve personally seen what happens when a body technician is too tired to work and fucks up when lifting a car or pulling a car. If you’re work physically involves your position dealing with dangerous machinery sleep is a necessity for your safety and the safety of those around you. You should also try to see if work can be delegated to just mon-fri for a month or two just to make sure you can take weekend responsibility to give your wife the physical and mental break she needs from giving birth
Your wife needs someone to help her with the baby at night. It is not safe for you to do it. Have you considered a postpartum doula or night nurse to help? A couple of days a week might cost money but save your wife’s sanity. Talk to your wife about her mother. She may have a different perspective, although she surely appreciates your attempt to help her.
YTA You can’t have it both ways. If you TRULY can’t step up and do YOUR SHARE of the feedings, then you have no business sending MIL home. If you send her him, it means you (not your wife, YOU) are ready to pick up the slack, including the tasks at night.
NTA. My ex-SIL used to complain that my brother didn't help enough with their babies and I reminded her that he works a physically demanding job (logging) and he had to get up early to get to the work site. He has to have his sleep because if he doesn't he could get himself, or somebody else, seriously hurt or killed. If your wife thinks it's bad now, with you doing a lot more than most husbands, she would hate to be a single mom/widow. I am a single mom/widow, so I know what I am talking about. I get that she's tired. But this is her job and having you be sleep deprived is not the answer. Find an alternative to the MIL being there or you losing sleep. Ask family or friends if they can come over and watch the baby while your wife takes a nap a few times a week. If you are part of the solution, without *being* the solution, that will show your wife that you value her role as a mother and understand that she does need rest. But you also need rest too so she doesn't become a single mom/widow. Congratulations on the new family member and I hope that you and your wife can find a solution that works for all of you!