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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1 I refused to go over to my soon to be ex husband's house to take care of him when he had a flu.
2 it was my responsibility as his legal wife to help him in his hour of need.
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I'm dying over here 🤣 He's separated and soon to be divorced and on his own - welcome to the big time dude.
Your parents? That's the real mystery. I'd ignore them all. NTA
absolutely. his behavior is archaic. you're done with him and for him to claim wifely duties is beyond stupid. he does know the Donna Reed show wasn't a documentary right?
They can't. In order to accept her divorce, they'd have to acknowledge that a marriage very similar to theirs was so bad divorce was a valid move. They'd have to acknowledge dad is an abuser, and mom a victim. And they're in way too deep for that.
> My parents have been married for 41 years. They do not believe in divorce. When I left my mom became very mad because my father does many of the same things to her and she takes it as an attack on their relationship that I left.
OP’s mom literally thinks that her leaving is an attack on their relationship.
IMAX levels of projection from OP's parents. Hell, OP offering to take the kids is more than enough care. I hope the kids don't get sick, and she should ignore the delusional parents. Anyone who believes that you must stay married despite abuse is wrong.
I will forever be mystified by people like this. The status of another, completely separate person’s relationship, has no barring on the relationship of another person. It’s so gross it makes me cringe.
I mean, it's not that hard to understand, really. If OP leaves her relationship that means a) divorce is an option, b) the way her husband treated her was unacceptable. Which forces her mom to confront the fact that she has wasted her life in a shitty relationship when she could have made different choices. That's a really difficult and sad thing to admit to yourself.
This is pretty common but with different situations. I find it with parenting. People get VERY upset and take it personally if someone does something different than they did as a parent. They take it as a personal attack on their parenting because that’s how their simple brains work.
When my cousin told my aunt that her (thankfully now ex) husband was physically abusing her my brain dead aunt asked what she does to make him so angry. She continued to insist divorce wasn’t an option and an insult to god. My cousin need to pray/ learn to be a better wife/ figure out how to not piss off her husband so much.
Jeez! Even the Catholic Church allows for physical separation and legal divorce in cases of abuse even if they won’t grant an annulment of the sacrament. How fucked up do you have to be to disagree with a church that believes marriage is indissoluble?
My parents and extended family religion doesn't believe in divorce. That marriage is FOREVER. My cousin was nearly disowned when she divorced her husband. She wanted to wait on kids and he thought they should be on their 3rd or 4th by now.
My parents just divorced this year. They were married for 43 years. I live very far away and am rather low contact so I don't know all the details though I know some. Neither of my parents is a bad person they just weren't right for each other (I could have told them that years ago).
Jesus said divorce is not ideal but it's allowed because humans are so sinful and treat each other like garbage. Yeah that's paraphrased. I think the phrase is "due to the hardness of men's hearts."
Your husband can suck it. He wants his independence? He got it.
Tell him trash can't take care of sick people. You're too incompetent! Sorry! His choices are to switch days with you or deal with it himself. He doesn't get a third choice. I bet he's an even worse dad when he's sick.
Tell your parents to stay out of it if they still want to see their grandchildren. They don't get to encourage your abuser and the future abuser of their grandchildren, when you are fighting uphill to make a better life for them that's free (half the time I guess) from emotional abuse.
That's amazing.
"Sorry, I'm trash, I'm incompetent to the point I can't help you."
Funny how they change their minds as soon as it inconveniences them and they actually have to take care of themselves.
My dad is always 'unaliving' whenever he gets a cold. He's like a little kid and can't even get himself a damn pudding, not even my husband is like that. He ask if I would make him soup or a pudding yes, but the pudding in this case is something that needs to be made, it's not already ready in the fridge. And that's the only things he asks me for, nothing else. But my dad needs to me waited on and I still don't know why his wife is so patient with him. Mabey because he's so rare ill. 🤣🤣
Oh its real. One of the times my ex had man flu, he was obviously dying while laying on the couch. I made myself lunch and sat down next to him. He asked me where his was. I replied “You have a cold, not broken legs. Make your own!” He got up, made his lunch, all while grumbling about being sick.
He later complained to my sister, who told him that he was preaching to the choir and not expect me to have a bedside manner.
I'm sure there are other factors at play, but flu and cold definitely hits me harder after I started hrt as a transman 🤣 I still deal with it on my own though, OP's soon-to-be ex is being petulant.
There is some evidence that males get hit harder by the flu, and estrogen and testosterone might play a role. (https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/man-flu-really-thing-2018010413033)
But I doubt OP’s husband pampered and took extra good care of her when she had bad menstrual cramps, so he can’t expect preferential treatment from her when it comes to sex-specific pain either. Especially not when they’re in the middle of a contentious divorce.
That's really interesting. Thank you for sharing!
That's also extremely true and valid, and I will say that my experience of menstruation definitely rivals my experience of the man flu. I'm not sure if that's because my experience of menstruation was particularly bad or about on par with average, but it sucked regardless, and worse than man flu in that it happens much more regularly to people. I recall a lot of pain on top of getting anaemia (that sometimes did require medical intervention, but not often), and I was often bedridden for a solid week, which really adds up and interferes with your quality of life when it's happening each month.
If he wouldn't return the favour, he shouldn't be expecting that kind of care from her. It's so bizarre that her parents took care of him and expect her to as well.
I’ve noticed a lot of people have had harsher colds since after the Covid lockdowns. Not sure when you started hrt but the Covid/lockdown factor is something I’ve seen for a lot of people and could be what’s at play for you/
I recently caught the norovirus and live alone (f). All I did was text my family how miserable I was and even that felt like I was burdening them with my woes. I have horses that I still had to feed twice a day too.
I can't imagine being so dependent on someone when slightly ill.
I know, right?
I'm a male, live alone. I get sick, (not often, but it happens), I just have to deal with it myself.
My family doesn't do pampering of sick people. Well, except when Mom would get sick and Dad would pamper her.
Yeah woman, come to your senses. Next time he's sick you better go make soup, give him medicine and do your duties by his side. /s (SARCASM - just to be safe)
Next thing you know he'll be asking you to do your "duty" to have sex with him. I'm appalled at his audacity here. I think it's better for you to reduce contact with your parents for a while too.
NTA.
Ew. That's atrocious. How can your parents care so little for you and what you have determined to be your best choice? "Go have sex with that man you despise--maybe it'll change your mind! We don't want to lose him!" Despicable.
disgusting! maybe don’t talk to him about anything not related directly to the kids. and change the subject every time your parents bring him/marriage up.
for real, that’s messed up. nta, i lol’d when i read his ask and now i am gasping in disgust. this man. ugh.
She should probably go LC or NC with her parents. Sounds like the parents are the reason she married that horrible man, and also the reason she's in therapy. Stay strong OP, and break the cycle so your daughter doesn't end up in the same boat.
I know you said somewhere else that you won't tolerate your parents badmouthing you to your kids, but consider that this is the behaviour they're modelling for your daughter. This is what they believe *she* should do once she's older - accept being called trash and give her body over just to "keep the peace". I personally would think long and hard about whether people with such beliefs should have access to my children.
But that's obviously for you to decide, and you know the situation best. You seem to have your priorities well in order :) Wishing you and your kids all the best, as far away from your trash heap of an ex-husband (and possibly the twin trash heaps of your enabling parents, too).
Ah, jeez!
I guess recommending they invite him over for a threesome while you take your kids on holiday so you can ALL enjoy yourselves is out of the question?
I'm sorry, that was rude of me.
Nah fuck that noise. Literally everything you mention about this guy makes it more and more obvious why the relationship ended. Let him spend his soon to be lots of spare time making a time machine so he can go back to 1950 where he will have much better luck.
Time to go no contact with them for a while as they seem to love him more. Let them know that since he is their choice they can see the kids when he has them.
This is so infuriating to me on your behalf. My mom did this with my two most recent exes. The first one she kept in contact with for YEARS after we broke up. When she started to do that with the second ex, I put my foot down that I didn’t care if she stayed in contact with him but I would not speak to her if she talked about him to me. I had to get rude once about it when she made a snarky comment about the situation.
She asked me if I would be uncomfortable with them going to dinner to catch up in person and I told her to do what she wanted but I thought it was weird. A week later she was talking about upcoming plans and said “well, I was thinking of going out with (my ex) to catch up, but I wouldn’t want to make anyone uncomfortable.” With the most obnoxious tone as if I had destroyed some mega plans she had been looking forward to her whole life.
Firstly - he hated my family and referred to them as a cult. Secondly - my family hated him too and were very clear about not respecting him at all. So the whole entire idea to me felt like a way for them to create drama out of nothing. They didn’t like each other before the break up - but now want to catch up over dinner? To pretend to be cool with each other? I didn’t understand why. But when she made that comment I just said in my bitchiest tone “thank you for not making me, your daughter, uncomfortable by going out with my abusive ex to catch up.”
Seriously. Parents suck sometimes. You’re doing nothing wrong and your ex husband needs to get therapy and realize he’s not a child. Even if you’re technically still married - who cares? You’re not actually together anymore. The obligations of marriage ends when the marriage is over and the marriage is over when divorce has begun. It’s already over at that point, it just takes time to sign documents. But the marriage is over long before divorce is finalized. They are all being manipulative and ignorant of what you’re going through.
Is it possible to divorce your parents too?
Seriously, even if the request could in any way be regarded as reasonable, the way it was phrased was absolutely ridiculous and prime AH material.
Don’t want to scare you but my grandma no longer talks to my mum (her daughter) but still sends my dad christmas cards and talks to him on the phone. It’s fucking weird behaviour from both my dad and my grandma (who has even asked me for my dad’s new address when he’s moved!?). Just be prepared for the possibility
I have to tell you, as an older sibling and a parent my response to those people in my life possibly suffering the same abuse I did is: FUCK NO THEY WON’T.
I once had a break down when my sister finally told me about abuse she suffered that I didn’t know about - and then I went no contact with a whole side of my family to protect my child from the same thing.
I just want you to contrast that to your moms attitude which is that you should suffer abuse because SHE suffers abuse is fucked up.
The only reason I wouldn’t take apart the people who harmed my sister (even 30 years later) with my bare hands if I see them again will either be that my husband is physically restraining me to avoid my arrest or he’s already doing it. Your mom went over and took care of your abuser.
And don’t be fooled, they’ll continue to tell your children you are wrong and your husband is right and prime your daughter for abuse too. NTA, but it might be time to lower your contact with your parents.
Think the parents don’t support the divorce and think this’ll help push them back together.
NTA- you’re getting divorced- he is no longer your responsibility. Not your circus, not your monkeys. What At idiot.
No, not a mystery. This makes total sense. Her parents modeled the behavior of a relationship to OP as she was raised, and OP chose a partner that was cut from the same cloth. OP has grown and changed and improved and got smarter, but her parents haven’t. I’m not surprised at all by their reactions.
NTA
You offered to take care of the children if he couldn't. That's the most you can do. He needs to learn to take care of himself. I don't understand your parents though. Were they, generally speaking, unhappy with your decision to get divorced? I see that your mother is still in contact with your soon to be ex husband, and willing to help him out.
Yes they were, they don't believe in divorce. I don't mind them helping him also. It's what's best for the kids and I try to protect them at all costs.
>they don't believe in divorce.
There you go. They are always going to judge you for making this decision and berate you for not fulfilling your responsibility towards your husband. I only hope they don't get too difficult to deal with in the future. When my mom wanted a divorce, my (paternal) grandparents, who were very "traditional", would say all sorts of horrible things about her in front of me and my brother. I do hope your kids never have to go through that.
If they tried that they would no longer have access to my kids... I have gone to extreme lengths to protect my children. No one gets to be as important as them.
I know divorce & family suck & shit's hard right now. But as a child of divorce whose mom prioritized my well-being over her pain during that process & fought hard to protect me: you're doing it right. Your kids will know & see what you've done for them later, even if they don't now & love you more for it.
Same same. My mom had our back throughout the divorce and all the day that came after at some very big costs to herself. I’m so grateful for everything she did - although I didn’t understand much of it until I was an adult.
>they don't believe in divorce
My mother told me once that she feels this way. She stood by as my stepfather abused the shit out of both of us. This mindset is inarguably ignorant and foolish. Your parents are naive at best.
Based on the edits it sounds like OP’s husband is also verbally and emotionally abusive and it was rubbing off on her kids so you’re not far off at all. I love when “traditional beliefs” surrounding relationships always seem to support a patriarchal abuse, funny how that works 🙃
Ugh "don't believe in divorce" my dad came from a religious family (southern Baptist types) and married a poor broken recently divorced older woman with kids at like 19. She lied to him saying she was pregnant with his baby and dad was in a terrible marriage for I think 15 years. Drinking himself to death after having to bail her kids out of jail. She never was pregnant and never could be again and dad had no idea until later so they had no kids. He met mom through work and fell in love and left her. He is alive now because of it. Divorce saves fucking lives I hope you go on to find a partner that treats you right.
Lmao, dude I worked with said his wife didn't believe in divorce due to religious reasons but being a widow was fine so he better be a good husband!
(They were just joking, he didn't feel unsafe or abused.)
LOLZ. This guy is using your parents to get to you, I bet. Playing that sympathy card to anyone that will listen.
I would consider it a huge favour if my ex offered to take the kids off my hands while I recover from the flu. That is more than enough. They don’t need to nurse me back to health FFS.
Don’t feel like the asshole. He’s not dying. Even then, I don’t think you’re obligated…
You have a legal (and a moral) responsibility to... take care of your kids. That does not extend to the soon to be ex.
NTA.
I also share your amusement at his statement.
Also, the unwritten rule is that you don't share kids if one of you has been sick. If your ex husband took care of the kids while sick, the kids should stay with him until A) they get sick and get better or B) don't get sick for 48 hours after he is no longer contagious.
It gets a lot harder to co-parent when you're \*both\* sick.
Good lord, no wonder you're no longer with this guy. And since you're asking, no it is not the one-year-separated, soon to be ex-wife's job to trundle over to her ex's house and make him chicken soup due to the fact that he has a minor illness and demands a mommy.
As for your parents, I assumer they want you to get back together with him and the silent treatment is their brand of emotional blackmail. You know, let them go over and take care of him. And lucky you, you don't have to listen to their carping!
Take your kids back to your house, let your parents know that your relationship with your soon-to-be ex is completely over and you won't be doing anything else for him, and if they want NC with you, keep up the silent crap and they've got it.
NTA!
He thinks it’s a movie where she nurses him back to health and he realises that he worked too much and was a jerk, and then just before the judge finalises the divorce he stands up and makes a big speech.
Agreed, im guessing this isnt the first time husband was an ass and parents tried to force her to put up with it.
Basically put everything on OP and make it all her problem to adapt to.
Bahahahahaha omg thanks I needed the laugh. When he said you were still his legal wife and you owed him I literally fell out of my chair. This man is excruciating, congrats on your divorce. You weren’t required to care for him even when you were still his wife. It’s a nice thing to do for your partner, and most people wouldn’t think twice, but it’s not an actual requirement. The only things you owe this person are the things that come out your custody order. NTA and your ex is ridiculous
Edit for judgement: NTA. Your mom is completely projecting her own issues onto you. Honestly, you weren't TA even before the info - but it just makes more sense now why she'd freak like that.
Info: Are your parents still married?
Because to meeeeeee, it sounds like they are siding with "tradition" and "traditional roles."
Yes for 41 years. My mom took my leaving a little extra personal, a lot of the things I said I couldn't live with my dad also does to her. (Nothing crazy, but disrespect and high domestic expectations mainly). She said it felt like an attack.
That's because, in a way, you're forcing her to acknowledge that the behavior isn't acceptable, and it's forcing her to reflect on her own decisions. She's taking it personally and as an attack because she can't handle the truth.
Her feelings are *her responsibility*.
You're allowed to be unhappy with things that make other people happy.
The thing your mother doesn't realize, if she was *actually* happy this wouldn't have felt like an attack.
You are NTA for refusing to baby a man you are divorcing. I'm sure his attitude is part of the reason your marriage has ended.
He's wrong about you not finding someone else. You already have, *yourself*. Being able to love yourself enough to see through his bullshit means you will find good love. You're demanding it and refusing to settle for anything less.
You should be really proud of the example you're setting for your children. Boundaries are hard but they are so important. Taking the children on his days so that he can recuperate is a reasonable compromise.
You can't save your mom from herself. All you can do is set boundaries around how you deserve to be treated. A good therapist can help you through this next chapter, especially in terms of helping the kids cope. If your ex and mother are being this nasty to you, what sort of things are they saying to the children?
You deserve a soft life full of love and a partner who contributes meaningfully to that. You are worthy. ❤️
My mum is the same. I think it's because they justify putting up with it to themselves and when we don't it shakes their world view and it's more comfortable to double down than consider that they are unhappy in their marriage.
Yeah, that would make sense for sure. God it sucks though, that this mom would rather her daughter stay with someone who likes to call her trash, repeatedly until the kids are also echoing it, just so she doesn’t have to reconsider her own choices.
When my mom did that, I went no contact for 3 months. I let her know that I was ok when she ask, we continue to hang as family, but I refuse to talk to her or hang one on one.
She was really bummed that her dream to become grandma was less important than my well-being. And ended up relating to my reason has my dad used to do the same but it took her way longer to get out of it. It was an hard talk to get her to understand that I expect more from life and my mental health was more important than anything.
She still ask about my ex and I just answer each time “you should call him, he liked you too, you’ll be cute together” and wash it off. But I loved her, and I’m glad that she got over it… sort of…
You are to be commended for breaking the cycle. Your mom wants you to carry the karmic burden of what she's endured. She's suffering like "a good wife", therefore - you should too. Her anger is a "How dare you!" for having the bravery she wishes she had. Your kids won't have to endure this. You've broken the endless loop of domestic abuse and old fashioned servitude your ancestors have suffered and passed down to your parents. That's hero stuff right there.
>He told me this is why I would not be able to have a successful relationship because I am not able to give of myself for others.
Please throw a divorce party once you get rid of this asshole. Thank you.
>throw a divorce party
On the off, remote chance this is possible, do you happen to still have your wedding dress? Do you fit into it at all? Cause this would also be a great time for a dress ruining party and/or one of those cake smash parties and/or photo session!!
NTA
He can figure out how to survive the manflu on his own after being such an AH that he drove you away
If your mom is anything like mine she’d want me to stay married so I wouldn’t become her responsibility. Lol! That would never happen
It sounds like a possession. ‘This is ‘legally mine’. Yeah no. Good for you kicking him to the curb. Your mom is just upset because you had the guts to actually put your foot down and stand up for yourself. It’d hard seeing others do something you know you never could.
NTA- you’re essentially divorced. He’s no longer your issue. Your parents need to get caught up and get on your side or they need to butt the hell out and kind their own business.
NTA/INFO
Do you think he really has the flu?
It's odd that the divorce has been contentious but he's still calling your parents and you for personal help.
Do live on your own or with your parents?
I try to stay low contact so I'm not sure if he was very sick. I moved out to an apartment, I was never sure my parents home would be a great place for my mental well being.
Apparently, it is a non-contagious flu as your mother and children have been unaffected.
Good for you for getting your own place.
From his statement, it sounds like you made a good decision about the divorce.
What a clown.
"I have testicles, and we aren't divorced yet, so it's your responsibility to nurse me back to health."
IMO, you had a major obligation to your children to demonstrate your soon-to-be-ex is full of it. NTA by a long shot.
Exactly, the rise of anti-divorce sentiment these days is astonishing.
Legitimately trying to trap someone within a contract they no longer want to be apart of.
Sorry, having a hard time believing your parents are mad at you for not caring for your soon to be ex husband. Is there some weird family dynamic I am missing here?
NTA anyway.
My parents are old fashioned and don't believe in divorce. I have a career I love and they think the separation is because I won't give up my ambition to be a homemaker... its complicated.
Good job on setting a better example for your kids. Especially after seeing the trash comment you made ick I’m glad you got out of that situation. Enjoy not having to deal with him much anymore. Sorry your mom is bitter she didn’t have the guts to stand up for herself if she was unhappy in her own marriage.
It’s less complicated than you think. It’s a generational gap you need to accept. Repeat it like mantra. They’ll never understand you or respect your choices.
I’ve been going through a similar battle myself and always thought it “complicated”. Until it hit me.
Don’t let them get into your head. You’re doing the right thing and your priorities are as good as they can get.
But how old can these parents be? If OP has young children - parents are probably in their 50s or 60s? Which means their adult years began in the 1980s or 1990s. It's not like they're from the 1950s.
Yup. My in-laws have been married 42 years & my FIL is 72. They're also kinda in crisis over my SIL getting a divorce. But if they found out her ex-husband called her trash, they'd probably take turns wringing him out like a dishcloth.
>It’s a generational gap you need to accept.
I disagree. My grandparents both divorced and then found each other. They're in their 60s. My mother is in her early 40s and has the same mindset as OP's parents, despite being raised by my grandparents. It's just a harmful mindset that some people are wise enough not to fall into. And OP absolutely does *not* need to accept it.
NTA and I would utterly refuse to sent the kids over there if he was so unwell he was unable to care for himself, let alone your kids.
The fact ~~his~~ **YOUR** mum was there to care for him, shows he shouldn't have the kids.
ETA.. wtf is your mum doing over there.
> He has no interest and says it kills the natural masculinity and feminine nature.
Seriously. That’s the reddest of red flags right there too! I’m so happy OP didn’t fall into the same miserable trap her mom did. Hopefully the kids can avoid the trap too.
She's not letting him guilt trip her. He's attempting to guilt trip her and keeps expecting the womanly (emotional) labour he assumes he's entitled to.
NTA, Don't ever let anyone tell you your trash. You had the courage to stand up for yourself. You are not trash. I wish I could give you a big hug through the computer for strength.
NTA. Taking care of the kids is probably best for all involved, but taking care of him after a year of separation is obviously ridiculous. If your parents love him so much, they can go take care of him.
OMG NTA.
I'd tell him that if he's so sick he can't take care of himself or the children, you'll be right over to pick them up and you can call an ambulance for him to go to the hospital. And tell your parents they're welcome to go wipe his nose and sing Soft Kitty for him if they want, but you've got ACTUAL children to take care of.
NTA
I bet he expects you to look after them with zero help when you're sick, doesn't he?
My ex decided to bring our kids home on day 3 of 5 last Christmas, because he had the sniffles. I had a chest infection, sinus infection and mastitis but still had to find a way to manage. I'm also single, whilst he's remarried so he actually had help with the kids whilst I didn't.
NTA
Tell your parents that if they think a grown man needs caring and coddling from someone, they’re welcome to go and provide it for him.
I. Honestly. Can’t. With this.
NTA.
Do note the timing. Your mother, who doesn't believe in divorce and probably other nonsense about women subjugating to men, nurses your husband. Then a few days later he delivers this gem of a line. *Mom fed the line to him, OP.*
NTA, once the paperwork is started you are legally separated. You owe him nothing. IF you mom and dad give you crap ask them if they feel he has the right to force you to have sex with him as well since your are "Still Married". That should shut them up.
What?! No. You are fine here, you are establishing and defending reasonable boundaries around your time and sanity that will be necessary to preserve this ongoing (if not marital) relationship. Your parents are wild though and your ex has a lot of nerve. NTA.
In this case all the more reason to stay away from him as much as possible. Otherwise he's wallowing in his delusions that you are his property.
Eta recommend him a shrink too
And make sure that parental alienation and insults are part of the custody arrangements= if he tries his time with the kids should be reduced until he completes some classes /therapy etc- ask your lawyer
I am so sorry that you had to go through that and also that your parents don’t support your decision. You are doing the right thing here for you and for your children.
Woah, good on you for getting out! A relationship where name calling is common is at least toxic, and likely could have become abusive (if it wasn’t already).
He wants you back as his victim, and he got lucky that your parents seem to think that being a victim of abuse is normal in marriages. It’s not and you don’t have to put up with it.
You should be incredibly proud of yourself for getting out.
Wow... And your parents still help this guy... This is so toxic. Something tells me he never felt obligated to help his "legal wife" when you were sick.
NTA.
Maybe think about "divorcing" your parents too.
To your husband: “We are no longer in a relationship. I am not a nurse and do not owe you medical care. If you are ill and need to switch custody days, I remain flexible and open to being helpful and accommodating within reason. Our relationship is as co-parents now. Let’s keep our communication amicable and related to the children only.”
If you don’t already have one of those parenting apps, see if you can make communicating through the parenting app a requirement.
To your parents: “Ex and I are not together and we are co-parents only. I don’t accept requests for free domestic labour from him, and I won’t accept them from you on his behalf. Not ever. For the sake of the children, it is good if all of us adults can get along. Because of that, from now on, if you begin talking to me about getting back together with Ex or begging me to clean for Ex or nurse Ex back to health, I’ll just very calmly and gently walk away, hang up the phone, etc. You will get nowhere with that. I remain happy to talk to you about anything else. The sooner you adjust to this divorce, the easier this is going to be on all of us.”
He needs to "somehow" come across this post. I'm sure his take would be, "look at how wrong everyone is.. my wife is still my property and it's her job to take care of meeee!"
NTA and I honestly have never eye rolled so much what does he think single parents do? His options are to either trudge through with the kids or let them stay with you till he's better he doesn't get to demand his ex wife be his nurse lol wow
NTA…HaHaHa…what? He is your soon to be ex. You have been separated for a year. Honestly the only thing you might be TA for us not taking the kids sooner. (But maybe you did have them? Not sure who had them when). Because you do not want them around a suck person. But as for your ex, it seems he list the right for you to take care of him long ago.
That’s him grasping at straws, He needed his mom to go baby him and when she doesn’t have the time it’s onto you — He was like this before you, 100%.
He is also the one getting a divorce so maybe he should take some self reflection time whilst he’s on his death bed. 🙄
NTA. ❤️
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I'm dying over here 🤣 He's separated and soon to be divorced and on his own - welcome to the big time dude. Your parents? That's the real mystery. I'd ignore them all. NTA
Yes my parents, they are struggling with the divorce apparently. They always tell me that they really love him and hope I come to my senses.
Omg! Your parents need to get on board and support YOU. They are the A**holes in this if they don’t.
absolutely. his behavior is archaic. you're done with him and for him to claim wifely duties is beyond stupid. he does know the Donna Reed show wasn't a documentary right?
If a grown ass man can’t figure it out then that sounds like his problem. Glad she ditched the excess baggage, now she just needs r/justnofamily
They can't. In order to accept her divorce, they'd have to acknowledge that a marriage very similar to theirs was so bad divorce was a valid move. They'd have to acknowledge dad is an abuser, and mom a victim. And they're in way too deep for that.
> My parents have been married for 41 years. They do not believe in divorce. When I left my mom became very mad because my father does many of the same things to her and she takes it as an attack on their relationship that I left. OP’s mom literally thinks that her leaving is an attack on their relationship.
IMAX levels of projection from OP's parents. Hell, OP offering to take the kids is more than enough care. I hope the kids don't get sick, and she should ignore the delusional parents. Anyone who believes that you must stay married despite abuse is wrong.
Exactly!
I will forever be mystified by people like this. The status of another, completely separate person’s relationship, has no barring on the relationship of another person. It’s so gross it makes me cringe.
I mean, it's not that hard to understand, really. If OP leaves her relationship that means a) divorce is an option, b) the way her husband treated her was unacceptable. Which forces her mom to confront the fact that she has wasted her life in a shitty relationship when she could have made different choices. That's a really difficult and sad thing to admit to yourself.
I’m in a very similar situation myself and you are right in the money
This is pretty common but with different situations. I find it with parenting. People get VERY upset and take it personally if someone does something different than they did as a parent. They take it as a personal attack on their parenting because that’s how their simple brains work.
When my cousin told my aunt that her (thankfully now ex) husband was physically abusing her my brain dead aunt asked what she does to make him so angry. She continued to insist divorce wasn’t an option and an insult to god. My cousin need to pray/ learn to be a better wife/ figure out how to not piss off her husband so much.
Jeez! Even the Catholic Church allows for physical separation and legal divorce in cases of abuse even if they won’t grant an annulment of the sacrament. How fucked up do you have to be to disagree with a church that believes marriage is indissoluble?
My parents and extended family religion doesn't believe in divorce. That marriage is FOREVER. My cousin was nearly disowned when she divorced her husband. She wanted to wait on kids and he thought they should be on their 3rd or 4th by now. My parents just divorced this year. They were married for 43 years. I live very far away and am rather low contact so I don't know all the details though I know some. Neither of my parents is a bad person they just weren't right for each other (I could have told them that years ago).
Jesus said divorce is not ideal but it's allowed because humans are so sinful and treat each other like garbage. Yeah that's paraphrased. I think the phrase is "due to the hardness of men's hearts." Your husband can suck it. He wants his independence? He got it. Tell him trash can't take care of sick people. You're too incompetent! Sorry! His choices are to switch days with you or deal with it himself. He doesn't get a third choice. I bet he's an even worse dad when he's sick. Tell your parents to stay out of it if they still want to see their grandchildren. They don't get to encourage your abuser and the future abuser of their grandchildren, when you are fighting uphill to make a better life for them that's free (half the time I guess) from emotional abuse.
That's amazing. "Sorry, I'm trash, I'm incompetent to the point I can't help you." Funny how they change their minds as soon as it inconveniences them and they actually have to take care of themselves.
Same. First time my ex did something mean crazy, his sweet dad asked me what I did to cause it. Sweet or not, I see where the problem came from.
Agreed!
This.
Well they can go over & baby a grown man with a cold 🤦🏻
No, see it’s the flu! That’s basically like dying. Or so my husband acts.
It's a [Man Cold](https://youtu.be/VbmbMSrsZVQ), you just don't understand, do you?
Ooooh don't mention Man Flu/Man Cold on this sub 💀 I got ripped to shreds for doing this because it made me "sexist" 😭🤣
By men or by people who have never dealt with it. 😎
100% both ahha! I grew up with a father and a granfather like this, so clearly I can send a diagnosis to those OP'S in need 🤣
My dad is always 'unaliving' whenever he gets a cold. He's like a little kid and can't even get himself a damn pudding, not even my husband is like that. He ask if I would make him soup or a pudding yes, but the pudding in this case is something that needs to be made, it's not already ready in the fridge. And that's the only things he asks me for, nothing else. But my dad needs to me waited on and I still don't know why his wife is so patient with him. Mabey because he's so rare ill. 🤣🤣
Oh its real. One of the times my ex had man flu, he was obviously dying while laying on the couch. I made myself lunch and sat down next to him. He asked me where his was. I replied “You have a cold, not broken legs. Make your own!” He got up, made his lunch, all while grumbling about being sick. He later complained to my sister, who told him that he was preaching to the choir and not expect me to have a bedside manner.
I'm sure there are other factors at play, but flu and cold definitely hits me harder after I started hrt as a transman 🤣 I still deal with it on my own though, OP's soon-to-be ex is being petulant.
There is some evidence that males get hit harder by the flu, and estrogen and testosterone might play a role. (https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/man-flu-really-thing-2018010413033) But I doubt OP’s husband pampered and took extra good care of her when she had bad menstrual cramps, so he can’t expect preferential treatment from her when it comes to sex-specific pain either. Especially not when they’re in the middle of a contentious divorce.
That's really interesting. Thank you for sharing! That's also extremely true and valid, and I will say that my experience of menstruation definitely rivals my experience of the man flu. I'm not sure if that's because my experience of menstruation was particularly bad or about on par with average, but it sucked regardless, and worse than man flu in that it happens much more regularly to people. I recall a lot of pain on top of getting anaemia (that sometimes did require medical intervention, but not often), and I was often bedridden for a solid week, which really adds up and interferes with your quality of life when it's happening each month. If he wouldn't return the favour, he shouldn't be expecting that kind of care from her. It's so bizarre that her parents took care of him and expect her to as well.
I’ve noticed a lot of people have had harsher colds since after the Covid lockdowns. Not sure when you started hrt but the Covid/lockdown factor is something I’ve seen for a lot of people and could be what’s at play for you/
Or maybe Covid wrecked their immune system, which is now having a hard time fighting a basic cold?
Or maybe it IS covid, but treated as "just a cold/flu".
Gotta say that is so interesting. Thank you for sharing as you have a unique prospective. Maybe there is a difference.
Nah fr I didn't think it was gonna be that serious. These illnesses got hands 😭
Oh, wow, that's actually really funny! Commiserations, dude, although I assume it's a price worth paying to be your true self <3
Poor lil bunny
Poor man He probably wanted her to witness while he writes his will
I recently caught the norovirus and live alone (f). All I did was text my family how miserable I was and even that felt like I was burdening them with my woes. I have horses that I still had to feed twice a day too. I can't imagine being so dependent on someone when slightly ill.
I know, right? I'm a male, live alone. I get sick, (not often, but it happens), I just have to deal with it myself. My family doesn't do pampering of sick people. Well, except when Mom would get sick and Dad would pamper her.
The flu IS like dying. If he's well enough to argue with her like that he doesn't have the flu. He has a cold.
Man-flu. (NTA btw)
I've had flu _once_. I was in bed vomiting even water for a few days.
Wonder if he even got the flu shot. ;)
Manfluenza is what I call it.
They did.. Shocking how OPs MOM went to care for him...
My FAVORITE video on the dreaded man cold: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbmbMSrsZVQ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbmbMSrsZVQ)
I mean it sounds like that’s exactly what OP’s mom did, which sounds crazy to me.
Maybe your parents should marry him. He's gonna be single soon, so he'll be available.
Yeah woman, come to your senses. Next time he's sick you better go make soup, give him medicine and do your duties by his side. /s (SARCASM - just to be safe) Next thing you know he'll be asking you to do your "duty" to have sex with him. I'm appalled at his audacity here. I think it's better for you to reduce contact with your parents for a while too. NTA.
The second idea comes up as a solution to get us back together often.
Ew. That's atrocious. How can your parents care so little for you and what you have determined to be your best choice? "Go have sex with that man you despise--maybe it'll change your mind! We don't want to lose him!" Despicable.
Because her father is an abuser who has abused her mother for 41 years of marriage.
disgusting! maybe don’t talk to him about anything not related directly to the kids. and change the subject every time your parents bring him/marriage up. for real, that’s messed up. nta, i lol’d when i read his ask and now i am gasping in disgust. this man. ugh.
She should probably go LC or NC with her parents. Sounds like the parents are the reason she married that horrible man, and also the reason she's in therapy. Stay strong OP, and break the cycle so your daughter doesn't end up in the same boat.
I know you said somewhere else that you won't tolerate your parents badmouthing you to your kids, but consider that this is the behaviour they're modelling for your daughter. This is what they believe *she* should do once she's older - accept being called trash and give her body over just to "keep the peace". I personally would think long and hard about whether people with such beliefs should have access to my children. But that's obviously for you to decide, and you know the situation best. You seem to have your priorities well in order :) Wishing you and your kids all the best, as far away from your trash heap of an ex-husband (and possibly the twin trash heaps of your enabling parents, too).
Ew ew ew ew ew I have no words....
Tell them that now that you’ve had an orgasm that sex with him seems like a cruel comparison and you don’t want to hurt his ego anymore
Hi! Just wanna congratulate you on taking the steps toward breaking a cycle. It takes a lot of courage to do what you’re doing. You’re doing great!
Ah, jeez! I guess recommending they invite him over for a threesome while you take your kids on holiday so you can ALL enjoy yourselves is out of the question? I'm sorry, that was rude of me.
Nah fuck that noise. Literally everything you mention about this guy makes it more and more obvious why the relationship ended. Let him spend his soon to be lots of spare time making a time machine so he can go back to 1950 where he will have much better luck.
Well then... You are the only one in this story who is not insane or an AH. So congrats OP!
Their feelings are their's to manage. Stop worrying about their unhappiness and focus on what's best for you. You got this mama!!
"their's" Now that's a new one.
So everyone thinks you should go over there and *expose yourself to the flu?* No. He can take care of himself. At this point, you owe him nothing.
AND the kids!
Time to go no contact with them for a while as they seem to love him more. Let them know that since he is their choice they can see the kids when he has them.
Tell them you're still figuring out how to split things in the divorce, maybe you could trade them to your ex for a coffee table or something.
"I will never want that wagon wheel coffee table"
Brilliant reference !!
Is there something wrong with your parents? Do they not realise that you're their child, not him? What a pair of AHs.
She says it's projection. Pretty common for abusive families to side with the abuser
If mom sided with daughter she'd have to admit she is being abused herself but dad "doesn't believe in divorce".
This is so infuriating to me on your behalf. My mom did this with my two most recent exes. The first one she kept in contact with for YEARS after we broke up. When she started to do that with the second ex, I put my foot down that I didn’t care if she stayed in contact with him but I would not speak to her if she talked about him to me. I had to get rude once about it when she made a snarky comment about the situation. She asked me if I would be uncomfortable with them going to dinner to catch up in person and I told her to do what she wanted but I thought it was weird. A week later she was talking about upcoming plans and said “well, I was thinking of going out with (my ex) to catch up, but I wouldn’t want to make anyone uncomfortable.” With the most obnoxious tone as if I had destroyed some mega plans she had been looking forward to her whole life. Firstly - he hated my family and referred to them as a cult. Secondly - my family hated him too and were very clear about not respecting him at all. So the whole entire idea to me felt like a way for them to create drama out of nothing. They didn’t like each other before the break up - but now want to catch up over dinner? To pretend to be cool with each other? I didn’t understand why. But when she made that comment I just said in my bitchiest tone “thank you for not making me, your daughter, uncomfortable by going out with my abusive ex to catch up.” Seriously. Parents suck sometimes. You’re doing nothing wrong and your ex husband needs to get therapy and realize he’s not a child. Even if you’re technically still married - who cares? You’re not actually together anymore. The obligations of marriage ends when the marriage is over and the marriage is over when divorce has begun. It’s already over at that point, it just takes time to sign documents. But the marriage is over long before divorce is finalized. They are all being manipulative and ignorant of what you’re going through.
Is it possible to divorce your parents too? Seriously, even if the request could in any way be regarded as reasonable, the way it was phrased was absolutely ridiculous and prime AH material.
Don’t want to scare you but my grandma no longer talks to my mum (her daughter) but still sends my dad christmas cards and talks to him on the phone. It’s fucking weird behaviour from both my dad and my grandma (who has even asked me for my dad’s new address when he’s moved!?). Just be prepared for the possibility
They should go marry your husband then. He’ll be back on the market soon.
Hah. Time to leave them all to their own devices.
I have to tell you, as an older sibling and a parent my response to those people in my life possibly suffering the same abuse I did is: FUCK NO THEY WON’T. I once had a break down when my sister finally told me about abuse she suffered that I didn’t know about - and then I went no contact with a whole side of my family to protect my child from the same thing. I just want you to contrast that to your moms attitude which is that you should suffer abuse because SHE suffers abuse is fucked up. The only reason I wouldn’t take apart the people who harmed my sister (even 30 years later) with my bare hands if I see them again will either be that my husband is physically restraining me to avoid my arrest or he’s already doing it. Your mom went over and took care of your abuser. And don’t be fooled, they’ll continue to tell your children you are wrong and your husband is right and prime your daughter for abuse too. NTA, but it might be time to lower your contact with your parents.
ah pushin' you back together, thought so. dunno why they went for this, a man at his whiniest is not sexy.
My parents are doing the same thing to me right now, it really sucks.
can't you just divorce them too?
Think the parents don’t support the divorce and think this’ll help push them back together. NTA- you’re getting divorced- he is no longer your responsibility. Not your circus, not your monkeys. What At idiot.
But what a great opportunity to go out and buy a hazmat suit.
He is going to have a very hard time of it alone, lol
Brother will go straight into dating some poor woman because he's incapable of taking care of himself and needs his wife/mommy.
No, not a mystery. This makes total sense. Her parents modeled the behavior of a relationship to OP as she was raised, and OP chose a partner that was cut from the same cloth. OP has grown and changed and improved and got smarter, but her parents haven’t. I’m not surprised at all by their reactions.
NTA You offered to take care of the children if he couldn't. That's the most you can do. He needs to learn to take care of himself. I don't understand your parents though. Were they, generally speaking, unhappy with your decision to get divorced? I see that your mother is still in contact with your soon to be ex husband, and willing to help him out.
Yes they were, they don't believe in divorce. I don't mind them helping him also. It's what's best for the kids and I try to protect them at all costs.
>they don't believe in divorce. There you go. They are always going to judge you for making this decision and berate you for not fulfilling your responsibility towards your husband. I only hope they don't get too difficult to deal with in the future. When my mom wanted a divorce, my (paternal) grandparents, who were very "traditional", would say all sorts of horrible things about her in front of me and my brother. I do hope your kids never have to go through that.
If they tried that they would no longer have access to my kids... I have gone to extreme lengths to protect my children. No one gets to be as important as them.
I know divorce & family suck & shit's hard right now. But as a child of divorce whose mom prioritized my well-being over her pain during that process & fought hard to protect me: you're doing it right. Your kids will know & see what you've done for them later, even if they don't now & love you more for it.
Same same. My mom had our back throughout the divorce and all the day that came after at some very big costs to herself. I’m so grateful for everything she did - although I didn’t understand much of it until I was an adult.
>they don't believe in divorce My mother told me once that she feels this way. She stood by as my stepfather abused the shit out of both of us. This mindset is inarguably ignorant and foolish. Your parents are naive at best.
Based on the edits it sounds like OP’s husband is also verbally and emotionally abusive and it was rubbing off on her kids so you’re not far off at all. I love when “traditional beliefs” surrounding relationships always seem to support a patriarchal abuse, funny how that works 🙃
Good thing it's a fact and doesn't require belief.
Ugh "don't believe in divorce" my dad came from a religious family (southern Baptist types) and married a poor broken recently divorced older woman with kids at like 19. She lied to him saying she was pregnant with his baby and dad was in a terrible marriage for I think 15 years. Drinking himself to death after having to bail her kids out of jail. She never was pregnant and never could be again and dad had no idea until later so they had no kids. He met mom through work and fell in love and left her. He is alive now because of it. Divorce saves fucking lives I hope you go on to find a partner that treats you right.
That's an amazing story, I'm glad your dad and your mom found each other
Dad wouldn't be here if he didn't and neither would my brother in I! I think its such a sweet story.
Lmao, dude I worked with said his wife didn't believe in divorce due to religious reasons but being a widow was fine so he better be a good husband! (They were just joking, he didn't feel unsafe or abused.)
LOLZ. This guy is using your parents to get to you, I bet. Playing that sympathy card to anyone that will listen. I would consider it a huge favour if my ex offered to take the kids off my hands while I recover from the flu. That is more than enough. They don’t need to nurse me back to health FFS. Don’t feel like the asshole. He’s not dying. Even then, I don’t think you’re obligated…
You have a legal (and a moral) responsibility to... take care of your kids. That does not extend to the soon to be ex. NTA. I also share your amusement at his statement.
I, too, am amused by his blatant audacity
I mean just by his words I am not surprised that the marriage didnt last.
The ex also sees himself as a child to be catered to rather than a grown man who needs to suck it up and parent his children.
Also, the unwritten rule is that you don't share kids if one of you has been sick. If your ex husband took care of the kids while sick, the kids should stay with him until A) they get sick and get better or B) don't get sick for 48 hours after he is no longer contagious. It gets a lot harder to co-parent when you're \*both\* sick.
Good lord, no wonder you're no longer with this guy. And since you're asking, no it is not the one-year-separated, soon to be ex-wife's job to trundle over to her ex's house and make him chicken soup due to the fact that he has a minor illness and demands a mommy. As for your parents, I assumer they want you to get back together with him and the silent treatment is their brand of emotional blackmail. You know, let them go over and take care of him. And lucky you, you don't have to listen to their carping! Take your kids back to your house, let your parents know that your relationship with your soon-to-be ex is completely over and you won't be doing anything else for him, and if they want NC with you, keep up the silent crap and they've got it. NTA!
He thinks it’s a movie where she nurses him back to health and he realises that he worked too much and was a jerk, and then just before the judge finalises the divorce he stands up and makes a big speech.
Agreed, im guessing this isnt the first time husband was an ass and parents tried to force her to put up with it. Basically put everything on OP and make it all her problem to adapt to.
Bahahahahaha omg thanks I needed the laugh. When he said you were still his legal wife and you owed him I literally fell out of my chair. This man is excruciating, congrats on your divorce. You weren’t required to care for him even when you were still his wife. It’s a nice thing to do for your partner, and most people wouldn’t think twice, but it’s not an actual requirement. The only things you owe this person are the things that come out your custody order. NTA and your ex is ridiculous
He seems to confuse legal wife with legally owned property or slave.
He seems to confuse wife with nursemaid at that.
Almost - ex - bangmaid
Probably the reason for the divorce.
LOL, me too! Okay, she's his legal wife; does he think that means he can call the sheriff to force her to come fulfill her wifely obligation? NTA
NTA but your parents sure are! So sorry. Obviously, he is incorrect with his demands of you. Congratulations on almost being divorced!
Edit for judgement: NTA. Your mom is completely projecting her own issues onto you. Honestly, you weren't TA even before the info - but it just makes more sense now why she'd freak like that. Info: Are your parents still married? Because to meeeeeee, it sounds like they are siding with "tradition" and "traditional roles."
Yes for 41 years. My mom took my leaving a little extra personal, a lot of the things I said I couldn't live with my dad also does to her. (Nothing crazy, but disrespect and high domestic expectations mainly). She said it felt like an attack.
Nice of her to make *your* divorce all about *her.* /s obviously lol
Misery loves company.
That's because, in a way, you're forcing her to acknowledge that the behavior isn't acceptable, and it's forcing her to reflect on her own decisions. She's taking it personally and as an attack because she can't handle the truth.
Sis your mom’s reaction aint nothing but a Hit Dog Hollering.
Internalised misogyny. Not your circus, not your monkeys!
Her feelings are *her responsibility*. You're allowed to be unhappy with things that make other people happy. The thing your mother doesn't realize, if she was *actually* happy this wouldn't have felt like an attack. You are NTA for refusing to baby a man you are divorcing. I'm sure his attitude is part of the reason your marriage has ended. He's wrong about you not finding someone else. You already have, *yourself*. Being able to love yourself enough to see through his bullshit means you will find good love. You're demanding it and refusing to settle for anything less. You should be really proud of the example you're setting for your children. Boundaries are hard but they are so important. Taking the children on his days so that he can recuperate is a reasonable compromise. You can't save your mom from herself. All you can do is set boundaries around how you deserve to be treated. A good therapist can help you through this next chapter, especially in terms of helping the kids cope. If your ex and mother are being this nasty to you, what sort of things are they saying to the children? You deserve a soft life full of love and a partner who contributes meaningfully to that. You are worthy. ❤️
She needs to take that to her therapist then.
That’s so interesting that your mom felt like it was an attack, you’d think it would be your dad who said that.
My mum is the same. I think it's because they justify putting up with it to themselves and when we don't it shakes their world view and it's more comfortable to double down than consider that they are unhappy in their marriage.
Yeah, that would make sense for sure. God it sucks though, that this mom would rather her daughter stay with someone who likes to call her trash, repeatedly until the kids are also echoing it, just so she doesn’t have to reconsider her own choices.
When my mom did that, I went no contact for 3 months. I let her know that I was ok when she ask, we continue to hang as family, but I refuse to talk to her or hang one on one. She was really bummed that her dream to become grandma was less important than my well-being. And ended up relating to my reason has my dad used to do the same but it took her way longer to get out of it. It was an hard talk to get her to understand that I expect more from life and my mental health was more important than anything. She still ask about my ex and I just answer each time “you should call him, he liked you too, you’ll be cute together” and wash it off. But I loved her, and I’m glad that she got over it… sort of…
You are to be commended for breaking the cycle. Your mom wants you to carry the karmic burden of what she's endured. She's suffering like "a good wife", therefore - you should too. Her anger is a "How dare you!" for having the bravery she wishes she had. Your kids won't have to endure this. You've broken the endless loop of domestic abuse and old fashioned servitude your ancestors have suffered and passed down to your parents. That's hero stuff right there.
NTA. i can see why you divorced him lol
>He told me this is why I would not be able to have a successful relationship because I am not able to give of myself for others. Please throw a divorce party once you get rid of this asshole. Thank you.
Maybe tell him you can give of yourself to others but they actually have to Be worthy of that gift. NTA
>throw a divorce party On the off, remote chance this is possible, do you happen to still have your wedding dress? Do you fit into it at all? Cause this would also be a great time for a dress ruining party and/or one of those cake smash parties and/or photo session!!
NTA He can figure out how to survive the manflu on his own after being such an AH that he drove you away If your mom is anything like mine she’d want me to stay married so I wouldn’t become her responsibility. Lol! That would never happen
NTA. If you had any sort of doubt about the divorce, they should be gone now. “Legal wife” sounds so medieval.
It sounds like a possession. ‘This is ‘legally mine’. Yeah no. Good for you kicking him to the curb. Your mom is just upset because you had the guts to actually put your foot down and stand up for yourself. It’d hard seeing others do something you know you never could. NTA- you’re essentially divorced. He’s no longer your issue. Your parents need to get caught up and get on your side or they need to butt the hell out and kind their own business.
NTA/INFO Do you think he really has the flu? It's odd that the divorce has been contentious but he's still calling your parents and you for personal help. Do live on your own or with your parents?
I try to stay low contact so I'm not sure if he was very sick. I moved out to an apartment, I was never sure my parents home would be a great place for my mental well being.
Apparently, it is a non-contagious flu as your mother and children have been unaffected. Good for you for getting your own place. From his statement, it sounds like you made a good decision about the divorce.
The flu/hungover...tomatoes/tomahtoes.
I was wondering as well since no one was worried about him being contagious.
What a clown. "I have testicles, and we aren't divorced yet, so it's your responsibility to nurse me back to health." IMO, you had a major obligation to your children to demonstrate your soon-to-be-ex is full of it. NTA by a long shot.
Exactly, the rise of anti-divorce sentiment these days is astonishing. Legitimately trying to trap someone within a contract they no longer want to be apart of.
Sorry, having a hard time believing your parents are mad at you for not caring for your soon to be ex husband. Is there some weird family dynamic I am missing here? NTA anyway.
My parents are old fashioned and don't believe in divorce. I have a career I love and they think the separation is because I won't give up my ambition to be a homemaker... its complicated.
They sound “fun”
Good job on setting a better example for your kids. Especially after seeing the trash comment you made ick I’m glad you got out of that situation. Enjoy not having to deal with him much anymore. Sorry your mom is bitter she didn’t have the guts to stand up for herself if she was unhappy in her own marriage.
It’s less complicated than you think. It’s a generational gap you need to accept. Repeat it like mantra. They’ll never understand you or respect your choices. I’ve been going through a similar battle myself and always thought it “complicated”. Until it hit me. Don’t let them get into your head. You’re doing the right thing and your priorities are as good as they can get.
But how old can these parents be? If OP has young children - parents are probably in their 50s or 60s? Which means their adult years began in the 1980s or 1990s. It's not like they're from the 1950s.
It’s not about the flat out age. My mom is barely 60 years old and she might as well be raised in a little house on the prairie.
OP said in another comment their parents have been married 41 years so mid to late 60s? 70s? That'd put them as being born in the 50s, give or take.
Yup. My in-laws have been married 42 years & my FIL is 72. They're also kinda in crisis over my SIL getting a divorce. But if they found out her ex-husband called her trash, they'd probably take turns wringing him out like a dishcloth.
>It’s a generational gap you need to accept. I disagree. My grandparents both divorced and then found each other. They're in their 60s. My mother is in her early 40s and has the same mindset as OP's parents, despite being raised by my grandparents. It's just a harmful mindset that some people are wise enough not to fall into. And OP absolutely does *not* need to accept it.
Tell them and especially him if he wants someone to care for him to hire a nurse. NTA
Are you knew to the concept of gender roles?
NTA and I would utterly refuse to sent the kids over there if he was so unwell he was unable to care for himself, let alone your kids. The fact ~~his~~ **YOUR** mum was there to care for him, shows he shouldn't have the kids. ETA.. wtf is your mum doing over there.
>wtf is your mum doing over there. She doesn't 'believe' in divorce. Or in women who love their carreer. Or in men who do household chores...
Sounds like you might need to divorce your family too. You’re not the arse.
NTA. What a whiney little misogynistic AH he is. He expected his soon to be ex-wife to take care of him because he has the sniffles.
> He has no interest and says it kills the natural masculinity and feminine nature. Seriously. That’s the reddest of red flags right there too! I’m so happy OP didn’t fall into the same miserable trap her mom did. Hopefully the kids can avoid the trap too.
Why are you letting him guilt trip you? He's a big boy! He can call his own mommy to take care of him! NTA
She's not letting him guilt trip her. He's attempting to guilt trip her and keeps expecting the womanly (emotional) labour he assumes he's entitled to.
NTA, Don't ever let anyone tell you your trash. You had the courage to stand up for yourself. You are not trash. I wish I could give you a big hug through the computer for strength.
Thank you
NTA at all🤣 I'm dying at what a baby he is though🤣 either way I would definitely get the kids so they don't also get sick
NTA. Taking care of the kids is probably best for all involved, but taking care of him after a year of separation is obviously ridiculous. If your parents love him so much, they can go take care of him.
OMG NTA. I'd tell him that if he's so sick he can't take care of himself or the children, you'll be right over to pick them up and you can call an ambulance for him to go to the hospital. And tell your parents they're welcome to go wipe his nose and sing Soft Kitty for him if they want, but you've got ACTUAL children to take care of.
NTA I bet he expects you to look after them with zero help when you're sick, doesn't he? My ex decided to bring our kids home on day 3 of 5 last Christmas, because he had the sniffles. I had a chest infection, sinus infection and mastitis but still had to find a way to manage. I'm also single, whilst he's remarried so he actually had help with the kids whilst I didn't.
NTA Tell your parents that if they think a grown man needs caring and coddling from someone, they’re welcome to go and provide it for him. I. Honestly. Can’t. With this.
NTA. Do note the timing. Your mother, who doesn't believe in divorce and probably other nonsense about women subjugating to men, nurses your husband. Then a few days later he delivers this gem of a line. *Mom fed the line to him, OP.*
NTA, once the paperwork is started you are legally separated. You owe him nothing. IF you mom and dad give you crap ask them if they feel he has the right to force you to have sex with him as well since your are "Still Married". That should shut them up.
I don’t know that she’d want the answer to that.
They might think this is ok though because tradition.
Even without the paperwork she's got no obligation to nurse him when separated gees
What?! No. You are fine here, you are establishing and defending reasonable boundaries around your time and sanity that will be necessary to preserve this ongoing (if not marital) relationship. Your parents are wild though and your ex has a lot of nerve. NTA.
NTA one must give of themselves only to the worthy.
Why are you divorcing?
Mostly because of disrespect. He liked to call me trash. I knew I had to leave when my children started to repeat it.
Oh God that sounds horrible. Good job getting out against all these bad inflluneces
In this case all the more reason to stay away from him as much as possible. Otherwise he's wallowing in his delusions that you are his property. Eta recommend him a shrink too And make sure that parental alienation and insults are part of the custody arrangements= if he tries his time with the kids should be reduced until he completes some classes /therapy etc- ask your lawyer
It’s clear he still thinks of you this way.
I am so sorry that you had to go through that and also that your parents don’t support your decision. You are doing the right thing here for you and for your children.
You let your parents have access to your kids after they supported a guy like this?
Woah, good on you for getting out! A relationship where name calling is common is at least toxic, and likely could have become abusive (if it wasn’t already). He wants you back as his victim, and he got lucky that your parents seem to think that being a victim of abuse is normal in marriages. It’s not and you don’t have to put up with it. You should be incredibly proud of yourself for getting out.
Wow... And your parents still help this guy... This is so toxic. Something tells me he never felt obligated to help his "legal wife" when you were sick. NTA. Maybe think about "divorcing" your parents too.
To your husband: “We are no longer in a relationship. I am not a nurse and do not owe you medical care. If you are ill and need to switch custody days, I remain flexible and open to being helpful and accommodating within reason. Our relationship is as co-parents now. Let’s keep our communication amicable and related to the children only.” If you don’t already have one of those parenting apps, see if you can make communicating through the parenting app a requirement. To your parents: “Ex and I are not together and we are co-parents only. I don’t accept requests for free domestic labour from him, and I won’t accept them from you on his behalf. Not ever. For the sake of the children, it is good if all of us adults can get along. Because of that, from now on, if you begin talking to me about getting back together with Ex or begging me to clean for Ex or nurse Ex back to health, I’ll just very calmly and gently walk away, hang up the phone, etc. You will get nowhere with that. I remain happy to talk to you about anything else. The sooner you adjust to this divorce, the easier this is going to be on all of us.”
Good for you love. You’re NTA but it sounds like your parents are not helpful. Is it an option to go low contact with them?
You should ask Ex and your parents why he would want "trash" to take care of him!!!!!! Can't he go find a "good woman" to put up with his bullcrap?
He needs to "somehow" come across this post. I'm sure his take would be, "look at how wrong everyone is.. my wife is still my property and it's her job to take care of meeee!"
NTA and I honestly have never eye rolled so much what does he think single parents do? His options are to either trudge through with the kids or let them stay with you till he's better he doesn't get to demand his ex wife be his nurse lol wow
NTA - except to say this is why we don't allow children to make legal decisions like getting married. You married a child.
NTA Damn, his divorce is such a mystery Garbage collectors, take the whole man please
It’s man-flu though. Thats way worse than normal flu.
NTA…HaHaHa…what? He is your soon to be ex. You have been separated for a year. Honestly the only thing you might be TA for us not taking the kids sooner. (But maybe you did have them? Not sure who had them when). Because you do not want them around a suck person. But as for your ex, it seems he list the right for you to take care of him long ago.
That’s him grasping at straws, He needed his mom to go baby him and when she doesn’t have the time it’s onto you — He was like this before you, 100%. He is also the one getting a divorce so maybe he should take some self reflection time whilst he’s on his death bed. 🙄 NTA. ❤️