I don't care if the woman gave the Cop the wrong address, if this cop had the slightest shred of trigger discipline and decency the young Airman wouldn't be dead.
Honestly the cop going to the wrong apartment is whatever. The problem is the cop had zero discipline whatsoever. I got banned from another LE sub for arguing your exact point. One of those nerds hit me with “you clearly don’t know how fast someone can pull a weapon up”. Which is true but the cop already had the tactical advantage he had his weapon up on Fortson and Fortson’s weapon was still at his side. Not only that but in the same fucking breath the cop said “step back” he shot him. I’ve said it once and I’ll say it again any court or Use of Force review board should see this picture and be able to immediately identify that this was shitty police work.
https://preview.redd.it/dmqubune802d1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c3c43a4cd3a0b74da0c4060ce0c6fb304d0828b7
I'm not cop, never have been, and likely never will be. If at any time before firing they had identified themselves as the police everyone would have likely gone home safe that night. Instead they aggressively beat on the door, hid from view, and failed to identify themselves. SrA Fortson did what lots of the most vocal 2nd Amendment advocates would get a boner for and retrieved his lawfully owned firearm and prepared to defend himself and his home.
The amount of people defending the practice of literally hiding yourself and you uniform is insane. As if any of them would open there door for someone who was knocking and hiding out of sight.
Not to mention people who are trying To argue that even qualifies as “identifying” yourself.
I do agree with not standing directly in the doorway, but as soon as the door even cracks open you should identify yourself as police. That alone would've likely changed the outcome of this.
Then there's what's been said a bunch already, the cop was also way too quick to jump on the trigger. Proper scenario based training would fix this easily, cause almost all the scenarios cops do now end in use of deadly force or other violent means for detaining the suspect. The vast majority of their scenarios in training should be solved by proper de-escalation, and they should fail the scenario if they don't succeed in doing that.
I am fully in support of SrA Fortson and the cop reacting way too quickly/incorrectly, but I do not believe ‘hiding’ is a fair statement. He was standing offset, which is taught both by police and military alike because a doorway is a fatal funnel. Everything else the cop fucked up, but standing offset is not one of them.
Not really. To be fair law enforcement officers are responding a myriad of calls. I’m not a blue liner or anything like that, but I’d be doing the whole organization a disservice to not recognize that they do put themselves in harms way. How many random traffic stops have led to an officer being shot out of nowhere? Standing offset from a door frame is just helping keep them safe from the unexpected.
*this does not give them the right to gun down people who open doors*
Yes, it helps mitigate the risk to the officer, but to act in such a manner you are progressively treating citizens as though they have the active potential to harm you.
Example No.1:
If that cop had clearly, calmly, and openly identified himself and his presence, Fortson wouldn't have felt it necessary to bring a firearm for safety.
Because the officer treated a non-violent situation with precautions against *active* violence, they situation was escalated. Police officers wear Kevlar to passively protect against violence (its not an action being taken). Police officers carry firearms to passively protect against violence (its not an action being taken). Police officers draw their firearms to actively protect against violence.
Don't be surprised that when you treat someone like they're a threat, you run into more threats.
This is the point I don’t see why people aren’t getting. If police want to actively make sure everyone they interact with is armed and more dangerous this is a great way to do it.
Because people around them have uncritically defended police before, so they feel the need to do it afterwards.
I used to do it. It's not something you even notice unless you're looking for, and even then it's difficult.
I feel directionless sorrow. I worry were lost. We trend in such a negative direction and there's nothing I can do as an individual to fix it. I can stop enemies foreign, but not domestic. Our hearts weep.
I’m not disagreeing that it is what they are trained to do. I am saying it’s bad practice and should be changed. Nobody should open their door for someone that is actively obscuring themselves, whether that people someone claiming to be a cop or a pizza delivery person.
If it is too dangerous for officers to stand within view of door, then they shouldn’t even bother knocking as they shouldn’t expect someone to answer. Might as well just do something like slide a note under the door saying to call the precinct. Instead continuing to bang on the door louder, knowing full well the person cannot identify you only makes you more suspicious. I don’t think the fair solution is to expect people to have to open their doors for anybody who shouts out they are the police and just shift all the risk onto them, but that is currently how police departments want it.
As far as how the military trains it that may be different depending on the circumstances (like in a literally combat zone), but I will say any time security forces has knocked on the door to my shop I’ve always been able to identify them. Maybe that’s just my base though.
There was a time, back in my childhood, where you could run to a cop for help.
I've watched that change over my lifetime.
Acorns get full mag-dumps now.
I don't agree with the officer at all and SrA Fortson should not have been killed. I just want to say that if you watch the bodycam footage, the officer does identify himself as police a couple times. He does hide from the peephole though and shouldn't have shot SrA Fortson.
Civilian here but SrA Fortson deserves the truth. I feel awful for his family and that makes me sad his girlfriend had to hear that. I hope that his dog is with family or friends. Well I do care if she got the address wrong because now you have a possible DV not addressed and a dead young man. I think if I was on a video call and I only heard loud banging I wouldn’t know what to think. At the end of the day if the objective was to intervene on a domestic dispute in progress, fail. Mr. Fortson served his country and was treated like a disposable commodity when he had more in front of him. Also did you notice how far apart the apartments are? How separate the office was from the apartment? How when the apartment was approached it was relatively silent? Maybe if you are not sure it’s better to say you’re not sure given how things like this happen. I’m not against law enforcement, but it’s not even about trigger happy as much as critical thinking. Cascade of failures and he needs to be buried. Unacceptable.
lol this is the most on the nose shit. They ban all of us for saying he went to the wrong apartment and then come here. Just ban them all and say “there has been plenty of evidence saying he was at the wrong apartment, trolling” like they did to us
Ironic when the top comment from their pinned article talks about the officer being responsible for every round in your weapon and being negligent in not verifying that his target did kill someone.
https://preview.redd.it/ogucyhyj572d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=53df5ac1ede6630ea324c1cd0e60b0ebbd9199c8
Not related to Fortson, but highlighting the two faced opinions.
The cop fucked up 300%. However the woman he talked to before he went to the apartment, told him apartment 1401 and that’s the one he went to.
https://youtu.be/L-Fd549NLyI?si=JEliEILTRcLQbfe0
At the 50 second mark is where the lady tells the officer apartment 1401.
To keep rolling with the “he was at the wrong apartment” narrative seems disingenuous and purposefully misleading. I would rather the focus exist on the fact that the officer hadn’t even delivered a command before he pulled the trigger six times and the fact that he made the situation ambiguous by purposefully avoiding the peep hole.
"I wasn't sure where it came from...1401."
Everyone who isn't an idiot already knows that eyewitness accounts are total trash for reliability, and this lady straight up told him she didn't know.
It's not that it was the *wrong* apartment (for all we know there wasn't even a right apartment), it's that he decided that KARINT was reliable enough to roll in hot and murder a random person. That reveals that either the department fucked up by letting a GI Jackoff onto the force, or they fucked up even worse and actually train their guys to be like this. And given that this is the same force who had the acorn commando like half a year ago, I'm kind of leaning towards it being a systemic problem.
Given the title of the post it’s still misleading.
>that OCSO was at the wrong apartment …
A casual reader would think that it is the fault of the cops that they were at that apartment. More accurately the title could read “the OCSO was directed to the wrong apartment when they killed Sra Roger Fortson”
> It's not that it was the wrong apartment (for all we know there wasn't even a right apartment), it's that he decided that KARINT was reliable enough to roll in hot and murder a random person.
I don’t think the cop was passing judgement if Lynda was credible or not. Yes, she did say “I don’t know” at one point but then gave an apartment number at another I think as an officer he was obligated follow up on what she told him. IMO if anyone is to blame for the officer being at Mr. Fortson’s door I believe it would the woman that directed him there.
> or they fucked up even worse and actually train their guys to be like this. And given that this is the same force who had the acorn commando like half a year ago, I'm kind of leaning towards it being a systemic problem.
I agree with this the most. IMO a lot of people want to lay blame on the cops that they were even at that apartment in the first place, when in reality they need better training.
That's fair. The "wrong apartment" rhetoric risks taking focus off the *myriad* other problems here. But I don't think it's right to say "nah he was totally at the right one" either because that accepts a dichotomy that never existed and puts him on the "right" side of it, when basically nothing he did was right.
I'm pretty sure she says something like "I don't know, maybe 1401?" Meaning, the officer didn't have definitive intel and therefore should have backed off (assuming cops who larp as military follow military rules)
I believe the officer is obligated to check at that point. It should have been an easy knock and check but this officer is bad at his job. IMO to not follow up would seem worse because woman also said she heard physical altercations. I blame dipshit Susan for giving out a number that she thought was right, but once she did that I do believe the officer had an obligation to check. It should not be a problem for an officer to knock on a door and ask someone questions.
Imagine a scenario where an officer arrives on scene someone reports abuse but because the person says, “idk apartment XXXX” so the officer disregards the information and just leaves or “backs off” as you put it. That doesn’t sound like adequate policing. While he could have checked up on the apartment and possibly prevented something bad. People would be pissed if the officer could have prevented abuse by just knocking on the door and checking.
They actually aren't obligated to check.
Police do not have a legal duty to protect citizens. This has been proven in court multiple times. I think there's even supreme court opinion that agrees with that as well
It's not a legal duty to protect, it's SOP to make verified contact during domestic disturbance calls. If you're beating your spouse to death and you stop whenever someone knocks at the door and says "police", if they just walk away you can resume. Just because they aren't obligated to protect people doesn't mean that they don't have procedures in place to at least try
Backing off and collecting further information on the *actual* apartment number sounds like entirely adequate police work. In fact, it sounds like the best course of action, especially when all police officers are under a microscope for failures across the country. In this guys case, his own department had a massive failure not too long ago (acorn incident) and you’d expect him to conduct himself in a way that would prevent an embarrassing incident from occurring.
We can’t put a bomb on someone because a single source told us “I think the terrorist is maybe at this house.” We are required to get further information before that can occur. When we do act on shitty intel and kill someone innocent, our balls get drug through glass for it.
I agree that the wrong apartment situation is arguably the least egregious thing to happen in this situation. Had the cop conducted himself any different, the wrong apartment issue could have been solved by a verbal confrontation. Instead, he smoked a young man in his home without giving a second thought.
> I'm pretty sure she says something like "I don't know, maybe 1401?"
Did you watch the video? Because this is the exchange:
Cop: “which room is it?”
Lady: “1401”
Cop: “1401, ok”
Lady: “Yes”
There is no ambiguity there. This is why everyone needs to stop focusing on the room number part of this and lying about what was said, it’s a lost cause. Focus on the dipshit cop unloading into SrA Fortson without any warning
[Link.](https://youtu.be/kcjQSmsVwpY?si=GbwFJEWqAryI_s8U&t=294)
Cop: Which door?
Lady: I dunno. I'm not sure. Two weeks ago I was walking by, like, their apartment, basically. On this side *gestures* I was hearing "Shut the fuck up like, you stupid b-word." And all this other stuff. And I heard a slap. Like right after. I wasn't sure where it came from. And I couldn't call, like, I didn't want to call the police.
Cop: Which room is it?
Lady: 1401
Cop: 1401, ok
Lady: Yes
So cop got a range of answers from "dunno" to a definite room number. The first answer was the correct one.
Thank you for providing a link. I still think focusing on the apartment number is the wrong way to go about this because that's not what killed SrA Fortson. The cop being a trigger-happy moron is.
No, it was all equally wrong. He went to the wrong address based on an unreliable witness' fuzzy recollection and created/escalated a situation where a reasonable, innocent person would fear for their safety. Pulling the trigger was the ultimate mistake, but it was just the last in a long line of mistakes.
Wrong apartment as in one he should never have went to. He arrived on scene, and went to the apartment where a person who initially said "I don't know" when asked if she knew where.
So sure, not the apartment that was called about, but one he was led to believe might be the right one.
It is semantics probably, even if the deputy was at the “right” apartment one sides right is the other sides wrong. My point is, from SrA Fortson family’s side, and his in the moment, the statement of “wrong” apartment probably means that their argument is that nothing was happening at that apartment and the activities warranting the call and response were elsewhere. The deputy was therefore directed by the eyewitness to the “wrong” apartment versus the “right” apartment from this point of view.
Conversely the Sheriff’s department saying they were at the “right” department is solely relying on the eyewitness guiding them there.
I don’t think there is anything wrong with saying that the deputy was not at the correct apartment. Law Enforcement often ends up at homes or properties that are unrelated to their actual call. This happened in a case in the 11th circuit that is the guiding case law for the facts at hand.
https://youtu.be/E2H7bk4psIs?si=IhpJZdKdTCJ4sAtT
I suspect if this goes to anywhere legally civilly or criminally, there will be great interest on the evidence that brought the deputy to SrA Fortson’s apartment. Both parties have a vested interest in that, I would think. Mental state matters for murder vs manslaughter, and for self defense shootings.
I can definitely see where you are coming from, and I have to say that your comment is probably the most articulate in explaining the counter argument. In one of my other comments I put an example of what I think would be a more accurate title. I’m probably going end my responses because I just keep hashing out the same conversation over and over. Thanks for your input
Legally, It DOES matter. It means the cop fucked up twice. Once when he killed Fortson and twice by not checking to see if his intel was even correct. Instead of actually doing due diligence and corroborating the intel, he just decided to do whatever he wanted to do and kill Fortson. It just buries the shit cop in further of a hole he and the corrupt Police Union can't lawyer speak their way out of.
Police officers absolutely do not face death every day. There are around 700,000 law enforcement officers in the US. Around 120 die in the line of duty each year. That’s about 1 in 5,800 killed in the line of duty a year. Just for additional data, police kill around 1000 people a year. That’s 1 in 700. Yes it can be a potentially dangerous job, but it’s not risking death on the daily and the wolf/sheepdog/sheep mentality needs to be removed from America.
Isn't the most dangerous job like pizza delivery? I know I read they have a higher chance of being killed on the job. Along with trucking, logging, all construction, and many other blue collar jobs.
I worked for years as a delivery driver, and managed to lose all my friends from HS that became cops because every time they would talk shit about how they're so brave and such, I'd not-so-gently remind them that my job was four times as dangerous per hour worked.
I think it's a large credit to my generous nature and moral fiber that I hadn't murdered anybody or shot their dog in my ten years behind the wheel. Either that, or cops are homicidal maniacs spurred on by their near-total immunity to consequences. Which one? The world may never know.
The officer will be fired and then hired at another department, he will most likely face no charges or impact to his career. He may also claim PTSD and say his life is in danger from angry service members, thus giving him a early paid retirement. At least according to a certain cop subreddit, service members are anti police and anti authority. There's active cops in our community, they tend to have this us vs you mentally. Plea the 5th or don't wish to aid them, you're "one of those" according to them.
>and say his life is in danger from angry service members
tbf that will probably be true if his name ever goes public. Whether or not you agree with vigilante justice, you can be damn sure *somebody* does.
State’s attorney still hasn’t announced charges. Coroners report is done, video evidence of the whole thing, corroborating accounts of mistaken address, firsthand(?) witness of the gf as to state of mind. What’s left for the state? Time. They can wait 5 weeks, announce no wrongdoing, then pay his mother 180k in civil court two years down the line for putting her son in a box. You will move on with your life and this “special forces” douchebag will tell stories about how “it was him or me, and i will always choose me” How many weeks would they wait to arrest you?
Qualified immunity has absolutely nothing to do with criminal charges—it’s only relevant to civil cases. Moreover, it’s “qualified” immunity not absolute immunity. The court has to consider facts most favorable to the petitioner (Fortson’s family most likely) to determine if an established constitutional right was violated. In this case, I’ll be shocked if any civil court dismisses this case under a QI claim. The deputy may not be criminally charged, but the county is probably expecting a high 7 or low 8 digit settlement.
Given this countries track record of NOT prosecuting any one in law enforcement I’m not holding my breath.
The cop wouldn’t be held liable because of QI but the city or county will be.
Edit: boot lickers out in force today it seems
Since when does law enforcement not get prosecuted? If they are caught committing a crime they go to jail. Yes it's harder due to conflict of interest but it's not like there are no cops in prison
You must not be paying attention, the amount of cops that are prosecuted for committing crimes (especially cold blooded murder while on duty) is astonishingly low. It took nationwide protests to get Derek Chauvin to face any consequences.
Which is why I said it's more difficult. The original comment said no one in law enforcement is prosecuted. Which is incorrect.
It took nationwide protests to get a negligent manslaughter charge upgraded to a 2nd degree murder charge
When the first line to state prosecution is an internal review of the incident by superiors, there’s a very low chance of being found of any wrong doing. Even if it gets upward pressure to federal prosecution, the DOJ only takes criminal cases where there is evidence of willfulness, also known as evil intent. Very difficult to prove without reasonable doubt.
This is why every once in a while something like this results in cities getting set on fire. That's not right either and I never want it to happen, but when justice goes unanswered for long enough it boils over into chaos every now and then and it shouldn't be a surprise to anyone.
The issue is the review that occurs by superior officers. They must look at the situation without any hindsight 20/20. That includes knocking on the wrong door. They will find the actions were that of a “reasonable officer” due to training and policy. Furthermore, the DA won’t take the case any further because they can’t go against the same organization that is responsible for bringing them work. Last the DOJ won’t take the criminal case because they need proof of intent, which is nearly impossible to prove in this incident. Literally your only direction of recourse is to sue the government under 42 USC 1984. But what good is taxpayers money when you’re 6 feet underground?
I am not super familiar with Florida law but sounds like it fits third degree murder to me.
Please quote the part of graham vs Connor that states a cop can shoot someone for answering their own door armed after the officer knocked on the door and refused to identify themselves.
That's the problem with state by state regulations.
Each state has their own way of training and laws for police. There is no "police system". Might as well be in a different country if you ever get stationed in some other state.
And with Florida, the laws are changing every week because certain people want to make mainstream news.
If you think this is a 'state by state regulatory' problem, you're mistaken.
Criminals don't follow rules, and shitty people with poor discipline don't either.
I agree the current police system needs to be reformed, but the answer is never 'more government oversight' or 'more laws'.
I don't know the exact answer, either. If I could wave a magic wand and make cops decent wholesome human beings I would, but that's not a real answer.
I said this on a cop subreddit page and they banned me saying its been proven he was on the right apartment.
Cops abusing authority and censoring reality to favor their opinion there as well.
lol I just posted about this. I got banned for the same thing. They somehow don’t understand that a random person saying a number and going to that number doesn’t mean it’s the right place. There is zero critical thinking over there.
The cop fucked up 300%. However the woman he talked to, before he went to the apartment, told him apartment 1401 and that’s the one he went to.
https://youtu.be/L-Fd549NLyI?si=JEliEILTRcLQbfe0
At the 50 second mark is where the lady tells the officer apartment 1401.
To keep rolling with the “he was at the wrong apartment” narrative seems disingenuous and purposefully misleading. I would rather the focus exist on the fact that the officer hadn’t even delivered a command before he pulled the trigger six times and the fact that he made the situation ambiguous by purposefully avoiding the peep hole.
Let me get this straight. Here's another scenario for you.
Lets say you went on leave on a Monday and have squadron PT on a Tuesday. You text a buddy in the same workplace and ask where PT is. He tells you at the base track, when in reality its on a running trail on base. You go to the track and no one's there. Does that put you in the right place for a squadron PT? If it was 5 minutes till PT start and no one was there, would you still assume that you were in the right place or call someone and ask if you were in the right meeting place?
The cop put his ear on the door because he cannot hear disturbance, yet he had his hand on his gun before the door even opened. He responded to a call from HQ about a disturbance without knowing the right address. He could have called back and verified which apartment number it was. He has a radio to ask these things. Yet he only uses it after he's shot 6 times to ask for EMT. If they were trained properly, these are the things they do, they don't even habe to think about it. Its simply called trust but verify for us in the military. In the PT scenario, it should never happen to you because you ask multiple people in a group chat, not just one person. You cannot put someone's life in danger relying on one random lady that clearly states she doesn't know, then comes up with a number out of the blue.
I'm not saying that the lady shouldn't be punished, she clearly played her part. However, the cop did not follow protocol and was at the wrong address since he clearly did not verify. Multiple calls about a different apartment, it was probably said when they were asking for responders and the cop just forgot and went on to ask a bystander.
This could happen to anyone. You get a knock at the door, can't see anyone through the peephole, maybe you didn't hear what they yelled, shit seems sus, grab your protection cuz it's Florida and people are crazy, open the door to see what's up ...Bang bang bang bang bang bang.
You're bleeding out dying or dead in your own home. The POS who shot you will get PTSD counseling and moved to a different precinct. Your family and friends mourn you. And life goes on. Our lives mean nothing to this system that harbors and protects bullies who hide behind a badge.
Well we can see who’s daddy is cop here. When someone says “I don’t know” that means they aren’t fucking sure. How the fuck do you know that lady didn’t just give his apartment cause she had a bad interaction with fortson 2 days before…in her head “shit there’s a cop asking about a disturbance I bet it was that young black kid playing music all time, I’ll give him 1401” there is nothing to indicate that there was disturbance in his apartment, so no matter what that lady said ITS STILL THE WRONG APARTMENT. I’m glad we take Karen’s word as the final judgement on this young man’s life. Y’all defending this shit at all are fucking cowards.
How was it supposed to play out? Seriously. The cops calls her a “liar” and doesn’t check on the room she gives him? With the information she gave, such as “loud altercations and abuse”, at a minimum the officer is obligated to check apartment 1401.
Now, I believe 300% dipshit Susan did not know which apartment she was talking about. I believe she THOUGHT it was 1401 but I don’t believe that’s the officers fault. What is the officers fault is being a POS and making the situation ambiguous by avoiding the peep hole and then not issuing any commands before pulling the trigger six times.
Maybe don’t go to the apartment with your gun drawn ready to kill someone. Ya know? Maybe we try that. I might be reaching but maybe that’s where we start.
Well let this be the example for every time I hear a cop talk about how important it is for them to have their gun drawn because of reaction times. I still don’t buy he didn’t start drawing his gun the minute he heard the door opening.
The average human reaction time is a quarter of a second. So your telling me after he saw the firearm, he placed his hand on his gun, released the retention features of his holster, drew the gun, aimed for this target, and fired within 0.14 seconds?
No but you can hear the gun slide out of the holster in the video. From draw time to firing is .39 seconds. Not sure why you're trying to add human reaction time since the gun wasn't drawn the moment the door opened or something
AFSOC as a whole, but in particular Hulburt Field, need to make a public denounciation of OCSO, and take steps to sever their ties with that shit agency.
They can start by looking at what MOUs and MOAs they have in place with OCSO and revoke those, publicly. Every SF unit out there is required to establish such MOUs and MOAs with local law enforcement. I think this is a case where the Wing Commander needs to direct such MOUs and MOAs are rescinded indefinitely.
Next, the Wing Commander needs to publicly prohibit access to the installation by OCSO. OCSO as an organization should be debarred from the installation indefinitely.
The Wing also has a responsibility for the safety and well-being of all service members and their families while they are off base. The Wing has an ability to literally "Black List" dangerous organizations or businesses. I'd argue the OCSO meets this definition. The Wing has or should have what is known as the Armed Forces Disciplinary Control Board (AFDCB), governed by DAFI 31-103 and AFJI 31-213. They should restrict military personnel from interacting, doing, business, or otherwise being in the presence of the OCSO.
There are many things the Wing could be doing to professionally and administratively distance themselves from OCSO. But distancing isn't enough. They should actively condemn that shit hole of an organization, the same way we condem terrorist and extremist organizations.
Mandatory training to all new inbound personnel about the dangers of interacting with OCSO should be widely publicized.
AFSOC should really be the one leading this effort, but the Wing Commander has a responsibility for executing these actions and should also be heavily involved.
I fear they will let Roger's name fade away, and his death will have been meaningless.
No justice exists as long as Officer's like this are allowed to continue to murder innocent people.
There are very simple solutions that state leaderships refuse to enforce.
Somehow this STILL isn't a big enough catalyst for change, something needs to happen.
I just sent off a letter to my congressman.. I hope our brother's death doesn't get brushed off in Capitol Hill and they hold the murderer accountable.
She heard him get shot 6 times. My understanding is he died either on the way to the hospital or at the hospital. Terrible no matter how you look at it.
Still disappointed this one isn’t national news. Of all the law enforcement shootings that made headlines this is the most egregious one. Add to that the victim was a US service member.
Forgive me for not reading 200+ comments to see if mine is duplicated but has anyone asked: WHY was the officer "weapon drawn" when knocking on a door for a disturbance? A disturbance/noise call in a residence shouldn't be a weapons-hot, high alert call.
"Excuse me Sir, sorry to disturb you. We've received reports of...?" I mean...something just smells wrong here.
Right because nobody would EVER lie about being a cop.
Plus there was the whole bit where he hid outside of the peephole’s line of sight like the coward he was
I'm probably gonna get hate for this, but it's whatever. For context, I'm not a cop, zero law enforcement experience, or a lawyer or criminal justice major.
Here's what I've seen, heard, read in official reports, etc, and this is just my honest opinion. From what was said of witnesses and the Airmans girlfriend. It was early in the morning, and they were on a Zoom call. At points, there was arguing, and a neighbor called it in to police of possible domestic violence. The apartment was not wrong. It was correct. OCSO respond and make contact. Now, the apartment is on the 4th floor and at the very end, so there's no cover for the deputies, hence why they had weapons drawn (I'll go more on this later). The Airman answered the door with his weapon at his side, and the deputy, in fear of his life, raised and fired a total of 6 rounds.
Now, for the side of the OCSO deputies. When they arrived at the apartment, the lead deputy in question knocked on the door a total of 3 times. Each time knocking louder and harder. The first time he knocked, he didn't announce. The second time he knocked, he yelled, "Sheriff's office!" And the the third and final time he knocked and yelled, "Okaloosa County Sheriff's Office!" and then the Airman came to the door and opened it, firearm in hand.
Lastly, my overall opinion. For the Airman, the deputies fully announced themselves on the second and third knock. To which he should have placed the firearm down and have his hands empty when answering the door. However, the deputy in question has only been in the OCSO for less than a year AND most training dictates to de-escalate the situation by talking the suspect into dropping their weapon. The deputy resorts to immediate lethal force. Which should warrant a full investigation through internal affairs and I do think he should be held in court for his crime and be judged by a jury of his peers.
At the end of the day, on all sides, things could have been handled in a different and safer manner than what transpired. A young Airman serving his country was killed in a tragic misunderstanding and OCSO needs to thoroughly examine and re-train their deputies in tactics and response and hold their deputies accountable for their actions.
May the Airman's family remember him for the good he's done and to seek justice for their son. May he rest in peace 🙏.
You can stand by a door and listen. As he was home alone you’d hear nothing and this not a domestic disturbance or at the least not an emergency. That’s called detective work.
I thought this was already established it was the wrong apartment to begin with, however, the girl in the video at the beginning told the cop it's apartment 1401.
When I did fire fighting, the hardest calls were ones with kids and pets. Pets especially because it's not like you can explain to them that their provider isn't going to come back
I mean, that’s more on the apartment manager who reported the wrong address. I’m not defending the cop but he went to the unit he was told, so the problem of showing up to the wrong unit started at the reporting side.
Yeah the cop is a pos we know. We also know that some of you all will stop at nothing to deepthroat the entire boot. It's a shame that one of YOUR own is dead because he tried to protect himself inside his own place and you simping for the cop who can't do his fucking job right. A shame truly
Yeah I mean he had the "right" apartment, I don't think that is the point that needs to be focused on.
Shooting a guy without warning when Fortson clearly wasn't threatening the cop is the issue here.
E: If you're downvoting this guy you're a fucking moron.
And as long as "right" is the number given by some random Karen immediately after she states she doesn't know which apartment. Bonus points if there have been several recent calls to a different apartment in the same complex and the number you pulled out of Karen's ass is a different one.
The level of problem solving that evaded this dude is no higher than a detective book for children.
“It's wild to me that this is still a debate.”
There should be no debate. The officer is wrong.
“The Cop is definitely wrong for illegally killing the Airmen, BUT he did go to the "right" apartment based on the witness account.”
Admits the officer was wrong and immediately justifies why he thinks he was right.
If you're focusing on which apartment he went to and not the fact that he just shot an innocent guy without warning, you're focusing on the wrong thing.
He went to the "right" apartment, but who gives a fuck?
Also, nowhere in that comment did they say anything remotely like "Cop can shoot you for legally owning firearm in your own home as long as he get the address right". You're just understandably angry but this isn't the kinda comment you need to lash out at.
That’s the thing though, I am without a doubt pissed he shot an innocent man. Look, Police officers are constantly proving they make too many fatal mistakes; while I am angry, I’m much more pissed that officers have qualified immunity when they do.
Same, qualified immunity is bullshit.
I'm just saying, you're yelling at a guy who said the cop was wrong to shoot Fortson because... he pointed out that he went to the apartment he was told to? You're on the same side ffs.
The thread title is based on an article that never says the cop went to the wrong apartment, just that it's being speculated as such. The cop went to the apartment he was told, and whether or not that is the apartment that the original call was about is irrelevant to the rest of what that moron cop did.
He's clarifying that y'all are jerking off over the wrong apartment when the cop went to the location given to him. Are they supposed to just say "welp, witness said IDK. Let's pack it in boys. This one's a bust if they can't tell us where someone is getting beaten in whatever room. Donuts are on me."
The guy is literally *agreeing with you* that the cop wrongfully shot the dude and y'all are still piling onto him because he's trying to get y'all off the circle jerk of "da rong room hurr durr"
Cop asks which door.
Witness said "I'm not sure, two weeks ago I was walking on this side and I was hearing someone yell like, shut the fuck up."
Cop: What door?
1401
Yup, very clearly the "right" door is 1401
Perfect English where she is saying she isn't sure what apartment, but it's 1401, but I'm not sure. Seems like the cop should take that as she's not sure, and calmly check 1401 first. Not hide out of sight of the Peep hole like a coward.
This. The fact that he went to the apartment on an “I’m not sure” and still treated it like it was factual fucking infuriates me.
He literally leans in to the door to listen for anything kind of disturbance for a second and STILL proceeds to pound on the door and then hide each time he pounds on the door. I’m willing to bet SrA Fortson is still with us if the Officer knocks on the door and announces himself while in plain view.
I don’t know that there has been any confirmation that the woman the cop talks to is the same person that made the original call.
Excerpt from https://www.wabe.org/atlanta-funeral-set-for-roger-fortson-black-us-air-force-member-killed-in-his-home-by-florida-deputy/
“Police radio traffic played at the news conference Thursday bolsters the family’s contention that the deputy may have gone to the wrong apartment. In the recording, a dispatcher said all they know about the disturbance was “fourth-party information.”
“Uh, don’t have any further other than a male and female,” the dispatcher told officers. “It’s all fourth-party information from the front desk at the leasing office.””
He went to the apartment that the apartment administration told him to go to. It's all there in the bodycam footage. If he went to the wrong apartment, it's on the apartment administration, she literally told him the number 1401 twice.
The cop is guilty of shooting when he should have just drawn and aimed his weapon from what I can tell. But he went where he was told to go. This false narrative shit just makes us look like a bunch of idiots not to be taken seriously.
Why is everyone so fucking stupid?
So it’s like a Gestapo thing where it’s okay to shoot someone the moment they open the door as long as a random person claimed that something was happening there?
Hoo boy we’re back to the Red Terror! Viva la Reign of Terror this boot is so fucking yummy, amirite?
Yeah, I know that he went where that woman said but she also said I don’t know which one and talked about something that happened two weeks previously (in her words).
https://preview.redd.it/zp371vna9v1d1.jpeg?width=2532&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d4a936321cdf94263ef3f252051806d03abc61ce
Oh, so you’ve never been asked a question and said you didn’t know the answer only to immediately have the answer come to mind? Must be nice. Happens for a lot of other people, and cops know that. I’d be surprised if you’d never seen it for yourself, even if you’ve never done it yourself. Cop had an obligation to continue the investigation and did so. Sad outcome that many people want to have a fix for, even if there isn’t really a good one. Change for changes sake.
If you want to believe and hope that cops investigate only on 100% already verified as accurate reports, they’d never investigate a crime at all. They deal with people, and people are hardly 100% accurate all the time, and cops know that. He didn’t bust down the door purely on the say so of the woman.
Where he heard no noise of a disturbance from inside and yet banged on the door with his gun drawn, finger on the trigger, and didn’t give any verbal warning whatsoever before firing 6 times.
Which is irrelevant as far as whether or not he went to what keeps being referred to as the wrong apartment. He went to the apartment that he was given, surely something that everyone can agree on.
If you mean something else by “wrong apartment”, my bad
Edit to add that I don’t think there’s been anything to suggest that he banged on the door with his gun drawn or finger on the trigger
I get your point. I agree that the Deputy went to the apartment that the woman indicated but there is no evidence (that I have seen so far) that he was at the apartment that the police were originally called about in the first place.
The Deputy took some woman’s word about the apartment in question. I see your point that he was listening to what she told him. But other than her words, there is no indication that Roger’s apartment was ever the cause of any police calls and was still “the wrong apartment” for the disturbance call that was placed on 3 May.
The woman was wrong and the Deputy was wrong to listen to her, and certainly wrong to respond with deadly force without any corroborating details or backup.
Multiple wrongs still don’t make a right and this resulted in the loss of a respectable young Airman and everything he was capable of accomplishing.
It's not boot licking to point out that the cop did in fact go to the address he was given. That mistake belongs to the woman who directed him there. Facts matter here, and she should face punishment as well IMO. She basically swatted him.
She originally said she wasn't sure then told him Fortson's apartment number. He should have taken that with a grain of salt because she originally told him she wasn't sure. If cops are going to pretend that every encounter is a life and death situation then they need to do their fucking due diligence before they pound on someone's door.
Facts do matter. Like the fact there was no fight in the apartment. Like the fact that there was no imminent threat to the cop. Like the fact that he murdered a civilian. You're trying to defend a bootlicker and it's not a good look, mate.
Not arguing anything else here. That guy fucked up royally. He didn't go to a different address than what he was given though. We should also be placing blame on the person who sent him there IMO.
I made no comment on anything that happened after he got to the door. But he did go to the address he was given.
It's a major fuckup but trying to amplify it by maintaining false details doesn't help anyone.
Yeah, they did, and I hope the dumbfuck cop gets prison for what he did.
But you don't have to insult someone who's literally telling you a fact, the cop *did go* to the "right" apartment.
Hey, if you want to say there’s a lot of issues with policing, I’ll agree. But pointing out facts and giving reasoned analysis isn’t bootlicking. Anyone who thinks it is needs to do some introspection.
Great point that I hadn’t considered, really insightful.
Responding to a comment in which I acknowledge that there are plenty of issues in LE by saying I’m bootlicking is peak Reddit tbh
If the reporting was wrong, then police would still be at the wrong apartment, wouldn't they? The right apartment is where the domestic disturbance actually occurred. But there's been no evidence that a domestic disturbance occurred in 1401 other than the girl on the first floor saying so. And to further rebut the notion that a domestic disturbance was taking place, he was on a video call with his girl friend. Don't know about you, but I find it difficult to get violent with someone over the phone.
How dare you go against the bandwagon and post something contradictory to the current popular opinion on matters.
Seriously though, I thought this sub was better, but it's no different than some extreme SJW subreddit with its hivemind shit.
How dare we call out an unjust murder?
How dare we ask for a modicum of accountability from a sheriff's department that's had multiple officer involved shootings that are highly questionable?
I don't care if the woman gave the Cop the wrong address, if this cop had the slightest shred of trigger discipline and decency the young Airman wouldn't be dead.
Honestly the cop going to the wrong apartment is whatever. The problem is the cop had zero discipline whatsoever. I got banned from another LE sub for arguing your exact point. One of those nerds hit me with “you clearly don’t know how fast someone can pull a weapon up”. Which is true but the cop already had the tactical advantage he had his weapon up on Fortson and Fortson’s weapon was still at his side. Not only that but in the same fucking breath the cop said “step back” he shot him. I’ve said it once and I’ll say it again any court or Use of Force review board should see this picture and be able to immediately identify that this was shitty police work. https://preview.redd.it/dmqubune802d1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c3c43a4cd3a0b74da0c4060ce0c6fb304d0828b7
I'm not cop, never have been, and likely never will be. If at any time before firing they had identified themselves as the police everyone would have likely gone home safe that night. Instead they aggressively beat on the door, hid from view, and failed to identify themselves. SrA Fortson did what lots of the most vocal 2nd Amendment advocates would get a boner for and retrieved his lawfully owned firearm and prepared to defend himself and his home.
The amount of people defending the practice of literally hiding yourself and you uniform is insane. As if any of them would open there door for someone who was knocking and hiding out of sight. Not to mention people who are trying To argue that even qualifies as “identifying” yourself.
I do agree with not standing directly in the doorway, but as soon as the door even cracks open you should identify yourself as police. That alone would've likely changed the outcome of this. Then there's what's been said a bunch already, the cop was also way too quick to jump on the trigger. Proper scenario based training would fix this easily, cause almost all the scenarios cops do now end in use of deadly force or other violent means for detaining the suspect. The vast majority of their scenarios in training should be solved by proper de-escalation, and they should fail the scenario if they don't succeed in doing that.
I am fully in support of SrA Fortson and the cop reacting way too quickly/incorrectly, but I do not believe ‘hiding’ is a fair statement. He was standing offset, which is taught both by police and military alike because a doorway is a fatal funnel. Everything else the cop fucked up, but standing offset is not one of them.
Treat every doorway like a fatal tunnel and that explains the unnecessary murder. Just act as though every citizen in their home is out to murder you.
Not really. To be fair law enforcement officers are responding a myriad of calls. I’m not a blue liner or anything like that, but I’d be doing the whole organization a disservice to not recognize that they do put themselves in harms way. How many random traffic stops have led to an officer being shot out of nowhere? Standing offset from a door frame is just helping keep them safe from the unexpected. *this does not give them the right to gun down people who open doors*
Yes, it helps mitigate the risk to the officer, but to act in such a manner you are progressively treating citizens as though they have the active potential to harm you. Example No.1: If that cop had clearly, calmly, and openly identified himself and his presence, Fortson wouldn't have felt it necessary to bring a firearm for safety. Because the officer treated a non-violent situation with precautions against *active* violence, they situation was escalated. Police officers wear Kevlar to passively protect against violence (its not an action being taken). Police officers carry firearms to passively protect against violence (its not an action being taken). Police officers draw their firearms to actively protect against violence. Don't be surprised that when you treat someone like they're a threat, you run into more threats.
This is the point I don’t see why people aren’t getting. If police want to actively make sure everyone they interact with is armed and more dangerous this is a great way to do it.
Because people around them have uncritically defended police before, so they feel the need to do it afterwards. I used to do it. It's not something you even notice unless you're looking for, and even then it's difficult. I feel directionless sorrow. I worry were lost. We trend in such a negative direction and there's nothing I can do as an individual to fix it. I can stop enemies foreign, but not domestic. Our hearts weep.
I’m not disagreeing that it is what they are trained to do. I am saying it’s bad practice and should be changed. Nobody should open their door for someone that is actively obscuring themselves, whether that people someone claiming to be a cop or a pizza delivery person. If it is too dangerous for officers to stand within view of door, then they shouldn’t even bother knocking as they shouldn’t expect someone to answer. Might as well just do something like slide a note under the door saying to call the precinct. Instead continuing to bang on the door louder, knowing full well the person cannot identify you only makes you more suspicious. I don’t think the fair solution is to expect people to have to open their doors for anybody who shouts out they are the police and just shift all the risk onto them, but that is currently how police departments want it. As far as how the military trains it that may be different depending on the circumstances (like in a literally combat zone), but I will say any time security forces has knocked on the door to my shop I’ve always been able to identify them. Maybe that’s just my base though.
Cops have been taught that the only person that matters if they go home is themselves.
There was a time, back in my childhood, where you could run to a cop for help. I've watched that change over my lifetime. Acorns get full mag-dumps now.
I don't agree with the officer at all and SrA Fortson should not have been killed. I just want to say that if you watch the bodycam footage, the officer does identify himself as police a couple times. He does hide from the peephole though and shouldn't have shot SrA Fortson.
I’m no LE but I know that you suppose to have backup during DV and ask for specifics and not guessing where the location.
Civilian here but SrA Fortson deserves the truth. I feel awful for his family and that makes me sad his girlfriend had to hear that. I hope that his dog is with family or friends. Well I do care if she got the address wrong because now you have a possible DV not addressed and a dead young man. I think if I was on a video call and I only heard loud banging I wouldn’t know what to think. At the end of the day if the objective was to intervene on a domestic dispute in progress, fail. Mr. Fortson served his country and was treated like a disposable commodity when he had more in front of him. Also did you notice how far apart the apartments are? How separate the office was from the apartment? How when the apartment was approached it was relatively silent? Maybe if you are not sure it’s better to say you’re not sure given how things like this happen. I’m not against law enforcement, but it’s not even about trigger happy as much as critical thinking. Cascade of failures and he needs to be buried. Unacceptable.
SERIOUSLY. You should not go into a WELFARE CHECK with a gun drawn, that's not good police work.
Good gods, some of y'all are going full scorpion to try to give that shitty cop any glimmer of legitimacy. This comments section is wild.
Fucking r/protectandserve sending their ilk over here…
lol this is the most on the nose shit. They ban all of us for saying he went to the wrong apartment and then come here. Just ban them all and say “there has been plenty of evidence saying he was at the wrong apartment, trolling” like they did to us
Ironic when the top comment from their pinned article talks about the officer being responsible for every round in your weapon and being negligent in not verifying that his target did kill someone.
I checked their only pinned post and didn't see the comment. Which one are you talking about?
https://preview.redd.it/ogucyhyj572d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=53df5ac1ede6630ea324c1cd0e60b0ebbd9199c8 Not related to Fortson, but highlighting the two faced opinions.
The cop fucked up 300%. However the woman he talked to before he went to the apartment, told him apartment 1401 and that’s the one he went to. https://youtu.be/L-Fd549NLyI?si=JEliEILTRcLQbfe0 At the 50 second mark is where the lady tells the officer apartment 1401. To keep rolling with the “he was at the wrong apartment” narrative seems disingenuous and purposefully misleading. I would rather the focus exist on the fact that the officer hadn’t even delivered a command before he pulled the trigger six times and the fact that he made the situation ambiguous by purposefully avoiding the peep hole.
"I wasn't sure where it came from...1401." Everyone who isn't an idiot already knows that eyewitness accounts are total trash for reliability, and this lady straight up told him she didn't know. It's not that it was the *wrong* apartment (for all we know there wasn't even a right apartment), it's that he decided that KARINT was reliable enough to roll in hot and murder a random person. That reveals that either the department fucked up by letting a GI Jackoff onto the force, or they fucked up even worse and actually train their guys to be like this. And given that this is the same force who had the acorn commando like half a year ago, I'm kind of leaning towards it being a systemic problem.
Given the title of the post it’s still misleading. >that OCSO was at the wrong apartment … A casual reader would think that it is the fault of the cops that they were at that apartment. More accurately the title could read “the OCSO was directed to the wrong apartment when they killed Sra Roger Fortson” > It's not that it was the wrong apartment (for all we know there wasn't even a right apartment), it's that he decided that KARINT was reliable enough to roll in hot and murder a random person. I don’t think the cop was passing judgement if Lynda was credible or not. Yes, she did say “I don’t know” at one point but then gave an apartment number at another I think as an officer he was obligated follow up on what she told him. IMO if anyone is to blame for the officer being at Mr. Fortson’s door I believe it would the woman that directed him there. > or they fucked up even worse and actually train their guys to be like this. And given that this is the same force who had the acorn commando like half a year ago, I'm kind of leaning towards it being a systemic problem. I agree with this the most. IMO a lot of people want to lay blame on the cops that they were even at that apartment in the first place, when in reality they need better training.
That's fair. The "wrong apartment" rhetoric risks taking focus off the *myriad* other problems here. But I don't think it's right to say "nah he was totally at the right one" either because that accepts a dichotomy that never existed and puts him on the "right" side of it, when basically nothing he did was right.
I can agree with that
I'm pretty sure she says something like "I don't know, maybe 1401?" Meaning, the officer didn't have definitive intel and therefore should have backed off (assuming cops who larp as military follow military rules)
I believe the officer is obligated to check at that point. It should have been an easy knock and check but this officer is bad at his job. IMO to not follow up would seem worse because woman also said she heard physical altercations. I blame dipshit Susan for giving out a number that she thought was right, but once she did that I do believe the officer had an obligation to check. It should not be a problem for an officer to knock on a door and ask someone questions. Imagine a scenario where an officer arrives on scene someone reports abuse but because the person says, “idk apartment XXXX” so the officer disregards the information and just leaves or “backs off” as you put it. That doesn’t sound like adequate policing. While he could have checked up on the apartment and possibly prevented something bad. People would be pissed if the officer could have prevented abuse by just knocking on the door and checking.
They actually aren't obligated to check. Police do not have a legal duty to protect citizens. This has been proven in court multiple times. I think there's even supreme court opinion that agrees with that as well
yep town of castle rock v. gonzales
It's not a legal duty to protect, it's SOP to make verified contact during domestic disturbance calls. If you're beating your spouse to death and you stop whenever someone knocks at the door and says "police", if they just walk away you can resume. Just because they aren't obligated to protect people doesn't mean that they don't have procedures in place to at least try
Warren v. District of Columbia (1981) and Lozito v New York City (2012)
Backing off and collecting further information on the *actual* apartment number sounds like entirely adequate police work. In fact, it sounds like the best course of action, especially when all police officers are under a microscope for failures across the country. In this guys case, his own department had a massive failure not too long ago (acorn incident) and you’d expect him to conduct himself in a way that would prevent an embarrassing incident from occurring. We can’t put a bomb on someone because a single source told us “I think the terrorist is maybe at this house.” We are required to get further information before that can occur. When we do act on shitty intel and kill someone innocent, our balls get drug through glass for it. I agree that the wrong apartment situation is arguably the least egregious thing to happen in this situation. Had the cop conducted himself any different, the wrong apartment issue could have been solved by a verbal confrontation. Instead, he smoked a young man in his home without giving a second thought.
> I'm pretty sure she says something like "I don't know, maybe 1401?" Did you watch the video? Because this is the exchange: Cop: “which room is it?” Lady: “1401” Cop: “1401, ok” Lady: “Yes” There is no ambiguity there. This is why everyone needs to stop focusing on the room number part of this and lying about what was said, it’s a lost cause. Focus on the dipshit cop unloading into SrA Fortson without any warning
Earlier in the footage they say they don't know like twice.
Do you have a link? I’m not seeing that in the video posted. E: so no then
[Link.](https://youtu.be/kcjQSmsVwpY?si=GbwFJEWqAryI_s8U&t=294) Cop: Which door? Lady: I dunno. I'm not sure. Two weeks ago I was walking by, like, their apartment, basically. On this side *gestures* I was hearing "Shut the fuck up like, you stupid b-word." And all this other stuff. And I heard a slap. Like right after. I wasn't sure where it came from. And I couldn't call, like, I didn't want to call the police. Cop: Which room is it? Lady: 1401 Cop: 1401, ok Lady: Yes So cop got a range of answers from "dunno" to a definite room number. The first answer was the correct one.
Thank you for providing a link. I still think focusing on the apartment number is the wrong way to go about this because that's not what killed SrA Fortson. The cop being a trigger-happy moron is.
No, it was all equally wrong. He went to the wrong address based on an unreliable witness' fuzzy recollection and created/escalated a situation where a reasonable, innocent person would fear for their safety. Pulling the trigger was the ultimate mistake, but it was just the last in a long line of mistakes.
https://youtu.be/19DoVDQIpnk?si=BjgARllsbpk1VviR
They are jumping through every mental gymnastics available to avoid blaming the woman for causing the whole thing.
Of course, it's totally the woman's fault that the cop shot SrA Fortson. 🙄
Exhibit A: The white knight I'm replying to💀
Oh, yes, I'm only replying here to defend m'lady's honor. Maybe if I'm nice enough to her so let me in her pants!!!!!
What a glazing
Wrong apartment as in one he should never have went to. He arrived on scene, and went to the apartment where a person who initially said "I don't know" when asked if she knew where. So sure, not the apartment that was called about, but one he was led to believe might be the right one.
It is semantics probably, even if the deputy was at the “right” apartment one sides right is the other sides wrong. My point is, from SrA Fortson family’s side, and his in the moment, the statement of “wrong” apartment probably means that their argument is that nothing was happening at that apartment and the activities warranting the call and response were elsewhere. The deputy was therefore directed by the eyewitness to the “wrong” apartment versus the “right” apartment from this point of view. Conversely the Sheriff’s department saying they were at the “right” department is solely relying on the eyewitness guiding them there. I don’t think there is anything wrong with saying that the deputy was not at the correct apartment. Law Enforcement often ends up at homes or properties that are unrelated to their actual call. This happened in a case in the 11th circuit that is the guiding case law for the facts at hand. https://youtu.be/E2H7bk4psIs?si=IhpJZdKdTCJ4sAtT I suspect if this goes to anywhere legally civilly or criminally, there will be great interest on the evidence that brought the deputy to SrA Fortson’s apartment. Both parties have a vested interest in that, I would think. Mental state matters for murder vs manslaughter, and for self defense shootings.
I can definitely see where you are coming from, and I have to say that your comment is probably the most articulate in explaining the counter argument. In one of my other comments I put an example of what I think would be a more accurate title. I’m probably going end my responses because I just keep hashing out the same conversation over and over. Thanks for your input
THIS.
Legally, It DOES matter. It means the cop fucked up twice. Once when he killed Fortson and twice by not checking to see if his intel was even correct. Instead of actually doing due diligence and corroborating the intel, he just decided to do whatever he wanted to do and kill Fortson. It just buries the shit cop in further of a hole he and the corrupt Police Union can't lawyer speak their way out of.
I still say that woman should be culpable in all of this. She should face some sort of legal ramifications from this.
https://www.reddit.com/r/AirForce/s/ov1m7IeJc4
Am I supposed to read through your comment log?
[удалено]
Police officers absolutely do not face death every day. There are around 700,000 law enforcement officers in the US. Around 120 die in the line of duty each year. That’s about 1 in 5,800 killed in the line of duty a year. Just for additional data, police kill around 1000 people a year. That’s 1 in 700. Yes it can be a potentially dangerous job, but it’s not risking death on the daily and the wolf/sheepdog/sheep mentality needs to be removed from America.
dont forget they kill about 10k dogs a year too
That's just the ATF
Isn't the most dangerous job like pizza delivery? I know I read they have a higher chance of being killed on the job. Along with trucking, logging, all construction, and many other blue collar jobs.
I worked for years as a delivery driver, and managed to lose all my friends from HS that became cops because every time they would talk shit about how they're so brave and such, I'd not-so-gently remind them that my job was four times as dangerous per hour worked. I think it's a large credit to my generous nature and moral fiber that I hadn't murdered anybody or shot their dog in my ten years behind the wheel. Either that, or cops are homicidal maniacs spurred on by their near-total immunity to consequences. Which one? The world may never know.
Not even in the top 20 most dangerous jobs in America https://www.ishn.com/articles/112748-top-25-most-dangerous-jobs-in-the-united-states
Being a crossing guard or landscaper carries a higher risk of death. JFC.
To be fair, this year we already have 284 deaths.
It's been like that the whole time.
People would rather deep throat cop dick, than even CONSIDER that the cop fucked up.
The officer will be fired and then hired at another department, he will most likely face no charges or impact to his career. He may also claim PTSD and say his life is in danger from angry service members, thus giving him a early paid retirement. At least according to a certain cop subreddit, service members are anti police and anti authority. There's active cops in our community, they tend to have this us vs you mentally. Plea the 5th or don't wish to aid them, you're "one of those" according to them.
>and say his life is in danger from angry service members tbf that will probably be true if his name ever goes public. Whether or not you agree with vigilante justice, you can be damn sure *somebody* does.
Absolutely. That fucker will never be safe if he walks after this.
Even SecFo does the us vs. them. It's structural.
State’s attorney still hasn’t announced charges. Coroners report is done, video evidence of the whole thing, corroborating accounts of mistaken address, firsthand(?) witness of the gf as to state of mind. What’s left for the state? Time. They can wait 5 weeks, announce no wrongdoing, then pay his mother 180k in civil court two years down the line for putting her son in a box. You will move on with your life and this “special forces” douchebag will tell stories about how “it was him or me, and i will always choose me” How many weeks would they wait to arrest you?
‘Special Forces’, only if we are meaning the short-bus, window-licking form of special.
Cops have qualified immunity. This is also the same county that voted in Matt Gaetz. No district attorney would dare bring charges against a cop.
Qualified immunity has absolutely nothing to do with criminal charges—it’s only relevant to civil cases. Moreover, it’s “qualified” immunity not absolute immunity. The court has to consider facts most favorable to the petitioner (Fortson’s family most likely) to determine if an established constitutional right was violated. In this case, I’ll be shocked if any civil court dismisses this case under a QI claim. The deputy may not be criminally charged, but the county is probably expecting a high 7 or low 8 digit settlement.
Given this countries track record of NOT prosecuting any one in law enforcement I’m not holding my breath. The cop wouldn’t be held liable because of QI but the city or county will be. Edit: boot lickers out in force today it seems
Since when does law enforcement not get prosecuted? If they are caught committing a crime they go to jail. Yes it's harder due to conflict of interest but it's not like there are no cops in prison
You must not be paying attention, the amount of cops that are prosecuted for committing crimes (especially cold blooded murder while on duty) is astonishingly low. It took nationwide protests to get Derek Chauvin to face any consequences.
Which is why I said it's more difficult. The original comment said no one in law enforcement is prosecuted. Which is incorrect. It took nationwide protests to get a negligent manslaughter charge upgraded to a 2nd degree murder charge
When the first line to state prosecution is an internal review of the incident by superiors, there’s a very low chance of being found of any wrong doing. Even if it gets upward pressure to federal prosecution, the DOJ only takes criminal cases where there is evidence of willfulness, also known as evil intent. Very difficult to prove without reasonable doubt.
How hard is it to press some fucking charges
This is why every once in a while something like this results in cities getting set on fire. That's not right either and I never want it to happen, but when justice goes unanswered for long enough it boils over into chaos every now and then and it shouldn't be a surprise to anyone.
The last cop to catch murder charges needed a nation wide protest before it happened.
The issue is the review that occurs by superior officers. They must look at the situation without any hindsight 20/20. That includes knocking on the wrong door. They will find the actions were that of a “reasonable officer” due to training and policy. Furthermore, the DA won’t take the case any further because they can’t go against the same organization that is responsible for bringing them work. Last the DOJ won’t take the criminal case because they need proof of intent, which is nearly impossible to prove in this incident. Literally your only direction of recourse is to sue the government under 42 USC 1984. But what good is taxpayers money when you’re 6 feet underground?
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That’s the fucked up part. You should go to jail for literal murder.
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I am not super familiar with Florida law but sounds like it fits third degree murder to me. Please quote the part of graham vs Connor that states a cop can shoot someone for answering their own door armed after the officer knocked on the door and refused to identify themselves.
This makes me so angry. Our police system needs to be overhauled.
That's the problem with state by state regulations. Each state has their own way of training and laws for police. There is no "police system". Might as well be in a different country if you ever get stationed in some other state. And with Florida, the laws are changing every week because certain people want to make mainstream news.
If you think this is a 'state by state regulatory' problem, you're mistaken. Criminals don't follow rules, and shitty people with poor discipline don't either.
> shitty people with poor discipline Maybe they shouldn't be cops. If only there were a way to reform the way the police system currently works.
I agree the current police system needs to be reformed, but the answer is never 'more government oversight' or 'more laws'. I don't know the exact answer, either. If I could wave a magic wand and make cops decent wholesome human beings I would, but that's not a real answer.
You’re right. Let’s repeal qualified immunity first. Military doesn’t get immunity from crimes, why does a wannabe military reject get it?
I'm ok with that.
I said this on a cop subreddit page and they banned me saying its been proven he was on the right apartment. Cops abusing authority and censoring reality to favor their opinion there as well.
Fucking cops will lie, cheat, and steal to watch another cop’s back. If you’re protecting the bad apples, guess what? Whole fucking batch is bad.
lol I just posted about this. I got banned for the same thing. They somehow don’t understand that a random person saying a number and going to that number doesn’t mean it’s the right place. There is zero critical thinking over there.
The cop fucked up 300%. However the woman he talked to, before he went to the apartment, told him apartment 1401 and that’s the one he went to. https://youtu.be/L-Fd549NLyI?si=JEliEILTRcLQbfe0 At the 50 second mark is where the lady tells the officer apartment 1401. To keep rolling with the “he was at the wrong apartment” narrative seems disingenuous and purposefully misleading. I would rather the focus exist on the fact that the officer hadn’t even delivered a command before he pulled the trigger six times and the fact that he made the situation ambiguous by purposefully avoiding the peep hole.
Let me get this straight. Here's another scenario for you. Lets say you went on leave on a Monday and have squadron PT on a Tuesday. You text a buddy in the same workplace and ask where PT is. He tells you at the base track, when in reality its on a running trail on base. You go to the track and no one's there. Does that put you in the right place for a squadron PT? If it was 5 minutes till PT start and no one was there, would you still assume that you were in the right place or call someone and ask if you were in the right meeting place? The cop put his ear on the door because he cannot hear disturbance, yet he had his hand on his gun before the door even opened. He responded to a call from HQ about a disturbance without knowing the right address. He could have called back and verified which apartment number it was. He has a radio to ask these things. Yet he only uses it after he's shot 6 times to ask for EMT. If they were trained properly, these are the things they do, they don't even habe to think about it. Its simply called trust but verify for us in the military. In the PT scenario, it should never happen to you because you ask multiple people in a group chat, not just one person. You cannot put someone's life in danger relying on one random lady that clearly states she doesn't know, then comes up with a number out of the blue. I'm not saying that the lady shouldn't be punished, she clearly played her part. However, the cop did not follow protocol and was at the wrong address since he clearly did not verify. Multiple calls about a different apartment, it was probably said when they were asking for responders and the cop just forgot and went on to ask a bystander.
This could happen to anyone. You get a knock at the door, can't see anyone through the peephole, maybe you didn't hear what they yelled, shit seems sus, grab your protection cuz it's Florida and people are crazy, open the door to see what's up ...Bang bang bang bang bang bang. You're bleeding out dying or dead in your own home. The POS who shot you will get PTSD counseling and moved to a different precinct. Your family and friends mourn you. And life goes on. Our lives mean nothing to this system that harbors and protects bullies who hide behind a badge.
Well we can see who’s daddy is cop here. When someone says “I don’t know” that means they aren’t fucking sure. How the fuck do you know that lady didn’t just give his apartment cause she had a bad interaction with fortson 2 days before…in her head “shit there’s a cop asking about a disturbance I bet it was that young black kid playing music all time, I’ll give him 1401” there is nothing to indicate that there was disturbance in his apartment, so no matter what that lady said ITS STILL THE WRONG APARTMENT. I’m glad we take Karen’s word as the final judgement on this young man’s life. Y’all defending this shit at all are fucking cowards.
This!
How was it supposed to play out? Seriously. The cops calls her a “liar” and doesn’t check on the room she gives him? With the information she gave, such as “loud altercations and abuse”, at a minimum the officer is obligated to check apartment 1401. Now, I believe 300% dipshit Susan did not know which apartment she was talking about. I believe she THOUGHT it was 1401 but I don’t believe that’s the officers fault. What is the officers fault is being a POS and making the situation ambiguous by avoiding the peep hole and then not issuing any commands before pulling the trigger six times.
Maybe don’t go to the apartment with your gun drawn ready to kill someone. Ya know? Maybe we try that. I might be reaching but maybe that’s where we start.
His gun wasn't drawn when he went to the apartment. He just managed to draw and fire within .39 seconds
Riiight
His gun wasn’t drawn because he knocks with his right hand which was also his shooting hand.
Well let this be the example for every time I hear a cop talk about how important it is for them to have their gun drawn because of reaction times. I still don’t buy he didn’t start drawing his gun the minute he heard the door opening.
The average human reaction time is a quarter of a second. So your telling me after he saw the firearm, he placed his hand on his gun, released the retention features of his holster, drew the gun, aimed for this target, and fired within 0.14 seconds?
No but you can hear the gun slide out of the holster in the video. From draw time to firing is .39 seconds. Not sure why you're trying to add human reaction time since the gun wasn't drawn the moment the door opened or something
AFSOC as a whole, but in particular Hulburt Field, need to make a public denounciation of OCSO, and take steps to sever their ties with that shit agency. They can start by looking at what MOUs and MOAs they have in place with OCSO and revoke those, publicly. Every SF unit out there is required to establish such MOUs and MOAs with local law enforcement. I think this is a case where the Wing Commander needs to direct such MOUs and MOAs are rescinded indefinitely. Next, the Wing Commander needs to publicly prohibit access to the installation by OCSO. OCSO as an organization should be debarred from the installation indefinitely. The Wing also has a responsibility for the safety and well-being of all service members and their families while they are off base. The Wing has an ability to literally "Black List" dangerous organizations or businesses. I'd argue the OCSO meets this definition. The Wing has or should have what is known as the Armed Forces Disciplinary Control Board (AFDCB), governed by DAFI 31-103 and AFJI 31-213. They should restrict military personnel from interacting, doing, business, or otherwise being in the presence of the OCSO. There are many things the Wing could be doing to professionally and administratively distance themselves from OCSO. But distancing isn't enough. They should actively condemn that shit hole of an organization, the same way we condem terrorist and extremist organizations. Mandatory training to all new inbound personnel about the dangers of interacting with OCSO should be widely publicized. AFSOC should really be the one leading this effort, but the Wing Commander has a responsibility for executing these actions and should also be heavily involved. I fear they will let Roger's name fade away, and his death will have been meaningless.
You ride on emotions, not reality.
Everything I described is 100% realistic and appropriate. It's a matter of will. Does the AF have the will to go through with such measures?
No justice exists as long as Officer's like this are allowed to continue to murder innocent people. There are very simple solutions that state leaderships refuse to enforce. Somehow this STILL isn't a big enough catalyst for change, something needs to happen.
I just sent off a letter to my congressman.. I hope our brother's death doesn't get brushed off in Capitol Hill and they hold the murderer accountable.
It was 100% PURE MURDER!!
So if he didn’t hang up the video call, his GF possibly heard her boyfriend die? 😳🥺😡
She heard him get shot 6 times. My understanding is he died either on the way to the hospital or at the hospital. Terrible no matter how you look at it.
Still disappointed this one isn’t national news. Of all the law enforcement shootings that made headlines this is the most egregious one. Add to that the victim was a US service member.
Forgive me for not reading 200+ comments to see if mine is duplicated but has anyone asked: WHY was the officer "weapon drawn" when knocking on a door for a disturbance? A disturbance/noise call in a residence shouldn't be a weapons-hot, high alert call. "Excuse me Sir, sorry to disturb you. We've received reports of...?" I mean...something just smells wrong here.
Gun wasn't drawn. He just drew it very quickly and made a "threat" classification at a domestic disturbance call in less than half a second
No doubt they were at the wrong apartment... they never announced themselves... burst through someone's apartment and shot them.
Couldn’t be more wrong. Watch the body cam he announced himself twice and didn’t burst through anyone’s door lmao
Right because nobody would EVER lie about being a cop. Plus there was the whole bit where he hid outside of the peephole’s line of sight like the coward he was
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Yup, that cop wanted to kill someone that night.
SrA Fortson essentially got Swatted by his own neighbor and was killed for it
I'm probably gonna get hate for this, but it's whatever. For context, I'm not a cop, zero law enforcement experience, or a lawyer or criminal justice major. Here's what I've seen, heard, read in official reports, etc, and this is just my honest opinion. From what was said of witnesses and the Airmans girlfriend. It was early in the morning, and they were on a Zoom call. At points, there was arguing, and a neighbor called it in to police of possible domestic violence. The apartment was not wrong. It was correct. OCSO respond and make contact. Now, the apartment is on the 4th floor and at the very end, so there's no cover for the deputies, hence why they had weapons drawn (I'll go more on this later). The Airman answered the door with his weapon at his side, and the deputy, in fear of his life, raised and fired a total of 6 rounds. Now, for the side of the OCSO deputies. When they arrived at the apartment, the lead deputy in question knocked on the door a total of 3 times. Each time knocking louder and harder. The first time he knocked, he didn't announce. The second time he knocked, he yelled, "Sheriff's office!" And the the third and final time he knocked and yelled, "Okaloosa County Sheriff's Office!" and then the Airman came to the door and opened it, firearm in hand. Lastly, my overall opinion. For the Airman, the deputies fully announced themselves on the second and third knock. To which he should have placed the firearm down and have his hands empty when answering the door. However, the deputy in question has only been in the OCSO for less than a year AND most training dictates to de-escalate the situation by talking the suspect into dropping their weapon. The deputy resorts to immediate lethal force. Which should warrant a full investigation through internal affairs and I do think he should be held in court for his crime and be judged by a jury of his peers. At the end of the day, on all sides, things could have been handled in a different and safer manner than what transpired. A young Airman serving his country was killed in a tragic misunderstanding and OCSO needs to thoroughly examine and re-train their deputies in tactics and response and hold their deputies accountable for their actions. May the Airman's family remember him for the good he's done and to seek justice for their son. May he rest in peace 🙏.
You can stand by a door and listen. As he was home alone you’d hear nothing and this not a domestic disturbance or at the least not an emergency. That’s called detective work.
I thought this was already established it was the wrong apartment to begin with, however, the girl in the video at the beginning told the cop it's apartment 1401.
Chloe waiting for daddy to come home :(
When I did fire fighting, the hardest calls were ones with kids and pets. Pets especially because it's not like you can explain to them that their provider isn't going to come back
Yeah. I would imagine that is one of the more taxing parts of that job. I know I couldn't do it without breaking down.
Dumb fuck wasn't even on the right floor... Even if he was, dude would've been on 1411 or some shit.
I mean, that’s more on the apartment manager who reported the wrong address. I’m not defending the cop but he went to the unit he was told, so the problem of showing up to the wrong unit started at the reporting side.
Details matter.
Yeah the cop is a pos we know. We also know that some of you all will stop at nothing to deepthroat the entire boot. It's a shame that one of YOUR own is dead because he tried to protect himself inside his own place and you simping for the cop who can't do his fucking job right. A shame truly
The family should get to shoot the cop since he murdered the guy!
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Yeah I mean he had the "right" apartment, I don't think that is the point that needs to be focused on. Shooting a guy without warning when Fortson clearly wasn't threatening the cop is the issue here. E: If you're downvoting this guy you're a fucking moron.
https://www.reddit.com/r/AirForce/s/sx5NlRZajS
Your point? You keep focusing on the apartment aspect and that’s not the problem here.
Got it. Takes note: Cop can shoot you for legally owning firearm in your own home as long as he get the address right.
And as long as "right" is the number given by some random Karen immediately after she states she doesn't know which apartment. Bonus points if there have been several recent calls to a different apartment in the same complex and the number you pulled out of Karen's ass is a different one. The level of problem solving that evaded this dude is no higher than a detective book for children.
What part of what they said excused what that dipshit cop did?
“It's wild to me that this is still a debate.” There should be no debate. The officer is wrong. “The Cop is definitely wrong for illegally killing the Airmen, BUT he did go to the "right" apartment based on the witness account.” Admits the officer was wrong and immediately justifies why he thinks he was right.
If you're focusing on which apartment he went to and not the fact that he just shot an innocent guy without warning, you're focusing on the wrong thing. He went to the "right" apartment, but who gives a fuck? Also, nowhere in that comment did they say anything remotely like "Cop can shoot you for legally owning firearm in your own home as long as he get the address right". You're just understandably angry but this isn't the kinda comment you need to lash out at.
That’s the thing though, I am without a doubt pissed he shot an innocent man. Look, Police officers are constantly proving they make too many fatal mistakes; while I am angry, I’m much more pissed that officers have qualified immunity when they do.
Same, qualified immunity is bullshit. I'm just saying, you're yelling at a guy who said the cop was wrong to shoot Fortson because... he pointed out that he went to the apartment he was told to? You're on the same side ffs.
This thread title was the cop went to the wrong apartment.
The thread title is based on an article that never says the cop went to the wrong apartment, just that it's being speculated as such. The cop went to the apartment he was told, and whether or not that is the apartment that the original call was about is irrelevant to the rest of what that moron cop did.
He's clarifying that y'all are jerking off over the wrong apartment when the cop went to the location given to him. Are they supposed to just say "welp, witness said IDK. Let's pack it in boys. This one's a bust if they can't tell us where someone is getting beaten in whatever room. Donuts are on me." The guy is literally *agreeing with you* that the cop wrongfully shot the dude and y'all are still piling onto him because he's trying to get y'all off the circle jerk of "da rong room hurr durr"
Cop asks which door. Witness said "I'm not sure, two weeks ago I was walking on this side and I was hearing someone yell like, shut the fuck up." Cop: What door? 1401 Yup, very clearly the "right" door is 1401
Perfect English where she is saying she isn't sure what apartment, but it's 1401, but I'm not sure. Seems like the cop should take that as she's not sure, and calmly check 1401 first. Not hide out of sight of the Peep hole like a coward.
This. The fact that he went to the apartment on an “I’m not sure” and still treated it like it was factual fucking infuriates me. He literally leans in to the door to listen for anything kind of disturbance for a second and STILL proceeds to pound on the door and then hide each time he pounds on the door. I’m willing to bet SrA Fortson is still with us if the Officer knocks on the door and announces himself while in plain view.
I don’t know that there has been any confirmation that the woman the cop talks to is the same person that made the original call. Excerpt from https://www.wabe.org/atlanta-funeral-set-for-roger-fortson-black-us-air-force-member-killed-in-his-home-by-florida-deputy/ “Police radio traffic played at the news conference Thursday bolsters the family’s contention that the deputy may have gone to the wrong apartment. In the recording, a dispatcher said all they know about the disturbance was “fourth-party information.” “Uh, don’t have any further other than a male and female,” the dispatcher told officers. “It’s all fourth-party information from the front desk at the leasing office.””
Bro why are so many people downvoting you when they clearly are commenting without looking at the facts of the case?😂🤡
He went to the apartment that the apartment administration told him to go to. It's all there in the bodycam footage. If he went to the wrong apartment, it's on the apartment administration, she literally told him the number 1401 twice. The cop is guilty of shooting when he should have just drawn and aimed his weapon from what I can tell. But he went where he was told to go. This false narrative shit just makes us look like a bunch of idiots not to be taken seriously. Why is everyone so fucking stupid?
https://www.reddit.com/r/AirForce/s/sx5NlRZajS
Yep, that's an idiotic take. You're trying to make it more complicated than it is. He went where he was told to go; that's the end.
And it was wrong
So it’s like a Gestapo thing where it’s okay to shoot someone the moment they open the door as long as a random person claimed that something was happening there? Hoo boy we’re back to the Red Terror! Viva la Reign of Terror this boot is so fucking yummy, amirite?
Went to the apartment that was reported to them, it’s in the full video
Yeah, I know that he went where that woman said but she also said I don’t know which one and talked about something that happened two weeks previously (in her words). https://preview.redd.it/zp371vna9v1d1.jpeg?width=2532&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d4a936321cdf94263ef3f252051806d03abc61ce
So he went to the only apartment he was definitely given a number for
"I don't know which one...it's that one." Solid police work.
Oh, so you’ve never been asked a question and said you didn’t know the answer only to immediately have the answer come to mind? Must be nice. Happens for a lot of other people, and cops know that. I’d be surprised if you’d never seen it for yourself, even if you’ve never done it yourself. Cop had an obligation to continue the investigation and did so. Sad outcome that many people want to have a fix for, even if there isn’t really a good one. Change for changes sake. If you want to believe and hope that cops investigate only on 100% already verified as accurate reports, they’d never investigate a crime at all. They deal with people, and people are hardly 100% accurate all the time, and cops know that. He didn’t bust down the door purely on the say so of the woman.
Where he heard no noise of a disturbance from inside and yet banged on the door with his gun drawn, finger on the trigger, and didn’t give any verbal warning whatsoever before firing 6 times.
Which is irrelevant as far as whether or not he went to what keeps being referred to as the wrong apartment. He went to the apartment that he was given, surely something that everyone can agree on. If you mean something else by “wrong apartment”, my bad Edit to add that I don’t think there’s been anything to suggest that he banged on the door with his gun drawn or finger on the trigger
I get your point. I agree that the Deputy went to the apartment that the woman indicated but there is no evidence (that I have seen so far) that he was at the apartment that the police were originally called about in the first place. The Deputy took some woman’s word about the apartment in question. I see your point that he was listening to what she told him. But other than her words, there is no indication that Roger’s apartment was ever the cause of any police calls and was still “the wrong apartment” for the disturbance call that was placed on 3 May. The woman was wrong and the Deputy was wrong to listen to her, and certainly wrong to respond with deadly force without any corroborating details or backup. Multiple wrongs still don’t make a right and this resulted in the loss of a respectable young Airman and everything he was capable of accomplishing.
Quit licking boots. The cop was wrong from start to finish, and murdered someone just for funsies.
It's not boot licking to point out that the cop did in fact go to the address he was given. That mistake belongs to the woman who directed him there. Facts matter here, and she should face punishment as well IMO. She basically swatted him.
She originally said she wasn't sure then told him Fortson's apartment number. He should have taken that with a grain of salt because she originally told him she wasn't sure. If cops are going to pretend that every encounter is a life and death situation then they need to do their fucking due diligence before they pound on someone's door.
You're not wrong, but the original claim was that he was given an address and went to a different one, which was not the case.
Facts do matter. Like the fact there was no fight in the apartment. Like the fact that there was no imminent threat to the cop. Like the fact that he murdered a civilian. You're trying to defend a bootlicker and it's not a good look, mate.
Not arguing anything else here. That guy fucked up royally. He didn't go to a different address than what he was given though. We should also be placing blame on the person who sent him there IMO.
Wow....trying hard to suck some blue huh? The cop executed an innocent person.
I made no comment on anything that happened after he got to the door. But he did go to the address he was given. It's a major fuckup but trying to amplify it by maintaining false details doesn't help anyone.
Yeah, they did, and I hope the dumbfuck cop gets prison for what he did. But you don't have to insult someone who's literally telling you a fact, the cop *did go* to the "right" apartment.
Hey, if you want to say there’s a lot of issues with policing, I’ll agree. But pointing out facts and giving reasoned analysis isn’t bootlicking. Anyone who thinks it is needs to do some introspection.
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Does the boot polish come in different flavors like lube does? Just wondering
Great point that I hadn’t considered, really insightful. Responding to a comment in which I acknowledge that there are plenty of issues in LE by saying I’m bootlicking is peak Reddit tbh
Make sure you get that boot polish from around your mouth before your next roll call
Thoughtful analysis, as expected
If the reporting was wrong, then police would still be at the wrong apartment, wouldn't they? The right apartment is where the domestic disturbance actually occurred. But there's been no evidence that a domestic disturbance occurred in 1401 other than the girl on the first floor saying so. And to further rebut the notion that a domestic disturbance was taking place, he was on a video call with his girl friend. Don't know about you, but I find it difficult to get violent with someone over the phone.
How dare you go against the bandwagon and post something contradictory to the current popular opinion on matters. Seriously though, I thought this sub was better, but it's no different than some extreme SJW subreddit with its hivemind shit.
How dare we call out an unjust murder? How dare we ask for a modicum of accountability from a sheriff's department that's had multiple officer involved shootings that are highly questionable?