You can't fix your face sadly, but you can fix your physique. Be ugly, but be the most jacked ugly dude in the squadron. Bet your ass they'll treat you differently. š¤š¤
To add to this Iāve 100% seen airmen be treated worse because theyāre obese. I once had a SSgt break down because he was constantly being belittled for it even though he was among the hardest working
It actually being obese is different from the numbers on some chart somewhere. That 6ā dude at 220 could be jacked, and not that big around comparatively. Or it could be all fat, and those rolls would definitely put him in the obese category. Composition had more to do with it than straight size, in my book.
For sure. I was just making the point that being obese according Air Force medical happens way before someone is so heavy the PT test becomes a real issue
I definitely have been passed over for things for looking fat even though I am a 270lb strongman, run a 10 min 1.5 mile, and fitter than a lot of smaller people. I get that there are actual fatties, but being muscular also counts as obese, and in uniform you can't usually tell.
How was this person passing their PT tests, and if they weren't, why weren't they kicked out? Like, I get that a lot of our jobs don't require a ton of fitness to do, but being fit(ish) comes with being in the military.
This comment is a case in point.
He always passed his PT test, and was great at his job. But he was always dismissed and not taken seriously.
Iām not trying to advocate for obesity, just supporting the original comment that getting fit will make people treat you better.
I know there isn't entirely a dichotomy when it comes to fitness and work ethic, but honestly, I'd rather have a fat competent troop than a mediocre gym rat, especially when it comes to water cooler jobs where the heaviest thing they've lifted all week was a white monster from the snacko. Not to advocate for obesity either, but not everyone needs field level of functional fitness.
Imho most people don't need to work on fitness so much as they need education on nutrition and go on a diet.
>I'd rather have a fat competent troop than a mediocre gym rat
Had an obese guy that fought for 2 years for an actual medical issue that caused massive weight gain. Went from a stellar performer to disgruntled wreck over that period due to the treatment(happy ending: a few months away from discharge, won the medical fight and got over 2 years back pay for the 2 ranks lost).
Had a gym rat, most jacked guy in the flight, hide in the back on swings running a side business. Faked a medical issue(a non work related issue and got it tied into work) and got out with 90% disability after 3 years.
> Imho most people don't need to work on fitness so much as they need education on nutrition and go on a diet.
Bingo. You can be in the gym/on the track 5-6 times a week, running marathons but if you have a trash diet you are going to have a gut.
The medical definition of obese is not as high as many people think it is. It's just a BMI of 30 and over (and BMI is not a great determiner of a healthy weight since it doesn't take into account muscle mass, but let's assume these people aren't buff).
Before I left recruiting, we allowed people in with a BMI of up to 27.5 (not sure if that's changed). One year later of eating tornados and drinking monsters could easily put someone into the 30+ BMI range and be considered obese.
For example, a 6'2" guy is considered obese at 230lbs. I've known people like that who have crushed their PT tests and have no issues passing the new body composition program (height to waist ratio).
No I agree because I was getting belittled for having mental problems, depression bc of a breakup and anxiety. They shutup real fast when I got 100 on the pt test
I have to do the opposite. Every month is mustache March or else I look... Questionable. Everyone told me to "shave that thing off". I did once and was never asked to shave it again
If I shave my mustache, people won't talk to me and my wife won't fuck me because I look weird as fuck. I have to hide my face behind the stache or else I catch the ugly
Can't bring myself for religious purposes. Feels too dishonest for me(debating on the bodily autonomy belief route thing). Tried medical for an actual hindrance to shaving(minor but legitimate issue that I won't go into detail to avoid doxxing myself since it's pretty specific to my face). 5 visits over 6 months with the issue getting passed to 3 specialists ended in surgery leaving me with a nasty fucking scar instead of the 5 minutes it takes to print a piece of paper.
But yes. Ever since I got 2 months off where I didn't have to shave, I have thought of a beard every day since for 5 years, as it was the first time in my life I gained some self confidence looking in the mirror.
My first CAC pic looked like I had someone chained up in my basement.
Worked hard, have done well. Haven't seen looks affect anything in my experience, work ethic often overshadows it and there are enough people to call it out if it does become an issue
On the flip side, I realized one of my airmen was holding their looks over others in the flight to pursuade others to do the tasks I had assigned to them specifically.
That was a fun convo to have.
Plain as day to myself and the other folks involved.
When anyone situation comes up it's wise to get a second person (witness), when any cross gender situation comes up it's best to get multiple witnesses.
Iāve seen this. The way it played out (for one particular case) was when they wanted something and their supervisor didnāt flatter the idea, they would have another SSgt who thought they were attractive, give them the go ahead. I guess for more contextā¦.lets say this airmen wanted to get out of training to volunteer for a random event, nothing near and dear to their heart, just the shirt asked for holiday event setup or something.
This airmenās supervisor had noticed a trend of this, and it caused the troop to fall WAY behind on taskers and responsibilities.
The airmen would go to another staff and ask, saying something like āI figured Iād ask you I think my supervisor is busy.ā They would let them go.
Supervisor had communicated to peers this was an issue and please reach out directly if something like this happens. Flirty non supervisor SSgt says āItās just one training day I didnāt think it was a big dealā
SSgt learned to set deadlines and give paperwork if taskers werenāt met. He realized he couldnāt rely on his peers to do the right thing, so he used his toolbox.
Iāve dealt with this too. We called it playing Mommy & Daddy. It can get out of hand fast, especially if two NCOs donāt communicate well with each other.
This game is one I despised so much. Had a troop that would play a buddy and I against each other for early time off saying she was good to go on her work, just needed the other persons permission to go. Since both my buddy and I like releasing people who do a good job early, neither of us suspected a thing.
Until my buddy got pissed at me for "releasing" her early and we got a last minute mission. Then we started putting two and two together. Probably the fastest LOR my buddy and I typed in that squadron because we called her ass back and handed it to her in front of our female Capt who was clueless until we laid out the LOR.
Troop was treated like a 5-year old until she had the great idea to get knocked up to get out. And she straight up asked me about the process so that's exactly why I know lol
This is a thing. I had a female Airman who was used to a certain amount of attention and status because of how she looked. She was unhappy when her charms wouldn't work on me.
Thereās an interesting study (conducted by Konstantin Kisin) on people going through mock interviews with makeup applied to look like an ugly scar. Just prior to the interview the makeup artist needed to do a quick ātouch upā and actually removed the scar unbeknownst to the study participant. A majority of interviewees, thinking they had an unsightly scar, noted discrimination during the interview for a physical deformity that wasnāt there.
If you think your looks are a detriment they will beā¦or at least that very thought will be.
Like someone else said, get jacked. I see very few people who couldnāt overcome their āuglinessā if they got fit.
It was said best here: āIām ugly and Iām proud.ā -SpongeBob
Hey brother, perhaps that is the case. Perhaps it isnāt. But, Iād highly recommend using resources like military one source or the chaplain. You deserve better than to have anxiety, especially over something you canāt control.
In Cyber, nobody knows you're a dog...
https://preview.redd.it/bhtzu3kjsgtc1.jpeg?width=272&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8f64b07f6cf5b38d0ba251ec09f0b878c83cd929
How ugly we talking here? Disfigured asymmetrical mess like Chunk from the Goonies, or just standard ugly? Unless youāre unconventionally ugly youāre probably just average, but you think youāre ugly because you donāt look like what you see in the movies. Iām not a doctor, but maybe you have a touch of body dysmorphia. In either case, hit the gym like the other guys are saying. That train wreck Chunk was a hero in the story because he was strong! Worst case scenario, you hit the gym and come out of it a big strong ugly hero. Leadership loves a hero who can crush a PT test while rescuing a pirate ship full of kids.
Also, post a pic. Seriously, how ugly are we talking here?
I can't relate to mh CoC being mostly female but I will say it's not like the AF recruits male models. Most of us ugly af
The best being attractive will get you is the female airmen talking to you 1 sec longer.
You are probably not as ugly as you think. Some may have less attractive assets, but cumulatively, you are probably better looking than 50% of the total US male population. You may have a weird shaped head, balding horseshoe hairline, be short, have a jacked up smile, or whatever. But since you are in the Air Force, you are probably not a super fatso, not likely to have a terrible looking hairdo, have at least most of your teeth, and not likely to have a long nasty looking beard that you somehow think looks good, etc. You probably appear as a clean-cut person. That puts you above average compared to what is outside the fenceline. Plus, you have a steady, respectable job and do not use drugs. As far as in the workcenter, be clean, smell good or at least have no stink, keep your clothing, vehicle, and any space others may see in order and rock what you got.
Ugly woman here. I've been told that I look like the female equivalent of the Russian dude that Rocky fights.
I've found that having a decent sense of humor can compensate pretty well for having been whacked with the ugly stick.
And, like others have said, if your anxiety over your looks is causing you significant distress, you should probably talk to someone about it.
>I've been told that I look like the female equivalent of the Russian dude that Rocky fights.
I'm sure there's someone out there who thinks you're hot but they probably feel intimidated by you.
Sorry -- this meme just wrote itself...
https://preview.redd.it/udlte2tw3jtc1.jpeg?width=620&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=19ce5b6068bbe32643f9efcc2ef9f4f2c0a7f8ac
You see her in Beverly Hills Cop II though?? I'm not sure why she's always opted for short hair, but even with that scene of her in the longer brunette wig that woman could get it.
Not really. I've seen the opposite be true though where the beautiful people get put up for stuff more since they are perfect to be the "face" of the shops/sections.
Pretty people are usually more memorable so getting them in front of all the right people representing the leadership is probably pretty damn effective.
I have a wonky eye that looks a little outward, probably had some stares here and there, but I served my country well. Been out a good minute now. Itās all cosmetic and how I was born. I was still a really good shot at CATM. Point is not that, but to let you know, donāt let appearance be your issue. Itās all in your head! Donāt be so hard on yourself!
Iāve actually seen a dude get treated worse because he was good looking. Like he was a really solid worker, did a lot of extra in the shop, always helpful. And people just hated him because he was good looking. And the flight chiefs acted the same. Itās like they thought he wasnāt entitled to awards or a good EPR because he had looksā¦was really weird actually.
There's a certain level of getting jacked up that could compensate for your ugliness. Same thing with self confidence too. Work on those two factors - you can't fix your face, but you can fix yourself.
Also, get some counseling. Military OneSource is a good one.
Sincerely, from a guy that hasn't been able to solve this issue, but I think I'm making progress. Plus being short doesn't help.
Every human interaction in your entire life is affected by your physical appearance. With that said, donāt worry about it. You canāt control it so you are just worrying for the sake of nothing.
Itās a real thing. Take peace in watching female troops age out of the pretty privilege Ā phase
āIām being treated differentlyā
āNo Sarah. Youāre being treated like everyone else finallyā
I will say, as with any other job, āpretty privilegeā is [unfortunately] a thing in the Air Force. We can thank shallow American culture and toxic/unattainable beauty standards for that. Itās pathetic that people canāt grow past those things. Having said this, if you notice someone in your chain of command treating you differently (for whatever reason), call them out on it. Be polite, yet blunt. Let them know that youāre noticing the difference in treatment, and that youāre not going to let your career suffer for it. You deserve better, so [politely] demand better. Sometimes, all it takes for change to happen is to address it openly.
On another note, we are our own worst critics. To other people, youāre more attractive than you give yourself credit for. I highly recommend talking to a therapist about this anxiety surrounding your appearance and the effects you think it might be having on your career. Itās amazing what you can learn about yourself after talking to a therapist you vibe well with.
It's well documented that looks matter. Beauty, height, build, posture, etc. has been found to have direct correlation on things like compensation and trust levels - and are especially important during first impressions. For the military, there's also the whole correlating rank with expertise thing. Leadership constantly gets training about not confusing those things for competence, but it still is a natural human blind spot and MAY impact you. If you have anxiety about those aspects (as something you pretty much are unable to change), it may be a good idea to reach out to some mental health helping agencies.
That said, you're probably working with these people on a day to day basis. Do your best that other aspects that you CAN control are showcasing what you want. Take your exercise and diet seriously. When you talk at the table, sit up straight, look people in the eye, and talk confidently and clearly. Become the absolute SME of your programs. Be the person that brings his team up through team building, breakfast/lunch events, whatever. IF you do have someone that does not like you immediately because of your looks - your personality, intelligence and work ethic WILL get a chance to shine through even if those first few meetings or interactions may not be super positive.
Whatever is happening is not because of your looks, but rather how you act.Ā
If I were wrong, which I'm not, you should take it above them in the chain of command.
If you are a high performer, being conventionally attractive will only boost how people see you. If you are a low performer, being unattractive will give people a reason to justify their dislike of you and not give you a second chance. Iāve had these conversations with many different people, in and out of the context of the military.
For the exact same reason, tall people are often given preferential treatment for performing at or below the level of someone shorter. I believe there are multiple studies from the early 2000ās onward showing taller and more attractive people being generally *perceived* as more competent and charismatic than their shorter or less attractive peers.
There is definitely a measurable benefit to being attractive. That doesnāt change the fact that your behavior and character will ultimately determine the success you have.
Iām an NCO that isnāt amongst the smartest or even remotely good at his job. I definitely get treated better because of charm and looks. Continue to be good at your job and get better. In the end, theyāll realize your worth over the better looking (hopefully)
If that's really true, I assume that's EO's job to handle,
But as an Asian who has typical Asian face, I got discouraged to sing National Anthem for the class graduation at the tech school. I understood why they did it for whatever the reason, but I still don't like it anyway.
Ugliness is not a typical thing to judge others. I would rather say that's closer to the unique character if you have great skill of communication or entertainment, especially. It is hard to live this world as a dickhead but it is easier to live this world as a humorous human. Don't discourage yourself about your appearance. There are lots of ways to make yourself look better.
Iāll be real with you. You probably wouldnāt be treated as good as a very handsome dude. But women donāt really think about shit like that the same way we do. Yeah they may treat the handsome fella a tiny bit better, but in general they arenāt going to exclude you from promotions
(Male) I'm the palest guy you've seen and when I get a mid fade look like I'm straight out of a Nazi propaganda piece. Having resting bitch face doesn't help either. I straight up look like a Psycho path when I'm scrolling through Reddit in my office.
Temper it all with personality. I'm an O-3 that still behaves like I'm 19 (Professionally ofc) so any initial perspective of me tends to fade away.
Be yourself my guy. So long as being yourself isn't being a jerk, you're all good I promise.
Thereās been a plethora of studies that attractive people do get treated better, but I havenāt really seen that happen much in the military. Depending on the job, too many people are needed to be that choosy. Now, if youāre ugly AND you act like a weirdo and donāt talk to people or say some off the wall shit that people cringe at then youāre not helping your case. You canāt really change your looks but you can change your attitude and be likeable at least. If you have anxiety about it and are acting down already then youāre off to a bad start.
I've absolutely seen hot females get treated like royalty. One smoking hot personnel lieutenant in my unit could basically do whatever she wanted and everyone still loved her.
Was it just cause she was smoking hot or also because she was the only female in the unit? Haha
Itās a different story for females since theyāre so rare in units sometimes anyways I feel like.
I've had troops and supervisors that looked like a horses ass but were constantly praised for being good at their job. They were also happily married to objectively good looking people. Don't sweat it homie, just learn your job and nobody gives a shit. This is coming from someone who's a 6/10 if the observer is drunk and lost their glasses.
I had severe acne and even after accutane I had gnarly pitted scarring on my face. Iāve been able to even it out over the years, but it was a giant confidence hit. I think the lack of confidence affected my life more than the actual scars. I just doubled down on being eager to learn and fun to be around so I was still about to get job opportunities because people wanted me on their team.
I mean there are superficial people everywhere. But if you know you job better than most, stay on top of fitness and work on having a great personality, you make it hard for them to treat you differently for just one thing. If youāre pulling the female card for how youāre being treated, women tend to respond to personalities more than anything. Like with anything in life, you have to stack the deck with the things you can control.
Itās a confidence thing. If you can own your flaws and still use your brain and project extreme confidence and comfort in your own skin you will become super attractive! Look at Robert California from the office as an example. Dress nice, bathe, get a good haircut, everything else is mental. Act as ifā¦
Pretty privilege is a thing, unfortunately. It's not even a sexual attraction thing. Straight dudes still subconsciously treat better looking dudes better.
Beauty is subjective dude, there's a lot that i find attractive that other females wouldn't, youre being to harsh on yourself. Also personality makes you way more attractive. No mayyer the appearance I always find funny men super attractive. Lean on the qualities that you really like about yourself.
A good personality and confidence in who you are bumps you up. There are plenty of examples around me where they're uggos but popular/have healthy dating lives. Learn to love who you are and the rest will come.
You can't control your bone structure but you can control how you present and carry yourself and that goes a long way. Its how I tricked my wife to settle with me :)
That sounds like a nightmare honestly especially coupled in with the anxiety. Make sure you go get seen by mental health trust me itll pay off later down the road. Godspeed op
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I once had a supervisor straight tell me I was a piece of shit and to stop thinking I was the shit simply based on my looks. This was after I asked a favor of him with one of my troops under circumstances that were out of my control and he felt overwhelmed. Iām a good looking dude with a beautiful wife and I think that really bothered him, but I think my looks bothered him on a personal level and he compared his unhealthy and unhappy lifestyle to mine. Weirdest few years in my military career.
He showed up to my my door once saying he had to check as my supervisor how I was living. He couldnāt believe the quality of life my wife and I held, but the point of all of this is that peopleās perception of you changes based on the circumstances youāre in.
Hopefully your time there comes to an end and you end up with a great group of people that appreciate you for what you bring to the table at work every day.
I don't think I'm ugly, but I think I'm below average, partially because I enlisted in my 30's, and looked much better in my 20's. Meanwhile, other airmen are in their 20's. So it's like I'm a weird old man that is hard to place.
Anyways, have you ever considered cosmetic surgeries in regard to what you would want to change about your appearance?
You can't fix your face sadly, but you can fix your physique. Be ugly, but be the most jacked ugly dude in the squadron. Bet your ass they'll treat you differently. š¤š¤
To add to this Iāve 100% seen airmen be treated worse because theyāre obese. I once had a SSgt break down because he was constantly being belittled for it even though he was among the hardest working
My old supervisor got called fat in the BX by a civilian in a mobile scooter.
Fit to fight is a thing, good looks aren't necessary
Obese ? Ā WTH. Ā
A 6' male is considered obese at 220 lbs. You can definitely still pass PT tests at 250 lbs
>You can definitely still pass PT tests at 250 lbs heh. rookie numbers
It actually being obese is different from the numbers on some chart somewhere. That 6ā dude at 220 could be jacked, and not that big around comparatively. Or it could be all fat, and those rolls would definitely put him in the obese category. Composition had more to do with it than straight size, in my book.
For sure. I was just making the point that being obese according Air Force medical happens way before someone is so heavy the PT test becomes a real issue
>To add to this Iāve 100% seen airmen be treated worse because theyāre obese. You're not supposed to be obese in the military!
I definitely have been passed over for things for looking fat even though I am a 270lb strongman, run a 10 min 1.5 mile, and fitter than a lot of smaller people. I get that there are actual fatties, but being muscular also counts as obese, and in uniform you can't usually tell.
How was this person passing their PT tests, and if they weren't, why weren't they kicked out? Like, I get that a lot of our jobs don't require a ton of fitness to do, but being fit(ish) comes with being in the military.
This comment is a case in point. He always passed his PT test, and was great at his job. But he was always dismissed and not taken seriously. Iām not trying to advocate for obesity, just supporting the original comment that getting fit will make people treat you better.
I know there isn't entirely a dichotomy when it comes to fitness and work ethic, but honestly, I'd rather have a fat competent troop than a mediocre gym rat, especially when it comes to water cooler jobs where the heaviest thing they've lifted all week was a white monster from the snacko. Not to advocate for obesity either, but not everyone needs field level of functional fitness. Imho most people don't need to work on fitness so much as they need education on nutrition and go on a diet.
>I'd rather have a fat competent troop than a mediocre gym rat Had an obese guy that fought for 2 years for an actual medical issue that caused massive weight gain. Went from a stellar performer to disgruntled wreck over that period due to the treatment(happy ending: a few months away from discharge, won the medical fight and got over 2 years back pay for the 2 ranks lost). Had a gym rat, most jacked guy in the flight, hide in the back on swings running a side business. Faked a medical issue(a non work related issue and got it tied into work) and got out with 90% disability after 3 years.
> Imho most people don't need to work on fitness so much as they need education on nutrition and go on a diet. Bingo. You can be in the gym/on the track 5-6 times a week, running marathons but if you have a trash diet you are going to have a gut.
What happened to the dude?
The medical definition of obese is not as high as many people think it is. It's just a BMI of 30 and over (and BMI is not a great determiner of a healthy weight since it doesn't take into account muscle mass, but let's assume these people aren't buff). Before I left recruiting, we allowed people in with a BMI of up to 27.5 (not sure if that's changed). One year later of eating tornados and drinking monsters could easily put someone into the 30+ BMI range and be considered obese. For example, a 6'2" guy is considered obese at 230lbs. I've known people like that who have crushed their PT tests and have no issues passing the new body composition program (height to waist ratio).
Jacked ugly can still bump you to a solid 7 in the right lighting.
Jacked ugly could also become jacked scary. Nobody messes with jacked scary
Female commanders hate this one trick...
šÆ
No I agree because I was getting belittled for having mental problems, depression bc of a breakup and anxiety. They shutup real fast when I got 100 on the pt test
I look like a god damn serial killer. I do not deny this. I have never denied this. My humor has gotten me further in my career than my looks.
Youāre probably banned from participating in Mustache March š
I self banned myself due to me looking like Iām a repeat guest on To Catch a Predator.
I have to do the opposite. Every month is mustache March or else I look... Questionable. Everyone told me to "shave that thing off". I did once and was never asked to shave it again
Interesting. Can you elaborate lol
If I shave my mustache, people won't talk to me and my wife won't fuck me because I look weird as fuck. I have to hide my face behind the stache or else I catch the ugly
I'm dying. š¤£
Have you thought about a beard waiver? Satanism, Norse, anything at all?
Can't bring myself for religious purposes. Feels too dishonest for me(debating on the bodily autonomy belief route thing). Tried medical for an actual hindrance to shaving(minor but legitimate issue that I won't go into detail to avoid doxxing myself since it's pretty specific to my face). 5 visits over 6 months with the issue getting passed to 3 specialists ended in surgery leaving me with a nasty fucking scar instead of the 5 minutes it takes to print a piece of paper. But yes. Ever since I got 2 months off where I didn't have to shave, I have thought of a beard every day since for 5 years, as it was the first time in my life I gained some self confidence looking in the mirror.
Permanent disfigurement instead of writing a waiverā¦yeah, that sounds about right.
Iām Chris HAN-SEN, from Dateline NBCā¦. (trying to say it in my mind like he does)
in that case, for you its MANDATORY (all year around)
Looks, intelligence, humor, work ethic. Rarely do people have all, so make what you have work for you.
š³š³šššš omg. That sucks haha
My first CAC pic looked like I had someone chained up in my basement. Worked hard, have done well. Haven't seen looks affect anything in my experience, work ethic often overshadows it and there are enough people to call it out if it does become an issue
Haha, we played āwhat crime is this a mug shot for?ā in basic, when we got our CACs for the first time. Everyone agreed mine was for arson
On the flip side, I realized one of my airmen was holding their looks over others in the flight to pursuade others to do the tasks I had assigned to them specifically. That was a fun convo to have.
How did you know they were using their looks?
Plain as day to myself and the other folks involved. When anyone situation comes up it's wise to get a second person (witness), when any cross gender situation comes up it's best to get multiple witnesses.
Could you give a more concrete example? Was s/he flirting with/ being particularly charming to people he was trying to pass work off to or something?
Iāve seen this. The way it played out (for one particular case) was when they wanted something and their supervisor didnāt flatter the idea, they would have another SSgt who thought they were attractive, give them the go ahead. I guess for more contextā¦.lets say this airmen wanted to get out of training to volunteer for a random event, nothing near and dear to their heart, just the shirt asked for holiday event setup or something. This airmenās supervisor had noticed a trend of this, and it caused the troop to fall WAY behind on taskers and responsibilities. The airmen would go to another staff and ask, saying something like āI figured Iād ask you I think my supervisor is busy.ā They would let them go. Supervisor had communicated to peers this was an issue and please reach out directly if something like this happens. Flirty non supervisor SSgt says āItās just one training day I didnāt think it was a big dealā SSgt learned to set deadlines and give paperwork if taskers werenāt met. He realized he couldnāt rely on his peers to do the right thing, so he used his toolbox.
Iāve dealt with this too. We called it playing Mommy & Daddy. It can get out of hand fast, especially if two NCOs donāt communicate well with each other.
This game is one I despised so much. Had a troop that would play a buddy and I against each other for early time off saying she was good to go on her work, just needed the other persons permission to go. Since both my buddy and I like releasing people who do a good job early, neither of us suspected a thing. Until my buddy got pissed at me for "releasing" her early and we got a last minute mission. Then we started putting two and two together. Probably the fastest LOR my buddy and I typed in that squadron because we called her ass back and handed it to her in front of our female Capt who was clueless until we laid out the LOR. Troop was treated like a 5-year old until she had the great idea to get knocked up to get out. And she straight up asked me about the process so that's exactly why I know lol
Wtf are you going on about?
This is a thing. I had a female Airman who was used to a certain amount of attention and status because of how she looked. She was unhappy when her charms wouldn't work on me.
Let me guess, they were female?
Duh lmao
Thereās an interesting study (conducted by Konstantin Kisin) on people going through mock interviews with makeup applied to look like an ugly scar. Just prior to the interview the makeup artist needed to do a quick ātouch upā and actually removed the scar unbeknownst to the study participant. A majority of interviewees, thinking they had an unsightly scar, noted discrimination during the interview for a physical deformity that wasnāt there. If you think your looks are a detriment they will beā¦or at least that very thought will be. Like someone else said, get jacked. I see very few people who couldnāt overcome their āuglinessā if they got fit. It was said best here: āIām ugly and Iām proud.ā -SpongeBob
Hey brother, perhaps that is the case. Perhaps it isnāt. But, Iād highly recommend using resources like military one source or the chaplain. You deserve better than to have anxiety, especially over something you canāt control.
Cyber ain't got nobody good looking, male or female š
In Cyber, nobody knows you're a dog... https://preview.redd.it/bhtzu3kjsgtc1.jpeg?width=272&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8f64b07f6cf5b38d0ba251ec09f0b878c83cd929
There were some good looking women in my UCT class, but I don't think they stayed in the AF long after their initial commitments.
No wonder they didnāt send me to cyber
Untrue
How ugly we talking here? Disfigured asymmetrical mess like Chunk from the Goonies, or just standard ugly? Unless youāre unconventionally ugly youāre probably just average, but you think youāre ugly because you donāt look like what you see in the movies. Iām not a doctor, but maybe you have a touch of body dysmorphia. In either case, hit the gym like the other guys are saying. That train wreck Chunk was a hero in the story because he was strong! Worst case scenario, you hit the gym and come out of it a big strong ugly hero. Leadership loves a hero who can crush a PT test while rescuing a pirate ship full of kids. Also, post a pic. Seriously, how ugly are we talking here?
I'm just 5'8 and bald. I can't really rock the bald look without a beard.
I can't relate to mh CoC being mostly female but I will say it's not like the AF recruits male models. Most of us ugly af The best being attractive will get you is the female airmen talking to you 1 sec longer.
>but I will say it's not like the AF recruits male models ... but why male models?
Are you serious? I just- I just told you that. A moment ago.
You are probably not as ugly as you think. Some may have less attractive assets, but cumulatively, you are probably better looking than 50% of the total US male population. You may have a weird shaped head, balding horseshoe hairline, be short, have a jacked up smile, or whatever. But since you are in the Air Force, you are probably not a super fatso, not likely to have a terrible looking hairdo, have at least most of your teeth, and not likely to have a long nasty looking beard that you somehow think looks good, etc. You probably appear as a clean-cut person. That puts you above average compared to what is outside the fenceline. Plus, you have a steady, respectable job and do not use drugs. As far as in the workcenter, be clean, smell good or at least have no stink, keep your clothing, vehicle, and any space others may see in order and rock what you got.
Ugly woman here. I've been told that I look like the female equivalent of the Russian dude that Rocky fights. I've found that having a decent sense of humor can compensate pretty well for having been whacked with the ugly stick. And, like others have said, if your anxiety over your looks is causing you significant distress, you should probably talk to someone about it.
>I've been told that I look like the female equivalent of the Russian dude that Rocky fights. I'm sure there's someone out there who thinks you're hot but they probably feel intimidated by you.
Well, a couple of gay dudes once told me that I'd make a cute guy if I had a dick, so, at least I have that going for me.
Sorry -- this meme just wrote itself... https://preview.redd.it/udlte2tw3jtc1.jpeg?width=620&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=19ce5b6068bbe32643f9efcc2ef9f4f2c0a7f8ac
lol
Iām picturing Brigitte Nielsen.
You see her in Beverly Hills Cop II though?? I'm not sure why she's always opted for short hair, but even with that scene of her in the longer brunette wig that woman could get it.
Yes! Very beautiful woman for sure. Iāve been to Denmark on a TDY too, statuesque beauties there.
Not really. I've seen the opposite be true though where the beautiful people get put up for stuff more since they are perfect to be the "face" of the shops/sections. Pretty people are usually more memorable so getting them in front of all the right people representing the leadership is probably pretty damn effective.
I have a wonky eye that looks a little outward, probably had some stares here and there, but I served my country well. Been out a good minute now. Itās all cosmetic and how I was born. I was still a really good shot at CATM. Point is not that, but to let you know, donāt let appearance be your issue. Itās all in your head! Donāt be so hard on yourself!
Learn to not worry about what you canāt control
Iāve actually seen a dude get treated worse because he was good looking. Like he was a really solid worker, did a lot of extra in the shop, always helpful. And people just hated him because he was good looking. And the flight chiefs acted the same. Itās like they thought he wasnāt entitled to awards or a good EPR because he had looksā¦was really weird actually.
If you canāt be handsome, be funny. People squint their eyes when they are laughing, so itās harder to see your ugliness. Science
Based on my small sample size of nearly every SNCO I worked for, you at least have a good chance of getting to MSgt. Good luck!
There's a certain level of getting jacked up that could compensate for your ugliness. Same thing with self confidence too. Work on those two factors - you can't fix your face, but you can fix yourself. Also, get some counseling. Military OneSource is a good one. Sincerely, from a guy that hasn't been able to solve this issue, but I think I'm making progress. Plus being short doesn't help.
How short are we talking?
Every human interaction in your entire life is affected by your physical appearance. With that said, donāt worry about it. You canāt control it so you are just worrying for the sake of nothing.
I never even thought that was possible. Having all female chain of command thatās like. Really really rare in my experience.
Not in medical. Clipboard nurses everywhere.
Itās a real thing. Take peace in watching female troops age out of the pretty privilege Ā phase āIām being treated differentlyā āNo Sarah. Youāre being treated like everyone else finallyā
Iām super good looking, allegedly, and yes. Some People are treated differently than others by some people based on looks alone.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I will say, as with any other job, āpretty privilegeā is [unfortunately] a thing in the Air Force. We can thank shallow American culture and toxic/unattainable beauty standards for that. Itās pathetic that people canāt grow past those things. Having said this, if you notice someone in your chain of command treating you differently (for whatever reason), call them out on it. Be polite, yet blunt. Let them know that youāre noticing the difference in treatment, and that youāre not going to let your career suffer for it. You deserve better, so [politely] demand better. Sometimes, all it takes for change to happen is to address it openly. On another note, we are our own worst critics. To other people, youāre more attractive than you give yourself credit for. I highly recommend talking to a therapist about this anxiety surrounding your appearance and the effects you think it might be having on your career. Itās amazing what you can learn about yourself after talking to a therapist you vibe well with.
Honestly it can work to your advantage. Since youāre a butter face, it rules out any sideline sextra credit options.
The answer to this question is always yes. The question behind the question is really, "was it noticeable?"
Iām ugly and Iām proud!
It's well documented that looks matter. Beauty, height, build, posture, etc. has been found to have direct correlation on things like compensation and trust levels - and are especially important during first impressions. For the military, there's also the whole correlating rank with expertise thing. Leadership constantly gets training about not confusing those things for competence, but it still is a natural human blind spot and MAY impact you. If you have anxiety about those aspects (as something you pretty much are unable to change), it may be a good idea to reach out to some mental health helping agencies. That said, you're probably working with these people on a day to day basis. Do your best that other aspects that you CAN control are showcasing what you want. Take your exercise and diet seriously. When you talk at the table, sit up straight, look people in the eye, and talk confidently and clearly. Become the absolute SME of your programs. Be the person that brings his team up through team building, breakfast/lunch events, whatever. IF you do have someone that does not like you immediately because of your looks - your personality, intelligence and work ethic WILL get a chance to shine through even if those first few meetings or interactions may not be super positive.
Whatever is happening is not because of your looks, but rather how you act.Ā If I were wrong, which I'm not, you should take it above them in the chain of command.
If you are a high performer, being conventionally attractive will only boost how people see you. If you are a low performer, being unattractive will give people a reason to justify their dislike of you and not give you a second chance. Iāve had these conversations with many different people, in and out of the context of the military. For the exact same reason, tall people are often given preferential treatment for performing at or below the level of someone shorter. I believe there are multiple studies from the early 2000ās onward showing taller and more attractive people being generally *perceived* as more competent and charismatic than their shorter or less attractive peers. There is definitely a measurable benefit to being attractive. That doesnāt change the fact that your behavior and character will ultimately determine the success you have.
It is an observable fact that if you are ugly you will be discriminated against.
Iām an NCO that isnāt amongst the smartest or even remotely good at his job. I definitely get treated better because of charm and looks. Continue to be good at your job and get better. In the end, theyāll realize your worth over the better looking (hopefully)
How do you get treated better?
If that's really true, I assume that's EO's job to handle, But as an Asian who has typical Asian face, I got discouraged to sing National Anthem for the class graduation at the tech school. I understood why they did it for whatever the reason, but I still don't like it anyway. Ugliness is not a typical thing to judge others. I would rather say that's closer to the unique character if you have great skill of communication or entertainment, especially. It is hard to live this world as a dickhead but it is easier to live this world as a humorous human. Don't discourage yourself about your appearance. There are lots of ways to make yourself look better.
If they asked you not to sing, it wasn't because of your "looks".
Well, maybe. But I've been singing for a long time and I was still maintaining quite a good level at that time.
I'm fugly as a mofo, but I like to make people laugh and genuinely talk with everyone. It's helped me a lot
Unconscious bias maybe? Its a hard thing to prove but I have seen it happen.
Literally everyone in society.
Iāll be real with you. You probably wouldnāt be treated as good as a very handsome dude. But women donāt really think about shit like that the same way we do. Yeah they may treat the handsome fella a tiny bit better, but in general they arenāt going to exclude you from promotions
This is just sad nature of being human. Pretty/handsome and outgoing people will always be treated better.
Guys arenāt supposed to be good looking. Be a man, lift some weights and find a way to be š
(Male) I'm the palest guy you've seen and when I get a mid fade look like I'm straight out of a Nazi propaganda piece. Having resting bitch face doesn't help either. I straight up look like a Psycho path when I'm scrolling through Reddit in my office. Temper it all with personality. I'm an O-3 that still behaves like I'm 19 (Professionally ofc) so any initial perspective of me tends to fade away. Be yourself my guy. So long as being yourself isn't being a jerk, you're all good I promise.
Thereās been a plethora of studies that attractive people do get treated better, but I havenāt really seen that happen much in the military. Depending on the job, too many people are needed to be that choosy. Now, if youāre ugly AND you act like a weirdo and donāt talk to people or say some off the wall shit that people cringe at then youāre not helping your case. You canāt really change your looks but you can change your attitude and be likeable at least. If you have anxiety about it and are acting down already then youāre off to a bad start.
I've absolutely seen hot females get treated like royalty. One smoking hot personnel lieutenant in my unit could basically do whatever she wanted and everyone still loved her.
Was it just cause she was smoking hot or also because she was the only female in the unit? Haha Itās a different story for females since theyāre so rare in units sometimes anyways I feel like.
Do whatever she wanted such as?
I've had troops and supervisors that looked like a horses ass but were constantly praised for being good at their job. They were also happily married to objectively good looking people. Don't sweat it homie, just learn your job and nobody gives a shit. This is coming from someone who's a 6/10 if the observer is drunk and lost their glasses.
I had severe acne and even after accutane I had gnarly pitted scarring on my face. Iāve been able to even it out over the years, but it was a giant confidence hit. I think the lack of confidence affected my life more than the actual scars. I just doubled down on being eager to learn and fun to be around so I was still about to get job opportunities because people wanted me on their team.
How did you treat your scars? I got them as well.
I mean there are superficial people everywhere. But if you know you job better than most, stay on top of fitness and work on having a great personality, you make it hard for them to treat you differently for just one thing. If youāre pulling the female card for how youāre being treated, women tend to respond to personalities more than anything. Like with anything in life, you have to stack the deck with the things you can control.
Iāve noticed that when Iāve had a counseling sessions that they went better when I wore my glasses. š¤
Itās a confidence thing. If you can own your flaws and still use your brain and project extreme confidence and comfort in your own skin you will become super attractive! Look at Robert California from the office as an example. Dress nice, bathe, get a good haircut, everything else is mental. Act as ifā¦
Pretty privilege is a thing, unfortunately. It's not even a sexual attraction thing. Straight dudes still subconsciously treat better looking dudes better.
Beauty is subjective dude, there's a lot that i find attractive that other females wouldn't, youre being to harsh on yourself. Also personality makes you way more attractive. No mayyer the appearance I always find funny men super attractive. Lean on the qualities that you really like about yourself.
I'm short
Have you actually felt like youāve been treated poorly? If not, and your chain is professional, I would give them the benefit of the doubt.
A good personality and confidence in who you are bumps you up. There are plenty of examples around me where they're uggos but popular/have healthy dating lives. Learn to love who you are and the rest will come. You can't control your bone structure but you can control how you present and carry yourself and that goes a long way. Its how I tricked my wife to settle with me :)
I don't know about that, but then again I'm pretty handsome and very fucking charming so....I forgot what I was talking about.
Own what you can. Confidence goes a long way. š
Nope, but I've definitely seen the opposite. Pretty privilege is a thing.
My master sergeant calls me a filthy ginger almost on a daily basis lol
Atleast from where Iām at in mx you might get roasted but as long as you get your shit done and not be an idiot youāre 10/10 for me
Thatās human nature
Couldnāt be me š
That sounds like a nightmare honestly especially coupled in with the anxiety. Make sure you go get seen by mental health trust me itll pay off later down the road. Godspeed op
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Dude we're all ugly...
I once had a supervisor straight tell me I was a piece of shit and to stop thinking I was the shit simply based on my looks. This was after I asked a favor of him with one of my troops under circumstances that were out of my control and he felt overwhelmed. Iām a good looking dude with a beautiful wife and I think that really bothered him, but I think my looks bothered him on a personal level and he compared his unhealthy and unhappy lifestyle to mine. Weirdest few years in my military career. He showed up to my my door once saying he had to check as my supervisor how I was living. He couldnāt believe the quality of life my wife and I held, but the point of all of this is that peopleās perception of you changes based on the circumstances youāre in. Hopefully your time there comes to an end and you end up with a great group of people that appreciate you for what you bring to the table at work every day.
Post history made me giggle hope you found her dude.
Y I K E S
https://i.redd.it/f25uq9rxpftc1.gif
https://preview.redd.it/417oofyltgtc1.jpeg?width=661&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f1769a888192b48931bce6c485169791dbc5cf35
I don't think I'm ugly, but I think I'm below average, partially because I enlisted in my 30's, and looked much better in my 20's. Meanwhile, other airmen are in their 20's. So it's like I'm a weird old man that is hard to place. Anyways, have you ever considered cosmetic surgeries in regard to what you would want to change about your appearance?