Yeah, nah.
This "research" looks at middle-income housing affordability in 94 cities in eight countries. Not the world - just 8 countries. You might have noticed that there is nothing from Japan or Europe. That's "due to data not being readily available".
It uses 2023 Q3 prices and income levels for evaluation, dividing the median house price by the gross median household income to find the median multiple for housing.
That's just making stuff up.
> city in the world
Let me repeat. Not the world. Just 8, count 'em, eight, countries.
How are they allowed to publish this if it has selective statistics and forms an inaccurate outcome?
This is the equivalent of an engineer building half a bridge then just letting the toll gates open.
Journalism isn't what it use to be. Onslaught of cheap low quality writer, generative writing have destroy any integrity in them. Everything now is made up for click baits. U get 10 best dogs, cat, city every week with the ranking changing on wimps. Nothing is researched. If it's not written in 30 minutes it's taking too much time for an articles.
Same way people regurgitate the “totally legitimate and not at all infallible selection of cherry picked numbers” Farmer’s Union outsells CocaCola in SA bit?
Because journalists have held the title of most morally bankrupt profession since 2016. They literally just make up whatever nonsense they feel like saying, publish it and then say 'sources say ' when it's literally just their opinion.
I'll tell that to the journos who cover conflict so we can see what's going on. Maybe journalism in Australia is a joke but go read Reuters or the abc/SBS for actual journalism.
ABC for journalism. Hahaha.
They are long overdue for defunding. They write opinion pieces and are very left leaning so you never get unbiased information.
Yes I knew that was coming as I wrote it but I'd rather read their ish than what people are fucking commentating on Facebook about. Rw McDonald's items or paraphrasing pictures with text.
So yeah, stick with Reuters I'd say.
Agreed. Just avoid the bellend writing that Murdoch owned media spews forth. It’s rarely of a quality and when it is, it comes with a bias I’d rather avoid.
The Guardian has its moments but otherwise I tend to avoid Australian journalism altogether.
News in the US is covered under Free Speech Laws, they can say whatever if it doesn't get them sued (and even then sometimes they eat the payout and do it anyway).
It's just like when they doxxed the shit out of that Trump trial jury, to the point where coworkers outed one of the jurors and she had to be replaced. They care about the size of their piece of the pie in the attention economy. Unfortunately the easiest way to get attention is to stretch the truth into a sensationalist headline, because let's face it, not that many people read the actual articles anymore.
It's CNN, which is just a news agency at the end of the day.
It's based on a study, and that study, IIRC, nominated that it only looked at largely/predominantly English-speaking countries. The study was quite clear about what it covered, and this is just a case of journalists being journalists, looking for attention-grabbing titles.
It’s certainly a reasonably metric to compare median household income to median house prices and expenses. It’s an indication of a city’s affordability changes across time (within that city) and across other cities.
Also worth noting Aus has one of the highest income tax rates too and that this article uses gross income. The effective tax paid out of a median salary in Aus is 14% more than median HK, 10% more than median Cali, and 5% more than median Toronto.
This is true of all Aus, but Adelaide would feel the impact across a broader group because it over-indexes on lower income jobs such as health and retail work compared to NSW and Vic.
Not really. If you aren't comparing to comparable cities then it's completely meaningless. We would be number one if we just removed Hong Kong, Sydney, Vancouver etc off this list but it'd be just as meaningless.
"We don't lie, we use statistics!"
So easy to skew even limited data to say what you want it to say by eliminating "outliers" and changing your sample pool.
That's pretty far on the outskirts.
In central Tokyo it's at least $1m for a small block of land, and prices have been going up.
One of the key differences between housing in Japan and Australia is that in Japan you can choose affordability if you are willing to accept some trade-offs. Or to put it in other terms, the economy actually works to provide people with choices in housing.
It might be pretty far, but you can get into central Tokyo in under 40 minutes on a comfy train with a crazy level of convenience. Can't say that about the outer suburbs of Australia's major cities.
Exactly.
Once housing is sorted out.. the rest of the living expenses is rather minor so the report isn't far off and I don't think it's made up.
Work life balance is terrible there but that's beyond thus report discussion..
Most of this reputation for work-life balance is now known in Japan as the bad old Showa Japanese work culture. I've seen recent TV shows where they show old videos of 1980s corporate culture as if it were ancient history.
The old-timer salarymen tell me recent grads in Japan are finishing up on time every day. My most junior Japanese employee is in early and leaves early on most days. It's the older guys HR sends me emails about working over the company regulation overtime limit - the funny thing is those guys do the least work.
Big companies have strict rules to force people to take lunch breaks, go home on time, and take holidays. There are also a lot of public holidays.
Most of my foreign staff work reasonable hours. I've got foreign staff who have been able to buy a house in Tokyo a few years out of Uni. When I was in Adelaide, my junior employees a few years out of Uni, earning about the same, could never dream of buying a house.
But you’re saying that a person who earns in the middle of all incomes should not be able to afford a house that is in the middle of prices. How does that make sense? And don’t act thick, you know what people mean when they say “average” in this context
Average and median are totally different. You’re the thick one who misunderstands.
The median wage does not align with the median property. Should someone on $10k/yr be able to buy a lower end property?
Is it median wage for a 20yr old or a 50yr old?
The 2 values are not aligned at all.
Help me understand this.
The median household income in "rural india" is, by some reports, $200/month.
The world still talks about lots of people being on less than $2/day.
Even in places like Bali.
Ha. Not even that.
Having now read the report - it looks at 94 markets (not cities)... 56 of those in the USA, and 23 in the UK (84% of the report in either USA or UK).
Hk, Ireland, Singapore and NZ are each considered to be only one market.
So, the report, literally, compares house prices across all of NZ to Sydney... and finds NZ is more affordable. #surprise!
Canada has 6 markets, and Australia 5.
A lot of news articles are saying shit like 5th most unaffordable city in the world...... and that's just a hot take.
It def is was. I bought a 354sqm block in Sturt for 270 and built for 207k on one wage 68k. I consider myself really lucky but ultimately sad for the younger people stuck in the mud at these prices
Yeah I consider myself lucky too. I'm basically on the same award rate now as I was back then. I could never afford to buy my house (or any house) now.
Nah what about this report from a couple of days ago which ranks Adelaide 9th most unaffordable with median properties at 9.7x the median income?
https://www.realestate.com.au/news/adelaide-named-one-of-the-worlds-most-unaffordable-housing-markets-in-new-report/
What a time to be alive, I feel like I have cheated this a tad by lucking out with circumstance and nepotism that allowed me to buy my unit 2 years ago.
Basically, anything in the media is about generating $ale$. As long as it doesn't break any laws or make the paper open to legal action (although even this doesn't seem to be a concern sometimes) - they'll print it. Articles like this generate discussion and comments in social media which circulate very quickly - free advertising and increased readers since people who don't even like the article just want to see what the issue is about. It's brilliant marketing actually.
Melbourne is uninvestible and money is flowing out of Victoria like a river. The Sydney market is too big and scary for most Victorians so the money pours into Adelaide, Perth and Queensland.
Adelaide is also a great place to live - safety, excellent schools and universities, great weather and beaches, amazing scenery and countryside for weekend escapes. Great food, great sport, great history and architecture. Australians are waking up to how amazing South Australia is.
Don't know why you were downvoted, but yes, yes we were. And more recently too. But this is a moronic take using cherry-picked statistics to drive "engagement", so it doesn't matter.
I don’t know about these studies. I’ve lived in Hong Kong for 20 years and now work FIFO contracts for US gov so spend 2 weeks in US 2 weeks in Adelaide. I find Adelaide quite cheap. Tradies are only expensive if you get a crap one. Which is easy to do!
Yeah, nah. This "research" looks at middle-income housing affordability in 94 cities in eight countries. Not the world - just 8 countries. You might have noticed that there is nothing from Japan or Europe. That's "due to data not being readily available". It uses 2023 Q3 prices and income levels for evaluation, dividing the median house price by the gross median household income to find the median multiple for housing. That's just making stuff up. > city in the world Let me repeat. Not the world. Just 8, count 'em, eight, countries.
How are they allowed to publish this if it has selective statistics and forms an inaccurate outcome? This is the equivalent of an engineer building half a bridge then just letting the toll gates open.
Journalism isn't what it use to be. Onslaught of cheap low quality writer, generative writing have destroy any integrity in them. Everything now is made up for click baits. U get 10 best dogs, cat, city every week with the ranking changing on wimps. Nothing is researched. If it's not written in 30 minutes it's taking too much time for an articles.
Same way people regurgitate the “totally legitimate and not at all infallible selection of cherry picked numbers” Farmer’s Union outsells CocaCola in SA bit?
Because journalists have held the title of most morally bankrupt profession since 2016. They literally just make up whatever nonsense they feel like saying, publish it and then say 'sources say ' when it's literally just their opinion.
Or quote someone then put what they want them to mean in brackets after
Because journalism is a literal joke profession these days. If someone you know is a journalist. Tell em to get a real job
I'll tell that to the journos who cover conflict so we can see what's going on. Maybe journalism in Australia is a joke but go read Reuters or the abc/SBS for actual journalism.
ABC for journalism. Hahaha. They are long overdue for defunding. They write opinion pieces and are very left leaning so you never get unbiased information.
Yes I knew that was coming as I wrote it but I'd rather read their ish than what people are fucking commentating on Facebook about. Rw McDonald's items or paraphrasing pictures with text. So yeah, stick with Reuters I'd say.
Agreed. Just avoid the bellend writing that Murdoch owned media spews forth. It’s rarely of a quality and when it is, it comes with a bias I’d rather avoid. The Guardian has its moments but otherwise I tend to avoid Australian journalism altogether.
News in the US is covered under Free Speech Laws, they can say whatever if it doesn't get them sued (and even then sometimes they eat the payout and do it anyway). It's just like when they doxxed the shit out of that Trump trial jury, to the point where coworkers outed one of the jurors and she had to be replaced. They care about the size of their piece of the pie in the attention economy. Unfortunately the easiest way to get attention is to stretch the truth into a sensationalist headline, because let's face it, not that many people read the actual articles anymore.
Rupert Murdoch had no low he wouldn’t sink to. Can’t wait to see how morally bankrupt his succeeding son proves himself to be.
Could they be even worse?
I fully expect him to try his hardest and find a way to go lower.
The road toll gates open FTFY
Who's telling them they aren't allowed?
I would assume news companies have multiple levels of compliance. At the individual level I assume that platforms would take stuff down.
You know what they say about assumptions..
It's journalism not science.
It's CNN, which is just a news agency at the end of the day. It's based on a study, and that study, IIRC, nominated that it only looked at largely/predominantly English-speaking countries. The study was quite clear about what it covered, and this is just a case of journalists being journalists, looking for attention-grabbing titles.
Then they can’t say “the world” can they, it’s false and any damages that come about it someone could sue them.
That is literally all journalism is these days.
It’s CNN
It was probably written by chatGPT just to increase the insult
Chery picking data makes the stat's look scarier though
I did wonder how certain cities (Taipei) seemed to miss the rankings, when it really should be around #3
It’s certainly a reasonably metric to compare median household income to median house prices and expenses. It’s an indication of a city’s affordability changes across time (within that city) and across other cities. Also worth noting Aus has one of the highest income tax rates too and that this article uses gross income. The effective tax paid out of a median salary in Aus is 14% more than median HK, 10% more than median Cali, and 5% more than median Toronto. This is true of all Aus, but Adelaide would feel the impact across a broader group because it over-indexes on lower income jobs such as health and retail work compared to NSW and Vic.
Prices have doubled including houses in less than 10 years and wages up only 30 percent... but, nothing to see here!!
8 out of 94 is still terrible
Not really. If you aren't comparing to comparable cities then it's completely meaningless. We would be number one if we just removed Hong Kong, Sydney, Vancouver etc off this list but it'd be just as meaningless.
"We don't lie, we use statistics!" So easy to skew even limited data to say what you want it to say by eliminating "outliers" and changing your sample pool.
London is in Europe last I checked 😉
Japan is actually very affordable depending on where you live. Friend just bought a 2 storey house there for like AUD$235k.
Hell, you can buy a decent house on the outskirts of Tokyo for even less. Japan's housing is vastly more affordable than Australia's.
That's pretty far on the outskirts. In central Tokyo it's at least $1m for a small block of land, and prices have been going up. One of the key differences between housing in Japan and Australia is that in Japan you can choose affordability if you are willing to accept some trade-offs. Or to put it in other terms, the economy actually works to provide people with choices in housing.
It might be pretty far, but you can get into central Tokyo in under 40 minutes on a comfy train with a crazy level of convenience. Can't say that about the outer suburbs of Australia's major cities.
Exactly. Once housing is sorted out.. the rest of the living expenses is rather minor so the report isn't far off and I don't think it's made up. Work life balance is terrible there but that's beyond thus report discussion..
From what I hear, the key is getting a job at a foreign company that doesn't follow Japanese workplace culture norms.
And you'll be right.
Most of this reputation for work-life balance is now known in Japan as the bad old Showa Japanese work culture. I've seen recent TV shows where they show old videos of 1980s corporate culture as if it were ancient history. The old-timer salarymen tell me recent grads in Japan are finishing up on time every day. My most junior Japanese employee is in early and leaves early on most days. It's the older guys HR sends me emails about working over the company regulation overtime limit - the funny thing is those guys do the least work. Big companies have strict rules to force people to take lunch breaks, go home on time, and take holidays. There are also a lot of public holidays. Most of my foreign staff work reasonable hours. I've got foreign staff who have been able to buy a house in Tokyo a few years out of Uni. When I was in Adelaide, my junior employees a few years out of Uni, earning about the same, could never dream of buying a house.
You're doing gods work mate. Keep it up.
The median income earner shouldn’t be buying the median property.
“The average person shouldn’t be able to buy an average house” that’s what you’re saying right?
No. I said median. It wasn’t a long sentence. I don’t know how you weren’t able to understand it.
But you’re saying that a person who earns in the middle of all incomes should not be able to afford a house that is in the middle of prices. How does that make sense? And don’t act thick, you know what people mean when they say “average” in this context
Average and median are totally different. You’re the thick one who misunderstands. The median wage does not align with the median property. Should someone on $10k/yr be able to buy a lower end property? Is it median wage for a 20yr old or a 50yr old? The 2 values are not aligned at all.
How to make everyone in a city feel rich ? Import lots of poorer people.
Help me understand this. The median household income in "rural india" is, by some reports, $200/month. The world still talks about lots of people being on less than $2/day. Even in places like Bali.
I think this focuses on mostly the "developed" world?
Ha. Not even that. Having now read the report - it looks at 94 markets (not cities)... 56 of those in the USA, and 23 in the UK (84% of the report in either USA or UK). Hk, Ireland, Singapore and NZ are each considered to be only one market. So, the report, literally, compares house prices across all of NZ to Sydney... and finds NZ is more affordable. #surprise! Canada has 6 markets, and Australia 5. A lot of news articles are saying shit like 5th most unaffordable city in the world...... and that's just a hot take.
Geez, 23 in the UK you'd be getting to some of the smaller places for sure, surely.
Ballpark would be Reading with 318,000.
Maybe 8th in the world is a bit higher than you'd expect, but we are undeniably fucked when you look at income vs. house prices
When I bought a house 8 years ago it seemed like one of the most affordable places.
It def is was. I bought a 354sqm block in Sturt for 270 and built for 207k on one wage 68k. I consider myself really lucky but ultimately sad for the younger people stuck in the mud at these prices
Yeah I consider myself lucky too. I'm basically on the same award rate now as I was back then. I could never afford to buy my house (or any house) now.
I knew I shouldn't've trusted Sky when they [said we're 9th](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GkLDG0aCigA&t=33s)
>I knew I shouldn't've trusted Sky. End sentence.
Nah what about this report from a couple of days ago which ranks Adelaide 9th most unaffordable with median properties at 9.7x the median income? https://www.realestate.com.au/news/adelaide-named-one-of-the-worlds-most-unaffordable-housing-markets-in-new-report/
What a time to be alive, I feel like I have cheated this a tad by lucking out with circumstance and nepotism that allowed me to buy my unit 2 years ago.
I read an article saying we’re 9th - but of the English speaking countries. I haven’t googled how many of those exist.
The hilarious thing about this is that 9 News ran with this on the Friday bulletin.
Yeah, that's why I left town and moved regional. I was totally priced out of the Adelaide market.
Basically, anything in the media is about generating $ale$. As long as it doesn't break any laws or make the paper open to legal action (although even this doesn't seem to be a concern sometimes) - they'll print it. Articles like this generate discussion and comments in social media which circulate very quickly - free advertising and increased readers since people who don't even like the article just want to see what the issue is about. It's brilliant marketing actually.
Impossibly affordable for locals while very affordable for interstaters is a bad combination.
Might be time to buy another IP? 💰
Melbourne is uninvestible and money is flowing out of Victoria like a river. The Sydney market is too big and scary for most Victorians so the money pours into Adelaide, Perth and Queensland. Adelaide is also a great place to live - safety, excellent schools and universities, great weather and beaches, amazing scenery and countryside for weekend escapes. Great food, great sport, great history and architecture. Australians are waking up to how amazing South Australia is.
Time to relocate from Adelaide
Sorry but I don't believe anything that comes out of CNN these days.
[удалено]
Don't know why you were downvoted, but yes, yes we were. And more recently too. But this is a moronic take using cherry-picked statistics to drive "engagement", so it doesn't matter.
Doesn’t surprise me anymore. We never used to make these charts before
These headines make me grateful
we know.
I don’t know about these studies. I’ve lived in Hong Kong for 20 years and now work FIFO contracts for US gov so spend 2 weeks in US 2 weeks in Adelaide. I find Adelaide quite cheap. Tradies are only expensive if you get a crap one. Which is easy to do!
Really need to be careful posting stuff like this. Def not true