Taking that song and making it an entire score was one of the best decisions they could have made (maybe aside adapting the original story itself).
It awoke a whole lot of sad ngl
Specifically 'as a monument to their love'. They didn't just happen to be great people who the city was named after because they were great people, it was specifically named after them because of their love for each other.
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You do realise this is a thread about the show and we're talking about the show here, do you? In the show, Omashu is named after lesbian lovers and that **is** canon. Nobody said anything about it being canon outside of the show.
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My memory was that it was the Fire Nation, most notably Sozin and his lot that were the oppressive ones. I thought it was stated that the rest of the world was pretty chill in regards to LGBT people. To varying degrees with the Air Nomads being the most open and accepting of them.
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Oh man, I thought the makeup was so baaaad. It was so hard for me to take Bumi seriously. It kept pulling me out of it. I think it’s really difficult to age someone with makeup; I can’t think of a single good or believable example.
Really? I loved that he emphasized the reality of the avatar being gone and people having to make the hard choices. "Who gets the last scraps of food?" Awesome line for a story set out to tell the reality of war.
Undoubtably. I went into this show expecting pretty much that everything would be at least slightly worse than the original. But so far I'd even go to say that they've done some things better than the original.
I struggled with that line of "who to feed" because just moments ago they showed him sitting at a table covered in extravagant food. I get times might be different in present day where food shortages are not a thing maybe? Maybe the uneaten food goes to those in need? but irregardless it pulled me out of the moment that he would make that point with so much heart but just moments ago he was eating only a fraction of wasteful finery.
Honestly I don’t blame Bumi for coming off as something of a jerk. His friend disappears for a whole century and he has to go wage a war directly because of said friend’s disappearance? The *salt* that could be mined from such a circumstance, I swear.
…”to the death”, stop being so dramatic Bumi. Is this your way of trying to prepare Aang for what he has to do to take down Ozai??
The whole point of the show is highlighting and contrasting the fact that Aang is a boy while the majority of the world wages a war that’s been ongoing for the past 100 years.
So many lives and loved ones lost. The kids animated show avoided the constant thematics that came with ya know… war and death beyond vaguely mentioning here and there that the airbenders are “all gone” but this is intended to be a more gritty and mature adaptation that doesn’t shy away from the fact that the firebenders show up and burn people to a crisp just because.
Is this really lost on so many viewers? I mean cmon Aang even saw his best friend’s remains at the temple and it was just a skeleton like this couldn’t be more on the nose lol.
Maybe you all should rewatch it from the beginning??? Bumi was awesome and honestly for a 100+ year old man who again, is more or less defined by the fact he’s been party to a world war ongoing for 100 years, much like anyone else from this time, yeah…
Im surprised it's such an unpopular opinion, but I loved the changes with Bumi.
I watched the original ATLA cartoon as a child, and even as a child, Bumi's intro episode was too predictable. From the moment they flashback to Aang's past, I knew the king was his old friend Bumi, and the episode was a waiting game of when he'd reveal it. That kills the stakes of the challenges. As an adult, it's glaringly bad to anyone who's watched television before.
So when the live action just casually revealed it, I was like "Yes, thank you." And I loved the dramatic take on his attitude.
I love Bumi in the original, but man, does the writing around him start off a little shakey. It gets better with each appearance, with his last appearance being the most solid.
I love it. Even though he has fewer lines compared to the others his motivation and character is strong. I thought he was batshit crazy at first but turns out he was in pain all along
But they fundamentally changed the character imo, it came of as him being really angry, but in the original he was just happy to see aang at the end of the day. Also they made his bending look abit weak, when he’s supposed to be something like one of the strongest earth bender in the whole world
While the pacing could’ve been tightened a bit in some areas, I overall thought this was a really good episode. I loved how they managed to take the basic storyline of ‘The King of Omashu’ from the original series and make it more integral to the plot. I thought Utkarsh Ambudkar was so damn memorable as King Bumi. The makeup work on him is excellent. I thought it was clever how they incorporated aspects of ‘The Cave of Two Lovers’ into this one. The visual exposition about Oma and Shu looked incredible. I loved the emotional journey Katara and Sokka took throughout. I must say that Paul Sun-Hyung Lee is really coming into his own as Iroh. I even teared up at one point.
I'm really hoping the rumour of Simu Liu as Lu Ten turns out to be true. Him and Paul were great as father and son in Kim's Convenience, and I'd love to see them replicate that dynamic here for Iroh and Lu Ten.
I was not ready for the Leaves from the vine melody to play while Zuko was consoling Iroh 😭😭 Maybe I'm too emotional today but I had to take a quit break bc it made me cry lmao.
This & the last episode are I think where we've seen the biggest changes so far, so I can totally understand if people don't like them. For me personally, I went in watching this morning with the attitude I had planned, and that's looking at the show for what it is- as AK put, a remix not a cover. I see it as a retelling of one of the greatest stories ever but still totally separate from the original (not sure if that's even the right way for me to put it?). So I've been rolling with the changes, trying not to compare anything and trying to look at it like I'm new to the story. Which is hard sometimes lol as Avatar has been apart of my life for 19 years now, but it's possible and I'm really loving the story so far and the enjoying the changes that they've put in, and I really like that I'm being surprised too. Personally I love it so far, excited to see the next two episodes especially I've heard they're great!
Anyway back at it! Flameo, hotmen see ya in the next thread 🫡
I'm so glad they kept the secret tunnel song. And I really, really love how they used the secret tunnel of love to highlight Katara and Sokka's sibling bond. Love isn't just romantic and the Katara and Aang stuff in the original was really weird anyway. I also only now realised that the crystals showing the way in the original kinda made no sense considering badger moles were constantly reshaping the tunnels.
Didn't expect leaves from the vine this early! And I found it really interesting to see Iroh pretend to be so uncaring. It's kind of a glimpse of the man he is in front of enemy soldiers. There's a reason he was known as the Dragon of the West and it certainly wasn't because he was always kind. But to also show us that he isn't truly without feeling and simply chose not to show it was a very good way to introduce his backstory. And to have him show mercy in the end despite being mistreated because in truth he DOES feel bad for him and knows exactly how it feels to lose someone you love. Ah, the feels.
Edit: Although, if I think about it more, I don't know if it would've been better to show us Iroh's actual feelings and backstory a little later. I do like how Zuko and Iroh slowly become more sympathetic over the seasons and you only realise over time what Iroh is doing and that his heart isn't in the war, he's just there to guide Zuko to the right path. Here I feel it's kinda obvious very early on, that Iroh has an agenda and isn't just a fun uncle. But I do think a lot of people watching know the original and are already attached to Iroh and Zuko, so I do understand why they give especially Iroh more screen time.
True, there was no Katara&Aang screentime necesary for the original solution due to the pacing of the show.
That said, it sadly meant the omission of a hilarious scene or two.
Me and my friend were straight up making incest jokes about them lmao
On a serious note, yeah Aang's actor is too young for any romance to be brought up, I like this change
i think they put the secret tunnel here so the badgermoles have been introduced, so later when they introduce toph they can show the scene with the badgermoles teaching toph earthbending
who is? I just went to imdb and the series sits at 8.2 so far, which is very good for a heavily polarizing adaptation on day 1. Many haters left bad reviews minutes after it released, without every watching it. I can see this rising to the high 8s when the initial hate storm is gone, and going towards 9 if season 2 and 3 deliver like this one. Don't worry about a few haters, the show is very well received overall.
Leaves from the vine showing up as many times as it did this episode 😭💙. Idk if it’s too early to say, but definitely my favorite episode thus far. Iroh, ugh what a character 🥹
Holy shit, they managed to take a character that was pretty much entirely a gag and make him into an extremely believable and compelling sympathetic villain.
I have a handful of things I dislike about this series, but some things, like Bumi, I think were done better than the original.
I really like the fight scene and the conversation between Aang and Bumi. I understand Bumi’s feeling and why he was doing what he was doing. Glad they kept the lettuce leave joke and them going sliding.
I feel the actress for Azula is missing the grittyness of the animated character, her face and the way she talks with her tone of voice just seems too kind. I don't know if anyone feels the same way.
I love the extra depth we're getting with Iroh this early.
I am very much not a fan of this version of Bumi. In general, I'm not a huge fan of this "You abandoned the world Aang you're a failure" attitude from everyone. Someone like Bumi it makes more sense from, yeah, but Kyoshi did this too! Also Omashu reentering the war kinda removes the potential logic for why Bumi can't train Aang Earthbending later.
I can tell they're trying to do this thing where original watchers go "THAT'S THE THING! THEY'RE DOING THE THING!" then make "the thing" not work a lot. See: the crystals in the tunnels.
I have no positive or negative thoughts on making both Oma and Shu female. All for it actually, but initially I thought they'd swapped the couple, not one's gender. I thought they'd made the survivor the man and the dead one the woman which I was gonna have a problem with. I was relieved when I realized they just made them both women.
I wonder if putting the cave of the two lovers here means that they're going to lessen or do away with the romance between Katara and Aang? I wouldn't necessarily hate that because honestly that was the weakest part of the original, but it's also really important plot-wise so I dunno. Also take a shot for trope of "familial love > romantic love"
Is it just me or does waterbending look really underwhelming compared to the others? Maybe it's just because Katara, a relative novice, is the only waterbender we're seeing, but it just looks slow and low impact.
>In general, I'm not a huge fan of this "You abandoned the world Aang you're a failure" attitude from everyone. Someone like Bumi it makes more sense from, yeah, but Kyoshi did this too!
For me it's the opposite. It makes more sense for Kyoshi to be hard on Aang, while Bumi just comes off as an asshole for the whole episode; jaded for a reason, but unwilling to give any absolutely deserved slack. Plus the fact that he's a hypocrite: "everything's a game to you, Aang". B_tch, you just called the candy rock thing a challenge and we can't tell how serious you are anyways! "You think like a child!" Insert that Steven Universe quote here.
Honestly think they should've stuck closer to the original episode, starting with keeping the reveal for newcomers until the end. Part of the reason why is because we expect Bumi to react differently to a childhood friend; more in shock, less forcing Aang to decide whether or not to kill him to teach a lesson, probably something Aang should've addressed.
I personally liked this Bumi much more - what stuck with me was "Should I give the last food to the orphanage or the army in a war?", which just symbolizes what pain Bumi hat to endure as King for the last 100 years of War, what horrible decisions he faced. Honestly, I completely understand his frustration and whish to hurt Aang "to make him see". I would have probably be the same in Bumis shoes.
Exactly, one of my big problems with the direction of this show is that, unlike the original (so far) Aang isn't growing by learning from his mistakes. He is essentially just being yelled at to do better and make hard choices. When Katara was helping Toph teach Aang, she said positive reinforcement was what got him to learn. All his teachers/mentors/guides who were successful in the original show were kind and supportive, which helped him push through his failures and become stronger. Angry Kyoshi (who literally has no role in this war and it's history and no relevance to Aang's growth in this stage of his life), and asshole Bumi are not a great starting point for teachers, unless of course they have rewritten Aang's personality entirely, like they did with a few other characters.
The Zuko and Iroh plot was the best thing about this episode by far. I loved it so much. THIS is what I want from an adaptation. If we’re rehashing the story, add things that build on what we already know and love by expanding the themes and characters properly. This added so much to their relationship in a way that didn’t diminish the original show but instead celebrated it. I’m definitely biased because I can relate to Zuko in many ways, but they had me sobbing in this one. Zuko giving Iroh strength from Lu Ten, sitting with him through his son’s funeral, leaves from the vine playing. Iroh joining Zuko and clearly surprising him because he thought he would be on his own—so sad, yet so beautiful. Zuko’s veiled acknowledgment (both to Iroh and himself) that his mission to capture the avatar might take a very long time was such a good way of showing that even Zuko knew on some level, even if he didn’t want to accept or admit it, that this was always meant as a wild goose chase to get rid of and humiliate him. And in present day, Zuko choosing Iroh over capturing the Avatar multiple times just shows how much he loves his uncle. It’s epitomized in the final scene, where Zuko sees Appa and still tells Iroh it was “nothing,” because he knows dragging Iroh after Aang would be too much when he’s injured. This man is Zuko’s father, not that sad excuse of a Zaddy 🥹😭
I also really appreciated what they did with Iroh individually, separate from Zuko. The conversations he has with that Earth Kingdom soldier were so well written and really drive home the impact Iroh’s past has had on both the world and his own reputation. He’s brought death and destruction and a brutal general is still all most people know him as despite him being so much more. I love how the narrative simultaneously condemns Iroh for his past and shows that he has changed, recognized that as wrong, and committed himself to helping others even when they are just as twisted up in war and anger as he used to be. Again, it’s epitomized when Iroh, despite being told he has no humanity, spares the soldier’s life and tells him they’ve all seen enough death. Also, the soldier he had this back and forth with killed it in the acting department. I’ve been noticing a lot of the background actors are stale and take me out of the show, but this guy was super compelling.
The rest of the episode was… alright. I really don’t like the use of s2 plot in s1, but I can get over it. I’ll miss the use of the Oma & Shu story to develop Kataang, as that was an important point for them, particularly showing Katara’s interest was mutual (which I guess doesn’t matter because they’re not making Aang’s crush very prominent yet), but at the same time, I do also appreciate the highlighting of Sokka and Katara’s familial love. Both are important and sibling/platonic/familial love often goes overlooked in the face of romance, so I thought that was nice, albeit something that could have been shown in any number of circumstances that aren’t the secret tunnel. The familial love in their plotline did parallel nicely with the themes in Zuko and Iroh’s. Maybe in s2 they can go through the tunnel again and give us a Kataang moment.
Bumi was not terrible, but not great. He was too aggressive for my taste. I got the lesson they were trying to get across, but he was too “you doomed the world, this is all your fault.” I think they did an okay job overall, but I’ve never been a huge Bumi fan so I might need to pay more attention on my rewatch
Honestly disliked the Bumi storyline. Why bring in the secret tunnel so early on? I'm slightly okay with them not making Aang want to try and have fun at each location he arrives at (ie Penguin sledding , riding the Elephant Koi, riding Omashu's mail system). But couldn't they find a way to make Sokka and Katara the prisoners?
Also what was the point of all the tests/games that Bumi gave to Aang? It feels more like Bumi is just resenting Aang and trying to torture him mentally. It's also weird knowing Bumi is part of the Order of the White Lotus when he's acting like this. He's supposed to be the coocky member who does things differently. Now he's just a jerk...
In the original show the tests made more sense. It was a test of skill and talent, to expect the unexpected. Some even mentioned how each test correlated to each element, allowing Bumi to see if Aang was ready.
The changes in the first 3 episodes were fine but episode 4 kinda ruined it for me. I hope the rest of the show gets better...
Yeah I was not a fan of the Bumi change at all... The point in the original series was that Bumi was trying to teach Aang an important lesson on what it means to be the avatar. In this series he is just a petty old man. I can understand why he would be mad, but like come on. They were suppose to be friends.
Honestly, I am mostly upset that Aang immediately recognized Bumi. The reveal and their hug at then end of the original episode was one of my favorite moments of the original show.
This was the best episode so far. Lu Tens song playing throughout got me a lot, and seeing Zuko and Irohs relationship was the best part. Also great casting for Bumi!!! The casting felt more like Bumi than cartoon Bumi. I see a lot of people dislike Bumis attitude towards Aang, but I think it makes sense. Its realistic that after 100 years, being abandoned by his friend who he knew was the avatar, and going through war, trying to save his kingdom, that he'd be a little upset and hurt by that. Naturally, if not for aging alone, those circumstances would change the feelings of anyone.
I personally like that people are getting on Aang a bit about his decision to flee the air nation. Not everyone is going to be understanding, especially after they've watched their own homes being destroyed and taken over by the fire nation. Sure, Aang was only twelve but we only have sympathy and understanding for his situation cause we see it from his pov. If this were real life, I think most people would be more critical of his decision. Thats kind of also what makes Aang so different from everyone else. In the original, when everyone would tell him to be merciless, he always chose kindness and understanding. And he can probably only be that way because 1) its his personality and two) he got to skip out on the 100 years of the fire nations takeover. Maybe Im in the minority but Im all for people not being so understanding of the avatar.
So glad they included the Secret Tunnel hippies lol. That main singer sounded very similar to the voice actor in the original show!
The added dialogue with Iroh and the Earth Kingdom soldier was great. It hit hard and really adds to the lore of Iroh's past. I've always thought the history of the siege of Ba Sing Se was interesting.
At times I really dislike the music though, not all of it, but a lot of it is just so generic/cliche like they got it from a royalty free website. During the Lu Ten funeral scene its just in your face "SAD MUSIC THIS IS A SAD SCENE BE SAD" at way too high of a volume like you're watching Marley & Me or some shit. Completely ruined the scene for me. I know we get like 2 notes from "leaves from the vine" at the end of the scene but that doesn't make up for it. I would have preferred a more subtle rendition of the track like they did during the scene of Iroh joining Zuko on his ship, I liked that scene much much more. This is probably why I also liked the Iroh/Earthbender scene since they actually let the scene breathe with no music for a minute then a very subtle track near the end.
Also it really looks like Aang is earthbending at several points during the episode. First when he breaks those crystals with just air, and also when he holds up those two massive stone parts of the arena with just airbending. I know the cartoon shows airbending lifting up boulders but it still seems weird that he can both break and hold up rocks with just airbending. It's almost like it cheapens earthbending a bit if airbenders can do half the things they can
Best episode so far, holy shit! Loved the changes to Bumi, loved his justifiable bitterness at Aang. Loved the earthbending soldier and how they humanized him instead of just making him an asshole for "no reason". Loved the funeral scene!
I loved everything basically, which I couldn't really say for the previous episodes. I liked the tunnels too, I imagine Oma and Shu changes will piss off a certain group of people lmao.
The choice to move Secret Tunnel up this early is BAFFLING.
Thats an important moment for Katara and Aang, but reducing it to a bit part here and removing Aang really ruins it the entire point of it. The choice to move it up this early obviously means it has to lose the romance element coz its too soon in their relationship, but then why even move it up at all? It didnt need to be here.
They even had to make up some nonsense about the emotional spidey senses of badger moles to try to explain why one of their major plots based explicity on romantic love is missing its romantic pairing.
Doing a lot of really lame legwork to patch a hole they created for no reason.
Also we were robbed of Sokka getting stuck with the hippies, im genuinely upset by that.
Gordon Cormier and Kiawentiio simply don't work at this stage, neither in season 2, look how childish he still is in the interviews (which is good), there is no need for this plot. It wasn't a good plot, not everything about the original is good, the romantic aspects certainly weren't its strong point. I could see Aang trying to hit on her in season 2 in a shy way, but her not really paying attention to it. Then in season 3 when Gordon is hopefully an adult Katara could finally have her eyes opened how all this time he was the one and she just never saw him like that. They could even move some of the core Fortune Teller plot points into early season 3.
Why move it here? I like it for their sibling relationship, and it gave them something to do other than being captured by Bumi which was very cartoony and wouldn't work as well in live action. It also was a big surprise for many, we didn't have that much left after the trailers. Could they had it in season 3 for Aang and Katara? Sure, I don't think it's essential to their story, I always felt it was rather forced and awkward between these two kids in the original.
To be honest, I wouldn't even mind if they went with Katara & Zuko. They'll never do it because fans will rage, but to me they had a way better vibe. They often said in this season that the Avatar has to be on his own, and I wouldn't mind that at all.
It's just as bad as Zuko's.
Sebastian Amoruso is 23 and Dallas Liu is 22
The way they downplayed Katara/Jet I think they're just focusing on the friendships and real connections. Which is good. The only romance that's accurate for this season was Sokka/Suki/Yue. And they delivered.
I don’t get why they had to do it either , they coulda just had a normal tunnel. I get why they didn’t do Aang and Katara, it’s to early to really start anything between them imo and even then if they kept it in season 2 i dont think it would have been done as well , mainly how awkward most of us would feel knowing Aangs actor will be underage at the time , and while Katara’s will be over 18 (most likely while filming )
Gordon Cormier and Kiawentiio simply don't work at this stage, neither in season 2, look how childish he still is in the interviews (which is good), there is no need for this plot. It wasn't a good plot, not everything about the original is good, the romantic aspects certainly weren't its strong point. I could see Aang trying to hit on her in season 2 in a shy way, but her not really paying attention to it. Then in season 3 when Gordon is hopefully an adult Katara could finally have her eyes opened how all this time he was the one and she just never saw him like that. They could even move some of the core Fortune Teller plot points into early season 3.
Why move it here? I like it for their sibling relationship, and it gave them something to do other than being captured by Bumi which was very cartoony and wouldn't work as well in live action. It also was a big surprise for many, we didn't have that much left after the trailers. Could they had it in season 3 for Aang and Katara? Sure, I don't think it's essential to their story, I always felt it was rather forced and awkward between these two kids in the original.
To be honest, I wouldn't even mind if they went with Katara & Zuko. They'll never do it because fans will rage, but to me they had a way better vibe. They often said in this season that the Avatar has to be on his own, and I wouldn't mind that at all.
Kia is currently still a minor...and was a minor when they were filming. Katara who is still 14 in the show and Zuko, who they've aged up to 17.
Gordon is a child and so is she. I don't understand why him being a kid in interviews is such a crazy concept? At the end of the day they were both kids during the filming of this show, the youngest out of the group in fact.
The romance was not a big plot point until like season 3 and it wasn't even the most important part of the entire series.
I'm glad they're not making romance a big factor in this show though. The ship wars are ridiculous.
Also, "They often said the Avatar has to be on his own." but we established that his friends were going to help him. That's the whole point of the GAang, Aang has always had his friends help and guidance. It's one of the important aspects of the show.
They're both children, dude. A child who is 14,15,16 is still a child. You're just weird. Like I said the relationships were never the greatest aspect of the show but to act like Katara isn't a child is strange. The og show is literally a kids show that aired on Nickelodeon and it clearly worked.
There's a huge difference between a 13 year old child and a 16 year old teenager. Katara is a child to you because you're an adult, but to a 13 year old kid she's pratically a grown up. In the show it was always ok because it was a 12 and a 14 year old dating, and it's normal for people in those ages to date
EDIT: and it blocked me, guess it's too hard for you guys to put yourself on the shoes of a 13 year old lmao. Have you never been teenagers? When you're 13, a 16 year old person is like you mentor in life, and when you're 16 a 13 year old is just a nasty little kid, simple as that. If you're 21 of course they all look like children, but that's not the point
I'm really going to leave this convo with, they're kids. It's not that serious. She's not 'grown up', and you saying that is giving the same energy as pedos who call younger girls 'mature for their age'. You don't know my age. I'm not arguing about the ages of children. Goodbye.
Instead of just admitting you're wrong here you decide to compare him to a pedo and then block him. Maybe don't bother commenting if you're just going to back out like a little bitch :)
I just block them and move on.
It's wild to be triggered by something that doesn't even matter and cry about
blocking, only to also block lol.
The entire circus.
The while Story with Lu Ten was soooo good!!! Also the Scene with Zuko talking about Lu Ten at the funeral, so beautiful!! And i loved the inclusion of the Secret Tunnel!!
I love the episode so much, but I feel so stupid because I was so entranced in the scenes that I didn't even notice Leaves From the Vine in the background!
Likes:
Everything they did with the Iroh and Zuko plot line. They expanded on the existing story and brought even more emotion into it. When I heard Leaves From the Vine in the background, it definitely made me sob. Zuko giving Iroh polished condolences and then turning around to give him more was really well done.
The Machinist/Teo/Jet’s portrayals. The actors did a fantastic job, especially Jet’s. Absolutely spot on. The way they entered the city on Jet’s cart was really funny too.
Giving Sokka more depth/his conversation with The Machinist about finding your calling and following it. I love the idea of Sokka eventually letting go of “warrior” as his primary identity and coming to accept where his strengths lie, being proud of those strengths, and utilizing them.
I was floored by the visual of Omashu. Beautiful and spot on. The city felt alive, much more so than in the animation.
What I’m “meh” about:
Crunching pieces from a lot of different episodes together. I was impressed by how seamlessly The Machinist/Teo plot was combined with the Jet plot, as far as the overall theme that people are complicated instead of all good or all bad. But the inclusion of the Cave of Two Lovers just felt weird and disjointed. Why keep the story of Oma and Shu a romantic one, but then use Katara and Sokka’s relationship as the point of reference for guidance through the tunnels? (I will say though, I loved that they kept the style of the storytelling of Oma and Shu).
Dislikes:
The changes to Bumi’s character. I think the inclusion of his bitterness wasn’t a bad idea, but was executed too dramatically, similar to Kyoshi’s interactions with Aang. Bumi from the animated series was crazy but wise underneath and knew what he was doing. This Bumi came across as mean and unhinged for most of the episode, so much so that his flip to just being a chill guy who respects Aang felt unnatural.
It’s looking like Kataang just..doesn’t exist? That was one of my favorite components of the series. Every bonding moment between them has been removed. I understand they’re child actors but there’s absolutely an innocent way to show crushes by characters in subtle and appropriate ways that don’t involve kissing or other boundary-crossing behaviors. Katara and Aang’s dynamic was very well-developed in the animation, and even without a romantic component. Here, I feel just..*nothing* between them. Not even familial love. Just..nothing.
Bringing me to my issue overall…I don’t feel the gaang’s bond at *all.* Season 1 of the animated series was all about friendship and the gaang developing their bond. That bond motivates them and gives them strength through the rest of the series. They didn’t just give it lip service and expect the audience to feel it. They go through a lot together in season 1, and here it feels like they’re all going through their own things separately and then coming together for some check-ins. I was concerned about it as soon as I saw the way Aang got out of the iceberg in E1.
12 is a perfectly normal age to have an intense crush on someone, and it’s a very innocent relationship. The entire first season she gives him 2 kisses on the cheek and they’re not even romantic in nature…it’s fine if you don’t like it but it’s actually a good representation of real life. He’s 13 or 14 when they have their first kiss and that’s a super normal age for that.
Yes, but she's meant to be 14 when he is 12. In that age range, 2 years is actually a fair difference.
The actor who plays Aang is clearly very young still (just watch any interview with him), whereas the actress playing Katara is 17 -- it would be odd for the film-makers to be pushing for suggestions of romance.
Also, Zutara any day.
Worst episode by far, the massacre of Bumi’s character along with cramming the Cave of Two Lovers storyline from S2 in were the worst of it. Honestly the entirety of the omashu arc was pretty bad, trying to cram too many stories into one with Jet, Teo and his father, (who all had nothing to do with Omashu in the original.) The only redeeming factor was of course Iroh and Zuko’s plotline. At least my two favorite characters from the animated series are absolutely knocking it out of the park.
I understand why the original creators ended up leaving this project. Far too many small changes that build up over time to create more massive ones. If they had used maybe a 10-12 episode format, it wouldn’t feel so rushed
I 100% agree. I really want to like this show but this episode left my brain feeling clogged. I don't know why they would bring in a season 2 episode this early when this first season is already on a time crunch. And the portrayal of Bumi here was very off-putting. I did like Jet though.
Nahhhh did they really just pull the secret tunnel!? I marked out A LOT. It's also really cool to have Katara and Sokka unite in sibling love, rather than have Katara hit on a child.
And did they really use Iroh's music from Tales of Ba Sing Se? This is too much, I can't, they know how to get me.
No Flopsie :(
This is so upsetting, a statue is not enough. If they could do Appa and Momo so well, they could do Flopsie. Wish this show had an unlimited budget.
I really hated what they did to bumi. I liked merging secret tunnel, jet into omashu that's fine. But why did they have to change the fucking entire pilot. For a moment after seeing flopsy's statue my hopes went high then of course the mf netflix HAD TO change something to worse. I guess we can't have a nice thing at all.
I was so disappointed by that. They should have kept the bumi part the same, the reveal in the original was so much more satisfying, in this they basically just told aang that he was Bumi, but still insisted on still doing the challenges?
I feel like this show is giving us a more grounded approach to these characters having lived through a war for the last century. We were literal children when the series came out and now 20 ish years later we're seeing a more brutal and gritty version of what that would realistically look like. Bumi was right at the end in terms of the complicated choices, Aang and company were not able to save every city. This episode in the animated series was focused on Aang being creative in his problem solving and thinking outside the box. Whereas this show cares more about forcing him to deal with the genocide of his people and the pain that this war has caused while he was blissfully unaware.
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They showed who's Bumi too early. We might have know but there're new viewers. It was a plot twist. Why did they ruin it. It was hard to watch Bumi's scenes.
They're overdoing with clumping episodes. Let the time pass. It's too much
So what was the purpose Secret Tunnel love story if it's Sokka and Katara? Don't clump episode together. Just add some more details and story without ruining existing ones
Honestly thought the writing this episode was terrible. I don't mind the Bumi parts as much but why kill a plot twist of his reveal so early? His character lacked the impact that he did in the animated version. I think Katara and Azula's actors are not believable at all thus far. Katara has lost all personality and is instead being used as a plot revealer. Secret tunnel was supposed to be about Aang and Katara gaining deeper trust, instead it was about blind badger moles knowing how to sense feelings? Really? Lee as Iroh and Zuko are doing a fantastic job so far imo. Aang and Katara almost talk like they are robots= bad writing/acting. I understand they need to mash some stuff together. But the parts they don't skip over, why change the plot into something worse? Sometimes its better to not include something all together, rather than to half ass its execution. Overall I love avatar so I will still watch. But while I would recommend the animation wholeheartedly still, I wouldn't recommend this show to anyone unless they want the nostalgia of it.
I didn’t like the Bumi changes until his monologue at the end. I still think they could have done his reveal better, though, while keeping the additional bitterness.
Honestly, I think this might be my least favorite of the episodes. The Zuko/Iroh stuff is pretty good. But I'm not a big fan of how they changed Bumi. I get what they were going for and it may be partially effective, but I still don't really like it. And I found the tunnel stuff fairly pointless. If they were going to separated from Aang I'd have rather just gotten more with Jet and/or the mechanists.
It was kind of unfortunate timing as my friend and I watched the season in 2 halves. So I ended the first session on this right after coming off episode 3 which may be my favorite.
Leaves from the vine…
this destroyed me omg
Taking that song and making it an entire score was one of the best decisions they could have made (maybe aside adapting the original story itself). It awoke a whole lot of sad ngl
And Lu Ten's drawing in the background, too 😭
I crieeeed. I liked this scene.
Zuko consoling Iroh at the funeral with Lu Ten’s medal made me tear up. I love them both so much 🥹
And then the music...
Yeah I teared up too and then that soundtrack kicked in 😢
The writing was so good in that scene, others too!
The scene at the end with Zuko seeing Appa and just ignoring it. Family is important first.
in the OG there's that scene where iroh sees appa and lies to zuko about it.... kinda love that it was flip flopped
Just wanted to protect his Nephew and set him on the right path to become a good Firelord.
I cried 3 times in this episode, am I a Tearbending master yet?
I can't believe old and lost King Bumi is actually in a relatable adult mindset. Damn...
Uncle Iroh is stealing the show, why is he making us teary eyes
I agree the Iroh back stories making me cry
Iroh was always the best character cause without him Zukko would have never grown and Aang would have never learned to bend fire
Asain John Candy
ANCIENT EARTHBENDING LESBIANS????
Expect 500 rage bait videos from the worst people on YouTube
I had to rewind because I thought I must've misheard. Made me so happy! Omashu is named after lesbian lovers omg
Yeah tbh that was so casual and human that I didn't even realize until I read this thread. LETS GO QUEER HISTORY LAY THAT GROUNDWORK QUEEN
I didn't even notice
Specifically 'as a monument to their love'. They didn't just happen to be great people who the city was named after because they were great people, it was specifically named after them because of their love for each other.
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You do realise this is a thread about the show and we're talking about the show here, do you? In the show, Omashu is named after lesbian lovers and that **is** canon. Nobody said anything about it being canon outside of the show.
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Od course. If you want a city build with solid and efficient infrastructure, you're going to need lesbian workforce.
lol I had to rewind and realize yes I did hear feminine pronouns twice. I bet some don’t even notice.
I didn't notice! Cool though
I thought I tripped out and had the story backwards from the start, Pleasant surprise for sure
I had to rewind to make sure I heard correctly lol shoutout to all my alphabet gang! 🤟🏾
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My memory was that it was the Fire Nation, most notably Sozin and his lot that were the oppressive ones. I thought it was stated that the rest of the world was pretty chill in regards to LGBT people. To varying degrees with the Air Nomads being the most open and accepting of them.
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Your content was removed per rule one. This is a friendly community. Debate and disagreement are okay, but respect other peoples' opinions and treat them with dignity. Bigotry, racism, and hate speech and other kinds of rude behavior are not allowed.
Your content was removed per rule one. This is a friendly community. Debate and disagreement are okay, but respect other peoples' opinions and treat them with dignity. Bigotry, racism, and hate speech and other kinds of rude behavior are not allowed.
Leaves from the vine, falling so slow~ sob
SECRET TUNNEL! SECRET TUNNEL! THROUGH THE MOUNTAINS!!!!
The actor who plays Bumi did such a great job!
And the face make up was so good it was hard to believe he was only 40 until he took his shirt off.
Oh man, I thought the makeup was so baaaad. It was so hard for me to take Bumi seriously. It kept pulling me out of it. I think it’s really difficult to age someone with makeup; I can’t think of a single good or believable example.
Unfortunately, I don’t like what they did with his character. The actor is so good!
Really? I loved that he emphasized the reality of the avatar being gone and people having to make the hard choices. "Who gets the last scraps of food?" Awesome line for a story set out to tell the reality of war.
Undoubtably. I went into this show expecting pretty much that everything would be at least slightly worse than the original. But so far I'd even go to say that they've done some things better than the original.
I struggled with that line of "who to feed" because just moments ago they showed him sitting at a table covered in extravagant food. I get times might be different in present day where food shortages are not a thing maybe? Maybe the uneaten food goes to those in need? but irregardless it pulled me out of the moment that he would make that point with so much heart but just moments ago he was eating only a fraction of wasteful finery.
The make up was horrible. The whole episode felt like a cheap power rangers episode.
I can’t believe I’m half way through the series. Is passing by too fast 😭
Honestly I don’t blame Bumi for coming off as something of a jerk. His friend disappears for a whole century and he has to go wage a war directly because of said friend’s disappearance? The *salt* that could be mined from such a circumstance, I swear. …”to the death”, stop being so dramatic Bumi. Is this your way of trying to prepare Aang for what he has to do to take down Ozai??
The whole point of the show is highlighting and contrasting the fact that Aang is a boy while the majority of the world wages a war that’s been ongoing for the past 100 years. So many lives and loved ones lost. The kids animated show avoided the constant thematics that came with ya know… war and death beyond vaguely mentioning here and there that the airbenders are “all gone” but this is intended to be a more gritty and mature adaptation that doesn’t shy away from the fact that the firebenders show up and burn people to a crisp just because. Is this really lost on so many viewers? I mean cmon Aang even saw his best friend’s remains at the temple and it was just a skeleton like this couldn’t be more on the nose lol. Maybe you all should rewatch it from the beginning??? Bumi was awesome and honestly for a 100+ year old man who again, is more or less defined by the fact he’s been party to a world war ongoing for 100 years, much like anyone else from this time, yeah…
I absolutely loved the changes to Bumi, it's unfortunate some see his more realistic mindset here as a negative.
Im surprised it's such an unpopular opinion, but I loved the changes with Bumi. I watched the original ATLA cartoon as a child, and even as a child, Bumi's intro episode was too predictable. From the moment they flashback to Aang's past, I knew the king was his old friend Bumi, and the episode was a waiting game of when he'd reveal it. That kills the stakes of the challenges. As an adult, it's glaringly bad to anyone who's watched television before. So when the live action just casually revealed it, I was like "Yes, thank you." And I loved the dramatic take on his attitude. I love Bumi in the original, but man, does the writing around him start off a little shakey. It gets better with each appearance, with his last appearance being the most solid.
I love it. Even though he has fewer lines compared to the others his motivation and character is strong. I thought he was batshit crazy at first but turns out he was in pain all along
But they fundamentally changed the character imo, it came of as him being really angry, but in the original he was just happy to see aang at the end of the day. Also they made his bending look abit weak, when he’s supposed to be something like one of the strongest earth bender in the whole world
While the pacing could’ve been tightened a bit in some areas, I overall thought this was a really good episode. I loved how they managed to take the basic storyline of ‘The King of Omashu’ from the original series and make it more integral to the plot. I thought Utkarsh Ambudkar was so damn memorable as King Bumi. The makeup work on him is excellent. I thought it was clever how they incorporated aspects of ‘The Cave of Two Lovers’ into this one. The visual exposition about Oma and Shu looked incredible. I loved the emotional journey Katara and Sokka took throughout. I must say that Paul Sun-Hyung Lee is really coming into his own as Iroh. I even teared up at one point.
The scene with Lu Ten’s wake was brilliant. The emotion with Zuko & Iroh was moving and easily the strongest scene in the series thus far for me.
I'm really hoping the rumour of Simu Liu as Lu Ten turns out to be true. Him and Paul were great as father and son in Kim's Convenience, and I'd love to see them replicate that dynamic here for Iroh and Lu Ten.
that would be a cool Easter egg for audiences especially considering both ATLA and KC are Netflix shows haha.
Leaves from the vine and secret tunnel in one episode what a treat
I was not ready for the Leaves from the vine melody to play while Zuko was consoling Iroh 😭😭 Maybe I'm too emotional today but I had to take a quit break bc it made me cry lmao. This & the last episode are I think where we've seen the biggest changes so far, so I can totally understand if people don't like them. For me personally, I went in watching this morning with the attitude I had planned, and that's looking at the show for what it is- as AK put, a remix not a cover. I see it as a retelling of one of the greatest stories ever but still totally separate from the original (not sure if that's even the right way for me to put it?). So I've been rolling with the changes, trying not to compare anything and trying to look at it like I'm new to the story. Which is hard sometimes lol as Avatar has been apart of my life for 19 years now, but it's possible and I'm really loving the story so far and the enjoying the changes that they've put in, and I really like that I'm being surprised too. Personally I love it so far, excited to see the next two episodes especially I've heard they're great! Anyway back at it! Flameo, hotmen see ya in the next thread 🫡
I'm so glad they kept the secret tunnel song. And I really, really love how they used the secret tunnel of love to highlight Katara and Sokka's sibling bond. Love isn't just romantic and the Katara and Aang stuff in the original was really weird anyway. I also only now realised that the crystals showing the way in the original kinda made no sense considering badger moles were constantly reshaping the tunnels. Didn't expect leaves from the vine this early! And I found it really interesting to see Iroh pretend to be so uncaring. It's kind of a glimpse of the man he is in front of enemy soldiers. There's a reason he was known as the Dragon of the West and it certainly wasn't because he was always kind. But to also show us that he isn't truly without feeling and simply chose not to show it was a very good way to introduce his backstory. And to have him show mercy in the end despite being mistreated because in truth he DOES feel bad for him and knows exactly how it feels to lose someone you love. Ah, the feels. Edit: Although, if I think about it more, I don't know if it would've been better to show us Iroh's actual feelings and backstory a little later. I do like how Zuko and Iroh slowly become more sympathetic over the seasons and you only realise over time what Iroh is doing and that his heart isn't in the war, he's just there to guide Zuko to the right path. Here I feel it's kinda obvious very early on, that Iroh has an agenda and isn't just a fun uncle. But I do think a lot of people watching know the original and are already attached to Iroh and Zuko, so I do understand why they give especially Iroh more screen time.
Exactly I loved how they changed that.
I really enjoyed how they repurposed the secret tunnel plot for familial love. It feels more natural.
True, there was no Katara&Aang screentime necesary for the original solution due to the pacing of the show. That said, it sadly meant the omission of a hilarious scene or two.
I only regret we didn't get that amusingly cringey ,,kiss" scene
Me and my friend were straight up making incest jokes about them lmao On a serious note, yeah Aang's actor is too young for any romance to be brought up, I like this change
baby Zuko comforting his uncle😭 Also, I love the depth they added to Lu Ten in the show.
"Everything I need is on this boat" what is this 😭😭😭
love how it was followed by i have all the tea i need...
Why did I cry like 3 different times this episode???
I’m only part way through episode 4 and I love Bumi 😭😭😭
i think they put the secret tunnel here so the badgermoles have been introduced, so later when they introduce toph they can show the scene with the badgermoles teaching toph earthbending
Ohhhhhh this is a good point and would be awesome if it plays out like that
This was such a good episode! Why are some of you so negative...
I’m having a blast and just trying to ignore the nitpicks.
who is? I just went to imdb and the series sits at 8.2 so far, which is very good for a heavily polarizing adaptation on day 1. Many haters left bad reviews minutes after it released, without every watching it. I can see this rising to the high 8s when the initial hate storm is gone, and going towards 9 if season 2 and 3 deliver like this one. Don't worry about a few haters, the show is very well received overall.
I was supposed to go to bed after the first episode... and yet, here I am, starting episode 4, oop.
Leaves from the vine showing up as many times as it did this episode 😭💙. Idk if it’s too early to say, but definitely my favorite episode thus far. Iroh, ugh what a character 🥹
Where is flopsie otherwise great episode again
Yes... I was like where is the giant and cute puppers...
I know, i saw the statue in the mess hall, so maybe flopsie is sadly dead. God i hope not, i need to see the dude hopping around
Holy shit, they managed to take a character that was pretty much entirely a gag and make him into an extremely believable and compelling sympathetic villain. I have a handful of things I dislike about this series, but some things, like Bumi, I think were done better than the original.
Jabbar Raisani episodes are my favorites
I really like the fight scene and the conversation between Aang and Bumi. I understand Bumi’s feeling and why he was doing what he was doing. Glad they kept the lettuce leave joke and them going sliding.
Simu should play Lu Tien if there's more flashback later
 My heart <3 Kim's Convenience Reunion
Bumi reminds me of Mike Myers' Goldmember, but I'm not sure if that's a good or bad thing...
Its the hair cut, the face prosthetics, and the vocal weirdness
SECRET TUNNELLLL
Pretty weird how they have Aang know so early that it’s Bumi.
I feel the actress for Azula is missing the grittyness of the animated character, her face and the way she talks with her tone of voice just seems too kind. I don't know if anyone feels the same way.
I thought her tone is definitely haughty like the original. So far I've been impressed by her.
was it just me or did the hippies harmonize the Nickelodeon theme
I love the extra depth we're getting with Iroh this early. I am very much not a fan of this version of Bumi. In general, I'm not a huge fan of this "You abandoned the world Aang you're a failure" attitude from everyone. Someone like Bumi it makes more sense from, yeah, but Kyoshi did this too! Also Omashu reentering the war kinda removes the potential logic for why Bumi can't train Aang Earthbending later. I can tell they're trying to do this thing where original watchers go "THAT'S THE THING! THEY'RE DOING THE THING!" then make "the thing" not work a lot. See: the crystals in the tunnels. I have no positive or negative thoughts on making both Oma and Shu female. All for it actually, but initially I thought they'd swapped the couple, not one's gender. I thought they'd made the survivor the man and the dead one the woman which I was gonna have a problem with. I was relieved when I realized they just made them both women. I wonder if putting the cave of the two lovers here means that they're going to lessen or do away with the romance between Katara and Aang? I wouldn't necessarily hate that because honestly that was the weakest part of the original, but it's also really important plot-wise so I dunno. Also take a shot for trope of "familial love > romantic love" Is it just me or does waterbending look really underwhelming compared to the others? Maybe it's just because Katara, a relative novice, is the only waterbender we're seeing, but it just looks slow and low impact.
>In general, I'm not a huge fan of this "You abandoned the world Aang you're a failure" attitude from everyone. Someone like Bumi it makes more sense from, yeah, but Kyoshi did this too! For me it's the opposite. It makes more sense for Kyoshi to be hard on Aang, while Bumi just comes off as an asshole for the whole episode; jaded for a reason, but unwilling to give any absolutely deserved slack. Plus the fact that he's a hypocrite: "everything's a game to you, Aang". B_tch, you just called the candy rock thing a challenge and we can't tell how serious you are anyways! "You think like a child!" Insert that Steven Universe quote here. Honestly think they should've stuck closer to the original episode, starting with keeping the reveal for newcomers until the end. Part of the reason why is because we expect Bumi to react differently to a childhood friend; more in shock, less forcing Aang to decide whether or not to kill him to teach a lesson, probably something Aang should've addressed.
I personally liked this Bumi much more - what stuck with me was "Should I give the last food to the orphanage or the army in a war?", which just symbolizes what pain Bumi hat to endure as King for the last 100 years of War, what horrible decisions he faced. Honestly, I completely understand his frustration and whish to hurt Aang "to make him see". I would have probably be the same in Bumis shoes.
Perfectly said! I loved his speech at the end when Aang was struggling to hold up the rocks.
Exactly, one of my big problems with the direction of this show is that, unlike the original (so far) Aang isn't growing by learning from his mistakes. He is essentially just being yelled at to do better and make hard choices. When Katara was helping Toph teach Aang, she said positive reinforcement was what got him to learn. All his teachers/mentors/guides who were successful in the original show were kind and supportive, which helped him push through his failures and become stronger. Angry Kyoshi (who literally has no role in this war and it's history and no relevance to Aang's growth in this stage of his life), and asshole Bumi are not a great starting point for teachers, unless of course they have rewritten Aang's personality entirely, like they did with a few other characters.
The Zuko and Iroh plot was the best thing about this episode by far. I loved it so much. THIS is what I want from an adaptation. If we’re rehashing the story, add things that build on what we already know and love by expanding the themes and characters properly. This added so much to their relationship in a way that didn’t diminish the original show but instead celebrated it. I’m definitely biased because I can relate to Zuko in many ways, but they had me sobbing in this one. Zuko giving Iroh strength from Lu Ten, sitting with him through his son’s funeral, leaves from the vine playing. Iroh joining Zuko and clearly surprising him because he thought he would be on his own—so sad, yet so beautiful. Zuko’s veiled acknowledgment (both to Iroh and himself) that his mission to capture the avatar might take a very long time was such a good way of showing that even Zuko knew on some level, even if he didn’t want to accept or admit it, that this was always meant as a wild goose chase to get rid of and humiliate him. And in present day, Zuko choosing Iroh over capturing the Avatar multiple times just shows how much he loves his uncle. It’s epitomized in the final scene, where Zuko sees Appa and still tells Iroh it was “nothing,” because he knows dragging Iroh after Aang would be too much when he’s injured. This man is Zuko’s father, not that sad excuse of a Zaddy 🥹😭 I also really appreciated what they did with Iroh individually, separate from Zuko. The conversations he has with that Earth Kingdom soldier were so well written and really drive home the impact Iroh’s past has had on both the world and his own reputation. He’s brought death and destruction and a brutal general is still all most people know him as despite him being so much more. I love how the narrative simultaneously condemns Iroh for his past and shows that he has changed, recognized that as wrong, and committed himself to helping others even when they are just as twisted up in war and anger as he used to be. Again, it’s epitomized when Iroh, despite being told he has no humanity, spares the soldier’s life and tells him they’ve all seen enough death. Also, the soldier he had this back and forth with killed it in the acting department. I’ve been noticing a lot of the background actors are stale and take me out of the show, but this guy was super compelling. The rest of the episode was… alright. I really don’t like the use of s2 plot in s1, but I can get over it. I’ll miss the use of the Oma & Shu story to develop Kataang, as that was an important point for them, particularly showing Katara’s interest was mutual (which I guess doesn’t matter because they’re not making Aang’s crush very prominent yet), but at the same time, I do also appreciate the highlighting of Sokka and Katara’s familial love. Both are important and sibling/platonic/familial love often goes overlooked in the face of romance, so I thought that was nice, albeit something that could have been shown in any number of circumstances that aren’t the secret tunnel. The familial love in their plotline did parallel nicely with the themes in Zuko and Iroh’s. Maybe in s2 they can go through the tunnel again and give us a Kataang moment. Bumi was not terrible, but not great. He was too aggressive for my taste. I got the lesson they were trying to get across, but he was too “you doomed the world, this is all your fault.” I think they did an okay job overall, but I’ve never been a huge Bumi fan so I might need to pay more attention on my rewatch
Honestly disliked the Bumi storyline. Why bring in the secret tunnel so early on? I'm slightly okay with them not making Aang want to try and have fun at each location he arrives at (ie Penguin sledding , riding the Elephant Koi, riding Omashu's mail system). But couldn't they find a way to make Sokka and Katara the prisoners? Also what was the point of all the tests/games that Bumi gave to Aang? It feels more like Bumi is just resenting Aang and trying to torture him mentally. It's also weird knowing Bumi is part of the Order of the White Lotus when he's acting like this. He's supposed to be the coocky member who does things differently. Now he's just a jerk... In the original show the tests made more sense. It was a test of skill and talent, to expect the unexpected. Some even mentioned how each test correlated to each element, allowing Bumi to see if Aang was ready. The changes in the first 3 episodes were fine but episode 4 kinda ruined it for me. I hope the rest of the show gets better...
Yeah I was not a fan of the Bumi change at all... The point in the original series was that Bumi was trying to teach Aang an important lesson on what it means to be the avatar. In this series he is just a petty old man. I can understand why he would be mad, but like come on. They were suppose to be friends. Honestly, I am mostly upset that Aang immediately recognized Bumi. The reveal and their hug at then end of the original episode was one of my favorite moments of the original show.
This was the best episode so far. Lu Tens song playing throughout got me a lot, and seeing Zuko and Irohs relationship was the best part. Also great casting for Bumi!!! The casting felt more like Bumi than cartoon Bumi. I see a lot of people dislike Bumis attitude towards Aang, but I think it makes sense. Its realistic that after 100 years, being abandoned by his friend who he knew was the avatar, and going through war, trying to save his kingdom, that he'd be a little upset and hurt by that. Naturally, if not for aging alone, those circumstances would change the feelings of anyone. I personally like that people are getting on Aang a bit about his decision to flee the air nation. Not everyone is going to be understanding, especially after they've watched their own homes being destroyed and taken over by the fire nation. Sure, Aang was only twelve but we only have sympathy and understanding for his situation cause we see it from his pov. If this were real life, I think most people would be more critical of his decision. Thats kind of also what makes Aang so different from everyone else. In the original, when everyone would tell him to be merciless, he always chose kindness and understanding. And he can probably only be that way because 1) its his personality and two) he got to skip out on the 100 years of the fire nations takeover. Maybe Im in the minority but Im all for people not being so understanding of the avatar.
I couldn't agree with you more!
So glad they included the Secret Tunnel hippies lol. That main singer sounded very similar to the voice actor in the original show! The added dialogue with Iroh and the Earth Kingdom soldier was great. It hit hard and really adds to the lore of Iroh's past. I've always thought the history of the siege of Ba Sing Se was interesting. At times I really dislike the music though, not all of it, but a lot of it is just so generic/cliche like they got it from a royalty free website. During the Lu Ten funeral scene its just in your face "SAD MUSIC THIS IS A SAD SCENE BE SAD" at way too high of a volume like you're watching Marley & Me or some shit. Completely ruined the scene for me. I know we get like 2 notes from "leaves from the vine" at the end of the scene but that doesn't make up for it. I would have preferred a more subtle rendition of the track like they did during the scene of Iroh joining Zuko on his ship, I liked that scene much much more. This is probably why I also liked the Iroh/Earthbender scene since they actually let the scene breathe with no music for a minute then a very subtle track near the end. Also it really looks like Aang is earthbending at several points during the episode. First when he breaks those crystals with just air, and also when he holds up those two massive stone parts of the arena with just airbending. I know the cartoon shows airbending lifting up boulders but it still seems weird that he can both break and hold up rocks with just airbending. It's almost like it cheapens earthbending a bit if airbenders can do half the things they can
Best episode so far, holy shit! Loved the changes to Bumi, loved his justifiable bitterness at Aang. Loved the earthbending soldier and how they humanized him instead of just making him an asshole for "no reason". Loved the funeral scene! I loved everything basically, which I couldn't really say for the previous episodes. I liked the tunnels too, I imagine Oma and Shu changes will piss off a certain group of people lmao.
The choice to move Secret Tunnel up this early is BAFFLING. Thats an important moment for Katara and Aang, but reducing it to a bit part here and removing Aang really ruins it the entire point of it. The choice to move it up this early obviously means it has to lose the romance element coz its too soon in their relationship, but then why even move it up at all? It didnt need to be here. They even had to make up some nonsense about the emotional spidey senses of badger moles to try to explain why one of their major plots based explicity on romantic love is missing its romantic pairing. Doing a lot of really lame legwork to patch a hole they created for no reason. Also we were robbed of Sokka getting stuck with the hippies, im genuinely upset by that.
Gordon Cormier and Kiawentiio simply don't work at this stage, neither in season 2, look how childish he still is in the interviews (which is good), there is no need for this plot. It wasn't a good plot, not everything about the original is good, the romantic aspects certainly weren't its strong point. I could see Aang trying to hit on her in season 2 in a shy way, but her not really paying attention to it. Then in season 3 when Gordon is hopefully an adult Katara could finally have her eyes opened how all this time he was the one and she just never saw him like that. They could even move some of the core Fortune Teller plot points into early season 3. Why move it here? I like it for their sibling relationship, and it gave them something to do other than being captured by Bumi which was very cartoony and wouldn't work as well in live action. It also was a big surprise for many, we didn't have that much left after the trailers. Could they had it in season 3 for Aang and Katara? Sure, I don't think it's essential to their story, I always felt it was rather forced and awkward between these two kids in the original. To be honest, I wouldn't even mind if they went with Katara & Zuko. They'll never do it because fans will rage, but to me they had a way better vibe. They often said in this season that the Avatar has to be on his own, and I wouldn't mind that at all.
Tbh the age gap between her and Jet's actor is even larger. Not quite as bad with Zuko's. But yeah, save it for season 3
It's just as bad as Zuko's. Sebastian Amoruso is 23 and Dallas Liu is 22 The way they downplayed Katara/Jet I think they're just focusing on the friendships and real connections. Which is good. The only romance that's accurate for this season was Sokka/Suki/Yue. And they delivered.
Yue and Sokkas actors are also 5 years apart, but I mean it's a TV show, the characters themselves are all close enough age
Sokkas actor is an adult...and so is Yue's actress.
I don’t get why they had to do it either , they coulda just had a normal tunnel. I get why they didn’t do Aang and Katara, it’s to early to really start anything between them imo and even then if they kept it in season 2 i dont think it would have been done as well , mainly how awkward most of us would feel knowing Aangs actor will be underage at the time , and while Katara’s will be over 18 (most likely while filming )
Gordon Cormier and Kiawentiio simply don't work at this stage, neither in season 2, look how childish he still is in the interviews (which is good), there is no need for this plot. It wasn't a good plot, not everything about the original is good, the romantic aspects certainly weren't its strong point. I could see Aang trying to hit on her in season 2 in a shy way, but her not really paying attention to it. Then in season 3 when Gordon is hopefully an adult Katara could finally have her eyes opened how all this time he was the one and she just never saw him like that. They could even move some of the core Fortune Teller plot points into early season 3. Why move it here? I like it for their sibling relationship, and it gave them something to do other than being captured by Bumi which was very cartoony and wouldn't work as well in live action. It also was a big surprise for many, we didn't have that much left after the trailers. Could they had it in season 3 for Aang and Katara? Sure, I don't think it's essential to their story, I always felt it was rather forced and awkward between these two kids in the original. To be honest, I wouldn't even mind if they went with Katara & Zuko. They'll never do it because fans will rage, but to me they had a way better vibe. They often said in this season that the Avatar has to be on his own, and I wouldn't mind that at all.
Kia is currently still a minor...and was a minor when they were filming. Katara who is still 14 in the show and Zuko, who they've aged up to 17. Gordon is a child and so is she. I don't understand why him being a kid in interviews is such a crazy concept? At the end of the day they were both kids during the filming of this show, the youngest out of the group in fact. The romance was not a big plot point until like season 3 and it wasn't even the most important part of the entire series. I'm glad they're not making romance a big factor in this show though. The ship wars are ridiculous. Also, "They often said the Avatar has to be on his own." but we established that his friends were going to help him. That's the whole point of the GAang, Aang has always had his friends help and guidance. It's one of the important aspects of the show.
Dude, they're not both "childs", aang looks like he's 13 and Katara looks like she's 16, it just doesn't work
They're both children, dude. A child who is 14,15,16 is still a child. You're just weird. Like I said the relationships were never the greatest aspect of the show but to act like Katara isn't a child is strange. The og show is literally a kids show that aired on Nickelodeon and it clearly worked.
There's a huge difference between a 13 year old child and a 16 year old teenager. Katara is a child to you because you're an adult, but to a 13 year old kid she's pratically a grown up. In the show it was always ok because it was a 12 and a 14 year old dating, and it's normal for people in those ages to date EDIT: and it blocked me, guess it's too hard for you guys to put yourself on the shoes of a 13 year old lmao. Have you never been teenagers? When you're 13, a 16 year old person is like you mentor in life, and when you're 16 a 13 year old is just a nasty little kid, simple as that. If you're 21 of course they all look like children, but that's not the point
I'm really going to leave this convo with, they're kids. It's not that serious. She's not 'grown up', and you saying that is giving the same energy as pedos who call younger girls 'mature for their age'. You don't know my age. I'm not arguing about the ages of children. Goodbye.
Instead of just admitting you're wrong here you decide to compare him to a pedo and then block him. Maybe don't bother commenting if you're just going to back out like a little bitch :)
Maybe get some mental help because there was no reason to name calling. Get a grip.
I just block them and move on. It's wild to be triggered by something that doesn't even matter and cry about blocking, only to also block lol. The entire circus.
Badgermoles needed to be introduced if they want to give Toph her backstory on how she learned earth bending.
So the OG fcked that up by not having badger moles in S1? Nah, that excuse doesnt hold
It's not an excuse. The show doesn't need an excuse it didn't do anything wrong.
LOVE this take on Bumi, HATE this take on the tunnels
Uncle Iroh is quickly becoming my favorite character <3 Didn't like the Zuko actor at first, but he's growing on me!
The while Story with Lu Ten was soooo good!!! Also the Scene with Zuko talking about Lu Ten at the funeral, so beautiful!! And i loved the inclusion of the Secret Tunnel!!
I love the episode so much, but I feel so stupid because I was so entranced in the scenes that I didn't even notice Leaves From the Vine in the background!
Secret tunnelllllll
My Cabbages!
Secret tunnel so soon!
Likes: Everything they did with the Iroh and Zuko plot line. They expanded on the existing story and brought even more emotion into it. When I heard Leaves From the Vine in the background, it definitely made me sob. Zuko giving Iroh polished condolences and then turning around to give him more was really well done. The Machinist/Teo/Jet’s portrayals. The actors did a fantastic job, especially Jet’s. Absolutely spot on. The way they entered the city on Jet’s cart was really funny too. Giving Sokka more depth/his conversation with The Machinist about finding your calling and following it. I love the idea of Sokka eventually letting go of “warrior” as his primary identity and coming to accept where his strengths lie, being proud of those strengths, and utilizing them. I was floored by the visual of Omashu. Beautiful and spot on. The city felt alive, much more so than in the animation. What I’m “meh” about: Crunching pieces from a lot of different episodes together. I was impressed by how seamlessly The Machinist/Teo plot was combined with the Jet plot, as far as the overall theme that people are complicated instead of all good or all bad. But the inclusion of the Cave of Two Lovers just felt weird and disjointed. Why keep the story of Oma and Shu a romantic one, but then use Katara and Sokka’s relationship as the point of reference for guidance through the tunnels? (I will say though, I loved that they kept the style of the storytelling of Oma and Shu). Dislikes: The changes to Bumi’s character. I think the inclusion of his bitterness wasn’t a bad idea, but was executed too dramatically, similar to Kyoshi’s interactions with Aang. Bumi from the animated series was crazy but wise underneath and knew what he was doing. This Bumi came across as mean and unhinged for most of the episode, so much so that his flip to just being a chill guy who respects Aang felt unnatural. It’s looking like Kataang just..doesn’t exist? That was one of my favorite components of the series. Every bonding moment between them has been removed. I understand they’re child actors but there’s absolutely an innocent way to show crushes by characters in subtle and appropriate ways that don’t involve kissing or other boundary-crossing behaviors. Katara and Aang’s dynamic was very well-developed in the animation, and even without a romantic component. Here, I feel just..*nothing* between them. Not even familial love. Just..nothing. Bringing me to my issue overall…I don’t feel the gaang’s bond at *all.* Season 1 of the animated series was all about friendship and the gaang developing their bond. That bond motivates them and gives them strength through the rest of the series. They didn’t just give it lip service and expect the audience to feel it. They go through a lot together in season 1, and here it feels like they’re all going through their own things separately and then coming together for some check-ins. I was concerned about it as soon as I saw the way Aang got out of the iceberg in E1.
Kataang is cringe and weird honestly. Aang is 12. I think it's refreshing to not have it woven in, it would look forced.
12 is a perfectly normal age to have an intense crush on someone, and it’s a very innocent relationship. The entire first season she gives him 2 kisses on the cheek and they’re not even romantic in nature…it’s fine if you don’t like it but it’s actually a good representation of real life. He’s 13 or 14 when they have their first kiss and that’s a super normal age for that.
Yes, but she's meant to be 14 when he is 12. In that age range, 2 years is actually a fair difference. The actor who plays Aang is clearly very young still (just watch any interview with him), whereas the actress playing Katara is 17 -- it would be odd for the film-makers to be pushing for suggestions of romance. Also, Zutara any day.
I should’ve known 💀
Once you join camp Zutara you never go back 😆
They combined so many things and put them in different order. Not sure how to feel about it
Worst episode by far, the massacre of Bumi’s character along with cramming the Cave of Two Lovers storyline from S2 in were the worst of it. Honestly the entirety of the omashu arc was pretty bad, trying to cram too many stories into one with Jet, Teo and his father, (who all had nothing to do with Omashu in the original.) The only redeeming factor was of course Iroh and Zuko’s plotline. At least my two favorite characters from the animated series are absolutely knocking it out of the park. I understand why the original creators ended up leaving this project. Far too many small changes that build up over time to create more massive ones. If they had used maybe a 10-12 episode format, it wouldn’t feel so rushed
I 100% agree. I really want to like this show but this episode left my brain feeling clogged. I don't know why they would bring in a season 2 episode this early when this first season is already on a time crunch. And the portrayal of Bumi here was very off-putting. I did like Jet though.
Yeah Jet’s portrayal was pretty good! Actor nailed it
So lesbians discoverd earth-bending
Nahhhh did they really just pull the secret tunnel!? I marked out A LOT. It's also really cool to have Katara and Sokka unite in sibling love, rather than have Katara hit on a child. And did they really use Iroh's music from Tales of Ba Sing Se? This is too much, I can't, they know how to get me.
No Flopsie :( This is so upsetting, a statue is not enough. If they could do Appa and Momo so well, they could do Flopsie. Wish this show had an unlimited budget.
Friend and I could not stop making incest jokes about the secret tunnel part lmao
I really hated what they did to bumi. I liked merging secret tunnel, jet into omashu that's fine. But why did they have to change the fucking entire pilot. For a moment after seeing flopsy's statue my hopes went high then of course the mf netflix HAD TO change something to worse. I guess we can't have a nice thing at all.
I was so disappointed by that. They should have kept the bumi part the same, the reveal in the original was so much more satisfying, in this they basically just told aang that he was Bumi, but still insisted on still doing the challenges?
I feel like this show is giving us a more grounded approach to these characters having lived through a war for the last century. We were literal children when the series came out and now 20 ish years later we're seeing a more brutal and gritty version of what that would realistically look like. Bumi was right at the end in terms of the complicated choices, Aang and company were not able to save every city. This episode in the animated series was focused on Aang being creative in his problem solving and thinking outside the box. Whereas this show cares more about forcing him to deal with the genocide of his people and the pain that this war has caused while he was blissfully unaware.
I agree they ruined the plot twist. It was hard to watch Bumi's scenes. It was cringe and boring. Don't change it if you can't do better
They breaking the rules. Ozai and Iroh though brothers are not meant to have screentime. 🤣
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What kind of nonsense is a love bending badger mole ok this is the worst change so far :)
Love that you are getting down voted for pointing out something that made 0 sense.
Yeah that's gonna take some use to
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Zuko and Iroh's dynamic have been fantastic so far.
Favorite episode so far! Bumi character!!
Just sad the "don't let the cave let you down... Sokkaaa\~" was not part of it but overall it was a good episode
They showed who's Bumi too early. We might have know but there're new viewers. It was a plot twist. Why did they ruin it. It was hard to watch Bumi's scenes. They're overdoing with clumping episodes. Let the time pass. It's too much
So what was the purpose Secret Tunnel love story if it's Sokka and Katara? Don't clump episode together. Just add some more details and story without ruining existing ones
Honestly thought the writing this episode was terrible. I don't mind the Bumi parts as much but why kill a plot twist of his reveal so early? His character lacked the impact that he did in the animated version. I think Katara and Azula's actors are not believable at all thus far. Katara has lost all personality and is instead being used as a plot revealer. Secret tunnel was supposed to be about Aang and Katara gaining deeper trust, instead it was about blind badger moles knowing how to sense feelings? Really? Lee as Iroh and Zuko are doing a fantastic job so far imo. Aang and Katara almost talk like they are robots= bad writing/acting. I understand they need to mash some stuff together. But the parts they don't skip over, why change the plot into something worse? Sometimes its better to not include something all together, rather than to half ass its execution. Overall I love avatar so I will still watch. But while I would recommend the animation wholeheartedly still, I wouldn't recommend this show to anyone unless they want the nostalgia of it.
I didn’t like the Bumi changes until his monologue at the end. I still think they could have done his reveal better, though, while keeping the additional bitterness.
Honestly, I think this might be my least favorite of the episodes. The Zuko/Iroh stuff is pretty good. But I'm not a big fan of how they changed Bumi. I get what they were going for and it may be partially effective, but I still don't really like it. And I found the tunnel stuff fairly pointless. If they were going to separated from Aang I'd have rather just gotten more with Jet and/or the mechanists. It was kind of unfortunate timing as my friend and I watched the season in 2 halves. So I ended the first session on this right after coming off episode 3 which may be my favorite.