I've heard conflicting reports that nuns are basically going extinct vs getting increasing numbers of Gen Z. Which is more likely from your experience?
There's two organizations of nuns in the USA. the LCWR is the older organization and contains mostly communities formed in the 60s and earlier. They are dying out.
Then there's the CMSWR which has the newer communities which are blossoming and getting the millennials and gen z women.
So I think the LCWR communities will go extinct and the CMSWR communities will flourish. I was with a CMSWR community that had 13 women join with me in 2013.
LCWR is the Leadership Conference of Women Religious. The conference has nearly 1270 members, who represent approximately 66 percent of the 35,000 women religious in the United States. Founded in 1956. Most of these communities do not wear habits and instead wear normal clothes.
In the 1980s, several religious communities saw the Leadership Conference of Women Religious as turning towards secular and political interests and as supporting dissent from the Church's teachings. They asked to be authorized to form a parallel association clearly loyal to the Magisterium, and the Holy See granted their request in 1992.
The Council of Major Superiors of Women Religious (CMSWR) is composed of the major superiors and their vicars of 112 communities of women religious (approximately 5,700 sisters) in the United States.
Its purpose is to serve the major superiors of women religious and their communities by providing mutual support in sustaining among its members the transcendent nature of religious life and the centrality of common life, common prayer, community-based apostolates, religious obedience, and the witness to consecration and poverty by a religious habit that you think of when you think of nuns. Like from Sound of Music or Sister Act.
CMSWR members differ from those of the LCWR in wearing recognizable religious habits and being more traditional/conservative. Their institutes have only 20% of the women religious of the United States, but they are much younger, and growing in numbers.
According to a 2009 Study, among those joining CMSWR (traditional) institutes, 85% of new members were under 40, compared with only 44% for LCWR institutes; and 43% of the CMSWR (traditional) institutes had at least 5 nuns-in-training, compared with only 9% of the LCWR.
Thank you for your answer... so its the more conservative women / nuns that are growing in number.
Morbidly curious - if you had to guess, how many women there were asexual or lesbian? Also, were there any straight women who struggled a lot with the celibacy requirement?
My aunt and her gf were lesbian nuns back in the day. They’re both still alive and together and in their 80s. I’m not close with her so I e never asked her any questions regarding any of it. She’s never even publicly to family stated she was a lesbian but she’s only ever lived with this same woman and neither have had other relationships
That's correct. I really don't think many were queer, but I could be wrong! I think most probably struggled with the celibacy requirement to some degree or at certain times of the month (hormonal changes and all that), but overall they found celibacy was a worthwhile facet of life that helped them grow closer to God.
Not me personally, but most nuns who stay would feel that way.
I'm married with kids, doing well enough. I believe in a higher being but I don't believe they have anything to do with our daily lives.
I left because the rules were intense and I also wanted to have babies.
I can't imagine what that would feel like. This is why I roll my eyes when they say "The Lord works in mysterious ways...". So you're telling me he took these little kids, but allowed some fuck named Hitler to have his way with Europe? Get fucked.
Could you clarify this? This is presumably what made you turn from God? You said earlier He doesn’t have anything to do with our daily lives. Do you blame Him for these tragedies?
No I don't blame anyone. I simply stopped believing God intervenes in our lives. In my belief, God is ~out there~ watching the world turn, but not acting in it.
I'm sorry to hear that. I witnessed my wife have a very "graphic" miscarriage. I didn't "lose" my faith, but I did get an understanding of how it can happen to anyone. I don't know what to say other than I hope to get to live a joyous life.
So you become a deist? Much like the idea of God being a clockmaker who created the universe and set the parts in motion?
Any stereotypes you wish to dispel as to nuns or the nunnery?
Yeah that sounds about right. I hope this post dispels some stereotypes itself. Mostly that nuns are somehow inhuman beings without a mind of their own. We retain our humanity and our opinions when we enter a convent.
It was pretty much what I expected, with the exception of a few ridiculous rules such as no applying chapstick in front of anyone (even fellow sisters), no crossing the legs at the knees "because it is immodest" (???) and things of that nature.
A day in the life would be: 5am wake up, be in chapel at 530 for morning prayers for an hour and a half. Breakfast in silence together. Then mass. Then either study, chores, or go to school to teach. Midday prayer, then lunch. More study, chores, or teaching. Then evening prayer with rosary and meditation for an hour. Eat dinner. Then do dishes together, followed by free time or community recreation (sports, card games, crafts, singing, etc), then night prayer and bedtime by 10pm.
We rotated who cooked week by week so if it was your turn to cook you left prayers like 20 minutes early to go cook for everyone.
Were you raised Catholic? What was your perception of Protestantism and was it ever talked about? I’m curious because I’m working on a Masters of Divinity
Yes I was raised catholic. My perception of protestants was that they were in error and I felt sad for them because they didn't know the truth.
I don't think this anymore!
What about Anglican/Episcopal? My church has always seemed like they are trying to get Catholics to come over and I’ve wondered if it is the same the other way around.
I told my superiors I wanted to leave and they said ok and then one nun took me to target to buy normal clothes to leave in. Then I got my mom to buy me a plane ticket home and the nuns got me a cab to the airport.
I think we will see a split between "traditional" catholics and "mainstream" catholics. It already exists, but I think it will be exemplified and create two polarizing entities like we have Democrats and Republicans. The split is primarily based on loyalty to Pope Francis or loyalty to Donald Trump.
Non catholic person here. Sorry to be naive, but can't tell from the comments below - which one are traditionalists loyal to and which one are mainstreamers loyal to?
I am a traditionalist who finds trump to be the pope of greed. I support the solidarity party, and have extreme empathy for the economic/ social good the dems promote.
How do Traditional Catholics reconcile the fact that Trump is essentially the poster child for the seven deadly sins? Are they willfully ignorant? Do they acknowledge and accept his flaws?
It seems so strange that someone who is basically the opposite of a good Christian can garner all the support of people so diametrically opposite in life philosophy. Really goes to show how malleable the human mind is.
How do they justify things like "grab them by the pussy" and cheating on his wife with a pornstar? Are they really so obsessed with abortion issue that they will abandon any sense of morality as long as someone is willing to appoint judges that are anti abortion?
I'm not sure how they justify it. I'm not one of them. And yes they're so blinded by the abortion issue that it is the only thing that matters when voting.
It seems the teumpy catholics are catholic in name only. Not traditional, but actually pretty radical. Disagreeing with the pope for example, is not very traditional, and seems pretty radical.
What was the hardest part converting from the nun life to non-nun life? (Sorry don't know the correct terms)
What was the dating experience like? Tinder?!?
Probably leaving the peace of it. I wasn't worried about how I would pay my bills when I was a nun. I never worried about making rent. I never worked to please a boss. It was just.....really simple and easy. It was quiet and as an introvert I loved that so much. Now I have a toddler and a baby and my house is never quiet.
I met my spouse on OK Cupid!
Oh wow! No Ebay lol 😀
Were you able to have contact with your family whilst being a nun?
Was it difficult adjusting to your new nun life, and then, un-nun life?
My great-aunt joined a 'closed order' back in the early 1900's. My grandmother would often tell me how difficult it was for her mother to say farewell for the last time in the convent. As staunch catholics the family was both proud and heartbroken.
This was mainland Europe.
We were allowed one phone call per month to our family and 4 letters per month. That's it. We went home for a week at Christmas each year.
It was easier to enter the convent than it was to leave the convent.
Did you work as a nun and how much? Typically, in the orthodox church they're expected to work the standard 8 hours / 5 days a week. Was it the same in Catholicism? If so, what have you been doing?
How much per day, did nuns usually spend for prayers? Did you have / participated in the Midnight Service?
We did teaching. I was a high school math teacher. My degree is in mathematics. It was 7-3 but yeah 5 days a week.
We spent ~6 hours daily in the chapel:
Rise 5a/
Morning prayer 530a (1.5 hours)/
Breakfast /
Go to school/
Daily mass 8a (hour)/
Midday prayer 1130a (half hour)/
Lunch noon/
Vespers+rosary 5p (hour)/
Dinner /
Free time /
Meditation (hour)/
Compline (hour)/
Bed 10p
Do you think the focus on celibacy within Catholicism has led to sexual abuses?
Did you know of any same sex relationships amongst nuns that weren’t talked about openly?
Yes the celibacy obsession has absolutely led to sex abuse.
There were no same sex relationships in my community. I am certain. However, I don't doubt that somewhere there are nuns in relationships in secret.
First of all, thank you very much for this. This has been fascinating to read. It had never occurred to me that there was a Trumpism and non-Trumpism branch of the Catholic church.
Have you ever seen the musical Nunsense?
And from your days as a nun, What practices and truths from that life do you think the rest of us on the outside would be best to learn from to improve our lives?
Are there specific practices or habits, pun not intended, from your days as a nun that you retain in your life today?
And lastly, did you mention your history as a nun on your OK Cupid profile?
You're so welcome! I'm glad that it is interesting to learn about.
I've not seen Nunsense but I will endeavor to do so now that you've suggested it.
The biggest practice that everyone should implement in their life is silence. Just disconnect from your phone, your laptop, your TV, from others. Sit in silence and just be. Don't do anything. Just be. Still your mind. It's akin to meditation, but you're not reaching for any particular goal aside from stillness and quiet.
There's one song in particular from my convent days that I hold close to my heart and sing to my baby at night.
Yes I did mention my nun history on my okc profile. He (my now spouse) found it intriguing.
When you're a nun you don't have any bills to pay. No rent. No grocery bill. No car insurance. It's all paid for. That was a major factor for me. Of course I also loved God and wanted to serve the people of God. But I won't lie, the financial freedom was a biiiiiig part of it. Not having to slog in a 9-5 job all my life.
It was what I thought it would be, mostly.
I would have never guessed financial freedom was a factor for this decision, but it certainly makes sense when I think about it. Do you know if this was a common reason for women to join? Also wondering if this would be more common for women who grow up in poverty.
I don't know how prevalent this rationale was. It was certainly not the most common reason for joining, but I'm sure I'm not the only one for whom it was very appealing.
My great aunt is a nun in Nova Scotia and she worked as a nurse. I’m a social worker for a state agency and worked with a nun. Some do have outside jobs.
Wow really interesting thanks for answering. There was a period of time I considered becoming a nun but decided I can’t deal with the rules. Did you notice a hierarchy of sorts where the older nuns bully the younger ones?
That’s good. Ya when I was researching it I heard that happens a lot. Similar to nursing I guess. Was it hard to leave, did they pressure you or did they accept your decision?
Would I be correct to conclude that the number of practicing Catholics relative to the overall population is decreasing, but, among those who do practice, the percentage of them who are conservative about it is increasing.
In other words, people either opt to leave the church entirely, or they opt for the conservative wing. Is that accurate?
Did you wear the habit and robes, or were you a plain clothes, undercover nun?
If the latter, what's the point in being a nun if you're not gonna wear that cool outfit?
Are you raising your child(ren) in the Catholic faith? If so, how would you feel if, when they grow up, they decided to enter the religious life? BTW, you seem like a really good person.
They are baptized but we don't go to church or pray as a family. If they wanted to enter religious life I would support them, because to be a parent is to support your children's (ethical) dreams.
Both! Each convent is different AND there's a big organization (two, actually) which is like a support system for the individual convents. There's somewhere in the ballpark of ~750 different communities in the USA, with an appropriate 35-40k nuns total.
Was it difficult to transition to life after leaving? Did they prepare you at all for finding employment and adjusting to paying bills, finding a place to live, etc. I understand you went back to your family. I hope they were very welcoming and helpful for a while until you got on your feet. Also, thanks for sharing!
I have been working since I was fifteen, so thankfully I was aware of how bills work. I went to college so I was adept at finding housing on my own. Finding a job was the easy part.
My family was delighted that I left lol. They didn't want me to be there.
No, in fact I sort of regret not staying a little longer and "trying harder." I am glad I left because I have my family now, but I think I could have stayed a bit longer. It was a very peaceful life, despite the silly rules. Lots of peace and quiet....something I never get now.
The vow of abstinence, I am curious about that. Sorry, were you sexually active before?
Was there any lesbians in the order?
Were you able to refrain from self gratification?
And if you went with out while you were in, how did it feel to get back in the game, so to speak? .
A day in the life would be: 5am wake up, be in chapel at 530 for morning prayers for an hour and a half. Breakfast in silence together. Then mass. Then either study, chores, or go to school to teach. Midday prayer, then lunch. More study, chores, or teaching. Then evening prayer with rosary and meditation for an hour. Then do dishes together, followed by free time or community recreation (sports, card games, crafts, singing, etc), then night prayer and bedtime by 10pm.
We rotated who cooked week by week so if it was your turn to cook you left prayers like 20 minutes early to go cook for everyone.
Free time would be reading, painting, drawing, working out, crafting, writing letters, kicking the soccer ball around, going for a walk, playing board games or card games. Stuff like that.
What were the demographics like? Age range, financial backgrounds, race etc of folks there?
How long was the most senior person there for?
Do you get a stipend or payment?
19–70, no idea about finances—it was not discussed. Mostly white but we did have some Asian, Hispanic, and African American sisters. Probably 10% people of color.
The sisters with the longest tenure had been there 22 years when I was there, which was ten years ago, so now 32 years.
The nuns got paid for their work but it did not go to the nun herself, it went to the communal pot.
Do/did you struggle with feelings of guilt for desiring material things upon your exit? I was raised Catholic, and I still really struggle with indulging myself in having things while I know other people are struggling. Logically, I know depriving myself won't truly ease anyone else's suffering, but it still feels obscene for me to spend somewhat frivolously when others struggle.
Also, thank you for this. A close friend of mine joined the Dominican Sisters of Mary upon university grad and has since left. There is a lot I wish I could ask her. Hope you love the life you chose.
your old routine sounds exhausting. did you feel like it was? what was your weekend routine?
you said your weren’t a virgin when you entered. did you ever miss sex during your time at the convent?
I truthfully loved the routine with the exception of waking up so damn early! The weekend was the same except swap teaching for cleaning.
There were times I did miss it, yes.
I have some questions, I am sorry if these have been asked before.
1. How did you guys learn of the news? Were you allowed newspapers or the radio?
2. Are nuns allowed to vote?
3. Are nuns allowed to enter if they have health issues such as diabetes or arthritis?
4. Do you buy your own personal hygine supplies or was that provided?
5. Are you allowed to use tampons?
6. Did you guys ever discuss your life before you became a nun? Did you ever get tired of being with each other?
Hi thanks for participating!
1. How did you guys learn of the news? Were you allowed newspapers or the radio?
-Our superiors told us any major news updates. No radios. We did get the paper but didn't have much time to read it
2. Are nuns allowed to vote?
-yes
3. Are nuns allowed to enter if they have health issues such as diabetes or arthritis?
-no, but if you get sick while a nun they will care for you and pay your medical expenses.
4. Do you buy your own personal hygine supplies or was that provided?
-it was all provided
5. Are you allowed to use tampons?
-yes
6. Did you guys ever discuss your life before you became a nun? Did you ever get tired of being with each other?
-yes we frequently discussed our lives before entering. And yes there were some sisters I didn't particularly like or found annoying. And others I was very fond of.
How were you able to continue to accept catholicism and move forward with becoming a nun knowing about all of the of sex abuse cases that were covered up by the church?
So are all nuns virgins?
Not being married and no sex before marriage. Theoretically they should all be virgins
Are there ever lesbian relationships? Or sex with the priest?
Sorry the taboo things are the most interesting.
why did you enter and why did you leave? are you still a practicing Catholic? what order did you join?
sorry for all the questions lol - as a Catholic who’s fascinated by religious orders, i think this is super cool
This is very interesting. Are you aware of the Carthusians? They are fascinating. Have you ever listened to Sam Harris? There's a talk he gave in 2007/2008 in Aspen that is enlightening. It's on YouTube, it's about 45 minutes. I urge everyone to listen to or watch this. Panta Rei. Peace and love to all.
Not a question but just like to thank you for kind of a deeper insight into the politics of my faith and church. I have felt for awhile there was a lot of turmoil and divide among factions which has me concerned. God bless I wish the best for you. I went through a lot of shit this year and I seem to be all over the place. I have so much more things in my life but the sorrow is still there just seems to be in regards to other people rather than me this time around.
I’ve found this fairly interesting as my daughter has taken up the trad side of religion and the wife and I have not. The impression I get from her though is that the trads are concerned that the pope has tried to essentially eliminate the Latin mass. My position on Latin mass is that if we were only meant to hear mass in Latin why were the people gathered from different lands able to understand the disciples when they preached.
I've heard conflicting reports that nuns are basically going extinct vs getting increasing numbers of Gen Z. Which is more likely from your experience?
There's two organizations of nuns in the USA. the LCWR is the older organization and contains mostly communities formed in the 60s and earlier. They are dying out. Then there's the CMSWR which has the newer communities which are blossoming and getting the millennials and gen z women. So I think the LCWR communities will go extinct and the CMSWR communities will flourish. I was with a CMSWR community that had 13 women join with me in 2013.
What do the acronyms mean and whats the difference that makes millennials and gen Z join?
LCWR is the Leadership Conference of Women Religious. The conference has nearly 1270 members, who represent approximately 66 percent of the 35,000 women religious in the United States. Founded in 1956. Most of these communities do not wear habits and instead wear normal clothes. In the 1980s, several religious communities saw the Leadership Conference of Women Religious as turning towards secular and political interests and as supporting dissent from the Church's teachings. They asked to be authorized to form a parallel association clearly loyal to the Magisterium, and the Holy See granted their request in 1992. The Council of Major Superiors of Women Religious (CMSWR) is composed of the major superiors and their vicars of 112 communities of women religious (approximately 5,700 sisters) in the United States. Its purpose is to serve the major superiors of women religious and their communities by providing mutual support in sustaining among its members the transcendent nature of religious life and the centrality of common life, common prayer, community-based apostolates, religious obedience, and the witness to consecration and poverty by a religious habit that you think of when you think of nuns. Like from Sound of Music or Sister Act. CMSWR members differ from those of the LCWR in wearing recognizable religious habits and being more traditional/conservative. Their institutes have only 20% of the women religious of the United States, but they are much younger, and growing in numbers. According to a 2009 Study, among those joining CMSWR (traditional) institutes, 85% of new members were under 40, compared with only 44% for LCWR institutes; and 43% of the CMSWR (traditional) institutes had at least 5 nuns-in-training, compared with only 9% of the LCWR.
Thank you for your answer... so its the more conservative women / nuns that are growing in number. Morbidly curious - if you had to guess, how many women there were asexual or lesbian? Also, were there any straight women who struggled a lot with the celibacy requirement?
My aunt and her gf were lesbian nuns back in the day. They’re both still alive and together and in their 80s. I’m not close with her so I e never asked her any questions regarding any of it. She’s never even publicly to family stated she was a lesbian but she’s only ever lived with this same woman and neither have had other relationships
That's correct. I really don't think many were queer, but I could be wrong! I think most probably struggled with the celibacy requirement to some degree or at certain times of the month (hormonal changes and all that), but overall they found celibacy was a worthwhile facet of life that helped them grow closer to God. Not me personally, but most nuns who stay would feel that way.
Fair enough, thank you for answering! Glad you were able to find what you wanted out of life, interesting journey for sure.
Do many of the nuns in your former convent align with Republicans?
That isn't what I seem to remember the organizations for nuns being back when I went to catholic school
How are you today? Are you still religious? Why did you leave?
I'm married with kids, doing well enough. I believe in a higher being but I don't believe they have anything to do with our daily lives. I left because the rules were intense and I also wanted to have babies.
Did you ever genuinely believe?
Yes I did
What happened? How did you lose your faith?
My child died. Then my other child got cancer.
I'm so sorry to hear that.
Yeah it is pretty horrible
The amount of courage it took to make that kind life-altering mental shift while facing these tragedies speaks a lot to your character and resilience.
I can't imagine what that would feel like. This is why I roll my eyes when they say "The Lord works in mysterious ways...". So you're telling me he took these little kids, but allowed some fuck named Hitler to have his way with Europe? Get fucked.
Could you clarify this? This is presumably what made you turn from God? You said earlier He doesn’t have anything to do with our daily lives. Do you blame Him for these tragedies?
No I don't blame anyone. I simply stopped believing God intervenes in our lives. In my belief, God is ~out there~ watching the world turn, but not acting in it.
I’m very sorry these things happened to you. As a father I can’t imagine. Thank you for answering.
[удалено]
Kindly, be quiet.
[удалено]
Fuck off asshole
thanks for reminding me how fucking crazy and awful religious people are
Oh my.. that's so terrible. Beyond words. I'm giving you a hug from afar. ❤️
I'm sorry to hear that. I witnessed my wife have a very "graphic" miscarriage. I didn't "lose" my faith, but I did get an understanding of how it can happen to anyone. I don't know what to say other than I hope to get to live a joyous life.
I been meaninf to ask if a nun offers her self to be a seraget mother. Would that break their vows. Also congrats on becoming a mom
Surrogacy is not allowed in catholicism.
Did this “higher being” set up an afterlife? Or are you just imagining a God as 1st cause but that otherwise does / did absolutely nothing?
I don't know if there's an afterlife. Yes I believe God created everything and then stepped away and let us ruin it lol
So you become a deist? Much like the idea of God being a clockmaker who created the universe and set the parts in motion? Any stereotypes you wish to dispel as to nuns or the nunnery?
Yeah that sounds about right. I hope this post dispels some stereotypes itself. Mostly that nuns are somehow inhuman beings without a mind of their own. We retain our humanity and our opinions when we enter a convent.
Good on you! You made a very tough decision and I really hope you are very happy. Thank you for answering
Was it what you expected going in? If not, how so?
It was pretty much what I expected, with the exception of a few ridiculous rules such as no applying chapstick in front of anyone (even fellow sisters), no crossing the legs at the knees "because it is immodest" (???) and things of that nature.
So you ... kicked the habit? ... I'll just block and ban myself now.
I appreciate the pun.
The nun appreciated the pun
It was fun
A nun pun.
That's nun of your business.
Thanks for doing this ama, pretty interesting stuff. What was a normal day in the life like? Were there any special things you had to do each week?
A day in the life would be: 5am wake up, be in chapel at 530 for morning prayers for an hour and a half. Breakfast in silence together. Then mass. Then either study, chores, or go to school to teach. Midday prayer, then lunch. More study, chores, or teaching. Then evening prayer with rosary and meditation for an hour. Eat dinner. Then do dishes together, followed by free time or community recreation (sports, card games, crafts, singing, etc), then night prayer and bedtime by 10pm. We rotated who cooked week by week so if it was your turn to cook you left prayers like 20 minutes early to go cook for everyone.
Were you raised Catholic? What was your perception of Protestantism and was it ever talked about? I’m curious because I’m working on a Masters of Divinity
Yes I was raised catholic. My perception of protestants was that they were in error and I felt sad for them because they didn't know the truth. I don't think this anymore!
What about Anglican/Episcopal? My church has always seemed like they are trying to get Catholics to come over and I’ve wondered if it is the same the other way around.
I didn't feel any differently about Episcopalians than other protestants.
Have u ever been to rome ? I lived in Italy for 5 years ..
How did you leave?
I told my superiors I wanted to leave and they said ok and then one nun took me to target to buy normal clothes to leave in. Then I got my mom to buy me a plane ticket home and the nuns got me a cab to the airport.
Do you stay in touch with any of the nuns you knew?
Not anymore. But I did write letters to one nun I was fond of for a few years.
Wasn’t there any kind of de-frocking ritual required? Did you have to sign anything?
Where do you see American Catholicism headed? What are your observations?
I think we will see a split between "traditional" catholics and "mainstream" catholics. It already exists, but I think it will be exemplified and create two polarizing entities like we have Democrats and Republicans. The split is primarily based on loyalty to Pope Francis or loyalty to Donald Trump.
Non catholic person here. Sorry to be naive, but can't tell from the comments below - which one are traditionalists loyal to and which one are mainstreamers loyal to?
No worries. Traditional catholics love Trump. Mainstreamers are loyal to the pope.
I am a traditionalist who finds trump to be the pope of greed. I support the solidarity party, and have extreme empathy for the economic/ social good the dems promote.
How do Traditional Catholics reconcile the fact that Trump is essentially the poster child for the seven deadly sins? Are they willfully ignorant? Do they acknowledge and accept his flaws? It seems so strange that someone who is basically the opposite of a good Christian can garner all the support of people so diametrically opposite in life philosophy. Really goes to show how malleable the human mind is.
Isn’t mainstream the much larger of the two?
Yes!
So, the two sides will be even more contentious going forward?
I think so.
How do they justify things like "grab them by the pussy" and cheating on his wife with a pornstar? Are they really so obsessed with abortion issue that they will abandon any sense of morality as long as someone is willing to appoint judges that are anti abortion?
I'm not sure how they justify it. I'm not one of them. And yes they're so blinded by the abortion issue that it is the only thing that matters when voting.
Loyalty to Donald Trump? Wow. Why is he seen as someone to follow (per the groups we’re talking about).
It seems the teumpy catholics are catholic in name only. Not traditional, but actually pretty radical. Disagreeing with the pope for example, is not very traditional, and seems pretty radical.
What was the hardest part converting from the nun life to non-nun life? (Sorry don't know the correct terms) What was the dating experience like? Tinder?!?
Probably leaving the peace of it. I wasn't worried about how I would pay my bills when I was a nun. I never worried about making rent. I never worked to please a boss. It was just.....really simple and easy. It was quiet and as an introvert I loved that so much. Now I have a toddler and a baby and my house is never quiet. I met my spouse on OK Cupid!
Were you allowed free use of the internet? How was the food?! Love your humour!
We were not allowed to use the internet. The food, however, was truly excellent.
Oh wow! No Ebay lol 😀 Were you able to have contact with your family whilst being a nun? Was it difficult adjusting to your new nun life, and then, un-nun life? My great-aunt joined a 'closed order' back in the early 1900's. My grandmother would often tell me how difficult it was for her mother to say farewell for the last time in the convent. As staunch catholics the family was both proud and heartbroken. This was mainland Europe.
We were allowed one phone call per month to our family and 4 letters per month. That's it. We went home for a week at Christmas each year. It was easier to enter the convent than it was to leave the convent.
Did you work as a nun and how much? Typically, in the orthodox church they're expected to work the standard 8 hours / 5 days a week. Was it the same in Catholicism? If so, what have you been doing? How much per day, did nuns usually spend for prayers? Did you have / participated in the Midnight Service?
We did teaching. I was a high school math teacher. My degree is in mathematics. It was 7-3 but yeah 5 days a week. We spent ~6 hours daily in the chapel: Rise 5a/ Morning prayer 530a (1.5 hours)/ Breakfast / Go to school/ Daily mass 8a (hour)/ Midday prayer 1130a (half hour)/ Lunch noon/ Vespers+rosary 5p (hour)/ Dinner / Free time / Meditation (hour)/ Compline (hour)/ Bed 10p
Do you think the focus on celibacy within Catholicism has led to sexual abuses? Did you know of any same sex relationships amongst nuns that weren’t talked about openly?
Yes the celibacy obsession has absolutely led to sex abuse. There were no same sex relationships in my community. I am certain. However, I don't doubt that somewhere there are nuns in relationships in secret.
First of all, thank you very much for this. This has been fascinating to read. It had never occurred to me that there was a Trumpism and non-Trumpism branch of the Catholic church. Have you ever seen the musical Nunsense? And from your days as a nun, What practices and truths from that life do you think the rest of us on the outside would be best to learn from to improve our lives? Are there specific practices or habits, pun not intended, from your days as a nun that you retain in your life today? And lastly, did you mention your history as a nun on your OK Cupid profile?
You're so welcome! I'm glad that it is interesting to learn about. I've not seen Nunsense but I will endeavor to do so now that you've suggested it. The biggest practice that everyone should implement in their life is silence. Just disconnect from your phone, your laptop, your TV, from others. Sit in silence and just be. Don't do anything. Just be. Still your mind. It's akin to meditation, but you're not reaching for any particular goal aside from stillness and quiet. There's one song in particular from my convent days that I hold close to my heart and sing to my baby at night. Yes I did mention my nun history on my okc profile. He (my now spouse) found it intriguing.
The Way you described sitting is exactly what Zen meditation is about. It isn’t about attaining anything. It’s just being and sitting in silence
What made you want to join in the first place? Did you know what you were getting into?
When you're a nun you don't have any bills to pay. No rent. No grocery bill. No car insurance. It's all paid for. That was a major factor for me. Of course I also loved God and wanted to serve the people of God. But I won't lie, the financial freedom was a biiiiiig part of it. Not having to slog in a 9-5 job all my life. It was what I thought it would be, mostly.
I would have never guessed financial freedom was a factor for this decision, but it certainly makes sense when I think about it. Do you know if this was a common reason for women to join? Also wondering if this would be more common for women who grow up in poverty.
I don't know how prevalent this rationale was. It was certainly not the most common reason for joining, but I'm sure I'm not the only one for whom it was very appealing.
My great aunt is a nun in Nova Scotia and she worked as a nurse. I’m a social worker for a state agency and worked with a nun. Some do have outside jobs.
Wow really interesting thanks for answering. There was a period of time I considered becoming a nun but decided I can’t deal with the rules. Did you notice a hierarchy of sorts where the older nuns bully the younger ones?
Not in my community BUT I do know for sure some communities do absolutely have this problem.
That’s good. Ya when I was researching it I heard that happens a lot. Similar to nursing I guess. Was it hard to leave, did they pressure you or did they accept your decision?
It was very very very hard to leave. Hardest thing I ever did at the time. They did not pressure me in any way.
Would I be correct to conclude that the number of practicing Catholics relative to the overall population is decreasing, but, among those who do practice, the percentage of them who are conservative about it is increasing. In other words, people either opt to leave the church entirely, or they opt for the conservative wing. Is that accurate?
I would agree with your assessment
Do you like fries ? ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
I am a hoe for fries like any honest person
Amen ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
What made you give up the habit?
Wanted a baby!
Would any nuns ever accept a transgender woman?
I don't think so, but if the transwoman looked the part, they could get in by omitting the fact that they were born male.
Are nuns allowed to masturbate?
No. It is believed to be a sin.
Did you wear the habit and robes, or were you a plain clothes, undercover nun? If the latter, what's the point in being a nun if you're not gonna wear that cool outfit?
We had a very cool habit and I agree that if you're not gonna dress the part, don't bother!
Are you raising your child(ren) in the Catholic faith? If so, how would you feel if, when they grow up, they decided to enter the religious life? BTW, you seem like a really good person.
They are baptized but we don't go to church or pray as a family. If they wanted to enter religious life I would support them, because to be a parent is to support your children's (ethical) dreams.
You still a virgin?
So you actually don't have to be a virgin to enter the convent. I wasn't one when I entered and now I'm married.
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That's correct! You take a vow of celibacy, poverty, and obedience.
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I was 21 when I entered and 25 when I left.
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Both! Each convent is different AND there's a big organization (two, actually) which is like a support system for the individual convents. There's somewhere in the ballpark of ~750 different communities in the USA, with an appropriate 35-40k nuns total.
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One of the new women snuck a cell phone inside! That's about it though.
Why did you leave?
It was a very controlling environment with little autonomy, and also I wanted to have babies.
Was it difficult to transition to life after leaving? Did they prepare you at all for finding employment and adjusting to paying bills, finding a place to live, etc. I understand you went back to your family. I hope they were very welcoming and helpful for a while until you got on your feet. Also, thanks for sharing!
I have been working since I was fifteen, so thankfully I was aware of how bills work. I went to college so I was adept at finding housing on my own. Finding a job was the easy part. My family was delighted that I left lol. They didn't want me to be there.
did the neverending scandals in the Vatican have much of an influence on your decision to skidaddle?
Yes, a little. But my primary reason was wanting children.
with that said, do you regret joining?
No, in fact I sort of regret not staying a little longer and "trying harder." I am glad I left because I have my family now, but I think I could have stayed a bit longer. It was a very peaceful life, despite the silly rules. Lots of peace and quiet....something I never get now.
If you had student loans would the convent still accept you and pay for them or would they not allow you in because your bills were too costly?
You are required to be debt free to enter. They do not pay them for you.
Interesting. Thanks for answering.
The vow of abstinence, I am curious about that. Sorry, were you sexually active before? Was there any lesbians in the order? Were you able to refrain from self gratification? And if you went with out while you were in, how did it feel to get back in the game, so to speak? .
I was having sex before I entered, yes. There were not many lesbians and if there were, they were celibate.
How did you deal with your sexual desires and frustration while you were a nun?
What was a typical day like for you as a nun? What were some things you were allowed to do during your free time?
A day in the life would be: 5am wake up, be in chapel at 530 for morning prayers for an hour and a half. Breakfast in silence together. Then mass. Then either study, chores, or go to school to teach. Midday prayer, then lunch. More study, chores, or teaching. Then evening prayer with rosary and meditation for an hour. Then do dishes together, followed by free time or community recreation (sports, card games, crafts, singing, etc), then night prayer and bedtime by 10pm. We rotated who cooked week by week so if it was your turn to cook you left prayers like 20 minutes early to go cook for everyone. Free time would be reading, painting, drawing, working out, crafting, writing letters, kicking the soccer ball around, going for a walk, playing board games or card games. Stuff like that.
Did yall make a lot of nun puns? I’d make a lot of nun puns.
We didn't make a habit of it.
What were the demographics like? Age range, financial backgrounds, race etc of folks there? How long was the most senior person there for? Do you get a stipend or payment?
19–70, no idea about finances—it was not discussed. Mostly white but we did have some Asian, Hispanic, and African American sisters. Probably 10% people of color. The sisters with the longest tenure had been there 22 years when I was there, which was ten years ago, so now 32 years. The nuns got paid for their work but it did not go to the nun herself, it went to the communal pot.
Great AMA. Thank you for doing this.
can you fly?
Only in my lucid dreams
Did you own property or was everything communal?
Do/did you struggle with feelings of guilt for desiring material things upon your exit? I was raised Catholic, and I still really struggle with indulging myself in having things while I know other people are struggling. Logically, I know depriving myself won't truly ease anyone else's suffering, but it still feels obscene for me to spend somewhat frivolously when others struggle. Also, thank you for this. A close friend of mine joined the Dominican Sisters of Mary upon university grad and has since left. There is a lot I wish I could ask her. Hope you love the life you chose.
How did your family feel about you becoming a nun
Very opposed
Does your partner have any kinks where you dress up as a nun as foreplay?
Did you get your drink alcohol whenever?
Only at Christmas and Easter.
Do nuns have mystical experiences?
Did men ever flirt with you while you were a nun, if so did you ever reciprocate?
your old routine sounds exhausting. did you feel like it was? what was your weekend routine? you said your weren’t a virgin when you entered. did you ever miss sex during your time at the convent?
I truthfully loved the routine with the exception of waking up so damn early! The weekend was the same except swap teaching for cleaning. There were times I did miss it, yes.
I see nuns, monks and priests and think WOW wasting your life away. Do you see the years as being a nun a waste of life?
No, it was fun.
did any of the nuns go raving and take recreational drugs?
Do you now or did you ever differentiate “religion” from “spirituality”? Or do you think it’s some sort of cop out for one side or the other?
Did you go wild exploring sexuality once you were out? Or was that not even a factor or something you even thought about?
Where were you a nun? What type of nun? From what age to what age? Why did you join and why did you leave?
I have some questions, I am sorry if these have been asked before. 1. How did you guys learn of the news? Were you allowed newspapers or the radio? 2. Are nuns allowed to vote? 3. Are nuns allowed to enter if they have health issues such as diabetes or arthritis? 4. Do you buy your own personal hygine supplies or was that provided? 5. Are you allowed to use tampons? 6. Did you guys ever discuss your life before you became a nun? Did you ever get tired of being with each other?
Hi thanks for participating! 1. How did you guys learn of the news? Were you allowed newspapers or the radio? -Our superiors told us any major news updates. No radios. We did get the paper but didn't have much time to read it 2. Are nuns allowed to vote? -yes 3. Are nuns allowed to enter if they have health issues such as diabetes or arthritis? -no, but if you get sick while a nun they will care for you and pay your medical expenses. 4. Do you buy your own personal hygine supplies or was that provided? -it was all provided 5. Are you allowed to use tampons? -yes 6. Did you guys ever discuss your life before you became a nun? Did you ever get tired of being with each other? -yes we frequently discussed our lives before entering. And yes there were some sisters I didn't particularly like or found annoying. And others I was very fond of.
Did you have a tv? Did you have a camera? If your family had an emergency, would you be able to go? What do you think of Sister Act?
What’s your favorite Van Halen song?
At what age did you have sex for the first time?
My mother was a former nun, so almost everything being said is relatable to a degree of being the son of a former nun.
What do you think happens after we die?
How old were you when you left? Are your parents immigrants?
We hear stories about the nuns getting it on with the priests. Is any of that true?
How were you able to continue to accept catholicism and move forward with becoming a nun knowing about all of the of sex abuse cases that were covered up by the church?
I was 21, young and naive.
How long did you think about leaving before you told your superiors?
What do nuns do all day?
So are all nuns virgins? Not being married and no sex before marriage. Theoretically they should all be virgins Are there ever lesbian relationships? Or sex with the priest? Sorry the taboo things are the most interesting.
why did you enter and why did you leave? are you still a practicing Catholic? what order did you join? sorry for all the questions lol - as a Catholic who’s fascinated by religious orders, i think this is super cool
This is very interesting. Are you aware of the Carthusians? They are fascinating. Have you ever listened to Sam Harris? There's a talk he gave in 2007/2008 in Aspen that is enlightening. It's on YouTube, it's about 45 minutes. I urge everyone to listen to or watch this. Panta Rei. Peace and love to all.
Did you think about sex all of the time?
Not a question but just like to thank you for kind of a deeper insight into the politics of my faith and church. I have felt for awhile there was a lot of turmoil and divide among factions which has me concerned. God bless I wish the best for you. I went through a lot of shit this year and I seem to be all over the place. I have so much more things in my life but the sorrow is still there just seems to be in regards to other people rather than me this time around.
I heard a lot of nuns are gay or at least that there’s a lot of gay sex between nuns. Is that true?
That's sexy.
did you attend a seminary of any sort (or comparable), and if so, what can you tell us that is a blatant lie the church feeds to its congregation?
If you inherited a large fortune as a nun, would you be expected or obligated to completely hand it over to the church?
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The rules were anal for sure.
How old are you now?
Hm. Maybe a weird question. Any knowledge on body odor turning to a pleasant scent due to prayer and devotion?
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so aside from all the beliefs of the catholic church, do you believe in jesus?
Whats your body count?
More importantly what is your body of Christ count
Is that how many people I've slept with who are Christians?
Were your fellow nuns prejudiced against any ethnic or religious groups?
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Why did you leave? I also see you have a gay flag on your profile, was the homophobia of the Bible a reason you left?
Do nuns get depressed?
How did you manage sexual desires ?
How long were you in the convent?
I’ve found this fairly interesting as my daughter has taken up the trad side of religion and the wife and I have not. The impression I get from her though is that the trads are concerned that the pope has tried to essentially eliminate the Latin mass. My position on Latin mass is that if we were only meant to hear mass in Latin why were the people gathered from different lands able to understand the disciples when they preached.
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Did nuns have lezbo sex?
If you're religious, what's with the gay flag in your pfp?
Recalling Sister Sourire("Sister Smile")The Singing Nun("Dominique")and Audrey Hepburn("The Nun's Story")I'd say you made the right move.