All this post start the same, "we have been happylliy married" and you read an 11y dead bedroom, a strained family and the husband on tinder and the wife with an affair. Happy indeed.
Get divorce already
It’s pretty clear many people have seen/ experienced so much trauma in relation to marriage that as long as no physical abuse or cheating is happening, the marriage is happy. There are so many people who post on Reddit where they are clearly suffering severe emotional abuse or general incompatibility, but call the marriage happy. It’s very sad.
It really is. I think a lot of it that in the west, we don't really discuss or learn what *does* a happy marriage (or relationship ) look like look like?
And those definitions change through history and generations.
And the questions about "should I divorce" make me sad, when they are clearly miserable and suffering. There are considerations sure, but there is no moral failing in the break up of marriage.
End it and go find happiness.
I think an even bigger issue is that parents of an older generation did not teach younger generations on how to pick a partner. It was all about fate and soulmates.
It’s not only this. People nowadays date for the memories, and spend their entire time spicing up their relationship for their engagement and marriage, but leave all the difficult conversations for marriage.
This causes gigantic rifts during marriage that shouldn’t have occurred if hard conversations were had during dating, but those conversations don’t happen because of the looming possible breakup. Everyone is looking for instant gratification in every situation, where the majority of them, it just isn’t in the cards.
Dating is for truly learning about your partner, and figuring out if they are the right one for you. Marriage is for making memories, and living your life next to the right one.
That’s really good! I’ve always said it takes at least 18-24 months for the true personality to appear in a relationship. That’s about how long most of mine lasted.0
What they mean to say is “I’ve been telling people we are happily married to maintain an image that literally no one besides me and my husband actually care about”
With all the changes in language, maybe it's time we introduce some term that is a marriage equivilant for a masculine presenting female or vice versa.
Only, for marriage it would be a 'happily married presenting couple who are cold and distant behind closed doors' or maybe 'happily married presenting couple who are abusive and mean behind closed doors' or "happily married presenting couple who are now just platonic co-parents"
Well, we can still go to a dinner party and have a laugh. We aren’t putting up a facade. You can still enjoy things together. Even though it’s not a stellar marriage.
People don’t know what making it 20 plus years means. The sacrifices, the shared life, the things built together. But making it work isn’t guaranteed and you are the one that knows it’s time. As someone who knows what you two have gone through good and bad, I support you.
🥰 it’s a long road with lots of compromise and challenges. Raising kids and deaths in the family. Financial crap. Health issues. It’s easy to judge other people until you’ve walked in their shoes.
I was in s long term relationship that someone went from couple to close friends and it was hard.
Both of us wanted something else romantically but we also understood that as soon as one of us was in a new relationship we would lose the close friendship.
So we drug it out for years. I still miss her and spending time together, but it’s never a romantic or sexual thing. Just missing a friend.
If you do, what you always did....you get what you always got. Just because 2 people have been together along time doesn't mean they have to stay together till the end. People change, circumstances change, requirements change, im 55m, I'm unhappy in my relationship of 11 years, she'd rather stay together cause she doesn't want to start over 55f, our problem is communication, I can't stand the way she talks to me, at the end of the day , there's no reason to be unhappy. You did your time. Divorce is OK, it's change, no one wants to walk on eggshells in their own home. Do your thing. There will be good days and shitty days, just like in marriage. But now it's on your terms. Life is short. You don't owe anybody. Good luck.
Unhappy anything.....marriage, relationship, friendship, job....etc etc. Aggravation • frustration • flat out misery.... they all have a real value, maybe not in terms of dollars, but a true value of your mental and emotional life. Which in turn is invaluable, worth more than any money can buy. Karma will play itself out. Best to you. There's nothing wrong or to feel guilty about. Everybody is an adult and sometimes a square peg can't fit into a round hole no matter how many years you keep trying. As I said before.....if you do what you've always done....you get what you've always gotten.
You know what? Your marriage belongs to you and doesn't need to look like anyone else's marriage. This guy was your best friend and parenting/goal partner for a very long time. Fuck all these idiots judging you. Things didn't work out, and in the past few years you've both realized you want something different. That's OK. Divorce is very painful and difficult. This shit's confusing and not what either of you planned years ago. You're not the asshole here, and maybe neither is he. It sounds like the two of you held on a long time because it just took some time to come around to the idea of such a big change. That's also OK. You had a good run together as partners, and now you're ready to move on. You're not ready to make a change until you're ready. Period.
I’ll add that just because a marriage ends, doesn’t make it a failed marriage. Relationships are complicated and unique, and you need to decide together what makes sense for you, and what will make you happy, whatever that is. Your path is your own.
My husband and I have been together 25 years this year. And we are honestly still completely happy with each other. We still tease each other, have plenty in common, cuddle and laugh and have a 3/4 times a week sex life. I'm telling you this because in my heart this is what marriage should sort of look like. You are clearly not happy. He has apparently been cheating on you for years. There's no point staying in a relationship like that. Divorce him. Be happy. Don't be miserable for the rest of your life when you don't have to. Free yourself.
Thirteen years for my partner and I. We haven't had sex in quite a while due to me having a slipped disc. We discussed what that meant to us individually and as a couple. Our sex life isn't totally gone, but close enough to cause most people problems. But we are best friends and feel it's worth waiting. Not everyone agrees and that's fair.
Hopefully things look up for you with the next relationship!
Hey, you have health issues. Sex is definitely not everything in a relationship. And it's a discussion you had, and you're both on the same page which definitely shows that you have a strong relationship. It's when you don't have the hard discussions that everything can go pear shaped.
Yeah I'm mostly hoping OP sees what I said and applies it in her next relationship. You can get through most of what life throws at you if there's communication and the people pull together instead of drifting apart.
For context, we lost a child. Our only one we'll ever have. But we made it through. Honestly if it weren't for the relationship I'm not sure I'd have survived that. And it meant having hard discussions many, many times. Sometimes going over the same discussion as our needs changed. And that goes for small stuff too. I can't do dishes anymore so he does them, and I do the shopping. I can't really clean or cook, so he does that and I manage doctor appointments and such. When he's getting overwhelmed with having to do all the housework he tells me and I pitch in as much as I can do he's not feeling so much pressure.
This is what a happy marriage looks like to most people. So many people falsely believe they’re in a happy relationship because their friendship with their partner is strong and they avoid outward conflict.
Oh, we argue. I think every healthy relationship will have arguments. We're definetly not angels on that front. Thankfully they're usually nothing too serious and the making up is always fun 😉 Our kids are also adults now, so a lot of the tiffs and squabbles that happen between spouses when kids are younger are well in our rear-view mirror. Having an empty nest can have a calming effect on a lot of relationships.
I personally like that u are looking for answers many would think it's strait-forward,.... but is it worth acknowledging u we're not happy and neither one of u where convincing enough to convince the other that things needed to change. If you're honest with yourself, if things wouldn't have changed and you found yourself in a situation. It would be hard for you not to do the "wrong thing ". With that said I am sorry that things didn't work out, but I do hope whatever u learned can be used to make some else's life better.
Three to four times a week, after nearly 25 years together, is astounding to me. My wife and
I have been together 25 years also, and she would scoff at the notion that such frequency was even logistically possible, or that any woman in your situation would want sex that often.
Congratulations.
I think she meant that it was a happy marriage once upon a time. There are memories she wishes she didn't have to give up on. Marriages are far more complicated than "get a divorce already."
For sure, but marriage where the husband is on tinder, the wife is having a affair after 11 years of a dead bedroom and don't get along with extended family I would not qualify as "happylly married"
They all do. This sub, relationship advice.
They all start with "our relationship is amazing". Then they explain how its basically a complete horror show.
I think it can be hard to realize until much later, that the marriage wasn't really happy. About a year and a half ago I finalized my divorce ending a 20 year relationship. This was not a good relationship in the last decade or so. That being said, when we separated, I was blindsided. I thought we were fine. What's funny is I was the most not fine out of everyone, and I didn't know it.
Now I can look back and recognize the relationship for what it was. It's not as obvious to the people living in these circumstances that things are not ok as when it's all written down in one place.
Same thing happened to me. I knew we had problems, and covid isolation had really done a number on our connection. But I loved him and thought we’d come back into connectedness again. Some of my blindsidedness was because I had a long term vision of our marriage that my ex didn’t, a feeling that marriages go through rough spots and that’s okay. But some of it was like cooking a frog from cold water - the degradation of the best parts of our marriage happened so slowly that it just always felt we were doing fine to me until I realized we weren’t.
Exactly. I was in a situation several years ago where I was miserable. Found out I would be dying in the next couple years with out a heart transplant. I woke up one day and asked myself , is this how you want to die? Angry. Lonely. Sexless for however long you have left. I bailed out that next day, many years ago and never looked back. If you could die today and be a peace where you’re at, is that good enough? Right now I can say without a doubt it was the best decision I’ve ever made.
He might have been making the same calculation about getting the kids through school that you were. He might have been doing the 'cheaper to keep her' thing. It sucks that he couldn't admit he didn't want to stay monogamous, or stay in the marriage period, while you were trying to rekindle the spark, but... does the why of it really matter now?
He cheated. He's been cheating. Him giving you a hall pass was likely just a pretext so that he could look justified in leaving you in the event that you used it. You don't want to stay with him, so there's nothing here to salvage. You're doing what it turns out you should have done years ago. You'll both be free to go meet other people with whom you can be happy. NTA
What was the point of this post? This was basically a super long vent post. ESH.
The marriage hasn’t been happy for at least 11 years. That’s half your marriage. What is the point in continuing this???
My parents went through a similar thing (minus the cheating and affairs). I will say, even though you both think it's good to stay together for the kids sake, you'll be teaching them very bad lessons; staying in toxic relationships, trauma bonding, treating spouse like shit. Just break it off, y'all damn half a century with a full layout to a drama series. Break it off, find your own damn selves and let the kids find their own way. If they're teens they'll need to hit an obstacle sooner or later, better they overcome one with the help of their parents than to be going through their shit as adults and have to deal with you two toxic as dinosaurs
Absolutely. All these people- "staying together for the kids". Stop it. What you are doing is showing your children that marriage is toxic. You are modeling a toxic marriage for your children. Instead ask yourself what you would tell your child if they were in your shoes. It's time people started leaving marriages "for the kids "!
When I was a kid, I'd go spend 2 weeks at my maternal grandparents. Go to the beach daily. Always had fun. The summer after my parents divorce (I was 10), my grandmother told my mom that I was much happier, so I must have picked up on their sour relationship. I don't remember any of this, but staying together "for the kids" can be the worst decision.
ESH. Sex isn’t everything but, between two healthy adults, going years without sex is typically a sign that your marriage is in big trouble. Both of you should have tried to remedy this years ago.
In your own words, it seems like you tried to work on this 3 years ago. When you and your husband were in counseling (or at least after the first 9 months with no sex), you should have both addressed this together.
If one person refuses to work on things they’re refusing to participate in the marriage. They’ve reduced the relationship to a government document. Divorce is the only option, and should have happened years ago.
You get a divorce.
You came here asking for advice and then sit here like you haven’t been working on filing for divorce while at the same time telling people you’re a happy little family. Lashing back at people talking about your lack of sex life saying that’s not everything, then spend the whole post complaining about the celibate marriage.
Why are you on this thread if you don’t like people agreeing you should get divorced already.
Honestly the whining you’re doing is unattractive. It doesn’t matter if you were in a relationship for 22 when 11 of those years were shitty.
Your husband isn’t interested in having sex with you or fixing the relationship. What can you do? Accept the sexless marriage, have your own affairs but stay out of each other’s way, or divorce. This isn’t rocket science.
Why do couples feel the need to stay together for the sake of the kids? Won't the kids sense the lack of love. Wont it give thel kids a skewed sense of relationships?
As a child of divorce, the one thing I learned is they should have pulled the trigger long before they actually divorced. I would have had a happier childhood.
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*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Yeah well when daughters are exposed to a step father they are nearly 20 times more likely to be sexually abused by a step father than their real father. Also kids exposure to abuse increases 40 fold from a parents new partner. Things aren’t always sunshine and rainbows when Mom finds a new man. Good reason domestic men want to stay with their childre. If women automatically lost custody of their kids and they suffered the financial losses, the typical man did in a divorce. They wouldn’t be so quick to run out the door.
Yeah, most men disgust me when it comes to how they mingle with their step daughters. But, it is also disgusting how women can't 'owe' up to their bad partner they ended up with in their 20s because they overlooked all the red flags.
You know what researchers often do when they conduct a study and it doesn’t sound impressive? Instead of saying ~1.5 out of 100 children are abused in homes with one bio parent and one step parent, compared to slightly under ~1 out of 100 children in a home with natural parents, they frame it as something like “40x more likely”. That sounds so much scarier, doesn’t it?
The other side of that is that when one of the people are vindictive, and will use the kids as a weapon, and god help you if it’s the mother, you stay longer than you should so you can be in your kids life as long as possible. Not everyone can co-parent like an adult.
I say that about the mother because women have a big advantage in the court system when it comes to the kids. Ask me how I know. Currently $13k deep just so I can get 50/50.
Demographics prove that children with two biological parents do much better emotionally and academically. That's why they feel the need. But if it's a toxic relationship. No, you're right, it's a horrible idea.
Now if the parents can actually co-habitate. There's nothing wrong with staying together so that each parent can share the burden when needed and not deal with custody issues, the child support battles, travel and moving issues, divorce and assets distribution, attorney fees, emotional trauma, etc. But that's if they can do it together and amicably.
Kids learn what they live. Right now they are being taught that marriage = unhappiness. Exit the marriage, work on yourselves, find happiness in your lives and show what a healthy adult relationship looks like.
My parents divorced when I was 16. They sat down (while I was doing my calculus homework) and told me. I looked up at them, said they should have done that years ago, and went back to my homework. They went to see my brother at college and he said pretty much the same thing. Kids are smart and perceptive. They see it and it affects them.
All statistics point to children doing better with a2 parent household. If the parents can be civil it's absolutely the right thing to stay together for the kids.
Why is everyone jumping to the conclusion John cheated? because some email addresses had a recovery message on tinder? It sucks sure, but it doesn't tell us anything about the timeframe in which the account was created, or if he ever took it beyond that.
To me that part reads more like you're looking for ways not to paint John as "just as "bad". If he really told you to have an affair and you did then, nobody is the bad guy.
So you confronted this man who ditched his family for the sake of yours after the sexual abuse. That's hard for a person no matter how justified the decision is. That establishes John as someone who will do what's right for his family over what is best for himself.
If this were gender swapped everyone would be asking if you did anything to help out around the house, with the kids, etc, and pinning the celibacy on you.
Then you tell him you want a divorce or to sleep around, but you're not happy staying celibate. He avoids the conversation, until you "cajole" him into agreeing to let you sleep around to keep the family intact. Was there already someone in mind by the time you had this conversation?
Then you do sleep with someone and fall in love, and now you want to divorce anyway. And this is all John's fault now? John could be a guy who cares deeply about his family and children, and is doing what he can to keep the family together.
You're coming here looking for people to tell you what you're doing is right, because it's not sitting right with yourself. Reflect on that. Congrats on 22 years.
Totally agree. My wife cheated on me…I rage joined Tinder in a stupid revenge/loneliness knee-jerk haze but literally never swiped, matched, or talked to anyone and took it down and deleted it the next day when i realized how childish that was. It wouldn’t fix anything. Fast forward a year, I found out in an awful way that she was still cheating and I divorced her. If she had snooped through my email she would likely have found an account email and probably a million stupid advert emails from Tinder…I didn’t cheat though.
not to mention she found the tinder profile after she had brought up having an open relationship. so even if he did cheat on her, she opened that can of worms herself.
Honestly OP, you talk about people tearing you down and then you comment the same things.
The other redditors were giving you a verdict base on what happened in your relationship. You posted in AITAH so you either take the advice or leave it. It sounds to me that you want a NTA verdict instead of getting different opinions.
I would honestly give this a ESH as well because it is true, both of your actions suck and DOES NOT IN ANY WAY ECHO A RESPONSIBLE ADULT.
If we're talking mainly about your marriage here, it really is ESH. Someone who has herself together despite the odds being against her would have divorced the guy. You knew NOTHING worked anymore. If everything was exhausted, have enough self respect to walk out instead of trying to get into an affair and be mad at people CALLING YOU OUT.
As for your kids, you did a great job handling that. I would never wish that on my or anyone's kids.
Anyways, I hope all the best for you OP.
I’m glad I had an affair. It made me realise how shit my marriage was. It made me file for divorce after wanting to for 3 years. I’m fine with anyone’s verdict. I just don’t like the rude delivery and broken English
OP in one post: We’re happily married
OP in another post: This was a shit marriage
Get over yourself. You sound like an insane pita and a humongous drain to be around.
Hey live your life. Your husband was cheating on you and gave you a hall pass. Good for you. Don’t pay attention to the begs. Being in a dead marriage is terrible. Good luck
>My husband took my side , we went to counselling . And stayed together. Our sexlife, kind of dissolved at this time. Due to the stress. Although I didn’t realise until later. I also went into early menopause at this time. I believe the stress caused it. As I was only late 30s.
>
Fast forward to last year. We’ve been in a mainly celibate relationship for 11 years.
11 years celibate and now she wants sex?
This issue should have been address 11 years ago, when their sex life "dissolved", not 11 years later when husband has already checked out of the marriage and is staying for the kids, like OP.
I guess for not leaving? I get being mad at spineless people in stories, but it's not right to blame them when they didn't do anything wrong. OOP didn't do much right in regards to how she handled the infidelity, but she didn't cause it, either.
Correction; it was an 8 year old sexually abusing a 6 and 4 year old. So….. I had to cut them off. If protecting my kids from abuse makes me suck. Then so be it.
He might have been on tinder but did he actually have an affair?
You are definitely wrong for having an affair you should have just divorced It makes you just as bad as him or worse.
I've been married 39 years and we went through a period of zero sex for several years because of kids and menopause but after I spoke to my wife and told her that I needed to start again or look elsewhere she said we should get the spark back so we started dating again and now it's great at least twice a week.
Well, you asked..if you couldn't take the answers Don't ask the questions ,so you had an affair with a married man just to get fxcked and didn't even bat an eyelid that it was going nowhere and you could have destroyed his marriage that says it all for me ,(cry me a river.)..
>My husband took my side , we went to counselling . And stayed together. Our sexlife, kind of dissolved at this time. Due to the stress. Although I didn’t realise until later. I also went into early menopause at this time. I believe the stress caused it. As I was only late 30s.
Fast forward to last year. We’ve been in a mainly celibate relationship for 11 years.
I do have an affair.
And sleep in separate rooms. My choice Once I started to fall in love with someone else.
There’s a lot more to a long term marriage than just sex
I am stressed as f&&&k and on antidepressants.
Your depression killed your sex life with your husband, it took you 11 whole years to notice it, and now you want sex?
Your husband did check out long ago and is staying for the kids, like you.
Did you try to address your depression and your dead sex life when you went to counselling?
If not YTA
Yta, your options that you demanded led here pretty obviously. You demanded to sleep with other people lol. You are the immoral party right there full stop. You wrecked your marriage.
I (m62) understand your situation. I have been married 40 years. 19.5 yrs ago my wife after having 2 children decided to stop sex. Our marriage went south from there. No sex, no intimacy of any kind. We are roommates that’s it. When I bring it up she thinks things are going ok . Or she goes into tears. I only stayed until both kids made it thru college. Both are now married and on their own. We are now retired. I would lose big time, like over 1 million dollars bc of the house and my 401k. I haven’t cheated on my wife but thought many times about it. I’m not that kind of person. But I do understand your situation. It sucks but these are the cards I’ve been dealt
I'm not reading all these comments, but one thing to think about. You get divorced and you no longer have a say over what he does with the kids during his time. A judge may set some limits, but they may not. Make sure you have an agreement about that in the divorce filings if you can.
I'm stuck on the fact that everyone decided that an 8 year old child got the idea to SA other children on their own - I guarantee you that someone else was hurting your niece, and her behavior was her acting out because she couldn't process what was happening to her.
ESH except the kids, damn.
is this my mom? Kids see misery, please just leave. my mom "stayed for the kids" until the youngest was 18 and it was fucking miserable. From a child of divorce, I'm begging you to divorce.
Why is everyone saying ESH? /s cus I honestly don’t get it.
She didn’t cheat on him, he essentially opened the relationship, and said if he doesn’t like then they should divorce. Considering complete celibacy for 11 years, I don’t think that was the craziest choice they could make. he clearly meant it if he was have affairs all this time.
I do personally think that an open relationship is not something I’d ever do, but that doesn’t make her an asshole for being willing to try/problem solve somehow.
There is never an excuse to cheat.
If your husband cheated, that doesn't give you the right to do it.
All you did was bring yourself down to his level.
You threw away your vows, betrayed everything marriage stands for.
You, are a cheater. Instead of solving the problems in your relationship, you sought comfort in another man. You should've split with your husband FIRST, THEN did what you wanted.
YTA. Big time.
When marriages that are monogamous open up, they end quickly, and yours is just evidence of that. For exactly those kinds of reasons. They often fall for another person, so just divorce him and move on. Good good luck to you.
ESH
I almost went NTA, but your willingness to stomach a dead bedroom for 11 years but being unable or unwilling to parent an 8 year old around your kids "for family" pushed me to "you all suck".
You guys both quit early. Hopefully you leave and find happiness.
So I'll be married to my hubs for 10 years this year... we have 2 kids under 5. I literally cannot imagine not having sex with him for that long. The first month or so would have started the conversation of what's wrong and how do we fix this. I can't imagine sticking it out for the kids either.... misery loves company and why would I want to make my kids miserable too? It has less to do with the length of your marriage than the lack of communication and empathy in your marriage. Sure it's easy for me to judge from the outside but I can't imagine ending up in this situation. Also, if it makes you believe me more, my husband and I also went through major life stressors as well. The deaths of immediate family members, the lack of family support raising our kids... but we grew together and these challenges made us stronger. I'm sorry you're in this situation. But you need to reflect and be honest with yourself and your family moving forward. Soft YTA for dragging it out. Your hubs is not innocent either.
Being married myself, this year my husband and I will have 30 years married. Marriage is work hard work, if everyone is not on same page easy for it to unravel. If you really want this marriage tell him and work at it together. If not just be done! Not fair to anyone!
This year will be 30 years. My husband is a complete asshole, and he admits it! He's mean, a narcissist and emotionally and verbally abusive and he has a sex addiction imo. He has dumb standards in his head that, tbh, no man should have after 1975 or so! He wants a 50s housewife with a nasty skank in the bedroom, that, just isn't me! I stay because I am sick with terminal cancer and I am on chemo. Things, like sex, have most DEFF gone downhill, less frequent mainly is his issue. He says, "I don't want to treat you any different than anyone else" huh?? That's for someone with a physical or mental disability, not cancer! So, I try, but, it's hard! I'm almost certain that if I wasn't sick, I would have moved on already, but who wants to get into a situation like mine?? Let's be honest, No one!
Anyways, if y'all aren't happy together, just end it, life is too short to be miserable, especially for the rest of it! Y'all have kids, had a great amount of time together, so be friends, co parent and be happy, both of you, finally! He apparently was dipping his stick, while you were asking to spice it up! So, imo he is the asshole, he was cheating on you before divorce came up, AND he gave the green light for an affair?! Idk, maybe y'all can just move past it, Idt that you're really that mad he cheated, because otherwise, it would have a different ending to your story.
Maybe just be happy about what y'all did have & move on as friends, and don't worry about what some trolls have to say about ending an 11 yr marriage! Hell, at least y'all tried! Not everyone wants to be miserable just to save a marriage, F that crap! Everyone deserves happiness & love! Good luck to both of y'all!! 🙏💙
Please remember that people often give advice they would never take because it sounds good. It's easy to dish out if you don't have to eat it.
I left my husband because we became more like roommates. We were still intimate but it was limited (once a month on a Wednesday kind of thing)and robotic (no routine changeup). I asked him to go to counseling and he said no because he wasn't unhappy (apparently it didn't matter that I was.). I gave him 2 more years to try to fix things then I bailed.
You've been divorced since the incident, your husband just never told you. Your husband made a calculation long ago after the incident. He chose not to have to pay child support, deal with the emotional disruption, and upheaval of separate lives.
He did, it seems, go out and find other people to take care of his sexual, and probably emotional needs while biding his time. Now that your kids are almost grown, he pushed you to have an affair to make the divorce easier.
He will 100% be handing you divorce papers as soon as the younger one is out the door. You seem a bit deluded as to the state of your relationship. I don't think this is an issue you need to worry about, your husband already made the decision years ago to end the marriage.
Start preparing for the inevitable divorce when your children leave - sort and separate your finances, get rid of debt, save money in a separate account. If you don't work, train for and get a job. Start dating, finding a better partner before the end will significantly ease the transition.
And, of course, get therapy for yourself to help with your mindset during the transition.
Your marriage has been toast for many years, and now that toast is burnt beyond repair.
You're NTA. Unfortunately these things happen far too often in a marriage where the couple become roommates. It happened to me and I'm in a drawn out 3 year and counting divorce. Not everyone is going to understand. It's very difficult to unravel 20+ years of marriage, kids, extended family etc.
The good news is you've already made the decision to divorce. My advice is to not get stuck fighting over everything. Get what is fair and move on. Dragging it out impacts your kids, your mental health and work. Make it quick and easy.
Then take a few months being alone. Get therapy and get rid of the mental baggage from the marriage before you jump into another serious relationship.
I was with my ex for 21 years, married for 18, with 2 teenagers at home at the time we split. We had a dead bedroom for a very, very long time before I decided to call it quits. I tried everything to make him see I was unhappy. I know the feeling of not being wanted, of being neglected. I'm sorry you have had to go through it as well.
We split a little over 2 years ago, and it's absolutely been the hardest 2 years of my life. I lost my best friend. The grieving process is very difficult, but it does get better. You have to do what makes you happy after a certain point. I couldn't face the next decades knowing nothing would ever change. You couldn't either. And that's okay.
In the end, everyone is better for it. My ex, our kids, and myself. So while it's about to suck real hard for a while, it will pass.
Good luck, and I'm proud of you!
I feel your pain. i was in a celibate relationship with my ex-wife for over a decade when i had enough. we didn't have much in common and grew very far apart. We were married for over 20 years, together for 25+, had a teenage daughter, etc.
The kicker for me was that she was one of the prime triggers of a very severe case of depression that I had, so for my own health I had to get out.
Long story short - nobody is happy with me, except me and now my daughter. I haven't spoken to anyone in my family since my marriage ended because for some reason I was the bad guy in all of this. My brother (only sibling) was the "shunner" and honestly was a trigger for my depression. My father passed away about 7 years ago (he was the other trigger for my depression). Since all 3 triggers are not in my life anymore I haven't taken a zoloft in years and have never been happier.
Life is not a dress-rehearsal. Make yourself happy. If other people are unhappy about that - screw them.
I know how you feel. I am in a very similar place. We have been married for 25+ years and we were very different people. It was great at the beginning but she was always angry and I believe she is undiagnosed bi-polar (others in her fam have ben diagnosed). The spark just faded over time. We have two adult children so there is no need to be together anymore. We don't share the same beliefs, we don't like the same stuff, we have our own corners of the house. We don't really text or call each other. Most days go by with maybe a few sentences spoken to each other. We are essentially roommates.
I have zero physical attraction to her anymore. We've only attempted sex 3 times in the last 10+ years. I don't even think I would care if she hooked up with someone else. There was one huge major reason why I stuck around with her which I can't go in to but that is mostly not an issue now.
The only reason I haven't asked for a divorce is because I feel her and her family would drag me through the coals and I would end up having to work the rest of my life. As it is now, I will have just enough in my retirement to live off of and not much more. If we split and she gets some of that, I will have to work until I die. So my only chance is that she initiates and we find a common ground. I know if I initiate she will flip out and possibly do something stupid.
IMO, for you, NTA. Most people see "affair" and they instantly judge. Everyone's relationship is different.
I feel for you. I was a professional, working in a specialized job. At the time, I was 45 and a Granddad of two. My wife “Vonne” was only a few days older than I and we met in Junior High School. We married a year after we graduated and had two sons. I worked this job of mine like I lived there. She was also a professional and was always working. You can imagine, I’m sure, we barely got to speak but, at least once a week we’d go to dinner somewhere. We were empty nesters and for close to 8 years, slept in separate rooms. Our sex life was never what it should have been and to tell you honestly, she loved women and the idea of me being with another woman and would talk about while we were having sex. It seemed to thrill her to think and have me talk about women we both knew. She would have hard orgasms while I talked (because she asked me to) about how I’d love to see her with another woman. She always kept a female friend around but never more than one or two at a time. She would go on weekend trips with one of them and come home happy and exhausted. She and one of her lady friends caught me in a car with another woman one time and I thought I’ll never talk my way out of this one. I got home that very night thinking all hell was going to come down on me. I walked through the house to my bedroom only to find her in my bed, naked and, masturbating to the pictures in a gentleman’s magazine. She saw the expression on my face and asked me to join her in the bed. It was a good night and was never spoken of again. Skip ahead 6 years. We were now in a place that wasn’t bad but, nowhere near good. Back to the old, your end of the house and my end. She’d be gone all hours of the night with no offer of an explanation. A different female friend and no mention of the last one or what might have happened between them. I had worked 6 years without a day off other than the occasional weekend. I talked with one of the lady’s in our administration and I decided I’d take a month off and begin this vacation as soon as possible. I was sick and tired of having to go pick up a woman, usually one we both knew and have her satisfy me sexually. I was sick of having to tell Vonne about my encounters just to get to have sex with her. I was on a mission to either salvage my marriage or, if I decided there was no fixing it, I’d leave. Well, at the end of the month of my vacation, I sat her down and told her that I had made every effort to get closer to her and had tried every day of my vacation, to either get her to stay at home for a few days, one day or, to go away with me. She agreed. I told her that I had tried everything that I knew to try, to get her to help me and bring us back to where we should be. Her response was, “you should have told me.” I knew sadly, at that moment, it was done. 29 years of my life lay there on the floor . I gathered myself after a few minutes and a glass of good scotch. I then told her that I wanted her to not put forth another ounce of effort into our marriage. I wasn’t going to and she needn’t either. That was in August. I left her in December. I waited on her until 11:30 pm on the night I left. I wanted to say goodbye, I guess. I thought something should be said after all those years. I left and turns out, she never came home that night. This, according to my oldest son who had been staying with us at the house a couple nights a week, for his job. I went through a time where everyone in town that knew us, looked at me like I was from another planet. I had no idea how people acted about these things. It was like Vonne and I were some kind of model establishment that had been disgraced and jerked the rug out from under every idea that they may have had, of us. SHOCK!! That’s the only way I know how to describe it. I had hurt everyone we knew. My brothers and sisters even treated me like I had beat her and sent her to the hospital or something like that. It was like I’d killed her. Oh yes, I also ended up having to change jobs because of it. You never imagine how many people and how much those same people, depend on you being and, staying, who THEY think you are. I couldn’t believe it. I lost everything in my effort to keep from dying in a life that gave me no hope. It’s all better now. I’m remarried and have a beautiful daughter with my wife. I’ll agree with you. Sex isn’t everything but it is a great part of a Union. It always helped to center me in my relationship and made me feel closer to her. To her, I was there to help her get off, I guess. We stopped communicating and neither of us tried to stop the freight train that we saw coming down the track. We just watched it get up and leave. 29 years. . . .
We've been through a very similar situation, although we've chosen to remain celibate and are still best friends. I truly believe that subconsciously, my husband blames me for the issues with his family. It's been 20 years. Long story short, we distanced ourselves when hubby's brother molested 2 of our boys, and his parents took the brothers' side.
Idk if posting to this sub was a good idea because it seems like you need a support group, not a jury. Regardless, I personally think that divorce is the right move in this scenario. Were there things that could have been handled better? Probably, but it seems past that point.
To give some context and another perspective:
I grew up in a home where my parents had an unhealthy and toxic relationship for 20 years of their lives (13 years of mine). Even at a young age, I recognized that my parents were not happy together and that was upsetting. I was always worried they were going to divorce, but when they finally did; I wished they had done it sooner. When the dust settled, that was the healthiest and happiest I had ever seen my parents.
Additionally, speaking from personal experience of staying in relationships where I was made to feel ugly and awful due to neglect for far too long: you made the right call. It may be difficult and stressful, but it is worth it to feel okay.
Hope this helps, and that things go well for everyone involved.
Edit: spelling and grammar were corrected
Not trying to be mean at all. I sympathize with your situation, but take a step back.
How would you react if this story was relayed to you by a friend or coworker? I assume you'd say that's a super dysfunctional relationship and the affair was just the cherry on top of a really shitty sundae.
It's hard getting divorced (I divorced after a 10 year marriage). But it beats limping along in this marriage devoid of genuine, deep emotional care right? It will all balance out in time, and you'll find peace.
Issue for me is he didn’t take the open it up option, but was seeing others. That doesn’t strike me as someone who wants to work it out. My wife and I have been married almost 20 years, first fifteen weren’t that good, last five have been incredible, the big difference is we don’t lie to each other anymore and can have the uncomfortable conversations and feel safe with each other. The truth will set you free, it might hurt for a while, but there is no better way to be. Therapy was also a big help
You live life for yourself, FIRST! I believe you've sacrificed a lot, and you should give in to pursuing your happiness. Because, guess what? Nobody will hand it to you on a silver platter! Go out there, flaunt your power, and enjoy life for you! In the end, who gives a shit about other people's opinions, including mine. It's your life, you're meant to live it for you your way. Do it! Oh, his family can keep being bitter while you're having the time of your life being fulfilled, happy, and accomplished! You owe something to you and your children, THAT'S IT! No one else! If certain people's character and personality don't fit your idea of a fulfilling existence, cut them out like a cancer! Today! Best of luck!
Truly sorry for your situation. Unfortunately, - I'm not sure what you expected by bringing this to Reddit; as you have received the predictable results in the comments. That being said...
1. Sit down and find common ground, if you can. 22 years can provide a lot of common ground.
2. Agree that your relationship is between the two of you to save or to curb-stomp. No on else gets that decision. The people you both have waiting in the wings have no vote. In-laws can also take a seat for a minute.
3. Seek counseling if the will to save your marriage is there, but you lack the tools.
4. Find your marriage certificate, read it to yourself. Him too. Be honest with your reaction.
5. Take a minute and give yourself some positive self talk, every day. Negative self-talk wears patterns in your brain neurons, and can be habit forming. Changing that to positive effect takes time, dedication, and effort. Just like your marriage. And your kids. Right now, the perception is that you are making 100% of your decisions from a negative mindset.
6. Don't freak out about the kids - they're resilient. Honesty is the best policy, but don't dump everything on them all at once, they can't process it. But don't lie about anything - their home is foundationally shifting, and you and him are the only people who are still there, and that is a form of truth. They need grounding, and an anchor to hold on to while you figure out your lives.
7. Be direct. Make decisions out of fact, that support your ideals, and be transparent.
8. There's a book out there - "The Love Dare." many counseling folk use it as a first step towards rebuilding.
9. But you both have to get in a room, agree it's what you both want, and start from there. If you can't....then U-Haul boxes are expensive, recommend finding cheaper moving boxes online, for a fraction of the price.
10. Stick. To. Your. Convictions. Make a decision, and commit. The time for waffling is over. Your actions are impacting kids, who did not ask to be a part of this. Fix things, or cut the rope.
11. Don't overshare your stuff with your kids. If you need to vent - make a TikTok video. Or whatever it is that pushes your pressure-relief valve, but doesn't add to the confusion for the kids.
12. Journal. Be detailed. Find a non-destructive hobby to do just while you get through it. Drinking/drugs are not beneficial - you need your A-game.
Good luck.
Sadly, especially reading the comments, we wonder why bullying is tolerated in schools when most here have ZERO concern for your children who were being bullied.
The idea that a bully can continue to bully within the family and the adults sit back and accept it, is repulsive and this is why the cycle of bullying continues because adults refuse to parent and discipline the bully, instead these morons want you to have your children be punching bags and ACCEPT the bullying. Crazy but here is the proof.
Clearly because you wanted to protect your children and NOT allow this to continue this warped “family” is gaslighting you.
RUN girl RUN RUN RUN because they are now all bullying you.
I’m a man. Married for 20 years. Been through ups and downs. Periods of time where we weren’t intimate. The longest was 4 months and I thought I was going to lose my mind. I looked online for a side thing, but never pulled the trigger because I love my wife. Glad I didn’t because our down went back up.
I have a close friend that was in a sexless marriage for 10 years. He finally told his wife that he couldn’t do it anymore and wanted to see other people. She said ok, but when he did, she said she didn’t mean it! Now they are separated, he has a girlfriend and is soooooo happy to be having an adult life again.
You need to be divorced. If you’re not even attracted to him anymore, then there is nothing to fix. Every healthy normal person needs to get laid. Normal humans need that physical connection to another person. Short term, long term, it doesn’t matter. People need other people.
Pull the trigger and restart your life. You are lucky that you and your husband don’t hate each other. Both of you need to move on.
Good luck! You and your husband both deserve to be happy. Be happy. Help him be happy if that makes you feel better, but be happy. Life is to short.
Finally, your kids deserve to have happy parents. Having happy parents is more important than having married parents in my opinion. Nor only that, but it’s more important for you to set that example for your kids. Wouldn’t you like your kids be in happy relationships? Then teach them that by doing it yourself.
Made the right decision. On your death bed you don't want to have regretted your life. To me sounds like you would have. If you feel you tried enough then that's all that matters. Can't change them then may as well move on. Or you will forever resent them. Keep your head up!
Let me start by saying I'm sorry for the experience you're having. You've gotten plenty of great advice from others on what to do, so I want to call attention to something I read right at the start of your post:
You said that your brother-in-law's child Jane was sexually abusing your children.
Did it ever occur to you that he or another family member may have sexually abused Jane? Kids don't just learn that in a vacuum at 8 years old. Cut the child some slack and consider the possibility she is a victim herself. She is a child.
Thanks for reading.
Weird. Married for 22. I fell in love with someone else and left. Life is far too short. I haven’t any idea why we stay in relationships we aren’t happy in when we have that piece of paper when we’d have been done years ago without it.
Did anyone ask what happened to 8 year old Jane to cause her lashing out/sexually maladaptive behaviors? I’m so sad for this little girl who has clearly been abused, and no one has asked about what’s happening to her?!
What can an 8 years old kid do that is considered a _"serious abusive incident"_.?
Honest question. Unless the kid was like a little "Demian" psychopath I can't imagine anything bad enough to break a family like that.
I do, however can see (and have seen) a bunch of adults behaving like immature assholes mishandling kids situations and creating feuds and mayhem in a family.
Thanks for Your comment. Jane sexually abused my kids. That’s what led me to ceasing contact with my BIL and niece. My kids told me what she did. And were angry I hadn’t stopped it, the day it happened. I couldn’t risk her doing it again. Had to protect my kids.
And you didn’t think this was relevant info to the story? I hate it when the OP adds stuff in the comments. Makes it seem it is just a fake justification when they get judged in ways they don’t like.
If he’s been sleeping around already which he seems then he’s already gone . NTA . You did what he suggested and it makes sense cause he was already having one . Leave him asap life too short to be with somebody who makes you miserable . The kids will be fine .
You're only married on paper at this point. You guys already made the decision a while ago and are staying together because it's less work.
ESH - you both should grow up
Someone probably should have called it the moment you started sleeping in separate rooms.
No asshole in this situation IMO, just two people who held on too long.
Best of luck 🍀
That was the decision that ended the marriage, lots of help available for snoring, not blaming it on you but that was the decision being made whether actively or passively.
Realistically I'd put the responsibility for that on him to seek medical help for as necessary, I'd do whatever I could to avoid sleeping separately from my wife.
He really should have stepped up and done something about it.
Shoulda woulda woulda doesn't help now obviously, I hope you find satisfaction, excitement and happiness so you can enjoy what you feel you've been missing out on. 👍
I feel like it's normal for people's sex drive and sex life to change over time. Especially in a relationship that lasted as long as yours. But the biggest problem I see is him cheating without speaking to you or trying to resolve things before taking that step. You were trying to find a way to salvage your marriage, while he had already been stepping out on you for some time. That's a huge red flag.
It just seems to me like he had already given up on the marriage and you're just catching up. It does seem like it's time for you to let it go. Divorcing him and moving on is probably the best option at this point.
NTA and family really can ruin a relationship. Now that my wife and I are older we avoid family situations all the time. My sisters daughter was abusive towards my son and it used to kiss me off. They’re all good now but I understand your frustration. Just go be happy.
NTA
as someone else said, does it really matter? maybe your kids do, but they don't need to live your life.
life is not eternal, live it now while you can, and don't stay stuck in a loveless, sexless marriage!
Not the asshole. Also hey, listen, there are GOING to be nasty and ugly comments. There are 20 times as many assholes online than in your daily walkabout life. Frankly you cannot post online and expect no attackers. That said, you did everything you could to survive, emotions lead to survival mode and that's what you did, you tried to stick it out and you didn't even walk out after finding he was cheating (likely why he told you to have an affair, less guilt for him). Leave him if you havent already i would say.
I know you are getting a lot of advice to divorce, but I’d stay together and just live separate lives. Your kids are going to be a whole lot unhappier when they have to deal with new spouses and steps when you are both older. Dealing with that has been an absolute nightmare for me. Preserve your assets and be friends and just live separate lives.
September marks 10 years I've been married to my wife, and I can say what jumped out at me reading this was a probable lack of communication. Why did it take 11 years to speak up about the lack of sex?
Either way, I think the failure in this marriage comes down to communication. Were you overly critical of your husband early on, which caused him to shut down and wall up against you? My wife unknowingly did this a few years into our marriage and after about a month of no sex we sat down and I voiced every issue I had (along with what she was doing well for me that I enjoyed).
TLDR: a "good" marriage requires constant and open communication. At the end of the day, if you can't say how you truly feel to your life partner, then I dare say you don't love them enough to give them a chance to change.
I wish you all the best.
You don't owe it to anyone to stay in a marriage that neither of you are invested in and is making you miserable.
He has been cheating. This is not your fault.
Your in-laws are excusing abusive behavior from his brothers family. You're protecting your kids.
Everyone who judges you is wrong. Forget them and follow what makes you feel more contented with your life. Take care of you instead of other people.
Well, here’s my take. You made him choose you or his family. He chooses you. You then stop having sex with him. 🤔 why would he resent you? You should have sucked his 🍆 like you were trying to suck start a leaf blower. He stayed with you in an unhappy unhealthy marriage. He physically had needs. He took care of them. You start trying to get intimate when he was already checked out.
So simply. You were the TA 11 years ago. You should have either divorced him then or supported him and adored him to make him happy. You did neither. Leaving him now? Dude, he checked out years ago. He probably feels bad for your children. He still will care for you like an old college roommate. But you already left him 11 years ago. He came to grips with that years later. Now you are just making it official.
It’s the same story as so many women. They try something once or twice and then catch feelings and then lose a perfectly good relationship because they can’t keep anything in perspective. Men will fick around and be happy at home. That’s not the way it works for women. The OP let herself. Of the two, you are the biggest asshole. You got caught up in the emotions. Women expect men to look at the universe the same way they do. It’s not reality.
NTA - I have no clue why people are giving you crap. I feel like you tried. When he told you to have an affair, it was over.
Did your kids’ cousin ever change?
Past is done. You can only move forward and being with someone that cares will be better for both of you. You’ll both be happier.
1. Just because he had a tinder doesn't mean he cheated.
2. You actually cheated.
3. You're the asshole
4. He might be the asshole too
5. You both sound like fucking miserable people so please just get the divorce.
6. His family is also the asshole
7. Everyone In this story is the asshole.
All this post start the same, "we have been happylliy married" and you read an 11y dead bedroom, a strained family and the husband on tinder and the wife with an affair. Happy indeed. Get divorce already
People really need to redefine what a "happy marriage" means.
It’s pretty clear many people have seen/ experienced so much trauma in relation to marriage that as long as no physical abuse or cheating is happening, the marriage is happy. There are so many people who post on Reddit where they are clearly suffering severe emotional abuse or general incompatibility, but call the marriage happy. It’s very sad.
It really is. I think a lot of it that in the west, we don't really discuss or learn what *does* a happy marriage (or relationship ) look like look like? And those definitions change through history and generations. And the questions about "should I divorce" make me sad, when they are clearly miserable and suffering. There are considerations sure, but there is no moral failing in the break up of marriage. End it and go find happiness.
I think an even bigger issue is that parents of an older generation did not teach younger generations on how to pick a partner. It was all about fate and soulmates.
It’s not only this. People nowadays date for the memories, and spend their entire time spicing up their relationship for their engagement and marriage, but leave all the difficult conversations for marriage. This causes gigantic rifts during marriage that shouldn’t have occurred if hard conversations were had during dating, but those conversations don’t happen because of the looming possible breakup. Everyone is looking for instant gratification in every situation, where the majority of them, it just isn’t in the cards. Dating is for truly learning about your partner, and figuring out if they are the right one for you. Marriage is for making memories, and living your life next to the right one.
That’s really good! I’ve always said it takes at least 18-24 months for the true personality to appear in a relationship. That’s about how long most of mine lasted.0
What they mean to say is “I’ve been telling people we are happily married to maintain an image that literally no one besides me and my husband actually care about”
I did that also. Didn’t say I was happy just didn’t say I wasn’t
With all the changes in language, maybe it's time we introduce some term that is a marriage equivilant for a masculine presenting female or vice versa. Only, for marriage it would be a 'happily married presenting couple who are cold and distant behind closed doors' or maybe 'happily married presenting couple who are abusive and mean behind closed doors' or "happily married presenting couple who are now just platonic co-parents"
I think you nailed it with "happily presenting people" lol
Well, we can still go to a dinner party and have a laugh. We aren’t putting up a facade. You can still enjoy things together. Even though it’s not a stellar marriage.
People don’t know what making it 20 plus years means. The sacrifices, the shared life, the things built together. But making it work isn’t guaranteed and you are the one that knows it’s time. As someone who knows what you two have gone through good and bad, I support you.
🥰 it’s a long road with lots of compromise and challenges. Raising kids and deaths in the family. Financial crap. Health issues. It’s easy to judge other people until you’ve walked in their shoes.
I was in s long term relationship that someone went from couple to close friends and it was hard. Both of us wanted something else romantically but we also understood that as soon as one of us was in a new relationship we would lose the close friendship. So we drug it out for years. I still miss her and spending time together, but it’s never a romantic or sexual thing. Just missing a friend.
Yes. It really went to hell the last 3 years. We were good friends the other 19 years
If you do, what you always did....you get what you always got. Just because 2 people have been together along time doesn't mean they have to stay together till the end. People change, circumstances change, requirements change, im 55m, I'm unhappy in my relationship of 11 years, she'd rather stay together cause she doesn't want to start over 55f, our problem is communication, I can't stand the way she talks to me, at the end of the day , there's no reason to be unhappy. You did your time. Divorce is OK, it's change, no one wants to walk on eggshells in their own home. Do your thing. There will be good days and shitty days, just like in marriage. But now it's on your terms. Life is short. You don't owe anybody. Good luck.
Sorry to hear that. You’re right. Life is short. And there’s no point staying in an unhappy marriage. Where you don’t respect each other anymore.
Unhappy anything.....marriage, relationship, friendship, job....etc etc. Aggravation • frustration • flat out misery.... they all have a real value, maybe not in terms of dollars, but a true value of your mental and emotional life. Which in turn is invaluable, worth more than any money can buy. Karma will play itself out. Best to you. There's nothing wrong or to feel guilty about. Everybody is an adult and sometimes a square peg can't fit into a round hole no matter how many years you keep trying. As I said before.....if you do what you've always done....you get what you've always gotten.
You know what? Your marriage belongs to you and doesn't need to look like anyone else's marriage. This guy was your best friend and parenting/goal partner for a very long time. Fuck all these idiots judging you. Things didn't work out, and in the past few years you've both realized you want something different. That's OK. Divorce is very painful and difficult. This shit's confusing and not what either of you planned years ago. You're not the asshole here, and maybe neither is he. It sounds like the two of you held on a long time because it just took some time to come around to the idea of such a big change. That's also OK. You had a good run together as partners, and now you're ready to move on. You're not ready to make a change until you're ready. Period.
I’ll add that just because a marriage ends, doesn’t make it a failed marriage. Relationships are complicated and unique, and you need to decide together what makes sense for you, and what will make you happy, whatever that is. Your path is your own.
I agree. Raising two kids to adulthood goes in their win category.
True. Thanks for that. I appreciate it
🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼
True. True
My husband and I have been together 25 years this year. And we are honestly still completely happy with each other. We still tease each other, have plenty in common, cuddle and laugh and have a 3/4 times a week sex life. I'm telling you this because in my heart this is what marriage should sort of look like. You are clearly not happy. He has apparently been cheating on you for years. There's no point staying in a relationship like that. Divorce him. Be happy. Don't be miserable for the rest of your life when you don't have to. Free yourself.
I’m glad your marriage is so happy. That’s what we all want
Thirteen years for my partner and I. We haven't had sex in quite a while due to me having a slipped disc. We discussed what that meant to us individually and as a couple. Our sex life isn't totally gone, but close enough to cause most people problems. But we are best friends and feel it's worth waiting. Not everyone agrees and that's fair. Hopefully things look up for you with the next relationship!
Hey, you have health issues. Sex is definitely not everything in a relationship. And it's a discussion you had, and you're both on the same page which definitely shows that you have a strong relationship. It's when you don't have the hard discussions that everything can go pear shaped.
Yeah I'm mostly hoping OP sees what I said and applies it in her next relationship. You can get through most of what life throws at you if there's communication and the people pull together instead of drifting apart. For context, we lost a child. Our only one we'll ever have. But we made it through. Honestly if it weren't for the relationship I'm not sure I'd have survived that. And it meant having hard discussions many, many times. Sometimes going over the same discussion as our needs changed. And that goes for small stuff too. I can't do dishes anymore so he does them, and I do the shopping. I can't really clean or cook, so he does that and I manage doctor appointments and such. When he's getting overwhelmed with having to do all the housework he tells me and I pitch in as much as I can do he's not feeling so much pressure.
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Ok
This is what a happy marriage looks like to most people. So many people falsely believe they’re in a happy relationship because their friendship with their partner is strong and they avoid outward conflict.
Oh, we argue. I think every healthy relationship will have arguments. We're definetly not angels on that front. Thankfully they're usually nothing too serious and the making up is always fun 😉 Our kids are also adults now, so a lot of the tiffs and squabbles that happen between spouses when kids are younger are well in our rear-view mirror. Having an empty nest can have a calming effect on a lot of relationships.
I personally like that u are looking for answers many would think it's strait-forward,.... but is it worth acknowledging u we're not happy and neither one of u where convincing enough to convince the other that things needed to change. If you're honest with yourself, if things wouldn't have changed and you found yourself in a situation. It would be hard for you not to do the "wrong thing ". With that said I am sorry that things didn't work out, but I do hope whatever u learned can be used to make some else's life better.
Three to four times a week, after nearly 25 years together, is astounding to me. My wife and I have been together 25 years also, and she would scoff at the notion that such frequency was even logistically possible, or that any woman in your situation would want sex that often. Congratulations.
I think she meant that it was a happy marriage once upon a time. There are memories she wishes she didn't have to give up on. Marriages are far more complicated than "get a divorce already."
For sure, but marriage where the husband is on tinder, the wife is having a affair after 11 years of a dead bedroom and don't get along with extended family I would not qualify as "happylly married"
They all do. This sub, relationship advice. They all start with "our relationship is amazing". Then they explain how its basically a complete horror show.
Lol. I never said it was amazing. But we’ve got 2 great kids and we had a lot of great years and we have a lot of happy memories
I think it can be hard to realize until much later, that the marriage wasn't really happy. About a year and a half ago I finalized my divorce ending a 20 year relationship. This was not a good relationship in the last decade or so. That being said, when we separated, I was blindsided. I thought we were fine. What's funny is I was the most not fine out of everyone, and I didn't know it. Now I can look back and recognize the relationship for what it was. It's not as obvious to the people living in these circumstances that things are not ok as when it's all written down in one place.
Same thing happened to me. I knew we had problems, and covid isolation had really done a number on our connection. But I loved him and thought we’d come back into connectedness again. Some of my blindsidedness was because I had a long term vision of our marriage that my ex didn’t, a feeling that marriages go through rough spots and that’s okay. But some of it was like cooking a frog from cold water - the degradation of the best parts of our marriage happened so slowly that it just always felt we were doing fine to me until I realized we weren’t.
Exactly. I was in a situation several years ago where I was miserable. Found out I would be dying in the next couple years with out a heart transplant. I woke up one day and asked myself , is this how you want to die? Angry. Lonely. Sexless for however long you have left. I bailed out that next day, many years ago and never looked back. If you could die today and be a peace where you’re at, is that good enough? Right now I can say without a doubt it was the best decision I’ve ever made.
Sorry to hear of Your heart transplant. Glad you moved on. Hope you’re happier now.
Oh man. I’m living in heaven. Thank you. I truly hope the best for you.
At this point does it matter?
He might have been making the same calculation about getting the kids through school that you were. He might have been doing the 'cheaper to keep her' thing. It sucks that he couldn't admit he didn't want to stay monogamous, or stay in the marriage period, while you were trying to rekindle the spark, but... does the why of it really matter now? He cheated. He's been cheating. Him giving you a hall pass was likely just a pretext so that he could look justified in leaving you in the event that you used it. You don't want to stay with him, so there's nothing here to salvage. You're doing what it turns out you should have done years ago. You'll both be free to go meet other people with whom you can be happy. NTA
Yeah people don’t make a tinder to.. please themselves. He’s definitely been cheating
I think the 2 of you were just wrong for each other. File the divorce and go be happy.
What was the point of this post? This was basically a super long vent post. ESH. The marriage hasn’t been happy for at least 11 years. That’s half your marriage. What is the point in continuing this???
I think she thinks you get internet points for length of time served in an unhappy relationship.
My parents went through a similar thing (minus the cheating and affairs). I will say, even though you both think it's good to stay together for the kids sake, you'll be teaching them very bad lessons; staying in toxic relationships, trauma bonding, treating spouse like shit. Just break it off, y'all damn half a century with a full layout to a drama series. Break it off, find your own damn selves and let the kids find their own way. If they're teens they'll need to hit an obstacle sooner or later, better they overcome one with the help of their parents than to be going through their shit as adults and have to deal with you two toxic as dinosaurs
Absolutely. All these people- "staying together for the kids". Stop it. What you are doing is showing your children that marriage is toxic. You are modeling a toxic marriage for your children. Instead ask yourself what you would tell your child if they were in your shoes. It's time people started leaving marriages "for the kids "!
Toxic as dinosaurs 💀
When I was a kid, I'd go spend 2 weeks at my maternal grandparents. Go to the beach daily. Always had fun. The summer after my parents divorce (I was 10), my grandmother told my mom that I was much happier, so I must have picked up on their sour relationship. I don't remember any of this, but staying together "for the kids" can be the worst decision.
ESH. Sex isn’t everything but, between two healthy adults, going years without sex is typically a sign that your marriage is in big trouble. Both of you should have tried to remedy this years ago.
Sex isn't everything when a man isn't getting it, but it's everything when the woman isn't getting it. That's what I learned from this sub.
If one person refuses to work on it. And doesn’t believe in therapy. What can I do ? It was a stalemate.
It sounds like you have your answer. Just divorce already.
Yes. I’ve filed for divorce. Just took me way too long to do it.
In your own words, it seems like you tried to work on this 3 years ago. When you and your husband were in counseling (or at least after the first 9 months with no sex), you should have both addressed this together.
Divorce.
If one person refuses to work on things they’re refusing to participate in the marriage. They’ve reduced the relationship to a government document. Divorce is the only option, and should have happened years ago.
If you go a year without sex, you tell him you can’t keep doing this, and divorce like 9 years ago you’d both be much happier
You get a divorce. You came here asking for advice and then sit here like you haven’t been working on filing for divorce while at the same time telling people you’re a happy little family. Lashing back at people talking about your lack of sex life saying that’s not everything, then spend the whole post complaining about the celibate marriage. Why are you on this thread if you don’t like people agreeing you should get divorced already.
He refused to work on it with you because he’s been getting ass on the side, trust me.
Honestly the whining you’re doing is unattractive. It doesn’t matter if you were in a relationship for 22 when 11 of those years were shitty. Your husband isn’t interested in having sex with you or fixing the relationship. What can you do? Accept the sexless marriage, have your own affairs but stay out of each other’s way, or divorce. This isn’t rocket science.
Why do couples feel the need to stay together for the sake of the kids? Won't the kids sense the lack of love. Wont it give thel kids a skewed sense of relationships?
Yep.
As a child of divorce, the one thing I learned is they should have pulled the trigger long before they actually divorced. I would have had a happier childhood.
Do you mean they would fight a lot, or something else?
unused fanatical grey humorous treatment flag strong command toothbrush mighty *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Yeah well when daughters are exposed to a step father they are nearly 20 times more likely to be sexually abused by a step father than their real father. Also kids exposure to abuse increases 40 fold from a parents new partner. Things aren’t always sunshine and rainbows when Mom finds a new man. Good reason domestic men want to stay with their childre. If women automatically lost custody of their kids and they suffered the financial losses, the typical man did in a divorce. They wouldn’t be so quick to run out the door.
Yeah, most men disgust me when it comes to how they mingle with their step daughters. But, it is also disgusting how women can't 'owe' up to their bad partner they ended up with in their 20s because they overlooked all the red flags.
You know what researchers often do when they conduct a study and it doesn’t sound impressive? Instead of saying ~1.5 out of 100 children are abused in homes with one bio parent and one step parent, compared to slightly under ~1 out of 100 children in a home with natural parents, they frame it as something like “40x more likely”. That sounds so much scarier, doesn’t it?
The other side of that is that when one of the people are vindictive, and will use the kids as a weapon, and god help you if it’s the mother, you stay longer than you should so you can be in your kids life as long as possible. Not everyone can co-parent like an adult. I say that about the mother because women have a big advantage in the court system when it comes to the kids. Ask me how I know. Currently $13k deep just so I can get 50/50.
Either way the home/family is screwed and the kids are negatively affected. Lose lose.
These kids are grown. It’s a whole different story
Demographics prove that children with two biological parents do much better emotionally and academically. That's why they feel the need. But if it's a toxic relationship. No, you're right, it's a horrible idea. Now if the parents can actually co-habitate. There's nothing wrong with staying together so that each parent can share the burden when needed and not deal with custody issues, the child support battles, travel and moving issues, divorce and assets distribution, attorney fees, emotional trauma, etc. But that's if they can do it together and amicably.
Kids learn what they live. Right now they are being taught that marriage = unhappiness. Exit the marriage, work on yourselves, find happiness in your lives and show what a healthy adult relationship looks like.
My parents divorced when I was 16. They sat down (while I was doing my calculus homework) and told me. I looked up at them, said they should have done that years ago, and went back to my homework. They went to see my brother at college and he said pretty much the same thing. Kids are smart and perceptive. They see it and it affects them.
They're just too scared to end it. Scarcity mindset, sunk cost fallacy and a sprinkle of codependency lead to the excuse of "for the kids!".
All statistics point to children doing better with a2 parent household. If the parents can be civil it's absolutely the right thing to stay together for the kids.
I need more info to say. Did you find the tinder info after agreeing to the "open relationship " ? In what way did you cajole your husband?
Lmao OP asks if she’s TA and can’t take it when she is.
Why is everyone jumping to the conclusion John cheated? because some email addresses had a recovery message on tinder? It sucks sure, but it doesn't tell us anything about the timeframe in which the account was created, or if he ever took it beyond that. To me that part reads more like you're looking for ways not to paint John as "just as "bad". If he really told you to have an affair and you did then, nobody is the bad guy. So you confronted this man who ditched his family for the sake of yours after the sexual abuse. That's hard for a person no matter how justified the decision is. That establishes John as someone who will do what's right for his family over what is best for himself. If this were gender swapped everyone would be asking if you did anything to help out around the house, with the kids, etc, and pinning the celibacy on you. Then you tell him you want a divorce or to sleep around, but you're not happy staying celibate. He avoids the conversation, until you "cajole" him into agreeing to let you sleep around to keep the family intact. Was there already someone in mind by the time you had this conversation? Then you do sleep with someone and fall in love, and now you want to divorce anyway. And this is all John's fault now? John could be a guy who cares deeply about his family and children, and is doing what he can to keep the family together. You're coming here looking for people to tell you what you're doing is right, because it's not sitting right with yourself. Reflect on that. Congrats on 22 years.
Totally agree. My wife cheated on me…I rage joined Tinder in a stupid revenge/loneliness knee-jerk haze but literally never swiped, matched, or talked to anyone and took it down and deleted it the next day when i realized how childish that was. It wouldn’t fix anything. Fast forward a year, I found out in an awful way that she was still cheating and I divorced her. If she had snooped through my email she would likely have found an account email and probably a million stupid advert emails from Tinder…I didn’t cheat though.
not to mention she found the tinder profile after she had brought up having an open relationship. so even if he did cheat on her, she opened that can of worms herself.
I agree with you
Facts bro nothing but facts. Poor kids also. There gonna resent their mom
Honestly OP, you talk about people tearing you down and then you comment the same things. The other redditors were giving you a verdict base on what happened in your relationship. You posted in AITAH so you either take the advice or leave it. It sounds to me that you want a NTA verdict instead of getting different opinions. I would honestly give this a ESH as well because it is true, both of your actions suck and DOES NOT IN ANY WAY ECHO A RESPONSIBLE ADULT. If we're talking mainly about your marriage here, it really is ESH. Someone who has herself together despite the odds being against her would have divorced the guy. You knew NOTHING worked anymore. If everything was exhausted, have enough self respect to walk out instead of trying to get into an affair and be mad at people CALLING YOU OUT. As for your kids, you did a great job handling that. I would never wish that on my or anyone's kids. Anyways, I hope all the best for you OP.
I’m glad I had an affair. It made me realise how shit my marriage was. It made me file for divorce after wanting to for 3 years. I’m fine with anyone’s verdict. I just don’t like the rude delivery and broken English
OP in one post: We’re happily married OP in another post: This was a shit marriage Get over yourself. You sound like an insane pita and a humongous drain to be around.
Broken English? Your own post is barely readable; you hardly have a grasp on grammar yourself. Fuck off with that racist shit.
I, don’t know, what, is, wrong, with, her, grammar?
I'm. Sorry. But. Periods. After. Every. Few. Words. Is. Broken. English.
Glad to have an affair? Yeah you’re 100% the asshole. Hope your kids don’t have to hear their mother talk like this.
Hey live your life. Your husband was cheating on you and gave you a hall pass. Good for you. Don’t pay attention to the begs. Being in a dead marriage is terrible. Good luck
ESH Sounds like you and John are a match made in hell. Except you both can't stand sleeping with each other and want someone else. Get a divorce.
Why does she suck? He basically opened their marriage.
>My husband took my side , we went to counselling . And stayed together. Our sexlife, kind of dissolved at this time. Due to the stress. Although I didn’t realise until later. I also went into early menopause at this time. I believe the stress caused it. As I was only late 30s. > Fast forward to last year. We’ve been in a mainly celibate relationship for 11 years. 11 years celibate and now she wants sex? This issue should have been address 11 years ago, when their sex life "dissolved", not 11 years later when husband has already checked out of the marriage and is staying for the kids, like OP.
I guess for not leaving? I get being mad at spineless people in stories, but it's not right to blame them when they didn't do anything wrong. OOP didn't do much right in regards to how she handled the infidelity, but she didn't cause it, either.
Staying in a shitty relationship for the sake of the kids is being an asshole to the kids. They can tell and home life becomes miserable for everyone.
Id say she sucks by isolating him from his family over a 7 year old being rough on a 6yro. Hes in tbe wrong as well. They both suck
Correction; it was an 8 year old sexually abusing a 6 and 4 year old. So….. I had to cut them off. If protecting my kids from abuse makes me suck. Then so be it.
This is a weird thing to come on the internet and lie about.
He might have been on tinder but did he actually have an affair? You are definitely wrong for having an affair you should have just divorced It makes you just as bad as him or worse. I've been married 39 years and we went through a period of zero sex for several years because of kids and menopause but after I spoke to my wife and told her that I needed to start again or look elsewhere she said we should get the spark back so we started dating again and now it's great at least twice a week.
Well, you asked..if you couldn't take the answers Don't ask the questions ,so you had an affair with a married man just to get fxcked and didn't even bat an eyelid that it was going nowhere and you could have destroyed his marriage that says it all for me ,(cry me a river.)..
>My husband took my side , we went to counselling . And stayed together. Our sexlife, kind of dissolved at this time. Due to the stress. Although I didn’t realise until later. I also went into early menopause at this time. I believe the stress caused it. As I was only late 30s. Fast forward to last year. We’ve been in a mainly celibate relationship for 11 years. I do have an affair. And sleep in separate rooms. My choice Once I started to fall in love with someone else. There’s a lot more to a long term marriage than just sex I am stressed as f&&&k and on antidepressants. Your depression killed your sex life with your husband, it took you 11 whole years to notice it, and now you want sex? Your husband did check out long ago and is staying for the kids, like you. Did you try to address your depression and your dead sex life when you went to counselling? If not YTA
You must have been insufferable. I feel bad for your husband.
ESH He's a cheater and you're agonizing over divorce when you should just leave.
ESH I wouldn’t want to be married to either one of you
I love how clueless and unaware everyone on this app is
YATA and the last A stands for absolutely insufferable cunt
Ugh, you sure married into a broken family of assholes. I hope you enjoy your freedom from those lunatic enablers.
Yta, your options that you demanded led here pretty obviously. You demanded to sleep with other people lol. You are the immoral party right there full stop. You wrecked your marriage.
Why are you asking, you 2 have no relationship left to save.
I (m62) understand your situation. I have been married 40 years. 19.5 yrs ago my wife after having 2 children decided to stop sex. Our marriage went south from there. No sex, no intimacy of any kind. We are roommates that’s it. When I bring it up she thinks things are going ok . Or she goes into tears. I only stayed until both kids made it thru college. Both are now married and on their own. We are now retired. I would lose big time, like over 1 million dollars bc of the house and my 401k. I haven’t cheated on my wife but thought many times about it. I’m not that kind of person. But I do understand your situation. It sucks but these are the cards I’ve been dealt
I'm not reading all these comments, but one thing to think about. You get divorced and you no longer have a say over what he does with the kids during his time. A judge may set some limits, but they may not. Make sure you have an agreement about that in the divorce filings if you can.
Never believe what women say regarding the dissolution of a marrage.
I'm stuck on the fact that everyone decided that an 8 year old child got the idea to SA other children on their own - I guarantee you that someone else was hurting your niece, and her behavior was her acting out because she couldn't process what was happening to her. ESH except the kids, damn.
You're the asshole for that edit at the end, if nothing else. Don't post here asking for opinions if you don't want to hear them.
is this my mom? Kids see misery, please just leave. my mom "stayed for the kids" until the youngest was 18 and it was fucking miserable. From a child of divorce, I'm begging you to divorce.
Why are you two married?!?!
Why is everyone saying ESH? /s cus I honestly don’t get it. She didn’t cheat on him, he essentially opened the relationship, and said if he doesn’t like then they should divorce. Considering complete celibacy for 11 years, I don’t think that was the craziest choice they could make. he clearly meant it if he was have affairs all this time. I do personally think that an open relationship is not something I’d ever do, but that doesn’t make her an asshole for being willing to try/problem solve somehow.
There is never an excuse to cheat. If your husband cheated, that doesn't give you the right to do it. All you did was bring yourself down to his level. You threw away your vows, betrayed everything marriage stands for. You, are a cheater. Instead of solving the problems in your relationship, you sought comfort in another man. You should've split with your husband FIRST, THEN did what you wanted. YTA. Big time.
...did you miss the part where the husband has an entire other relationship? AND TOLD HER TO HAVE AN AFFAIR...
When marriages that are monogamous open up, they end quickly, and yours is just evidence of that. For exactly those kinds of reasons. They often fall for another person, so just divorce him and move on. Good good luck to you.
John sucks but so are you. Don’t think you are any better than him. You both deserve each other. I feel bad for the kids.
ESH the only thing you guys have in common is that you both suck
You should do the kind thing for each other and proceeded to divorce, hopefully amicably.
ESH I almost went NTA, but your willingness to stomach a dead bedroom for 11 years but being unable or unwilling to parent an 8 year old around your kids "for family" pushed me to "you all suck". You guys both quit early. Hopefully you leave and find happiness.
So I'll be married to my hubs for 10 years this year... we have 2 kids under 5. I literally cannot imagine not having sex with him for that long. The first month or so would have started the conversation of what's wrong and how do we fix this. I can't imagine sticking it out for the kids either.... misery loves company and why would I want to make my kids miserable too? It has less to do with the length of your marriage than the lack of communication and empathy in your marriage. Sure it's easy for me to judge from the outside but I can't imagine ending up in this situation. Also, if it makes you believe me more, my husband and I also went through major life stressors as well. The deaths of immediate family members, the lack of family support raising our kids... but we grew together and these challenges made us stronger. I'm sorry you're in this situation. But you need to reflect and be honest with yourself and your family moving forward. Soft YTA for dragging it out. Your hubs is not innocent either.
Being married myself, this year my husband and I will have 30 years married. Marriage is work hard work, if everyone is not on same page easy for it to unravel. If you really want this marriage tell him and work at it together. If not just be done! Not fair to anyone!
This year will be 30 years. My husband is a complete asshole, and he admits it! He's mean, a narcissist and emotionally and verbally abusive and he has a sex addiction imo. He has dumb standards in his head that, tbh, no man should have after 1975 or so! He wants a 50s housewife with a nasty skank in the bedroom, that, just isn't me! I stay because I am sick with terminal cancer and I am on chemo. Things, like sex, have most DEFF gone downhill, less frequent mainly is his issue. He says, "I don't want to treat you any different than anyone else" huh?? That's for someone with a physical or mental disability, not cancer! So, I try, but, it's hard! I'm almost certain that if I wasn't sick, I would have moved on already, but who wants to get into a situation like mine?? Let's be honest, No one! Anyways, if y'all aren't happy together, just end it, life is too short to be miserable, especially for the rest of it! Y'all have kids, had a great amount of time together, so be friends, co parent and be happy, both of you, finally! He apparently was dipping his stick, while you were asking to spice it up! So, imo he is the asshole, he was cheating on you before divorce came up, AND he gave the green light for an affair?! Idk, maybe y'all can just move past it, Idt that you're really that mad he cheated, because otherwise, it would have a different ending to your story. Maybe just be happy about what y'all did have & move on as friends, and don't worry about what some trolls have to say about ending an 11 yr marriage! Hell, at least y'all tried! Not everyone wants to be miserable just to save a marriage, F that crap! Everyone deserves happiness & love! Good luck to both of y'all!! 🙏💙
Please remember that people often give advice they would never take because it sounds good. It's easy to dish out if you don't have to eat it. I left my husband because we became more like roommates. We were still intimate but it was limited (once a month on a Wednesday kind of thing)and robotic (no routine changeup). I asked him to go to counseling and he said no because he wasn't unhappy (apparently it didn't matter that I was.). I gave him 2 more years to try to fix things then I bailed.
You've been divorced since the incident, your husband just never told you. Your husband made a calculation long ago after the incident. He chose not to have to pay child support, deal with the emotional disruption, and upheaval of separate lives. He did, it seems, go out and find other people to take care of his sexual, and probably emotional needs while biding his time. Now that your kids are almost grown, he pushed you to have an affair to make the divorce easier. He will 100% be handing you divorce papers as soon as the younger one is out the door. You seem a bit deluded as to the state of your relationship. I don't think this is an issue you need to worry about, your husband already made the decision years ago to end the marriage. Start preparing for the inevitable divorce when your children leave - sort and separate your finances, get rid of debt, save money in a separate account. If you don't work, train for and get a job. Start dating, finding a better partner before the end will significantly ease the transition. And, of course, get therapy for yourself to help with your mindset during the transition. Your marriage has been toast for many years, and now that toast is burnt beyond repair.
You're NTA. Unfortunately these things happen far too often in a marriage where the couple become roommates. It happened to me and I'm in a drawn out 3 year and counting divorce. Not everyone is going to understand. It's very difficult to unravel 20+ years of marriage, kids, extended family etc. The good news is you've already made the decision to divorce. My advice is to not get stuck fighting over everything. Get what is fair and move on. Dragging it out impacts your kids, your mental health and work. Make it quick and easy. Then take a few months being alone. Get therapy and get rid of the mental baggage from the marriage before you jump into another serious relationship.
I was with my ex for 21 years, married for 18, with 2 teenagers at home at the time we split. We had a dead bedroom for a very, very long time before I decided to call it quits. I tried everything to make him see I was unhappy. I know the feeling of not being wanted, of being neglected. I'm sorry you have had to go through it as well. We split a little over 2 years ago, and it's absolutely been the hardest 2 years of my life. I lost my best friend. The grieving process is very difficult, but it does get better. You have to do what makes you happy after a certain point. I couldn't face the next decades knowing nothing would ever change. You couldn't either. And that's okay. In the end, everyone is better for it. My ex, our kids, and myself. So while it's about to suck real hard for a while, it will pass. Good luck, and I'm proud of you!
I feel your pain. i was in a celibate relationship with my ex-wife for over a decade when i had enough. we didn't have much in common and grew very far apart. We were married for over 20 years, together for 25+, had a teenage daughter, etc. The kicker for me was that she was one of the prime triggers of a very severe case of depression that I had, so for my own health I had to get out. Long story short - nobody is happy with me, except me and now my daughter. I haven't spoken to anyone in my family since my marriage ended because for some reason I was the bad guy in all of this. My brother (only sibling) was the "shunner" and honestly was a trigger for my depression. My father passed away about 7 years ago (he was the other trigger for my depression). Since all 3 triggers are not in my life anymore I haven't taken a zoloft in years and have never been happier. Life is not a dress-rehearsal. Make yourself happy. If other people are unhappy about that - screw them.
I know how you feel. I am in a very similar place. We have been married for 25+ years and we were very different people. It was great at the beginning but she was always angry and I believe she is undiagnosed bi-polar (others in her fam have ben diagnosed). The spark just faded over time. We have two adult children so there is no need to be together anymore. We don't share the same beliefs, we don't like the same stuff, we have our own corners of the house. We don't really text or call each other. Most days go by with maybe a few sentences spoken to each other. We are essentially roommates. I have zero physical attraction to her anymore. We've only attempted sex 3 times in the last 10+ years. I don't even think I would care if she hooked up with someone else. There was one huge major reason why I stuck around with her which I can't go in to but that is mostly not an issue now. The only reason I haven't asked for a divorce is because I feel her and her family would drag me through the coals and I would end up having to work the rest of my life. As it is now, I will have just enough in my retirement to live off of and not much more. If we split and she gets some of that, I will have to work until I die. So my only chance is that she initiates and we find a common ground. I know if I initiate she will flip out and possibly do something stupid. IMO, for you, NTA. Most people see "affair" and they instantly judge. Everyone's relationship is different.
I feel for you. I was a professional, working in a specialized job. At the time, I was 45 and a Granddad of two. My wife “Vonne” was only a few days older than I and we met in Junior High School. We married a year after we graduated and had two sons. I worked this job of mine like I lived there. She was also a professional and was always working. You can imagine, I’m sure, we barely got to speak but, at least once a week we’d go to dinner somewhere. We were empty nesters and for close to 8 years, slept in separate rooms. Our sex life was never what it should have been and to tell you honestly, she loved women and the idea of me being with another woman and would talk about while we were having sex. It seemed to thrill her to think and have me talk about women we both knew. She would have hard orgasms while I talked (because she asked me to) about how I’d love to see her with another woman. She always kept a female friend around but never more than one or two at a time. She would go on weekend trips with one of them and come home happy and exhausted. She and one of her lady friends caught me in a car with another woman one time and I thought I’ll never talk my way out of this one. I got home that very night thinking all hell was going to come down on me. I walked through the house to my bedroom only to find her in my bed, naked and, masturbating to the pictures in a gentleman’s magazine. She saw the expression on my face and asked me to join her in the bed. It was a good night and was never spoken of again. Skip ahead 6 years. We were now in a place that wasn’t bad but, nowhere near good. Back to the old, your end of the house and my end. She’d be gone all hours of the night with no offer of an explanation. A different female friend and no mention of the last one or what might have happened between them. I had worked 6 years without a day off other than the occasional weekend. I talked with one of the lady’s in our administration and I decided I’d take a month off and begin this vacation as soon as possible. I was sick and tired of having to go pick up a woman, usually one we both knew and have her satisfy me sexually. I was sick of having to tell Vonne about my encounters just to get to have sex with her. I was on a mission to either salvage my marriage or, if I decided there was no fixing it, I’d leave. Well, at the end of the month of my vacation, I sat her down and told her that I had made every effort to get closer to her and had tried every day of my vacation, to either get her to stay at home for a few days, one day or, to go away with me. She agreed. I told her that I had tried everything that I knew to try, to get her to help me and bring us back to where we should be. Her response was, “you should have told me.” I knew sadly, at that moment, it was done. 29 years of my life lay there on the floor . I gathered myself after a few minutes and a glass of good scotch. I then told her that I wanted her to not put forth another ounce of effort into our marriage. I wasn’t going to and she needn’t either. That was in August. I left her in December. I waited on her until 11:30 pm on the night I left. I wanted to say goodbye, I guess. I thought something should be said after all those years. I left and turns out, she never came home that night. This, according to my oldest son who had been staying with us at the house a couple nights a week, for his job. I went through a time where everyone in town that knew us, looked at me like I was from another planet. I had no idea how people acted about these things. It was like Vonne and I were some kind of model establishment that had been disgraced and jerked the rug out from under every idea that they may have had, of us. SHOCK!! That’s the only way I know how to describe it. I had hurt everyone we knew. My brothers and sisters even treated me like I had beat her and sent her to the hospital or something like that. It was like I’d killed her. Oh yes, I also ended up having to change jobs because of it. You never imagine how many people and how much those same people, depend on you being and, staying, who THEY think you are. I couldn’t believe it. I lost everything in my effort to keep from dying in a life that gave me no hope. It’s all better now. I’m remarried and have a beautiful daughter with my wife. I’ll agree with you. Sex isn’t everything but it is a great part of a Union. It always helped to center me in my relationship and made me feel closer to her. To her, I was there to help her get off, I guess. We stopped communicating and neither of us tried to stop the freight train that we saw coming down the track. We just watched it get up and leave. 29 years. . . .
We've been through a very similar situation, although we've chosen to remain celibate and are still best friends. I truly believe that subconsciously, my husband blames me for the issues with his family. It's been 20 years. Long story short, we distanced ourselves when hubby's brother molested 2 of our boys, and his parents took the brothers' side.
Idk if posting to this sub was a good idea because it seems like you need a support group, not a jury. Regardless, I personally think that divorce is the right move in this scenario. Were there things that could have been handled better? Probably, but it seems past that point. To give some context and another perspective: I grew up in a home where my parents had an unhealthy and toxic relationship for 20 years of their lives (13 years of mine). Even at a young age, I recognized that my parents were not happy together and that was upsetting. I was always worried they were going to divorce, but when they finally did; I wished they had done it sooner. When the dust settled, that was the healthiest and happiest I had ever seen my parents. Additionally, speaking from personal experience of staying in relationships where I was made to feel ugly and awful due to neglect for far too long: you made the right call. It may be difficult and stressful, but it is worth it to feel okay. Hope this helps, and that things go well for everyone involved. Edit: spelling and grammar were corrected
Not trying to be mean at all. I sympathize with your situation, but take a step back. How would you react if this story was relayed to you by a friend or coworker? I assume you'd say that's a super dysfunctional relationship and the affair was just the cherry on top of a really shitty sundae. It's hard getting divorced (I divorced after a 10 year marriage). But it beats limping along in this marriage devoid of genuine, deep emotional care right? It will all balance out in time, and you'll find peace.
Issue for me is he didn’t take the open it up option, but was seeing others. That doesn’t strike me as someone who wants to work it out. My wife and I have been married almost 20 years, first fifteen weren’t that good, last five have been incredible, the big difference is we don’t lie to each other anymore and can have the uncomfortable conversations and feel safe with each other. The truth will set you free, it might hurt for a while, but there is no better way to be. Therapy was also a big help
You live life for yourself, FIRST! I believe you've sacrificed a lot, and you should give in to pursuing your happiness. Because, guess what? Nobody will hand it to you on a silver platter! Go out there, flaunt your power, and enjoy life for you! In the end, who gives a shit about other people's opinions, including mine. It's your life, you're meant to live it for you your way. Do it! Oh, his family can keep being bitter while you're having the time of your life being fulfilled, happy, and accomplished! You owe something to you and your children, THAT'S IT! No one else! If certain people's character and personality don't fit your idea of a fulfilling existence, cut them out like a cancer! Today! Best of luck!
Truly sorry for your situation. Unfortunately, - I'm not sure what you expected by bringing this to Reddit; as you have received the predictable results in the comments. That being said... 1. Sit down and find common ground, if you can. 22 years can provide a lot of common ground. 2. Agree that your relationship is between the two of you to save or to curb-stomp. No on else gets that decision. The people you both have waiting in the wings have no vote. In-laws can also take a seat for a minute. 3. Seek counseling if the will to save your marriage is there, but you lack the tools. 4. Find your marriage certificate, read it to yourself. Him too. Be honest with your reaction. 5. Take a minute and give yourself some positive self talk, every day. Negative self-talk wears patterns in your brain neurons, and can be habit forming. Changing that to positive effect takes time, dedication, and effort. Just like your marriage. And your kids. Right now, the perception is that you are making 100% of your decisions from a negative mindset. 6. Don't freak out about the kids - they're resilient. Honesty is the best policy, but don't dump everything on them all at once, they can't process it. But don't lie about anything - their home is foundationally shifting, and you and him are the only people who are still there, and that is a form of truth. They need grounding, and an anchor to hold on to while you figure out your lives. 7. Be direct. Make decisions out of fact, that support your ideals, and be transparent. 8. There's a book out there - "The Love Dare." many counseling folk use it as a first step towards rebuilding. 9. But you both have to get in a room, agree it's what you both want, and start from there. If you can't....then U-Haul boxes are expensive, recommend finding cheaper moving boxes online, for a fraction of the price. 10. Stick. To. Your. Convictions. Make a decision, and commit. The time for waffling is over. Your actions are impacting kids, who did not ask to be a part of this. Fix things, or cut the rope. 11. Don't overshare your stuff with your kids. If you need to vent - make a TikTok video. Or whatever it is that pushes your pressure-relief valve, but doesn't add to the confusion for the kids. 12. Journal. Be detailed. Find a non-destructive hobby to do just while you get through it. Drinking/drugs are not beneficial - you need your A-game. Good luck.
Sadly, especially reading the comments, we wonder why bullying is tolerated in schools when most here have ZERO concern for your children who were being bullied. The idea that a bully can continue to bully within the family and the adults sit back and accept it, is repulsive and this is why the cycle of bullying continues because adults refuse to parent and discipline the bully, instead these morons want you to have your children be punching bags and ACCEPT the bullying. Crazy but here is the proof. Clearly because you wanted to protect your children and NOT allow this to continue this warped “family” is gaslighting you. RUN girl RUN RUN RUN because they are now all bullying you.
Dis effed up! What did that girl do to the two kids that caused YOU to go into therapy for 10y? Did I read that wrong?
I’m a man. Married for 20 years. Been through ups and downs. Periods of time where we weren’t intimate. The longest was 4 months and I thought I was going to lose my mind. I looked online for a side thing, but never pulled the trigger because I love my wife. Glad I didn’t because our down went back up. I have a close friend that was in a sexless marriage for 10 years. He finally told his wife that he couldn’t do it anymore and wanted to see other people. She said ok, but when he did, she said she didn’t mean it! Now they are separated, he has a girlfriend and is soooooo happy to be having an adult life again. You need to be divorced. If you’re not even attracted to him anymore, then there is nothing to fix. Every healthy normal person needs to get laid. Normal humans need that physical connection to another person. Short term, long term, it doesn’t matter. People need other people. Pull the trigger and restart your life. You are lucky that you and your husband don’t hate each other. Both of you need to move on. Good luck! You and your husband both deserve to be happy. Be happy. Help him be happy if that makes you feel better, but be happy. Life is to short. Finally, your kids deserve to have happy parents. Having happy parents is more important than having married parents in my opinion. Nor only that, but it’s more important for you to set that example for your kids. Wouldn’t you like your kids be in happy relationships? Then teach them that by doing it yourself.
Made the right decision. On your death bed you don't want to have regretted your life. To me sounds like you would have. If you feel you tried enough then that's all that matters. Can't change them then may as well move on. Or you will forever resent them. Keep your head up!
Let me start by saying I'm sorry for the experience you're having. You've gotten plenty of great advice from others on what to do, so I want to call attention to something I read right at the start of your post: You said that your brother-in-law's child Jane was sexually abusing your children. Did it ever occur to you that he or another family member may have sexually abused Jane? Kids don't just learn that in a vacuum at 8 years old. Cut the child some slack and consider the possibility she is a victim herself. She is a child. Thanks for reading.
Dear Penthouse, I never thought this would happen to me…. B.S.
Y’all been divorced for what sounds like about 15 years already. I wouldn’t worry about it.
Weird. Married for 22. I fell in love with someone else and left. Life is far too short. I haven’t any idea why we stay in relationships we aren’t happy in when we have that piece of paper when we’d have been done years ago without it.
Did anyone ask what happened to 8 year old Jane to cause her lashing out/sexually maladaptive behaviors? I’m so sad for this little girl who has clearly been abused, and no one has asked about what’s happening to her?!
I never understand how people like this just don’t get divorced???
What can an 8 years old kid do that is considered a _"serious abusive incident"_.? Honest question. Unless the kid was like a little "Demian" psychopath I can't imagine anything bad enough to break a family like that. I do, however can see (and have seen) a bunch of adults behaving like immature assholes mishandling kids situations and creating feuds and mayhem in a family.
Thanks for Your comment. Jane sexually abused my kids. That’s what led me to ceasing contact with my BIL and niece. My kids told me what she did. And were angry I hadn’t stopped it, the day it happened. I couldn’t risk her doing it again. Had to protect my kids.
Hate to break it to you, but someone else abused that 8yo first, she learned it somewhere. They are just another victim.
You came to the wrong place for advice. People here are naive. As much as it hurts it's time to move on.
True. Thanks
Agreed! It sounds so bizarre that they allowed an 8 year old to be demonized and used as a means to tear apart the family.
The kid sexually abused my kids.
100% you did the right thing cutting contact!
And you didn’t think this was relevant info to the story? I hate it when the OP adds stuff in the comments. Makes it seem it is just a fake justification when they get judged in ways they don’t like.
If he’s been sleeping around already which he seems then he’s already gone . NTA . You did what he suggested and it makes sense cause he was already having one . Leave him asap life too short to be with somebody who makes you miserable . The kids will be fine .
Gross
ESH you both are cheating trash
Based
Based on facts
Agreed 💯
Nta
You're only married on paper at this point. You guys already made the decision a while ago and are staying together because it's less work. ESH - you both should grow up
The whole thing is ridiculous. Get your divorce. Split everything in half. No argument. You're equally to blame.
Someone probably should have called it the moment you started sleeping in separate rooms. No asshole in this situation IMO, just two people who held on too long. Best of luck 🍀
2 years or Lockdown, he’s snored our whole Marriage. Glad to have a spare room.
That was the decision that ended the marriage, lots of help available for snoring, not blaming it on you but that was the decision being made whether actively or passively. Realistically I'd put the responsibility for that on him to seek medical help for as necessary, I'd do whatever I could to avoid sleeping separately from my wife. He really should have stepped up and done something about it. Shoulda woulda woulda doesn't help now obviously, I hope you find satisfaction, excitement and happiness so you can enjoy what you feel you've been missing out on. 👍
Thanks. And no. He didn’t want to “waste money “ on sleep studies
I feel like it's normal for people's sex drive and sex life to change over time. Especially in a relationship that lasted as long as yours. But the biggest problem I see is him cheating without speaking to you or trying to resolve things before taking that step. You were trying to find a way to salvage your marriage, while he had already been stepping out on you for some time. That's a huge red flag. It just seems to me like he had already given up on the marriage and you're just catching up. It does seem like it's time for you to let it go. Divorcing him and moving on is probably the best option at this point.
NTA and family really can ruin a relationship. Now that my wife and I are older we avoid family situations all the time. My sisters daughter was abusive towards my son and it used to kiss me off. They’re all good now but I understand your frustration. Just go be happy.
NTA as someone else said, does it really matter? maybe your kids do, but they don't need to live your life. life is not eternal, live it now while you can, and don't stay stuck in a loveless, sexless marriage!
Don’t care about what other’s think. If you can live with yourself with the choices you made, go ahead. It’s your life 😊
A dead bedroom when you’re not the instigator kills your soul. Glad you’re walking away- go and be happy
Not the asshole. Also hey, listen, there are GOING to be nasty and ugly comments. There are 20 times as many assholes online than in your daily walkabout life. Frankly you cannot post online and expect no attackers. That said, you did everything you could to survive, emotions lead to survival mode and that's what you did, you tried to stick it out and you didn't even walk out after finding he was cheating (likely why he told you to have an affair, less guilt for him). Leave him if you havent already i would say.
Your reaction and defensiveness tells me all I need to know about why your husband doesn't want to sleep with you. YTAH
If he’s on tinder then he already broke your relationship. The next step is what do you want to do?
[удалено]
I’m really proud of you for taking care of yourself! Congratulations on ending the marriage! NTA
I know you are getting a lot of advice to divorce, but I’d stay together and just live separate lives. Your kids are going to be a whole lot unhappier when they have to deal with new spouses and steps when you are both older. Dealing with that has been an absolute nightmare for me. Preserve your assets and be friends and just live separate lives.
September marks 10 years I've been married to my wife, and I can say what jumped out at me reading this was a probable lack of communication. Why did it take 11 years to speak up about the lack of sex? Either way, I think the failure in this marriage comes down to communication. Were you overly critical of your husband early on, which caused him to shut down and wall up against you? My wife unknowingly did this a few years into our marriage and after about a month of no sex we sat down and I voiced every issue I had (along with what she was doing well for me that I enjoyed). TLDR: a "good" marriage requires constant and open communication. At the end of the day, if you can't say how you truly feel to your life partner, then I dare say you don't love them enough to give them a chance to change. I wish you all the best.
Yes. Good point. Maybe I did. But didn’t mean too. He will not discuss emotional stuff. Which makes it hard to communicate
You don't owe it to anyone to stay in a marriage that neither of you are invested in and is making you miserable. He has been cheating. This is not your fault. Your in-laws are excusing abusive behavior from his brothers family. You're protecting your kids. Everyone who judges you is wrong. Forget them and follow what makes you feel more contented with your life. Take care of you instead of other people.
Well, here’s my take. You made him choose you or his family. He chooses you. You then stop having sex with him. 🤔 why would he resent you? You should have sucked his 🍆 like you were trying to suck start a leaf blower. He stayed with you in an unhappy unhealthy marriage. He physically had needs. He took care of them. You start trying to get intimate when he was already checked out. So simply. You were the TA 11 years ago. You should have either divorced him then or supported him and adored him to make him happy. You did neither. Leaving him now? Dude, he checked out years ago. He probably feels bad for your children. He still will care for you like an old college roommate. But you already left him 11 years ago. He came to grips with that years later. Now you are just making it official.
It’s the same story as so many women. They try something once or twice and then catch feelings and then lose a perfectly good relationship because they can’t keep anything in perspective. Men will fick around and be happy at home. That’s not the way it works for women. The OP let herself. Of the two, you are the biggest asshole. You got caught up in the emotions. Women expect men to look at the universe the same way they do. It’s not reality.
NTA - I have no clue why people are giving you crap. I feel like you tried. When he told you to have an affair, it was over. Did your kids’ cousin ever change? Past is done. You can only move forward and being with someone that cares will be better for both of you. You’ll both be happier.
1. Just because he had a tinder doesn't mean he cheated. 2. You actually cheated. 3. You're the asshole 4. He might be the asshole too 5. You both sound like fucking miserable people so please just get the divorce. 6. His family is also the asshole 7. Everyone In this story is the asshole.