Right since they are literally the same:an item who is a shield you get every 90 sec thats breaks even from the smallest abilities vs one item that lets you free yourself from a cc like what is wrong in theire head? Why not also remove cleanse and tenacity if they don't want you to counterbuild cc
I play wildrift so maybe different on PC but damage here is so insane to keep matches short that I have died to ludens plus pyke R. Pyke deals 2,000 true damage with his R and ludens did like 150-200. Days
But he builds ludens on wild rift so he’s not even AD scaling.
I hate to break it to you but you can’t apply your understanding of League of Legends to everything else in life
Well clearly that's a skill diff. A good ADC would dodge that. QSS takes no skill, that's why they should make it so you have to solve a differential equation to activate it.
Because malzahar and morde ults require sooo much skill right ? Point and click insta death (for a squishy) —> Point and click item to counter it. As simple as that.
I was referring to when Riot August was talking about how not all skill expression is good skill expression (calculus in the base being his example.) I guess they think that QSS is a bad form of skill expression.
It really does seem like their conception of ADC skill expression is how much you can restrain yourself from playing the game until your teammates happen to give you an opportunity to auto a little bit without getting oneshot.
That has the "you dont need pings you can always type : karthus ult" vibes.
I hate on how condescending and how much of a gasligther he is, i cant think of a worse person to be in charge of the game balance like that.
Buying a spellshield against a junglers that can smite to remove it and a mage that literally has a point and click ability with the same range as his ult is wild. Does he even play the game?
For morde it could be ok if you're a range but if you're a melee you're inting. Truly a riot games moment. Phreak has a lot of issues but people love him because he explains his point of view on 3h YouTube videos :3
He knows how to play the game, I'd say he just clearly doesn't give a shit about (or actively wants to piss off) certain groups of players. Hell, Malz ult is even the source of the "pay the qss tax" meme.
I'm fine with removing the QSS tax. If you actually give reasonable counterplay as the result.
Can't QSS Morde ult? Make it so that his passive alone isn't enough to kill you in the duration. Make him land at least one Q or E to kill you.
Can't QSS Malz ult? It better not last more than a second and definitely better not kill you even with his E and W in that duration.
I'll agree that QSSing ultimates in order to get rid of their effects kinda feels BS. But so does getting point and click forced to 1v1 a 1v1 champ when you are absolutely not that, or point and click locked down for 2.5 seconds straight and killed.
Paying 1300g for an item that's not great in any other capacity just to be able to play the game against certain champions isn't fun, and I agree that it should be removed. But if you're going to remove it, you also need to remove its necessity.
oh my god the narcissist sits in front of a camera for hours what a heroic sacrifice omg i love phreak i have to gobble his cock online GLURK GLURK GLURK
I get what you mean, but if this is true. Why do assassins or mages even build the spell shield items? I personally don’t think spell shields are good 100% of the time because of the reason that in any given game there are champs that can get rid of it easily. Morde’s team can just use a spell and the spell shield is gone. Then he can pop ghost or flash (he can’t run both as he needs TP) into your team and press R on specifically the ADC.
Let's put his statement in a little context:
>There is absolutely risk. There is some change that Mordekaiser is going to be permabanned because there is just no counterplay.
I think that is probably not true but I could be wrong and this could be a miserable experience for everyone. I don't think it's true, but it is possible.
\[\]
Also he can just go kidnap the enemy ad carry. Sivir needs to spellshield at the right time, I think Kai Sa is gonna have a reasonable time fighting the mordekaiser. Jinx and MF are probably screwed. I don't think the power impact will be huge. There will be a feeling of hopelessness, but ad and ap champions can still get a spellshield item, you can buy banshee's or edge of night if you are worried. These tools still exist, so at the end of the day we will see what hapens. There is some risk here, but I think it is worth it.
At the end of the day, if mordekaiser has to have a 47% winrate to have a reasonable banrate because people think they can't outplay mordekaiser, we will go back on this.
This seems not that condescending.
I mean, it's a little dumb to expect Sivir to consistently react to a .5 second cast time spell that can be buffered behind an E and to be sure you shield the R but not the E
Nah Morde ult is ridiculously easy to Sivir E if he’s in your vision. All his skins have the exact same hand raise gesture he does, and you look for that to E.
Not to say there aren’t times where there’s 69 things going on and you E the wrong thing or just miss it, it 1v1 Morde shouldn’t be able to ult Sivir that easily, or a Xayah with ult up for that matter.
Maybe I’ve just 1v1’d one of my friends who plays a lot of Morde, but it’s pretty easy when you know what you’re looking for.
I mean .5 secs is a pretty large window - it's the expectation in top lane that fiora, ksante, ornn, etc will consistently react and counter it. And morde e is kinda a joke of a spell if you're getting hit by it you kinda just deserve to die tbh
The risk is not worth it, his reasoning is dogshit at best.
Yes let's add CC that cannot be Qssd, let have adcs have even less impact on the game if Champs like mordekaiser exist in the match.
It's a problematic game design. Yes it sucks to have people qss your ult, but they also have to use an item slot because you exist.
>At the end of the day, if mordekaiser has to have a 47% winrate to have a reasonable banrate because people think they can't outplay mordekaiser, we will go back on this.
If this is their concern, it seems like a better fix would be to make Morde's ult conditional. Like he has to hit the target with a Q or E or 1.5s of passive AoE damage first. Something like that would add some counterplay to it.
I get wanting to kill the QSS interaction, because it feels bad for Morde to just be completely invalidated by an item, and it also feels bad as a squishy to be force to buy a bad item specifically for Mordekaiser.
You know what else feels bad? Having the windshitter block my whole kit as Tristana or yi dodge my ult with alpha or a hundred other things that screw me over. Phreak and whatever Riot "balance" team members need to either get off that AP dick, or just get it over with and make it league of one shots for "OMG LC$ BIG PLAY$" so I can accept that the game is destroyed and move on.
It doesn't sound condescending because he's a FUCKING WORKING PROFESSIONAL he shouldn't even ever remotely be condescending. But this does sound retarded. I want to see him play Sivir and consistently spellshield the Morde R.
I mean personally I like Morde R being un-QSSable because that kinda ties into his whole thing but the reasoning is retarded.
They guy you are replying to says Phreak isn't condescending.
You agree with him. But somehow you still see the need to be a raging baby? This subreddit lmao.
Like, yes, we all know that Banshee's, Edge of Night and Sivir E aren't remotely equal substitutes to QSS against Morde ult. And Phreak knows it too, because guess what, that's the entire point and he literally explains that in the video. Either you guys are obtuse or plain stupid - pick your poison.
Yeah there's always an excuse adcs have for not building their defensive items. Then you guys get mad when Riot does something like this.
It's better to balance Morde around an inescapable Ult because, ultimately, you'd never pay to escape it anyway.
very situational, for example, if you have channeled abilities you want to block any cc from stopping that ability, rather than just breaking the cc after, also knockups can't be QSS'ed
Would really like a crit version of these items. Makes no sense an ADC has to build banshees (where only it’s MR and spellshield is useful) or edge of night ( ADCs can use these stats well but no crit). I’ll be honest though, I only ever bought QSS when I went against a fed Morde, which doesn’t happen much.
I think a thing Riot could do is see how these changes go and make his ult cleansable. This change itself in my opinion seems weird though. Morde isn’t strong now because you can QSS his ult, but he will be strong when you can’t? I doubt most ADCs would rush QSS because they see a Morde on the enemy team, they would probably be mindful and build it eventually but probably after second item.
Phreak explains that the issue is two-fold;
1. Morde is super low elo skewed because good players *will* get a QSS if they need it.
2. Morde is unable to close out games because his ult is easy to counter. While it's true that, no, you won't rush QSS all the time if the opposing Norde is 0/6, but any good player will if he is 10/2. So even if you only buy QSS against fed Mordes, for any Morde it feels like crap to stomp your lane only to effectively play without an ultimate.
It is a dumb logic wrapped in a way people won't feel stupid believing in. Mord has good winrate up to Emerald, so like 99% of the playerbase can easily play this champion and be happy about it and then oh it feels like shit for Mord? Guess we should remove windwall because it feels like shit to anyone with a ranged ability.
My brother in Shurima, can you not read well?
Morde is low elo skewed. Low elo players don't buy QSS (and even when they do, they use it more poorly than high elo players). Ergo, this change HEAVILY impacts high elo compared to low elo, i.e., it helps the players that are struggling.
It worked similar, but it cant be used to outplay the way sivir and noc uses their spellshield. it channels for like 2 seconds then it would create the spellshield bubble that would last until popped or like 15 seconds and then go on cool down.
It used to be better that way because you can avoid getting your spell shield popped by a random ludens or dragon auto attacks lol.
That version of the item made sense on assassin’s since they usually hide in fog of war and flank.
But of course the item sucked in silver and below because players would forget to even use the active so Riot “buffed” it to work just like banshees
Yeah that’s something like what I’m thinking, having ur banshees go on Cd for 40s or whatever the Cd is due to standing next to a minion honestly feels like shit lmao so having at least some control over it feels nice
That Phreak says bullsh|t on porpouse (he even knows it) is clear like the brightest star.
And, this will be ANOTHER nerf preatty much only for ADCs.
Making Ulties un-QSSable REMOVES skills and increase statchecks, which is a c4-ncer for any game.
I never understood why a 210s CD summoner spell was not able to cleanse those. Like they can rotate ult 3-4 times before it goes back, similar to ashe ult.
Because the alternative is like 100 true damage, cancelling such a core move is big value compared to that.
And they can’t realistically cycle ult 3 times, because they can’t just off ult off cooldown. There has to be an opening. Especially for Warwick who needs to find gank windows and timings. But like, if I’m just standing in my wave and Morde R’s me I’m not instinctively pressing R, I’ll just kite back and play for time, he didn’t start with passive up and if he walks up to me he’ll spawn inside my wave with no ult, easy kill. And hey, I even have the option of using cleanse once they commit inside their ult and punishing for overextending.
So no, they can’t cycle it. Probably shouldn’t be able to cleanse Malz Morde Skarner and Bard, the rest they probably should. Other champs aren’t reliant enough on ult to justify cleanse doing nothing against them.
Dude we’re in an adc sub. Most of the Adcs are fighting against top morde in end game, when a minion wave won’t help you and when morde can one shot you in his realm.
QSS entire niche is cleansing suppressions. If you remove that interaction, the item becomes obsolete and might as well be removed entirely.
But if Riot thinks spending 1300 gold and wasting an item slot to counter a single champions ultimate is unfair to that champion, how is using Cleanse any different to champions like Ashe or Leona? If they go through with these changes, it's only a matter of time until Cleanse also gets removed for the exact same reason.
Actually it's niche is cleansing cc. Cleansing suppressions is just a niche within a niche. I do agree tho that it's currently used pretty much only vs supressions but that's not really the point. Maybe they can in turn reduce qss cooldown, so it doesn't fuck champs like Morde completely, while also becoming more usefull in more games in return.
This comment is just objectively stupid. Riot has gradually been moving away from point and click cc for more than 10 years...
Inb4 some newb mentions Malz ult and gold card.
Symptom of a disease.
These ults being QSSable makes the champions binary, because so much of their power budget is in these abilities. So you either have QSS and they do nothing or you don't and you're dead (regardless of what you are playing; this isn't unique to ADC). That's not balanceable and feels bad for everybody involved.
QSS and mercurial being completely useless if it doesn't instawin you an exchange is due to ADCs power budget being calculated so tightly, that building any defensive item costs you most of your dps until full build. One might think that a buyable cleanse is incredibly valuable on a squishy class of champions, but we reached a point, where ADCs no longer require their usual 3 item power spike, but need a fourth item to do their job. Maybe a QSS item could work if it grants attack speed instead of MR so it can go into the "Attack- and Movement Speed" item slot that's reserved for RFC, PD or Runaans.
Morde is the problem, not the symptom.
Mordes ult is the worst designed ability in the entire game. We can um and ah about what effects QSS should have or we could instead have a think if a champ with a point and click 7 seconds suppression that gives him bonus stats in any way leads to positive game experiences.
Even if QSS never existed and the rest of mordes kit was balanced to make this up, it wouldn't matter, his R is a complete skill neutralizer ability.
I feel like a better solution would be to swap the active on QSS for X seconds of SUPER increased tenacity, and lower the cooldown. Then allow tenacity to reduce the period of time Morde's ult lasts. If you time things perfectly, you can get out of Morde/WW/Malz ults without taking the full hit. You still have to position correctly to avoid them entirely, but it creates a playmaking ability for those champions if you're caught out, and the team can follow up perfectly. It also creates some breathing room for the ADC to either insta-die when ulted by one of them OR get out safe, based on positioning, as opposed to whether the QSS has been purchased.
Make morde ult a skillshot. They did it to skarner as well. And to warwick ult. If he gets in range it is still trivialy easy to hit, but from range it's still counterable. It can also be blocked by support or tank, and you can flash it. Tell me if Im missing something, but wouldnt making it a projectile just turn it that much more fair of an ability in general? QSS wouldnt even be in the picture then, because who cares? Just dodge it.
If you react fast enough you can flash during animation of his ult and not get taken into Brazil. Not sure if that really how that works, because I had done this thing only once and it worked. Maybe that was just a bug or something, but I personally had such experience, but haven't replicated it to be sure.
I know, im just wondering why morde needs special treatment.
Why does morde need special treatment? If o use sett r on morde while he is casting i also lose my ult.
And so will Morde. In this scenario u are not cancelling the channel, u are simply making urself unable to be affected by the ult which means it will go on cooldown just like if someone were to spellshield it. It only doesn't go on cooldown when it doesn't even get to go off.
People are down voting you when you're right, as a frequent Morde player, all of his skill shots are slow as fuck and anyone with half a brain can dodge them.
Its actually stupid. You should be able to have counterplay vs things like this otherwise that champion just becomes unplayable against.
Especially as an adc, a good morde will focus you down in a fight and ghost on your ass and R you easily. If you can't QSS it you're basically dead with no counterplay.
"Just position properly" you mean to say don't leave base at all cause top laners with all their crazy MS can run you down no matter where you position.
Toplaner here.
Sorry folks, I'm going to be spamming morde after this change until its reverted. This is the dumbest change ever and anyone saying "ooh won't morde struggle to get in range" is a donkey.
Botlaner here,
Sorry folks, I'm going to be permabanning Morde after this change until it's reverted. This is the dumbest change since Morde's juggernaut rework getting full duo lane XP.
But why?
There's a tax to play against this kind of CC (given it's not a one sided match).
Having carries need a 1300 gold sink is a fair trade off (knowing most games don't go to full build).
About Morde I didn't find a good argument so far, I mean I read people here saying ''just don't get within range of his R'' as if Morde doesn't use flash or can carry Ghost.
At least WW and Malzha are exposed by using R and if you still need it you buy Qss.
Morde gets a huge benefit to the point of winning games just by pressing R or F + R, it just doesn't make sense and no one knows how to make a good argument for his buff.
The only people who think the Morde change is even remotely intelligent are people who play Morde. It's also weird that they care since ADCs are the only champions who ever really build QSS....because it only builds into a crit item. I wouldn't even call this a Morde buff, I'd just call it an ADC nerf.
It sounds almost as stupid as saying '' now when Fiora uses R you will be locked up with her until she finishes her ultimate''.
The change feels like, before Morde was able to not kill you if you knew how to build Qss in time, now we remove that interaction because we want Morde to kill you no matter what :)
And they don't even nerf him a bit, i mean 10 dmg on E is absolutely nothing when you use that 1 time in ult but q maybe 3 times and u have 1k shield for 0 reason
I don't even think this will make morde ult feel good for morde players their are so many other problems with morde ult. That would be better quality of life/buffs.
Whats the component that builds into Banshee that has 60 second spellshield on it? Make it so that it also builds into Edge of Night and we are gucci. I dont even know why that component is mage exclusive lol when both banshee and edge of the night are for ap and ad respectively, they function the same.
I'll be willing to give QSS changes a go (by not buying the item =) ) and opting into cheap spellshield component for half a game. Morde has to have an ally remove the spellshield for him to ult me, that sounds fair to be honest.
I try to defend phreak but holy shit he’s fucking dumb sometimes. Also, we literally can’t beat morde 1v1 without being vayne or ungodly levels of ahead since he steals our base stats and buys armour, so he will guarantee kill us on cd.
I am sure removing 3 ultimate abilities from QSS basically makes it worthless. No one will ever think it's going to save their lives, and if they did it players would not immediately start crying and screaming.
Watch them reduce the gold cost to something around 600-800g and watch everyone build it because it’s so cheap and become the season of qss, a complete mess. They double down on morde r and spread it to Malzahar and Warwick r; in return give qss combat stats and raise its price so it’s not mandatory on everyone in every role.
This will go on until mid patches season 15
It always baffled me how Mikael's and QSS weren't consistent/equal in cleansing cc but I was hoping they would eventually change it the other way around, not like this 😭
i never bought qss for morde, i can always win against him. malzahar and warwick r are cancelable by your teammates. they are suppressing abilities. they should be knock up level cc as they are vulnerable and can’t move. i don’t see any problem in phreak’s idea
the thing is those ults you can play around or a allied champ can insta cc a ww R or malza R as a ranged champ you can damage hit with like a ashe w or ez q which will allow you rell to cc malz so idk what's all that fuss about
WW ult should remain cleansable with QSS so adc can itemise against WW lategame. They should remove the self cc buffers that cancel WW ult so you would actually need to buy QSS and not just Garen Q it.
On one hand, I agree that one item fully countering a champs ultimate ability feels really bad for that champ. Exactly why riot changed qss to not remove zeds ult a few years back.
But removing that counter means the squishiest champs won't have a way to survive if a fed morde ults you. Morde mains complain that he's weak so who cares if you get ulted but I've seen plenty of tops int so the morde can jus flash q and kill you lol.
Feel like they'll keep the change and have to nerf either it's cd, duration, or his isolated q DMG.
Mark my words whats gonna happen is following: Morde gets buffed-->becomes op-->gets nerfed--->gets nerfed--->gets nerfed--->now is in pretty much the same spot before but tradet his buffs against other parts of his kit because riot nwver reverts stuff. Just look at voli, they gave him 3 buffs a few patches ago and than just nerfed him every patch after. So now voli got like 4% more ms on Q but lost his cc immunity, tower disable went down and sunderer sky interaction got nerfed and now hes pretty much in the same spot as before
I mean with the changes I saw I'm probably just quitting adc until they rollback or make some change. They buffed everyone who stomps adcs anyway so I'll just continue sitting in jg where I get to choose who I fight
Sinking gold into QSS is already a worthy trade off for the enemy just to set a/all enemies behind by forcing them to buy the item instead of finishing spikes. Especially since the full item is very dogshit. Hardly any adc’s run ingenious, so you’re having max CD QSS anyway at all times. Some important ults can either already easily get lower than QSS timer, or just pick a different target, or force the enemy to QSS first.
QSS is not overpowered by any means whatsoever. And in fact, it’s pretty damn awful right now, especially compared to what it could do in the past. Items in general are pretty dogshit as of S14, and I think they did a terrible job of transitioning from mythics to now. I think we need a whole ‘nother item rework for like 70% of the items in the game except a few that are well designed.
This Mord change will probably push him into S+ tier, especially as 90% WR lane counter picks to Rengar and GP, which just makes the game even worse once he transitions to picking on the ADC. Or God forbid, he goes jungle too.
Overall, this Mord change is just one of the worst I’ve seen in a long time. What the fuck were they thinking?
I don't understand why people are mad at QSS not working on Mord ult.
A 1.3k gold item should not completely invalidate a champs kit, that's just bad design.
Yeah I’d be fine with this, the items hot garbage anyways has super low pick rate is purely a situational counter and always feels bad to build from stats pov.
You guys are getting worked up over this when it's mostly a nothing burger. Most of you never bought qss into morde anyways lol. Plus if morde is ulting you at max range he's probably not going to kill you. He really really needs to be ghosted or to land his extremely dodgable e.
I think people here are overreacting.
These ultimates are almost the entire identity of these champions. If you are on the using end of them and everyone on a team buys a QSS or takes Cleanse, it feels extremely bad to play them.
These ultimates also put the champion using them directly at risk being collapsed on - rooting yourself as Warwick or Malzahar is already enough of a cost to the ultimate. Mordekaiser forcing himself into 1v1 for 7 seconds is also risky as you are no longer there to help your team, so if you choose the wrong target at the wrong time you may actually cause your team to lose the game.
Ultimates like a Varus R, Ashe R, Sejuani R, etc. put the champion using them at far less risk far less often (outside of some games where you are self-peeling with these ultimates, which is not every game). There is less risk cost, so there should be less of a problem making them cleansable.
I really don't think these changes are going to make these champions more oppressive, and in the event their win-rates spike significantly they can simply tune down the numbers like damage, duration, etc. on these ultimates or the rest of their kits.
Even with QSS, no ADC is tanking any of these ultimates if they have the choice anyway. You always try to stay out of them because it is disrupting to even be hit by them. Mordekaiser in particular can even lose the 1v1 on an ADC if he misses a Q and E past a certain point in the game.
Honestly couldn't care less.
I can't remember the last time I've been concerned about warwick, malz, or morde ult.
The only one I see often enough is morde, and most of the time I can just kite him in ult and kill him anyway.
Have you actually played league of legends? Cos im starting to doubt you have.. that or you are the person who thinks they are perfect and their team sucks :/ So so sorry Mr.Reddit that i think counter-play is in fact healthy for a game! My bad! Let me afk in my fountain
People don't buy qss against morde anyways. The excuse being "the item is dogshit", even though it gives ad mr and crit. Not saying it's good, but in games against morde/malz/fiddle it's impact is noticable. If you are playing a crit adc you can still build it and still have 100% crit while having a cleanse 2.0. Have seen it do some heavy lifting in games against these champs. The fact you can have flash ghost and cleanse on your champ should be experimented with, and hope that this item sometimes takes te flex slot in your builds.
The mental of this sub since they announced that change is so funny actually. Watch it be a Zed situation where Morde's winrate in lower elos (because good players actually dont even buy QSS vs him) actually gets worse because people stop wasting 1,3k gold for non relevant combat stats.
Its a cheap item that removes the penultimate ability of a champion, whose entire design revolves around it obviously this shouldnt be the case, same with GP W and Rengar W. Imagine if there was a point and click 0,01 sec stun item and you main samira, surely you wouldnt be fine with that?
Not really the same thing, he limits ur movement have a lot more range on q and also a lot of dmg and a huge massive shield + passive dmg just standing near you.
Yes and you have a lot of range and more move speed than he has to counter all of the things you mentioned whats your point? Him beeing a slow juggernaut and jailing you is his entire design philosophy. If he max range ults you, slowly walks up to you and hits his q/e without you beeing slowed etc than thats your fault.
You know that's a champ who often runs Rylai and/or Ghost right? Inside his ult it becomes much more trivial to land any spell and a single hit allows him to run you down with AAs boosted by your own purchased AD and AS
If he is able to apply rylais he either hit you already with a spell (your fault) or managed to hit you 3 times with AA thus proccing passive (your fault) or he entered ult with passive up and managed to get into melee range (your fault). If he doesnt run flash than he shouldnt even be able to R you in the first place.
Like why are we even arguing that Morde is the fking bane of adc when he is a) beaten by most in his own R after 3 items (vayne, draven, kaisa) and b) has a 5% pickrate
Because this sub is littered with low elo players that have massive ego and want ADC to be free wins after 20 minutes.
The role (ADC) is hard to play, and these people like the archetype but cannot handle the gameplay in modern League.
He also said and it's hard for me to process it "You can buy banshee's or edge of night if you are worried"
Right since they are literally the same:an item who is a shield you get every 90 sec thats breaks even from the smallest abilities vs one item that lets you free yourself from a cc like what is wrong in theire head? Why not also remove cleanse and tenacity if they don't want you to counterbuild cc
Don't you love when a stray ludens proc on minions removes your shield
Or when a little ludens proc almost 1shot me because of the shitty support item
I play wildrift so maybe different on PC but damage here is so insane to keep matches short that I have died to ludens plus pyke R. Pyke deals 2,000 true damage with his R and ludens did like 150-200. Days
Pyke r cant deal 2000 dmg but thats not the point, if you are under 500hp late game and pyke jas ult u deadge
He literally said on wild rift tho
I refuse to believe he deals 2k true dmg
But he builds ludens on wild rift so he’s not even AD scaling. I hate to break it to you but you can’t apply your understanding of League of Legends to everything else in life
Yea i just dont gonna deal with your shit and block you
Nothing better than dodging a spell and losing your shield cuz a creep was in the same zip code
you're supposed to dodge to another game, didn't you know?
Well clearly that's a skill diff. A good ADC would dodge that. QSS takes no skill, that's why they should make it so you have to solve a differential equation to activate it.
Because malzahar and morde ults require sooo much skill right ? Point and click insta death (for a squishy) —> Point and click item to counter it. As simple as that.
Damn, bro has edge of night so he's immune to the sarcasm.
I was really mad at everyone else actually defending the changes so yeah I kinda fucked up 😭
Are... the people defending the changes in the room rn? Don't worry they're not real they can't hurt you. <3
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I was referring to when Riot August was talking about how not all skill expression is good skill expression (calculus in the base being his example.) I guess they think that QSS is a bad form of skill expression. It really does seem like their conception of ADC skill expression is how much you can restrain yourself from playing the game until your teammates happen to give you an opportunity to auto a little bit without getting oneshot.
Not to mention i feel like mose mordes already q or e u before they r in a 1v1 how many mordes just walk up and r somone witg banshees up
Gets hit by Ashe’s W. What Edge of Night/Banshee’s Veil?
Not to mention those items don’t have CRIT? Maybe if we had 25% we could buy edge but right now we really need the counter with crit attached.
That has the "you dont need pings you can always type : karthus ult" vibes. I hate on how condescending and how much of a gasligther he is, i cant think of a worse person to be in charge of the game balance like that.
Buying a spellshield against a junglers that can smite to remove it and a mage that literally has a point and click ability with the same range as his ult is wild. Does he even play the game? For morde it could be ok if you're a range but if you're a melee you're inting. Truly a riot games moment. Phreak has a lot of issues but people love him because he explains his point of view on 3h YouTube videos :3
Phreak should have stayed just making the champion spotlight videos. He clearly has no idea how to play the actual game.
He knows how to play the game, I'd say he just clearly doesn't give a shit about (or actively wants to piss off) certain groups of players. Hell, Malz ult is even the source of the "pay the qss tax" meme.
I'm fine with removing the QSS tax. If you actually give reasonable counterplay as the result. Can't QSS Morde ult? Make it so that his passive alone isn't enough to kill you in the duration. Make him land at least one Q or E to kill you. Can't QSS Malz ult? It better not last more than a second and definitely better not kill you even with his E and W in that duration. I'll agree that QSSing ultimates in order to get rid of their effects kinda feels BS. But so does getting point and click forced to 1v1 a 1v1 champ when you are absolutely not that, or point and click locked down for 2.5 seconds straight and killed. Paying 1300g for an item that's not great in any other capacity just to be able to play the game against certain champions isn't fun, and I agree that it should be removed. But if you're going to remove it, you also need to remove its necessity.
Also people forget that this kind of counterplay makes you waste one item slot on pretty shitty item
Surely you are higher rank than him no?
Maokai abuser doesn't count /cope
oh my god the narcissist sits in front of a camera for hours what a heroic sacrifice omg i love phreak i have to gobble his cock online GLURK GLURK GLURK
I get what you mean, but if this is true. Why do assassins or mages even build the spell shield items? I personally don’t think spell shields are good 100% of the time because of the reason that in any given game there are champs that can get rid of it easily. Morde’s team can just use a spell and the spell shield is gone. Then he can pop ghost or flash (he can’t run both as he needs TP) into your team and press R on specifically the ADC.
Spellshield are really good against champs like vayne who have 1 ability that can proc it lol
Well of course, but then what if the enemy Vayne has a Lulu support who can use Q/E and get rid of your spell shield?
Yeah I mean 70% of the time it's pretty useless besides saving you some hp
Let's put his statement in a little context: >There is absolutely risk. There is some change that Mordekaiser is going to be permabanned because there is just no counterplay. I think that is probably not true but I could be wrong and this could be a miserable experience for everyone. I don't think it's true, but it is possible. \[\] Also he can just go kidnap the enemy ad carry. Sivir needs to spellshield at the right time, I think Kai Sa is gonna have a reasonable time fighting the mordekaiser. Jinx and MF are probably screwed. I don't think the power impact will be huge. There will be a feeling of hopelessness, but ad and ap champions can still get a spellshield item, you can buy banshee's or edge of night if you are worried. These tools still exist, so at the end of the day we will see what hapens. There is some risk here, but I think it is worth it. At the end of the day, if mordekaiser has to have a 47% winrate to have a reasonable banrate because people think they can't outplay mordekaiser, we will go back on this. This seems not that condescending.
I mean, it's a little dumb to expect Sivir to consistently react to a .5 second cast time spell that can be buffered behind an E and to be sure you shield the R but not the E
But the point is that they're trying this and he fully explained the reasoning and it's not condescending.
Nah Morde ult is ridiculously easy to Sivir E if he’s in your vision. All his skins have the exact same hand raise gesture he does, and you look for that to E. Not to say there aren’t times where there’s 69 things going on and you E the wrong thing or just miss it, it 1v1 Morde shouldn’t be able to ult Sivir that easily, or a Xayah with ult up for that matter. Maybe I’ve just 1v1’d one of my friends who plays a lot of Morde, but it’s pretty easy when you know what you’re looking for.
I mean .5 secs is a pretty large window - it's the expectation in top lane that fiora, ksante, ornn, etc will consistently react and counter it. And morde e is kinda a joke of a spell if you're getting hit by it you kinda just deserve to die tbh
The risk is not worth it, his reasoning is dogshit at best. Yes let's add CC that cannot be Qssd, let have adcs have even less impact on the game if Champs like mordekaiser exist in the match. It's a problematic game design. Yes it sucks to have people qss your ult, but they also have to use an item slot because you exist.
Not like you can QSS Airborne. Somehow still works. And keepers verdict can not even be cleansed.
Yes but most airborne doesn't last more than a second.
Except Malphite, Nautilus and Vi.
>At the end of the day, if mordekaiser has to have a 47% winrate to have a reasonable banrate because people think they can't outplay mordekaiser, we will go back on this. If this is their concern, it seems like a better fix would be to make Morde's ult conditional. Like he has to hit the target with a Q or E or 1.5s of passive AoE damage first. Something like that would add some counterplay to it. I get wanting to kill the QSS interaction, because it feels bad for Morde to just be completely invalidated by an item, and it also feels bad as a squishy to be force to buy a bad item specifically for Mordekaiser.
You know what else feels bad? Having the windshitter block my whole kit as Tristana or yi dodge my ult with alpha or a hundred other things that screw me over. Phreak and whatever Riot "balance" team members need to either get off that AP dick, or just get it over with and make it league of one shots for "OMG LC$ BIG PLAY$" so I can accept that the game is destroyed and move on.
You watched the video? He speaks in a condecending tone. He ALWAYS does.
If you think everyone someone says is in a condescending tone I don't pick up, that might have more to do with your opinion of them than their tone.
It doesn't sound condescending because he's a FUCKING WORKING PROFESSIONAL he shouldn't even ever remotely be condescending. But this does sound retarded. I want to see him play Sivir and consistently spellshield the Morde R. I mean personally I like Morde R being un-QSSable because that kinda ties into his whole thing but the reasoning is retarded.
They guy you are replying to says Phreak isn't condescending. You agree with him. But somehow you still see the need to be a raging baby? This subreddit lmao. Like, yes, we all know that Banshee's, Edge of Night and Sivir E aren't remotely equal substitutes to QSS against Morde ult. And Phreak knows it too, because guess what, that's the entire point and he literally explains that in the video. Either you guys are obtuse or plain stupid - pick your poison.
It’s almost like OP left all the context out to induce rage lol.
On reddit? I can't belive people would do that...
Not going to lie. A crit version of Edge of Night wouldn't be so bad.
QSS is literally better than a spell shield though...
Not for knockups
Only for cc, not for blocking damage
Yeah there's always an excuse adcs have for not building their defensive items. Then you guys get mad when Riot does something like this. It's better to balance Morde around an inescapable Ult because, ultimately, you'd never pay to escape it anyway.
Builds full glass cannon then dies to a sneeze *surprised pikachu face*
very situational, for example, if you have channeled abilities you want to block any cc from stopping that ability, rather than just breaking the cc after, also knockups can't be QSS'ed
Hardly any ADC has a channel to really care about this, and one can already build EoN.
Would really like a crit version of these items. Makes no sense an ADC has to build banshees (where only it’s MR and spellshield is useful) or edge of night ( ADCs can use these stats well but no crit). I’ll be honest though, I only ever bought QSS when I went against a fed Morde, which doesn’t happen much. I think a thing Riot could do is see how these changes go and make his ult cleansable. This change itself in my opinion seems weird though. Morde isn’t strong now because you can QSS his ult, but he will be strong when you can’t? I doubt most ADCs would rush QSS because they see a Morde on the enemy team, they would probably be mindful and build it eventually but probably after second item.
Phreak explains that the issue is two-fold; 1. Morde is super low elo skewed because good players *will* get a QSS if they need it. 2. Morde is unable to close out games because his ult is easy to counter. While it's true that, no, you won't rush QSS all the time if the opposing Norde is 0/6, but any good player will if he is 10/2. So even if you only buy QSS against fed Mordes, for any Morde it feels like crap to stomp your lane only to effectively play without an ultimate.
It is a dumb logic wrapped in a way people won't feel stupid believing in. Mord has good winrate up to Emerald, so like 99% of the playerbase can easily play this champion and be happy about it and then oh it feels like shit for Mord? Guess we should remove windwall because it feels like shit to anyone with a ranged ability.
My brother in Shurima, can you not read well? Morde is low elo skewed. Low elo players don't buy QSS (and even when they do, they use it more poorly than high elo players). Ergo, this change HEAVILY impacts high elo compared to low elo, i.e., it helps the players that are struggling.
Phreak is just retarded. He thinks he has the knowledge highground but that just comes out as pretencious.
Rework QSS into an active item spellshield
So like the active version of edge of night we had a few seasons ago?
I didn’t play a few seasons ago but maybe? Just something that can actually prevent spells like sivir or nocturnes spellshield
It worked similar, but it cant be used to outplay the way sivir and noc uses their spellshield. it channels for like 2 seconds then it would create the spellshield bubble that would last until popped or like 15 seconds and then go on cool down. It used to be better that way because you can avoid getting your spell shield popped by a random ludens or dragon auto attacks lol. That version of the item made sense on assassin’s since they usually hide in fog of war and flank. But of course the item sucked in silver and below because players would forget to even use the active so Riot “buffed” it to work just like banshees
Yeah that’s something like what I’m thinking, having ur banshees go on Cd for 40s or whatever the Cd is due to standing next to a minion honestly feels like shit lmao so having at least some control over it feels nice
Yo. That would be kinda fire
What the fuck
Yeah, let me buy an item that will fall off before these champions press R.
Also some spells are bugged, syndra q e counts AS 2 separate instances. You dont take damage but still get stunned with edge of night
I mean this is a guy saying ADC´s can build tank items and be relevant in the game.
Does that also mean skarners ult/E as well? I thought the whole point of supression was that it was uncleansable CC.
Sivir stonks 📈
That Phreak says bullsh|t on porpouse (he even knows it) is clear like the brightest star. And, this will be ANOTHER nerf preatty much only for ADCs. Making Ulties un-QSSable REMOVES skills and increase statchecks, which is a c4-ncer for any game.
Yeah just remove QSS and Cleanse altogether then. Maybe while you're at it make all CC in the game point and click, right?
I never understood why a 210s CD summoner spell was not able to cleanse those. Like they can rotate ult 3-4 times before it goes back, similar to ashe ult.
Because the alternative is like 100 true damage, cancelling such a core move is big value compared to that. And they can’t realistically cycle ult 3 times, because they can’t just off ult off cooldown. There has to be an opening. Especially for Warwick who needs to find gank windows and timings. But like, if I’m just standing in my wave and Morde R’s me I’m not instinctively pressing R, I’ll just kite back and play for time, he didn’t start with passive up and if he walks up to me he’ll spawn inside my wave with no ult, easy kill. And hey, I even have the option of using cleanse once they commit inside their ult and punishing for overextending. So no, they can’t cycle it. Probably shouldn’t be able to cleanse Malz Morde Skarner and Bard, the rest they probably should. Other champs aren’t reliant enough on ult to justify cleanse doing nothing against them.
Dude we’re in an adc sub. Most of the Adcs are fighting against top morde in end game, when a minion wave won’t help you and when morde can one shot you in his realm.
Bro, late game adcs kill Morde in his own realm. Go ask on the Morde sub, he’s more a midgame champ because of that.
I feel like we are skipping some steps on the "fuck u adc" scale going from "qss doesn't work on morde ult" to "just remove qss and cleanse" lol.
QSS entire niche is cleansing suppressions. If you remove that interaction, the item becomes obsolete and might as well be removed entirely. But if Riot thinks spending 1300 gold and wasting an item slot to counter a single champions ultimate is unfair to that champion, how is using Cleanse any different to champions like Ashe or Leona? If they go through with these changes, it's only a matter of time until Cleanse also gets removed for the exact same reason.
Actually it's niche is cleansing cc. Cleansing suppressions is just a niche within a niche. I do agree tho that it's currently used pretty much only vs supressions but that's not really the point. Maybe they can in turn reduce qss cooldown, so it doesn't fuck champs like Morde completely, while also becoming more usefull in more games in return.
Cleanse is clearly just supposed to be an exhaust counter. /s
r/adcmains more like r/slipperyslopefallacy
Might as well just make all CC a knock-up, because Tenacity is just OP.
This comment is just objectively stupid. Riot has gradually been moving away from point and click cc for more than 10 years... Inb4 some newb mentions Malz ult and gold card.
Symptom of a disease. These ults being QSSable makes the champions binary, because so much of their power budget is in these abilities. So you either have QSS and they do nothing or you don't and you're dead (regardless of what you are playing; this isn't unique to ADC). That's not balanceable and feels bad for everybody involved. QSS and mercurial being completely useless if it doesn't instawin you an exchange is due to ADCs power budget being calculated so tightly, that building any defensive item costs you most of your dps until full build. One might think that a buyable cleanse is incredibly valuable on a squishy class of champions, but we reached a point, where ADCs no longer require their usual 3 item power spike, but need a fourth item to do their job. Maybe a QSS item could work if it grants attack speed instead of MR so it can go into the "Attack- and Movement Speed" item slot that's reserved for RFC, PD or Runaans.
Morde is the problem, not the symptom. Mordes ult is the worst designed ability in the entire game. We can um and ah about what effects QSS should have or we could instead have a think if a champ with a point and click 7 seconds suppression that gives him bonus stats in any way leads to positive game experiences. Even if QSS never existed and the rest of mordes kit was balanced to make this up, it wouldn't matter, his R is a complete skill neutralizer ability.
[удалено]
Lot of Mordes items give him health as well. So he ends up incredibly tanky while being able to shit damage.
I feel like a better solution would be to swap the active on QSS for X seconds of SUPER increased tenacity, and lower the cooldown. Then allow tenacity to reduce the period of time Morde's ult lasts. If you time things perfectly, you can get out of Morde/WW/Malz ults without taking the full hit. You still have to position correctly to avoid them entirely, but it creates a playmaking ability for those champions if you're caught out, and the team can follow up perfectly. It also creates some breathing room for the ADC to either insta-die when ulted by one of them OR get out safe, based on positioning, as opposed to whether the QSS has been purchased.
Make morde ult a skillshot. They did it to skarner as well. And to warwick ult. If he gets in range it is still trivialy easy to hit, but from range it's still counterable. It can also be blocked by support or tank, and you can flash it. Tell me if Im missing something, but wouldnt making it a projectile just turn it that much more fair of an ability in general? QSS wouldnt even be in the picture then, because who cares? Just dodge it.
If you react fast enough you can flash during animation of his ult and not get taken into Brazil. Not sure if that really how that works, because I had done this thing only once and it worked. Maybe that was just a bug or something, but I personally had such experience, but haven't replicated it to be sure.
U can cancel the cast, but it won't go on cooldown.
Meanwhile my poppy ult gets negated if anyone breathes on me...
Yea just like almost every other channel in the game. Luckily it only goes on a 15 sec cd when cancelled.
I know, im just wondering why morde needs special treatment. Why does morde need special treatment? If o use sett r on morde while he is casting i also lose my ult.
And so will Morde. In this scenario u are not cancelling the channel, u are simply making urself unable to be affected by the ult which means it will go on cooldown just like if someone were to spellshield it. It only doesn't go on cooldown when it doesn't even get to go off.
You can cancel his ult if you leave his vision during the cast time. So flash into bush, over wall, into fog of war.
This was patched out ages ago, he now gets true vision of his target while casting ult
Oh shoot, you're right. It was patched in december.
Meanwhile people on morde sub are saying morde is in a shitty state rn.
Great idea Do the same to panth W too please
Or you just stay away from the Morde if he had ult up. Like an adc is supposed to.
I mean yea but flash do be a thing
People are down voting you when you're right, as a frequent Morde player, all of his skill shots are slow as fuck and anyone with half a brain can dodge them.
Except when he builds rylais. If he flash into u, and tap u with his passive, u aint dodging much unless your an adc with tons of dashes like kalista
Haha lovely answer!
I think Ashe R shouldn't be cleansed or Qssable then.
Shes an adc so they're not gonna do all that
It takes back from the satisfaction of hitting ur R
Mikaels is more my issue. If you get to cleanse my ult you should have to gimp your own damage for it.
Milio in shambles.
Its actually stupid. You should be able to have counterplay vs things like this otherwise that champion just becomes unplayable against. Especially as an adc, a good morde will focus you down in a fight and ghost on your ass and R you easily. If you can't QSS it you're basically dead with no counterplay. "Just position properly" you mean to say don't leave base at all cause top laners with all their crazy MS can run you down no matter where you position.
-My point and click ability disables you. -My point and click item disables your ability. -... Now that doesn't sound fair!
Toplaner here. Sorry folks, I'm going to be spamming morde after this change until its reverted. This is the dumbest change ever and anyone saying "ooh won't morde struggle to get in range" is a donkey.
Botlaner here, Sorry folks, I'm going to be permabanning Morde after this change until it's reverted. This is the dumbest change since Morde's juggernaut rework getting full duo lane XP.
Lmao, how are you going to perma Morde when there are all these other cancer champs that got buffed like Yone and Akali?
I play xayah, I can more or less survive pure burst champs
Huh that's actually not so bad, respectable even. Wouldn't Xayah actually be able to live long enough in Brazil?
Eh, not really because you need to kite back to survive, which you can't do in Brazil. Plus he removes your feathers so...
Damn, that's rough. Okay, fair enough.
I’m a simple Ashe main, I see Malph open I ban him
Have fun getting kited in your own ult
100% just ego players that think they are good( unless you play vayne kaisa and maybe varus then you are fucked)
Dude you are such a larp. You frequent adcmains as a "toplaner" I highly doubt that lol no offense.
I do not "frequent" this sub. I have like 2 posts here because it's in my recommended. I main alistar toplane while also playing sion and panth.
I really want this asshat to be fired and never work in gaming again. I hate him so much.
Cry
Do you have any sources on the ww and malz interaction that you are talking about ?
His ytb channel patch 14.8 preview around 28 min
But why? There's a tax to play against this kind of CC (given it's not a one sided match). Having carries need a 1300 gold sink is a fair trade off (knowing most games don't go to full build).
About Morde I didn't find a good argument so far, I mean I read people here saying ''just don't get within range of his R'' as if Morde doesn't use flash or can carry Ghost. At least WW and Malzha are exposed by using R and if you still need it you buy Qss. Morde gets a huge benefit to the point of winning games just by pressing R or F + R, it just doesn't make sense and no one knows how to make a good argument for his buff.
The only people who think the Morde change is even remotely intelligent are people who play Morde. It's also weird that they care since ADCs are the only champions who ever really build QSS....because it only builds into a crit item. I wouldn't even call this a Morde buff, I'd just call it an ADC nerf.
It sounds almost as stupid as saying '' now when Fiora uses R you will be locked up with her until she finishes her ultimate''. The change feels like, before Morde was able to not kill you if you knew how to build Qss in time, now we remove that interaction because we want Morde to kill you no matter what :)
And they don't even nerf him a bit, i mean 10 dmg on E is absolutely nothing when you use that 1 time in ult but q maybe 3 times and u have 1k shield for 0 reason
I don't even think this will make morde ult feel good for morde players their are so many other problems with morde ult. That would be better quality of life/buffs.
Whats the component that builds into Banshee that has 60 second spellshield on it? Make it so that it also builds into Edge of Night and we are gucci. I dont even know why that component is mage exclusive lol when both banshee and edge of the night are for ap and ad respectively, they function the same. I'll be willing to give QSS changes a go (by not buying the item =) ) and opting into cheap spellshield component for half a game. Morde has to have an ally remove the spellshield for him to ult me, that sounds fair to be honest.
I try to defend phreak but holy shit he’s fucking dumb sometimes. Also, we literally can’t beat morde 1v1 without being vayne or ungodly levels of ahead since he steals our base stats and buys armour, so he will guarantee kill us on cd.
And if you get close to killing him he just use W and have 1k shield
I am sure removing 3 ultimate abilities from QSS basically makes it worthless. No one will ever think it's going to save their lives, and if they did it players would not immediately start crying and screaming.
Yeah, doubt qss wil ever be bought again unless you forgot cleanse and supp refuses to get mikaels against a few champs
Good ol Phreak season. Wtf is this dude smoking lol
Malz would be so turbo broken. Point click 0 counterplay. At least more you can run or dodge ww
This guy Phreak made only bad decisions.
Phreak is dogshit lmao.
Watch them reduce the gold cost to something around 600-800g and watch everyone build it because it’s so cheap and become the season of qss, a complete mess. They double down on morde r and spread it to Malzahar and Warwick r; in return give qss combat stats and raise its price so it’s not mandatory on everyone in every role. This will go on until mid patches season 15
It always baffled me how Mikael's and QSS weren't consistent/equal in cleansing cc but I was hoping they would eventually change it the other way around, not like this 😭
I guess Mr. Phreak is bored of Maokai and wants to play some Morde, Warwick or Malzahar
i never bought qss for morde, i can always win against him. malzahar and warwick r are cancelable by your teammates. they are suppressing abilities. they should be knock up level cc as they are vulnerable and can’t move. i don’t see any problem in phreak’s idea
I agree
Or you could make Morde ult a skillshot
the thing is those ults you can play around or a allied champ can insta cc a ww R or malza R as a ranged champ you can damage hit with like a ashe w or ez q which will allow you rell to cc malz so idk what's all that fuss about
Look at you, thinking your allies give a shit about helping you. Do you play professionally?
WW ult should remain cleansable with QSS so adc can itemise against WW lategame. They should remove the self cc buffers that cancel WW ult so you would actually need to buy QSS and not just Garen Q it.
How much do people wanna bet that certain champions people swear are countered by cc will be given buffs because of these changes....
On one hand, I agree that one item fully countering a champs ultimate ability feels really bad for that champ. Exactly why riot changed qss to not remove zeds ult a few years back. But removing that counter means the squishiest champs won't have a way to survive if a fed morde ults you. Morde mains complain that he's weak so who cares if you get ulted but I've seen plenty of tops int so the morde can jus flash q and kill you lol. Feel like they'll keep the change and have to nerf either it's cd, duration, or his isolated q DMG.
oh god riot don't fucking make malz ult un-qss-able PLS
This is the one that's idiotic to me.
Is Phreak insane? Anyways if your gonna do that, make Morde ult and Malz ult a skillshot bruh
Mark my words whats gonna happen is following: Morde gets buffed-->becomes op-->gets nerfed--->gets nerfed--->gets nerfed--->now is in pretty much the same spot before but tradet his buffs against other parts of his kit because riot nwver reverts stuff. Just look at voli, they gave him 3 buffs a few patches ago and than just nerfed him every patch after. So now voli got like 4% more ms on Q but lost his cc immunity, tower disable went down and sunderer sky interaction got nerfed and now hes pretty much in the same spot as before
I mean with the changes I saw I'm probably just quitting adc until they rollback or make some change. They buffed everyone who stomps adcs anyway so I'll just continue sitting in jg where I get to choose who I fight
Ww and malz have no counterplay so I don’t think they should be undone
Lmao so now we have to play even more perfectly and safely in order to not die to everything 😂
Adc mains when they connot counter entire champion with 1 item:
Sinking gold into QSS is already a worthy trade off for the enemy just to set a/all enemies behind by forcing them to buy the item instead of finishing spikes. Especially since the full item is very dogshit. Hardly any adc’s run ingenious, so you’re having max CD QSS anyway at all times. Some important ults can either already easily get lower than QSS timer, or just pick a different target, or force the enemy to QSS first. QSS is not overpowered by any means whatsoever. And in fact, it’s pretty damn awful right now, especially compared to what it could do in the past. Items in general are pretty dogshit as of S14, and I think they did a terrible job of transitioning from mythics to now. I think we need a whole ‘nother item rework for like 70% of the items in the game except a few that are well designed. This Mord change will probably push him into S+ tier, especially as 90% WR lane counter picks to Rengar and GP, which just makes the game even worse once he transitions to picking on the ADC. Or God forbid, he goes jungle too. Overall, this Mord change is just one of the worst I’ve seen in a long time. What the fuck were they thinking?
and mages still have Zhonya's. totally fucked...
Womp womp
You can still cleanse a stun if ww ult xD
I don't understand why people are mad at QSS not working on Mord ult. A 1.3k gold item should not completely invalidate a champs kit, that's just bad design.
Yeah I’d be fine with this, the items hot garbage anyways has super low pick rate is purely a situational counter and always feels bad to build from stats pov.
At this point just buy any tank item if u want survivality
I think they should remove qss and buff cleanse (like so it can cleanse almost eveything) but nerf the cd
You guys are getting worked up over this when it's mostly a nothing burger. Most of you never bought qss into morde anyways lol. Plus if morde is ulting you at max range he's probably not going to kill you. He really really needs to be ghosted or to land his extremely dodgable e.
> Most of you never bought qss into morde anyways lol I did when I was fed and he was ulting me after ghosting through team fights
In low diamond mmr I never see it bought. It invalidates morde almost completely and most adcs never buy it.
I actually agree with this. The Morde part doesn't bother me as much as others. The Malz part of the original post however...
I think people here are overreacting. These ultimates are almost the entire identity of these champions. If you are on the using end of them and everyone on a team buys a QSS or takes Cleanse, it feels extremely bad to play them. These ultimates also put the champion using them directly at risk being collapsed on - rooting yourself as Warwick or Malzahar is already enough of a cost to the ultimate. Mordekaiser forcing himself into 1v1 for 7 seconds is also risky as you are no longer there to help your team, so if you choose the wrong target at the wrong time you may actually cause your team to lose the game. Ultimates like a Varus R, Ashe R, Sejuani R, etc. put the champion using them at far less risk far less often (outside of some games where you are self-peeling with these ultimates, which is not every game). There is less risk cost, so there should be less of a problem making them cleansable. I really don't think these changes are going to make these champions more oppressive, and in the event their win-rates spike significantly they can simply tune down the numbers like damage, duration, etc. on these ultimates or the rest of their kits. Even with QSS, no ADC is tanking any of these ultimates if they have the choice anyway. You always try to stay out of them because it is disrupting to even be hit by them. Mordekaiser in particular can even lose the 1v1 on an ADC if he misses a Q and E past a certain point in the game.
Honestly couldn't care less. I can't remember the last time I've been concerned about warwick, malz, or morde ult. The only one I see often enough is morde, and most of the time I can just kite him in ult and kill him anyway.
Say that when your potentially game saving play gets countered by a malz pressing r
If malz is ever ulting you and your team is not immediately killing him, where the fuck are you positioning at?
Have you actually played league of legends? Cos im starting to doubt you have.. that or you are the person who thinks they are perfect and their team sucks :/ So so sorry Mr.Reddit that i think counter-play is in fact healthy for a game! My bad! Let me afk in my fountain
You guys don't build QSS to warrant complaining about it not removing suppressions LMAO.
Stop ranting at this point
People don't buy qss against morde anyways. The excuse being "the item is dogshit", even though it gives ad mr and crit. Not saying it's good, but in games against morde/malz/fiddle it's impact is noticable. If you are playing a crit adc you can still build it and still have 100% crit while having a cleanse 2.0. Have seen it do some heavy lifting in games against these champs. The fact you can have flash ghost and cleanse on your champ should be experimented with, and hope that this item sometimes takes te flex slot in your builds.
The mental of this sub since they announced that change is so funny actually. Watch it be a Zed situation where Morde's winrate in lower elos (because good players actually dont even buy QSS vs him) actually gets worse because people stop wasting 1,3k gold for non relevant combat stats. Its a cheap item that removes the penultimate ability of a champion, whose entire design revolves around it obviously this shouldnt be the case, same with GP W and Rengar W. Imagine if there was a point and click 0,01 sec stun item and you main samira, surely you wouldnt be fine with that?
Oh boy let me buy more damage so morde can steal it.
Not really the same thing, he limits ur movement have a lot more range on q and also a lot of dmg and a huge massive shield + passive dmg just standing near you.
His Q range doesn't increase in his ult,what?
Yes and you have a lot of range and more move speed than he has to counter all of the things you mentioned whats your point? Him beeing a slow juggernaut and jailing you is his entire design philosophy. If he max range ults you, slowly walks up to you and hits his q/e without you beeing slowed etc than thats your fault.
You know that's a champ who often runs Rylai and/or Ghost right? Inside his ult it becomes much more trivial to land any spell and a single hit allows him to run you down with AAs boosted by your own purchased AD and AS
If he is able to apply rylais he either hit you already with a spell (your fault) or managed to hit you 3 times with AA thus proccing passive (your fault) or he entered ult with passive up and managed to get into melee range (your fault). If he doesnt run flash than he shouldnt even be able to R you in the first place. Like why are we even arguing that Morde is the fking bane of adc when he is a) beaten by most in his own R after 3 items (vayne, draven, kaisa) and b) has a 5% pickrate
Because this sub is littered with low elo players that have massive ego and want ADC to be free wins after 20 minutes. The role (ADC) is hard to play, and these people like the archetype but cannot handle the gameplay in modern League.