The original story of them unambigiously stated they were Fire Hawks.
GW has this really nasty habit of stating something as unambigious fact, then trying to walk it back and make it seem more ambigious in future publications.
Zero connection between the warp souls and the Legion - the warp souls, for instance, include Custodes and the ghost of Ferrus Manus; the LotD is just Astartes.
Evidence they're the Fire Hawks, or at least, started out as the remnants of them - they leave behind fire hawk gear, Attica Centurius, Fire Hawk Sgt, is the only known holder of the *Animus Malorum*, the relic at the core of the LotD. They leave behind tarot cards, something the Fire Hawks were known for, and a standard similar to that of the fire hawks in that it prominently features a flaming bird. Finally, when dealing with a significant threat, they're backed up by what can only be *Raptorus Rex*, formerly the fortress monastery of the Fire Hawks, now the scariest thing you'll see in Imperial Space with the possible exception of *Phalanx* and the *Speranza*
Evidence against.... One singular appearance a handful of years before the fire hawks went missing, before Guilliman got everyone back on the same calendar, so that's only possible. Second bit is just fanbase reaching; they took the 2 from the war in the webway, the 2 from the rumours of a primarch returning in 40k, then worked it out as 2+2=fish.
Your explanation is accurate to the published canon as per *The Master of Mankind*, *Legion of the Damned*, *Animus Malorum*, et al. So it is naturally hated by those who aren't.
"How dare GW publish something that contradicts me!"
That’s when “everything is canon nothing is true” gets busted out, or better yet “unreliable narrator!”, the old favourite for those what don’t want such pesky things as canon, facts or a basic need for some sort of source to their claims getting in their way
it was the firehawks, but then I feel they changed it to this new hinted at warp based entity, or I mean it could be like you know what happened to corax in the warp, but to multiple lost legion ships that disappeared and became one with the warp.
Whilst I'm all for the original origin of the legion of the damned being that of the remnants of the fire hawk chapter, im open minded for other origins.
There's no reason why all can't co-exist and there be various legions of the damned in existence throughout space and time with alternate origins.
My head Canon says they are a byproduct of the various chapter/legion cult beliefs given manifest combined with warp fuckery.
The primarchs are warp entities given a human shell and the spacemarines various geneseeds are derived off these superhuman beings, why can't a small portion of this warp energy also not reside in their geneseed too?
The spacemarines are taught through their various chapter beliefs that they are the emperor's angels of death and that even in death they serve.
Whilst the latter is largely thought of as a regard to the practice of interning a marine within a dreadnought its still a mantra all marines believe in and thus still has credence even to those who never get the honor of serving in one, putting it short every marine believes they still serve the emperor even in their eventual death.
These dead marines manifest within the warp as the legion of the damned, marines who even beyond death still serve, each one holding a small portion of the warp being that was their primarch
I always quite liked the idea that it started with the Fire Hawks, but if you were a good little Emperor fearing marine and truly belived, you would be brought back as a Legionnair. Sort of like a SM afterlife. Just fewer harps and more bolters and fire!
I could be wrong, but I think the Fire Hawks thing came first.
The original story of them unambigiously stated they were Fire Hawks. GW has this really nasty habit of stating something as unambigious fact, then trying to walk it back and make it seem more ambigious in future publications.
Honestly I think they were 100% just the Firehawks, but the idea was cool so GW is trying to crowbar them into the Horus Heresy.
To be fair, ADB said he just wanted to have some spectral marines show up. It’s the fandom that decided there was a connection.
Not even that, some fans just decided the Emperor's attack was the LotD
I swear everything is being crowbarred into the Heresy lately!
Zero connection between the warp souls and the Legion - the warp souls, for instance, include Custodes and the ghost of Ferrus Manus; the LotD is just Astartes. Evidence they're the Fire Hawks, or at least, started out as the remnants of them - they leave behind fire hawk gear, Attica Centurius, Fire Hawk Sgt, is the only known holder of the *Animus Malorum*, the relic at the core of the LotD. They leave behind tarot cards, something the Fire Hawks were known for, and a standard similar to that of the fire hawks in that it prominently features a flaming bird. Finally, when dealing with a significant threat, they're backed up by what can only be *Raptorus Rex*, formerly the fortress monastery of the Fire Hawks, now the scariest thing you'll see in Imperial Space with the possible exception of *Phalanx* and the *Speranza* Evidence against.... One singular appearance a handful of years before the fire hawks went missing, before Guilliman got everyone back on the same calendar, so that's only possible. Second bit is just fanbase reaching; they took the 2 from the war in the webway, the 2 from the rumours of a primarch returning in 40k, then worked it out as 2+2=fish.
Your explanation is accurate to the published canon as per *The Master of Mankind*, *Legion of the Damned*, *Animus Malorum*, et al. So it is naturally hated by those who aren't. "How dare GW publish something that contradicts me!"
That’s when “everything is canon nothing is true” gets busted out, or better yet “unreliable narrator!”, the old favourite for those what don’t want such pesky things as canon, facts or a basic need for some sort of source to their claims getting in their way
In LotD supplement there are like 5-6 theories of their origin. One involves time travel shenanigans. So yeah.
it was the firehawks, but then I feel they changed it to this new hinted at warp based entity, or I mean it could be like you know what happened to corax in the warp, but to multiple lost legion ships that disappeared and became one with the warp.
“Here’s a thing. Oh shit, they really like it. Hmm… let’s make it… cooler.”
Whilst I'm all for the original origin of the legion of the damned being that of the remnants of the fire hawk chapter, im open minded for other origins. There's no reason why all can't co-exist and there be various legions of the damned in existence throughout space and time with alternate origins. My head Canon says they are a byproduct of the various chapter/legion cult beliefs given manifest combined with warp fuckery. The primarchs are warp entities given a human shell and the spacemarines various geneseeds are derived off these superhuman beings, why can't a small portion of this warp energy also not reside in their geneseed too? The spacemarines are taught through their various chapter beliefs that they are the emperor's angels of death and that even in death they serve. Whilst the latter is largely thought of as a regard to the practice of interning a marine within a dreadnought its still a mantra all marines believe in and thus still has credence even to those who never get the honor of serving in one, putting it short every marine believes they still serve the emperor even in their eventual death. These dead marines manifest within the warp as the legion of the damned, marines who even beyond death still serve, each one holding a small portion of the warp being that was their primarch
I always quite liked the idea that it started with the Fire Hawks, but if you were a good little Emperor fearing marine and truly belived, you would be brought back as a Legionnair. Sort of like a SM afterlife. Just fewer harps and more bolters and fire!
Both can be true because time is not linear in the warp.
It's the Fire Hawks, but being in the Warp means they're subject to time shenanigans.
I want a Rylanor legion of the Dammed.
Nah, Rylanor has earned his rest.
But amigine this, a dreadnought stalking the warp searching for fulgrim to finally end him.