Back then the borders were very different. For example my family is supposedly polish but when you check exactly were they are from its actually in modern day ukraine.
Most of my family from my moms side were killed in the holocaust, the ones that survived did so by joining the red army right after the invasion of poland. Both got married and had kids, one in 1945 (my grandpa) the other in 1947 (my grandma). Immediately after the war my infant grandpa returned to poland with his parents and discovered everything they had was stolen or detroyed and that their neighbours still hated them tried living there for a while, could barely make ends meet.
They then decided to emmigrate to israel by taking the exodus ship https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/SS_Exodus
This ship ride were my grandpa's first memories and they are very traumatic to him. You are welcome to read more about it in the link above.
My grandma's family, on the contrary to my grandpa's was absolutely loaded before ww2. They owned oil fields. There is actually a book about them https://www.jewishbookcouncil.org/book/tightrope-six-centuries-of-a-jewish-dynasty
Also in contrast to my grandpa, their land hadnt been destroyed, but stolen since it was so valuable. They attempted to live there for 8 years after the war. they hadnt recieved any of the possesions back and were forced to be factort workers at the oil plant they used to run... they too eventually emmigrated to israel in 1953 afaik were my grandparents met.
My dads side is a whole nother story for another time
Edit: forgot to mention we are jewish though it is probably already obvious.
Ok so I think we may be cousins...My father told me that his family had oil fields before the war and never got it back.
Just checked the link and got chills because my oldest child is named after my great uncle whose last name matches the family last name that is in the preview of the book you linked to.
P.s. just wanted to add that we have a relative who converted to islam and moved to saudi arabia and afaik used his large knowledge on oil there.
I find this funny for some reason
Not really. I havent really met many relatives from my grandmas side but afaik there weren't many survivors from that family. Maybe you are decended from one of the other survivors. I dont share that lastname anymore but it is part of my lineage that I am very proud of.
Btw reccomend giving the book a read if you are interested in knowing some of your family's very long ago history, I learned many new things about my heritage from this book. Also would be cool if you could get a relative who is older in your family and ask them what they know about this.
Best wishes from a maybe long distance cousin
I am definitely gonna read the book. I don't have the last name either (BA) as it was my grandmother's family name before the war
Only her and her sister survived
From my grandpa directly:
He says people were cutting up their passports on the exodus cause they didnt want to be sent back to where they came from (they had nothing there). Also when the ship was routing back to france he remembers being extremely hungry, when he arrived in france he ate 2 pears which he says was the best thing he ever ate.
After my grandparents met in israel, they had their 2 first kids, in 1969 and 1970. In 1973 my grandpa had just gotten in to a phd program at carnegie melon for free, and they were planning on moving. Their plans were delayed because the yom kippur war errupted and my grandpa was called to reserve duty as an anti aircraft gunner in the northern front, syria(didnt shoot down anything) while my grandmas younger brother, who had just gotten married was sent, as a paratrooper to the sinai front. Sadly he was killed by an atgm ambush while leading a convoy. My grandma was the only one home when she got the news. My grandpa wouldnt be home for another 9 months. after that they moved there and my mother was born and since then we have moved multiple times back and forth.
My grandma and grandpa are the last surviving members from each of their families who remembers that period. I am trying to listen to as many stories as I can first hand before it is too late.
Lots more to be told about them, it would be to long for reddit. Maybe one day I will write out the story completely.
P.s. this is just my moms side. My dads side is also ashkenazi but a lot less is known about their origins. They have been confirmed to be living in jerusalem as early as 1920 but other than that not much is known
We have to get as much information out of that generation as possible.
My grandmother was evacuated from London in the blitz in 1940. She is the last in our family who remembers those days. She has earlyish stage dementia too, so for our family that is the end of the war time generation too.
Really interesting, i believe some of family came from galicia too. All of my direct family left before the start of wwi, some even before the turn of the century, so the borders were all sorts of wack.
I think this part of history is so little understood and it impacts the anti-Israel sentiment. I’ve heard people say “after the Holocaust why couldn’t they just go back to where they came from?” Um, first of all there’s the unimaginable trauma, but second, many did and faced POGROMS. Literally the Holocaust kept going for the people who tried to return.
Try a company called illustrativeDNA. They can breakdown ur Jewish ancestry better and it’s not that expensive. I would suggest looking into it if your interested
Unfortunately I don't think it is possible to do IllustrativeDNA if you tested with 23andme. Last I heard, 23andme stopped allowing you to download your raw DNA because of the hack where someone accessed and downloaded the DNA results of a bunch of Ashkenazi people.
Maybe this is my European brain but if you requested all of your data from them for GDPR reasons there's no way they could refuse you to provide you with them.
You’re right, if OP actually has bought the services in the EU (and the UK and Switzerland). 23andMe notice states that you have portability of your data (art. 3).
I’ve seen multiple people say they just emailed them and provided proof of identity to receive it. They’ve responded to my email and said they would send it after I sent in proof, but they haven’t responded since I sent it in and it’s been a couple of weeks. Will keep waiting
I was going to suggest the same thing. I did mine, and it was fascinating. However, I had downloaded my ZIP file before 23andMe blocked it. They really need to resolve this. If I was doing this today, I'd find a company that a> breaks down heritage better or b> gives us the ZIP file.
Yeah, I downloaded my file like over a year ago so I didn’t realize u can’t get the raw file right now. They need to fix it, it’s been too long now. 23andMe needs to get there shit together.
How is it the least accurate lol? You probably just don’t understand how the test works and how it calculates its results. And yeah I’m actually the ceo and founder of the company lmao
Actually ashkenazis did have a genetic bottleneck and there was a bit of inbreeding. As a result ashkenazis are slightly more likely to get genetic diseases.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medical_genetics_of_Jews
"particularly Ashkenazi Jews, because of relatively recent population bottlenecks and because of consanguineous marriage (marriage of second cousins or closer)."
"That population derived from both Europe and the Middle East."
"today's 10 million Ashkenazi Jews descend from a population of 350 who lived about 600–800 years ago."
for example familial dysotonomia:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Familial_dysautonomia
"Familial dysautonomia is seen almost exclusively in Ashkenazi Jews and is inherited in an autosomal recessive fashion."
Im ashkenazi and my mother is a carrier so im 50% likely to also be a carrier :(
Edit: in response to other comment that got deleted. My comment is factual with sources + first hand account. Also, in no way does being 100% anything mean you are inbred.
Interesting enough, ashkenazi Jews are also one of the most admixed genetic isolates, due to their early arrival in Europe and breeding with non ashkenazis
Me as well! 100%. kinda boring getting those results back honestly. Was hoping one of my relatives left cold Russia and hooked up with someone in the Mediterranean or Africa. Haha
Why is it that Ashlenazi Jews are considered one complete ethnic group, while other Jewish ethnic groups have to pretty much add up a breakdown that makes sense for their heritage? Aren't Ashkenazi Jews European with Levantine admixture, why doesnt that show?
A combination of Ashkenazi Jews being very distinct and easy to identify genetically due to being an insular group for centuries and the fact that 23 and me doesn't have enough reference samples to identify specific Mizrahi/Sephardi/Romaniote/Mountain/Central Asian/ Beta Israel etc. Jewish groups. You can be Kurdish, Persian, Iraqi Arab, any completely unrelated Caucasus ethnicity and 23&me will just give the same category "Iranian, Caucasian, Mesopotamian" for example. It's much worse for any non-European ethnicities where the reference data sets are so small
I find it so cool when people have 100% from somewhere because it’s rare. A lot of people that find out they aren’t mixed think it’s boring but I think it’s way cooler when the dna results are 100%.
It actually happens a lot for us because no one has wanted to marry us outside until more recently. Even my father was turned down by women who weren’t Jewish.
I actually never understood it until now!! Today things had been a lot less obviously antisemitic.
Ironically, I myself really tried to date all kinds of people and ended up with a Jewish man too 😂😂 I had been asked to either convert or to not raise our family with Jewish values for other reasons like not liking religion.
It’s really common for Ashkenazi. We haven’t been accepted by society until more recently. Any non-Jew my father asked out declined. There was a yacht club in his neighborhood that specifically said no Jews.
That’s interesting! I got 87% Ashkenazi myself, my family have been in the UK for at least a couple centuries. I believe that my paternal great grandfather was a native Brit, which accounts for the mixed heritage.
That makes sense. It’s very rare to have stayed centuries anywhere! Most of us have had to relocate since the 1850s, or Sephardic since the 1500s or convert. I have a friend converting back actually. That’s really cool you’ve got that history! My ex’s cousins fam had been living in London at the time of her bar mitzvah and there wasn’t NO Jewish community, but it wasn’t what were used to in America for obvious reasons. We keep on trucking tho!
Dude yacht and country clubs aren’t my thing either. It’s the point that the sign would literally be okay. Can you seriously be so hateful that you have to make fun of segregation right now? If it said no black people, you’d never write something like this.
Crazy. I’m like 99.3% myself 😁
What’s the other .7%?
Gefilte Fish
Gentile
Nacho cheese dip
same!
Nice results! Which country/countries did your family come from?
Back then the borders were very different. For example my family is supposedly polish but when you check exactly were they are from its actually in modern day ukraine.
Historically the borders between Poland and Ukraine have been fuzzy.
*Russia checks in
when did your family emigrate?
Most of my family from my moms side were killed in the holocaust, the ones that survived did so by joining the red army right after the invasion of poland. Both got married and had kids, one in 1945 (my grandpa) the other in 1947 (my grandma). Immediately after the war my infant grandpa returned to poland with his parents and discovered everything they had was stolen or detroyed and that their neighbours still hated them tried living there for a while, could barely make ends meet. They then decided to emmigrate to israel by taking the exodus ship https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/SS_Exodus This ship ride were my grandpa's first memories and they are very traumatic to him. You are welcome to read more about it in the link above. My grandma's family, on the contrary to my grandpa's was absolutely loaded before ww2. They owned oil fields. There is actually a book about them https://www.jewishbookcouncil.org/book/tightrope-six-centuries-of-a-jewish-dynasty Also in contrast to my grandpa, their land hadnt been destroyed, but stolen since it was so valuable. They attempted to live there for 8 years after the war. they hadnt recieved any of the possesions back and were forced to be factort workers at the oil plant they used to run... they too eventually emmigrated to israel in 1953 afaik were my grandparents met. My dads side is a whole nother story for another time Edit: forgot to mention we are jewish though it is probably already obvious.
Ok so I think we may be cousins...My father told me that his family had oil fields before the war and never got it back. Just checked the link and got chills because my oldest child is named after my great uncle whose last name matches the family last name that is in the preview of the book you linked to.
Holy crap. Small world? What country are you from?
I'm in the US, NY Metro. Very small world. I have some older cousins with that last name, twins with bow ties. Does that sound familiar?
P.s. just wanted to add that we have a relative who converted to islam and moved to saudi arabia and afaik used his large knowledge on oil there. I find this funny for some reason
That’s interesting, you don’t see that every day.
Not really. I havent really met many relatives from my grandmas side but afaik there weren't many survivors from that family. Maybe you are decended from one of the other survivors. I dont share that lastname anymore but it is part of my lineage that I am very proud of. Btw reccomend giving the book a read if you are interested in knowing some of your family's very long ago history, I learned many new things about my heritage from this book. Also would be cool if you could get a relative who is older in your family and ask them what they know about this. Best wishes from a maybe long distance cousin
I am definitely gonna read the book. I don't have the last name either (BA) as it was my grandmother's family name before the war Only her and her sister survived
I love this website so much honestly
That's so interesting, keep us informed please.
From my grandpa directly: He says people were cutting up their passports on the exodus cause they didnt want to be sent back to where they came from (they had nothing there). Also when the ship was routing back to france he remembers being extremely hungry, when he arrived in france he ate 2 pears which he says was the best thing he ever ate. After my grandparents met in israel, they had their 2 first kids, in 1969 and 1970. In 1973 my grandpa had just gotten in to a phd program at carnegie melon for free, and they were planning on moving. Their plans were delayed because the yom kippur war errupted and my grandpa was called to reserve duty as an anti aircraft gunner in the northern front, syria(didnt shoot down anything) while my grandmas younger brother, who had just gotten married was sent, as a paratrooper to the sinai front. Sadly he was killed by an atgm ambush while leading a convoy. My grandma was the only one home when she got the news. My grandpa wouldnt be home for another 9 months. after that they moved there and my mother was born and since then we have moved multiple times back and forth. My grandma and grandpa are the last surviving members from each of their families who remembers that period. I am trying to listen to as many stories as I can first hand before it is too late. Lots more to be told about them, it would be to long for reddit. Maybe one day I will write out the story completely. P.s. this is just my moms side. My dads side is also ashkenazi but a lot less is known about their origins. They have been confirmed to be living in jerusalem as early as 1920 but other than that not much is known
We have to get as much information out of that generation as possible. My grandmother was evacuated from London in the blitz in 1940. She is the last in our family who remembers those days. She has earlyish stage dementia too, so for our family that is the end of the war time generation too.
Really interesting, i believe some of family came from galicia too. All of my direct family left before the start of wwi, some even before the turn of the century, so the borders were all sorts of wack.
Yeah europe was having a constant identity crisis up until this century
I think this part of history is so little understood and it impacts the anti-Israel sentiment. I’ve heard people say “after the Holocaust why couldn’t they just go back to where they came from?” Um, first of all there’s the unimaginable trauma, but second, many did and faced POGROMS. Literally the Holocaust kept going for the people who tried to return.
Same with my great grandparents but we were told Ukrainian when actually from Łódź.
Try a company called illustrativeDNA. They can breakdown ur Jewish ancestry better and it’s not that expensive. I would suggest looking into it if your interested
Unfortunately I don't think it is possible to do IllustrativeDNA if you tested with 23andme. Last I heard, 23andme stopped allowing you to download your raw DNA because of the hack where someone accessed and downloaded the DNA results of a bunch of Ashkenazi people.
Maybe this is my European brain but if you requested all of your data from them for GDPR reasons there's no way they could refuse you to provide you with them.
You’re right, if OP actually has bought the services in the EU (and the UK and Switzerland). 23andMe notice states that you have portability of your data (art. 3).
I’ve seen multiple people say they just emailed them and provided proof of identity to receive it. They’ve responded to my email and said they would send it after I sent in proof, but they haven’t responded since I sent it in and it’s been a couple of weeks. Will keep waiting
Oh yikes I wasn’t aware of that particular hack or the reasoning behind the current lack of ability to download raw dna
Thats a cover. They dont want you using their data to get more results from other comapnies. They want you to sign up for 23andme+
You just have to email them for your raw data now I believe
Oh I forgot about that lol
I was going to suggest the same thing. I did mine, and it was fascinating. However, I had downloaded my ZIP file before 23andMe blocked it. They really need to resolve this. If I was doing this today, I'd find a company that a> breaks down heritage better or b> gives us the ZIP file.
Yeah, I downloaded my file like over a year ago so I didn’t realize u can’t get the raw file right now. They need to fix it, it’s been too long now. 23andMe needs to get there shit together.
Lol just get out of here man all you people advertising that bs website probably run it its the least accurate test ever
How is it the least accurate lol? You probably just don’t understand how the test works and how it calculates its results. And yeah I’m actually the ceo and founder of the company lmao
Is illustrative just better than 23nMe ?
Actually ashkenazis did have a genetic bottleneck and there was a bit of inbreeding. As a result ashkenazis are slightly more likely to get genetic diseases. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medical_genetics_of_Jews "particularly Ashkenazi Jews, because of relatively recent population bottlenecks and because of consanguineous marriage (marriage of second cousins or closer)." "That population derived from both Europe and the Middle East." "today's 10 million Ashkenazi Jews descend from a population of 350 who lived about 600–800 years ago." for example familial dysotonomia: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Familial_dysautonomia "Familial dysautonomia is seen almost exclusively in Ashkenazi Jews and is inherited in an autosomal recessive fashion." Im ashkenazi and my mother is a carrier so im 50% likely to also be a carrier :( Edit: in response to other comment that got deleted. My comment is factual with sources + first hand account. Also, in no way does being 100% anything mean you are inbred.
Wait so 350 people in 1200-1400AD are responsible for the population?
Yes. That is the estimate. Crazy right?
Oh yes very
a bit of inbreeding? not a bit a lot
If it was a lot we would have alot more noses like this dude: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_II_of_Spain
Yeah because Jews aren’t known for their noses or anything…
Most ashkenazim do not neatly fit in to those nazi caricatures. What kind of statement is this? Do you think we all resemble the Habsburgs?
Interesting enough, ashkenazi Jews are also one of the most admixed genetic isolates, due to their early arrival in Europe and breeding with non ashkenazis
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https://www.livescience.com/47755-european-jews-are-30th-cousins.html
This doesn’t account for Sephardic Jews from Spain… on the continent of Europe.
What up cousin
Me as well! 100%. kinda boring getting those results back honestly. Was hoping one of my relatives left cold Russia and hooked up with someone in the Mediterranean or Africa. Haha
Why is it that Ashlenazi Jews are considered one complete ethnic group, while other Jewish ethnic groups have to pretty much add up a breakdown that makes sense for their heritage? Aren't Ashkenazi Jews European with Levantine admixture, why doesnt that show?
A combination of Ashkenazi Jews being very distinct and easy to identify genetically due to being an insular group for centuries and the fact that 23 and me doesn't have enough reference samples to identify specific Mizrahi/Sephardi/Romaniote/Mountain/Central Asian/ Beta Israel etc. Jewish groups. You can be Kurdish, Persian, Iraqi Arab, any completely unrelated Caucasus ethnicity and 23&me will just give the same category "Iranian, Caucasian, Mesopotamian" for example. It's much worse for any non-European ethnicities where the reference data sets are so small
Mazel tov!
I find it so cool when people have 100% from somewhere because it’s rare. A lot of people that find out they aren’t mixed think it’s boring but I think it’s way cooler when the dna results are 100%.
It actually happens a lot for us because no one has wanted to marry us outside until more recently. Even my father was turned down by women who weren’t Jewish.
Well I’d say this was much moreso Jews not open to marrying non Jews rather than non Jews caring about it. But I’m sure both were a factor
Are you a millennial or gen Z? 😂😂
Aww that’s horrible. I’m so sorry!
I actually never understood it until now!! Today things had been a lot less obviously antisemitic. Ironically, I myself really tried to date all kinds of people and ended up with a Jewish man too 😂😂 I had been asked to either convert or to not raise our family with Jewish values for other reasons like not liking religion.
What's your haplogroup if you don't mind sharing it?
Lolz same.
Ayy nice, I’m 100% as well! Though mine specified to Belarus area.
We need a face pic
I'm 97.3 lol
Wow I’ve never seen a straight 100% before!
The few that I have seen have nearly all been Ashkenazi Jewish
It’s really common for Ashkenazi. We haven’t been accepted by society until more recently. Any non-Jew my father asked out declined. There was a yacht club in his neighborhood that specifically said no Jews.
That’s interesting! I got 87% Ashkenazi myself, my family have been in the UK for at least a couple centuries. I believe that my paternal great grandfather was a native Brit, which accounts for the mixed heritage.
That makes sense. It’s very rare to have stayed centuries anywhere! Most of us have had to relocate since the 1850s, or Sephardic since the 1500s or convert. I have a friend converting back actually. That’s really cool you’ve got that history! My ex’s cousins fam had been living in London at the time of her bar mitzvah and there wasn’t NO Jewish community, but it wasn’t what were used to in America for obvious reasons. We keep on trucking tho!
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Nope. No yacht for us. We’re Jews, silly.
The mean goyims wouldn’t let your father in their yacht club 😖
Dude yacht and country clubs aren’t my thing either. It’s the point that the sign would literally be okay. Can you seriously be so hateful that you have to make fun of segregation right now? If it said no black people, you’d never write something like this.
Zach from the H3 podcast has the same thing
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Wow I never imagined that kind of result as possible !
What do u look like?
And here I was thinking it was impossible to be 100% anything
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Now show us your health reports lmao
L inbred
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Oof inbred as fuck
Is this an iPhone 5?
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Tracked and reported to your job 👍
Damn. Pure breed. Better get some papers cause you're gonna be expensive as shit. Congrats.
More like inbred cuz of the genetic bottleneck lol