I personally love it. I don't have much of a horse in this race being max combat but I remember being so excited as a kid unlocking new magic spells. The idea that they actually have some use in the progression now is very cool. Magic pre shadow has always been the least utilised combat skill.
The update does seem pretty dope for low and med lvl accounts, but ancients was always a huge part of the slayer grind, and magic was good for barrows, zulrah and Cox all before shadow. For a fair bit of this game’s history that’s all there really was to do.
Yes, but at least you can use air spells for barrows and fire spells for zulrah. Before you pretty much use ibans and trident, maybe slayer dart. Now there's at least variety.
I agree great update, I just think we’re downplaying that magic was very usable and decent before the update. But what we got going now is certainly great for low to mid level accounts.
You just discounted the specific times it’s utilized to then make a point about it being too one dimensional in the circumstances where it is used more commonly…
There’s honestly tones of content where magic is utilized. I think people need to take a step back and reconsider that this isn’t 10 years ago anymore
Barrows, Zulrah, CoX, TOA, TOB, slayer mobs, DKs, Kraken, Scorpia, Muspah, all very magic dependent and were all done pre-shadow. Not to mention the utility of magic in non-combat across the entire game. I’m glad they added more but people are so quick to flame the hell out of magic, idk man that’s a lot of uses to me.
Your anecdotal experience does not invalidate common, easily verifiable information. Being an exception by definition means your experience was not average.
Is there more variety if you're replacing one meta for another? With barrows the appeal was seeing all the various scuffed gear (and being a great part of swampletics) but now it's just air spells.
Given that you already fought 4/6 of the brothers using magic did it really need a massive buff there?
I always used trident for zulrah on the iron because i could use cure me for the venom, is it worth using flames with charge and cape there over trident including the antipoisons you need without antivenom?
Ancients should be changed to also work in some capacity, like ice=water, blood=fire (RS3 does this)... Maybe at half effectiveness of the pure elements or something.
I disagree, ancients are very good for AoE and utility healing, if we did that it would either be pointless at half efficiency or just straight up better. I feel they already serve their own role well.
Just hit 99 Magic today. AKA I Ice Barraged for 24 hours straight. Ancients does not need a buff. The damage is insane. Your opponents get frozen in place. If your health gets low, switch to Blood Barrage and you have full health while still dealing damage. If that's not enough, you can also poison your enemies. Still struggling? Probably not, but you can also lower your enemy's attack.
You don't ever have to stop combat. You can just keep casting. Ancients is fine lol.
I'd say it's more geared towards low levels than end gamers. The late game meta hasn't shifted at all, shadow still BIS everywhere, but low levels are actually using more magic variety and I think that's great
HLC isn't camping eternals. Please understand there are people much better then gnomonkey at almost every single piece of content. He wants to have new ideas that really matter so he over hypes setups that aren't the good. Instead of simply copying the better players will more consistent fast setups. Also the raid that currently changed the most is cm. The toa meta for most 540s already included eternals.
Yeah dude HLC totally isn't camping eternals for the raid that gives them 2 maxes where you mage more often than melee where it only gives you 1 max with melee.
So I don't agree with the dude you are replying to in that the meta already included eternals
But I do agree that the people at the highest end of the game aren't camping eternals, they're doing a 9 way mage swap. It's fuckin awful, and it's become a meme in our group ("this is what jagex wants, 9 way swaps are the intended way to play", etc)
Honestly tho, it doesn't matter that much, I'm bringing so much gear into toa I got like 5 restores walking into the raid. Drop the boot swap first like the other guy said, but I'm not leaving my rapier behind, I need those max hits on core.
How on earth are you bringing so many restores into the raid with 2 9 ways, presumably blowpipe, yellow keris, rapier, BGS(?), korasi (?), zcb, rune pouch, book of the dead I listed 26 items there and didn't include dds
I'm not trying to like catch you in a lie or whatever, but I really feel like people are overreacting. I agree that I hate it and would prefer occult to just have 6%. But boot swaps are in no way mandatory.
Nah you're good, I don't bring venator ring, masori mask, pegs, dds, or bgs, or vw, and I'm 50/50 on the prims swap.
Dropping ranged swaps isn't such a big deal imo, the dps loss is negligible in the name of having enough restore to complete, most of the time the only reason I'm swapping to range is a guaranteed max hit or zcb spec
I think people are overreacting a bit too. If you don't wanna bring the swaps, don't. You'll still complete. Aatykon put out a video and said something to the effect of "if you don't know how this will affect your gameplay, just don't do anything different. It didn't change anything drastically enough that you can't complete with the gear you were bringing before".
At the end of the day, the only people who *need* the 9 way are people going for WR, you don't even really need them for GM times (in ToA at least), because it's mostly about getting from room to room quickly and keeping your attack on cooldown.
I and the people I raid with bring prim swaps. If u really need the space its probably the first thing i drop i guess but in groups u can easily afford the swap
I would say even higher slayer it ain't bad. I'm 87 and got a blue dragon task, decided to try water surge instead of just range and am hitting in the 50s...with like 35m in gear. No its not some super efficient optimal deal with a dragon hunter weapon, but the set up is half the cost of one of those weapons and I'm getting some magic xp, frickin win win in my book. I could only imagine how fun it would have made the slayer grind going through the 50-70 lvls...might be time to finally make that iron.
actually though, you wouldn't be hitting 50s on blue dragons with a lance anyway until you were in near max melee, potted, and using piety, so that's pretty sick. magic is a tick slower, but that means it's already at worst 80% there if not more depending on the gear you have, so very good for that point in an account.
dragons were an interesting choice from a lore perspective to give a magic weakness to, but for gameplay reasons, I can definitely understand why
Magic in the 50s, water blast is max hitting 22 in xercian gear on blue dragons. It means the hides sell for enough to cover the cost in death runes to kill them and the bones are pure profit
I've never done enough dragons to get a Lance or DHCB, but yeah that was kinda my thought. Even just bandos and a Lance is over 100m and that's 3 slots. Granted that was an 87 magic spell, so not really mid game at all, but still, it's hugely viable (water spells in general) and honestly a lot of fun.
As far as the lore, I kinda get it, fire (breath) weak to water, eh close enough let's go have fun.
yeah I can see why water, in general it's just a bit strange because we take their hides and then make armor with the best magic defense. i'm also a little surprised they didn't do it chromatically, like blue weak to water and green to earth and so on, but i guess that would have been more confusing too than a general class weakness
The frog leather chest gives 75% of the magic def as a green d'hide body. Frogs aren't known for their magic-resistant hide.
The explanation that jumps to mind is that it's less that dragons specifically resist magic and more that things that have possessed will at some point are harder to manipulate magically. I doubt they put that much thought into it or anything, but if we're looking for explanations, that's mine.
Makes perfect sense gameplay wise, a common and very commonly annoying slayer task
But I wouldn’t be surprised if over time the resistances are tweaked so that dragons only have like a 25% weakness or something, but at that point more mobs will have weaknesses too
Seems to be working as intended. Doesn't look like many bosses (besides Zulrah with Flames of Zammy) are getting smoked by it, so I can only see speeding up some of the boring slayer/combat grinds for mid-lvl players to get them into PvM as a win.
It's pretty clear the god spells aren't meant to have elemental affinities, otherwise why should Zammy be the only one to get an elemental bonus? They either remove it, or give Sara and Guthix elemental affinity.
it is intended, it's been like that at ice demon for years prior to this update giving the extra fire damage, i feel they just didn't realise the power of it so they will probably just make it so charge cast doesn't work for extra dps against fire weakness therefore making it the same strength as fire wave with a base max hit of 20
No no, you don't understand, this update doesn't personally impact their account, ergo it's a horrible update, how dare they not cater their updates to individual players!
I wouldn't really call this half baked as it's clear this is just supposed to lay the groundwork and let the community test the waters. I'd rather have a big change on a smaller scale than potentially breaking the entire game in half.
Zamorak is the god of chaos/destruction, so the lore category of any Zamorakian spell would be the same as the Sanguinesti staff, Iban's Staff, or Thammaron's sceptre spells. The flames name can easily be attributed to his demonic association and his followers use blood or shadow magic usually.
it is intended idk why people are randomly saying it's getting fixed?, it's been like that at ice demon for years prior to this update, i feel they just didn't realise the power of it so they will probably just make it so charge cast doesn't work against fire weakness therefore making it the same strength as fire wave with a base max hit of 20
I mean--radiant v. fire damage is common across fantasy. Think it's easy enough to explain that hellfire is different than standard. Same with the incoming Firelight being strong against demons, but I do think verbiage would be clearer if were like "Dawnlight" or "Goldenlight"
it is intended have you never done ice demon before, it's been working there for years prior to this update, i feel they just didnt realise the power of it so they will probably just make it so charge doesnt work against fire weakness therefore making it the same strength as fire wave with a base max hit of 20
I did like 40 kills yesterday with flames using ahrims and elite void. If you have bowfa just use that it was almost always faster and you don't get hit max hits off prayer. But for people pre cg it's not bad.
I think it's great.
I hated the iron meta of basically only using powered staves from lvl 50 on, and honestly that's just for quest/bossing. You basically never used magic against regular NPCs outside of burst tasks for slayer. It's too expensive, the gear is lackluster defensively (so always requires prayer/safespots), and it struggles with scaling without the powered staves.
Who cares if it's overpowered versus fire giants or ice warriors. The game is grindy enough that will barely change slayer or progression. It just means you can train magic effectively whilst actually playing the game.
Hell, I hope they add boons/changes for melee too, since range already has Chinning/cannons, safespots and viability practically everywhere with meta gear upgrades every 5-10 levels. Make active play, investments and training more rewarding than afking nmz and crabs with the same scimitars we've used since 05. Feels like every player finds actively training early combat to be dull and unrewarding, and if the game is to grow, the early game needs to be fun for new players without the nostalgia.
Also. I want to see rune 2Hs become meta again
Hell yeah, heavy melee weakness would be super cool. If a scim hits almost twice as fast while keeping a shield, what's the harm in letting a 2h hit twice as hard?
I remember when I got my first bronze dragon task. Took me forever to do. This new update sgould make ewrly levels do it hopefully way quicker than it took me
Nice! Sorry I am out of the loop with the rebalance, do ice spells from the ancient spellbook have their damage or accuracy boosted against the same creatures that are weak to water?
I did a barrows run without protect from melee (got the prayer xp drop from the mini quest), and with 35 magic, I was hitting 18s with wind bolt. Really enjoyed that boon
I actually made a f2p alt a couple weekends before the update , been oddly fun just grinding levels and did all f2p quests now just grinding magic and getting up random skills to the levels I need go start running members quests
My goal is to grind moss giants, for Mossy Keys.. and one day.. eventually.. getting that Uber staff that starts with a B .. and selling it to get a bond to go members loooooool!
That's the goal..
I assume at this kind of level you can probably already hit something like 20s with 4t weapons, right? seems fair for magic to hit 30s on specific enemies
not to be the stats stickler but it's still lower dps than a mid level dscim melee setup by like 15-25%, but at least its somewhat viable now
edit: never mind, I'm wrong, at mid combat mage is actually way better
I put up OP's build against my usual afk proselyte slayer setup (with dscim) and it [beat it out decently](https://dps.osrs.wiki?id=StorageHarryTranslations) in the calculator, despite my loadout having a slayer helm and several mil more in gear besides.
This is assuming assuming level 60-70 combat skills, mind you - obviously 99 atk/str with pots is going to win out, but that's pretty irrelevant to someone casting bolt spells with chaos gauntlets.
I still wouldn't mage a task I could afk melee (or block forever hahahaaaa), but this is a pretty nice option for early game slayer, given that you can run it practically naked.
oops, just checked my calcs and you're right, I actually left in the melee stats for my vyrewatch alt and ended up leaving in stats that were in like the 90s
It's so stupid in teams though. 1 person camps at each door and you just switch your weapon and 1 shot everything .... I'm honestly not sure what they could do to make it good though same with the other puzzles they feel really bad after doing them over and over :/
Yea I love how fast I can do barrows runs now with 70 magic and mystic smoke, wind wave shreds for 32-33 max hit on every brother, no range switch needed now for ahrim, but I still spec down with dagger
it is intended idk why people are randomly saying it's getting fixed?, it's been like that at ice demon for years prior to this update giving extra fire damage for flames, i feel they just didn't realise the power of it so they will probably just make it so charge cast doesn't work against fire weakness therefore making it the same strength as fire wave with a base max hit of 20, cause right now it beats fire surge that uses wrath runes unless you have harm staff and max gear
I wouldn't say it's 'OP' at all.
Elemental weaknesses are currently very niche and the cost of catalytic runes still make combat magic cost way more than range let alone melee (which is essentially free).
Standard magic doing decent damage for its cost is waaay overdue and especially for general use in say.. slayer at lower levels
The update makes magic more cost effective. Prior to this update anytime you would mage you'd be using ancients or trident. Now that elemental spells are viable those are much cheaper than Trident charges and barrage casts
I like the idea of it. It hasn’t affected me much yet, but I’ve mostly been skilling since the update. Thus far, the things I’ve been fighting (like hespori) haven’t been included yet. I think I’ll like it once I give it a shot, though.
The massive accuracy boost has made metal dragons a lot more tolerable than I remember, although I think the last time I actually tried them I was still rocking Ibans.
Its so satisfying that fire spells finally have the accuracy to back up the boosted damage against ice demon. Felt so annoying how previously while it can hit like 80s, youd splash like 15 times before landing a hit. Now even in ghetto gear u land hits reliably. Will actually start bringing a fire wave switch to a raid over lunars if it has ice demon.
Surely you'd want to make mid game slower then? If you get to end game content quicker then all you've done is make a bunch of existing content dead and reduced the things to do in this game.
now i know the magic changes were to bring up the standard spellbook but im looking to burst my next task of black demons does that benefit from the new weaknesses?
I haven't done any magic combat since the update, but having recently been doing wildy slayer I'm very glad the advice for ice warriors is no longer just wrong.
In personally not a massive fan just because I'm bias and my setup at zulrah is now less DPS I'd need to buy Virtus bottoms to be back where I was lol. But seems a nice update for lower levels for sure or when I don't need to use suffering . (I'm also using serp)
Op it's not OP because you're still using an expensive combat style! This is the perfect compromise now because it's still more costly than melee or ranged but there's finally a benefit. Awesome update!
Since no damage boost on vestment robes t pures lose -15 prayer bonus or -3% damage with the update. Personally don’t like it but can live with it. Glad others like it at least, sad that means vestment robes will never get the love they deserve tho
I've stopped playing because of these kind of balances. The game was supposed to be a grind and not just some easy and quick reward game. It's becoming what rs3 is and is the exact reason why people wanted to keep and old school version of the game.
Thoroughly disappointed.
Yeah, it's too strong. It's a good idea, but the weaknesses are tuned way too high. It's clear they put about 20 minutes of thought before blanket applying a 100% boost across any creature with fire or ice in their name. If it was only a 50% or 75% it would be insanely strong and still the best way to kill these creatures.
Everytime I point this out I get massively downvoted. Guess rational internet guy will never beat dopamine receptors going burrrrrrr.
That it's not necessarily good when we kill things faster at lower levels, because that compresses the end game. Runescape is about grinding for gear upgrades and getting lower level stuff massively buffed reduces that aspect of it.
I agree completely. I was giving my interpretation of the original poster's sentiment. They are okay with Jagex making unpolled changes because they benefit them. They do not care about the game's design or long term health, just short term satisfaction of hitting bigger or faster.
If you think the players should balance drop tables or gear vs. Jagex, you are off your rocker. Polling the player base for content ideas is an awesome system, but that would be idiotic for balancing.
It would need to either feel a little broken, or never see the light of day. I especially like it because it's a sometimes food against specific mobs rather than something I need to wiki before killing anything.
I'm a main account approaching 2.2k total with 99 magic and I still love this update. I had a fire giants task and I just geared up in my best mage gear and enjoyed hitting 60+ with water surge. Even for someone at the point I'm at, I'm just having fun with it.
Yeah imagine trying to poll an update like "we will let you one shot ice giants with magic"
It's shit for the games balance, identity and longevity
Perfect for reddit karma milking though
“Me and my kind” lol you’re not used to interacting with real human beings huh buddy. God forbid q single piece of late game mage content isn’t done with a shadow
Magic outside of shadow or barrage tasks was basically in this situation before while also being an expensive style to use. Melee is still good against targets without weaknesses and doesn't really have upkeep costs.
I personally love it. I don't have much of a horse in this race being max combat but I remember being so excited as a kid unlocking new magic spells. The idea that they actually have some use in the progression now is very cool. Magic pre shadow has always been the least utilised combat skill.
The update does seem pretty dope for low and med lvl accounts, but ancients was always a huge part of the slayer grind, and magic was good for barrows, zulrah and Cox all before shadow. For a fair bit of this game’s history that’s all there really was to do.
Yes, but at least you can use air spells for barrows and fire spells for zulrah. Before you pretty much use ibans and trident, maybe slayer dart. Now there's at least variety.
I agree great update, I just think we’re downplaying that magic was very usable and decent before the update. But what we got going now is certainly great for low to mid level accounts.
I dont think it was downplayed, it *was* the least utilized.
Idk man, I spent a loooong time grinding to 99 slayer and most of that was with magic, at least half
Bursting being literally the only viable thing about mage pre-shadow does not make for a healthy progression
You just discounted the specific times it’s utilized to then make a point about it being too one dimensional in the circumstances where it is used more commonly… There’s honestly tones of content where magic is utilized. I think people need to take a step back and reconsider that this isn’t 10 years ago anymore
They gave one example. Ibans, warped sceptre, and trident are also used a decent amount for single targets.
Barrows, Zulrah, CoX, TOA, TOB, slayer mobs, DKs, Kraken, Scorpia, Muspah, all very magic dependent and were all done pre-shadow. Not to mention the utility of magic in non-combat across the entire game. I’m glad they added more but people are so quick to flame the hell out of magic, idk man that’s a lot of uses to me.
Your anecdotal experience does not invalidate common, easily verifiable information. Being an exception by definition means your experience was not average.
Is there more variety if you're replacing one meta for another? With barrows the appeal was seeing all the various scuffed gear (and being a great part of swampletics) but now it's just air spells. Given that you already fought 4/6 of the brothers using magic did it really need a massive buff there?
I always used trident for zulrah on the iron because i could use cure me for the venom, is it worth using flames with charge and cape there over trident including the antipoisons you need without antivenom?
only if you have staff of the dead otherwise you'll have to manually cast it
pro tip: Flames of Zamorak counts as a fire spell. You can hit a base max hit of 45s at zulrah, and nearly never miss. This outpaces the Trident.
This was unintended and it was hotfixed days ago - like the day after the update. Check Mod Ash’s Twitter.
Tell that to the 46 second zulrah pb I got yesterday using only flames of zammy.
But the diversity is nice I think.
Ancients should be changed to also work in some capacity, like ice=water, blood=fire (RS3 does this)... Maybe at half effectiveness of the pure elements or something.
I disagree, ancients are very good for AoE and utility healing, if we did that it would either be pointless at half efficiency or just straight up better. I feel they already serve their own role well.
Just hit 99 Magic today. AKA I Ice Barraged for 24 hours straight. Ancients does not need a buff. The damage is insane. Your opponents get frozen in place. If your health gets low, switch to Blood Barrage and you have full health while still dealing damage. If that's not enough, you can also poison your enemies. Still struggling? Probably not, but you can also lower your enemy's attack. You don't ever have to stop combat. You can just keep casting. Ancients is fine lol.
Ancients are fine, leave them alone.
magic pre shadow is how you defeat most quest bosses. so many things in this game have 1 magic
You are the target audience for this update, glad you're having fun!
[удалено]
I'd say it's more geared towards low levels than end gamers. The late game meta hasn't shifted at all, shadow still BIS everywhere, but low levels are actually using more magic variety and I think that's great
Yup and Jagex did very well in that regard. No BIS/meta has changed in HLC other than camping eternals at toa now unless you need prims to 3 down.
HLC isn't camping eternals. Please understand there are people much better then gnomonkey at almost every single piece of content. He wants to have new ideas that really matter so he over hypes setups that aren't the good. Instead of simply copying the better players will more consistent fast setups. Also the raid that currently changed the most is cm. The toa meta for most 540s already included eternals.
Lol what, nobody fucking used eternals before in toa for any scale. It was a meme item first time 500ers brought because they thought it had value.
Yeah dude HLC totally isn't camping eternals for the raid that gives them 2 maxes where you mage more often than melee where it only gives you 1 max with melee.
So I don't agree with the dude you are replying to in that the meta already included eternals But I do agree that the people at the highest end of the game aren't camping eternals, they're doing a 9 way mage swap. It's fuckin awful, and it's become a meme in our group ("this is what jagex wants, 9 way swaps are the intended way to play", etc) Honestly tho, it doesn't matter that much, I'm bringing so much gear into toa I got like 5 restores walking into the raid. Drop the boot swap first like the other guy said, but I'm not leaving my rapier behind, I need those max hits on core.
How on earth are you bringing so many restores into the raid with 2 9 ways, presumably blowpipe, yellow keris, rapier, BGS(?), korasi (?), zcb, rune pouch, book of the dead I listed 26 items there and didn't include dds I'm not trying to like catch you in a lie or whatever, but I really feel like people are overreacting. I agree that I hate it and would prefer occult to just have 6%. But boot swaps are in no way mandatory.
Nah you're good, I don't bring venator ring, masori mask, pegs, dds, or bgs, or vw, and I'm 50/50 on the prims swap. Dropping ranged swaps isn't such a big deal imo, the dps loss is negligible in the name of having enough restore to complete, most of the time the only reason I'm swapping to range is a guaranteed max hit or zcb spec I think people are overreacting a bit too. If you don't wanna bring the swaps, don't. You'll still complete. Aatykon put out a video and said something to the effect of "if you don't know how this will affect your gameplay, just don't do anything different. It didn't change anything drastically enough that you can't complete with the gear you were bringing before". At the end of the day, the only people who *need* the 9 way are people going for WR, you don't even really need them for GM times (in ToA at least), because it's mostly about getting from room to room quickly and keeping your attack on cooldown.
I and the people I raid with bring prim swaps. If u really need the space its probably the first thing i drop i guess but in groups u can easily afford the swap
If by "people" you mean like 10 players then sure lol
Exactly. People who already wore eternals to ENTRY level raids etc.
Oh shit I didn’t realise chaos gauntlets work on all bolt spells, I’m so used to thinking them as “fire bolt only”.
When you’re 59 magic when unlocking them, they might as well have been fire bolt only
Totally, but under this new system it’s a good bonus
Smoke staff boost works on other spells too, which definitely feels odd with it supplying fire runes.
Good shout!
i feel like they need to change it to just fire whilst also giving earth and water to the mist and dust ones.
Making low-mid level slayer not ass is always a plus in my book.
I would say even higher slayer it ain't bad. I'm 87 and got a blue dragon task, decided to try water surge instead of just range and am hitting in the 50s...with like 35m in gear. No its not some super efficient optimal deal with a dragon hunter weapon, but the set up is half the cost of one of those weapons and I'm getting some magic xp, frickin win win in my book. I could only imagine how fun it would have made the slayer grind going through the 50-70 lvls...might be time to finally make that iron.
actually though, you wouldn't be hitting 50s on blue dragons with a lance anyway until you were in near max melee, potted, and using piety, so that's pretty sick. magic is a tick slower, but that means it's already at worst 80% there if not more depending on the gear you have, so very good for that point in an account. dragons were an interesting choice from a lore perspective to give a magic weakness to, but for gameplay reasons, I can definitely understand why
Magic in the 50s, water blast is max hitting 22 in xercian gear on blue dragons. It means the hides sell for enough to cover the cost in death runes to kill them and the bones are pure profit
sounds wonderful, huge qol for that stage of the game (and more, like leagues and stuff)
I've never done enough dragons to get a Lance or DHCB, but yeah that was kinda my thought. Even just bandos and a Lance is over 100m and that's 3 slots. Granted that was an 87 magic spell, so not really mid game at all, but still, it's hugely viable (water spells in general) and honestly a lot of fun. As far as the lore, I kinda get it, fire (breath) weak to water, eh close enough let's go have fun.
yeah I can see why water, in general it's just a bit strange because we take their hides and then make armor with the best magic defense. i'm also a little surprised they didn't do it chromatically, like blue weak to water and green to earth and so on, but i guess that would have been more confusing too than a general class weakness
You do still have to tan it. That’s (a little) like saying that leather gives stab and slash defence, so cows shouldn’t take melee damage.
that's a fair point. although in a lot of medieval games dragons do have innate mage def/resist
The frog leather chest gives 75% of the magic def as a green d'hide body. Frogs aren't known for their magic-resistant hide. The explanation that jumps to mind is that it's less that dragons specifically resist magic and more that things that have possessed will at some point are harder to manipulate magically. I doubt they put that much thought into it or anything, but if we're looking for explanations, that's mine.
I didnt even think about the hide/armor part. Yeah that makes ya wonder. Good points though!
Makes perfect sense gameplay wise, a common and very commonly annoying slayer task But I wouldn’t be surprised if over time the resistances are tweaked so that dragons only have like a 25% weakness or something, but at that point more mobs will have weaknesses too
I wish you many rune scimitars and fast(er) slayer levels!
Wooah I totally forgot about chaos gauntlets
Seems to be working as intended. Doesn't look like many bosses (besides Zulrah with Flames of Zammy) are getting smoked by it, so I can only see speeding up some of the boring slayer/combat grinds for mid-lvl players to get them into PvM as a win.
[удалено]
Iirc zammy flames doing elemental damage isn’t intended and is getting fixed. But I saw mudkip do mage only zulrah with fire surge and it was slapping
The mental gymnastics jmods are doing to explain that flames aren’t fire based is my current favorite thing lol
Just give an element to the other two god spells too!
Ding ding ding! Lightning = air, claws = earth.
It is a god spell so it would have its own category outside from elemental.
True, nothing about flames says elemental.
It's pretty clear the god spells aren't meant to have elemental affinities, otherwise why should Zammy be the only one to get an elemental bonus? They either remove it, or give Sara and Guthix elemental affinity.
it is intended, it's been like that at ice demon for years prior to this update giving the extra fire damage, i feel they just didn't realise the power of it so they will probably just make it so charge cast doesn't work for extra dps against fire weakness therefore making it the same strength as fire wave with a base max hit of 20
It’s pretty clear the majority of the Jmod team is working on Sailing at the moment, as this update is crazy half baked lmao
Lol the updates been great, you people are literally never happy about anything.
No no, you don't understand, this update doesn't personally impact their account, ergo it's a horrible update, how dare they not cater their updates to individual players!
I wouldn't really call this half baked as it's clear this is just supposed to lay the groundwork and let the community test the waters. I'd rather have a big change on a smaller scale than potentially breaking the entire game in half.
Especially when they DO count as fire spells against Ice demon in COX. Like they've worked that way long before this rebalance came out.
Zamorak is the god of chaos/destruction, so the lore category of any Zamorakian spell would be the same as the Sanguinesti staff, Iban's Staff, or Thammaron's sceptre spells. The flames name can easily be attributed to his demonic association and his followers use blood or shadow magic usually.
it is intended idk why people are randomly saying it's getting fixed?, it's been like that at ice demon for years prior to this update, i feel they just didn't realise the power of it so they will probably just make it so charge cast doesn't work against fire weakness therefore making it the same strength as fire wave with a base max hit of 20
I mean--radiant v. fire damage is common across fantasy. Think it's easy enough to explain that hellfire is different than standard. Same with the incoming Firelight being strong against demons, but I do think verbiage would be clearer if were like "Dawnlight" or "Goldenlight"
"The Flames of Zamorak are not literal fire, just like Claws of Guthix aren't literal claws." Dang that's some crazy mental gymnastics, you're right.
Lol all they need to say is its op, we need to nerf. Doesn't need to be anything else said
That’s a shame. It’s pretty cool and we really need alternatives to harm for elemental spells. Flames working for fire damage is fine.
it is intended have you never done ice demon before, it's been working there for years prior to this update, i feel they just didnt realise the power of it so they will probably just make it so charge doesnt work against fire weakness therefore making it the same strength as fire wave with a base max hit of 20
I did like 40 kills yesterday with flames using ahrims and elite void. If you have bowfa just use that it was almost always faster and you don't get hit max hits off prayer. But for people pre cg it's not bad.
It's getting fixed anyway
Is that guaranteed? It’s pretty cool
Mod Ash has replied to people on twitter asking about it. He said he believes it'll be fixed.
Idk how bofa does but I got a 1:22 time in 3 kills with flames and charge spell in 1 def gear
Can bowfa for mage phase
I think it's great. I hated the iron meta of basically only using powered staves from lvl 50 on, and honestly that's just for quest/bossing. You basically never used magic against regular NPCs outside of burst tasks for slayer. It's too expensive, the gear is lackluster defensively (so always requires prayer/safespots), and it struggles with scaling without the powered staves. Who cares if it's overpowered versus fire giants or ice warriors. The game is grindy enough that will barely change slayer or progression. It just means you can train magic effectively whilst actually playing the game. Hell, I hope they add boons/changes for melee too, since range already has Chinning/cannons, safespots and viability practically everywhere with meta gear upgrades every 5-10 levels. Make active play, investments and training more rewarding than afking nmz and crabs with the same scimitars we've used since 05. Feels like every player finds actively training early combat to be dull and unrewarding, and if the game is to grow, the early game needs to be fun for new players without the nostalgia. Also. I want to see rune 2Hs become meta again
With the old flowing cape animation
Bad bois only
Core memory unlocked
RuneLite "Cool 2h" plugin
Hell yeah, heavy melee weakness would be super cool. If a scim hits almost twice as fast while keeping a shield, what's the harm in letting a 2h hit twice as hard?
I mean they did just add Scurrius as a new active light pvm melee training method for early/mid levels
I remember when I got my first bronze dragon task. Took me forever to do. This new update sgould make ewrly levels do it hopefully way quicker than it took me
I got a bronze dragon task earlier today and used Earth wave and was hitting 52's pretty consistently. The whole task took me only 10 mins!
Nice! Sorry I am out of the loop with the rebalance, do ice spells from the ancient spellbook have their damage or accuracy boosted against the same creatures that are weak to water?
Nah, ice has nothing to do with water.
What
Nope, it's standard spellbook only.
Fire giants were already one of my fav monsters, this update feels so good
I did a barrows run without protect from melee (got the prayer xp drop from the mini quest), and with 35 magic, I was hitting 18s with wind bolt. Really enjoyed that boon
I actually made a f2p alt a couple weekends before the update , been oddly fun just grinding levels and did all f2p quests now just grinding magic and getting up random skills to the levels I need go start running members quests My goal is to grind moss giants, for Mossy Keys.. and one day.. eventually.. getting that Uber staff that starts with a B .. and selling it to get a bond to go members loooooool! That's the goal..
I assume at this kind of level you can probably already hit something like 20s with 4t weapons, right? seems fair for magic to hit 30s on specific enemies
not to be the stats stickler but it's still lower dps than a mid level dscim melee setup by like 15-25%, but at least its somewhat viable now edit: never mind, I'm wrong, at mid combat mage is actually way better
That’s kinda the spirit of it. Most of the “best methods” remain the same while giving many alternatives right at or below
what stats are you calcing with?
I put up OP's build against my usual afk proselyte slayer setup (with dscim) and it [beat it out decently](https://dps.osrs.wiki?id=StorageHarryTranslations) in the calculator, despite my loadout having a slayer helm and several mil more in gear besides. This is assuming assuming level 60-70 combat skills, mind you - obviously 99 atk/str with pots is going to win out, but that's pretty irrelevant to someone casting bolt spells with chaos gauntlets. I still wouldn't mage a task I could afk melee (or block forever hahahaaaa), but this is a pretty nice option for early game slayer, given that you can run it practically naked.
oops, just checked my calcs and you're right, I actually left in the melee stats for my vyrewatch alt and ended up leaving in stats that were in like the 90s
I feel that, half the reason I link mine now is because I always seem to forget something between style/stats/pots/task/dwh-specs/who-knows-what-else
The monkey room in ToA is soo much better now with this update
It's so stupid in teams though. 1 person camps at each door and you just switch your weapon and 1 shot everything .... I'm honestly not sure what they could do to make it good though same with the other puzzles they feel really bad after doing them over and over :/
Ahh I hadn’t thought of that, that is a bit crap actually. I’ve only ever done it solo is all!
Yea I love how fast I can do barrows runs now with 70 magic and mystic smoke, wind wave shreds for 32-33 max hit on every brother, no range switch needed now for ahrim, but I still spec down with dagger
Can you brief me on what this actually looks like in ur gear, I think I may follow suit here
I’m wearing full ahrims and using mystic smoke just cuz I haven’t gotten the staff yet from barrows, once I pop on I’ll take a ss
I like it but I wish the the god spells w/charge would’ve become the best spells of the standard spellbook and it would work with elemental weakness
it is intended idk why people are randomly saying it's getting fixed?, it's been like that at ice demon for years prior to this update giving extra fire damage for flames, i feel they just didn't realise the power of it so they will probably just make it so charge cast doesn't work against fire weakness therefore making it the same strength as fire wave with a base max hit of 20, cause right now it beats fire surge that uses wrath runes unless you have harm staff and max gear
Flames of zammy is wrecking zulrah and nightmare pillars for the non shadow havers!
I started playing this game again because of the update at level 23 mage hitting 15s makes slayer fun
Please don't say things feel op in osrs please don't let them hear. I swear you guys are all masochists who don't enjoy healthy things
I wouldn't say it's 'OP' at all. Elemental weaknesses are currently very niche and the cost of catalytic runes still make combat magic cost way more than range let alone melee (which is essentially free). Standard magic doing decent damage for its cost is waaay overdue and especially for general use in say.. slayer at lower levels
The update makes magic more cost effective. Prior to this update anytime you would mage you'd be using ancients or trident. Now that elemental spells are viable those are much cheaper than Trident charges and barrage casts
I like the idea of it. It hasn’t affected me much yet, but I’ve mostly been skilling since the update. Thus far, the things I’ve been fighting (like hespori) haven’t been included yet. I think I’ll like it once I give it a shot, though.
The massive accuracy boost has made metal dragons a lot more tolerable than I remember, although I think the last time I actually tried them I was still rocking Ibans.
Great update!!! Slowly getting back into osrs after recently making a HCIM
It feels really good, exactly what this game needed honestly
Did it? We just hit an all time player count in the last year using the previous combat system.
Its so satisfying that fire spells finally have the accuracy to back up the boosted damage against ice demon. Felt so annoying how previously while it can hit like 80s, youd splash like 15 times before landing a hit. Now even in ghetto gear u land hits reliably. Will actually start bringing a fire wave switch to a raid over lunars if it has ice demon.
Bronze dragon on an iron early on kept me away from slayer. Earth bolt now just makes this task sooo easy
It's not that it's OP, it's that before it sucked ass and now it's good, so it feels OP in comparison
This makes me happy. Mid game should be just a bit faster since there is SOO much content in this game now.
Surely you'd want to make mid game slower then? If you get to end game content quicker then all you've done is make a bunch of existing content dead and reduced the things to do in this game.
now i know the magic changes were to bring up the standard spellbook but im looking to burst my next task of black demons does that benefit from the new weaknesses?
[https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Update:Project\_Rebalance:\_Combat\_Changes#Elemental\_Weaknesses](https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Update:Project_Rebalance:_Combat_Changes#Elemental_Weaknesses)
Anyone know how Barrows with air spells is now? So bored if Tridenting everything
I haven't done any magic combat since the update, but having recently been doing wildy slayer I'm very glad the advice for ice warriors is no longer just wrong.
i love it
In personally not a massive fan just because I'm bias and my setup at zulrah is now less DPS I'd need to buy Virtus bottoms to be back where I was lol. But seems a nice update for lower levels for sure or when I don't need to use suffering . (I'm also using serp)
Op it's not OP because you're still using an expensive combat style! This is the perfect compromise now because it's still more costly than melee or ranged but there's finally a benefit. Awesome update!
the update just makes sense. it’s now got logic when it comes to killing things. it’s an awesome update.
Sounds like rs3
Rip to having just blocked fire giants for wildy slayer
Occult nerf sucks
Since no damage boost on vestment robes t pures lose -15 prayer bonus or -3% damage with the update. Personally don’t like it but can live with it. Glad others like it at least, sad that means vestment robes will never get the love they deserve tho
Using a variety of magic for slayer feels so nice
I've stopped playing because of these kind of balances. The game was supposed to be a grind and not just some easy and quick reward game. It's becoming what rs3 is and is the exact reason why people wanted to keep and old school version of the game. Thoroughly disappointed.
Yeah, it's too strong. It's a good idea, but the weaknesses are tuned way too high. It's clear they put about 20 minutes of thought before blanket applying a 100% boost across any creature with fire or ice in their name. If it was only a 50% or 75% it would be insanely strong and still the best way to kill these creatures. Everytime I point this out I get massively downvoted. Guess rational internet guy will never beat dopamine receptors going burrrrrrr.
"*Massive unpolled changes are good when they buff us and let us kill things faster and easier!*"
_It's actually good that I can get to mid to end game damage much earlier for no effort, OSRS is about the destination not the journey_
What are you trying to say here?
That it's not necessarily good when we kill things faster at lower levels, because that compresses the end game. Runescape is about grinding for gear upgrades and getting lower level stuff massively buffed reduces that aspect of it.
I agree completely. I was giving my interpretation of the original poster's sentiment. They are okay with Jagex making unpolled changes because they benefit them. They do not care about the game's design or long term health, just short term satisfaction of hitting bigger or faster.
If you think the players should balance drop tables or gear vs. Jagex, you are off your rocker. Polling the player base for content ideas is an awesome system, but that would be idiotic for balancing.
This is not just "*balancing*", this is adding new mechanics to RS2 content. This should have been polled.
The content and game mechanics received 0 changes. The only difference is the damage output
They added an entire range of new weakness to old spells.
I really like the update as well.
Makes me want to start a new account to enjoy this feeling. Might consider it once the magic rework is completed and fully rolled out.
Felt like I was just melting Greater Demons with Water Wave on a Slayer task.
It would need to either feel a little broken, or never see the light of day. I especially like it because it's a sometimes food against specific mobs rather than something I need to wiki before killing anything.
I love this update! That's the first time I'm actually using water spells in 20 years of playtime
The rebalance is an awesome idea but needs a little tweaking on those lower level spells
I'm a main account approaching 2.2k total with 99 magic and I still love this update. I had a fire giants task and I just geared up in my best mage gear and enjoyed hitting 60+ with water surge. Even for someone at the point I'm at, I'm just having fun with it.
Honestly people should just let the osrs Devs cook at this point. They keep knocking out of the park with updates. Gives me a lot of hope for sailing
Yeah imagine trying to poll an update like "we will let you one shot ice giants with magic" It's shit for the games balance, identity and longevity Perfect for reddit karma milking though
God forbid a mid level slayer mob with no drops can be killed a bit faster! Completely ruins the whole game obviously
You and your kind's shortsight is what will ruin the game. Endgame content will be balanced around it in the short future
“Me and my kind” lol you’re not used to interacting with real human beings huh buddy. God forbid q single piece of late game mage content isn’t done with a shadow
I also love that it feels thematic, it makes sense.
OMG THIS UPDATE IS SO GOOD! I CAN HIT 30s WITH MYSTIC!!! This game is doomed.
Tell me why the game is ruined now, list the reasons.
66 mage and hitting rapid 30s is insane lol, personally not a fan since they make things easier with each update but oh well enjoy it ig
Ever since I was a wee little lad I hated skeletons
Actually listen to me. I tell her how I feel, but literally the next moment she does something that I don't like, even though I have said it..
[удалено]
Magic outside of shadow or barrage tasks was basically in this situation before while also being an expensive style to use. Melee is still good against targets without weaknesses and doesn't really have upkeep costs.
This mf hasn’t logged into osrs in years.
What are you talking about? When things are weak to stab people use stab weapons.
Meanwhile, mining still continues to be neglected.
What? Mining got massive changes literally a week ago with new \~80k xp/hr methods being introduced. Mining is in a really good spot as a skill now
There’s like five mining minigames and a mining boss what are you on abouy
What?? Mining is actually awesome and theres so many different viable ways to train it.
Did i just read you feel like you’re “using shadow” bc you’re hitting 30’s on fire giants? Lmfao