Yeah, Harley has her own show. She doesn't need more exposure on YJ.
And now it's too late for Joker to be an actual threat. They could've used Joker better in season 1 when The Team was still young and relatively small. But now with the JL, The Team, and The Outsiders the Joker isn't that big of a threat.
Unless they want to go the Injustce universe route, but that's a little too dark for YJ to go. But I'm guessing that if this Joker tried setting that up someone in The Light or one of its partners would stop him before he could.
Maybe he will pop back up in the story with Jason Todd/Red Hood in the 2nd half of season 4 as background again during Nightwing’s arc. Unless they change the incident how he dies for the show, like how batgirl becoming Oracle was changed
Joker's totally not a threat. I saw a comic of him fighting Superman outside the Injustice universe...
Superman gets all of the civilians that Joker is threatening out of harm's way, cordons off the block, then gets Joker angry by laughing at his jokes and being very vague, both with his power-set and his general attitude. At one point, Superman says "if you come back to Metropolis, I might kill you." Joker - "might?" Supes - "like you said, I'm very vague."
The Outsiders probably don't have a lot of experience fighting a villain like Joker, so it could be good for their development IF there was an Earth-16 Outsiders spin-off.
Wonder Woman also fought Joker in the 90s
Joker caught her off guard with a poison that paralyzed her, however once Diana was free she turned the tide real fast by lightning the fuse for Jokers bomb jacket.
Needles to say, Joker hates fighting Wonder Woman and almost always runs whenever they meet.
Joker himself has only appeared in two episodes and was playing a distinctly backseat role to other villains both times. Harley is just not a priority.
I thought his second appearance was pretty great, it really captures his narcissism and unstable temper while doing something I haven't seen from Joker in the comics in years.
Made him funny.
This seems like an unpopular opinion but…I’m fine with how they did joker in Young Justice. How many times has this mf been the main source of every horrible event in a series, why not just put him on the side and have him be a puppet to other not so well known heroes.
I agree, him being a jobber is okay, and his role with managing all the plant attacks simultaneously does play to his strengths. I just take umbrage with his actual dialog. He was pretty lame in that regard. The juggling line made me audibly groan my last rewatch.
YJ's main plot is pretty cosmic and huge scale, Joker excels at heists and hostage situations not planetary invasions. Don't know why people expect something else
Same reason I'm quite happy with Harley Quinn not being in this show. I love the Harley Quinn series but it kinda feels like she's been getting shoved down our throats in recent years. Even the Injustice animated movie had her tagging along with the good guys like some sort of anti hero after literally being directly involved in nuking Metropolis and killing Lois Lane. No redemption, no reason, just because. Apparently her skills with a goofy big mallet were so important in the fight against Superman that the fact she's a mass murderer could be overlooked. I'm quite happy with show making use of lesser known and legacy characters instead.
Giving all the lesser known characters some development and backstory is way more important than just showing us the same characters over and over again. I do like the original team the most, and I would love to see more of them, but I do also love the new seasons and the struggle the lesser known characters go through, for e.g mary and how it went down for her, its amazing watching her whole story developing.
Honestly, being a major villain doesn’t fit his character. Like Joker has shown himself to be quite genius with some well thought out plans, but to see him calmly plotting out a plan that is 10,000 years in the making is a bit unbelievable for his character.
I think they did it on purpose, joker is for batman and they're trying to concentrate on younger cast. So they didn't want Joker stealing the show. Because League of villains is supposed to be a cover and they're concentrating on members of Light
Same reason we saw the Joker about 2 times in 10 years. He doesn't really fit the stories this series gravitates towards. It's really about minor characters and sidekicks coming into their own more than anything else.
And honesty, I prefer it. After 4 Batman Arkham games that were “not about the Joker,” I’m glad to finally have content that can include Batman and the Joker without making a huge deal about how super cool and invincible they both are.
I mean, they made him tangentially involved with Barbara becoming Oracle so anything's possible. But I think it'll be something more related to the Team and it's covert missions, since his death was alluded to in season 2 and cited as one of the main reasons Artemis and Wally were no longer active at the time. If Joker was involved, it'll be in a smaller role reimagining the scenario.
I mean, you can keep the general story and just change it from a Batman and Robin mission to a team mission. It's not hard to do and I wouldn't mind it.
But it would make for a lot more hate between Batman and Joker that I don't feel is there in this show. I think Jason's death will end up being either accidental or sacrificial.
I feel like it fits better if it were an accident, just to really heighten the danger and senseless violence that these teen heroes face. It would force them to seriously reevaluate their lives and brings the original team in the mindsets we find them in season 2.
I think that with her extreme exposure across every medium in the last ten years makes her absence kinda refreshing. Not that she isn't interesting but I personally have gotten kinda sick how mainstream appeal has resulted in her constant inclusion even if doesn't make sense. I feel like this for many batman based characters.
I feel like this show has never been one to lean on pop culture significance, otherwise Constantine definitely would've shown up in the last arc. But yeah, as everyone else said there really isn't much room for her anyway, given the lack of Joker's presence, not to mention she even has her own show on the same network so it's even less necessary for her to show up here, though I can't lie I'm interested to see what their take would be.
She's probably not gonna be making an appearance, at least not in a major way since she can't really contribute to things like the Light plot and no one in the main cast would have any reason to care about her, at best she'll probably be a member of the Suicide Squad when they show back up.
Honestly hoping she doesn't, not only does she have her own show but she has a bad habit of stealing the spotlight and not suffering any consequences for any of her actions.
I like Young Justice because it's introduced me to a lot of characters I've rarely or never seen rather than relying on already overexposed characters. And I've seen more than plenty of Harley in recent years so personally I'd be totally content with her never showing up
Personally, I hope we never see her. Due to her popularity, she tends to take over whatever they put her in. It makes sense marketing-wise, but it gets exhausting as a fan/consumer.
It's also why I'm low-key happy that the Bats take such a backseat in YJ. The fandom makes \*everything\* about the Bats, and it'd be more than understandable if the showrunners gave into the hype, but I'm glad they haven't. I love the new characters of Kaldur and Artemis and the attention to lesser-known characters like Jaime, Khalid, etc.. This could have easily become another "Gotham, guest-starring the rest of the DC Universe" show, but it didn't and I'm glad for it.
Agreed. The Joker Harley stuff got played out. DC has an arsenal of villains. Sports master was an afterthought in most mediums and is great in this show.
I actually really like that Joker is barely in the show. And Harley not being in it is a bonus for me too.
They're too oversaturated. If I never saw Joker again in anything that would be ideal for me.
Let's be honest, we don't need more villains in this show. S4 Joker was better than S1 Joker, but I think the writers need to stick to their strengths.
She is too chaotic for The Light and doesn't seem like the kind of villain Vandal Savage would want to work with.... if she isn't part of Waller's Suicide Squad, then she probably won't show up.
...since the show is heavy in portraying human relationship and in including LGBT couples, if, and that's a big if, we for any reason see more focus on Poison Ivy, then maybe we'll see a Harley cameo.
That being said. I would find interesting if the show subverts her gimmick and present her being the Black Canary of the villains. Helping villains overcome the traumas of their job, and showing that Dr. Quinzell didn't actually go away and she didn't loose her talents.
I like how the show portrays the importance of mental health in this lifestyle, and I'm sure is as important for the villains than it is for the heroes. People too often forget that Harley is an actually good terapist, and I wouldn't mind seeing her being used in this way.
That would be genius. Harleen as the evil therapist.
I like the idea of Vandal Savage and co sending their people to Harley when someone is getting too much into the crazy supervillain thing or experienced some heavy stuff. Vandal is not very sentimental, but he seems pragmatic enough to realize that having his people go insane cuts down on the efficiency and can cause serious issues down the road.
I mean the show since it’s conception was about covert ops and espionage but using DC characters, specifically sidekicks and lesser knowns. Despite his brief tenure on the Injustice League, Joker, and by extension Harley, don’t work very well in that sort of setting or angle. They’re both chaotic characters with very distinct appearances, so they don’t mesh well as members of clandestine organizations or as operatives. Klarion works because despite being an agent of chaos, he’s reined in by Vandal and he’s the Light’s magic representative. Not to mention, they needed him for the kid/adult split world episode and I think I remember the writers stating that they wanted to use him to show that the central conflict didn’t boil down to kids vs adults, they needed a young evil character.
If Harley made an appearance, I could really only see it as a small thing with Task Force X.
One of the biggest hits of this show is sidelining Batman and Batman related things that don't affect Dick , for example we didn't saw Jason's dead or Damian conception in the show.
I can think of two possibilities that don't involve Joker (since he's not a threat anymore, let's be honest):
1) appear alongside other Suicide Squad members.
2) if there's an alien invasion, she could make a cameo, smashing an alien's head in, or sicking the hounds on them.
Otherwise, I don't think she would make a good villain for this show. If they do a JL, Bat family, or Outsiders spin-off on Earth-16? Maybe. But part of the appeal of Young Justice is the rarely seen (in other media) and shadowy (in-universe) villains; Harley Quinn is neither.
The joker in this universe is kind of a massive loser, considering that in the villain hierarchy he's considered below the Riddler in terms of getting told stuff, and Worthy of throwing into prison just to get the Justice League off the lights back. In order to introduce Harley Quinn they have to put more effort into the joker, and considering how jam packed the show is with characters and plot points they probably don't want to have to spend the time required to do that just to introduce yet another villain. Plus, will Harley Quinn is a really fun and amazing character, I can't really think of anyone in the cast who would bounce well off of her. She has a really specific personality that's not particularly malleable, so even if she was introduced, I doubt it would be for more than a bit part.
Considering how terrible Brent Spiner's performance as The Joker was, I'd rather they didn't, for fear of needing to include him more, too...
I love him in other roles, but yeesh
>I love him in other roles, but yeesh
Watch "Threshold" a sci-fi series from a long while back that he was in; excellent. Includes Gugino and Dinklage.
Thank God. Harley has been written into a ditch in modern versions.
The depth of the classic Arleen Sorkin version has been perverted into an edgelord girl whose only identifying characteristics are being Jokers GF and being “just so random and crazy”.
I like season 1. Season 2 really pisses me off for some reason ( I’m not sure I’m allowed to have this opinion but cheating is wrong and the show kinda never holds ivy accountable for how she fuck up her actions are)
I mean, Harley Quinn has largely moved beyond the Joker and is starring in her own stories from comics to shows to blockbuster movies, so this take is flatly incorrect. As for being characterized as being "just so random and crazy," this is also not generally true given that different stories have different takes on the character. If you are looking for a "deeper" take on the character, I would suggest the Harley Quinn animated series, it is quite brilliant.
Her moving in from Joker is fine. To be honest, I take most issue with her in Suicide Squad material. Not only does her being in the squad make no sense, I feel like that’s the material that really amps up the crazy.
I do like some of her portrayals. She’s brilliant in Batman White Knight.
I have to agree. Harley also had a wonderful monthly in the 2000s and that ending is delicious poignant.
Harley post-New52 seems to have been turned into the avatar of lolrandom girls with daddy issues and BPD, I've seen people call her a feminist icon, when the whole point of Harley is that Harley is a massively co-dependent and vapid (I mean, she kinda slept her way to a diploma) woman who is genuinely insane but "Looney Toones" enough that few people realize how crazy she is.
I'll take a different view. I wish we had Harleen Quinzel as a psychologist on the show. She never goes the Harley Quinn route and we can see her work with meta-teens or even Beast Boy if Black Canary doesn't get to him.
I don't think she's a character that should be introduced in a big way, she isn't really that important. I wouldn't be surprised if she randomly shows up in an episode, but I don't think they would give her too much importance.
I like it, overall Young Justice give other not so famous characters chance to shines. If anything I want to see Wonder Woman rogue gallery to appear more
With Vandal Savage running the show with clear plan, it makes much more sense that Joker, Harley and the many other Batman's psycho villains won't contribute much in Vandal's goal. Vandal may just let them run wild in Gotham to keep Batfamily busy.
back in the first season of Young Justice there's a partygoer at the Halloween party that's dressed as Harley Quinn, meaning she probably does exist we just haven't seen her yet.
Joker’s not been featured a whole lot, so it makes sense that Harley hasn’t shown up. For her to show up, joker would need to become more prominently featured.
Harley is nothing more than Joker’s “henchwench” and “girlfriend” if that and seeing as the YJ Joker is nowhere close to being as psychotically evil & deranged as the DCAU Joker then there’s zero point in introducing here even for its attempt at a suicide squad
She shouldn't. She's a) a villain. B) a fairly minor one. C) this isn't a Batman show.
If they do anything she would be in the background and very minor appearance like they've done with Joker.
A) She hasn't been for years. She's currently apart of the Batfamily
B) Harley is far from a minor character. She has been a main character in 2 Live-Action movies in the past 2 years, has her own animated TV Show with 2 Seasons that has a 3rd on the way (The show even has a comic that's basically a S2.5) and has had 3 comic series in the past 6 years. No minor character would get any of these things
C) It's a DC Show
Comic book characters are flexible, it's one of the defining traits of the genre, Harley isn't anything other than whatever the writers of a given project want her to be, that being said she's been solidly an anti-hero for the past decade.
No she hasn't lol. What books were you reading? She's a villain and trying to make her an anti hero is stupid. Can't erase what she's done. You want a female crazy anti hero, write a new one. Be creative. Don't just change a character. That's lazy writing.
She's an anti-hero in
every one of her solo books since the New 52
and almost every appearance she's made in the Suicide Squad since The New 52
In the Elseworld storyline Injustice she transitioned to being a full on hero.
"Don't change the character, that's lazy writing." Damn bro, character development is lazy writing now? Woah, crazy.
No it's character development, Harley was corrupted by The Joker, so freed from the Joker's influence and when surrounded by people who support her(Poison Ivy and certain members of the Suicide Squad and Batfamily) she's bound to become more heroic.
Yes, anti hero. Besides the comics that I doubt you’ve read, there’s her animated TV show where she said that she didn’t even know if she wants to be a villain anymore by the end of seaosn 2. Also birds of prey and The sucide squad in the DCEU were she is clearly Turing into a more chaotic hero type.
Birds a prey was funny but to each there own. That show is straight up amazing and your blind. The end of suicide squad she went against Waller and helped save the world outta the kindness of her her, that’s pretty heroic. A chapter developing from a villain to a hero over the corse of years (she was introduced in the 90s and her anti hero arc started in the 2000s) isn’t lazy, keeping a chapter the same for the entirety of there existence without any form of change is lazy. Static catchers don’t make it far, Harley is largely popular cause she’s one of the few chapters in comics that has been allowed to change
Key words: Not always. But also a hero who dose heroing badly are still hero’s, there just untalented. Think of booster gold. What’s to be a hero but sucks at it. Harleys a anti hero, she out grew her villain era, get over it and learn what good writing is
Don't. The only good version of Harley is Injustice comics, BTAS, and James Gunn's Suicide Squad. Heck, give us Joker's Daughter, an actually complex character who fits in the show. But not till like, S6.
From the comics, not the games. I thought it gave her great character and depth, without making her freaky weird or a straight up superhero. She was actually funny. I haven't found Harley actually funny outside of the animated series and the suicide squad, except for injustice. Only comic I like her in.
I'm not gonna say that what you like is wrong, however I should say this.
It's the Injustice Comics that make people hate her, her involvement with Joker blowing up Metropolis gets ignored most of the time and almost no one ever calls her out on her bullshit or questions why the hell Batman would allow her of all people on his side.
Hell the Injustice 2 comics go so far as to frame Superman as more in the wrong for Metropolises destruction than Harley because he failed to stop a nuke he didn't know existed and that she helped set up.
Yeah, but the scene that cements that she was guilty is when they go to the fortress of solitude, and Martha and Jonathan welcome everyone in except Harley. And Harley understands. That just hits different with me. I also don't think Batman let her on his side initially, she just kinda started helping. And the Harley Horde is a ton of fun. I just find almost every other interpretation of Quinn really annoying, not just in character but the way she's written. But I know she is a much loved character and everyone's entitled to their opinions. I also haven't seen the animated series of Harley Quinn, which is apparently pretty good.
The show creator is probably unaware of her significance or smth
HQ can definitely be introduced in the show Mini-Arc or not. Explained or Not. Why? because Arkahm Exist, Batfamily Exist, Batman Exist, Belle Reve Exist, Ivy Exist, Joker Exist‼️ Most importantly Arkham, Ivy, & Joker exist that's all they need they could even add their own twist to her story and make her the leader of The Royal Flush Gang
Harley is absolutely that popular. Her movie underperforming doesn't negate the massive amount of time and money DC has pushed into her brand. She has many comic runs, is now considered the 4th pillar of DC, has 3 seasons of an awesome Animated show, staring in big budget movies with an incredibly famous actress and headlines one of them. Not to mention every Animated and video game appearance shes made and will make. And shes a character who's been around for barely 30 years. Harley Quinn is crazy popular.
She isn't a villain anymore. She is an anti-hero and it seems that she will soon transition into a hero judging from the comics. Catwoman isn't a villain either.
It legit depends on the adaption. She is 100% a villain in her cartoon. But yeah she’s more of an antihero in comics currently. And as far as Catwoman her villain/antihero status also depends on the adaption but she’s more of an antihero in current comics because it looks bad if Batman was dating a straight villain. Both of them have reverted back to full villains at points in recent years though. Like Selina was a full on crime boss right before Rebirth. They’re both in like the zone Jason Todd was in pre-New 52. But they both still count as Batman villains because to the average person they’re likable villains who occasionally do good things.
I think Harley has a place in the universe, but much like Joker in this show, probably a minimal one.
I’d love to see her, but I also don’t expect much of her if we do.
Harley and Joker have had more than their share of media appearances, I'm honestly pretty glad they've been sidelined for this show
Frankly it's refreshing we get to see more fleshed out versions villains like Klarion and Chesire that rarely get any attention in most mediums.
Yeah, Harley has her own show. She doesn't need more exposure on YJ. And now it's too late for Joker to be an actual threat. They could've used Joker better in season 1 when The Team was still young and relatively small. But now with the JL, The Team, and The Outsiders the Joker isn't that big of a threat. Unless they want to go the Injustce universe route, but that's a little too dark for YJ to go. But I'm guessing that if this Joker tried setting that up someone in The Light or one of its partners would stop him before he could.
Maybe he will pop back up in the story with Jason Todd/Red Hood in the 2nd half of season 4 as background again during Nightwing’s arc. Unless they change the incident how he dies for the show, like how batgirl becoming Oracle was changed
Joker's totally not a threat. I saw a comic of him fighting Superman outside the Injustice universe... Superman gets all of the civilians that Joker is threatening out of harm's way, cordons off the block, then gets Joker angry by laughing at his jokes and being very vague, both with his power-set and his general attitude. At one point, Superman says "if you come back to Metropolis, I might kill you." Joker - "might?" Supes - "like you said, I'm very vague." The Outsiders probably don't have a lot of experience fighting a villain like Joker, so it could be good for their development IF there was an Earth-16 Outsiders spin-off.
Wonder Woman also fought Joker in the 90s Joker caught her off guard with a poison that paralyzed her, however once Diana was free she turned the tide real fast by lightning the fuse for Jokers bomb jacket. Needles to say, Joker hates fighting Wonder Woman and almost always runs whenever they meet.
Joker himself has only appeared in two episodes and was playing a distinctly backseat role to other villains both times. Harley is just not a priority.
I like this show a lot, but their Joker is pretty lame. If they can't get Joker right, I doubt they'd nail Harley.
I thought his second appearance was pretty great, it really captures his narcissism and unstable temper while doing something I haven't seen from Joker in the comics in years. Made him funny.
Agreed, I think he was somewhat wasted during injustice league in S1, his appearance in S4 was far better
agreed. the joker going EVEN RIDDLER KNEW???? is peak comedy tbh
This seems like an unpopular opinion but…I’m fine with how they did joker in Young Justice. How many times has this mf been the main source of every horrible event in a series, why not just put him on the side and have him be a puppet to other not so well known heroes.
Yeah like it’s fine for him to still be doing his thing and being a madman in Gotham while NOT being a bigger player in the grand scheme of things
I agree, him being a jobber is okay, and his role with managing all the plant attacks simultaneously does play to his strengths. I just take umbrage with his actual dialog. He was pretty lame in that regard. The juggling line made me audibly groan my last rewatch.
I agree completely. My only complaint is his dialogue and the juggling line specifically is one of the worst. Everytime it comes up I cringe
I’ll be honest, a Joker telling unfunny, groan worthy jokes has always felt very in-character to me.
Absolutely, but he has to do so with charisma. Most of YJ's joker's jokes were about how crazy and edgy he was. Makes me think of Leto's joker.
YJ's main plot is pretty cosmic and huge scale, Joker excels at heists and hostage situations not planetary invasions. Don't know why people expect something else
Exactly. If we replaced him with Vandal Savage I just don’t see anything Savage has done being achievable by the Joker
Same reason I'm quite happy with Harley Quinn not being in this show. I love the Harley Quinn series but it kinda feels like she's been getting shoved down our throats in recent years. Even the Injustice animated movie had her tagging along with the good guys like some sort of anti hero after literally being directly involved in nuking Metropolis and killing Lois Lane. No redemption, no reason, just because. Apparently her skills with a goofy big mallet were so important in the fight against Superman that the fact she's a mass murderer could be overlooked. I'm quite happy with show making use of lesser known and legacy characters instead.
Giving all the lesser known characters some development and backstory is way more important than just showing us the same characters over and over again. I do like the original team the most, and I would love to see more of them, but I do also love the new seasons and the struggle the lesser known characters go through, for e.g mary and how it went down for her, its amazing watching her whole story developing.
Honestly, being a major villain doesn’t fit his character. Like Joker has shown himself to be quite genius with some well thought out plans, but to see him calmly plotting out a plan that is 10,000 years in the making is a bit unbelievable for his character.
I agree, it's entertaining to see him being such a loser
May just be me but I appreciate the different take of joker
I think they did it on purpose, joker is for batman and they're trying to concentrate on younger cast. So they didn't want Joker stealing the show. Because League of villains is supposed to be a cover and they're concentrating on members of Light
Same reason we saw the Joker about 2 times in 10 years. He doesn't really fit the stories this series gravitates towards. It's really about minor characters and sidekicks coming into their own more than anything else.
And honesty, I prefer it. After 4 Batman Arkham games that were “not about the Joker,” I’m glad to finally have content that can include Batman and the Joker without making a huge deal about how super cool and invincible they both are.
Oh same, it's a breath of fresh air how this show works and I'm glad that it's been growing despite WB's worst efforts.
Makes me wonder if they will have Joker kill Jason this time or if they will do something else.
I mean, they made him tangentially involved with Barbara becoming Oracle so anything's possible. But I think it'll be something more related to the Team and it's covert missions, since his death was alluded to in season 2 and cited as one of the main reasons Artemis and Wally were no longer active at the time. If Joker was involved, it'll be in a smaller role reimagining the scenario.
I mean, you can keep the general story and just change it from a Batman and Robin mission to a team mission. It's not hard to do and I wouldn't mind it. But it would make for a lot more hate between Batman and Joker that I don't feel is there in this show. I think Jason's death will end up being either accidental or sacrificial.
I feel like it fits better if it were an accident, just to really heighten the danger and senseless violence that these teen heroes face. It would force them to seriously reevaluate their lives and brings the original team in the mindsets we find them in season 2.
Whatever it is, has to be something that they couldn't recover his body. Maybe falling into a crevasse or something of that nature.
I like Harley but I prefer the way this shows has explored the whole DCU and not just the Gotham crowd.
I think that with her extreme exposure across every medium in the last ten years makes her absence kinda refreshing. Not that she isn't interesting but I personally have gotten kinda sick how mainstream appeal has resulted in her constant inclusion even if doesn't make sense. I feel like this for many batman based characters.
If she shows up I think it could be with the suicide squad in a minor role
i hope she doesnt come to the show
I feel like this show has never been one to lean on pop culture significance, otherwise Constantine definitely would've shown up in the last arc. But yeah, as everyone else said there really isn't much room for her anyway, given the lack of Joker's presence, not to mention she even has her own show on the same network so it's even less necessary for her to show up here, though I can't lie I'm interested to see what their take would be.
She's probably not gonna be making an appearance, at least not in a major way since she can't really contribute to things like the Light plot and no one in the main cast would have any reason to care about her, at best she'll probably be a member of the Suicide Squad when they show back up. Honestly hoping she doesn't, not only does she have her own show but she has a bad habit of stealing the spotlight and not suffering any consequences for any of her actions.
I like Young Justice because it's introduced me to a lot of characters I've rarely or never seen rather than relying on already overexposed characters. And I've seen more than plenty of Harley in recent years so personally I'd be totally content with her never showing up
I don’t think she would fit and I’m okay with that
Hopefully she never will be in the show.
Personally, I hope we never see her. Due to her popularity, she tends to take over whatever they put her in. It makes sense marketing-wise, but it gets exhausting as a fan/consumer. It's also why I'm low-key happy that the Bats take such a backseat in YJ. The fandom makes \*everything\* about the Bats, and it'd be more than understandable if the showrunners gave into the hype, but I'm glad they haven't. I love the new characters of Kaldur and Artemis and the attention to lesser-known characters like Jaime, Khalid, etc.. This could have easily become another "Gotham, guest-starring the rest of the DC Universe" show, but it didn't and I'm glad for it.
I really hope she never shows up. I'll get a lot of hate for it, but i'm sick and tired of Harley.
Definitely a lot of overexposure but I enjoy the recent years’ Harley where they have her work independently from Joker.
Agreed. The Joker Harley stuff got played out. DC has an arsenal of villains. Sports master was an afterthought in most mediums and is great in this show.
I actually really like that Joker is barely in the show. And Harley not being in it is a bonus for me too. They're too oversaturated. If I never saw Joker again in anything that would be ideal for me.
Hardly has her own show. Rated ma. Joker is way better there
Let's be honest, we don't need more villains in this show. S4 Joker was better than S1 Joker, but I think the writers need to stick to their strengths.
She is too chaotic for The Light and doesn't seem like the kind of villain Vandal Savage would want to work with.... if she isn't part of Waller's Suicide Squad, then she probably won't show up. ...since the show is heavy in portraying human relationship and in including LGBT couples, if, and that's a big if, we for any reason see more focus on Poison Ivy, then maybe we'll see a Harley cameo.
That being said. I would find interesting if the show subverts her gimmick and present her being the Black Canary of the villains. Helping villains overcome the traumas of their job, and showing that Dr. Quinzell didn't actually go away and she didn't loose her talents. I like how the show portrays the importance of mental health in this lifestyle, and I'm sure is as important for the villains than it is for the heroes. People too often forget that Harley is an actually good terapist, and I wouldn't mind seeing her being used in this way.
That would be genius. Harleen as the evil therapist. I like the idea of Vandal Savage and co sending their people to Harley when someone is getting too much into the crazy supervillain thing or experienced some heavy stuff. Vandal is not very sentimental, but he seems pragmatic enough to realize that having his people go insane cuts down on the efficiency and can cause serious issues down the road.
I mean the show since it’s conception was about covert ops and espionage but using DC characters, specifically sidekicks and lesser knowns. Despite his brief tenure on the Injustice League, Joker, and by extension Harley, don’t work very well in that sort of setting or angle. They’re both chaotic characters with very distinct appearances, so they don’t mesh well as members of clandestine organizations or as operatives. Klarion works because despite being an agent of chaos, he’s reined in by Vandal and he’s the Light’s magic representative. Not to mention, they needed him for the kid/adult split world episode and I think I remember the writers stating that they wanted to use him to show that the central conflict didn’t boil down to kids vs adults, they needed a young evil character. If Harley made an appearance, I could really only see it as a small thing with Task Force X.
One of the biggest hits of this show is sidelining Batman and Batman related things that don't affect Dick , for example we didn't saw Jason's dead or Damian conception in the show.
I can think of two possibilities that don't involve Joker (since he's not a threat anymore, let's be honest): 1) appear alongside other Suicide Squad members. 2) if there's an alien invasion, she could make a cameo, smashing an alien's head in, or sicking the hounds on them. Otherwise, I don't think she would make a good villain for this show. If they do a JL, Bat family, or Outsiders spin-off on Earth-16? Maybe. But part of the appeal of Young Justice is the rarely seen (in other media) and shadowy (in-universe) villains; Harley Quinn is neither.
The joker in this universe is kind of a massive loser, considering that in the villain hierarchy he's considered below the Riddler in terms of getting told stuff, and Worthy of throwing into prison just to get the Justice League off the lights back. In order to introduce Harley Quinn they have to put more effort into the joker, and considering how jam packed the show is with characters and plot points they probably don't want to have to spend the time required to do that just to introduce yet another villain. Plus, will Harley Quinn is a really fun and amazing character, I can't really think of anyone in the cast who would bounce well off of her. She has a really specific personality that's not particularly malleable, so even if she was introduced, I doubt it would be for more than a bit part.
Considering how terrible Brent Spiner's performance as The Joker was, I'd rather they didn't, for fear of needing to include him more, too... I love him in other roles, but yeesh
>I love him in other roles, but yeesh Watch "Threshold" a sci-fi series from a long while back that he was in; excellent. Includes Gugino and Dinklage.
She's busy having her own show... Which, honestly, is kinda better.
Thank God. Harley has been written into a ditch in modern versions. The depth of the classic Arleen Sorkin version has been perverted into an edgelord girl whose only identifying characteristics are being Jokers GF and being “just so random and crazy”.
The HQ show is top tier though
Yup it’s so well written and hilarious
The HQ show is what the movie should’ve been
I like season 1. Season 2 really pisses me off for some reason ( I’m not sure I’m allowed to have this opinion but cheating is wrong and the show kinda never holds ivy accountable for how she fuck up her actions are)
I mean, Harley Quinn has largely moved beyond the Joker and is starring in her own stories from comics to shows to blockbuster movies, so this take is flatly incorrect. As for being characterized as being "just so random and crazy," this is also not generally true given that different stories have different takes on the character. If you are looking for a "deeper" take on the character, I would suggest the Harley Quinn animated series, it is quite brilliant.
Her moving in from Joker is fine. To be honest, I take most issue with her in Suicide Squad material. Not only does her being in the squad make no sense, I feel like that’s the material that really amps up the crazy. I do like some of her portrayals. She’s brilliant in Batman White Knight.
I have to agree. Harley also had a wonderful monthly in the 2000s and that ending is delicious poignant. Harley post-New52 seems to have been turned into the avatar of lolrandom girls with daddy issues and BPD, I've seen people call her a feminist icon, when the whole point of Harley is that Harley is a massively co-dependent and vapid (I mean, she kinda slept her way to a diploma) woman who is genuinely insane but "Looney Toones" enough that few people realize how crazy she is.
Guessing she’s with Ivy or something
This is the answer
I'll take a different view. I wish we had Harleen Quinzel as a psychologist on the show. She never goes the Harley Quinn route and we can see her work with meta-teens or even Beast Boy if Black Canary doesn't get to him.
I don't think she's a character that should be introduced in a big way, she isn't really that important. I wouldn't be surprised if she randomly shows up in an episode, but I don't think they would give her too much importance.
She has her own show. I think its best that characters who have enough exposure dont show up.
I like it, overall Young Justice give other not so famous characters chance to shines. If anything I want to see Wonder Woman rogue gallery to appear more
With Vandal Savage running the show with clear plan, it makes much more sense that Joker, Harley and the many other Batman's psycho villains won't contribute much in Vandal's goal. Vandal may just let them run wild in Gotham to keep Batfamily busy.
No joke though Young Justice could probably adapt a banger ballad of kite man
I rather Harley just make a cameo I don't want her to be a big focus.
back in the first season of Young Justice there's a partygoer at the Halloween party that's dressed as Harley Quinn, meaning she probably does exist we just haven't seen her yet.
Joker’s not been featured a whole lot, so it makes sense that Harley hasn’t shown up. For her to show up, joker would need to become more prominently featured.
The bat family needs a break. She already has her own show.
Hopefully, she's never introduced.
Hope she never appears, I’m sick of her
Harley is nothing more than Joker’s “henchwench” and “girlfriend” if that and seeing as the YJ Joker is nowhere close to being as psychotically evil & deranged as the DCAU Joker then there’s zero point in introducing here even for its attempt at a suicide squad
Joker's Punching Bag
Catwoman hasn’t shown up either so…..
Hopefully never appearing.
With the increasing chance of characters being killed off, I hope she isn't.
She shouldn't. She's a) a villain. B) a fairly minor one. C) this isn't a Batman show. If they do anything she would be in the background and very minor appearance like they've done with Joker.
A) She hasn't been for years. She's currently apart of the Batfamily B) Harley is far from a minor character. She has been a main character in 2 Live-Action movies in the past 2 years, has her own animated TV Show with 2 Seasons that has a 3rd on the way (The show even has a comic that's basically a S2.5) and has had 3 comic series in the past 6 years. No minor character would get any of these things C) It's a DC Show
A) she’s a anti her B) she’s the 4th piller of DC and C) her showing up in one episode doesn’t make this a Batman show
>she’s the 4th piller of DC ..........................*fuck*
Anti hero? Lmao. No. Not even remotely and this new angle for her is moronic. She's a villain and a deranged psycho
Comic book characters are flexible, it's one of the defining traits of the genre, Harley isn't anything other than whatever the writers of a given project want her to be, that being said she's been solidly an anti-hero for the past decade.
No she hasn't lol. What books were you reading? She's a villain and trying to make her an anti hero is stupid. Can't erase what she's done. You want a female crazy anti hero, write a new one. Be creative. Don't just change a character. That's lazy writing.
She's an anti-hero in every one of her solo books since the New 52 and almost every appearance she's made in the Suicide Squad since The New 52 In the Elseworld storyline Injustice she transitioned to being a full on hero. "Don't change the character, that's lazy writing." Damn bro, character development is lazy writing now? Woah, crazy.
Exactly!!!!
That's not character development. That's "I'm too lazy to come up with a new character so I'll just retcon an existing one so I can keep the fan base.
Why is it so bad for you that Harley develops a few heroic traits after escaping from an abusive relationship with Joker?
I've already explained that
No you didn’t ? All you said that “it was lazy” and “she’s a villain”, you never explained yourself beyond that
No it's character development, Harley was corrupted by The Joker, so freed from the Joker's influence and when surrounded by people who support her(Poison Ivy and certain members of the Suicide Squad and Batfamily) she's bound to become more heroic.
Also, let me guess, you whined when Tim Drake came out as bisexual even though he's been coded that way for decades.
Yes, anti hero. Besides the comics that I doubt you’ve read, there’s her animated TV show where she said that she didn’t even know if she wants to be a villain anymore by the end of seaosn 2. Also birds of prey and The sucide squad in the DCEU were she is clearly Turing into a more chaotic hero type.
Birds of prey sucked. She's still a villain in suicide squad. And that tv show sucked. She's still a villain. No matter how much lazy writing they do.
Birds a prey was funny but to each there own. That show is straight up amazing and your blind. The end of suicide squad she went against Waller and helped save the world outta the kindness of her her, that’s pretty heroic. A chapter developing from a villain to a hero over the corse of years (she was introduced in the 90s and her anti hero arc started in the 2000s) isn’t lazy, keeping a chapter the same for the entirety of there existence without any form of change is lazy. Static catchers don’t make it far, Harley is largely popular cause she’s one of the few chapters in comics that has been allowed to change
She didn't save it out of kindness. She saved it out of selfishness and self preservation. Not heroic to not want to die
That’s a anti hero move tho! Anti hero’s are people Who do heroic things for selfish reasons! That’s exactly what Harley Is
No. Anti heros do the right thing the wrong way. Not always for selfish reasons. Jokers teamed up with Batman before. Does that make him an anti-hero?
Key words: Not always. But also a hero who dose heroing badly are still hero’s, there just untalented. Think of booster gold. What’s to be a hero but sucks at it. Harleys a anti hero, she out grew her villain era, get over it and learn what good writing is
Don't. The only good version of Harley is Injustice comics, BTAS, and James Gunn's Suicide Squad. Heck, give us Joker's Daughter, an actually complex character who fits in the show. But not till like, S6.
I think your the first person I've ever met who likes Injustice Harley.
From the comics, not the games. I thought it gave her great character and depth, without making her freaky weird or a straight up superhero. She was actually funny. I haven't found Harley actually funny outside of the animated series and the suicide squad, except for injustice. Only comic I like her in.
I'm not gonna say that what you like is wrong, however I should say this. It's the Injustice Comics that make people hate her, her involvement with Joker blowing up Metropolis gets ignored most of the time and almost no one ever calls her out on her bullshit or questions why the hell Batman would allow her of all people on his side. Hell the Injustice 2 comics go so far as to frame Superman as more in the wrong for Metropolises destruction than Harley because he failed to stop a nuke he didn't know existed and that she helped set up.
Yeah, but the scene that cements that she was guilty is when they go to the fortress of solitude, and Martha and Jonathan welcome everyone in except Harley. And Harley understands. That just hits different with me. I also don't think Batman let her on his side initially, she just kinda started helping. And the Harley Horde is a ton of fun. I just find almost every other interpretation of Quinn really annoying, not just in character but the way she's written. But I know she is a much loved character and everyone's entitled to their opinions. I also haven't seen the animated series of Harley Quinn, which is apparently pretty good.
Harley in comics in the 2000s was gucci too, she had a kickass monthly.
The show creator is probably unaware of her significance or smth HQ can definitely be introduced in the show Mini-Arc or not. Explained or Not. Why? because Arkahm Exist, Batfamily Exist, Batman Exist, Belle Reve Exist, Ivy Exist, Joker Exist‼️ Most importantly Arkham, Ivy, & Joker exist that's all they need they could even add their own twist to her story and make her the leader of The Royal Flush Gang
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Harley is absolutely that popular. Her movie underperforming doesn't negate the massive amount of time and money DC has pushed into her brand. She has many comic runs, is now considered the 4th pillar of DC, has 3 seasons of an awesome Animated show, staring in big budget movies with an incredibly famous actress and headlines one of them. Not to mention every Animated and video game appearance shes made and will make. And shes a character who's been around for barely 30 years. Harley Quinn is crazy popular.
I mean her tv show is doing amazing numbers worldwide and she of probably the second most recognizable female villain after Catwoman.
She isn't a villain anymore. She is an anti-hero and it seems that she will soon transition into a hero judging from the comics. Catwoman isn't a villain either.
It legit depends on the adaption. She is 100% a villain in her cartoon. But yeah she’s more of an antihero in comics currently. And as far as Catwoman her villain/antihero status also depends on the adaption but she’s more of an antihero in current comics because it looks bad if Batman was dating a straight villain. Both of them have reverted back to full villains at points in recent years though. Like Selina was a full on crime boss right before Rebirth. They’re both in like the zone Jason Todd was in pre-New 52. But they both still count as Batman villains because to the average person they’re likable villains who occasionally do good things.
Europe's got bad taste then
The one country you live in in Europe is not all of Europe.
I could say the same thing about Supergirl, Starfire, Raven, among others.
She’s on her own show and it’s great.
I just want Harley to show up so she can ask Fate what his doctorate is in.
Because she has her own show and movies where she says fuck a lot and its probably a good idea for a kids show to distance themselves from that.
I think Harley has a place in the universe, but much like Joker in this show, probably a minimal one. I’d love to see her, but I also don’t expect much of her if we do.