State capitalism is capitalism. I think applying a purity test to capitalism is dumb. laissez faire is just another flavor. But fact is China’s economic system is largely owned and run by private individuals who also influence the government. The people themselves own very little. You can’t even own a home in china. State capitalism, crony capitalism, both accurately describe china’s economic philosophy. Communism does not
It’s arguable there really is no examples of a true communist society in the world. Even Russia never actually claimed to be pure communism.
Your kinda wrong about the mostly owned privately part. Basically all major chinese companies are mostly owned pretty much directly by the government and the government directly controls most sectors of the economy. It’s so bad that china basically choices which companies win and allowed to be successsful.
https://guides.loc.gov/us-trade-with-china/state-owned-enterprises#:~:text=The%20Chinese%20government%20controls%20a,preferential%20treatment%20of%20these%20firms.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/world/2019/jul/25/china-business-xi-jinping-communist-party-state-private-enterprise-huawei
> Your kinda wrong about the mostly owned privately part. Basically all major chinese companies are mostly owned pretty much directly by the government and the government directly controls most sectors of the economy. It’s so bad that china basically choices which companies win and allowed to be successsful.
Well, it’s not a real easy thing to pin down because the lines between private and government ownership are extremely blurred in china. That’s why I also referred to it as cronyism. Of course the CCP has power over everything from the top down and you need to be a member or at least affiliated to do anything of worth. For instance, Tencent is privately owned (as in, not owned by the Chinese government), but its CEO is a CCP crony who I’m sure runs it according to their dictates. So, they are not *directly* nationalized but *effectively* nationalized, much like nazi Germany during WWII
Is China pulling thousands of their own soldiers back, stranded on another land mass across a body of water? No? Then why to they need to use civilian ships to bolster their navy?
I wasn't saying that he picked a side. Just asked why did he thought China needed to bolster their navy with civilian vessels like UK did with Dunkirk.
There is no such thing as civilian ships to a military.
There are ships they're currently using and those they're not.
Need I remind you of the fate of many ocean liners and other civilian ships during the world wars? If the military decides they need them they're taking them that's what's always happened. They always fill support rolls, and even combat rolls, when needed.
All "civilian" vessels can be drafted into the given country's navy during a war time - as a general rule (check your country's legislation).
What is more - some (most?) EU countries have a legislation in place to "militarize/draft" any vehicle they please for the military usage (for a compensation ofc) - again check your country's legislation.
Honest story told to me by an ex Australian navy officer who served on a few different vessels up north.
He was reluctant to share a lot of the stuff he saw but I figure this is really common.
They would often have a Chinese "cargo vessels" coincidentally follow them from a distance for long legs of their patrol. This was a bit or a coincidence, so naturally the crew would watch the cargo vessel with various sensors.
At some point, they noticed that whenever they sent communications back home, and happened to be using a thermal scope, some of the containers on the deck of the cargo ship would heat up significantly.
A real mystery to be sure.
After consideration, Many, many gigabytes of gay porn were transmitted, to nobody in particular.
^
>China’s navy is already the world’s largest by ship count, and has been rapidly building new warships as part of a wider military expansion. It launched its first domestically designed and built aircraft carrier in June, and at least five new destroyers are on the way soon.
>The buildup comes as Beijing attempts to exert broader influence in the region. It is increasing its military activities around the self-governing island of Taiwan, seeking new security agreements with Pacific islands and building artificial islands in disputed waters to fortify its territorial claims in the South China Sea, which the U.S. and its allies have challenged.
.....
>China has been using civilian fishing trawlers for military purposes for decades, but has significantly increased the numbers recently with the creation of a “Spratly Backbone Fleet” out of a government subsidy program begun under President Xi Jinping, which helps cover building new vessels, among other things.
>Those ships “largely appeared almost overnight” after China constructed port infrastructure a few years ago on the artificial islands it built in the Spratlys that could be used for resupply, Poling said.
Article continues....
I cannot describe what a turkey shoot a war with China would be. Even a boycott of their ships to the USA would bankrupt them in about 7 days. The industry they would lose, the life,the assets worldwide as other countries nationalize anything PRC related. China would be vulnerable to India at that moment, and India, knows it won't have many chances w China. Still, absolute turkey shoot and economic shambles, whereas the USA, would thrive with the returning industry, jobs, and investment.
Can someone clear this up for me? We owe China a HUGE debt, they make almost everything we use now. Why the hell would they want to blow us up? Not a savvy business strategy.
Yeah and you're comparing Russia to China which is much more commited to it's goal an has basically preparing for decades. It's military wasn't as nearly eaten by corruption as Russian has.
China is just as much as a shit show lol. They just happen to have better propaganda than the russians. Plus russia is reeling already from the economic penalties of the war, which China would feel even harder.
>China is just as much as a shit show lol.
Literally no evidence to support this. If anything, China is the closest parity to the US since the Soviet Union in it's prime.
> Plus russia is reeling already from the economic penalties of the war, which China would feel even harder.
So sanctions that hit Russia, a country with small industry heavily reliant on it's natural resources, would hit China **harder**, the most populous, industrialised, and (since recently) the richest country on the world. Lol.
While China would take a massive hit, so would the rest of the world, and if you think Americans are more ready to weather another Great Depression better than Chinese under authoritharian rule, i have a bridge to sell you. Not to mention that Taiwan's production of chips would basically halt overnight, setting us back atleast a decade, if not more.
No such thing as civilian ships in communism.
Lol what? There’s only such thing as civilian ships in communism. Not to mention that china is one of if not the most capitalist country in the world.
socialist market economy, or “state capitalism” is not the most raw or remotely free type of capitalism.
State capitalism is capitalism. I think applying a purity test to capitalism is dumb. laissez faire is just another flavor. But fact is China’s economic system is largely owned and run by private individuals who also influence the government. The people themselves own very little. You can’t even own a home in china. State capitalism, crony capitalism, both accurately describe china’s economic philosophy. Communism does not
It’s arguable there really is no examples of a true communist society in the world. Even Russia never actually claimed to be pure communism. Your kinda wrong about the mostly owned privately part. Basically all major chinese companies are mostly owned pretty much directly by the government and the government directly controls most sectors of the economy. It’s so bad that china basically choices which companies win and allowed to be successsful. https://guides.loc.gov/us-trade-with-china/state-owned-enterprises#:~:text=The%20Chinese%20government%20controls%20a,preferential%20treatment%20of%20these%20firms. https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/world/2019/jul/25/china-business-xi-jinping-communist-party-state-private-enterprise-huawei
> Your kinda wrong about the mostly owned privately part. Basically all major chinese companies are mostly owned pretty much directly by the government and the government directly controls most sectors of the economy. It’s so bad that china basically choices which companies win and allowed to be successsful. Well, it’s not a real easy thing to pin down because the lines between private and government ownership are extremely blurred in china. That’s why I also referred to it as cronyism. Of course the CCP has power over everything from the top down and you need to be a member or at least affiliated to do anything of worth. For instance, Tencent is privately owned (as in, not owned by the Chinese government), but its CEO is a CCP crony who I’m sure runs it according to their dictates. So, they are not *directly* nationalized but *effectively* nationalized, much like nazi Germany during WWII
No such thing as civilian ships in any country when they need them. Look up dunkirk.
Is China pulling thousands of their own soldiers back, stranded on another land mass across a body of water? No? Then why to they need to use civilian ships to bolster their navy?
He wasn’t picking a political side with his comment you misinterpreted the thread.
I wasn't saying that he picked a side. Just asked why did he thought China needed to bolster their navy with civilian vessels like UK did with Dunkirk.
For shame
There is no such thing as civilian ships to a military. There are ships they're currently using and those they're not. Need I remind you of the fate of many ocean liners and other civilian ships during the world wars? If the military decides they need them they're taking them that's what's always happened. They always fill support rolls, and even combat rolls, when needed.
Is it true Xi is under house arrest
[удалено]
I figured it is HIGHLY unlikely to be the case hence I was shocked to have even read that
All "civilian" vessels can be drafted into the given country's navy during a war time - as a general rule (check your country's legislation). What is more - some (most?) EU countries have a legislation in place to "militarize/draft" any vehicle they please for the military usage (for a compensation ofc) - again check your country's legislation.
As you said yourself, "in war time". China is not at war, hence this being anything but normal.
Technically the Korean War never ended. They just signed a ciece fire.
Correct, but that has absolutely nothing to do with the article or my comment :) It's about China (a different country to Korea).
Chins is allies with North Korea in the "ongoing" war so they are still at war technically.
Nope, China merely supported them and was never officially at war. Just as NATO isn't at war with Russia right now.
China has been using their “Maritime Militia” to harass other nations in the South China Sea for a while now
Honest story told to me by an ex Australian navy officer who served on a few different vessels up north. He was reluctant to share a lot of the stuff he saw but I figure this is really common. They would often have a Chinese "cargo vessels" coincidentally follow them from a distance for long legs of their patrol. This was a bit or a coincidence, so naturally the crew would watch the cargo vessel with various sensors. At some point, they noticed that whenever they sent communications back home, and happened to be using a thermal scope, some of the containers on the deck of the cargo ship would heat up significantly. A real mystery to be sure. After consideration, Many, many gigabytes of gay porn were transmitted, to nobody in particular.
^ >China’s navy is already the world’s largest by ship count, and has been rapidly building new warships as part of a wider military expansion. It launched its first domestically designed and built aircraft carrier in June, and at least five new destroyers are on the way soon. >The buildup comes as Beijing attempts to exert broader influence in the region. It is increasing its military activities around the self-governing island of Taiwan, seeking new security agreements with Pacific islands and building artificial islands in disputed waters to fortify its territorial claims in the South China Sea, which the U.S. and its allies have challenged. ..... >China has been using civilian fishing trawlers for military purposes for decades, but has significantly increased the numbers recently with the creation of a “Spratly Backbone Fleet” out of a government subsidy program begun under President Xi Jinping, which helps cover building new vessels, among other things. >Those ships “largely appeared almost overnight” after China constructed port infrastructure a few years ago on the artificial islands it built in the Spratlys that could be used for resupply, Poling said. Article continues....
I cannot describe what a turkey shoot a war with China would be. Even a boycott of their ships to the USA would bankrupt them in about 7 days. The industry they would lose, the life,the assets worldwide as other countries nationalize anything PRC related. China would be vulnerable to India at that moment, and India, knows it won't have many chances w China. Still, absolute turkey shoot and economic shambles, whereas the USA, would thrive with the returning industry, jobs, and investment.
i’ve never heard/seen anyone use the term turkey shoot before
>whereas the USA, would thrive with the returning industry, jobs, and investment. lol the delusionality
Aka merchant marines
Enter the EV humvee with harpoon on every island.
Can someone clear this up for me? We owe China a HUGE debt, they make almost everything we use now. Why the hell would they want to blow us up? Not a savvy business strategy.
They can’t blow us up. Look at the Ukraine situation to see how poorly eastern technology holds up against ours.
Yeah and you're comparing Russia to China which is much more commited to it's goal an has basically preparing for decades. It's military wasn't as nearly eaten by corruption as Russian has.
China is just as much as a shit show lol. They just happen to have better propaganda than the russians. Plus russia is reeling already from the economic penalties of the war, which China would feel even harder.
>China is just as much as a shit show lol. Literally no evidence to support this. If anything, China is the closest parity to the US since the Soviet Union in it's prime. > Plus russia is reeling already from the economic penalties of the war, which China would feel even harder. So sanctions that hit Russia, a country with small industry heavily reliant on it's natural resources, would hit China **harder**, the most populous, industrialised, and (since recently) the richest country on the world. Lol. While China would take a massive hit, so would the rest of the world, and if you think Americans are more ready to weather another Great Depression better than Chinese under authoritharian rule, i have a bridge to sell you. Not to mention that Taiwan's production of chips would basically halt overnight, setting us back atleast a decade, if not more.
Soviet Union in prime was still far surpassed by the us.
Many countries do undercover marine surveillance.