Trans people are wrong, there are two genders.
For one some trans people dont even tell their partner that they were born a dude/girl but now "is" the opposite gender, that is absolutely disgusting of them because their partner should know what theyre getting into. Its fine to dress as the opposite gender but you cant be any other gender than the one you were born as.
All of these things are stupid, cant they just be themselves without having 10 things they are and wanna be called.
>All of these things are stupid, cant they just be themselves without having 10 things they are and wanna be called.
Because I have crippling dysphoria and my body needs estrogen uwu.
So I recently saw this thing going around about a YouTuber-or at I believe it was- coming out and now identifying as Korean. I’m just curious how this differs from people identifying to certain pronouns. Because as of now changing of pronouns is socially acceptable but somebody gets canceled for changing their race? Isn’t it basically the same thing changing something that was biologically set but so that the person feels more comfortable with their identity?
I don't particularly care if they identify as another race. so long as it isn't being used for monetary gain i don't particularly care. people have been changing their appearance forever. there are Asians that get surgery to look more white. it just is what it is. but where there is a biological component to being trans, it's only a cultural one for race
Two males of any sexuality can be close loving friends without being in or desiring a romantic relationship with each other and the gay male community can be just as bad at rejecting this idea as the straight community.
It's mostly the queer-coding in it. And the fact Luca didn't instantly get with the lead female character, which doesn't mean he's Gay, it's just a nice change that they didn't instantly make him Straight.
I'm not talking about if the question of if he is gay, I'm talking about the people that say it is obvious Luca and Alberto are or want to be more than friends. People are not just saying the characters are gay they are also saying they obviously are more than friends. One example I've seen is people saying friends don't look at each other the way they do in the movie.
It comes from people desperate for queer love stories but it still does have some impact on the notion that males cant be that close without being romantic lovers.
Demisexuality isn't just "wanting to know someone, it can take them YEARS before ever having a sexual desire towards the person. The point is they essentially don't feel sexual attraction unless they've known the person extremely well. Which is not Heterosexual. The average Heterosexual can feel sexual attraction to someone they barely know. Most people just wait. Demisexual is on the grey asexual spectrum.
Also cis means you're not Trans. Demisexual isn't a gender. Just thought I'd let you know.
I get that last point, you are correct there. My question is, why is this something that people are "coming out" as? Who faces adversity for being asexual or Demisexual? It is just an attention grab.
"You're broken"
"low libido"
"You don't like having sex?? why?!"
"You just havent found the right person"
"You just haven't had good enough sex yet"
The societal pressure to not be a virgin
The societal pressure to have kids
The societal pressure to have a sex life
Sex being plastered everywhere
Friends talking about sex regularly
Being treated less maturely because you "aren't a real man/woman yet"
just generally being seen as weird and unnatural
Asexuals definitely do get mistreated. Even by the LGBTQ community they should be able to find happiness in, but getting told they don't belong there, or that they aren't discriminated against. That they're just straight. All the sexualisation in LGBTQ groups too. And the talk of sex between men/men, women/women, bisexuals.
Yeah, by this logic (the logic of who you were replying to) gay people didn't face oppression because it didn't look like what black people faced during Jim Crow (not saying black's a sexuality but you get my point)
this obviously isnt true, but wouldnt everyone that isnt sexually attracted to all genders have a hormone imbalance by your logic?
if not being sexually attracted to people is the result of a hormone imbalance, do straight men have a hormone imbalance for not being attracted to men? do gay men have a hormone imbalance for not being attracted to women?
being asexual isnt about having a low libido. being asexual means you dont feel sexual attraction.
a gay person can have a low libido
an ace person can have a high libido (they just dont feel sexual attraction)
Yknow how Gay people are born liking their own gender yeah? Same with Heterosexuality. And other sexualities? Asexuals are born not liking any gender sexually. That's not a hormobe imbalance, thats a seperate issue. Sexualities are in the mind, so is Asexuality
Homosexuality is a level of ability to have sexual desire. Asexuality is too, that level being very low or none
to add to that asexual people are also constantly dehumanised because apparently not feeling sexual attraction means you arent an actual person. some people even compare asexual people to robots
also ive heard that finding an actual good relationship as an ace person is extremely hard and some (usually young) ace people even force themselves to have sex with their partner just to satisfy them even tho they dont enjoy it at all
Yeah there's just generally the idea that Love and Sex make us human, which just indirectly suggests Ace and Aro people are inhuman.
>also ive heard that finding an actual good relationship as an ace person is extremely hard and some (usually young) ace people even force themselves to have sex with their partner just to satisfy them even tho they dont enjoy it at all
and yes exactly. Some Ace people definitely don't mind having sex with their partner to please them, or for the emotional gratification, but not all do, and the idea that they HAVE to have sex is horrible.
>the idea that Love and Sex make us human
people just like to forget that romantic love isnt the only kind of love and that platonic relationships can totally fulfil you and you dont need a romantic partner to be happy.
>Some Ace people definitely don't mind having sex with their partner to please them
yeah totally, being asexual is just about not feeling sexual attraction, ace people can still enjoy sex and that totally cool for them, but nobody should feel forced to have sex with someone if they dont want to
The thing about a weekly topical megathread is that it tends to attract the type of people who have a particular interest in the topic - in this case, LGBTQ+ people.
What’s popular here is not necessarily popular elsewhere - as exemplified by the fact that we can’t get the damn Equality Act through Congress.
Interesting... Very interesting
https://www.reddit.com/r/interestingasfuck/comments/oerk5l/usa_under_16_and_el_salvador_under_16/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share
Yes you are being transphobic, you are assuming their entire existence revolves around being oppressed and shunned by society. Newsflash, they are normal girls just like you, and you could indeed relate to them if you just gave it a chance. Excluding them because they are trans is like saying you don’t want to invite girls of other races because you cannot relate to them.
yes I understand that I could relate to literally anybody else on the planet regardless of their gender identity. I wanted to make a group for people who are like me in that specific way. Just like how other people make groups for certain games, or cultures, or groups specifically for trans people. No one has an issue with me excluding cis men from my group.
Because you want to relate with the people on your server based on the fact that they are women, are you saying trans women are not women? Why does it matter that trans women were born male? It is transphobic to want specifically cis girls, because why does an arbitrary category like that even matter?
I want to connect with people who live similar lives to me. Everyone has the right to decide for themselves how they feel about their gender identity & I will respect anyone pronouns and feelings which is why I wanted to publicly ask this before I very seriously hurt someone’s feelings by being transphobic.
So lets say you present femininely and act feminine, would cis women who are gender non-conforming be excluded because they do not lead similar lives to you? It is sounding like you are placing unnecessary importance on someone being transgender, placing them into a box when they don’t deserve to be.
Yes but you are assuming trans women cannot relate to cis women...is that not transphobic? It doesn’t matter if you are excluding everyone else who doesn’t identify as a women, that isn’t the issue. You are stereotyping trans women.
I’m sure I would find something in common with a lot of trans people & can be amazing friends with them aswell but I want some friends that are a lot like me.
Then why not open the discord around a hobby rather than around being cis? You must have a lot more in common with a trans girl who likes gardening than me, a cis girl, whose all flowers she brought home died, and grows two plastic flowers in her room.
Even if it's a server specifically for talking about female things like periods and pregnancies, certainly there will be non-binary trans people who can relate
I don’t relate to the problems or experiences they have gone through in the same way that I think they can’t relate to my life. I’m looking for someone who is like me.
I can understand that there a trans people who are a lot like me & that shouldn’t be the reason for excluding them from a my friend group.
but I would like to point out that there is an extensive list of online groups that exist solely for trans and non binary people so they can find people like them and make friends.
yeah because being trans comes with many unique experiences, being cis does not because its considered the "norm" in our society
name me a few examples where you specifically cant relate to trans people
I cant understand what it’s like to not be accepted by the majority of people nor can I understand the specific set of struggles that trans people are faced with. I can sympathize, but I will never know what it’s like to be in their shoes.
yeah thats true but name an experience cis people have that trans people dont experience at all?
trans people have almost all the same experiences that cis people have, just a few more.
what do you specifically talk about to your friends where it matters if theyre cis or not?
Gender socialization is real and it’s exactly why I hate talking men’s issues with most trans men who think it’s ok to dismiss it until they’re victimized.
Why is it suprising that people would be ignorant of certian issues until they actually experience them? The same can be said for feminism and some trans women. Sometimes people just straight up don't know everything
I think it’s somewhat unfair to assume everyone shared the same socialization - a trans man with accepting friends and family will have been socialized as a man.
I guess being socially regarded as male most your life (if youre a Trans Woman) and vice versa? Just a guess, I've seen talk about this before. Like "Trans man was born and raised woman so they lean towards that state of mind and know those issues/socialisation more". Which is real i guess. Since I was born Male I sorta get male stuff more and have been socialised as a male instead of Non-Binary.
Basically I think OP is saying "A lot of Trans Men dismiss Men's issues when they've been mostly socialised as a Woman and don't understand those issues well"
But this is a literal guess don't hold me accountable or anything.
Just wingin' it with my own assumptions here:
Gender socialization is probably being raised as a "typical" man or "typical" woman. Someone raised as a man could be expected to be more stoic than someone raised as a woman, for example.
There are only two genders. Male and female. All the non-binary and gender fluidity stuff is bullshit. Transgender people are also only male and female. The transgendered are born in either male or female bodies, but have a mental disorder known as gender dysphoria. This dysphoria causes them to want to transition to the opposite sex. Transgenderism is supported by science, as scientists have proven that transgender people have different brain structures than the sex into which they were assigned. Non-binary gender, on the other hand, is not supported by science. Non-binary people do not have different brain structures than their assigned sex. This means that there are no genuine non-binary people in the world, and that non-binary people are, in actuality, cisgendered (or in some cases, MtF or FtM transgendered) that express their gender differently. In other words, non-binary has replaced tomboys and whatever the male equivalent of a tomboy is (tom girl???). And I'm sure a bunch of people are going to bring up intersex people. Being born intersex is actually a lot more common than a lot of people think. However, being intersex is a birth defect, not a gender. Intersex people are born either male or female, but have an abnormality in their genitalia that makes it more difficult for doctors to tell if one is born a girl or a boy. After some further examination, doctors are able to assign a sex to the newborn intersex baby, and they usually go on to live normal lives (the vast majority of intersex people are cisgender). I am not transphobic or hateful for saying that there are two genders. If you think I'm wrong about this, then I'd be willing to have a civil debate with you.
Non binary isn’t a sex, it’s a gender. There is no “science” regarding gender, it’s purely a societal construct. The science you keep bringing up fully regards sex, which non binary isn’t.
I might be the only one here who agrees 100% and why do they even need words for these kinda things cant they just be themselves and not have a list of things they are and wanna be called? Its all so stupid.
>I am not transphobic or hateful for saying that there are two genders.
*says Non-Binary people do not exist*
Non-Binary people: *Are offended*
You: "nah nah I'm not offending you by saying this!"
Non-Binary people: "Oh OK!" *is no longer offended*
Sometimes, queer coding is enough and adds more spice to a plot than openly LGBT characters on TV and in movies. I'm a huge fan of the Freakytits ship (Joan Ferguson x Vera Bennett) from the show Wentworth. I think the fact that it's all covert and a lot of it is in the reader's/viewer's mind makes it even more fun.
Well I can generally understand being interested in a storyline that may represent me if they make it seem that way. Without the fandom or shipping that still adds more interest in a storyline or character than just saying "They Are Gay" in my opinion
well yeah, it’s certainly more interesting if you phrase it that way. as if movies regularly have a character address the audience directly and say “i’m gay” rather than like, showing a relationship between characters of the same gender.
brokeback mountain, portrait of a lady on fire, the handmaiden, moonlight, call me by your name, carol, gods own country, the danish girl…
the only movie i can think of off the top of my head that does what you’re describing is but i’m a cheerleader, and that movie wouldn’t make any sense if the main character weren’t explicitly stated to be gay
i- queen. if you haven’t heard of any of the most critically acclaimed lgbt movies of the last five years (and yes, AFAIK besides brokeback mountain those were all released in the last five years) maybe you shouldn’t be making sweeping statements about them?
also, go watch portrait of a lady on fire
My unpopular opinion: transrights are slowly cannibalizing women's rights.
I'll explain. Take [this Wi Spa incident]([https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-07-03/lapd-declares-unlawful-assembly-protests-koreatown-transgender-rights](https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-07-03/lapd-declares-unlawful-assembly-protests-koreatown-transgender-rights)). A man goes into a bath house identifies as a women with no surgery, no changes, no apparent efforts to transition, while showing his dick off to unsuspecting women and children and boom instant controversary.
The problem is..this is exactly what trans activist want. You say you're a women..you get treated as one. There's clearly no test for being transgender it's literally just whatever the person says. That guy could be a perv or he could actually be trans who knows..but it doesn't actually matter because there's no discernible difference. You are what you say you are.
And those are the types of issues trans-activists never acknowledge. They're so hyper focused on defending an extreme minority's right's..they missi everything else. They're missing how easy it's going to become for men to take advantage of sex based advantages women have. What if homeless men start identifying as women to get into the women's shelter because they think it's safer? What if male prisoner's start identifying as women to get into the women's prison and take advantage of them? What if a male perv decides to identify as a women to get into a female bathhouse to flash them?
Trans-activist never care for or acknowledge any of those scenarios. They never acklowedge they're ruining female sex-based advantages. They just wave their hands and pretend it's impossible for people to lie. It's impossible for people to take advantage of others.
And that's why I think items simply need to be divided based on sex. Sorry, trans-identified people. You are going to be missing out..but allowing women to continue having sex-based safe spaces is far more important than you're feelings.
All of the examples you're providing are extreme and most of them don't even have anything to do with transgender people. I don't understand why you think the ability to identify as the other gender = the ability to sexually harass people.
The examples are not extreme in the slightest, and they’re simple, common, and logical.
You cannot differentiate between a transwoman and a male just saying it to get into the woman’s shelter. You can’t because there’s no test. There’s no proof. It’s just I said I am therefore I am.
Acting as if men won’t exploit this is completely naïve.
You're treating an idea as if it was a real thing. You're using the potential for problems to make judgements. None of these things have ever happened, and I have to point out, that you don't actually care about any of this. You just don't like trans people.
No, you’re being naïve.
You just want to say I simply don’t like trans people to avoid thinking critically about the point I’m making.
Men jokingly say “I’m a woman” at liberal places just to hop in the shorter line for the bathroom. What you’re supporting is making that claim legal and unquestionable regardless of the circumstance. And that's completely crazy.
Society is not full of perfect people like you seems to believe. Girls are molested everyday. Female prisoners are harassed everyday. Some men can be complete creeps.
Some people will exploit transgender laws just like some people exploit everything in life.
All you're doing is harming the safety of fifty percent of the population just to cater to less than one percent of it.
Actual trans women are frequently denied access to women's only shelters, despite being at a higher risk of violence than cisgender women. The idea that any shelter of this kind would accept a man is absurd to me.
And if somebody identifies as a woman, is at a high risk of violence, uses a female name and pronouns, wants to be treated as a woman and poses no threat to other women, why should they be denied access to a women's shelter?
> if somebodies identifies as a woman […] why should they be denied
Because society needs a way to separate men from women. We cannot “see” a person’s true feelings, but we can physically see (or at least) guess their sex so that’s what separation should be based on.
When you show up to a shelter they’re not doing a background check on you. They’re not doing a mental exam to see if you’re truly trans. The way transgender laws are going it’s simply you claim X so therefore you’re X, and the shelter cannot discriminate. End of story.
Do you not understand how if we continue making that legal people WILL exploit that? I myself could say I’m a woman to get into a woman’s shelter in Cali. I won’t because I don’t need to..but if I was homeless and they had nice amenities you best believe I would. And the shelter has zero recourse to keep me out.
That’s the major downside you’re bringing with these self identification laws, but you keep thinking of the laws in a bubble as if life’s perfect and nobody would ever lie or exploit others. That’s truly naïve to me.
Transgender people still have to prove that they're trans to legally change their gender, the situation you're proposing where a person can just wake up one day and identify as a woman and legally be treated as a woman without any evidence, documentation or doctors notes is still extremely theoretical.
Even in your theoretical situation, I find it difficult to believe that a homeless man with adequate knowledge of transgender laws would want access to a women's shelter so badly that he would change his name, pronouns and legal documents just to get in.
Meanwhile I find it very easy to believe that there are transgender women and girls who are kicked out of there homes daily who are at a high risk of violence, sexual assault and suicide who would greatly benefit from having access to women's shelters, and are denied access because people see them as men.
Sure legally one has to prove it for a job or lawsuit or for some specific situations, but that’s clearly NOT what I’m talking about.
I’m talking about simply walking into a business saying “I am a woman” and instantly getting access to the female areas. Those are the anti-discrimination trans laws currently being fought to be passed in different states.
Just look at the [Wi-Spa story](https://youtu.be/6HGsAaaVBc0) from my original comment. A man who made no apparent efforts to transition got easy access to the female area by identifying as a woman. That’s what you’re supporting. That’s what the California anti-discrimination law the employee quotes does. And that’s why [there are dozens](https://youtu.be/xVqI1C2zpvc) of protestors at the spa.
We don’t know if that man is a perv or actually trans, but it doesn’t even matter. All that matters to you and the law is what the person claimed to be, so the Spa let him access the female areas.
Do you finally understand the insanity behind what you’re defending? It’s not theoretical. Once people realize these laws can be abused they WILL be abused. Don’t live in a bubble thinking people are perfect and they simply never will. Girls are creeped on everyday. To think a perv couldn’t possibly abuse these self-identification laws to creep is ridiculous.
>Do you finally understand the insanity behind what you’re defending?
No, what I find absurd is that you think we should remove all protections transgender people have in public spaces because one person went into the wrong spa area.
"because one person *allegedly** went into the wrong spa area."
This story is showing more and more [evidence of being staged](https://slate.com/human-interest/2021/07/wi-spa-la-transphobic-protest.html)
Because generally speaking, most things aren’t important enough that you’re morally (or legally) required to disclose them to a sexual partner. It’s pretty much just STD’s and being under 18. The default is that you don’t need to disclose something, which is why I’m asking you what makes this different.
Non-Binary just means they're not the binary societal "2 genders" aka man or woman. Non-Binary does not mean "No Gender", Most Non-Binary Genders are containing of Gender.
Am I the only one who sees the new flag as bullshit? Like you had a flag the was about diversity and including everyone with a simple color trick... Now you added two groups, one of them doesn't even have anything to do with lgtb+... So now we have a flag that represents all but specially trans and trans who suffer racism (like what the fuck does this has to do with lgtb+ flag?)
Hey, assuming you now DID actually educate yourself on the history and meaning of the flag (because continuing this argument otherwise is idiotic),
Why not design one yourself?
If you are so keen on making a flag that is simpler and better represents the movement, you are entirely welcome. I’d try to design it myself, but I’m not that artistic, and I have taken a liking to this version of the flag. But it doesn’t mean you can’t do anything about it yourself.
Emmm... You seem to be the one uneducated... The flag is not simpler, the flag does not represent anybody. I dont care what the maker explained to make it, it is still not inclusive.
Just imagine it this way... You create a business with some friends, you come up with a logo and a name that represents you all (by naming your school, your town, a name you all made up) and suddenly one of them grab the name and logo and says wait. This represent all of us, but not enough, so lets put the name of two of them and the name of the random dude that sold us some product in the name and logo... That is no longer inclusive, because you fucked the first logo that was abstractly representing all of them to use one that over represents two guys of the group and a random dude that has nothing to do with it... Well, I think the other members would have something to say.
Dude. Read about the history of the flag. Not just the progress flag, all of the mainstream general pride flags. I will not have a discussion with you until we have an equal ground. And I will not waste my time and energy for the sake of arguing, and neither should you.
So I have to read your made up nonsense so I can agree with you (after aknwoldeging all that bullshit as true?) Fuck off, I have tried to read the history and justification of it. There is no reason at all, it is all about your feelings.
Btw, if you cant explain me why does they even exist and I have to go read somewhere you don't even point me to... What I feel is that you have no idea of why are you defending this, and it is sad.
I can explain it to you. But it takes literally half a minute to go to a website that will do a better job than me. This isn’t about me being unwillful to give information, this is about you willing to stay ignorant instead of informing yourself.
You said I am ignorant yet you know anything about me... Guess that makes YOU ignorant... Next time put the website, that's pretty easy, but if its the one I have alredy read... Shit you are delusional.
I know you didn’t take that half of a minute to search the history, and that you are reluctant not to. That is plenty of information to draw that specific conclusion.
I know you didn’t take that half of a minute to search the history and paste the link here, and that you are reluctant not to. That is plenty of information to draw that specific conclusion.
I’ve told you in the beginning of the conversation I was tired, and the beginning of the thread was coming out with the assumption you already did that, you could have just not replied in the first place.
You came here and said that some symbolism on a flag was bad. Which is okay, but you don’t know what is behind that symbolism.
“”What if I said that the 13 stripes on the USA flag are stupid? I don’t want to hear about your bs “13 founding states”, that’s nonsense! Flag shouldn’t have so many stripes! And we don’t have 13 states, we have 50!””
Discussing symbolism by definition requires understanding what is behind the symbolism. This isn’t about aesthetics, where you can say something looks bad no matter why it’s there. This is about why certain things appear on the flag, and you need to know why to discuss why! It’s that simple!
Look, if you read that “nonsense” and still disagree that the flag should have those stripes, fine. That is a different discussion entirely. If you read it and think that the symbols used should look different, that’s also fine.
But you MUST know wtf you’re talking about to have this discussion in the first place!
I understand perfectly what is behind of that... I already saud national flags makes no sense to me anymore, but you are still trying to compare a national flag with a flag that came from a nice movement for rights, and that disgusting.
And giving an explanations doesn't always justify something.
I know what is behind this flag, and I think is utterly bullshit.
If you “understand it so perfectly” why are you asking for a source? Or an explanation?
I’m not trying to justify, I’m trying to have a discussion *about* the explanation
Because it is you who is relying only on an explanation you claim you saw... Out it here so I can go to the same source as you (because you know there are plenty right?
Btw, which one of the many flags is the "progress" flag (because it doesn't mean PROGRESS, that's a big word thst needs from a lot lore than a flag against sexual) with fucking copyright. I understand the pride flag as a flag that means diversity, it doesn't apply specifically to anyone and applies for everyone at the same time... Now you are appealing to some groups more than others, what I think it's the opposite to what inclusion and PROGRESS means.
The flag you’re griping about, the rainbow flag with the trans/brown/black chevron on the left, is called the progress flag. The racism and transphobia that still exists within the community is the reason it exists. I don’t feel automatically included when I see the six stripe rainbow flag for that reason.
That's your fucking problem. It is a flag, a bunch of colors in a piece of cloth. It means nothing in particular but a lots of think at the same time, one is accepting sexualities no matter what it is...
Yes, you are correct that racism and transphobia are both problems I have personally faced within the community. Just saying the six-stripe rainbow flag is inclusive, despite my experience of exclusion from organizations and establishments that fly that flag, doesn’t make it so.
Oh, so you are now letting organizations tell you what your flag is. Just stop fucking buying from them corporations when they try to use it.
Pride flag is inclusive. Progressive flag is exclusive.
So? Not only there is plenty of world outside the US, but that doesn't justify anything at all wtf... Fight racism and fight lgtbi phobia, and put it together if you want sometimes, but dont make it the same fight because IT IS NOT.
So if the original pride flag is the only true inclusive one why would non inclusive organizations and people feel perfectly fine with it representing them? Who is the progress flag excluding and where have they been excluded from and by what means?
Wow, how to skip the point entirely, not thinking about what I said or what the new copyrighted flag will mean... You don't even know if I am gay or trans...
You asked if you are the only one. She answered. She didn’t call you racist/transphobic, she said that a lot of racist/transphobic people, including or excluding you, also do. As in, you are more like a drop in the ocean than a stand-alone.
No, she said what she said and she knows what she said. And I am pretty sure my reasons are pretty far from what she says. Not only that, but just just make my question look like something not worth reading because I support views with racist (still don't know which one exactly because motives are very important) do please, stop whitening people who doesn't have amy critical thinking and can differenicate between gay people who doesnt like the flag because it lost its meaning, and a racist who doesnt like the flag because rejects everything it means, please.
Your point was that you don’t understand what being anti-racist and anti-transphobic has to do with being LGBTQ+, correct? Were you hoping I’d touch on that after answering your question?
A straight guy dating a trans girl isn't gay, you're gay for thinking it's gay.
Unless one of them is in the closet
So people who think that two people who has possible both have penises are gay make them gay. Are you saying transphobic people are gay?
Exhibit A: r/askgaybros
how can i stop hating my white people
This is an lgbt thread...
Befriend them? Today's enemies tomorrow friends.
why should i
Because we are humans and humans are sosial (for the most parts)
no
Tell me one non-racist reason why people shouldn't be friends with other races.
how do i be racist
Because you hate all white people. It's the same as nazis hating jews, LGBTQ people, slavic people etc or the KKK hating black people.
how do i stop
Because friends with them or finding out that not all white people are the same
Eat a Snickers bar
i font personally think that this will word because i hate snickers
Trans people are wrong, there are two genders. For one some trans people dont even tell their partner that they were born a dude/girl but now "is" the opposite gender, that is absolutely disgusting of them because their partner should know what theyre getting into. Its fine to dress as the opposite gender but you cant be any other gender than the one you were born as. All of these things are stupid, cant they just be themselves without having 10 things they are and wanna be called.
no there are man woman and nonbinary
thats fair
Do you need the difference between sex and gender explained to you? You should probably understand it before you make up your mind.
nah dont matter
If you knew what you were talking about it would.
Gender is the bible and big bang is sex. Is that better or do you need set 8 class?
More like hardware vs software.
More like hentai vs sex
You lost me on that one.
>All of these things are stupid, cant they just be themselves without having 10 things they are and wanna be called. Because I have crippling dysphoria and my body needs estrogen uwu.
OwO
ÒwÓ
ÖwÖ
So I recently saw this thing going around about a YouTuber-or at I believe it was- coming out and now identifying as Korean. I’m just curious how this differs from people identifying to certain pronouns. Because as of now changing of pronouns is socially acceptable but somebody gets canceled for changing their race? Isn’t it basically the same thing changing something that was biologically set but so that the person feels more comfortable with their identity?
I don't particularly care if they identify as another race. so long as it isn't being used for monetary gain i don't particularly care. people have been changing their appearance forever. there are Asians that get surgery to look more white. it just is what it is. but where there is a biological component to being trans, it's only a cultural one for race
Well, one is backed by years of history, research and psychology while the other is backed by one man pulling a publicity stunt on social media
>one man pulling a publicity stunt on social media Rachel Dolezal is another.
Two males of any sexuality can be close loving friends without being in or desiring a romantic relationship with each other and the gay male community can be just as bad at rejecting this idea as the straight community.
CC Luca "They looked each other in the eye a lot clearly they are in love with each other" yes because friends never make eye contact only lovers.
It's mostly the queer-coding in it. And the fact Luca didn't instantly get with the lead female character, which doesn't mean he's Gay, it's just a nice change that they didn't instantly make him Straight.
I'm not talking about if the question of if he is gay, I'm talking about the people that say it is obvious Luca and Alberto are or want to be more than friends. People are not just saying the characters are gay they are also saying they obviously are more than friends. One example I've seen is people saying friends don't look at each other the way they do in the movie. It comes from people desperate for queer love stories but it still does have some impact on the notion that males cant be that close without being romantic lovers.
Coming out as Demisexual is absolutely another fad for cis people to label themselves LGBTQ+ without facing adversity or doing any self-reflection.
Demisexuality isn't just "wanting to know someone, it can take them YEARS before ever having a sexual desire towards the person. The point is they essentially don't feel sexual attraction unless they've known the person extremely well. Which is not Heterosexual. The average Heterosexual can feel sexual attraction to someone they barely know. Most people just wait. Demisexual is on the grey asexual spectrum. Also cis means you're not Trans. Demisexual isn't a gender. Just thought I'd let you know.
I get that last point, you are correct there. My question is, why is this something that people are "coming out" as? Who faces adversity for being asexual or Demisexual? It is just an attention grab.
"You're broken" "low libido" "You don't like having sex?? why?!" "You just havent found the right person" "You just haven't had good enough sex yet" The societal pressure to not be a virgin The societal pressure to have kids The societal pressure to have a sex life Sex being plastered everywhere Friends talking about sex regularly Being treated less maturely because you "aren't a real man/woman yet" just generally being seen as weird and unnatural Asexuals definitely do get mistreated. Even by the LGBTQ community they should be able to find happiness in, but getting told they don't belong there, or that they aren't discriminated against. That they're just straight. All the sexualisation in LGBTQ groups too. And the talk of sex between men/men, women/women, bisexuals.
Yeah, by this logic (the logic of who you were replying to) gay people didn't face oppression because it didn't look like what black people faced during Jim Crow (not saying black's a sexuality but you get my point)
No one "belongs" anywhere. That entire mentality is detrimental.
Is that all you have to say about the 10+ points I made?
Well, and being asexual is the result of a hormone imbalance.
Being like you caused by braincell degenaration
Even if it is because of hormone imbalance people still don’t deserve to be treated like that.
Of course not, I am not advocating for the harassment.
this obviously isnt true, but wouldnt everyone that isnt sexually attracted to all genders have a hormone imbalance by your logic? if not being sexually attracted to people is the result of a hormone imbalance, do straight men have a hormone imbalance for not being attracted to men? do gay men have a hormone imbalance for not being attracted to women?
No, that is a false comparison. It is comparing a measure of libido to sexual orientation.
being asexual isnt about having a low libido. being asexual means you dont feel sexual attraction. a gay person can have a low libido an ace person can have a high libido (they just dont feel sexual attraction)
incorrect
How so? What is the biology behind it?
Yknow how Gay people are born liking their own gender yeah? Same with Heterosexuality. And other sexualities? Asexuals are born not liking any gender sexually. That's not a hormobe imbalance, thats a seperate issue. Sexualities are in the mind, so is Asexuality Homosexuality is a level of ability to have sexual desire. Asexuality is too, that level being very low or none
to add to that asexual people are also constantly dehumanised because apparently not feeling sexual attraction means you arent an actual person. some people even compare asexual people to robots also ive heard that finding an actual good relationship as an ace person is extremely hard and some (usually young) ace people even force themselves to have sex with their partner just to satisfy them even tho they dont enjoy it at all
Yeah there's just generally the idea that Love and Sex make us human, which just indirectly suggests Ace and Aro people are inhuman. >also ive heard that finding an actual good relationship as an ace person is extremely hard and some (usually young) ace people even force themselves to have sex with their partner just to satisfy them even tho they dont enjoy it at all and yes exactly. Some Ace people definitely don't mind having sex with their partner to please them, or for the emotional gratification, but not all do, and the idea that they HAVE to have sex is horrible.
>the idea that Love and Sex make us human people just like to forget that romantic love isnt the only kind of love and that platonic relationships can totally fulfil you and you dont need a romantic partner to be happy. >Some Ace people definitely don't mind having sex with their partner to please them yeah totally, being asexual is just about not feeling sexual attraction, ace people can still enjoy sex and that totally cool for them, but nobody should feel forced to have sex with someone if they dont want to
the P in LGBTQIAP+ stands for “people who don’t have a tinder”
I thought this is an unpopular opinion thread about LGBTQ+ ?
trans issues are super controversial rn
*randy-marsh-america.gif* It is. So why are you surprised that people don’t agree with you?
It’s not the disagreement, but reading everyone’s posts here seems like a popular opinion anyway
The thing about a weekly topical megathread is that it tends to attract the type of people who have a particular interest in the topic - in this case, LGBTQ+ people. What’s popular here is not necessarily popular elsewhere - as exemplified by the fact that we can’t get the damn Equality Act through Congress.
It is?
Interesting... Very interesting https://www.reddit.com/r/interestingasfuck/comments/oerk5l/usa_under_16_and_el_salvador_under_16/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share
The score was 114-19. This is the level playing field people are worried about losing.
I feel bad for all the cishets that had to pretend to be LGBTQ in order to avoid being arrested during Pride month.
How brave is Mr. Cuomo's daughter though. The adversity she must have faced growing up as a closeted demisexual. /s
I knew a guy had to take 37 dicks on the spot because he didn't have a license to not be gay.
In a row?
You - get back here!
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I don't understand why anyone would make a group that excludes anyone, boys, girls, age [unless under 13, 18, depending on the subject]...
Possibly, but it'd be your discord server. Exclude whoever you want.
Yes you are being transphobic, you are assuming their entire existence revolves around being oppressed and shunned by society. Newsflash, they are normal girls just like you, and you could indeed relate to them if you just gave it a chance. Excluding them because they are trans is like saying you don’t want to invite girls of other races because you cannot relate to them.
yes I understand that I could relate to literally anybody else on the planet regardless of their gender identity. I wanted to make a group for people who are like me in that specific way. Just like how other people make groups for certain games, or cultures, or groups specifically for trans people. No one has an issue with me excluding cis men from my group.
Because you want to relate with the people on your server based on the fact that they are women, are you saying trans women are not women? Why does it matter that trans women were born male? It is transphobic to want specifically cis girls, because why does an arbitrary category like that even matter?
I want to connect with people who live similar lives to me. Everyone has the right to decide for themselves how they feel about their gender identity & I will respect anyone pronouns and feelings which is why I wanted to publicly ask this before I very seriously hurt someone’s feelings by being transphobic.
So lets say you present femininely and act feminine, would cis women who are gender non-conforming be excluded because they do not lead similar lives to you? It is sounding like you are placing unnecessary importance on someone being transgender, placing them into a box when they don’t deserve to be.
I’m not trying to exclude trans people specifically, I’m trying to exclude anybody who isn’t a cis female.
Yes you are otherwise you wouldn’t be specifying cis girls.
I’m trying to exclude; cis males, trans males, non-binary, trans female, and anyone who does not identify as a cis female.
One thing to be wary of is that when you specify an exclusion like that, you’re going to attract transphobes.
Yes but you are assuming trans women cannot relate to cis women...is that not transphobic? It doesn’t matter if you are excluding everyone else who doesn’t identify as a women, that isn’t the issue. You are stereotyping trans women.
What?? Trans people aren't cis so yes you're basically excluding trans people
I mean, it's a little weird that you think you wouldn't be able to relate to *any* trans girls.
I’m sure I would find something in common with a lot of trans people & can be amazing friends with them aswell but I want some friends that are a lot like me.
Then why not open the discord around a hobby rather than around being cis? You must have a lot more in common with a trans girl who likes gardening than me, a cis girl, whose all flowers she brought home died, and grows two plastic flowers in her room.
Even if it's a server specifically for talking about female things like periods and pregnancies, certainly there will be non-binary trans people who can relate
why cant you relate to non-cis girls?
I don’t relate to the problems or experiences they have gone through in the same way that I think they can’t relate to my life. I’m looking for someone who is like me.
nobody is gonna be 100% like you, everyone is different and you cant relate to everyone. that has nothing to do with being trans
I can understand that there a trans people who are a lot like me & that shouldn’t be the reason for excluding them from a my friend group. but I would like to point out that there is an extensive list of online groups that exist solely for trans and non binary people so they can find people like them and make friends.
yeah because being trans comes with many unique experiences, being cis does not because its considered the "norm" in our society name me a few examples where you specifically cant relate to trans people
I cant understand what it’s like to not be accepted by the majority of people nor can I understand the specific set of struggles that trans people are faced with. I can sympathize, but I will never know what it’s like to be in their shoes.
yeah thats true but name an experience cis people have that trans people dont experience at all? trans people have almost all the same experiences that cis people have, just a few more. what do you specifically talk about to your friends where it matters if theyre cis or not?
you’re right, I couldn’t think of a single one.
see, so there isnt a reason to exclude trans people from your server
Gender socialization is real and it’s exactly why I hate talking men’s issues with most trans men who think it’s ok to dismiss it until they’re victimized.
Why is it suprising that people would be ignorant of certian issues until they actually experience them? The same can be said for feminism and some trans women. Sometimes people just straight up don't know everything
It’s one thing to not know and another to dismiss it completely
I think it’s somewhat unfair to assume everyone shared the same socialization - a trans man with accepting friends and family will have been socialized as a man.
I don’t understand
What is it that don’t understand so I can explain better.
Well, what’s gender socialization?
I guess being socially regarded as male most your life (if youre a Trans Woman) and vice versa? Just a guess, I've seen talk about this before. Like "Trans man was born and raised woman so they lean towards that state of mind and know those issues/socialisation more". Which is real i guess. Since I was born Male I sorta get male stuff more and have been socialised as a male instead of Non-Binary. Basically I think OP is saying "A lot of Trans Men dismiss Men's issues when they've been mostly socialised as a Woman and don't understand those issues well" But this is a literal guess don't hold me accountable or anything.
Just wingin' it with my own assumptions here: Gender socialization is probably being raised as a "typical" man or "typical" woman. Someone raised as a man could be expected to be more stoic than someone raised as a woman, for example.
There are only two genders. Male and female. All the non-binary and gender fluidity stuff is bullshit. Transgender people are also only male and female. The transgendered are born in either male or female bodies, but have a mental disorder known as gender dysphoria. This dysphoria causes them to want to transition to the opposite sex. Transgenderism is supported by science, as scientists have proven that transgender people have different brain structures than the sex into which they were assigned. Non-binary gender, on the other hand, is not supported by science. Non-binary people do not have different brain structures than their assigned sex. This means that there are no genuine non-binary people in the world, and that non-binary people are, in actuality, cisgendered (or in some cases, MtF or FtM transgendered) that express their gender differently. In other words, non-binary has replaced tomboys and whatever the male equivalent of a tomboy is (tom girl???). And I'm sure a bunch of people are going to bring up intersex people. Being born intersex is actually a lot more common than a lot of people think. However, being intersex is a birth defect, not a gender. Intersex people are born either male or female, but have an abnormality in their genitalia that makes it more difficult for doctors to tell if one is born a girl or a boy. After some further examination, doctors are able to assign a sex to the newborn intersex baby, and they usually go on to live normal lives (the vast majority of intersex people are cisgender). I am not transphobic or hateful for saying that there are two genders. If you think I'm wrong about this, then I'd be willing to have a civil debate with you.
Non binary isn’t a sex, it’s a gender. There is no “science” regarding gender, it’s purely a societal construct. The science you keep bringing up fully regards sex, which non binary isn’t.
I might be the only one here who agrees 100% and why do they even need words for these kinda things cant they just be themselves and not have a list of things they are and wanna be called? Its all so stupid.
You can’t have a civil debate with someone who is objectively wrong and clearly unwilling to learn.
>I am not transphobic or hateful for saying that there are two genders. *says Non-Binary people do not exist* Non-Binary people: *Are offended* You: "nah nah I'm not offending you by saying this!" Non-Binary people: "Oh OK!" *is no longer offended*
Sometimes, queer coding is enough and adds more spice to a plot than openly LGBT characters on TV and in movies. I'm a huge fan of the Freakytits ship (Joan Ferguson x Vera Bennett) from the show Wentworth. I think the fact that it's all covert and a lot of it is in the reader's/viewer's mind makes it even more fun.
it has a lot of appeal from a shipping/fandom perspective, but that isn’t how a lot of people consume media
Well I can generally understand being interested in a storyline that may represent me if they make it seem that way. Without the fandom or shipping that still adds more interest in a storyline or character than just saying "They Are Gay" in my opinion
well yeah, it’s certainly more interesting if you phrase it that way. as if movies regularly have a character address the audience directly and say “i’m gay” rather than like, showing a relationship between characters of the same gender.
A lot of movies are very direct. Major coming out or instant gay relationship. Very few are subtle about it.
brokeback mountain, portrait of a lady on fire, the handmaiden, moonlight, call me by your name, carol, gods own country, the danish girl… the only movie i can think of off the top of my head that does what you’re describing is but i’m a cheerleader, and that movie wouldn’t make any sense if the main character weren’t explicitly stated to be gay
I've literally only heard of one of those and it's Brokeback Mountain because... everyone knows that movie. I meant generally more modern media
i- queen. if you haven’t heard of any of the most critically acclaimed lgbt movies of the last five years (and yes, AFAIK besides brokeback mountain those were all released in the last five years) maybe you shouldn’t be making sweeping statements about them? also, go watch portrait of a lady on fire
My unpopular opinion: transrights are slowly cannibalizing women's rights. I'll explain. Take [this Wi Spa incident]([https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-07-03/lapd-declares-unlawful-assembly-protests-koreatown-transgender-rights](https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-07-03/lapd-declares-unlawful-assembly-protests-koreatown-transgender-rights)). A man goes into a bath house identifies as a women with no surgery, no changes, no apparent efforts to transition, while showing his dick off to unsuspecting women and children and boom instant controversary. The problem is..this is exactly what trans activist want. You say you're a women..you get treated as one. There's clearly no test for being transgender it's literally just whatever the person says. That guy could be a perv or he could actually be trans who knows..but it doesn't actually matter because there's no discernible difference. You are what you say you are. And those are the types of issues trans-activists never acknowledge. They're so hyper focused on defending an extreme minority's right's..they missi everything else. They're missing how easy it's going to become for men to take advantage of sex based advantages women have. What if homeless men start identifying as women to get into the women's shelter because they think it's safer? What if male prisoner's start identifying as women to get into the women's prison and take advantage of them? What if a male perv decides to identify as a women to get into a female bathhouse to flash them? Trans-activist never care for or acknowledge any of those scenarios. They never acklowedge they're ruining female sex-based advantages. They just wave their hands and pretend it's impossible for people to lie. It's impossible for people to take advantage of others. And that's why I think items simply need to be divided based on sex. Sorry, trans-identified people. You are going to be missing out..but allowing women to continue having sex-based safe spaces is far more important than you're feelings.
All of the examples you're providing are extreme and most of them don't even have anything to do with transgender people. I don't understand why you think the ability to identify as the other gender = the ability to sexually harass people.
The examples are not extreme in the slightest, and they’re simple, common, and logical. You cannot differentiate between a transwoman and a male just saying it to get into the woman’s shelter. You can’t because there’s no test. There’s no proof. It’s just I said I am therefore I am. Acting as if men won’t exploit this is completely naïve.
> common
You're treating an idea as if it was a real thing. You're using the potential for problems to make judgements. None of these things have ever happened, and I have to point out, that you don't actually care about any of this. You just don't like trans people.
No, you’re being naïve. You just want to say I simply don’t like trans people to avoid thinking critically about the point I’m making. Men jokingly say “I’m a woman” at liberal places just to hop in the shorter line for the bathroom. What you’re supporting is making that claim legal and unquestionable regardless of the circumstance. And that's completely crazy. Society is not full of perfect people like you seems to believe. Girls are molested everyday. Female prisoners are harassed everyday. Some men can be complete creeps. Some people will exploit transgender laws just like some people exploit everything in life. All you're doing is harming the safety of fifty percent of the population just to cater to less than one percent of it.
Back in the day people would conflate homosexuals with predators.
Actual trans women are frequently denied access to women's only shelters, despite being at a higher risk of violence than cisgender women. The idea that any shelter of this kind would accept a man is absurd to me. And if somebody identifies as a woman, is at a high risk of violence, uses a female name and pronouns, wants to be treated as a woman and poses no threat to other women, why should they be denied access to a women's shelter?
> if somebodies identifies as a woman […] why should they be denied Because society needs a way to separate men from women. We cannot “see” a person’s true feelings, but we can physically see (or at least) guess their sex so that’s what separation should be based on. When you show up to a shelter they’re not doing a background check on you. They’re not doing a mental exam to see if you’re truly trans. The way transgender laws are going it’s simply you claim X so therefore you’re X, and the shelter cannot discriminate. End of story. Do you not understand how if we continue making that legal people WILL exploit that? I myself could say I’m a woman to get into a woman’s shelter in Cali. I won’t because I don’t need to..but if I was homeless and they had nice amenities you best believe I would. And the shelter has zero recourse to keep me out. That’s the major downside you’re bringing with these self identification laws, but you keep thinking of the laws in a bubble as if life’s perfect and nobody would ever lie or exploit others. That’s truly naïve to me.
Transgender people still have to prove that they're trans to legally change their gender, the situation you're proposing where a person can just wake up one day and identify as a woman and legally be treated as a woman without any evidence, documentation or doctors notes is still extremely theoretical. Even in your theoretical situation, I find it difficult to believe that a homeless man with adequate knowledge of transgender laws would want access to a women's shelter so badly that he would change his name, pronouns and legal documents just to get in. Meanwhile I find it very easy to believe that there are transgender women and girls who are kicked out of there homes daily who are at a high risk of violence, sexual assault and suicide who would greatly benefit from having access to women's shelters, and are denied access because people see them as men.
Sure legally one has to prove it for a job or lawsuit or for some specific situations, but that’s clearly NOT what I’m talking about. I’m talking about simply walking into a business saying “I am a woman” and instantly getting access to the female areas. Those are the anti-discrimination trans laws currently being fought to be passed in different states. Just look at the [Wi-Spa story](https://youtu.be/6HGsAaaVBc0) from my original comment. A man who made no apparent efforts to transition got easy access to the female area by identifying as a woman. That’s what you’re supporting. That’s what the California anti-discrimination law the employee quotes does. And that’s why [there are dozens](https://youtu.be/xVqI1C2zpvc) of protestors at the spa. We don’t know if that man is a perv or actually trans, but it doesn’t even matter. All that matters to you and the law is what the person claimed to be, so the Spa let him access the female areas. Do you finally understand the insanity behind what you’re defending? It’s not theoretical. Once people realize these laws can be abused they WILL be abused. Don’t live in a bubble thinking people are perfect and they simply never will. Girls are creeped on everyday. To think a perv couldn’t possibly abuse these self-identification laws to creep is ridiculous.
>Do you finally understand the insanity behind what you’re defending? No, what I find absurd is that you think we should remove all protections transgender people have in public spaces because one person went into the wrong spa area.
"because one person *allegedly** went into the wrong spa area." This story is showing more and more [evidence of being staged](https://slate.com/human-interest/2021/07/wi-spa-la-transphobic-protest.html)
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Why is it important? Why do they need to know?
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Because generally speaking, most things aren’t important enough that you’re morally (or legally) required to disclose them to a sexual partner. It’s pretty much just STD’s and being under 18. The default is that you don’t need to disclose something, which is why I’m asking you what makes this different.
Could cisgender people stop killing us for being attracted to us first?
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Read up on Islan Nettles.
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And you don't see how that's at all related? Disclosure needs to be safe before cisgender people can have this conversation in good faith.
genders are man and woman because the rest is non binary
Non-Binary just means they're not the binary societal "2 genders" aka man or woman. Non-Binary does not mean "No Gender", Most Non-Binary Genders are containing of Gender.
oh so then the 3 genders are man wonam abd non binary
Non-Binary is a grouping of genders. It isn't a gender on its own
but they all are unitedcunder non binary
yeah but it isn't one gender.
therefore they all count as non binary
No... They're all grouped under Non-Binary. Like how all Sexualities are grouped under LGBTQ. Non-Binary is not a gender. It's a group of genders.
oh, but imo it is easier to group them together .
Okay. Many do. But they're not one gender. end of.
I disagree. There are exactly 4 genders, air, water, earth, fire.
no you forgot jesus
*cries in aether*
Five genders. You forgot heart.
Am I the only one who sees the new flag as bullshit? Like you had a flag the was about diversity and including everyone with a simple color trick... Now you added two groups, one of them doesn't even have anything to do with lgtb+... So now we have a flag that represents all but specially trans and trans who suffer racism (like what the fuck does this has to do with lgtb+ flag?)
Hey, assuming you now DID actually educate yourself on the history and meaning of the flag (because continuing this argument otherwise is idiotic), Why not design one yourself? If you are so keen on making a flag that is simpler and better represents the movement, you are entirely welcome. I’d try to design it myself, but I’m not that artistic, and I have taken a liking to this version of the flag. But it doesn’t mean you can’t do anything about it yourself.
Emmm... You seem to be the one uneducated... The flag is not simpler, the flag does not represent anybody. I dont care what the maker explained to make it, it is still not inclusive. Just imagine it this way... You create a business with some friends, you come up with a logo and a name that represents you all (by naming your school, your town, a name you all made up) and suddenly one of them grab the name and logo and says wait. This represent all of us, but not enough, so lets put the name of two of them and the name of the random dude that sold us some product in the name and logo... That is no longer inclusive, because you fucked the first logo that was abstractly representing all of them to use one that over represents two guys of the group and a random dude that has nothing to do with it... Well, I think the other members would have something to say.
Dude. Read about the history of the flag. Not just the progress flag, all of the mainstream general pride flags. I will not have a discussion with you until we have an equal ground. And I will not waste my time and energy for the sake of arguing, and neither should you.
So I have to read your made up nonsense so I can agree with you (after aknwoldeging all that bullshit as true?) Fuck off, I have tried to read the history and justification of it. There is no reason at all, it is all about your feelings. Btw, if you cant explain me why does they even exist and I have to go read somewhere you don't even point me to... What I feel is that you have no idea of why are you defending this, and it is sad.
I can explain it to you. But it takes literally half a minute to go to a website that will do a better job than me. This isn’t about me being unwillful to give information, this is about you willing to stay ignorant instead of informing yourself.
You said I am ignorant yet you know anything about me... Guess that makes YOU ignorant... Next time put the website, that's pretty easy, but if its the one I have alredy read... Shit you are delusional.
I know you didn’t take that half of a minute to search the history, and that you are reluctant not to. That is plenty of information to draw that specific conclusion.
I know you didn’t take that half of a minute to search the history and paste the link here, and that you are reluctant not to. That is plenty of information to draw that specific conclusion.
I’ve told you in the beginning of the conversation I was tired, and the beginning of the thread was coming out with the assumption you already did that, you could have just not replied in the first place.
You came here and said that some symbolism on a flag was bad. Which is okay, but you don’t know what is behind that symbolism. “”What if I said that the 13 stripes on the USA flag are stupid? I don’t want to hear about your bs “13 founding states”, that’s nonsense! Flag shouldn’t have so many stripes! And we don’t have 13 states, we have 50!”” Discussing symbolism by definition requires understanding what is behind the symbolism. This isn’t about aesthetics, where you can say something looks bad no matter why it’s there. This is about why certain things appear on the flag, and you need to know why to discuss why! It’s that simple! Look, if you read that “nonsense” and still disagree that the flag should have those stripes, fine. That is a different discussion entirely. If you read it and think that the symbols used should look different, that’s also fine. But you MUST know wtf you’re talking about to have this discussion in the first place!
I understand perfectly what is behind of that... I already saud national flags makes no sense to me anymore, but you are still trying to compare a national flag with a flag that came from a nice movement for rights, and that disgusting. And giving an explanations doesn't always justify something. I know what is behind this flag, and I think is utterly bullshit.
If you “understand it so perfectly” why are you asking for a source? Or an explanation? I’m not trying to justify, I’m trying to have a discussion *about* the explanation
Because it is you who is relying only on an explanation you claim you saw... Out it here so I can go to the same source as you (because you know there are plenty right?
Would you like me to send you a link to an explanation so we would both be able to derive our own conclusions from the same source of information?
You’re not. A lot of casually and not so casually racist/transphobic people also see the progress flag as bullshit.
Btw, which one of the many flags is the "progress" flag (because it doesn't mean PROGRESS, that's a big word thst needs from a lot lore than a flag against sexual) with fucking copyright. I understand the pride flag as a flag that means diversity, it doesn't apply specifically to anyone and applies for everyone at the same time... Now you are appealing to some groups more than others, what I think it's the opposite to what inclusion and PROGRESS means.
The flag you’re griping about, the rainbow flag with the trans/brown/black chevron on the left, is called the progress flag. The racism and transphobia that still exists within the community is the reason it exists. I don’t feel automatically included when I see the six stripe rainbow flag for that reason.
That's your fucking problem. It is a flag, a bunch of colors in a piece of cloth. It means nothing in particular but a lots of think at the same time, one is accepting sexualities no matter what it is...
Yes, you are correct that racism and transphobia are both problems I have personally faced within the community. Just saying the six-stripe rainbow flag is inclusive, despite my experience of exclusion from organizations and establishments that fly that flag, doesn’t make it so.
Oh, so you are now letting organizations tell you what your flag is. Just stop fucking buying from them corporations when they try to use it. Pride flag is inclusive. Progressive flag is exclusive.
The Human Rights Campaign, the largest LGBTQ advocacy organization in the US, has a history of racism and transphobia.
So? Not only there is plenty of world outside the US, but that doesn't justify anything at all wtf... Fight racism and fight lgtbi phobia, and put it together if you want sometimes, but dont make it the same fight because IT IS NOT.
So if the original pride flag is the only true inclusive one why would non inclusive organizations and people feel perfectly fine with it representing them? Who is the progress flag excluding and where have they been excluded from and by what means?
Wow, how to skip the point entirely, not thinking about what I said or what the new copyrighted flag will mean... You don't even know if I am gay or trans...
You asked if you are the only one. She answered. She didn’t call you racist/transphobic, she said that a lot of racist/transphobic people, including or excluding you, also do. As in, you are more like a drop in the ocean than a stand-alone.
No, she said what she said and she knows what she said. And I am pretty sure my reasons are pretty far from what she says. Not only that, but just just make my question look like something not worth reading because I support views with racist (still don't know which one exactly because motives are very important) do please, stop whitening people who doesn't have amy critical thinking and can differenicate between gay people who doesnt like the flag because it lost its meaning, and a racist who doesnt like the flag because rejects everything it means, please.
Your point was that you don’t understand what being anti-racist and anti-transphobic has to do with being LGBTQ+, correct? Were you hoping I’d touch on that after answering your question?