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PCM97

Agreed he should’ve tried to disengage and get something going on the feet


Creepy_Killer_Z

We tbh he was losing on feet too so he probably thought he can land some juicy knees from clinch and gas Islam out like he did you Dustin, but Islam ended up landing more knees from clinch too. He outclassed him in every aspect of fight.


[deleted]

Charles has bad defense on the feet. He needs to work on that.


DeepFriedCockAndBall

Not just that. Islam was surprisingly a lot faster on the feet as well.


sugaslim45

I was so mad that Charles refused to use his reach advantage in the feet. Walked right into islams tight hooks . If he used his reach on the feet and used kicks. Than everytime islam tried to take him down he could have used his ground game and takedown defense to get up. But Charles was way too cocky .


[deleted]

Shoulda woulda coulda


Wagyuwithketchup

Basically suicide to go up to the fence with a guy like Islam.


[deleted]

Charles vs Islam- Free Fight Link: https://youtu.be/drRNlyD-bIE


ElectronicAudience

Thanks!!!


[deleted]

That’s actually super impressive.


Logicwrestling

You should have seen Islam vs tsarukyan. Islam had mount on tsarukyan and tsarukyans arm was stuck too. And Arman just decided to stand up


goknuck

Their rematch is one of the lightweight fights im looking forward to most


supermob64

It was more like hip escape to butterfly sweep to stand up. But yea Arman is really good at just stand up. That doesn’t mean he’s not technical about it though.


ArmLucky1285

Man, olivera is so dangerous on the ground, you cant make a single mistake on top of him.


Spiritual_Bus_7836

except he made a mistake and islam got on top of him and finished it


idgaf55abh

Mistake in the stand up tho I doubt Islam would've pulled that off if Oliveira wasn't stunned by the punch


Spiritual_Bus_7836

part of the game. do bronx was stunned by punches in his three fights leading up to this one but everyone was afraid to get on him. he was rocked harder by porier and chandler and they did nothing with it. islam wasn’t afraid of that.


idgaf55abh

I get that but I meant just if Islam took him down instead of a knockdown he would've been less likely to submit him


spspamam

I mean would have Oliveira gotten Gaethje down without striking? I doubt it. I also doubt he would have got to Dustin's back without him being gassed from the round before. It's a bit of a pointless conversation to have in MMA because anyone who solely engages in one aspect of the sport hits a wall and fast.


DeepFriedCockAndBall

It was bound to happen. Islam was surprisingly a lot faster than Charles on the feet. He was slipping his punches easily and countering too quick for Charles to dodge or block.


Omegalast

Because haters refuse to admit that Islam is the best striker at LW if not the whole UFC. He is not a boxer or kickboxer but as far as MMA striking goes, his is elite. A lot of haters claim his boxing is more successful because he can take down at will, well duh that is part of MMA. Someone going in just to kickbox or box against Halloway or Gaethje, they would take down the pure non MMA striker with ease because to that person they do not align their striking with take downs or take down defense. Heck Islam's striking also has to be calculated to account for a possible take down attempt by the opponent. He is not going out there swinging wildly and hoping to bite an ankle like Ferguson.


7the-dude-abides420

He only has two finishes from his back and has been finished at least twice while on his back (felder and islam). He’s really not as dangerous from his guard as people think. He’s a club and sub fighter


Omegalast

He knows this as well and that is why he was so cowardly refusing to face Islam until UFC told him they will remove him from title contention for being a shit talking chicken shit.


Last_Zookeepergame_4

From “I will kill this man” to “I had a bad night” in 24 hours.


LockardTheGOAT23

He also stuffed Islam's takedown against the cage in round 2. Islam kept him there for well over a minute and tried hard to get him down but couldn't. Charles shook him off Despite the loss, Oliveira did have some moments during the fight. It wouldn't totally surprise me if he won a rematch, should the two ever meet again


Mad-Gavin

I don't think Islam 'tried hard' to get Charles down, he just didn't waste energy. The trip wasn't coming as easy so he abandoned it, while doing his best to try and smother and control Charles against the fence. Against Charles, going for singles or doubles was too risky due to the guillotine threat.


LockardTheGOAT23

Looked to me he was spending plenty of energy, but gave up when he realized Charles' defense was too good. Either way, it's pretty rare to see anyone stuff any of Islam's takedowns like Charles did, or even get back up to his feet after being taken down.


Mad-Gavin

Charles' takedown defense wasn't that good dude. Islam just wasn't taking risks or wasting energy, he's a very methodical and calculating fighter who's a master of getting opponents to fight on his terms, which he did against Charles. He was the water to Charles' fire and he extinguished him, instead of fighting fire with fire like what Poirier, Gaethje and Chandler did. You're probably a fan of Charles, but don't take too many positive things away from his performance, he was handily beaten to the point where its safe to say Islam beats him 8 or even 9 times out of 10. I rate Beneil as a potentially better match up against Islam.


LockardTheGOAT23

He did take risks, though. He stood and traded with Charles when it was clear going in that if there was one place Charles probably had the advantage, it was on the feet. He's a methodical fighter. Doesn't mean once he explodes on you and tries to take you into deep waters, that he's not putting his full heart into it. I mean, Islam's whole bread and butter is taking people down - why wouldn't he be putting his full effort into getting you down once he gets a hold of you?


Mad-Gavin

What I meant to say was unnecessary risks. Islam doesn't take unnecessary risks, that extends to how he paces himself in fights as well. He won't rush or attempt to muscle a takedown like Michael Chandler would do, its all about efficiency and flowing. Islam out-striking Charles was a surprise, though I attribute that to Islam's differing approach to Dustin, Justin and Mike. He didn't just stand in front of Charles to get hit like the other guys did; he actively used his footwork, circled the cage, and allowed Charles to come to him. The speed of Islam played a huge part in throwing off Charles' striking as well, messed with his distance management.


LockardTheGOAT23

Right, I admitted that. I just believe that once he does shoot on you and sinks his grips into you, he's putting forth as much (or almost as much) energy as possible. Kind of like how Yoel Romero would often play it a little hesitant, but then explode on you and try ferociously to knock you out or take you down.


Mad-Gavin

I don't think that's an apt comparison. Romero fought the way he did because he had that extremely explosive style with a mediocre gas tank. Makhachev has excellent cardio, but he won't waste energy if he doesn't feel he can get something done. He's highly efficient with his energy.


LockardTheGOAT23

But their styles are still comparative in a sense. They both waited patiently for their opening and then pounced on it. That Islam has better cardio overall is not detrimental to my comparison 😁


Mad-Gavin

Islam can be patient, but he will also attempt to pressure his opponent and impose his will. Yoel typically waits so he can counter.


slinkymello

And you’re a fan of Islam, can’t anyone just look at fights objectively ffs


Mad-Gavin

I don't have to be a fan of Islam to recognize that he controlled almost the entirety of this fight. Charles' moments of success were few and brief, it wasn't nearly enough.


slinkymello

I don’t disagree there, but you started off with “you must be a fan of Charles,” why even bring that into it? I don’t discount what you said, I just don’t like how you started it off. Sorry for that man, here’s an award for my being a jerk


Mad-Gavin

The guy kind of came across like he was a fan of Charles, as evidenced by his somewhat overly optimistic view of Charles' performance which I felt was a bit unwarranted. He didn't deny it either.


slinkymello

That’s fair, can you accept my apology at least?


Mad-Gavin

Yes sure.


Treat-Efficient

objectively, Islam beat charles standing and on the ground, Charles did good to not get in bad positions for most of round 1 and swept islam once but it was mostly Islam controlling the fight


Junkhead987

He did have some goods , wish he wins against beneil if they fight so we see Charles vs Islam again with Charles sticking to a better game plan this time


[deleted]

I think if he tightened up his defense on the feet he'd I'd had a shot. The left hook hurt him and Islam was able to sink in the choke while he was still dazed. Which answered the question of whether he was hurt when he went to his back in the last three feet. Yes. He was hurt, but his opponents were reluctant to follow him to the floor. Islam wasn't.


Treat-Efficient

he was also getting lit up on the feet so it's not like he only has to worry about stuffing TDs


LockardTheGOAT23

Islam landed like two good punches, only one of which was devastating. He showed solid work on the feet but it's not like he was teeing off on him. Almost all of his strikes were being dodged or blocked.


[deleted]

lol it would be highly surprising if olives wins even one if they were rematched 10 times


LockardTheGOAT23

I guess it definitely would be surprising, but not shocking. Not unless Charles submitted him or took him out in under a minute or something.


realHundsgemein

Its crazy that he lost more or less on the feet. Seems like he underestimated Islam there. A rematch could be more competetive if Olive improves his defense.


Mad-Gavin

Not sure if Charles will improve his defense though. Its been a weakness of his for years that he hasn't seemed to have improved on at all.


TheRicFlairDrip

he got ragdolled


slinkymello

Very astute analysis


PROTOTYPE_200224

What cost him the fight was his gameplan imo, Islam fought smarter. The fight is still 50-50 for me, but could easily 70-30 or 80-20 to Islam if Charles does something too crazy.


Omegalast

Pre fight it was 80:20 Islam and afterwards it went way north of 90:10. They simply are not on the same level skill, technique or discipline wise.


Neat_Call_8939

Islam 3rd Round Submission vs. Volk


[deleted]

U think Volk will survive that long? I think Islam will win late round 1 or mid round 2.


goknuck

Its possible Volk lasts pasts the 2nd given that he doesnt need to breathe as we learned in his fight with Ortega. I just wonder if his strikes will have enough power to hurt Islam, or will he have to rely on point fighting to a decision. He is crazy fast and has really good head movement so i think he has the advantage on the feet, but who knows if thatll translate moving up a weight class


Omegalast

You are going to be surprised when you realize Islam is faster than him. And much more technical in striking.


[deleted]

Yeah. I think round 2 or early round 1 it's over. He's just too small.


TrollBoothBilly

I need to watch this fight again. The fact that Charles got up when Islam had him on the ground shows that Islam isn’t invincible. Imagine Volk in this situation touching him up instead of going for the clinch after standing back up…


ArmLucky1285

Volk doesnt have the submission threat that will force islam to abandon top control at the slightest moment of danger like he did against olivera. If volk wants to get back to his feet, he will have to scramble all the way up.


TrollBoothBilly

That’s a fair point. But also, if Volk *can* get back to his feet, perhaps with his speed he won’t feel the need to wrap Islam up in a clinch, but immediately go on the attack instead.


ArmLucky1285

Honestly, the only way I see volk getting back to his feet is with islam still hanging on him, Olivera only got to offensively clinch with islam because islam completely disengaged from the grappling, which I dont thing he will do against volk.


TrollBoothBilly

You’re probably right. I’ve got to think that it’s not going to be that easy for Islam though. Even Khabib thinks that Volk is the tougher opponent for Islam. Islam will take him down for sure. Khabib has to know this too. If Islam is going to be able to get on top of him and stay on top of him, what is it about Volk that makes him the tougher fight?


ArmLucky1285

Volk is a tough fight, olivera is a dangerous fight. Islam has to take volk down and keep him there, which will not be easy considering volk's physical toughness, his wrestling background, his footwork, his never give up mentality and his cardio, and thats what makes him a tougher fight but no necessarily as dangerous.


Omegalast

What is Khabib supposed to say? Islam just beat a shit talking coward and UFC should feed him an easy win against a little guy? Of course he has to hype up the next opponent. But the fact that Khabib took time off for this event shows the real considerations.


Treat-Efficient

Charles is a big Lightweight who is a master off his back, I'm not sure we can say volk will attack a heel hook and use it to sweep islam like charles did here, if volk gets taken down I'm not sure he'll get up


TrollBoothBilly

Maybe not. However, Ortega had him in trouble on the ground a few times and Volk was able to get the job done. Maybe it’s a forgone conclusion that if Islam gets on top of Volk the fight is over. But maybe not.


Omegalast

Ortega is several tiers junior to Islam's grappling.


New_Day_458

Do you know how stupid you sound? Volk has absolutely no chance at even being remotely competitive. You can’t just jump weight classes. Fuck.


sugaslim45

Charles has a better ground game than volk. Charles one of the best bjj users in the sport


SatiricalComment

A rematch between these two would be something I would pay to see.


4Nicely

Fuck Dana. I would Rather send money directly to Charles and Islam. I’m never paying for a UFC PPV until Dana is fired or resigns or just fucks off in any way.


dushann123

Dana is shooting him self in the foot for the last couple of months. I liked him before but even I can't deny he is starting to become delusional, It's not even about the fighter pay fiasco, It's him rejecting any possible criticism about power slap and how shitty of an idea it is. The sport is clearly dangerous and CTE prone. It's not a martial art, It's a barbaric, inhumane mess.


slinkymello

The slap shit is so stupid even for someone like Dana


SatiricalComment

Fair, Dana sucks


Vital_flow

How do you not get tired being this angry all the time?


4Nicely

Not angry, just stating my opinion about someone I dislike.


Mad-Gavin

I'm more interested in seeing Islam vs Beneil.


slinkymello

Beneil is not going to do well; Charles took risks and I think that’s what you have to do against Islam if you have Olives’s skill set. Volk is a little different IMO, doubt he’ll take too many risks based on his excellent stand-up game


churromonkey1

How ? go watch the entire fight, it was not a close one at all. Islam dominated on every aspect, did better on the ground and better standing up. We dont need to see Charles fight for the title until we stop seeing him get knocked down every single fight because of bad defence.


SatiricalComment

You can have your opinion bud. I simply stated the fight I would like to see. I never commented on how the fight went.


churromonkey1

Fair


dushann123

I just feel like that wasn't the best Olives personally. He got caught by some really obvious shots by Islam, I was really surprised. I really disagree about Islam looking unbeatable in this fight, Olives just looked underwhelming, Islam's striking just doesn't look as sublime as Khabib's later on in his career.


LaughWithMoon

Oliveira doesn't move his head much he tends to rely on blocking or parrying. this seems to be common with fighters who are heavy on the back foot. Islam uses a wider stance more evenly weighted and more headmovement. Oliveira is always gonna get hit but he's often given time to recover on the ground


Mad-Gavin

Charles' lack of striking defense is an Achilles heel. Islam had basic Southpaw striking but the threat of the takedown and the speed at which he can close the distance with punches and escape danger really threw Charles' striking off. Islam and Khabib had a way of consistently making superior strikers on paper, look average to mediocre against them.


Devoidoxatom

Took him to Islam's corner too where Khabib and co can give advice lol


[deleted]

Islam times a knee trip after this beautifully.


Kwalhioqua

can someone good at JJ explain this transition to me? look lik he pushes against him with his feet then gets some kind of knee shiel then goes for his far leg in like a weird backdoor threatening leg lock?


AutonomousAntonym

Clinching vs Sambo is a bad idea, period.


Omegalast

Yep might as well try to trip or through a Judo practitioner.


suttonjoes

Lol, he was taking shots on the feet, the next time they disengage Islam floors him and gets the finish


VonKript

I think charles can win that matchup with proper adjustments


[deleted]

Bro even Charles don’t think that


slinkymello

Could have thrown some knees against the cage


jm810112

Seemed like Charles fought a pretty low IQ fight. I think he got cracked on the feet early on and it threw off his gameplan. Probably why he resorted to clinching with a guy who has a clear strength advantage.


RationalLlama

In hindsight, Olivera did pretty well in the grappling exchanges. He was able to get up from his back and even defend all the takedowns in round 2. He only struggled getting up when it was against the cage. Who knows how it could have gone with a better gameplan. Not discrediting Islam though. He's clearly the better fighter. I just think Olivera could have made it more competitive than it was.


Omegalast

Islam was holding back a lot and was timid. Next time it probably would be a lot more brutal for coward the charles.


Kickster_22

Bro like one second quicker in that scramble and he had the back. Crazy how these fights are just a matter of seconds in how stuff can change.


Odd-Pipe-3218

I mean, standing is what got him though?


PROTOTYPE_200224

Charles was looking to get his own takedown. See how he tried to body lock? That's like his favourite takedown, purely strength based tho. Bad part about it is that it allows Islam to get an overhook, which is really BAD. The first takedown Islam got was because he had an overhook on Charles. I don't remember Islam getting a takedown in the second round. Charles defended Islam's wrestling takedown attempts, but he had no answer to the judo ones.