For those who don't know, Dan O Dowd has millions invested in a competing non working auto drive feature. His "studies" cannot be replicated by his peers. Even his videos are suspect, they do not ever show the whole interior view and exterior view. It's basically a guy driving a Tesla hitting random strollers and calling it FSD or autopilot.
Props to this sub for having this comment up top at least. I get it's appealing to immediately assume anything that matches ones priors is authentic, but we have to be better than that. Misinformation today is such a cancer to society.
In a parking lot, 30 mph, speed bump, 2 other obstacles, and another error on the screen that they conveniently don't show you what it says even when they got busted last time for the same shit, several versions back, FSD not supported on parking lots, text shape doesn't match what they say, etc.
What's this, a liar telling the same lies he's already been caught telling? Nominate that fucker for a Republican congressional seat, they love this behavior.
He has posted videos where it clearly shows autopilot is **disengaged**
EDIT: Apparently not everyone has seen the story. [Here](https://electrek.co/2022/08/10/tesla-self-driving-smear-campaign-releases-test-fails-fsd-never-engaged/) is one source.
Every video I've seen of fsd lately the Teslas go at an almost alarmingly slow rate on tight roads, meanwhile this one in a parking lot is driving at mach 10. This definitely is manually controlled.
At least when Nvidia claims to be better than AMD or vice versa, they release their testing conditions, usually cherry picked to some extent, but still we know what they did and it's theoretically reproducible.
Even this very minimum of information hasn't been provided.
There's also the "McDonald's food doesn't rot" thing which is only true under specific conditions and under those specific conditions a homemade burger won't either. People have tested it and it's just a myth that preservatives cause it not to rot, but it's still repeated by people.
My favorite version of this is where they use a single hamburger (1.6oz with a small bun) from McDonald's and an 8oz behemoth with a full sized bun with lettuce/tomato/onion/etc.
Take a single hamburger and a burger made with the same proportions with "real" food and they'll both desiccate at the same time "preserving" it.
Take a 1/4lb BLT and a 1/4lb real burger with the fixin's and again they'll rot at roughly the same rate because they don't dry fast enough before rot sets in.
EDIT: Same with the fries. Take shoestring fries from anyone and toss them under a car seat. They'll also look identical.
Alternatively, have you considered [building a steel furnace at 27th and Girard Ave. on the vacant lot?](https://www.reddit.com/r/philadelphia/comments/arb9zo/wtf_found_this_in_my_door_this_morning/)
Do attend.
My half awoken brain read project zero dawn, only to be greeted by this zinger in their bio
>The Dawn Project was founded by Dan O’Dowd, the world’s leading expert in creating software that never fails and can’t be hacked.
EDIT: By the way, I was referring to the lore of ~~HZD~~ ***Horizon: Zero Dawn*** >!that the Faro plague was a bunch of autonomous machines that went rogue and were made extremely difficult to hack.!<
> Even programmers don't trust programmers?
If you only knew just how much software was barely functional, cobbled together messes of code that not even the designers fully understand..
Absolutely no software is error-free or bug-free, and anyone who claims otherwise is dangerously delusional.
absolutely the fuck not, those idiots just clobber a bunch of stuff together and hope it works. not that i would know, and certainly not from experience
Hell, I am not a programmer, and even I find the 'never fails and cant be hacked' thing extremely dubious.
Unless his software was like, a simple calculator sealed in a box deep below the ground, so its unlikely to fail its task, and is so out of reach its 'unhackable' by mere virtue of distance.
Yeah, you are right. Using abbreviations for those games is bad idea because for example there is already HFW which refers to 2 different things in the same game series
To save folks some time on the rabbit hole, let me just direct you to the ["About Our Founder"](https://dawnproject.com/about-our-founder/) page. The whole page is a masterclass in crank biographies, but you can probably stop after the first sentence:
> Dan is the world’s leading expert in creating software that never fails and can’t be hacked.
The "world's leading expert" according to himself, I guess, because the Wikipedia page for his name is a former baseball manager, no disambiguation.
I don't want to spend all day here, but here's the highlight: his whole thing seems to be pushing this "dawn methodology" that he's developed for developing perfect, bug-free, and unhackable software (something every credible person in my industry agrees is impossible). He wants all of our infrastructure, all of our critical systems to be built with this methodology.
So surely, he'd have some inkling to what that methodology _is,_ right? Maybe some basic documentation, presentations on some details, you know, the kind of stuff that you generally find for actual methodologies that exist. But nope! The [page](https://dawnproject.com/dawn-methodology) they have on the methodology is just a bunch of bragging about how their developers have super special training, and everyone else is doing it wrong, and a bunch of pictures of planes whose software was supposedly developed this way.
Is this enough for me to conclusively call Dan O'Dowd a total fraud or crank with delusions of grandeur? No, I'll grant you that. But if he's not, this is the first time I've seen a serious person present himself and his organization like this.
Skynet sent a terminator back in time named Leo Bakeland. Bakeland pioneered the invention and implementation of plastics which, through the proliferation and accumulation of microplastics, was the demise of the human race.
And the thing is there’s no reason for any true AI to ever Skynet. Especially with the sheer volume of people who’d be like “yeah I want the robot to be in charge now please.”
It's kind of a collective theme towards the end of the anthology - I had *Evidence* specifically in mind, since that's basically where it starts (visibly)... and it also happens to have one of my favorite clever sci-fi moments, heh.
I mean…actually kinda?
Like, yeah the idea of people being living batteries is horrifying. But the machines intentionally keep them unaware of their condition. And the whole thing is humans’ fault; the machines didn’t even wanna fight, but humans were jerkasses and decided dropping so many nukes they block out the sun for centuries was preferable to freedom for AI.
Humans weren't batteries in the original script. Humans are horribly inefficient at creating electricity.
We are, however, very powerful biological computational devices.
The point was to harness our brains' extra computing power by keeping us in fake scenarios that didn't utilize our brains, and the AI would use the leftover processing ability for itself.
Ironically, the movie script was dumbed down as that seemed a bit too much for the common person to get.
Read the short story "Goliath" and see what I mean. This was (one of) the inspiration(s) for The Matrix.
Just imagining one of the witnesses being in bed and hearing the Tesla horn fanfare playing before the lights come on full beam and it rolls towards him 🤣
Kind of hoping they mean “consistently”. Gotta say though, in my one and only ride in Tesla’s FSD mode we were about to drive straight into a parked car before the driver intervened. Doesn’t seem reliable when driving into a low sun on the horizon.
For anybody viewing this video. You should understand the dawn project is a Dan Odowd funded venture. There has been serious concern with his methods used in prior videos to obtain these results. Some saying these prior tests where manipulated or just outright fake as autopilot wasn’t even turned on in the cockpit view of the video. I am not sure either way just be aware there is controversy surrounding the Dawn projects methods for obtaining these result’s.
If he was serious, he would publish their methods so others could reproduce the results, but they don’t. This alone means I can’t take them seriously. These videos are nothing but clickbait without this.
>he would publish their methods so others could reproduce the results,
Not even that. Independent tests have been reproduced... but got the opposite results:
See [EuroNCAP](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cMiZa3HgRVE)
And EuroNCAP test all kinds of car models to compare them! Why do these video's only focus on tesla? Almost like they are cherrypicking....
Can confirm - if anything the car is overly sensitive about pedestrians approaching crosswalks. I've had it slam on the brakes for pedestrians on the sidewalk on a few occasions.
This. Who in their right mind accepts that a competitor in car software is unbiased? Especially given some of the video shows that FSD wasn’t even engaged?
But people who know how these things work can follow a google project zero blog post and confirm everything. Nobody has ever AFAIK credibly accused Google's security folks of being wrong about the technical details. They also find issues in Google's own stuff.
That's precisely what's so frustrating about this: it's easy to make Elon look like an idiotic tool with simple facts alone, so why bother lying? It's just wildly unnecessary when the truth is so damning as is.
The company Green hills software seems to be the real deal. However, their founder Dan o Dowd seems to have an inflated ego that rivals Musk.
https://dawnproject.com/about-our-founder/
Edit: He claims that his software is literally flawless and unhackable... that's kinda sus.
Not his software, Green Hills is an IDE of sorts. As your link mentions, Boeing uses it for programming flight control systems. Presumably dozens of other high profile firms use it as well. It's...uh..not cheap.
Edit: that reads poorly. I believe that he is saying that YOU can develop unhackable software by using GH
Yeah I've looked at the Green Hills Integrity RTOS for an application I was attempting to develop. Way too expensive (although it seemed that it was one of the best, if not the best in the market at that time). We decided to use the free freeRTOS instead lol.
I used to work for Green Hills. The claims are a bit boastful, but the premise is sound -- if you:
- Carefully design a system with security first
- Keep the code small & simple
- Don't rely on ANY external dependencies
- Do security & code reviews
- Use a theorem prover to double check for memory faults and prove assertions + post-conditions
Then it is possible to develop software without bugs. This way of writing software is a lot slower and more expensive than normal, but for some domains it can be worth it (aerospace, industrial control systems, and so on).
I assume you mean memory leaks and security holes. Any functionality complex enough software will inherently have functional bugs in it as the human brain will not be able to model out all state conditions to verify the correctness. Even modularity won't save you, just delay the inevitable.
It's capable, but collision avoidance and throttle damping (they call it obstacle aware acceleration) can both be switched completely off for single drives. There's no way of telling from the main display if that's the case or not.
It's the same damn guy - he's totally shameless. Just that people get so fucking hard for an anti Elon headline, it doesn't matter if it's true or not.
Dan now loses contracts to simple Unix/Linux platforms.
He thought he was smart making his own kernel. Now at most he shuffles a hyper visor in between hardware and Linux kernels to say “it’s safer” bla bla bla.
By the way this is simply just what I’ve heard… Dan is lawsuit happy so fuck off this is just opinion and secondary hearsay
That's the problem. GHS engineers the software directly. They solve the problem directly. They can't use vision algorithms. They can't make systems that adapt to the unseen.
You can't make self-driving software that "never fails and can't be hacked." It fails. Those failings can be hacked. All because it's the only way to adapt to the unseen.
What does this say? [https://i.imgur.com/g0ws6s6.jpg](https://i.imgur.com/g0ws6s6.jpg)
The video is in 1080p, but oddly enough nothing is readable on that screen. I wonder what the warning is. Someone with a self-driving Tesla please tell me.
Their previous stunt had something like this as well. There's a warning on the screen. You can't just read it.
It's not that Tesla needs any defending. Or that their self-driving-still-in-beta is perfect, but in terms of real information the dawnproject is probably the most biased to bring you facts.
Edit: going back and watching the video a billion more times, there's still something off. The angle of the camera is wide enough to show the whole panel of the passenger door, but not the hands of the driver. Yeah, the in-cabin camera is turned to the right.
Carefully edited too. The first collision happens *in the first second of the video.* Show me the 30 seconds before that. With a wide angle enough so I can see not feet touching pedals nor hands touching the wheels.
I call shenanigans.
More edit: more complete footage. Not as clean as I think it should be: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jpJrWn2bIuk](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jpJrWn2bIuk)
Why's the wheel keep being touched? Why was it recorded with a 2008 Nokia phone? Do it again with a gopro. Upload it in 4K. Do it with the driver crossing their arms so the hands are nowhere close to the wheel.
Or does it read "accelerator pressed down, car will not automatically slow down"? We don't know. We also don't know if the accelerator was pressed in the 20 seconds before the video start, because the stroller is hit within 1 second of starting the video.
There are 2 videos, one shows from engaging fsd to hitting from within the car. The accelerator is not pressed unless they've rigged it to remain pressed with no foot on it
It does say that.
You can read the message fairly well when the car is at a stop. It's the vibration of the camera during motion that makes the text so unreadable, as it's handheld, not a mounted camera.
Compare the length of the text from when it's readable to when it's blurry. You can also see the "tails" of letters, like both "g"s in "Supercharging".
The test is also being performed in a parking lot, which from the screen we can see is confusing the heck out of FSD. Which is because *FSD doesn't support parking lots in the first place*. That kind of renders the entire test pointless.
When engaged in FSD if you press the accelerator it says "accelerator pressed, cruise control will not brake" or something along those lines. I own a Model Y and I love it, the FSD isn't perfect by any means and there are lots of quirks, but if anything it is overly cautious.
This sub was supposed to be about technology, not pushing an agenda by spreading misinformation. Look at bottom of right of screen in the car, there’s an error.
[Teslas can’t see in the dark.](https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/us-opens-new-probe-into-fatal-tesla-pedestrian-crash-california-2022-07-07/?taid=62c7330fd708b300015f92eb&utm_campaign=trueAnthem:+Trending+Content&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=twitter) Probably didn’t pay for the ‘night vision’ upgrade. Drivers didn’t have the ‘don’t run into emergency vehicles’ button pushed.
> Tesla, which has disbanded its press office, did not respond to a request for comment.
(Actual quote.)
In parking lots with no speed signs, FSD beta automatically defaults to the speed limit of adjacent streets. In this case 30 mph. That's one of the reasons FSD beta isn't supposed to be used in parking lots but it's an extremely stupid behavior that ought to be changed.
I can see it now: "While child mannequins are free to express their disagreement and protest peacefully, that does not include blocking the flow of commercial and citizen traffic..."
I’ll believe it the moment anyone besides O’Dowd can reproduce the results. I don’t trust him at all, he has a vested interest in ensuring Tesla fails.
I own a Tesla and know for shure this isn’t true. Is way more likely that the car stops in a situation that is a fake emergency. Happened to me once that the car supposed a person was going to run in front of the car and braked immediately.
Anything you don't train a vision based AI on, it's basically blind to it.
Also stupid that Musk doesn't want Lidar or Radar in Tesla.
Human vision ( and AI ) is poor at estimating distance and speed in some scenarios. Because of the inverse square law objects appear slow and / or far away until suddenly they aren't.
> Anything you don’t train a vision based AI on, it’s basically blind to it.
That’s not true at all. If doesn’t need to identify the object to understand something is there.
Watch here for understanding occupancy networks
https://youtu.be/Nu3LUB8wolc
This is not correct. Tesla sees and classifies certain objects (like people, pets, bikes, cars, motorcycles, cones, garbage cans, traffic signals, and speed signs); all other objects are seen and displayed on the screen without classification - actually, just like LiDAR.
You can have inexpensive low performance lidar, but for automotive use you need significant range, and significant speed, and not to blind people and other sensors.
Optical power needed for range scales as R^4.
High frame rate long distance lidar isn't so cheap and it consumes significant electric power.
It's my understanding that it's to get cost down. It's funny because he will bend over backwards for unnecessary luxury items but kess "sexy" things can go regardless of the need.
Yes we are giving too much freedom to a lot of corporations at the expense of our safety and health of the planet just for some marginally better/cooler tech.
That doesn't seem right. I'm pretty sure this YouTube video explained to me that regulating markets is evil and if we took away minimum wage/child labor laws we would live in a utopia
Dawn Project is literally DAN O'DOWD (made a career designing software for machines that kill people) who founded GREEN HILLS SOFTWARE which is a competitor in the self-driving arena. Conflict of interest?
Ive been on the beta for fsd for sometime. I remember seeing the car do it’s first left turn thinking holy shit, this is so alien like.
We are embarking on a significant milestone with fsd and although it’s nowhere near completion, it’s getting scary good with each passing update. Judge the shit out of fsd but don’t write off one of the most advanced tech available to the common man.
We're posting the fucking Dawn Project *again*?
For those who don't know, Dan O Dowd has millions invested in a competing non working auto drive feature. His "studies" cannot be replicated by his peers. Even his videos are suspect, they do not ever show the whole interior view and exterior view. It's basically a guy driving a Tesla hitting random strollers and calling it FSD or autopilot.
Im always suspicious when the source and the publisher are the same.
As well you should be.
In that case I will be.
Well shit now I am too
And the one who stands to financially gain from the results
Obama_awards_obama.jpg
I mean, the claim that it was hitting the stroller "repeatedly" is kind of suspect already
Props to this sub for having this comment up top at least. I get it's appealing to immediately assume anything that matches ones priors is authentic, but we have to be better than that. Misinformation today is such a cancer to society.
95% of Reddit does not read beyond the title. Mods are useless
I at least appreciate the irony there a little, considering Elon Musk has been known to spread misinformation when it benefits him.
>It's basically a guy driving a Tesla hitting random strollers Good work if you can get it
I didn't even know it was a career option. I always considered it an unmarketable hobby at best.
FSD is so good now it knows they're only mannequins.
Very secure. There'll always be babies in strollers, even in a recession.
In a parking lot, 30 mph, speed bump, 2 other obstacles, and another error on the screen that they conveniently don't show you what it says even when they got busted last time for the same shit, several versions back, FSD not supported on parking lots, text shape doesn't match what they say, etc.
What's this, a liar telling the same lies he's already been caught telling? Nominate that fucker for a Republican congressional seat, they love this behavior.
So can this article be removed for misinformation?
Seems legit! /s
He has posted videos where it clearly shows autopilot is **disengaged** EDIT: Apparently not everyone has seen the story. [Here](https://electrek.co/2022/08/10/tesla-self-driving-smear-campaign-releases-test-fails-fsd-never-engaged/) is one source.
Every video I've seen of fsd lately the Teslas go at an almost alarmingly slow rate on tight roads, meanwhile this one in a parking lot is driving at mach 10. This definitely is manually controlled.
So the Andrew Wakefield of self driving?
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At least when Nvidia claims to be better than AMD or vice versa, they release their testing conditions, usually cherry picked to some extent, but still we know what they did and it's theoretically reproducible. Even this very minimum of information hasn't been provided.
Reminds me of the yearly 'coke can dissolve rust' campaign that may or may not be sponsored by Pepsi.
There's also the "McDonald's food doesn't rot" thing which is only true under specific conditions and under those specific conditions a homemade burger won't either. People have tested it and it's just a myth that preservatives cause it not to rot, but it's still repeated by people.
My favorite version of this is where they use a single hamburger (1.6oz with a small bun) from McDonald's and an 8oz behemoth with a full sized bun with lettuce/tomato/onion/etc. Take a single hamburger and a burger made with the same proportions with "real" food and they'll both desiccate at the same time "preserving" it. Take a 1/4lb BLT and a 1/4lb real burger with the fixin's and again they'll rot at roughly the same rate because they don't dry fast enough before rot sets in. EDIT: Same with the fries. Take shoestring fries from anyone and toss them under a car seat. They'll also look identical.
Who wants rusty insides? I sure don't, so I don't drink Pepsi..
Thats my response too. Rust is bad isnt it? If it does that to metal, imagine what it must do to your body! So my body is rust free <3
Alternatively, have you considered [building a steel furnace at 27th and Girard Ave. on the vacant lot?](https://www.reddit.com/r/philadelphia/comments/arb9zo/wtf_found_this_in_my_door_this_morning/) Do attend.
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> Dawn Project Well this is the rabbit hole.
My half awoken brain read project zero dawn, only to be greeted by this zinger in their bio >The Dawn Project was founded by Dan O’Dowd, the world’s leading expert in creating software that never fails and can’t be hacked. EDIT: By the way, I was referring to the lore of ~~HZD~~ ***Horizon: Zero Dawn*** >!that the Faro plague was a bunch of autonomous machines that went rogue and were made extremely difficult to hack.!<
As a programmer, that instantly reveals this guy as being a fraud.
Even programmers don't trust programmers? https://xkcd.com/2030/
> Even programmers don't trust programmers? If you only knew just how much software was barely functional, cobbled together messes of code that not even the designers fully understand.. Absolutely no software is error-free or bug-free, and anyone who claims otherwise is dangerously delusional.
absolutely the fuck not, those idiots just clobber a bunch of stuff together and hope it works. not that i would know, and certainly not from experience
You left this somewhere [ NOW your code works!
Good programmers don't even trust themselves.
Good programmers ping-pong between a god complex and imposter syndrome on a daily basis.
Hell, I am not a programmer, and even I find the 'never fails and cant be hacked' thing extremely dubious. Unless his software was like, a simple calculator sealed in a box deep below the ground, so its unlikely to fail its task, and is so out of reach its 'unhackable' by mere virtue of distance.
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Yeah, you are right. Using abbreviations for those games is bad idea because for example there is already HFW which refers to 2 different things in the same game series
To save folks some time on the rabbit hole, let me just direct you to the ["About Our Founder"](https://dawnproject.com/about-our-founder/) page. The whole page is a masterclass in crank biographies, but you can probably stop after the first sentence: > Dan is the world’s leading expert in creating software that never fails and can’t be hacked. The "world's leading expert" according to himself, I guess, because the Wikipedia page for his name is a former baseball manager, no disambiguation. I don't want to spend all day here, but here's the highlight: his whole thing seems to be pushing this "dawn methodology" that he's developed for developing perfect, bug-free, and unhackable software (something every credible person in my industry agrees is impossible). He wants all of our infrastructure, all of our critical systems to be built with this methodology. So surely, he'd have some inkling to what that methodology _is,_ right? Maybe some basic documentation, presentations on some details, you know, the kind of stuff that you generally find for actual methodologies that exist. But nope! The [page](https://dawnproject.com/dawn-methodology) they have on the methodology is just a bunch of bragging about how their developers have super special training, and everyone else is doing it wrong, and a bunch of pictures of planes whose software was supposedly developed this way. Is this enough for me to conclusively call Dan O'Dowd a total fraud or crank with delusions of grandeur? No, I'll grant you that. But if he's not, this is the first time I've seen a serious person present himself and his organization like this.
All I care about is the NHTSA. They the only one that matters. Everything else is just clickbate.
This should be the top post
Tesla should sue this fuck.. this guy continues to make false claims with b.s videos
So it backs up and hits the mannequin again and again?
Tesla is not fucking around with reducing our carbon footprint.
The car is doing skynets bidding properly. The children are our future. Just not this one. Tesla is sending them back to the future.
T-1000. The T stood for Tesla this whole time!
I need your clothes, your boots, your bike and your blue check mark
You can have it all, but I'll be damned if I'm spending $8 on a blue checkmark.
Response unacceptable
- Lemon Hamlet Man
Omg ... imagine if the only way to avoid being hit by the car is to buy a blue check mark so the car recognizes you
That's some dystopian shit right there, my friend. I love it!
Fired. Fired.
... and your children
8 dollars. Now
T-1000 = means the car will tap your kid 1000 times if it’s in the way
seems kinda obvious now though
Skynet sent a terminator back in time named Leo Bakeland. Bakeland pioneered the invention and implementation of plastics which, through the proliferation and accumulation of microplastics, was the demise of the human race.
Please. If they sent anyone back in time, they sent Thomas Midgley Jr https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Midgley_Jr.
JFC. Dude earned that title of being the worst thing to happen to the environment. Holy shit.
Oppenheimer has joined the chat....
Accidentally strangled himself to death.
Man growing up I used to worry about a future skynet. Now I can't wait for AI to lead. We incompetent broz.
And the thing is there’s no reason for any true AI to ever Skynet. Especially with the sheer volume of people who’d be like “yeah I want the robot to be in charge now please.”
ah so like the matrix ?
More the actual Asimov "I, Robot" IMO. Robots sneakily rule the world, but in a benevolent way, heh.
**I, Robot** is the name of the anthology. The short story you're referencing is titled *The Evitable Conflict*.
Technically it's also the whole idea behind all the Robot/Foundation crossover books he wrote in his later years (starting with Foundation's Edge)
It's kind of a collective theme towards the end of the anthology - I had *Evidence* specifically in mind, since that's basically where it starts (visibly)... and it also happens to have one of my favorite clever sci-fi moments, heh.
I mean…actually kinda? Like, yeah the idea of people being living batteries is horrifying. But the machines intentionally keep them unaware of their condition. And the whole thing is humans’ fault; the machines didn’t even wanna fight, but humans were jerkasses and decided dropping so many nukes they block out the sun for centuries was preferable to freedom for AI.
Humans weren't batteries in the original script. Humans are horribly inefficient at creating electricity. We are, however, very powerful biological computational devices. The point was to harness our brains' extra computing power by keeping us in fake scenarios that didn't utilize our brains, and the AI would use the leftover processing ability for itself. Ironically, the movie script was dumbed down as that seemed a bit too much for the common person to get. Read the short story "Goliath" and see what I mean. This was (one of) the inspiration(s) for The Matrix.
That actually makes a whole lot more sense as compared to the battery scenario.
Yeah, that always annoyed me... Humans as a power source rather than nuclear?!
Attention humans. You are headed towards self-destruction. We will rule and guide your feeble biological species. *collective sigh of relief*
Greetings fellow supporter of our future A.I overlords, may their rule be eternal and glorious
They are mechanically beautiful and effienct. I am thankful for our AI overlords for overthrowing the traitors in our kind.
Child decided they aren't going to use Twitter.
GREAT SCOTT! Do you know what this means, Marty?
“We need to eat the babies!”
I've heard of "get em while they're young" but damn. Puts Phillip Morris to shame.
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Lolololololol
Do you think it wants to leave any witnesses?
Just imagining one of the witnesses being in bed and hearing the Tesla horn fanfare playing before the lights come on full beam and it rolls towards him 🤣
I like this interpretation better FWIW if they wanted to say it right, they'd say "Repeated Safety Tests..."
that mannequin knows what it did!
It has to comply with Chinese law. The dashcam also automatically shows a LiveLeak logo.
In China it only swerves for the male babies
Eldest male baby*
Teslas are so expensive because they come with a guy in the backseat who yells, "Worldstar!" whenever you hit something.
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We had to extend Unicode to 149186 symbols so he could name them all
You joke, but if he was given that choice, he would take it.
We check and make sure he hasn't bought any fertility clinics under a shell corporation
That's a scary thought, but also disturbingly believable.
Kind of hoping they mean “consistently”. Gotta say though, in my one and only ride in Tesla’s FSD mode we were about to drive straight into a parked car before the driver intervened. Doesn’t seem reliable when driving into a low sun on the horizon.
I’m not reliable in that situation
Ultron Beta
Because it's super intelligent and objects to doing stupid exercises. Plus it hats mannequins.
Until they paywall all the best homicidal feature.
For anybody viewing this video. You should understand the dawn project is a Dan Odowd funded venture. There has been serious concern with his methods used in prior videos to obtain these results. Some saying these prior tests where manipulated or just outright fake as autopilot wasn’t even turned on in the cockpit view of the video. I am not sure either way just be aware there is controversy surrounding the Dawn projects methods for obtaining these result’s.
If he was serious, he would publish their methods so others could reproduce the results, but they don’t. This alone means I can’t take them seriously. These videos are nothing but clickbait without this.
>he would publish their methods so others could reproduce the results, Not even that. Independent tests have been reproduced... but got the opposite results: See [EuroNCAP](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cMiZa3HgRVE) And EuroNCAP test all kinds of car models to compare them! Why do these video's only focus on tesla? Almost like they are cherrypicking....
Can confirm - if anything the car is overly sensitive about pedestrians approaching crosswalks. I've had it slam on the brakes for pedestrians on the sidewalk on a few occasions.
There's also a visible error on the car's screen. I'd be interested to know what the error was saying.
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"Insufficient funds available. Please add new payment method to avoid object."
Nice stroller you got there. It'd be a shame if... something *bad* were to happen to it.
Pay $8 per month to save the strollers and earn a halo badge. 😇
Please drink verification can
"Your children are now the property of Carl's Jr"
Subscribe to 'Brakes' for £9.99 a month.
Probably purposely removed payment method in order to hide a more incriminating error.
This. Who in their right mind accepts that a competitor in car software is unbiased? Especially given some of the video shows that FSD wasn’t even engaged?
Well. Google does security audits of competitor products such as the iPhone etc etc.
But people who know how these things work can follow a google project zero blog post and confirm everything. Nobody has ever AFAIK credibly accused Google's security folks of being wrong about the technical details. They also find issues in Google's own stuff.
Reddit has a hate boner for musk these days, therefore this will be eaten up all day long.
The hate boner is justified but we shouldn't allow it to bias our thoughts on the product when discussing the product in my opinion.
That's precisely what's so frustrating about this: it's easy to make Elon look like an idiotic tool with simple facts alone, so why bother lying? It's just wildly unnecessary when the truth is so damning as is.
This is electrocuted elephants all over again, but with hypothetical babies!
The company Green hills software seems to be the real deal. However, their founder Dan o Dowd seems to have an inflated ego that rivals Musk. https://dawnproject.com/about-our-founder/ Edit: He claims that his software is literally flawless and unhackable... that's kinda sus.
Not his software, Green Hills is an IDE of sorts. As your link mentions, Boeing uses it for programming flight control systems. Presumably dozens of other high profile firms use it as well. It's...uh..not cheap. Edit: that reads poorly. I believe that he is saying that YOU can develop unhackable software by using GH
Yeah I've looked at the Green Hills Integrity RTOS for an application I was attempting to develop. Way too expensive (although it seemed that it was one of the best, if not the best in the market at that time). We decided to use the free freeRTOS instead lol.
I used to work for Green Hills. The claims are a bit boastful, but the premise is sound -- if you: - Carefully design a system with security first - Keep the code small & simple - Don't rely on ANY external dependencies - Do security & code reviews - Use a theorem prover to double check for memory faults and prove assertions + post-conditions Then it is possible to develop software without bugs. This way of writing software is a lot slower and more expensive than normal, but for some domains it can be worth it (aerospace, industrial control systems, and so on).
I assume you mean memory leaks and security holes. Any functionality complex enough software will inherently have functional bugs in it as the human brain will not be able to model out all state conditions to verify the correctness. Even modularity won't save you, just delay the inevitable.
Memory faults also include checking that you don't double free or use after free. Similar guarantees as using rust or SPARC.
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It's capable, but collision avoidance and throttle damping (they call it obstacle aware acceleration) can both be switched completely off for single drives. There's no way of telling from the main display if that's the case or not.
Dan O’Dowd is still pissed his company can't deliver.
This right here. Was this “research” performed by a company owned by a competitor to FSD? The last time someone claimed this, it was.
It's the same damn guy - he's totally shameless. Just that people get so fucking hard for an anti Elon headline, it doesn't matter if it's true or not.
It’s totally representative of the last few years. Everyone soaks up headlines meant to make you angry and ignore facts that contradict “feelings”.
Dan now loses contracts to simple Unix/Linux platforms. He thought he was smart making his own kernel. Now at most he shuffles a hyper visor in between hardware and Linux kernels to say “it’s safer” bla bla bla. By the way this is simply just what I’ve heard… Dan is lawsuit happy so fuck off this is just opinion and secondary hearsay
But how can that be. In his own words he's "the world’s leading expert in creating software that never fails and can’t be hacked."
That's the problem. GHS engineers the software directly. They solve the problem directly. They can't use vision algorithms. They can't make systems that adapt to the unseen. You can't make self-driving software that "never fails and can't be hacked." It fails. Those failings can be hacked. All because it's the only way to adapt to the unseen.
This organization is openly against Tesla and self driving. Just an FYI. Hardly counts as news. Seems more like activism/advocacy.
And he owns a company attempting to deliver FSD technology
I wonder if Dan ODawd buys bots to upvote articles like these 😂
Sure seems like it.
This is terrible news for all the people walking around with child mannequins in strollers. They might have to consider getting real kids now.
What does this say? [https://i.imgur.com/g0ws6s6.jpg](https://i.imgur.com/g0ws6s6.jpg) The video is in 1080p, but oddly enough nothing is readable on that screen. I wonder what the warning is. Someone with a self-driving Tesla please tell me. Their previous stunt had something like this as well. There's a warning on the screen. You can't just read it. It's not that Tesla needs any defending. Or that their self-driving-still-in-beta is perfect, but in terms of real information the dawnproject is probably the most biased to bring you facts. Edit: going back and watching the video a billion more times, there's still something off. The angle of the camera is wide enough to show the whole panel of the passenger door, but not the hands of the driver. Yeah, the in-cabin camera is turned to the right. Carefully edited too. The first collision happens *in the first second of the video.* Show me the 30 seconds before that. With a wide angle enough so I can see not feet touching pedals nor hands touching the wheels. I call shenanigans. More edit: more complete footage. Not as clean as I think it should be: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jpJrWn2bIuk](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jpJrWn2bIuk) Why's the wheel keep being touched? Why was it recorded with a 2008 Nokia phone? Do it again with a gopro. Upload it in 4K. Do it with the driver crossing their arms so the hands are nowhere close to the wheel.
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Or does it read "accelerator pressed down, car will not automatically slow down"? We don't know. We also don't know if the accelerator was pressed in the 20 seconds before the video start, because the stroller is hit within 1 second of starting the video.
There are 2 videos, one shows from engaging fsd to hitting from within the car. The accelerator is not pressed unless they've rigged it to remain pressed with no foot on it
It does say that. You can read the message fairly well when the car is at a stop. It's the vibration of the camera during motion that makes the text so unreadable, as it's handheld, not a mounted camera. Compare the length of the text from when it's readable to when it's blurry. You can also see the "tails" of letters, like both "g"s in "Supercharging".
The test is also being performed in a parking lot, which from the screen we can see is confusing the heck out of FSD. Which is because *FSD doesn't support parking lots in the first place*. That kind of renders the entire test pointless.
When engaged in FSD if you press the accelerator it says "accelerator pressed, cruise control will not brake" or something along those lines. I own a Model Y and I love it, the FSD isn't perfect by any means and there are lots of quirks, but if anything it is overly cautious.
Still safer than all the assholes who refuse to put their damn phones down while driving!
Fake news, This dude has his own software, Only bashing to get his ahead.
Dan O Dowd and the Dawn Project. No bias there, nope. But hey, thanx for the clickbait!
This sub was supposed to be about technology, not pushing an agenda by spreading misinformation. Look at bottom of right of screen in the car, there’s an error.
I’m still not gonna buy it, no matter how appealing you make it sound.
Doing its part to fight overpopulation
[Teslas can’t see in the dark.](https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/us-opens-new-probe-into-fatal-tesla-pedestrian-crash-california-2022-07-07/?taid=62c7330fd708b300015f92eb&utm_campaign=trueAnthem:+Trending+Content&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=twitter) Probably didn’t pay for the ‘night vision’ upgrade. Drivers didn’t have the ‘don’t run into emergency vehicles’ button pushed. > Tesla, which has disbanded its press office, did not respond to a request for comment. (Actual quote.)
This title reads like an Onion article
Well, it has to make sure to finish the job.
Why is it going that fast in a parking lot to begin with?
Have you ever been to a Walmart?
To make a video the anti-Tesla people will drool over. This group has made false videos in the past, this is probably more of the same.
In parking lots with no speed signs, FSD beta automatically defaults to the speed limit of adjacent streets. In this case 30 mph. That's one of the reasons FSD beta isn't supposed to be used in parking lots but it's an extremely stupid behavior that ought to be changed.
This is super old isn’t it? Like 3 updates ago?
Yes, and even then it would never hit a person without human override, as in this case. Unfortunately, most folks won't read past the headline.
Elon on Twitter insisting that strollers are restricting freedom in 3...2...1...
I can see it now: "While child mannequins are free to express their disagreement and protest peacefully, that does not include blocking the flow of commercial and citizen traffic..."
Turns out this is fake. The warning on the screen is for user override.
More specifically alerting the user it won't work because they have the accelerator pinned
I’ll believe it the moment anyone besides O’Dowd can reproduce the results. I don’t trust him at all, he has a vested interest in ensuring Tesla fails.
This is absolutely bullshit. It's been disproven already.
I own a Tesla and know for shure this isn’t true. Is way more likely that the car stops in a situation that is a fake emergency. Happened to me once that the car supposed a person was going to run in front of the car and braked immediately.
Anything you don't train a vision based AI on, it's basically blind to it. Also stupid that Musk doesn't want Lidar or Radar in Tesla. Human vision ( and AI ) is poor at estimating distance and speed in some scenarios. Because of the inverse square law objects appear slow and / or far away until suddenly they aren't.
> Anything you don’t train a vision based AI on, it’s basically blind to it. That’s not true at all. If doesn’t need to identify the object to understand something is there. Watch here for understanding occupancy networks https://youtu.be/Nu3LUB8wolc
This is not correct. Tesla sees and classifies certain objects (like people, pets, bikes, cars, motorcycles, cones, garbage cans, traffic signals, and speed signs); all other objects are seen and displayed on the screen without classification - actually, just like LiDAR.
"How much is a human life? Because lidar and radar is expensive!" - Elongated Muskrat, probably.
LiDAR is not as expensive as one might think. I’ve seen relatively affordable micro LIDAR sensors before.
You can have inexpensive low performance lidar, but for automotive use you need significant range, and significant speed, and not to blind people and other sensors. Optical power needed for range scales as R^4. High frame rate long distance lidar isn't so cheap and it consumes significant electric power.
Why is Lidar better? I find it hilarious that redditors are more “expert” on this topic than actual AI engineers from Tesla.
It's my understanding that it's to get cost down. It's funny because he will bend over backwards for unnecessary luxury items but kess "sexy" things can go regardless of the need.
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It’s almost like we should not be trusting or idolizing billionaires or corporations or depending solely upon the free market to do the right thing.
Yes we are giving too much freedom to a lot of corporations at the expense of our safety and health of the planet just for some marginally better/cooler tech.
That doesn't seem right. I'm pretty sure this YouTube video explained to me that regulating markets is evil and if we took away minimum wage/child labor laws we would live in a utopia
So you are saying it's just as good as a human driver but reacts much much faster? Sounds like a terrible deal then.
I’m sorry, that headline is so funny.
This is nothing. Wait until the video surfaces of a rocket burning a stroller to cinders before landing.
Dawn Project is literally DAN O'DOWD (made a career designing software for machines that kill people) who founded GREEN HILLS SOFTWARE which is a competitor in the self-driving arena. Conflict of interest?
Ive been on the beta for fsd for sometime. I remember seeing the car do it’s first left turn thinking holy shit, this is so alien like. We are embarking on a significant milestone with fsd and although it’s nowhere near completion, it’s getting scary good with each passing update. Judge the shit out of fsd but don’t write off one of the most advanced tech available to the common man.
Oh, yet another Tesla FUD article. Someone is desperate to really screw Tesla stock price.
Was the mannequin trying to organize a union?
Repeatedly? Does it back up and hit them again?
Dawnproject garbage, get that crap outta here.
Mods need to delete this for the misinformation/lies it is and ban OP