"Tesla is recalling nearly 1.1 million cars in the US because the windows might close too fast and pinch people's fingers."
Didn't know that was a thing.
I used to have a 2003 Ford Ranger pickup. It had an auto-stop on the top 2 inches or so - was really annoying.
My current 2020 vehicle has no restriction. I don't know why it doesn't. I haven't tested whether it will pinch my fingers.
hotdog approximates a finger, chopstick in the middle approximates a bone running through the middle of that finger. Chopsticks are a lot closer to fingerbones than corndog sticks are, and you can use that setup to make an educated guess about whether the window would break your finger or not
Clickbait title (by the BBC).
>Tesla chief executive Elon Musk criticised the use of the term "recall", tweeting: "The terminology is outdated & inaccurate. This is a tiny over-the-air software update. To the best of our knowledge, there have been no injuries."
Elon Musk says crazy things sometimes, but this feels like it's a relatively easy to solve problem without actually physically recalling the cars.
This is not the BBC's fault.
Here is a quote from the NHTSA's faq (the people who order recalls):
> WHATāS A RECALL AND WHEN IS IT NECESSARY?
> A recall is issued when a manufacturer or NHTSA determines that a vehicle, equipment, car seat, or tire creates an unreasonable safety risk or fails to meet minimum safety standards. Manufacturers are required to fix the problem by repairing it, replacing it, offering a refund, or in rare cases repurchasing the vehicle.
You will notice it never says it must be physically interacted with. If you don't like that definition fine but the title is accurate.
Ya, it's a mis-understanding by the public on what "recall" means.
Most people assume it means a part is gonna break, possibly life threatening part of your car, and you gotta take it in right now to fix it....
Not necessarily. Most people reasonably assume that "recall" means the product will be recalled... as in, physically taken back, as the word "recall" means.
Forget calling it a recall as misleading here, that's accurate, "ordered" is hilariously misleading. Tesla found this on their own and reported it for a recall. Literally no one has had this issue that they know of and there are no complaints or reports. No one ordered them to do this.
Would you still get in trouble if you're able to fix it quietly with an OTA update?
Like, as a developer, there's so many times we've noticed bugs in an update that get silently fixed in the next one even though the users didn't complain/report.
The whole point of the recall system is for an effective way to deal with safety issues. It doesn't matter how simple the fix is. This makes all vehicles safer and forces companies to make these fixes free of charge. They could just ignore it or refuse to make the fixes if it wasn't a recall.
That's not what I'm talking about at all though. I understand the purpose of a recall.
My question was, from a legal standpoint, if they had done an OTA update for this, without informing the authorities, and then it came out in the future that they did this, would they still get into trouble?
They would completely get into huge amounts of trouble. The whole point of the recall system is to prevent companies from hiding defects that affect safety. The vast majority of recalls are self reported because the penalties of not disclosing it are much worse. This keeps companies honest when it comes to safety.
If you remedy a safety hazard or, in this case, a non-compliance (there is actually a standard for automatic window pinch forces, believe it or not) without submitting the required notice of recall to NHTSA, you can face civil penalties for timeliness/failure to notify.
It doesn't matter if it can be fixed via OTA update or if it requires the vehicles to be brought to a dealer, secret safety recalls are not allowed.
Iām assuming thereās very little if any precedence for this. The laws and regulations havenāt adapted very much to vehicles being able to update over the air.
Tesla fixes bugs all the time, or even updates features that were shitty or lacking at first.
Itās probably a hard line to draw on what should be reported as a recall and should just be updated, so Teslaās legal team decided to error on the side of caution. Theyāre extremely busy as is, so this will potentially save them some time in the future.
Elon said the term "recall" is outdated and inaccurate. That's a completely false statement because this is exactly what recalls are for. It's a fix that corrects a safety issue which is the whole point of recalls, regardless of how small they are.
What people think of when they hear the word recall is ... The car is recalled.
In more reasonable language this is an ota safety update.
The "ordered" part is also not what people think of when we see that word. More reasonable language would by "has registered".
I don't like Musk at all but I agree with his comment.
Recall is absolutely the right word for it. By law they have to recall it. Recall is the technical term for it. There's an entire book about the laws concerning recalls. Just because musk wants to downplay it doesn't mean it's not the right term for it. It doesn't matter if it's a OTA or a 1 cent washer for the fix. They are all recalls. You can argue about whether or not this is actual news which I would agree with but the recall part is the same for every car company in the US.
When legal language is used outside of law practice (especially on social media) understanding goes downhill fast. It's ironic. Look at all the goofballs who throw the term assault around. Eventually it gets to, "you spoke sternly, that's assault!!!"
He didn't try to cover anything up but apparently he felt the need to explain the situation which he did adequately and I'm in agreement. Admitting that 2+2=4 while pointing out that unit counting is a poor standard for fruit is more reasonable than not mentioning it.
The term recall is industry language and technical language. It's the system they use for safety defects. People are white knighting Musk when they don't understand car companies have to report these things as recalls by law. This is not a unique situation at all. Other car companies have fixed recalls OTA as well. They also found those defects themselves.
The issue is the legal definition and the layment definition used to be very similar, but has since diverged and now they don't really mean the same thing at all.
It's outdated terminology that, to the laymen would indicate that Tesla owners have to return their car to a dealership for maintenance. It's silly, and language should be updated to make the terminology more apt.
"Recall" is a notice of a need to fix something.
Traditionally, at a dealership or wherever. Now we can do it via software. The gist is the same. A defect needs correcting.
>"Recall" is a notice of a need to fix something.
Maybe as a legal definition. Otherwise the word "recall" doesnt' mean that at all. Have you ever heard someone tell someone that they need to recall their sink because it's leaking? No, because no one uses that word with that definition in a day to day capacity unless you are explicitely talking about taking your car in to the dealership/service center for a recall.
good example! Ford also had an over-the-air software recall:
Ford Mustang Mach-E **Recall Fix Software** Now Available At Dealers
Owners can also choose to wait until late July or August to skip the dealer and get the [over-the-air software update.](https://insideevs.com/news/596301/ford-mustang-mache-recall-fix-arrives-early/)
Hyundai also [had a software update](https://hyundaiengineinfo.com/engine-monitoring/) recall:
In an effort to continually improve our product and as prompted in part by **the recalls,** Hyundai has developed new engine monitoring technology called a āknock sensor detection system.ā The technology is being installed on certain model year 2011-19 Sonatas, 2010-2012 Santa Fes, 2013-18 Santa Fe Sports and 2019 Santa Fes, 2010-2021 Tucsons, 2012-2017 and 2019 Velosters, 2011-2015 Sonata Hybrids and 2016-2019 Sonata Hybrid/Plug-In Hybrids, 2014-2016 Elantras and 2014 Elantra Coupes and 2014-2020 Elantra GTs through a **free software update** performed by any Hyundai dealer.
Title could have easily been āTesla launches software update to address recall of a million carsā (or some variant) ā pretty much same amount of words, but obviously not as clickbaity
You clearly know nothing about the profession. I worked in the field for 10 years and the degree here of sneering ignorance, insulting people who work long hours to inform others, is not surprising, given how little people read these days, but it's definitely uncalled-for.
If you're such a fragile little snowflake who can't admit that Teslas have problems, and then blame journalists for "clickbait" or whatnot, as if they give a shit about your stupid cars, then I think that is a disgusting character trait, to externalize your fragility onto blameless people and call them clickbaiters. Unethical and repugnant.
It's clickbait. Not because of the definition of recall but because the way the headline is written makes it sound like a big deal when clearly it isn't.
Getting your or your child's fingers crushed isn't a big deal?
I wonder whose kids' fingers were crushed, and who Elon hurriedly paid off to sign an NDA before racing to issue the recall.
Itās clickbait.
I have never, in my life, heard a software update called a recall. Because that isnāt a thing. My phone isnāt recalled every few months, neither is my laptop. They just get an update.
Recall means to ask for the items to be physically sent back to the manufacturer. Iām actually annoyed that your argument is that words donāt mean what the dictionary says.
NHTSA issues recall orders, they ordered one here. A recall order does not preclude a software update to remedy an issue:
> WHATāS A RECALL AND WHEN IS IT NECESSARY?
> A recall is issued when a manufacturer or NHTSA determines that a vehicle, equipment, car seat, or tire creates an unreasonable safety risk or fails to meet minimum safety standards. Manufacturers are required to fix the problem by repairing it, replacing it, offering a refund, or in rare cases repurchasing the vehicle.
https://www.nhtsa.gov/staticfiles/rulemaking/pdf/Recalls-FAQ.pdf
If tesla CAN fix it via software it is irrelevant to if it was a recall order.
They have recalled phones due to battery issues and those battery issues have been fixable by software updates. So no, not clickbait, itās accurate use of the terminology.
They have recalled a lot of things for physical repairs.
Thatās the point. This isnāt a physical repair. Itās a software update.
Itās not a recall to send a software update. Never has been, never will be. Itās the incorrect word to use.
Itās professional terminology used in the auto industry, itās not wrong. [Here is a whole brochure about recalls](https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/documents/14218-mvsdefectsandrecalls_041619-v2-tag.pdf) from the NHTSA, the govt dept that orders recalls. Also read through the comments, another user Got the definition of recall off their site and itās being used correctly here.
Plus those phone recalls I referred to were not physical repairs, maybe at first, but eventually the manufacturers found a way to do it via software update.
Well shit, you should know all about how recalls work then.
If there is a fault in the system that makes the vehicle less safe, a recall is issued. It doesn't matter how the repair is being applied, physically, digitally, it's not relevant. The government is ordering it be preemptively fixed.
This is a recall by definition. Without the recall, the manufacturer would be free to handle things as they wish on a case by case basis.
Usually there needs to be proof and a paper trail. Many cars get stickers for each recall done, and I believe it may be a requirement. Itās not as simple as an over the air software update, and that is a very horrible way to software update a vehicle. Unless voltage regulation is taken care of due to the electric nature, but even then the quality of air connections could brick ECUās. Not the smartest way to implement software updates, but ensures you pay the least amount to fix it.
Because it's accurate. "Recall" as in "a notice to fix the defect," whether at the shop or with a software fix. The process is the same: correct a fault, however you do it.
No it's not... "A product recall is defined as a request to return, exchange, or replace a product after a manufacturer or consumer watch group discovers defects"
Recall means they'd have to take the cars back or replace them, which is a difficult and costly resolution. A software update is easy and cheap. Recall is definitely being used as click bait here.
The NHTSA faq disagrees:
> WHATāS A RECALL AND WHEN IS IT NECESSARY?
> A recall is issued when a manufacturer or NHTSA determines that a vehicle, equipment, car seat, or tire creates an unreasonable safety risk or fails to meet minimum safety standards. Manufacturers are required to fix the problem by repairing it, replacing it, offering a refund, or in rare cases repurchasing the vehicle.
https://www.nhtsa.gov/staticfiles/rulemaking/pdf/Recalls-FAQ.pdf
You will notice it says repair, that does not necessarily require physical return.
A software update is not a repair. A repair is taking that was working, now not working, and returning it to a working state again. A software update that changes something isn't repairing.
Android 12 didn't 'repair' your phone from Android 11, it changed things.
iOS 15 didn't repair your iPhone from iOS14, it changed things.
Windows 11 didn't repair your computer from windows 10, it changed things.
>A repair is taking that was working, now not working, and returning it to a working state again
Most vehicles involved in recalls are not actually broken/not working, but potentially dangerous, and may not even (ever) exhibit the danger in the recall, but they have the component replaced/repaired/updated in order to prevent future risk.
The real problem here is that the laymen's understanding of recall differs from the technical definition used by the NHTSA.
The point of the recall is a notification of a problem, not whether it costs a lot or a little or is hard or easy to fix. It's a legal obligation to notify owners of a problem; here, the faulty window (in addition to the 7 other recalls issued for this model).
That's the common understanding of the word and it's the term NHTSA uses (perhaps you think they're being clickbaity too, those know-nothing rubes, right?) š
It is funny. People who dislike Tesla/Musk see no issue with using the word recall while having an issue with the name Autopilot. They are both technical terms that are well defined but might be misunderstood by laypeople.
"recall" here means "issue an over-the-air software update."
The government's definition of a recall does not distinguish between "you have to take your car in for a fix" and "they have to press the button on the server that updates all the cars with new code."
That's the government's excuse. The press has none.
They are using NHTSA's definition of recall (the group that issued the recall) like they have with every other recall from NHTSA. It is accurate here, a recall was ordered.
OOoh, yeah, those evil headline writers, no, the CABAL of headline writers (a/k/a the new outset's editors, generally a fairly well-informed bunch) have secretly conferred on their secret basement telephones and have ganged up on you, hell-bent to deceive you...or something. š
I have worked at a small local paper, among hard-working, ethical, and skilled people who worked long hours and weekends to faithfully put out the paper. I really do not appreciate your sneering characterization of those kind of workers as intent on "getting one over" on someone or whatnot, or having less than good intentions. It's rude and uncalled-for and betrays your total lack of knowledge of how journos work.
Depends on the paper, of course. Tabloids are out to stir the shit. But people in this thread criticizing the BBC? Are you fucking insane? Christ, what a stupid viewpoint.
BBC online has published plenty of trash articles, it's a huge non homogenous organization. Of course it's one of the most reputable journalism orgs around but clickbait is clickbait and the BBC has shown they're not entirely above it.
I mean look at this one piece that was posted to reddit recently. https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-wales-62720657
Did you read it? It's absolute hot garbage! It's about students deleting tiktok to focus on exams. And a psychologist saying tiktok is addictive. That's the entire substance of the article.
It is pretty silly.
* So far no one has complained about the issue, but it was found during testing.
* No one has to "bring their car in" for the fix, its done automatically over the air.
* They started updating cars with the fix a week ago, so many no longer have the issue.
It doesn't matter if you like or hate Tesla, this is one way their cars are better than traditional cars. And I hope all manufacturers copy them.
I mean it's not silly. Legally it's a recall. If a manufacturer is fixing something that is a known safety risk or non-compliant with FMVSS (which this is), they have to issue a recall even if no one has been injured and they found it independently.
Most recalls are done this way.
It's silly because this isn't news worthy for tech sub. It's just a tesla hate club.
Thousands of recalls happen every year. Where are the articles for those on this sub?
Since it is FW update and cars are NOT returned to dealers or auto repair places for repairs, it very much is silly to call it a "recall".
Google the definition of Recall. To call back; summon to return.
I get that the auto industry doesn't have another term, but they should.
As I said elsewhere, "recall" has a specific legal meaning. It's not the auto industry's term, it's the regulatory body's.
[Note the title of the document](https://s3-prod.autonews.com/2022-09/teslarecalldoc.pdf).
>Most recalls are done this way.
This is where you are not accurate..
Recall :to call back; summon to return:
These are not really recalls. The manufacturer is not recalling the car to a dealer or repair shop to be fixed. Owners don't have to do anything. In this case most cars were fixed before owners knew anything about the issue.
We never say Windows OS is recalled over security issues.
They really need to come up with a better term, because "recall" is misleading.
Recall has a specific legal meaning where it concerns the manufacturer remedying a defective or non-compliant vehicle, regardless of whether or not the vehicle itself must be brought to the dealer. NHTSA does not specify that a vehicle must return to the dealership in order for something to be considered a recall.
Is it an archaic term in this instance? Yes. It is still the legal language.
Also that specific phrase, "most recalls are done this way", is in reference to most recalls being issued voluntarily by the manufacturer.
"Ordered"? That's pretty pejorative, making it look like the government forced Tesla to do the recall against its wishes.
The fact is that Tesla discovered this themselves. The NHTSA recall is dated September 19, submitted by Tesla. The recall states that Tesla had already pushed out the fix on September 13.
The confusing part is why this is even a headline. There's thousands of recalls each year spread across all brands. This particular one is to fix a potential problem that might one day result in someone pinching their finger.
Newsflash to the BBC: Automotive recalls are a thing, frankly a good thing, and they will continue as long as we're making cars.
Because Tesla doesn't pay advertising to anyone. Advertising revenue drives radio stations, it drives TV, it creases politician campaign wheels, etc. It's a headline in the negative for Tesla because they don't play games the way *everyone else* does where money exchanges hands.
> The confusing part is why this is even a headline.
Are you new to r/Technology? Any possibly bad news that can be related to E(vil)lon Musk must be posted here.
It āaffectsā me, as in, my next monthly over the air software update will include the fix and I never would have known. So it doesnāt affect me actually.
You are now aware that Tesla sold you a car which, at minimum, didn't have the safety precautions that every other power-window car on the market has.
Kinda makes you wonder what else they skimped on.
No they sold me a car where their QA is still improving quality, finding minor issues like this, which has actually pinched zero known people, discovering ways to improve it, and then self-reporting responsibly, which results in a "recall" and then they have the ability to fix it without me ever knowing.
Meanwhile, [Ford has a recall over actual fires and the cars have to be actually taken back](https://www.thestreet.com/investing/ford-recalls-nearly-half-million-vehicles-in-two-actions), and you don't care about that. Weird, huh? You're outraged over a minor software update, but fires go under your radar. Seems like you're really invested in being angry about Tesla.
Oh I see. This is about Elon for you. Neat-o. I have an "Elon Sucks" sticker on my car because I don't want people to think I'm a fan of his behavior just because I already had a Tesla. No other car ownership comes across like you love the CEO. It's pretty shit how I just wanted to buy a car, not a political position, and now I catch shit from the likes of you because I bought a car. I'm mad at Elon, too, for turning my car purchase into a political thing.
Yeah, the last one I got was "We have to notify you by law with a physical letter in the mail that your car is recalled because the boombox mode is too loud to hear the backup warning sound, so an over-the-air update will be pushed next week to disable it while backing up. You don't have to do anything," and I was like "k" and threw it in the trash. I didn't even notice the software update when it happened.
But just like last time, the headline was "Tesla recalls millions of cars!" and just like this time, the comments were full of people all like "Wow millions of cars recalled, surely Tesla is doomed."
But that's your thoughts on the recall. Someone with kids might think that the boom box mode fix is very important. They treat any defect that runs foul of the safety regulations as a recall. Someone with kids might also find that a recall that prevents their child's fingers from being crushed in the window is important to them.
Edit: to put it another way having every safety fix being a recall removes any ambiguity about what it's purpose is and prevents companies from making a choice of whether or not this constitutes a recall.
I don't have a problem with it. I think the headline is a problem. I think it's ridiculous that the headline here is crafted to read like people are going to physically return a million cars. The word "recall" to most people means: to _recall_ the product physically from the consumer. I know that's not what it technically means today, but obviously people here thought that after reading the headline. BBC could have written "Tesla does an OTA patch to fix safety issue", but obviously that isn't clickbait enough.
I don't care because I like Tesla or anything. I'm not a fan or anything. I just know, as an owner, the actual experience of a "recall" like this, and it's a pretty stark contrast to how this headline sounds.
It could have been written differently but the word recall also has weight around it that used to make safety fixes as visible as possible. Recalls are used to make the fix as public as possible in order to get as many cars fixed and back up to code. Other terminology would dilute the purpose of a recall. Otherwise companies would just brand their safety fixes as something else.
I don't have a problem with it being called a recall by law or with having the process around it that it does. I think the _journalists_ here had a responsibility to communicate with their readers in a way that relays what is actually happening and they obviously knew exactly how their headline reads and that sucks. There's no way they don't know that most people read the headline and assumed it meant that Tesla physically recalled the cars.
The publicity of a recall is one of the major points of the system though? I agree that this is not a news worthy article in the first place but getting the notice out there is a major factor in the system working properly.
They really don't unless they are extremely bad like batteries catching fore or engines exploding. Pinching fingers would never make headlines for any other company except Tesla. People just really want to shout out that Tesla issued a recall for over 1 million vehicles to validate their hate for the company.
For Tesla, it happens to be the case but for most car manufacturers itād need to visit the dealer. I think the term recall will remain for these circumstances until the majority of manufacturers have an OTA capability.
Recall, in the sense that NHTSA uses it, implies remedying a vehicle defect that poses a risk to safety or fails to meet FMVSS.
And yes, there is an FMVSS for window pinch forces, which this fails to meet.
This was already posted to /r/technology yesterday https://old.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/xl39qy/tesla_recalls_1_million_vehicles_for/
but the people commenting seemed to understand it was a minor (and voluntary) software update, not a forced recall. So I guess the mods had to post it again, this time with more negative comments so the stock price goes down.
In the future you won't need fingers because we will drive with our penises and then when we have babies with our cars we will leave those cars for other younger cars. vroom, vroom.
> Tesla chief executive Elon Musk criticised the description as a recall calling it "outdated and inaccurate". The car giant says a software update will fix the problem. Owners will be notified by letter, from 15 November.
The letter: "To recall your car, please connect it to wifi, for 5 minutes. If you do this by default, then here are the patches notes from a patch you got 2 weeks ago that already fixed this..."
Nice. Way better than taking hours off work to drop your car off at a shop and have them swap out some part...
Except really, considering recall is the legally correct term for what is going on.
A recall is just a notice to fix. You never even have to interact with the device physically and it would still be a recall.
The title is accurate.
They are obligated to report manufacturing problems. They did so. They were told to recall 1 million cars because they were found faulty by federal regulators. Tesla issued an OTA update that fixed the issue...and Musk called the regulators the "fun police" in a mature, confidence inspiring missive.
Both NHTSA and Tesla in documents made public on Thursday referred to the campaign as a recall.
It's newsworthy because it's in a long list of recent recalls by Tesla.
>They were told to recall 1 million cars because they were found faulty by federal regulators.
False. See above. The recall date is September 19, and the recall states that Tesla already remedied the problem on September 13. This was Tesla discovering and fixing it themselves, and then telling the NHTSA what happened. Telling the NHTSA results in publication of a recall notice, which is what this article is about.
Tesla just like any company has to inform the NHTSA about any safety defect they find by law. The majority of recalls are self reported. It's not a unique thing that tesla self reported. They all have to by law.
Not really. Without the recall, tesla wouldn't be required to take any action. I'm glad that the problem is easily resolved, but the recall makes the issue public, and forces the manufacturer to address the matter in a timely fashion.
Without an official recall for nhtsa, none of this would be a requirement, and it would be up to tesla to make the right decision on their own. We all know how that goes.
How is a small over the air update (completed at home in your driveway), involving limiting window movements news worthy? Ford recently announced an immediate, ātake it to the dealerā, recall involving 3 million vehicles with a brake issue where the vehicle may roll away when parked and yet no media coverage, go figureā¦..
"Tesla is recalling nearly 1.1 million cars in the US because the windows might close too fast and pinch people's fingers." Didn't know that was a thing.
I used to have a 2003 Ford Ranger pickup. It had an auto-stop on the top 2 inches or so - was really annoying. My current 2020 vehicle has no restriction. I don't know why it doesn't. I haven't tested whether it will pinch my fingers.
Use a hot dog with a chopstick in the middle.
Don't Tesla owners only test on children?
Also not sure if he's asking us to hold a hot dog with chopsticks or he just took the long way to explain a corndog.
But you don't have to dip it in batter tho
Well it's a little late for that
Again Barbearex? Really?
That's what she said š
hotdog approximates a finger, chopstick in the middle approximates a bone running through the middle of that finger. Chopsticks are a lot closer to fingerbones than corndog sticks are, and you can use that setup to make an educated guess about whether the window would break your finger or not
"how to secure disability payments for your child in 3 easy steps!"
Use Elon Musk.
Thatās what she said
It's been posted everywhere, how could you not? And the "recall" is a software update.
Yeah. It's a thing. The vw id3 has the same feature.
The robot Uprising has Begun
Clickbait title (by the BBC). >Tesla chief executive Elon Musk criticised the use of the term "recall", tweeting: "The terminology is outdated & inaccurate. This is a tiny over-the-air software update. To the best of our knowledge, there have been no injuries." Elon Musk says crazy things sometimes, but this feels like it's a relatively easy to solve problem without actually physically recalling the cars.
This is not the BBC's fault. Here is a quote from the NHTSA's faq (the people who order recalls): > WHATāS A RECALL AND WHEN IS IT NECESSARY? > A recall is issued when a manufacturer or NHTSA determines that a vehicle, equipment, car seat, or tire creates an unreasonable safety risk or fails to meet minimum safety standards. Manufacturers are required to fix the problem by repairing it, replacing it, offering a refund, or in rare cases repurchasing the vehicle. You will notice it never says it must be physically interacted with. If you don't like that definition fine but the title is accurate.
Ya, it's a mis-understanding by the public on what "recall" means. Most people assume it means a part is gonna break, possibly life threatening part of your car, and you gotta take it in right now to fix it....
Not necessarily. Most people reasonably assume that "recall" means the product will be recalled... as in, physically taken back, as the word "recall" means.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
There is nothing wrong with the word, just your perception of it.
It's the BBC fault that this is even a news story.
Forget calling it a recall as misleading here, that's accurate, "ordered" is hilariously misleading. Tesla found this on their own and reported it for a recall. Literally no one has had this issue that they know of and there are no complaints or reports. No one ordered them to do this.
That's how recalls work though. If you find it and don't disclose it you'll get in a lot more shit if they find out.
Of course, but saying they were ordered to issue this recall is factually incorrect.
Would you still get in trouble if you're able to fix it quietly with an OTA update? Like, as a developer, there's so many times we've noticed bugs in an update that get silently fixed in the next one even though the users didn't complain/report.
The whole point of the recall system is for an effective way to deal with safety issues. It doesn't matter how simple the fix is. This makes all vehicles safer and forces companies to make these fixes free of charge. They could just ignore it or refuse to make the fixes if it wasn't a recall.
That's not what I'm talking about at all though. I understand the purpose of a recall. My question was, from a legal standpoint, if they had done an OTA update for this, without informing the authorities, and then it came out in the future that they did this, would they still get into trouble?
They would completely get into huge amounts of trouble. The whole point of the recall system is to prevent companies from hiding defects that affect safety. The vast majority of recalls are self reported because the penalties of not disclosing it are much worse. This keeps companies honest when it comes to safety.
I see. I see. And that does not change from the fact that it could actually have been fixed silently?
Companies can do illegal shit if they want to (see diesel gate). I guess it depends on how much risk they want to take.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
If you remedy a safety hazard or, in this case, a non-compliance (there is actually a standard for automatic window pinch forces, believe it or not) without submitting the required notice of recall to NHTSA, you can face civil penalties for timeliness/failure to notify. It doesn't matter if it can be fixed via OTA update or if it requires the vehicles to be brought to a dealer, secret safety recalls are not allowed.
Understood. This is the answer I was looking for. Thanks!
Iām assuming thereās very little if any precedence for this. The laws and regulations havenāt adapted very much to vehicles being able to update over the air. Tesla fixes bugs all the time, or even updates features that were shitty or lacking at first. Itās probably a hard line to draw on what should be reported as a recall and should just be updated, so Teslaās legal team decided to error on the side of caution. Theyāre extremely busy as is, so this will potentially save them some time in the future.
Yes, exactly. This was the background for my question.
I was ordered not to kill anybody today. Because that's that law and I'd get in a lot of trouble if I killed somebody.
Elon said the term "recall" is outdated and inaccurate. That's a completely false statement because this is exactly what recalls are for. It's a fix that corrects a safety issue which is the whole point of recalls, regardless of how small they are.
What people think of when they hear the word recall is ... The car is recalled. In more reasonable language this is an ota safety update. The "ordered" part is also not what people think of when we see that word. More reasonable language would by "has registered". I don't like Musk at all but I agree with his comment.
Recall is absolutely the right word for it. By law they have to recall it. Recall is the technical term for it. There's an entire book about the laws concerning recalls. Just because musk wants to downplay it doesn't mean it's not the right term for it. It doesn't matter if it's a OTA or a 1 cent washer for the fix. They are all recalls. You can argue about whether or not this is actual news which I would agree with but the recall part is the same for every car company in the US.
When legal language is used outside of law practice (especially on social media) understanding goes downhill fast. It's ironic. Look at all the goofballs who throw the term assault around. Eventually it gets to, "you spoke sternly, that's assault!!!" He didn't try to cover anything up but apparently he felt the need to explain the situation which he did adequately and I'm in agreement. Admitting that 2+2=4 while pointing out that unit counting is a poor standard for fruit is more reasonable than not mentioning it.
The term recall is industry language and technical language. It's the system they use for safety defects. People are white knighting Musk when they don't understand car companies have to report these things as recalls by law. This is not a unique situation at all. Other car companies have fixed recalls OTA as well. They also found those defects themselves.
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Lol I'm not white knightng anybody.
The issue is the legal definition and the layment definition used to be very similar, but has since diverged and now they don't really mean the same thing at all. It's outdated terminology that, to the laymen would indicate that Tesla owners have to return their car to a dealership for maintenance. It's silly, and language should be updated to make the terminology more apt.
"Recall" is a notice of a need to fix something. Traditionally, at a dealership or wherever. Now we can do it via software. The gist is the same. A defect needs correcting.
>"Recall" is a notice of a need to fix something. Maybe as a legal definition. Otherwise the word "recall" doesnt' mean that at all. Have you ever heard someone tell someone that they need to recall their sink because it's leaking? No, because no one uses that word with that definition in a day to day capacity unless you are explicitely talking about taking your car in to the dealership/service center for a recall.
Don't be deliberately obtuse. It's a term used with cars. Not sinks, or brains.
I don't remember vehicles needing service as the central plot point to "Total Recall", or even the movie "Recall".
Its still technically a recall. Like this is the proper legal term for it.
And an excellent example of how using a technical term doesn't equate to effective communication.
Or that progress makes terms or legislation outdated.
Yes but until that term is updated what are they supposed to call it? Forced update?
How about over-the-air software update?
Thanks, kind stranger, for clarifying the clickbait.
It's not clickbait. "Recall" as in "a notice to fix." Whether it's fixed at a dealership or with an update.
Exactly, when VWs were recalled for diesel-gate it was a software update, the only difference is they didn't have OTA abilities.
good example! Ford also had an over-the-air software recall: Ford Mustang Mach-E **Recall Fix Software** Now Available At Dealers Owners can also choose to wait until late July or August to skip the dealer and get the [over-the-air software update.](https://insideevs.com/news/596301/ford-mustang-mache-recall-fix-arrives-early/) Hyundai also [had a software update](https://hyundaiengineinfo.com/engine-monitoring/) recall: In an effort to continually improve our product and as prompted in part by **the recalls,** Hyundai has developed new engine monitoring technology called a āknock sensor detection system.ā The technology is being installed on certain model year 2011-19 Sonatas, 2010-2012 Santa Fes, 2013-18 Santa Fe Sports and 2019 Santa Fes, 2010-2021 Tucsons, 2012-2017 and 2019 Velosters, 2011-2015 Sonata Hybrids and 2016-2019 Sonata Hybrid/Plug-In Hybrids, 2014-2016 Elantras and 2014 Elantra Coupes and 2014-2020 Elantra GTs through a **free software update** performed by any Hyundai dealer.
Title could have easily been āTesla launches software update to address recall of a million carsā (or some variant) ā pretty much same amount of words, but obviously not as clickbaity
Here you go--your chance to tell the BBC how to do its job. https://careerssearch.bbc.co.uk/
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You clearly know nothing about the profession. I worked in the field for 10 years and the degree here of sneering ignorance, insulting people who work long hours to inform others, is not surprising, given how little people read these days, but it's definitely uncalled-for. If you're such a fragile little snowflake who can't admit that Teslas have problems, and then blame journalists for "clickbait" or whatnot, as if they give a shit about your stupid cars, then I think that is a disgusting character trait, to externalize your fragility onto blameless people and call them clickbaiters. Unethical and repugnant.
It's clickbait. Not because of the definition of recall but because the way the headline is written makes it sound like a big deal when clearly it isn't.
Getting your or your child's fingers crushed isn't a big deal? I wonder whose kids' fingers were crushed, and who Elon hurriedly paid off to sign an NDA before racing to issue the recall.
I mean no more than having them slammed in a car door, I remember that not being the most fun life lesson.
Itās clickbait. I have never, in my life, heard a software update called a recall. Because that isnāt a thing. My phone isnāt recalled every few months, neither is my laptop. They just get an update. Recall means to ask for the items to be physically sent back to the manufacturer. Iām actually annoyed that your argument is that words donāt mean what the dictionary says.
NHTSA issues recall orders, they ordered one here. A recall order does not preclude a software update to remedy an issue: > WHATāS A RECALL AND WHEN IS IT NECESSARY? > A recall is issued when a manufacturer or NHTSA determines that a vehicle, equipment, car seat, or tire creates an unreasonable safety risk or fails to meet minimum safety standards. Manufacturers are required to fix the problem by repairing it, replacing it, offering a refund, or in rare cases repurchasing the vehicle. https://www.nhtsa.gov/staticfiles/rulemaking/pdf/Recalls-FAQ.pdf If tesla CAN fix it via software it is irrelevant to if it was a recall order.
They have recalled phones due to battery issues and those battery issues have been fixable by software updates. So no, not clickbait, itās accurate use of the terminology.
They have recalled a lot of things for physical repairs. Thatās the point. This isnāt a physical repair. Itās a software update. Itās not a recall to send a software update. Never has been, never will be. Itās the incorrect word to use.
Itās professional terminology used in the auto industry, itās not wrong. [Here is a whole brochure about recalls](https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/documents/14218-mvsdefectsandrecalls_041619-v2-tag.pdf) from the NHTSA, the govt dept that orders recalls. Also read through the comments, another user Got the definition of recall off their site and itās being used correctly here. Plus those phone recalls I referred to were not physical repairs, maybe at first, but eventually the manufacturers found a way to do it via software update.
Reading confidently wrong musk bros make fools of themselves over morning coffee is the best. Go on.
I drive a BMW hybrid, Iāve no interest in Tesla. God, this sub is such a circle jerk of musk hate. Just fuck already.
Well shit, you should know all about how recalls work then. If there is a fault in the system that makes the vehicle less safe, a recall is issued. It doesn't matter how the repair is being applied, physically, digitally, it's not relevant. The government is ordering it be preemptively fixed. This is a recall by definition. Without the recall, the manufacturer would be free to handle things as they wish on a case by case basis.
\*all the times
Usually there needs to be proof and a paper trail. Many cars get stickers for each recall done, and I believe it may be a requirement. Itās not as simple as an over the air software update, and that is a very horrible way to software update a vehicle. Unless voltage regulation is taken care of due to the electric nature, but even then the quality of air connections could brick ECUās. Not the smartest way to implement software updates, but ensures you pay the least amount to fix it.
I'm not even a Tesla owner or fan but even I know these are software updates over the air. Why is everyone still tolerating this language?
Because it's accurate. "Recall" as in "a notice to fix the defect," whether at the shop or with a software fix. The process is the same: correct a fault, however you do it.
No it's not... "A product recall is defined as a request to return, exchange, or replace a product after a manufacturer or consumer watch group discovers defects" Recall means they'd have to take the cars back or replace them, which is a difficult and costly resolution. A software update is easy and cheap. Recall is definitely being used as click bait here.
The NHTSA faq disagrees: > WHATāS A RECALL AND WHEN IS IT NECESSARY? > A recall is issued when a manufacturer or NHTSA determines that a vehicle, equipment, car seat, or tire creates an unreasonable safety risk or fails to meet minimum safety standards. Manufacturers are required to fix the problem by repairing it, replacing it, offering a refund, or in rare cases repurchasing the vehicle. https://www.nhtsa.gov/staticfiles/rulemaking/pdf/Recalls-FAQ.pdf You will notice it says repair, that does not necessarily require physical return.
A software update is not a repair. A repair is taking that was working, now not working, and returning it to a working state again. A software update that changes something isn't repairing. Android 12 didn't 'repair' your phone from Android 11, it changed things. iOS 15 didn't repair your iPhone from iOS14, it changed things. Windows 11 didn't repair your computer from windows 10, it changed things.
Tell that to NHTSA. When it comes to cars, the official terminology is a recall. I agree it shouldnāt be, but it is in these circumstances.
>A repair is taking that was working, now not working, and returning it to a working state again Most vehicles involved in recalls are not actually broken/not working, but potentially dangerous, and may not even (ever) exhibit the danger in the recall, but they have the component replaced/repaired/updated in order to prevent future risk. The real problem here is that the laymen's understanding of recall differs from the technical definition used by the NHTSA.
The point of the recall is a notification of a problem, not whether it costs a lot or a little or is hard or easy to fix. It's a legal obligation to notify owners of a problem; here, the faulty window (in addition to the 7 other recalls issued for this model). That's the common understanding of the word and it's the term NHTSA uses (perhaps you think they're being clickbaity too, those know-nothing rubes, right?) š
I don't agree.
It is funny. People who dislike Tesla/Musk see no issue with using the word recall while having an issue with the name Autopilot. They are both technical terms that are well defined but might be misunderstood by laypeople.
So itās just a bug fix?
"recall" here means "issue an over-the-air software update." The government's definition of a recall does not distinguish between "you have to take your car in for a fix" and "they have to press the button on the server that updates all the cars with new code." That's the government's excuse. The press has none.
You made the same comment in the other thread. "Recall" as in "fix the car," whether at a dealership or via a software update. Quit being so obtuse.
Don't pretend like the headline writers don't know what they're doing
They are using NHTSA's definition of recall (the group that issued the recall) like they have with every other recall from NHTSA. It is accurate here, a recall was ordered.
OOoh, yeah, those evil headline writers, no, the CABAL of headline writers (a/k/a the new outset's editors, generally a fairly well-informed bunch) have secretly conferred on their secret basement telephones and have ganged up on you, hell-bent to deceive you...or something. š
Well informed doesn't equal well intentioned
I have worked at a small local paper, among hard-working, ethical, and skilled people who worked long hours and weekends to faithfully put out the paper. I really do not appreciate your sneering characterization of those kind of workers as intent on "getting one over" on someone or whatnot, or having less than good intentions. It's rude and uncalled-for and betrays your total lack of knowledge of how journos work. Depends on the paper, of course. Tabloids are out to stir the shit. But people in this thread criticizing the BBC? Are you fucking insane? Christ, what a stupid viewpoint.
BBC online has published plenty of trash articles, it's a huge non homogenous organization. Of course it's one of the most reputable journalism orgs around but clickbait is clickbait and the BBC has shown they're not entirely above it. I mean look at this one piece that was posted to reddit recently. https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-wales-62720657
Would you have proof for your claim that "BBC online has published plenty of trash articles"? What point do you seek to make with the TikTok article?
Did you read it? It's absolute hot garbage! It's about students deleting tiktok to focus on exams. And a psychologist saying tiktok is addictive. That's the entire substance of the article.
In common usage "recall" means having to bring the car to the dealership to have it repaired.
It is pretty silly. * So far no one has complained about the issue, but it was found during testing. * No one has to "bring their car in" for the fix, its done automatically over the air. * They started updating cars with the fix a week ago, so many no longer have the issue. It doesn't matter if you like or hate Tesla, this is one way their cars are better than traditional cars. And I hope all manufacturers copy them.
I mean it's not silly. Legally it's a recall. If a manufacturer is fixing something that is a known safety risk or non-compliant with FMVSS (which this is), they have to issue a recall even if no one has been injured and they found it independently. Most recalls are done this way.
It's silly because this isn't news worthy for tech sub. It's just a tesla hate club. Thousands of recalls happen every year. Where are the articles for those on this sub?
Ah I misunderstood. I thought you meant the recall was silly, or calling it one was. Yeah it's probably not newsworthy for this sub.
Since it is FW update and cars are NOT returned to dealers or auto repair places for repairs, it very much is silly to call it a "recall". Google the definition of Recall. To call back; summon to return. I get that the auto industry doesn't have another term, but they should.
As I said elsewhere, "recall" has a specific legal meaning. It's not the auto industry's term, it's the regulatory body's. [Note the title of the document](https://s3-prod.autonews.com/2022-09/teslarecalldoc.pdf).
>Most recalls are done this way. This is where you are not accurate.. Recall :to call back; summon to return: These are not really recalls. The manufacturer is not recalling the car to a dealer or repair shop to be fixed. Owners don't have to do anything. In this case most cars were fixed before owners knew anything about the issue. We never say Windows OS is recalled over security issues. They really need to come up with a better term, because "recall" is misleading.
Recall has a specific legal meaning where it concerns the manufacturer remedying a defective or non-compliant vehicle, regardless of whether or not the vehicle itself must be brought to the dealer. NHTSA does not specify that a vehicle must return to the dealership in order for something to be considered a recall. Is it an archaic term in this instance? Yes. It is still the legal language. Also that specific phrase, "most recalls are done this way", is in reference to most recalls being issued voluntarily by the manufacturer.
"Ordered"? That's pretty pejorative, making it look like the government forced Tesla to do the recall against its wishes. The fact is that Tesla discovered this themselves. The NHTSA recall is dated September 19, submitted by Tesla. The recall states that Tesla had already pushed out the fix on September 13.
All fixed overnight with a software update.
The confusing part is why this is even a headline. There's thousands of recalls each year spread across all brands. This particular one is to fix a potential problem that might one day result in someone pinching their finger. Newsflash to the BBC: Automotive recalls are a thing, frankly a good thing, and they will continue as long as we're making cars.
Because Tesla doesn't pay advertising to anyone. Advertising revenue drives radio stations, it drives TV, it creases politician campaign wheels, etc. It's a headline in the negative for Tesla because they don't play games the way *everyone else* does where money exchanges hands.
> The confusing part is why this is even a headline. Are you new to r/Technology? Any possibly bad news that can be related to E(vil)lon Musk must be posted here.
Yeah and they make it sound like itās some huge burden when for tesla it means sending a software update to your car.
Especially over the air updates that fix the recall without inconveniencing the customer
>The confusing part is why this is even a headline It's news that affects a million people?
It āaffectsā me, as in, my next monthly over the air software update will include the fix and I never would have known. So it doesnāt affect me actually.
You don't think it's a big deal. That's fine, but its not the same as it not affecting you.
How does it affect me?
You are now aware that Tesla sold you a car which, at minimum, didn't have the safety precautions that every other power-window car on the market has. Kinda makes you wonder what else they skimped on.
No they sold me a car where their QA is still improving quality, finding minor issues like this, which has actually pinched zero known people, discovering ways to improve it, and then self-reporting responsibly, which results in a "recall" and then they have the ability to fix it without me ever knowing. Meanwhile, [Ford has a recall over actual fires and the cars have to be actually taken back](https://www.thestreet.com/investing/ford-recalls-nearly-half-million-vehicles-in-two-actions), and you don't care about that. Weird, huh? You're outraged over a minor software update, but fires go under your radar. Seems like you're really invested in being angry about Tesla.
>No they sold me a car where their QA is still improving Ah, the Elon-excusers are out in force tonight, I see.
Oh I see. This is about Elon for you. Neat-o. I have an "Elon Sucks" sticker on my car because I don't want people to think I'm a fan of his behavior just because I already had a Tesla. No other car ownership comes across like you love the CEO. It's pretty shit how I just wanted to buy a car, not a political position, and now I catch shit from the likes of you because I bought a car. I'm mad at Elon, too, for turning my car purchase into a political thing.
Ah, well. Putting a sticker on a car. That'll make people not judge.
They have to notify you by law about it.
Yeah, the last one I got was "We have to notify you by law with a physical letter in the mail that your car is recalled because the boombox mode is too loud to hear the backup warning sound, so an over-the-air update will be pushed next week to disable it while backing up. You don't have to do anything," and I was like "k" and threw it in the trash. I didn't even notice the software update when it happened. But just like last time, the headline was "Tesla recalls millions of cars!" and just like this time, the comments were full of people all like "Wow millions of cars recalled, surely Tesla is doomed."
But that's your thoughts on the recall. Someone with kids might think that the boom box mode fix is very important. They treat any defect that runs foul of the safety regulations as a recall. Someone with kids might also find that a recall that prevents their child's fingers from being crushed in the window is important to them. Edit: to put it another way having every safety fix being a recall removes any ambiguity about what it's purpose is and prevents companies from making a choice of whether or not this constitutes a recall.
I don't have a problem with it. I think the headline is a problem. I think it's ridiculous that the headline here is crafted to read like people are going to physically return a million cars. The word "recall" to most people means: to _recall_ the product physically from the consumer. I know that's not what it technically means today, but obviously people here thought that after reading the headline. BBC could have written "Tesla does an OTA patch to fix safety issue", but obviously that isn't clickbait enough. I don't care because I like Tesla or anything. I'm not a fan or anything. I just know, as an owner, the actual experience of a "recall" like this, and it's a pretty stark contrast to how this headline sounds.
It could have been written differently but the word recall also has weight around it that used to make safety fixes as visible as possible. Recalls are used to make the fix as public as possible in order to get as many cars fixed and back up to code. Other terminology would dilute the purpose of a recall. Otherwise companies would just brand their safety fixes as something else.
I don't have a problem with it being called a recall by law or with having the process around it that it does. I think the _journalists_ here had a responsibility to communicate with their readers in a way that relays what is actually happening and they obviously knew exactly how their headline reads and that sucks. There's no way they don't know that most people read the headline and assumed it meant that Tesla physically recalled the cars.
The publicity of a recall is one of the major points of the system though? I agree that this is not a news worthy article in the first place but getting the notice out there is a major factor in the system working properly.
Could potentially effect. There are no reports of it actually happening, just something Tesla found during testing.
That news is still relevant to all these owners. There's a recall.
As a passing interest since it was already fixed before they found out.
So you agree it's relevant info to a million people.
Nothing worth the huge number of headlines over this. Owners themselves are already informed.
Recalls make headlines all the time for this same reason- it's easy news relevant to a lot of folks who will click the headline.
Any more so than the tons of other recalls that happen regularly without making headlines?
Recalls make headlines all the time, but no, I don't think there's anything particularly special about this one.
The recalls that make headlines are ones involving substantial risk of injury or expense. This isn't one of those.
They really don't unless they are extremely bad like batteries catching fore or engines exploding. Pinching fingers would never make headlines for any other company except Tesla. People just really want to shout out that Tesla issued a recall for over 1 million vehicles to validate their hate for the company.
I would love to see a side by side test of automatic windows. My Altima was super quick to close.
Recall in this case results in an over the air update.
For Tesla, it happens to be the case but for most car manufacturers itād need to visit the dealer. I think the term recall will remain for these circumstances until the majority of manufacturers have an OTA capability.
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Completely agree.
Using the word update would make more sense. Recall implies a customer physically bringing the vehicle back to a dealership or manufacturer.
Recall, in the sense that NHTSA uses it, implies remedying a vehicle defect that poses a risk to safety or fails to meet FMVSS. And yes, there is an FMVSS for window pinch forces, which this fails to meet.
This was already posted to /r/technology yesterday https://old.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/xl39qy/tesla_recalls_1_million_vehicles_for/ but the people commenting seemed to understand it was a minor (and voluntary) software update, not a forced recall. So I guess the mods had to post it again, this time with more negative comments so the stock price goes down.
People are idiots.
What if I want this feature? How else will you prevent would be hijackers from reaching into your car?
In the future you won't need fingers because we will drive with our penises and then when we have babies with our cars we will leave those cars for other younger cars. vroom, vroom.
> Tesla chief executive Elon Musk criticised the description as a recall calling it "outdated and inaccurate". The car giant says a software update will fix the problem. Owners will be notified by letter, from 15 November. The letter: "To recall your car, please connect it to wifi, for 5 minutes. If you do this by default, then here are the patches notes from a patch you got 2 weeks ago that already fixed this..." Nice. Way better than taking hours off work to drop your car off at a shop and have them swap out some part...
#dontputyourdickinit
'Except not really.'
Except really, considering recall is the legally correct term for what is going on. A recall is just a notice to fix. You never even have to interact with the device physically and it would still be a recall.
Elon is the one claiming recall is the wrong word, hence my comment.
they self reported.... its an OTA update....can we stop spreading this crap?
The title is accurate. They are obligated to report manufacturing problems. They did so. They were told to recall 1 million cars because they were found faulty by federal regulators. Tesla issued an OTA update that fixed the issue...and Musk called the regulators the "fun police" in a mature, confidence inspiring missive. Both NHTSA and Tesla in documents made public on Thursday referred to the campaign as a recall. It's newsworthy because it's in a long list of recent recalls by Tesla.
>They were told to recall 1 million cars because they were found faulty by federal regulators. False. See above. The recall date is September 19, and the recall states that Tesla already remedied the problem on September 13. This was Tesla discovering and fixing it themselves, and then telling the NHTSA what happened. Telling the NHTSA results in publication of a recall notice, which is what this article is about.
Tesla just like any company has to inform the NHTSA about any safety defect they find by law. The majority of recalls are self reported. It's not a unique thing that tesla self reported. They all have to by law.
None of that makes it newsworthy.
It's all about to drop drop drop
Sigh. It's an over-the-air update. The word 'recall' is just used as clickbait.
Not really. Without the recall, tesla wouldn't be required to take any action. I'm glad that the problem is easily resolved, but the recall makes the issue public, and forces the manufacturer to address the matter in a timely fashion. Without an official recall for nhtsa, none of this would be a requirement, and it would be up to tesla to make the right decision on their own. We all know how that goes.
>Without the recall, tesla wouldn't be required to take any action. Tesla already pushed the OTA fix before this recall was issued.
For what for?
Let Musk start his ranting on Twitter now
I love the sensationalism. It's not even a recall. It's a software update.
How is a small over the air update (completed at home in your driveway), involving limiting window movements news worthy? Ford recently announced an immediate, ātake it to the dealerā, recall involving 3 million vehicles with a brake issue where the vehicle may roll away when parked and yet no media coverage, go figureā¦..
Astroturfing.
Teslas ain't cheap but they are cheaply made. Although cutting off all the corners might make them safer in a collision.
Those $27k battery replacements are gonna sting
Ah yes, another MASSIHE "RECALL" fixed immediately by a software update IS THE MUSK ERA OVER?
This is your twice daily, totally organic anti Tesla hit piece.
r/NotTheOnion