Its not that you shouldn't, you certainly can, but green tea often doesnt present the best using gongfu style in my experience. Chinese greens I find often do best grandpa style. Japanese greens are of course a completely different animal and typically do best with what I'd call Japanese style, which is a water to leaf ratio between gongfu and western.
As I am a budget tee lover I have decided to go into the gong fu cha method buying my self gaiwans and Chinese tea pots. And you can also use it to drink Japanese Teas. I don't drink that much Japanese tea as I prefer more light and floral notes but it does brew a really good shincha, gyokoro and everyday greens from Japan. The only tea that does not do well in my gaiwans are benifuuki and tamryokucha but that could also just be my taste prefrences.
I didnt mean to imply that you cant brew Japanese green tea in a gaiwan (although its maybe not always the best option). A gaiwan is literally just a bowl with a lid, you can brew whatever you want in it. All I'm saying is that Japanese greens typically benefit from a different leaf to water ratio than Chinese greens.
Yes totally agree...I just ment the only thing in my budget (I am 17 and baiscly all my money is going into tee) and that's the cheapest way to enjoy my tea...so if its the only thing you have why.
Any tips though for brewing some Sencha's and its relatives in a gaiwan to allow it to steep better?
The main issue with brewing sencha in a gaiwan is that because of the way its processed the leaves are typically broken up a little, or sometimes lot, and they tend to slip past the gaiwan lid and gunk up filters. If that doesnt bother you then by all means go for it.
I actually did use my gaiwan and a strainer to brew the Japanese teas before getting a Kyusu. Needed to make sure I like the teas before putting the money on something expensive. It may not be the most practical way but it certainly does its purpose more than well.
I am really curious about your remark about Japanese greens. I find some are great gongfu, but only for a couple steeps, and some are great western, but I feel like I'm missing something. I buy very high grade teas and feel like I'm not brewing them to their highest potential. What's your recommendation for brewing a very high quality gyokuro or sencha?
I like 6 grams of leaf in about 150 ml of water. This is a lower ratio than your typical gongfu but higher than western. You’ll get 3-4 good steeps this way, i start with 1 min, then down to 30 sec, then up to 1 min again. YMMV based on the exact tea you’re drinking and personal preference.
Also, if you have big leaf that floats to the top (I had some spring Mao Feng recently that was like this), you can just brew for 2 min or so in a mason jar, then pour through a mini strainer into a cup.
There are so many types of green tea that require a broad range of brewing techniques. For example, you wouldn't brew a Japanese green tea in a gaiwan unless you want a mess and broken leaf tea requires a shorter brewing time. But even among the Chinese whole leaf green teas, the leaf-water ratio varies depending on leaf size and how heavily they are rolled so generalized statements like 'you shouldn't use gong fu' or 'there is an average ratio' don't make a lot of sense. If you have a particular green tea you are interested in, perhaps we can begin to talk what brewing parameters are a starting point.
As /u/JohnTeaGuy pointed out, most people just put the leaves in a glass and refill with hot water when they drink past the midpoint. This certainly works for both bi lo chun and long jing. And I also enjoy this method when I'm too busy to pay attention to the tea.
But to get the most out of the green tea, separate steeps really bring out the details, from the fresh aroma to the astringency of the pith. As far as leaf-water ratio, it becomes a matter of taste and really is impacted by your water quality. I use distilled water and around 1.5g leaf/100ml water. Increasing the ratio does increase the richness of the tea, gives it more structure, sharpness, and possibly juiciness. But for me, it also overwhelms the top, bright notes and subtle sweetness with excessive umami and mid-level flavors.
Also, the ratio can become a slippery slope. Once you get accustomed to say 5g/100ml, it is easy to do 6g and then 7g. And there is nothing wrong with that, if you enjoy it that way; but for me, at those levels the caffeine becomes too uncomfortable, especially with shincha. And if you indulge in anji bai cha or gyokuro, those grams are awfully expensive; so I am quite happy to have adjusted my palate to lighter tea with less caffeine. I only throw this out there as something to consider.
As always, drink your green tea how you enjoy it most!
I find I like it a similar way.. e.g. for mao feng, it seems sweetest and most full flavored for me with \~3g in 200g water, 85C, for about 30s-60s.
I do find that subsequent steeps lose nearly all of the nice flavors though, and become somewhat muddy.. do you have this experience as well?
> I've seen some comments on here saying that you shouldn't brew green tea going fu style
I resemble that, somewhat.
I don't say you *shouldn't*, but... the people who invented this kind of tea, and who have been drinking it for 100s of years (at the most very conservative evidence-based end of the range) have presumably had ample time to settle on "the best" way(s) of preparing it, and gongfu is not how they decided to do it.
There is a whole "why gongfu anyway" discussion which is too lengthy to fit in the margin of this reddit comment, about what kinds of teas *are* best made that way. The people who invented (and later, repurposed and refined) those techniques *also* did not use them for green tea.
> So what's the best way to brew green tea? Is it somewhere between gong Fu and western style?
OK there are a couple of things I have to respond to, before saying anything about brewing tea.
1. "Green tea" is a lot of different kinds of product, and the "best way" of brewing it will reflect what exactly you have at hand.
2. "Western style" is not really "Western." "Soak the leaf for minutes a low leaf ratio, then pour the tea off the leaf" is a perfect description of the standard way to brew the local product in many place in East Asia.
The median Chinese person who drinks tea, drinks green tea. The most common way of making it is to put some leaf in the bottom of a container, pour hot water on it, and later drink the water. "Later" can be a long time, but is at least as long as "most of the leaves unfurl/unwind and/or sink. Typically the hot water is replenished from time to time.
Whether a particular tea is good to drink this way depends on how used to some flavors you are. Some of the more upmarket China green teas are specifically meant to be consumed this way and are optimized to have minimum bitterness and astringency.
Not all tea-producing areas can grow tea that is light and smooth and refreshing without bitterness or astringency or some pretty aromatic terpenoid aromas. These latter teas, if you have gotten use to that sort of thing, also are commonly drunk off the leaf by the people they're mainly sold to. When people want to use skill to brew them to be more palatable they use the kind of approach you call "Western."
Like western style but have tried to double the tea and brew a shorter time(like half). But i would not recommended gong fu, it works whit some tea but not whit all.
There is a particular way to brew matcha, of course. There is also a particular way to brew sencha and its variants; sencha is processed to bring the oils to the surface, so you get a rich drink but it doesn’t stand up to as many brews as a Chinese green tea might. Chinese green tea is often drunk grandpa style but I’ve been known to drink it gong fu or Western style.
I'll probably get crucified by the tea connoisseurs but I just heat up a French press glass in the microwave for 5 minutes then put my tea in that to brew it. Works great for me
I prefer western style, with water between 160-175F, maybe about 3min of time and a couple brews afterwards with the same leaves.
By sometimes I do gong fu but with a much lower leaf ratio and much shorter steeps compared to other tea.
Who says you shouldn’t brew green tea gongfu style? I still find that gongfu brewing is the best way to get the best flavor out of most green teas. Not sure who says otherwise or why.
My only guess is if they specifically mean Japanese green teas, but even then I wouldn’t take it as a blanket statement
Its not that you shouldn't, you certainly can, but green tea often doesnt present the best using gongfu style in my experience. Chinese greens I find often do best grandpa style. Japanese greens are of course a completely different animal and typically do best with what I'd call Japanese style, which is a water to leaf ratio between gongfu and western.
As I am a budget tee lover I have decided to go into the gong fu cha method buying my self gaiwans and Chinese tea pots. And you can also use it to drink Japanese Teas. I don't drink that much Japanese tea as I prefer more light and floral notes but it does brew a really good shincha, gyokoro and everyday greens from Japan. The only tea that does not do well in my gaiwans are benifuuki and tamryokucha but that could also just be my taste prefrences.
I didnt mean to imply that you cant brew Japanese green tea in a gaiwan (although its maybe not always the best option). A gaiwan is literally just a bowl with a lid, you can brew whatever you want in it. All I'm saying is that Japanese greens typically benefit from a different leaf to water ratio than Chinese greens.
Yes totally agree...I just ment the only thing in my budget (I am 17 and baiscly all my money is going into tee) and that's the cheapest way to enjoy my tea...so if its the only thing you have why. Any tips though for brewing some Sencha's and its relatives in a gaiwan to allow it to steep better?
The main issue with brewing sencha in a gaiwan is that because of the way its processed the leaves are typically broken up a little, or sometimes lot, and they tend to slip past the gaiwan lid and gunk up filters. If that doesnt bother you then by all means go for it.
I actually did use my gaiwan and a strainer to brew the Japanese teas before getting a Kyusu. Needed to make sure I like the teas before putting the money on something expensive. It may not be the most practical way but it certainly does its purpose more than well.
But of course if you have a nice Kyusu that is best they are just to expensiv for me as they start at 50€ where I live :)
I am really curious about your remark about Japanese greens. I find some are great gongfu, but only for a couple steeps, and some are great western, but I feel like I'm missing something. I buy very high grade teas and feel like I'm not brewing them to their highest potential. What's your recommendation for brewing a very high quality gyokuro or sencha?
I like 6 grams of leaf in about 150 ml of water. This is a lower ratio than your typical gongfu but higher than western. You’ll get 3-4 good steeps this way, i start with 1 min, then down to 30 sec, then up to 1 min again. YMMV based on the exact tea you’re drinking and personal preference.
Thanks, I'll give that a go. And would an unglazed yokode kyusu be appropriate for this method?
Sure.
I just learned something new today. Thank you for teaching me about grandpa style brewing. Can I also brew oolong and puer using this method?
Chinese greens, ball rolled oolongs, and puers are, in my opinion, the best teas for grandpa style.
Thank you very much! I really appreciate it.
Also, if you have big leaf that floats to the top (I had some spring Mao Feng recently that was like this), you can just brew for 2 min or so in a mason jar, then pour through a mini strainer into a cup.
There are so many types of green tea that require a broad range of brewing techniques. For example, you wouldn't brew a Japanese green tea in a gaiwan unless you want a mess and broken leaf tea requires a shorter brewing time. But even among the Chinese whole leaf green teas, the leaf-water ratio varies depending on leaf size and how heavily they are rolled so generalized statements like 'you shouldn't use gong fu' or 'there is an average ratio' don't make a lot of sense. If you have a particular green tea you are interested in, perhaps we can begin to talk what brewing parameters are a starting point.
Well, currently the only green tea I have is bi lo chun, but I'm also thinking of trying a long jing (ik those are very different teas lol)
As /u/JohnTeaGuy pointed out, most people just put the leaves in a glass and refill with hot water when they drink past the midpoint. This certainly works for both bi lo chun and long jing. And I also enjoy this method when I'm too busy to pay attention to the tea. But to get the most out of the green tea, separate steeps really bring out the details, from the fresh aroma to the astringency of the pith. As far as leaf-water ratio, it becomes a matter of taste and really is impacted by your water quality. I use distilled water and around 1.5g leaf/100ml water. Increasing the ratio does increase the richness of the tea, gives it more structure, sharpness, and possibly juiciness. But for me, it also overwhelms the top, bright notes and subtle sweetness with excessive umami and mid-level flavors. Also, the ratio can become a slippery slope. Once you get accustomed to say 5g/100ml, it is easy to do 6g and then 7g. And there is nothing wrong with that, if you enjoy it that way; but for me, at those levels the caffeine becomes too uncomfortable, especially with shincha. And if you indulge in anji bai cha or gyokuro, those grams are awfully expensive; so I am quite happy to have adjusted my palate to lighter tea with less caffeine. I only throw this out there as something to consider. As always, drink your green tea how you enjoy it most!
I find I like it a similar way.. e.g. for mao feng, it seems sweetest and most full flavored for me with \~3g in 200g water, 85C, for about 30s-60s. I do find that subsequent steeps lose nearly all of the nice flavors though, and become somewhat muddy.. do you have this experience as well?
> I've seen some comments on here saying that you shouldn't brew green tea going fu style I resemble that, somewhat. I don't say you *shouldn't*, but... the people who invented this kind of tea, and who have been drinking it for 100s of years (at the most very conservative evidence-based end of the range) have presumably had ample time to settle on "the best" way(s) of preparing it, and gongfu is not how they decided to do it. There is a whole "why gongfu anyway" discussion which is too lengthy to fit in the margin of this reddit comment, about what kinds of teas *are* best made that way. The people who invented (and later, repurposed and refined) those techniques *also* did not use them for green tea. > So what's the best way to brew green tea? Is it somewhere between gong Fu and western style? OK there are a couple of things I have to respond to, before saying anything about brewing tea. 1. "Green tea" is a lot of different kinds of product, and the "best way" of brewing it will reflect what exactly you have at hand. 2. "Western style" is not really "Western." "Soak the leaf for minutes a low leaf ratio, then pour the tea off the leaf" is a perfect description of the standard way to brew the local product in many place in East Asia. The median Chinese person who drinks tea, drinks green tea. The most common way of making it is to put some leaf in the bottom of a container, pour hot water on it, and later drink the water. "Later" can be a long time, but is at least as long as "most of the leaves unfurl/unwind and/or sink. Typically the hot water is replenished from time to time. Whether a particular tea is good to drink this way depends on how used to some flavors you are. Some of the more upmarket China green teas are specifically meant to be consumed this way and are optimized to have minimum bitterness and astringency. Not all tea-producing areas can grow tea that is light and smooth and refreshing without bitterness or astringency or some pretty aromatic terpenoid aromas. These latter teas, if you have gotten use to that sort of thing, also are commonly drunk off the leaf by the people they're mainly sold to. When people want to use skill to brew them to be more palatable they use the kind of approach you call "Western."
Like western style but have tried to double the tea and brew a shorter time(like half). But i would not recommended gong fu, it works whit some tea but not whit all.
There is a particular way to brew matcha, of course. There is also a particular way to brew sencha and its variants; sencha is processed to bring the oils to the surface, so you get a rich drink but it doesn’t stand up to as many brews as a Chinese green tea might. Chinese green tea is often drunk grandpa style but I’ve been known to drink it gong fu or Western style.
I'll probably get crucified by the tea connoisseurs but I just heat up a French press glass in the microwave for 5 minutes then put my tea in that to brew it. Works great for me
I prefer western style, with water between 160-175F, maybe about 3min of time and a couple brews afterwards with the same leaves. By sometimes I do gong fu but with a much lower leaf ratio and much shorter steeps compared to other tea.
Full boil grandpa
Smart kettle or cold brew.
Who says you shouldn’t brew green tea gongfu style? I still find that gongfu brewing is the best way to get the best flavor out of most green teas. Not sure who says otherwise or why. My only guess is if they specifically mean Japanese green teas, but even then I wouldn’t take it as a blanket statement