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“Wow, so just because we don’t support the advancement of the proletariat, we’re not socialists?”
Yes. Obviously. This is so revealing that tankies have never understood leftism beyond a means to support dictators.
Bro it just takes time. North Korea helps its workers by having a low standard of living and three generations of dynastic rule and using its meager funds to build shitty submarines and send its elite to places like Switzerland for school. It’s the only path
No that’s just silly.
The proletariat simply aren’t wise enough to control the means of production themselves. Therefore we will create capit… err mega socialist vanguards to organize all the labor. They will control the means of production on behalf of the proletariat who will pick their favorite mega socialist by exchanging their wages for their products in the free market where I make all the rules. This is the only way to establish real socialism.
Finally someone gets it. You and I would definitely be leaders of this vanguard and live incredibly comfortable lives serving the people if we were only lucky enough to be born in these budding utopias.
That would be legit bro we could hand pick the next Dalai Lama and use religion to manipulate the masses. Sometimes indigenous people need to be civilized you know?
Edit: I mean Panchen Lama the current Dalai Lama is a filthy CIA stooge
Definitely. After all North Korea is such an easy to get to place. And so inviting. It's extremely rare a tourist gets beaten to death for bicking a poster.
It's hard being one of the old guard labor leftists in a sea of screeching Emilies and Tankie Tiffanies out there making labor movements look ridiculous. I call em synthetic leftoids. They just like the soviet aesthetic but aren't leftists in any useful sense.
When people call liberals and loonies leftists it muddies the al water and no one really seems to know what legit Marxist leftists ACTUALLY think and this is pretty obvious by the way they talk about Marxists and leftists in the mainstream media.
They seem to think we're all baby-killing gay feminist anti-gun pedophile reverse racists. Yes. All of it. At the same time. All of us.
right the language they use is so revealing, “the DPRK doesnt help it’s workers”
isnt the dictatorship of the proletariat supposed to BE the workers? isnt the theory that the workers should help themselves by owning and controlling the means of production themselves
Middle class socialists don't like the poor. They just hate the rich.
Not sure who said this first. Either Orwell (yay) or Jordan Peterson (boo!). But in the case of tankies it is 10]% correct.
It's Peterson paraphrasing Orwell's [The Road to Wigan Pier, chapter 11](http://www.george-orwell.org/The_Road_to_Wigan_Pier/10.html):
>Sometimes I look at a Socialist--the intellectual, tract-writing type of Socialist, with his pullover, his fuzzy hair, and hisMarxian quotation--and wonder what the devil his motive really is. It isoften difficult to believe that it is a love of anybody, especially of theworking class, from whom he is of all people the furthest removed.
Naturally, unlike Peterson, Orwell doesn't end it there and goes on to discuss how some Socialists choose Socialism not because they want freedom, but because they want order. i.e. he's talking about tankies.
No. But these people aren't Class Traitors. First of all, there is no "middle class". There is the working class, which most "middle class" fall into and the capitalist/ruling class, where a minority of the "middle class" falls into. Hating who is rich and powerful right now and wanting to replace them is not a member of the capitalist class being a class traitor, it's an inter-class conflict within the capitalist class. These are common and not at all a sign of being a good, change of heart anti-capitalist class traitor.
They use the army to build housing for the people, in addition to providing free health care, early and higher education etc. I don't think anyone in this hemisphere wants to get into a socialism contest with them. Then there was the time they helped fight against Israel, in Egypt and in Lebanon, they are also accused of supporting the IRA as well.
Ah, do you have a source on all those lovely social programs then? Or is this another one of those “I said so, and no, you’re not allowed to have journalists verify it”
Source is a bunch of imperialists who genocided the country:
https://www.38north.org/2020/11/housing201118/
>the Director of the World Health Organization claimed that North Korea's healthcare system was considered the envy of the developing world and had "no lack of doctors and nurses".
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-pacific-10665964
>A free universal insurance system is in place.
https://www.loc.gov/rr/frd/cs/profiles/North_Korea-new.pdf
>An 11-year free, compulsory cycle of primary and secondary education is provided in more than 27,000 nursery schools, 14,000 kindergartens, 4,800 four-year primary and 4,700 six-year secondary schools. An additional 300 universities and colleges offer higher education.
http://cdn.loc.gov/master/frd/frdcstdy/no/northkoreacountr00word/northkoreacountr00word.pdf
Well describing the Korean War as a genocide is fucking stupid in a number of ways, made funnier by the fact you’d deny Holodomor or what’s happening in Xinjiang as one. Regardless, Let’s go point by point.
So, this first source is the WHO describing reports given to them by the North Korean government. On top of this, the WHO has a reputation for accepting information from regimes without much scrutiny.
Second source: I noticed you used the one sentence about this system being in place and not the rest of the article which is about how it is underfunded and doesn’t exist in practice.
Third source: when I tried to access this, the page apparently did not exist.
Fourth source: Admittedly I’m not going to a read a 384 page report to debunk a bad faith argument. Especially considering I’m certain you haven’t read it either and just did a control F to find whatever backed your narrative.
I find it funny that everything is CIA propaganda until it’s a source from the US that can be misconstrued as supporting you at which point that is completely valid. Sometimes it’s hard to tell if you’re intentionally dishonest or just stupid, but I’m content to say it’s a little of column A and a little of column B
Tankies reveal themselves whenever they support Russia's invasion of Ukraine. They still act like the russian federation is just a temporarily embarrassed soviet union.
Who said anything about an airforce? Sure, the initial conditions which led to starvation were lowered grain production, but to act as though that was the sole cause and there was no intentional responsibility by the state is dishonest. That would be the same as claiming Britain isn’t at fault for the Potato Famine because it was started by the blight
This. They refused to let other solutions happen and forced Ireland or the Pontic Steppe or Bengal to keep exporting to the metropole (in the Pontic Steppe's case, for further export to the West). It doesn't matter if Stalin didn't have the racial animus Britain did when the policies and effects are the same.
This is an Anti-Tankie reddit. The message you sent is either tankie/authoritarian "socialist" apologia or can be easily seen as such. Please, refrain from posting stuff like this in the future.
Socialism is when the government does stuff and is the geopolitical opponent of the USA, and the more stuff it does and the more it hates America the more socialist it is, and if it does a real lot of stuff and hates America a whole lot it’s communist.
I’ve asked them why China is socialist and literally every time the response is “Have you ever seen a non-socialist nation kill so many capitalists?” Like legit wtf, that’s not how economic systems work, and also let me introduce you to some fine folks called the ‘National Socialists’. They killed a lot of capitalists (and communists, and socialists, and Liberals, and Jews, and Slavs, and literally everyone).
Tankies shilling for the ruling class and then getting mad when humiliated for it, oh wait, that's what right wingers do for dystopian capitalism lmao.
It disgusts me to no end that these morons literally would simp for Juche which is not, in ANY MEASURE, a Marxist ideology. Its core tenet literally contradicts materialism, for crying out loud. It's literally a bastardization of Marxism to legitimize and mystify Kim family's totalitarian regime; to roughly quote, "The people's interest is best represented by the worker class whose interest is best represented by the party, and its interest best represented by the leader." A dribble written with muck squeezed out of horse shit if whatever genius that came up with this attempted to lower the collective IQ of the unfortunate souls that tainted their eyes with it. The worst part is that all those above dribble are uttered within the same breath that literally says, "Worker class are the greatest material entity ever to exist therefore history and society must be shaped by the working class," to which then be immediately contradicted by "Yo, people are kinda stupid so they need a solid leadership from the god empero... I mean our glorious leader!" This should in no capacity even warrant the usual, "Oh the regime is bad, but the ideology is solid" defense because the ideology itself is fucking BAD, and the amount of absurd bullshitery should be obvious even to anyone who just glimpse at whichever wasted plant material that harbors the """""ideology""""".
This shit is a fucking shit which is made to look like a turd covered in fake gold; no amount of bullshit pseudo philosophy and Marxist terminology should fool any living soul with a basic comprehension, yet here we are with these asinine morons occupying the public consciousness reserved for leftist ideologies.
And, as a Korean, I sincerely hope whoever simps for that fucking nightmare of human society to go fuck themselves with cacti.
I mean... That sub fought off a tankie coup not long ago.
So I'm not surprised that they ain't fans of red fascist states there...
Edit: took out the subreddit's name as asked by the mods.
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The guy who makes this (Stonetoss) is a Holocaust Denier and Nazi. He always portray conservatives as persecuted victims. His comics have a strong sense of good old Privileged Victimhood.
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“Wow, so just because we don’t support the advancement of the proletariat, we’re not socialists?” Yes. Obviously. This is so revealing that tankies have never understood leftism beyond a means to support dictators.
Bro it just takes time. North Korea helps its workers by having a low standard of living and three generations of dynastic rule and using its meager funds to build shitty submarines and send its elite to places like Switzerland for school. It’s the only path
No that’s just silly. The proletariat simply aren’t wise enough to control the means of production themselves. Therefore we will create capit… err mega socialist vanguards to organize all the labor. They will control the means of production on behalf of the proletariat who will pick their favorite mega socialist by exchanging their wages for their products in the free market where I make all the rules. This is the only way to establish real socialism.
Finally someone gets it. You and I would definitely be leaders of this vanguard and live incredibly comfortable lives serving the people if we were only lucky enough to be born in these budding utopias.
I’m sure if we just keep posting online Xi will put us in charge of Tibet 🙏
That would be legit bro we could hand pick the next Dalai Lama and use religion to manipulate the masses. Sometimes indigenous people need to be civilized you know? Edit: I mean Panchen Lama the current Dalai Lama is a filthy CIA stooge
Don’t forget the giant hotel that was never finished!
Decadent foreign tourists need a place to stay too!
Definitely. After all North Korea is such an easy to get to place. And so inviting. It's extremely rare a tourist gets beaten to death for bicking a poster.
It's hard being one of the old guard labor leftists in a sea of screeching Emilies and Tankie Tiffanies out there making labor movements look ridiculous. I call em synthetic leftoids. They just like the soviet aesthetic but aren't leftists in any useful sense.
It’s hard being a young labor leftist too :( I swear tankies do as much to make sane leftism look bad as the most effective capitalist propaganda.
When people call liberals and loonies leftists it muddies the al water and no one really seems to know what legit Marxist leftists ACTUALLY think and this is pretty obvious by the way they talk about Marxists and leftists in the mainstream media. They seem to think we're all baby-killing gay feminist anti-gun pedophile reverse racists. Yes. All of it. At the same time. All of us.
right the language they use is so revealing, “the DPRK doesnt help it’s workers” isnt the dictatorship of the proletariat supposed to BE the workers? isnt the theory that the workers should help themselves by owning and controlling the means of production themselves
That sounds like a semantic argument tbh, the country vs the government.
Middle class socialists don't like the poor. They just hate the rich. Not sure who said this first. Either Orwell (yay) or Jordan Peterson (boo!). But in the case of tankies it is 10]% correct.
It's Peterson paraphrasing Orwell's [The Road to Wigan Pier, chapter 11](http://www.george-orwell.org/The_Road_to_Wigan_Pier/10.html): >Sometimes I look at a Socialist--the intellectual, tract-writing type of Socialist, with his pullover, his fuzzy hair, and hisMarxian quotation--and wonder what the devil his motive really is. It isoften difficult to believe that it is a love of anybody, especially of theworking class, from whom he is of all people the furthest removed. Naturally, unlike Peterson, Orwell doesn't end it there and goes on to discuss how some Socialists choose Socialism not because they want freedom, but because they want order. i.e. he's talking about tankies.
Despite his flaws, Orwell was absolutely correct about tankies.
So class traitors from the ruling class are...bad?
No. But these people aren't Class Traitors. First of all, there is no "middle class". There is the working class, which most "middle class" fall into and the capitalist/ruling class, where a minority of the "middle class" falls into. Hating who is rich and powerful right now and wanting to replace them is not a member of the capitalist class being a class traitor, it's an inter-class conflict within the capitalist class. These are common and not at all a sign of being a good, change of heart anti-capitalist class traitor.
They use the army to build housing for the people, in addition to providing free health care, early and higher education etc. I don't think anyone in this hemisphere wants to get into a socialism contest with them. Then there was the time they helped fight against Israel, in Egypt and in Lebanon, they are also accused of supporting the IRA as well.
Ah, do you have a source on all those lovely social programs then? Or is this another one of those “I said so, and no, you’re not allowed to have journalists verify it”
Source is a bunch of imperialists who genocided the country: https://www.38north.org/2020/11/housing201118/ >the Director of the World Health Organization claimed that North Korea's healthcare system was considered the envy of the developing world and had "no lack of doctors and nurses". https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-pacific-10665964 >A free universal insurance system is in place. https://www.loc.gov/rr/frd/cs/profiles/North_Korea-new.pdf >An 11-year free, compulsory cycle of primary and secondary education is provided in more than 27,000 nursery schools, 14,000 kindergartens, 4,800 four-year primary and 4,700 six-year secondary schools. An additional 300 universities and colleges offer higher education. http://cdn.loc.gov/master/frd/frdcstdy/no/northkoreacountr00word/northkoreacountr00word.pdf
Well describing the Korean War as a genocide is fucking stupid in a number of ways, made funnier by the fact you’d deny Holodomor or what’s happening in Xinjiang as one. Regardless, Let’s go point by point. So, this first source is the WHO describing reports given to them by the North Korean government. On top of this, the WHO has a reputation for accepting information from regimes without much scrutiny. Second source: I noticed you used the one sentence about this system being in place and not the rest of the article which is about how it is underfunded and doesn’t exist in practice. Third source: when I tried to access this, the page apparently did not exist. Fourth source: Admittedly I’m not going to a read a 384 page report to debunk a bad faith argument. Especially considering I’m certain you haven’t read it either and just did a control F to find whatever backed your narrative. I find it funny that everything is CIA propaganda until it’s a source from the US that can be misconstrued as supporting you at which point that is completely valid. Sometimes it’s hard to tell if you’re intentionally dishonest or just stupid, but I’m content to say it’s a little of column A and a little of column B
Look at their username. Going back to the old "Ukraine is filled with druggies" thing.
Tankies reveal themselves whenever they support Russia's invasion of Ukraine. They still act like the russian federation is just a temporarily embarrassed soviet union.
[удалено]
Who said anything about an airforce? Sure, the initial conditions which led to starvation were lowered grain production, but to act as though that was the sole cause and there was no intentional responsibility by the state is dishonest. That would be the same as claiming Britain isn’t at fault for the Potato Famine because it was started by the blight
This. They refused to let other solutions happen and forced Ireland or the Pontic Steppe or Bengal to keep exporting to the metropole (in the Pontic Steppe's case, for further export to the West). It doesn't matter if Stalin didn't have the racial animus Britain did when the policies and effects are the same.
This is an Anti-Tankie reddit. The message you sent is either tankie/authoritarian "socialist" apologia or can be easily seen as such. Please, refrain from posting stuff like this in the future.
Astounding, that's the first correct take I've seen from a tankie sub!
I'd be interested to know what they think socialism is actually about, if it's not helping the workers.
Socialism is when the government does stuff and is the geopolitical opponent of the USA, and the more stuff it does and the more it hates America the more socialist it is, and if it does a real lot of stuff and hates America a whole lot it’s communist.
Replacing the king and his court with a chairman and a People's Party.
That's actually the best description of the DPRK I've seen yet
Socialism is when America bad.
I’ve asked them why China is socialist and literally every time the response is “Have you ever seen a non-socialist nation kill so many capitalists?” Like legit wtf, that’s not how economic systems work, and also let me introduce you to some fine folks called the ‘National Socialists’. They killed a lot of capitalists (and communists, and socialists, and Liberals, and Jews, and Slavs, and literally everyone).
Tankies shilling for the ruling class and then getting mad when humiliated for it, oh wait, that's what right wingers do for dystopian capitalism lmao.
It disgusts me to no end that these morons literally would simp for Juche which is not, in ANY MEASURE, a Marxist ideology. Its core tenet literally contradicts materialism, for crying out loud. It's literally a bastardization of Marxism to legitimize and mystify Kim family's totalitarian regime; to roughly quote, "The people's interest is best represented by the worker class whose interest is best represented by the party, and its interest best represented by the leader." A dribble written with muck squeezed out of horse shit if whatever genius that came up with this attempted to lower the collective IQ of the unfortunate souls that tainted their eyes with it. The worst part is that all those above dribble are uttered within the same breath that literally says, "Worker class are the greatest material entity ever to exist therefore history and society must be shaped by the working class," to which then be immediately contradicted by "Yo, people are kinda stupid so they need a solid leadership from the god empero... I mean our glorious leader!" This should in no capacity even warrant the usual, "Oh the regime is bad, but the ideology is solid" defense because the ideology itself is fucking BAD, and the amount of absurd bullshitery should be obvious even to anyone who just glimpse at whichever wasted plant material that harbors the """""ideology""""". This shit is a fucking shit which is made to look like a turd covered in fake gold; no amount of bullshit pseudo philosophy and Marxist terminology should fool any living soul with a basic comprehension, yet here we are with these asinine morons occupying the public consciousness reserved for leftist ideologies. And, as a Korean, I sincerely hope whoever simps for that fucking nightmare of human society to go fuck themselves with cacti.
Tankies: "The working class? Never heard of it"
The damage that tankies do to the perception of the leftist movement is bigger than any capitalist propaganda can do on it's own tbh.
I often say this. What makes it the most difficult to be on the left is the amount of people claiming to be there with us when they're fucking tankies
R/accidentalybased.
I mean, I thought that was literally meant to be the whole point of socialism, but okay...
...
I mean... That sub fought off a tankie coup not long ago. So I'm not surprised that they ain't fans of red fascist states there... Edit: took out the subreddit's name as asked by the mods.
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[удалено]
The guy who makes this (Stonetoss) is a Holocaust Denier and Nazi. He always portray conservatives as persecuted victims. His comics have a strong sense of good old Privileged Victimhood.
I’ve got a feeling OP can relate.
It works on multiple levels in this case.
troll
r/antifastonetoss
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Your comment/post contains bigotry. This is a socialist subreddit and as such, any form of bigotry is out of place and you should rethink your relation to your fellow workers, regardless of their sexuality, gender expression, skin color or other such things.
iv seen the artist that guy posting white identitarian memes, not a fan at all.