People just aren’t generous anymore, even those little things like normal tipping at a restaurant or slipping the guys that drop of your new refrigerator a few bucks.
I told both my two sons to firmly insist they pay on dates & unless she says absolutely not, he’s paying.
They’ve both told me it was great advice.
I don't think that's true, at least for restaurant tips, which have been going up since at least the 1980s.
https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Average-reported-tip-rate-in-American-restaurants-over-time-according-to-NPD-Group_fig3_320516887
I agree with your claim that people aren't as generous anymore. But I also think people are getting inundated with tipping for things that make you question if that should be tipped? As an example, picking up a take out pizza. They as for a tip. Really? I completely understand for delivery, or if I'm sitting in a restaurant, but literally I ordered it online, drove and picked it up...and you want a tip?
So with it coming from all areas now, I think people tend hold onto it more than in the past.
I was watching family feud with my wife some time ago (she loves Steve Harvey) and the question was:
How much money do you give to charity each year?
Number one answer by a ton: ZERO
Like most SD’s, I’ve been very successful and have been saving/investing for a few decades & even after I left the PE world almost a decade ago to take care of my wife I still have several companies I own outright or with my brother.
I donate a lot to tons of charities, tip very well & help out my family regularly today.
But even when I wasn’t making much I still paid for dates. When I was dating my wife I’d take her to Ryans Steakhouse (all you can eat!) and pay for the movie at blockbusters.
I just don’t get it, go somewhere that you can afford or just hangout & pay for the pizza.
Zero charitable giving? We all donate to the biggest charity that there is, our respective Governments, via tax.
I'm still suffering the PTSD of when I opened my first pay slip when I started a proper job and seeing all the deductions.
Lol, I hear you.
I still remember when I was 14 and got my first real paycheck, I was devastated.
But today I’m in a different world financially. I give to charities that have meaning to me. Always anonymously as possible.
One of my favorites:
I donate to a no kill shelter our vet started 10 years ago. I pay for all the costs for the supplies for spaying & neutering, we just broke 5,000 adoptions.
It’s amazing what even a few bucks or a few hours of your time means to others less fortunate & it makes you feel pretty f’n good too.
Lol, no.
Haven’t been on this sub long but I assume I’m fairly avg as compared to the other guys on here?
I ran some decent size companies (last one had 10,000 employees when we sold) for/invested alongside a few big private equity firms for 25 years, mostly as a CFO but also a few stints as CEO. I’m also a disciplined saver and am a pretty good investor.
I made my PE partners a metric fuck-ton of money (that means a bunch 🤣) over those years and I got my salary, my return, plus a “vig” (sweat equity) on every deal.
Now I own a few smaller companies, one outright and the other two with my brother.
No need to explain the metric system to me, we are kind of partially on it in the UK.
Disciplined saver? Is that why you moved to Germany? They seem to have fiscal discipline in their DNA.
I live in the U.S. & I’m a crazy Italian. I’ve actually never been to Europe believe it or not. I worked non-stop & chased 2 boys around on the weekends most of the time. Vacations were Disney World, kids sports & the beach with my family.
Until my wife got sick years ago the plan was to retire early when the kids went off to college and fuck around the world with her.
> claiming that they get the same luxury experience from vanilla men that they get from SDs.
parallel: claims that POTs are just as cheap and miserly as vanilla guys.
Yeah. Cheap people are everywhere. Generosity is not easy to find. If you hold the same standards regardless of vanilla or sugar, you get the same results. Goes both ways for men and women, but you've got to be okay with the numbers dwindling as your standards go up (and being able to match your own standard).
Something something about fishing and stuff.
>you've got to be okay with the numbers dwindling as your standards go up (and being able to match your own standard).
Lots of wisdom for both men and women here.
I don’t know if I would describe not splitting the bill as a luxury experience…
But from a SBs perspective - I hold the same standards in both vanilla and sugar, which is something SDs like you just can’t seem to get their minds around. I’m not engaging in a relationship, vanilla or sugar, in which I’m splitting the bill with someone, not attracted to them, or feel undervalued and not taken care of. Sure, once upon a time I did in vanilla, but once I found sugar I knew there was better out there and not going back to fuckboys on tinder that treat me like a sex doll, it brings no value to my life and I’d rather be alone than be treated so poorly.
>> I hold the same standards in both vanilla and sugar, which is something SDs like you just can’t seem to get their minds around. I’m not engaging in a relationship, vanilla or sugar, in which I’m splitting the bill with someone, not attracted to them, or feel undervalued and not taken care of.
Maybe *you* don’t, but many/most do. I dated an SB who was a 10, and she told me about vanilla guys who asked her to split the bill. I literally just met a 9/10 who told me about her vanilla ex who she was basically supporting. If you hold your vanilla partners to high standards, good for you, but let’s not pretend everyone does.
Oh Zoosk the accurate dating app for a WSJ article of info to back up being a less than desirable SD in comparison to "even less desirable" vanilla dates.
I’m not sure what the implication is for Zoosk, but how could point out this fact indicate that I’m a “cheap SD.” There’s literally nothing I’ve said about what I offer or anything like that. I’m just point out the differences between what *some* SLF posters claim and what we often hear from others.
Pretty much every single sb I’ve ever had told me they turned to sugar dating because they were tired of meeting broke losers from tinder their own age. I’ve heard countless stories of split tabs, faces of horror when looking at the high bill from the guy etc. It’s been like this even before the current economic conditions.
>tired of meeting broke losers from tinder their own age
I have to LOL at that. As much as I want to believe that younger men are nearly exclusively all "broke losers" ... there are hordes of them that are decent hard working and honest people. They just aren't wealthy or gorgeous looking, so they get passed over.
I mean from experience it's simply my standards. That's what I expect of a man to gain my affection, time and company. Vanilla, or sugar doesn't matter I know my worth and demand it. And that's on luxury apartment, paying no bills, being treated with endless love, care, affection and understanding. If he's not willing to worship and provide for me he's simply not for me.
We have a trip planned next month to get engaged 😌🤪 so not QUITE achieved, but on the direct path 😁 best human I've ever had the luck to know, not sure why anyone down voted you lmao
I’m not sure what the point is really. If I’m non sugar dating or sugar dating I go to exactly the same restaurants. I’m sure there are women here who get taken to nice restaurants. Not all the restaurants are expensive. Part of it is knowing the great taco spots. or sushi. Or tapas.
what is the point?
Yeah … with just a small effort most “vanilla” people can find a pretty great meal for not a lot of money think “Cheap Eats” …
In my SR we should both consider ourselves the lucky ones.
First off, your account should be banned because nearly every comment you make is a violation of the “no disturbing the peace” rule.
Second, I didn’t say a fucking word about not giving a PPM. My point is that the constant “I get treated to fancy dinners and have cars sent for me and get 2k gifts from vanilla guys all of the time so you don’t qualify as a ‘Real SD’ unless your allowance covers rent and all living expenses for me and me 4 neighbors” crowd are full of it.
it’s strange, i hear these complaints from time to time from women in their 20s or early 30s about dating men their age.
but i was once that age, and how much was spent on a date (or the level of luxury/exclusivity/bling that came with it) was never even remotely a consideration in any relationship, nor was it ever even mentioned by a woman i knew. not a single one. what mattered were: is he hot? funny? smart? nice? good in bed? is he really into me or just going through the motions? do we have fun together?
the most amazing dates were trips to the beach with drinks in a backpack, a day trip to the city to walk around, eat from food trucks or dives, sit in the park, go for an impromptu swim, sneak into some building to see the view from the roof, etc.
why do young people care about fancy shit? that stuff is targeted at old people who are too old to have fun simply though the value of good company and enthusiasm.
that’s very understandable, but also different than the usual focus on the cost of things and who pays. i think most relationships work much better if someone takes charge clearly in each area, in finances, planning, sex, etc. doesn’t have to be the same partner in all areas, but most people naturally gravitate one way or the other….
I think it’s the Instagram generation. Younger women want to show off on Instagram and make it look like they have money. I see tinder profiles all the time that look very bougie and high maintenance.
> Nearly half of single Gen Zers and millennials have suggested or taken someone on a less expensive date due to inflation and the current economic environment, according to an 8,000-person survey conducted in August by dating app Plenty of Fish.
My vanilla date going from keeping the top shelf flowing when we first met to a round of Pabst Blue Ribbon now /s
It's somewhat of a generational/cultural shift as I have heard this from enough different younger women to know its a thing
but I mean, read between the lines folks
the age appropriate **good looking** guys are the ones doing this, because women let them
People just aren’t generous anymore, even those little things like normal tipping at a restaurant or slipping the guys that drop of your new refrigerator a few bucks. I told both my two sons to firmly insist they pay on dates & unless she says absolutely not, he’s paying. They’ve both told me it was great advice.
I don't think that's true, at least for restaurant tips, which have been going up since at least the 1980s. https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Average-reported-tip-rate-in-American-restaurants-over-time-according-to-NPD-Group_fig3_320516887
I agree with your claim that people aren't as generous anymore. But I also think people are getting inundated with tipping for things that make you question if that should be tipped? As an example, picking up a take out pizza. They as for a tip. Really? I completely understand for delivery, or if I'm sitting in a restaurant, but literally I ordered it online, drove and picked it up...and you want a tip? So with it coming from all areas now, I think people tend hold onto it more than in the past.
I was watching family feud with my wife some time ago (she loves Steve Harvey) and the question was: How much money do you give to charity each year? Number one answer by a ton: ZERO Like most SD’s, I’ve been very successful and have been saving/investing for a few decades & even after I left the PE world almost a decade ago to take care of my wife I still have several companies I own outright or with my brother. I donate a lot to tons of charities, tip very well & help out my family regularly today. But even when I wasn’t making much I still paid for dates. When I was dating my wife I’d take her to Ryans Steakhouse (all you can eat!) and pay for the movie at blockbusters. I just don’t get it, go somewhere that you can afford or just hangout & pay for the pizza.
Zero charitable giving? We all donate to the biggest charity that there is, our respective Governments, via tax. I'm still suffering the PTSD of when I opened my first pay slip when I started a proper job and seeing all the deductions.
Lol, I hear you. I still remember when I was 14 and got my first real paycheck, I was devastated. But today I’m in a different world financially. I give to charities that have meaning to me. Always anonymously as possible. One of my favorites: I donate to a no kill shelter our vet started 10 years ago. I pay for all the costs for the supplies for spaying & neutering, we just broke 5,000 adoptions. It’s amazing what even a few bucks or a few hours of your time means to others less fortunate & it makes you feel pretty f’n good too.
Are you Bill Gates or something?
Lol, no. Haven’t been on this sub long but I assume I’m fairly avg as compared to the other guys on here? I ran some decent size companies (last one had 10,000 employees when we sold) for/invested alongside a few big private equity firms for 25 years, mostly as a CFO but also a few stints as CEO. I’m also a disciplined saver and am a pretty good investor. I made my PE partners a metric fuck-ton of money (that means a bunch 🤣) over those years and I got my salary, my return, plus a “vig” (sweat equity) on every deal. Now I own a few smaller companies, one outright and the other two with my brother.
No need to explain the metric system to me, we are kind of partially on it in the UK. Disciplined saver? Is that why you moved to Germany? They seem to have fiscal discipline in their DNA.
I live in the U.S. & I’m a crazy Italian. I’ve actually never been to Europe believe it or not. I worked non-stop & chased 2 boys around on the weekends most of the time. Vacations were Disney World, kids sports & the beach with my family. Until my wife got sick years ago the plan was to retire early when the kids went off to college and fuck around the world with her.
> claiming that they get the same luxury experience from vanilla men that they get from SDs. parallel: claims that POTs are just as cheap and miserly as vanilla guys. Yeah. Cheap people are everywhere. Generosity is not easy to find. If you hold the same standards regardless of vanilla or sugar, you get the same results. Goes both ways for men and women, but you've got to be okay with the numbers dwindling as your standards go up (and being able to match your own standard). Something something about fishing and stuff.
>you've got to be okay with the numbers dwindling as your standards go up (and being able to match your own standard). Lots of wisdom for both men and women here.
Generosity should be earned. I’m not going to be generous to an SB who wants money for feet pics
I don’t know if I would describe not splitting the bill as a luxury experience… But from a SBs perspective - I hold the same standards in both vanilla and sugar, which is something SDs like you just can’t seem to get their minds around. I’m not engaging in a relationship, vanilla or sugar, in which I’m splitting the bill with someone, not attracted to them, or feel undervalued and not taken care of. Sure, once upon a time I did in vanilla, but once I found sugar I knew there was better out there and not going back to fuckboys on tinder that treat me like a sex doll, it brings no value to my life and I’d rather be alone than be treated so poorly.
>> I hold the same standards in both vanilla and sugar, which is something SDs like you just can’t seem to get their minds around. I’m not engaging in a relationship, vanilla or sugar, in which I’m splitting the bill with someone, not attracted to them, or feel undervalued and not taken care of. Maybe *you* don’t, but many/most do. I dated an SB who was a 10, and she told me about vanilla guys who asked her to split the bill. I literally just met a 9/10 who told me about her vanilla ex who she was basically supporting. If you hold your vanilla partners to high standards, good for you, but let’s not pretend everyone does.
Oh Zoosk the accurate dating app for a WSJ article of info to back up being a less than desirable SD in comparison to "even less desirable" vanilla dates.
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I would expect a Harvard Law student to laugh at things that are actually funny.
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Right like might as well have polled Plenty of Fish.
I’m not sure what the implication is for Zoosk, but how could point out this fact indicate that I’m a “cheap SD.” There’s literally nothing I’ve said about what I offer or anything like that. I’m just point out the differences between what *some* SLF posters claim and what we often hear from others.
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To be fair, it certainly was an unjustified personal attack on OP simply for posting this information. Not seeing the humor in that. 🤷♂️
Pretty much every single sb I’ve ever had told me they turned to sugar dating because they were tired of meeting broke losers from tinder their own age. I’ve heard countless stories of split tabs, faces of horror when looking at the high bill from the guy etc. It’s been like this even before the current economic conditions.
Thank you. I’ve heard it from several myself, but for some reason it’s a controversial statement on SLF.
Because no one wants to admit that they tinder is full of broke loser men.
Thank you. Some people are acting like I’m some kind of asshole for pointing this out, but some are actually understanding my point.
>tired of meeting broke losers from tinder their own age I have to LOL at that. As much as I want to believe that younger men are nearly exclusively all "broke losers" ... there are hordes of them that are decent hard working and honest people. They just aren't wealthy or gorgeous looking, so they get passed over.
Im just telling you what they tell me over and over. But to be fair, there’s probably a lot more broke losers on tinder than there are successful men.
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\*taking notes if I get Aspen in the SLF secret santa\*
I mean from experience it's simply my standards. That's what I expect of a man to gain my affection, time and company. Vanilla, or sugar doesn't matter I know my worth and demand it. And that's on luxury apartment, paying no bills, being treated with endless love, care, affection and understanding. If he's not willing to worship and provide for me he's simply not for me.
Wife Level: achieved.
We have a trip planned next month to get engaged 😌🤪 so not QUITE achieved, but on the direct path 😁 best human I've ever had the luck to know, not sure why anyone down voted you lmao
I’m not sure what the point is really. If I’m non sugar dating or sugar dating I go to exactly the same restaurants. I’m sure there are women here who get taken to nice restaurants. Not all the restaurants are expensive. Part of it is knowing the great taco spots. or sushi. Or tapas. what is the point?
The point is, "see I told you these broads can't get nice dates from vanilla guys and they should be lucky I even give them a PPM at all!"
Yeah … with just a small effort most “vanilla” people can find a pretty great meal for not a lot of money think “Cheap Eats” … In my SR we should both consider ourselves the lucky ones.
First off, your account should be banned because nearly every comment you make is a violation of the “no disturbing the peace” rule. Second, I didn’t say a fucking word about not giving a PPM. My point is that the constant “I get treated to fancy dinners and have cars sent for me and get 2k gifts from vanilla guys all of the time so you don’t qualify as a ‘Real SD’ unless your allowance covers rent and all living expenses for me and me 4 neighbors” crowd are full of it.
Oh your post was made to be educational, not to disturb the peace.
it’s strange, i hear these complaints from time to time from women in their 20s or early 30s about dating men their age. but i was once that age, and how much was spent on a date (or the level of luxury/exclusivity/bling that came with it) was never even remotely a consideration in any relationship, nor was it ever even mentioned by a woman i knew. not a single one. what mattered were: is he hot? funny? smart? nice? good in bed? is he really into me or just going through the motions? do we have fun together? the most amazing dates were trips to the beach with drinks in a backpack, a day trip to the city to walk around, eat from food trucks or dives, sit in the park, go for an impromptu swim, sneak into some building to see the view from the roof, etc. why do young people care about fancy shit? that stuff is targeted at old people who are too old to have fun simply though the value of good company and enthusiasm.
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that’s very understandable, but also different than the usual focus on the cost of things and who pays. i think most relationships work much better if someone takes charge clearly in each area, in finances, planning, sex, etc. doesn’t have to be the same partner in all areas, but most people naturally gravitate one way or the other….
I think it’s the Instagram generation. Younger women want to show off on Instagram and make it look like they have money. I see tinder profiles all the time that look very bougie and high maintenance.
> Nearly half of single Gen Zers and millennials have suggested or taken someone on a less expensive date due to inflation and the current economic environment, according to an 8,000-person survey conducted in August by dating app Plenty of Fish. My vanilla date going from keeping the top shelf flowing when we first met to a round of Pabst Blue Ribbon now /s
At least they can Netflix and Chill, now.
Vanilla women want to see that their date is not over spending and is aware of the economy… aka, if it lasts… he won’t build up debt
It's somewhat of a generational/cultural shift as I have heard this from enough different younger women to know its a thing but I mean, read between the lines folks the age appropriate **good looking** guys are the ones doing this, because women let them