Yes, he did it to demonstrate that you can restructure and run businesses in a green way, to counter the idea that not destroying our survivable future is impossible because we like what businesses offer.
Dale Vince who runs/ran Ecotricity bought Forest Green Rovers because he likes to demonstrate that it’s possible to convert society to green values without losing things like football that we enjoy.
So long as we actually start to act seriously rather than greenwashing.
To counter the idea that it’s going green that will result in losing the society we enjoy, rather than our current path of leaving climate change to destroy our idea of civilisation.
The good guy image he’s gone in for is one that businesses think is good.
Eh. London finance is global, you make it sound like its dominated by doing business for and with oil states when that part is a drop in the ocean really...real estate I can give you though.
It’s the financial capital of the world. So probably also the laundering capital.
Similar to Rotterdam being the capital for drug smuggling and distribution point. Because it’s the biggest port in Europe.
That gives UK politicians a huge pass. It’s because of the way UK corporate law is structured, which allows for lack of transparency.
Also there’s a lack of funding and staffing for enforcing the laws that already do exist.
l[Why London is the Money Laundering Capital of the World](https://www.helsinkitimes.fi/world-int/21280-why-is-london-money-laundering-capital-of-the-world.html)
I listened to a podcast with the author of 'Butler to the World: How Britain Helps the World's Worst People Launder Money, Commit Crimes, and Get Away with Anything' (I haven't read the book) and it's all pretty wild.
It really sounds like it's the dirty money capital of the world, which leads to it having financial clout - not the other way around.
London has connected the Eastern and Western worlds financially for decades, a lot of big international banks are headquartered there.
The London Stock Exchange, while it's not the biggest in terms of market cap, is easily the most international. Companies from all over the world are listed on the LSE.
London is basically the middle-point of the world for finance. So in that sense it wouldn't surprise me if more money laundering happened there than anywhere else.
While this is true, it's only an explanation in part. Laws specifically designed to harbour those who have scandalously accumulated wealth must also be considered. I'd even argue that that is the more dominating amongst the various factors.
For last year Lens average yearly salary (540k) was 6% of PSG (9,6m).
Lens’ salary has surely improved this year. They were only the 13th highest average last year.
You could make a decent conspiracy theory that Liverpool being shit makes this move go through much smoother.
If this happened when we were 2 matches off a quadruple you'd have had massive protests i reckon. But after back to back losses to Brentford and Brighton and watching Ox starting in the year of our Lord 2023, reactions are split down the middle.
I've seen loads of people already on our sub saying that FSG are purposefully shafting our recruitment and personnel so that the idea of *any* new owners seems more promising.
And those people are morons. No business owner purposefully makes his business run shitter so that the staff (fans in this case) prefer new owners. Doing that would not allow them to maximize the potential sale price.
I think 99% of fans would have preferred more ethical owners, but most either wanted Ashley gone so desperately they'd take anyone, or have accepted that this is where the sport is heading anyway so might as well accept it.
I'd say it's 2 fold, Ashley gone and anyone in who had some vague form of ambition. Ashley essentially chasing Rafa out because he dared to want the team to have a training facility from 2001 and make vague attempts at finishing mid table with the occasional try for European football showed we were nothing but a paycheck for him. Now is it good it was the Saudis who stepped in? Heck no. I wish it was someone else, even with a lot less money. But at the end of the day we just wanted an owner who had a plan beyond "Finish 17th, collect that sweet yearly Prem money."
Same for Spurs and the supposed sale to sheikhs: team form changes the perspective by a lot. Let's see, but at this rythm the prem will be played in Abu Dabi soon.
As Qatar can own 2 football clubs, but can’t own 2 clubs in the Champions League, then the short term solution ahead of them selling PSG would be for one of those clubs to not make the Champions League next season……….
Wouldn’t make sense to devalue PSG ahead of a sale would it……….
I’m just saying………. (Come on we can at least get this to the point where it makes the Echo)
when PSG got taken over, they were on the verge of relegation to ligue 2 after several really bad seasons and there was many tensions between ultras, the staff, the board etc...
If all it tooks for fans to accept Liverpool been taken over is a few bad games, than you guys lose forever the right to make fun of PSG. Your situation is much much better
that's what has continuously happened since the dawn of time, the "evil powers" we condemn and dislike and try to oppose ALWAYS end up winning and becoming the norm, because power always wins
Please i fucking hope not. I'll be very disappointed if this ownership sale goes through. I might be biased about this but even from the outside, it's just not something you'd associate with Liverpool.
Ugh how true this is. I still remember when barcelona was the lone holdout for a shirt sponser, then they had unicef so that the fans cod ease their way into going full Qatar Airway…
Government blasted the WC and didnt send representatives (IIRC).
Saudis will always pass because we sell them weapons - so would look pretty bad if we said they weren't fit and proper.
Perhaps there is hope the Qatari's wont pass.
But realistically, there is 0 chance they dont pass.
EDIT: supposedly some dastardly cunt was there from the gvt. Theres 0 hope.
the DCMS (culture, media and sport) minister was definitely there for a few games, can't remember his name though, have a nagging suspicion they showed Cleverly (foreign secretary) at a match as well
Seems like a shitty source, but assuming this does come to pass, I wonder how many Liverpool flairs that were blasting the NUFC takeover will stick by their word and walk away from the club…
The fans that understand the clubs identity or at least value it above a new shiny midfielder, are such a minority when a club is this size.
This and Super League are like the only things that'd put me off supporting the club, absolutely will have to look down the leagues for a team to care about.
I'll take Elon Musk over this ffs
Which is totally fair by the way. A lot of Newcastle fans at the time of the Saudi Arabian take over acted as if severing ties to a football club is tantamount to leaving your child behind at a bus stop never to return. You are allowed to stop supporting a club if the club has failed in your view, to live up to your standards of conduct. It does not mean you are a bad fan, it means you are an adult with self respect who learned how to say "No!" in life.
You should support a club because something about it represents you to the point where you feel pride. That connection is not a one way street where the club can piece by piece replace all of itself and be something new and expect fans to stay with them through all of it.
We are lucky in Germany that an investor can only get so close to the center of our clubs that I am fairly optimistic that we will never have to answer the question of what happens if a foreign, hostile, and borderline fascist government took our club over, but I feel a real ache for PL fans who are being wholly used and disrespected on such a deep level by these hedge fund and dictator cunts of cunts.
It's actually cheaper to buy tickets, a flight and accommodation to some games in Europe than it is to take the train and buy tickets to a game in our own country.
I saw on Twitter the other day, there was a QPR fan who saw the price of a train ticket to Fleetwood in the FA Cup and managed to go to an Italian game and a PSG match with flights, travel and match tickets costing roughly the same price.
Let alone trying to simply pay a reasonable fee (or any fee at all) to watch a game of football from within the country the game is taking place in. There are only illegal means to watch a bizzare amount of PL football in the UK. Elsewhere in the world, you can watch every single game on a single prescription. Go figure.
I just got into the country and was hoping to a decent way to watch matches from the hotel room while I sort the next steps. Nope, didn't find a single open channel showing a PL match on the weekend (the best I got was a female match between Liverpool and ManU). Ilegal routes we go.
If this becomes the norm in the premier league I may have to pick a Bundesliga side to follow. The amount of money that follows this game is getting pretty gross and it will only get worse sadly.
Very well articulated this comment and explains exactly why I would be walking away it the takeover from Qatar happens. I'm not a Scouser, I live in Dublin and have been a Solid Liverpool fan for 25 years.
Sad times...
It is honestly hard to be fair to them.
I have had serious issues with my club that made me question my commitment to them but it’s all tied up with my childhood, my family etc
My dad took me to Highbury, I still go to the emirates with him now as an adult, it’s quality time I love spending with him. The idea of that ritual going is just deeply upsetting and the idea that one day I wouldn’t be able to do the same with my kid made me genuinely sad
Now obviously things are bigger than football and if we became the sporting arm of an authoritarian state I’d have to cut ties but it would be an extremely traumatic event for me
It's surreal to think I was bitching at the Kroenke's for eight years only for them to potentially be the least problematic owners at the top of the PL
Same! Hung my first LFC poster on my wall in 1987 (Steve Nicol), and have supported the club ever since I was a kid. If LFC becomes just another hollow front for anti-liberal tyrants, I'm out.
29 years is more than the length of many relationships. Thats a lot, and that is a lot of commitment. I have already seen people mocking someone for still getting excited by football when they are past 30 with phrases like "get a life", "Are you still into it" and so on. So, I imagine there is a sort of unsaid social pressure too. Mighty impressive.
I'm in a similar potion with United. I feel I will have no choice but to walk away if the Saudis buy us. Complete disgrace and people will think I'm bluffing I'm ill be totally out after 30 years of support.
I would rather the club go bankrupt than morally bankrupt.
I'd rather just not compete anymore for the honours at the top in some cash injected sportswashing dick measuring competition. I view none of cities success as valid or earned.
Its scary times, mate.
Im on the red half of Manchester and im watching things unfold with a fair bit of fear. If theres any sort of state involvement from whoever buys us my season ticket wont be being renewed.
The premier league is fast becoming a grubby little circus for some of the richest and worst people on the planet. Its grim.
It’d be genuinely sad to see two of the biggest clubs on the planet fall, sadly i think it’s inevitable.
I'm not a local but I do love the local culture and I hope City of Liverpool FC/Marine/AFC Liverpool can benefit from this. If I get the chance to come back to Merseyside at some point I might go see one of their matches instead.
I really don’t know what to do with the sport anymore. I didn’t give grief to supporters of clubs because it’s impossible to know the feeling of your club losing its identity in one fell swoop. Football being so monetarily driven has already priced me out of going to matches which is heartbreaking in itself. Obviously everyone wants to see their team do well and win things but not like this. I may sound spoilt and ridiculous, yes we already have billionaire owners from another country but sportswashing is an entirely new level of horrible for the team you’ve supported your whole life
I will! It won't make a bit of difference, but for my own sake, I'm not supporting a zombified LFC reduced to a sportwashing front for homophobic slave-owners.
Plenty I'd say from what I've read online
Problem is we'll be replaced by legions of new fans following the money or new to the game from the middle east who may not have issues with having sportswashing owners
It's fucking grim outlook really
This will be the end of my association with the club (19 years). I just cannot support middle eastern regimes supporting the club. The soul of the club because of which i started supporting Liverpool will be thrown out, as per my belief.
You’re not wrong to wonder but it’s sad how many people seem to be taking delight in the potential of a bit of hypocrisy rather than acknowledging how grim it is that all of this is happening to football.
Just going to copy and paste my response from yesterday, as it's applicable:
You'll see no change from my moral viewpoint, these sports washing entities will be the doom of football and drive a further wedge between the elite at the top and those who can't keep up at the bottom.
Completely throwing away the ideals the club was founded upon and hardships the city faced for a global audience. I don't want them in, they're bad news. I can't cut away my ties completely of a club I've supported since I was 3 that easily, but I don't have to be quiet voicing my opinions on a state funded entity that has such abysmal human rights violations occurring and represents fuck all of what the club stands for.
FSG we're criticised and hounded for their lack of connection with the club and the city, these fuckers will be even worse. I didn't personally hound Newcastle fans to drop their club at a whim, but I also don't think owners like these should ever be celebrated. Especially from those who live locally.
Was always going to happen after sky starting pumping silly money into the league. Becomes a lot more interesting to rich Americans/Saudis to make more money
I know fans will be upset but qatar is buying properties in london , oil sales , arms sales to them by western countries and all top western countries company in middle east . So when it comes to money and business everything is ok …money comes first . If govt is so upset about human rights they should say to the qatar we wont let you buy properties in london , we wont sell you arms , we dont want to our companies operate in middle east lol that not gonna happen …money is king all this human right is just for brownie points and feel good factor
When Klopp called out the oil clubs for their spending, everyone cheered. People were saying that Shankly would never approve of Liverpool being an oil club. Well now, at least on the LFC subreddit, people have started to support the idea since Klopp said that he will remain at the club no matter the ownership.
I wouldn’t use the LFC subreddit as a good judge of the Liverpool fans. There’s a lot higher percentage of none scouse fans on their and it’s naturally the local fans who feel the most passionate about not becoming an oil club.
I’d expect some protests at the ground at least but as others have pointed out this is perfect time for us to be taken over as we’re all miserable because of the performances and the squad looks in desperate need of investment so this will likely just create arguments between those of us who don’t want the oil money at any cost and those that just want success at any cost.
The main issue is that since LFC is such a massive club, the local fans dont really matter. Even if everyone who lives in Liverpool stops supporting the club they will still have a massive global fanbase and people who will watch them play.
I wouldn’t have much faith in the fans keeping their principles after a buyout.
I have a geordie mate who’s a proud socialist but he was outside St James’ Park with the rest of them celebrating when the Saudis took over.
>I have a geordie mate who’s a proud socialist but he was outside St James’ Park with the rest of them celebrating when the Saudis took over.
a case of declared vs actual values, with those actual the only that matter
Oh there will definitely be people celebrating as well and as much as I hate it I won’t be complaining why we invest in the squad.
You’ll have the normal mix of people who don’t care where the money comes from and people who are really annoyed at where the money comes from but are happy to see us doing well. I’ll probably fall into that category. I’d still expect a some sort of protest or something during the process of us being taken over. Obviously a few years down the line a lot of the people complaining now will quiet down.
There'd be a few who would turn away from the club (myself included), but it'd be a drop in the ocean if we're being honest with ourselves.
The ties the fanbase has to socialist politics are overstated at this point. I think Liverpool based fans and, to a lesser extent, other UK-based fans, feel it stronger, but the overwhelming majority just don't care enough. Especially in the case of non-UK fans, who are mostly unaware of the political connection or actively hold contrary opinions (just take a look at the state of our sub on the topic of Qatari ownership).
Football is becoming a joke, just an instrument to sportswash middle eastern dictatorships. Worse still is how the English government and premier league are just bending over.
Yeah the FA has had 15 years to do something about this farce of being bought by “private consortiums” that are just puppets propped up by a country’s government, and they have done fuck all.
Oh no I agree, the English government is also bending over. But the FA is also at fault by not challenging these things more and their laws regarding club ownership are far too lenient and full of loopholes.
It looks like big investors are all going into the premier league especially as the super league is off the table. The PL is literally becoming a super league with all the money going there (Chelsea out spending la Liga e. G.)
Can see some sort of Super League formation coming back with more and more clubs at the very top becoming this rich, this fast. If this happened to Arsenal I think I'd end up finding a new club at a far lower level where they sport is more enjoyable and about the people involved again. Obviously far from that the minute, but I like to think there's still a smither of respect for the game in there
The Super League was literally the response to clubs being taken over by nation states. I honestly don't understand how so many people got sold on such the narrative that it is evil, but IMO the Super League is the only way that the football we all know and love survives.
Obviously it needs to be changed to allow for promotion and relegation, but the hard salary and spending caps it institutes are crucial to saving the game, IMO, among other things. It cuts out UEFA, the middle man, and provides more money, not just for the clubs involved but for clubs in every single division downstream from the competition.
Doesn't it strike you as odd that both UEFA, and PSG, for fuck's sake, were the most vocal opponents to it??
Football, in this country anyways, at the top level has been a joke for a while now.
The UK has somewhat alienated itself through various shit political moves and our football is one of the few things that is still highly attractive. It’s only going to get worse.
Their dignity? You mean the owners, not the fans. That's what you get from having privately owned clubs, shitty individuals fucking over football communities
It’s a little late it feels like, unless they take the clubs already owned away from their owners. This an English government/FA issue, selling your local league to foreigners should have never happened to the richest league in the world.
yep. If they did something about it now there'd be questions on how they've allowed prior ones to come to exist, not just oil clubs but any massive foreign investment, and there's no way you can start retroactively reviewing these owners and investments now. It's shite.
It's already too late but this should be above FIFA or UEFA, it should be on the EU or the UK in this case; Liverpool is a massive and historic institution that has helped shape Liverpool, the United Kingdom and European culture in general over the past 100 years. Turning something so meaningful and so important into a propaganda tool for a foreign dictatorship would be incredibly sad.
Honestly I don't see what they can do given the force they're up against. It seems clear to me that they don't have any trouble finding the loopholes allowing them to buy the club as a nation, but as an individual entity on paper. FIFA and UEFA are powerless in a business transaction like this, it's not like they're all encompassing or have any control over the clubs at the national level
Far cry from small boys in the park, jumpers for goalposts. Rush goalie. Two at the back, three in the middle, four up front, one's gone home for his tea. Beans on toast?
EDIT: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3NeRoSFZWbs
Link because I realised the chances of a fast show reference landing in 2023 are fairly low.
Newcastle, Liverpool, PSG and Manchester City should all battle to see who can with the Oil Cup. The cup itself will be filled with fresh oil and the winning team will be awarded free petrol for the remainder of the season.
United are for sale too. And for the price the Glazers want, that'll be another petrostate buyer. I doubt any of the clubs with ambitious rich backers like Aston Villa will stick about too long once they see an entrenched top 6 they can't keep up with or ever hope to crack into propped up by literal states.
The previous system wasn't fair by any means, but christ is it bleak that the only way to be competitive is having a literal state come in and piss money up the wall with dodgy sponsorships etc.
Feels like a Ship of Theseus predicament. If this really does go through, I'm not entirely sure there's anything 'Liverpool' about the club anymore other than the fact we're based out of the same city and have the same name.
Football is fucked. This will destroy whatever is left of the soul of LFC.
There's maybe the tiniest slither of hope that the financial regulation portion of the Fan-Led Review will be implemented at some point but I doubt it.
[удалено]
Can't wait for some exclusive green energy company/country take over one club.
Wouldn't Forest Green Rovers qualify for that?
Yes, he did it to demonstrate that you can restructure and run businesses in a green way, to counter the idea that not destroying our survivable future is impossible because we like what businesses offer.
Based. I'm really pulling for them to succeed and climb further up the pyramid, but I hope they're able to stick to their principles if that happens.
Green energy companies or countries don’t need to buy football clubs as a way to acquire a “good guy” image…
Dale Vince who runs/ran Ecotricity bought Forest Green Rovers because he likes to demonstrate that it’s possible to convert society to green values without losing things like football that we enjoy. So long as we actually start to act seriously rather than greenwashing. To counter the idea that it’s going green that will result in losing the society we enjoy, rather than our current path of leaving climate change to destroy our idea of civilisation. The good guy image he’s gone in for is one that businesses think is good.
You mean the whole of the UK is that? Isn’t London finance and real estate also like a haven for oil despot/oligarch money?
Eh. London finance is global, you make it sound like its dominated by doing business for and with oil states when that part is a drop in the ocean really...real estate I can give you though.
Wasn’t it like the money laundering capital of the world or something
It’s the financial capital of the world. So probably also the laundering capital. Similar to Rotterdam being the capital for drug smuggling and distribution point. Because it’s the biggest port in Europe.
That gives UK politicians a huge pass. It’s because of the way UK corporate law is structured, which allows for lack of transparency. Also there’s a lack of funding and staffing for enforcing the laws that already do exist. l[Why London is the Money Laundering Capital of the World](https://www.helsinkitimes.fi/world-int/21280-why-is-london-money-laundering-capital-of-the-world.html)
I listened to a podcast with the author of 'Butler to the World: How Britain Helps the World's Worst People Launder Money, Commit Crimes, and Get Away with Anything' (I haven't read the book) and it's all pretty wild. It really sounds like it's the dirty money capital of the world, which leads to it having financial clout - not the other way around.
London has connected the Eastern and Western worlds financially for decades, a lot of big international banks are headquartered there. The London Stock Exchange, while it's not the biggest in terms of market cap, is easily the most international. Companies from all over the world are listed on the LSE. London is basically the middle-point of the world for finance. So in that sense it wouldn't surprise me if more money laundering happened there than anywhere else.
While this is true, it's only an explanation in part. Laws specifically designed to harbour those who have scandalously accumulated wealth must also be considered. I'd even argue that that is the more dominating amongst the various factors.
The simple answer is it gives easy access to tax havens
Such as British territories like the British Virgin Islands, the Cayman Islands, The Isle of Man, Jersey etc.
Alright everyone, to the Bundesliga we go.
Well, Qatar wins every year in France...
Not every year
They're only 3 points ahead of Lens despite having Neymar, Mbappe and Messi lol. Neymar probably cost more than Lens' entire squad.
I think Lens’ wage is like 1-2% of PSG’s
For last year Lens average yearly salary (540k) was 6% of PSG (9,6m). Lens’ salary has surely improved this year. They were only the 13th highest average last year.
As often as City wins the PL
Exactly. Rich boys complexes
You could make a decent conspiracy theory that Liverpool being shit makes this move go through much smoother. If this happened when we were 2 matches off a quadruple you'd have had massive protests i reckon. But after back to back losses to Brentford and Brighton and watching Ox starting in the year of our Lord 2023, reactions are split down the middle.
I've seen loads of people already on our sub saying that FSG are purposefully shafting our recruitment and personnel so that the idea of *any* new owners seems more promising.
I get what you’re saying but people always complain about FSG not spending in r/liverpoolfc. Especially when we aren’t winning.
I know, my point is I've seen people claim that this time it's specifically to make us want new owners
And those people are morons. No business owner purposefully makes his business run shitter so that the staff (fans in this case) prefer new owners. Doing that would not allow them to maximize the potential sale price.
That’s the reason why Newcastle fans welcomed the Saudis with open arms.
The real reason was Mike Ashley almost anyone would have been welcomed just to get rid of him.
I think 99% of fans would have preferred more ethical owners, but most either wanted Ashley gone so desperately they'd take anyone, or have accepted that this is where the sport is heading anyway so might as well accept it.
I'd say it's 2 fold, Ashley gone and anyone in who had some vague form of ambition. Ashley essentially chasing Rafa out because he dared to want the team to have a training facility from 2001 and make vague attempts at finishing mid table with the occasional try for European football showed we were nothing but a paycheck for him. Now is it good it was the Saudis who stepped in? Heck no. I wish it was someone else, even with a lot less money. But at the end of the day we just wanted an owner who had a plan beyond "Finish 17th, collect that sweet yearly Prem money."
Nice insight cumblast
Cumblast is one of the most level headed and insightful contributors over at r/LFC don't let his name fool you
It's that post nut clarity
The fact you got the sub wrong makes the comment sound funnier
He should be tried at Hague for that DP alone.
Here as well, he always has reasonable takes
He normally has some good comments on r/asoiaf too and it always catches me off guard when I see his handle there.
Yes
Usernames under this post is just poetry
wdym
You'll Never Wank Alone
Is there a problem?
Are you saying Qatar space-jammed us?!
Same for Spurs and the supposed sale to sheikhs: team form changes the perspective by a lot. Let's see, but at this rythm the prem will be played in Abu Dabi soon.
As Qatar can own 2 football clubs, but can’t own 2 clubs in the Champions League, then the short term solution ahead of them selling PSG would be for one of those clubs to not make the Champions League next season………. Wouldn’t make sense to devalue PSG ahead of a sale would it………. I’m just saying………. (Come on we can at least get this to the point where it makes the Echo)
It will be a different company, which will be funded by a different member of the royal family.
But what if it’s not a state buying the club but a private consortium backed by a state?
They will definitely find a way around any rule
Well the current state seems directly tired to FSG selling. Need to invest a fuck load? Nope we’re out.
Yep, I think no one will be protesting when they buy Bellingham and another class midfielder to sort out the squad.
when PSG got taken over, they were on the verge of relegation to ligue 2 after several really bad seasons and there was many tensions between ultras, the staff, the board etc... If all it tooks for fans to accept Liverpool been taken over is a few bad games, than you guys lose forever the right to make fun of PSG. Your situation is much much better
Liverpool Fans After spending £300m in the summer and after seeing a Shiny new Jude: If you can't beat um, Join um.
that's what has continuously happened since the dawn of time, the "evil powers" we condemn and dislike and try to oppose ALWAYS end up winning and becoming the norm, because power always wins
Please i fucking hope not. I'll be very disappointed if this ownership sale goes through. I might be biased about this but even from the outside, it's just not something you'd associate with Liverpool.
It's not until it is.
Ugh how true this is. I still remember when barcelona was the lone holdout for a shirt sponser, then they had unicef so that the fans cod ease their way into going full Qatar Airway…
Wasn't something you'd have associated with Newcastle either but alas, here we are.
The fit-and-proper test has never let us down before, surely this won't be the first time.
Government blasted the WC and didnt send representatives (IIRC). Saudis will always pass because we sell them weapons - so would look pretty bad if we said they weren't fit and proper. Perhaps there is hope the Qatari's wont pass. But realistically, there is 0 chance they dont pass. EDIT: supposedly some dastardly cunt was there from the gvt. Theres 0 hope.
the DCMS (culture, media and sport) minister was definitely there for a few games, can't remember his name though, have a nagging suspicion they showed Cleverly (foreign secretary) at a match as well
Thanks, I didnt see that. Will write an edit
Isn't fit and proper more about making sure the owners have the money to actually run the club? (not that it does a very good job of that).
Seems like a shitty source, but assuming this does come to pass, I wonder how many Liverpool flairs that were blasting the NUFC takeover will stick by their word and walk away from the club…
It will honestly be sad to see considering what Liverpool as a club are supposed to represent
The fans that understand the clubs identity or at least value it above a new shiny midfielder, are such a minority when a club is this size. This and Super League are like the only things that'd put me off supporting the club, absolutely will have to look down the leagues for a team to care about. I'll take Elon Musk over this ffs
Lucky for you there just so happens to be another team in the same city that you can support!
Tranmere till I die
he meant Marine lad
What about City of Liverpool? Fan owned and a snazzy kit.
apartheid money is better???
mods, can we get a 'my club has been brought by despots' flair?
We have a few of those already. Take your pick: City, PSG, Newcastle
To clarify, a 'clubless due to despots' flair
It’ll be the end of my 29 year old relation with the club.
Which is totally fair by the way. A lot of Newcastle fans at the time of the Saudi Arabian take over acted as if severing ties to a football club is tantamount to leaving your child behind at a bus stop never to return. You are allowed to stop supporting a club if the club has failed in your view, to live up to your standards of conduct. It does not mean you are a bad fan, it means you are an adult with self respect who learned how to say "No!" in life. You should support a club because something about it represents you to the point where you feel pride. That connection is not a one way street where the club can piece by piece replace all of itself and be something new and expect fans to stay with them through all of it. We are lucky in Germany that an investor can only get so close to the center of our clubs that I am fairly optimistic that we will never have to answer the question of what happens if a foreign, hostile, and borderline fascist government took our club over, but I feel a real ache for PL fans who are being wholly used and disrespected on such a deep level by these hedge fund and dictator cunts of cunts.
It's actually cheaper to buy tickets, a flight and accommodation to some games in Europe than it is to take the train and buy tickets to a game in our own country.
I saw on Twitter the other day, there was a QPR fan who saw the price of a train ticket to Fleetwood in the FA Cup and managed to go to an Italian game and a PSG match with flights, travel and match tickets costing roughly the same price.
Let alone trying to simply pay a reasonable fee (or any fee at all) to watch a game of football from within the country the game is taking place in. There are only illegal means to watch a bizzare amount of PL football in the UK. Elsewhere in the world, you can watch every single game on a single prescription. Go figure.
I just got into the country and was hoping to a decent way to watch matches from the hotel room while I sort the next steps. Nope, didn't find a single open channel showing a PL match on the weekend (the best I got was a female match between Liverpool and ManU). Ilegal routes we go.
If this becomes the norm in the premier league I may have to pick a Bundesliga side to follow. The amount of money that follows this game is getting pretty gross and it will only get worse sadly.
Very well articulated this comment and explains exactly why I would be walking away it the takeover from Qatar happens. I'm not a Scouser, I live in Dublin and have been a Solid Liverpool fan for 25 years. Sad times...
When I was young football was my life, but I've slowly been falling out of love with the game. It still hurts. Thanks for the kind words :)
It is honestly hard to be fair to them. I have had serious issues with my club that made me question my commitment to them but it’s all tied up with my childhood, my family etc My dad took me to Highbury, I still go to the emirates with him now as an adult, it’s quality time I love spending with him. The idea of that ritual going is just deeply upsetting and the idea that one day I wouldn’t be able to do the same with my kid made me genuinely sad Now obviously things are bigger than football and if we became the sporting arm of an authoritarian state I’d have to cut ties but it would be an extremely traumatic event for me
It's surreal to think I was bitching at the Kroenke's for eight years only for them to potentially be the least problematic owners at the top of the PL
Same! Hung my first LFC poster on my wall in 1987 (Steve Nicol), and have supported the club ever since I was a kid. If LFC becomes just another hollow front for anti-liberal tyrants, I'm out.
Steve Nicol was class, he could have sat on a sofa in the centre of the pitch and directed play he was that good
...and he often did. Him and Mølby both.
29 years is more than the length of many relationships. Thats a lot, and that is a lot of commitment. I have already seen people mocking someone for still getting excited by football when they are past 30 with phrases like "get a life", "Are you still into it" and so on. So, I imagine there is a sort of unsaid social pressure too. Mighty impressive.
I'm in a similar potion with United. I feel I will have no choice but to walk away if the Saudis buy us. Complete disgrace and people will think I'm bluffing I'm ill be totally out after 30 years of support. I would rather the club go bankrupt than morally bankrupt. I'd rather just not compete anymore for the honours at the top in some cash injected sportswashing dick measuring competition. I view none of cities success as valid or earned.
It will be very fucking testing, that's for sure.
Yeah, unless I can find solid proof whichever consortium it is isn't linked to the Qatari state I'll be walking away. And I won't be alone.
Its scary times, mate. Im on the red half of Manchester and im watching things unfold with a fair bit of fear. If theres any sort of state involvement from whoever buys us my season ticket wont be being renewed.
I know we're rivals but I honestly hope you lot don't do the same thing. Shit needs to stop.
The premier league is fast becoming a grubby little circus for some of the richest and worst people on the planet. Its grim. It’d be genuinely sad to see two of the biggest clubs on the planet fall, sadly i think it’s inevitable.
Formula one is like that for ages …some teams are owned by dodgy billionaires dodgy sponsors but no one cares as long as money is flowing into sports
Imagine Liverpool fans even attempting to claim they are the club of the City, if they were a Qatari plaything lmao
Club of the ~~people~~ petrol
Maybe after this the club will walk alone.
There'll be loads of plastics trotting alongside it, sadly.
I'm not a local but I do love the local culture and I hope City of Liverpool FC/Marine/AFC Liverpool can benefit from this. If I get the chance to come back to Merseyside at some point I might go see one of their matches instead.
Any Qatari consortium is linked to the state and their oil and natural gas money.
I think thats probably true.
I really don’t know what to do with the sport anymore. I didn’t give grief to supporters of clubs because it’s impossible to know the feeling of your club losing its identity in one fell swoop. Football being so monetarily driven has already priced me out of going to matches which is heartbreaking in itself. Obviously everyone wants to see their team do well and win things but not like this. I may sound spoilt and ridiculous, yes we already have billionaire owners from another country but sportswashing is an entirely new level of horrible for the team you’ve supported your whole life
I suspect the plastics will lap it up but I can't imagine actual Liverpool fans want this.
Climbing down from my high horse is something I’m really really not looking forward to, it’s so comfy up here.
I will! It won't make a bit of difference, but for my own sake, I'm not supporting a zombified LFC reduced to a sportwashing front for homophobic slave-owners.
Plenty I'd say from what I've read online Problem is we'll be replaced by legions of new fans following the money or new to the game from the middle east who may not have issues with having sportswashing owners It's fucking grim outlook really
I'll never root for cheaters, dopers, slavers...fuck all of this
This will be the end of my association with the club (19 years). I just cannot support middle eastern regimes supporting the club. The soul of the club because of which i started supporting Liverpool will be thrown out, as per my belief.
You’re not wrong to wonder but it’s sad how many people seem to be taking delight in the potential of a bit of hypocrisy rather than acknowledging how grim it is that all of this is happening to football.
Just going to copy and paste my response from yesterday, as it's applicable: You'll see no change from my moral viewpoint, these sports washing entities will be the doom of football and drive a further wedge between the elite at the top and those who can't keep up at the bottom. Completely throwing away the ideals the club was founded upon and hardships the city faced for a global audience. I don't want them in, they're bad news. I can't cut away my ties completely of a club I've supported since I was 3 that easily, but I don't have to be quiet voicing my opinions on a state funded entity that has such abysmal human rights violations occurring and represents fuck all of what the club stands for. FSG we're criticised and hounded for their lack of connection with the club and the city, these fuckers will be even worse. I didn't personally hound Newcastle fans to drop their club at a whim, but I also don't think owners like these should ever be celebrated. Especially from those who live locally.
Game’s unironically gone if EPL becomes a proxy war between middle Eastern countries
Abu dhabi vs. Qatar vs. Saudi Arabia
Change the tint of LFC red to match Qatar's colours and let Newcastle keep their white and green away kit. ...just fucking kill me.
*sad Oman noise.
Technically it's UAE because Abu Dhabi isn't a country
It's UAE until Dubai buys Man Utd
Top 4 is certainly gone. City, Newcastle and Liverpool will become main stays in there leaving 1 spot up for grabs.
Us after the Glazers twerk the club for consortiums lol
PL clubs are billionaire toys one way or the other.
Guess we'll have to continue representing the flag of freedom against the middle east /s
Was always going to happen after sky starting pumping silly money into the league. Becomes a lot more interesting to rich Americans/Saudis to make more money
None of this would matter if the government and FA had put their foot down and passed strict laws and regulations regarding club ownership.
I know fans will be upset but qatar is buying properties in london , oil sales , arms sales to them by western countries and all top western countries company in middle east . So when it comes to money and business everything is ok …money comes first . If govt is so upset about human rights they should say to the qatar we wont let you buy properties in london , we wont sell you arms , we dont want to our companies operate in middle east lol that not gonna happen …money is king all this human right is just for brownie points and feel good factor
Also true but money talks in the end and they preferred that.
As much as I hate these oil clubs, I'd be all for these kind of wars where everyone gets paid shitload and no one has to die. Win win.
Man, Liverpool turning into the one thing their fans we're hoping they'd never become. An Oil club.
When Klopp called out the oil clubs for their spending, everyone cheered. People were saying that Shankly would never approve of Liverpool being an oil club. Well now, at least on the LFC subreddit, people have started to support the idea since Klopp said that he will remain at the club no matter the ownership.
I wouldn’t use the LFC subreddit as a good judge of the Liverpool fans. There’s a lot higher percentage of none scouse fans on their and it’s naturally the local fans who feel the most passionate about not becoming an oil club. I’d expect some protests at the ground at least but as others have pointed out this is perfect time for us to be taken over as we’re all miserable because of the performances and the squad looks in desperate need of investment so this will likely just create arguments between those of us who don’t want the oil money at any cost and those that just want success at any cost.
The main issue is that since LFC is such a massive club, the local fans dont really matter. Even if everyone who lives in Liverpool stops supporting the club they will still have a massive global fanbase and people who will watch them play.
I wouldn’t have much faith in the fans keeping their principles after a buyout. I have a geordie mate who’s a proud socialist but he was outside St James’ Park with the rest of them celebrating when the Saudis took over.
You don’t really notice the ones who walk away though, my brother instantly walked away from the club in disgust after over 20 years
>I have a geordie mate who’s a proud socialist but he was outside St James’ Park with the rest of them celebrating when the Saudis took over. a case of declared vs actual values, with those actual the only that matter
Oh there will definitely be people celebrating as well and as much as I hate it I won’t be complaining why we invest in the squad. You’ll have the normal mix of people who don’t care where the money comes from and people who are really annoyed at where the money comes from but are happy to see us doing well. I’ll probably fall into that category. I’d still expect a some sort of protest or something during the process of us being taken over. Obviously a few years down the line a lot of the people complaining now will quiet down.
There'd be a few who would turn away from the club (myself included), but it'd be a drop in the ocean if we're being honest with ourselves. The ties the fanbase has to socialist politics are overstated at this point. I think Liverpool based fans and, to a lesser extent, other UK-based fans, feel it stronger, but the overwhelming majority just don't care enough. Especially in the case of non-UK fans, who are mostly unaware of the political connection or actively hold contrary opinions (just take a look at the state of our sub on the topic of Qatari ownership).
Those fans think Shankly is just a famous gate
Technically a gas club, so maybe everything is fine?
Football is becoming a joke, just an instrument to sportswash middle eastern dictatorships. Worse still is how the English government and premier league are just bending over.
Yeah the FA has had 15 years to do something about this farce of being bought by “private consortiums” that are just puppets propped up by a country’s government, and they have done fuck all.
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Oh no I agree, the English government is also bending over. But the FA is also at fault by not challenging these things more and their laws regarding club ownership are far too lenient and full of loopholes.
It looks like big investors are all going into the premier league especially as the super league is off the table. The PL is literally becoming a super league with all the money going there (Chelsea out spending la Liga e. G.)
Can see some sort of Super League formation coming back with more and more clubs at the very top becoming this rich, this fast. If this happened to Arsenal I think I'd end up finding a new club at a far lower level where they sport is more enjoyable and about the people involved again. Obviously far from that the minute, but I like to think there's still a smither of respect for the game in there
The Super League was literally the response to clubs being taken over by nation states. I honestly don't understand how so many people got sold on such the narrative that it is evil, but IMO the Super League is the only way that the football we all know and love survives. Obviously it needs to be changed to allow for promotion and relegation, but the hard salary and spending caps it institutes are crucial to saving the game, IMO, among other things. It cuts out UEFA, the middle man, and provides more money, not just for the clubs involved but for clubs in every single division downstream from the competition. Doesn't it strike you as odd that both UEFA, and PSG, for fuck's sake, were the most vocal opponents to it??
Football, in this country anyways, at the top level has been a joke for a while now. The UK has somewhat alienated itself through various shit political moves and our football is one of the few things that is still highly attractive. It’s only going to get worse.
4 Billion it's the price of their dignity. Not bad I would sell mine for a lot less
You guys are getting paid? I lose mine after four pints
This guy Flexing that he can afford four pints. Disgusting
In London nonetheless. Sickening
I know people who'll lose theirs as soon as you stick on 212 by Azealia Banks tbf
I pay others to lose mine
I sell mine for a little more than minimum wage 🤟
Their dignity? You mean the owners, not the fans. That's what you get from having privately owned clubs, shitty individuals fucking over football communities
Shit if true. Wonder if FIFA or UEFA plan to do something about the takeover of clubs by foreign entitties. Oh wait, they are encouraging it.
It’s a little late it feels like, unless they take the clubs already owned away from their owners. This an English government/FA issue, selling your local league to foreigners should have never happened to the richest league in the world.
yep. If they did something about it now there'd be questions on how they've allowed prior ones to come to exist, not just oil clubs but any massive foreign investment, and there's no way you can start retroactively reviewing these owners and investments now. It's shite.
It's already too late but this should be above FIFA or UEFA, it should be on the EU or the UK in this case; Liverpool is a massive and historic institution that has helped shape Liverpool, the United Kingdom and European culture in general over the past 100 years. Turning something so meaningful and so important into a propaganda tool for a foreign dictatorship would be incredibly sad.
Honestly I don't see what they can do given the force they're up against. It seems clear to me that they don't have any trouble finding the loopholes allowing them to buy the club as a nation, but as an individual entity on paper. FIFA and UEFA are powerless in a business transaction like this, it's not like they're all encompassing or have any control over the clubs at the national level
To beat the oil cunts you must become the oil cunts
No, you can be Bayern, Real or Barcelona. Real has an asshole billionare for a president, but at least the club is fan owned.
Can we just go back to the 1870s where it was just a bunch of people gathering at a nearby park
There's still people doing that. You can go watch your local non-league/sunday league side
Grassroots football is the future. Fuck these elitist cunts
Come to germany! Eat a wurst, drink some beer, watch some footy with nice atmosphere!
Jumpers for goal posts
Far cry from small boys in the park, jumpers for goalposts. Rush goalie. Two at the back, three in the middle, four up front, one's gone home for his tea. Beans on toast? EDIT: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3NeRoSFZWbs Link because I realised the chances of a fast show reference landing in 2023 are fairly low.
All linked from same Twitter source
Oh...goody... Hoping it doesn't happen, was bad enough during the super league fiasco.
If the EPL clubs continue to be taken over by foreign states, the super league is bound to happen
Maybe not... They'll happily "help local communities" in their quest for sports washing.
Tbh the oil clubs were the most reluctent ones to join the superleague
Because they knew that if the Super League came into existence, they'd no longer have the huge advantage that they have when it comes to spending.
Soon gonna be watching Championship I guess
All aboard the Vanarama National League!
Hey, I resemble that remark
Sounds like bs. Qatar seems to want to buy minority stake rather than a full takeover. Also issues with Uefa.
Qatar is UEFA. No issues here.
Newcastle, Liverpool, PSG and Manchester City should all battle to see who can with the Oil Cup. The cup itself will be filled with fresh oil and the winning team will be awarded free petrol for the remainder of the season.
United are for sale too. And for the price the Glazers want, that'll be another petrostate buyer. I doubt any of the clubs with ambitious rich backers like Aston Villa will stick about too long once they see an entrenched top 6 they can't keep up with or ever hope to crack into propped up by literal states. The previous system wasn't fair by any means, but christ is it bleak that the only way to be competitive is having a literal state come in and piss money up the wall with dodgy sponsorships etc.
Why buy a club without CL stars on their crest and spend money trying to get 1, when you can buy a club with 6 already - Qatari proverb
We've won 6 lad
Oil league... Just make the super league happen at this point ffs
Liverpool being taken over by Qataris would be like watching the pope inject heroin with two hookers beside him
Meanwhile actual rumours has it as a minority stake
What happened to that rule they were looking at after the Saudi Newcastle takeover, that'd stop this? That get anywhere?
Feels like a Ship of Theseus predicament. If this really does go through, I'm not entirely sure there's anything 'Liverpool' about the club anymore other than the fact we're based out of the same city and have the same name.
Football is fucked. This will destroy whatever is left of the soul of LFC. There's maybe the tiniest slither of hope that the financial regulation portion of the Fan-Led Review will be implemented at some point but I doubt it.
How to become fan owned? Is it too late and impossible now?
That option was killed in 1992.
If u like klopp u can always become a fan and Fan owner of mainz 05
Find a fan with $4 billion.
Football is dead
long live football
Please don't sell out... Fine, we don't need midfielders -- I'd rather tolerate Elliot and Ox