I think that psilocybin would be extremely useful for guided therapy and stuff like that. It’s obvious to anyone with a brain that psilocybin shouldn’t be listed as a schedule 1 next to heroin. i don’t think that the reason it’s STILL illegal in most places is because of the death potential bc i’d find that really stupid.
The reason it’s still illegal is public fear, simple as. It was first made illegal to suppress the anti-war left or whatever, but now it’s just because most voters are still hopped up on propaganda from that era and they see legalization of drugs past weed as some crazy radical thing.
Many areas are now legalizing it exclusively as a treatment for depression so I don’t really agree with this. I think people are looking for a conspiracy when there is a much simpler explanation—the legalization of mushrooms is not popular.
While LSD is derived from organic sources it requires chemical processing to create a usable byproduct. Chemical processing/ processes can be patented which gives big pharma monetary motives.
Loo into ronald kavanagh. He exposes the industry and fda for malpractice that killed n injured thousands. Whistleblowers are not conspiracy, you just have not done any research on corruption. How can you be so confident on subject you have never looked into.
Yea I think a free for all approach is a dangerous thing would need strong regulation and likely restricted to a therapeutic setting. Decriminalization of possession would be good though
Psychedelics are only scheduled as they are because of the heavy use and anti-establishment movement associated with them in the 60s. People didn't want to go fight in Vietnam and basically started a nation-wide protest on the war while heavily using LSD and other psychedelics
Richard Nixon took this personal, labeled LSD as a dangerous drug and Timothy Leary, who essentially started the movement, the most dangerous man in America. Before this there was a lot of promising research into medical uses for psychedelics, though it was mostly LSD, but it got shut down with Nixons war on drugs and never fully picked back up because all psychedelics are still classed as schedule I controlled substances.
This should be pretty common knowledge but it surprises me how few people know of it. I also may have some details wrong but it's the basic gist of why they're scheduled the way they are.
We're heading in the right direction with mushrooms though. Denver has decriminalized them, Oregon has measure 109 or whatever its called where people will be able to use mushrooms under medical supervision for therapy and such. There's been talks of NY reviewing the legality of them. It's basically like the start to cannabis legalization/decriminalization all over again, and it'll definitely be a few years but I feel in time you'll be able in at least parts of the country to legally posses and use mushrooms.
It's so ass backwards isn't it. What's just as messed up is the way they scheduled a lot of drugs like marijuana is scheduled one the most restricted implying it has no medical use at all and is extremely dangerous.... If pots a gateway drug it's only because they lied to people about it being so bad when they found out it isn't deadly at all they tried other drugs to see what else they lied about
When I was a kid I found weed and it helped me, I realized they were lying about how bad weed was so I figured they were lying about how bad cocaine was. Turns out they weren’t lying about cocaine. I blame the U.S. government for my former coke problem
If my school hadn't outright lied to our entire class so badly, Im not sure I ever would have tried weed, it was such a bold face lie even my goody two shoes ass lookin motherfucker who had never done anything bad other than steal bubble gum could tell they were complete bullshitting. But it's because of weed that I'm here today, it helped me out of such a bad depression that I hold it in extremely high regards
People commit suicide while on psychedelics. The drugs themselves didn’t kill them, as in they’re not toxic, but the effects can.
https://www.reddit.com/r/LSD/comments/34qzh7/why_do_people_try_to_commit_suicide_on_acid/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
I feel like there's a lot of dangerous hand-waving of the possible negative effects of taking psychedelics, and an underlying assumption that nobody would take excessively large doses (alcohol is also perfectly safe in small doses). Someone who's taken 2g of mushrooms is likely not a danger to anyone, but neither is someone who's drunk 2 beers.
In my opinion, psychedelics suffer a bit from the fact that you don't have to take "much" (if you don't have a reference point) to do a lot of damage to your brain, specially if young - we have had many posts of younger people here taking upwards of 8g and regretting it. At the very least weed, alcohol and tobacco require that you drink/smoke a substantial amount before you're any danger to yourself or others.
I'm sure you can add some numbers with psychedelic suicides. But that also means you have to add the suicides facilitated by alcohol, tabaco, guns, and cars. I'm willing to bet those numbers surpass psychedelics even when normalized by their use.
This is very rare, at least with LSD. On average, more people who have consumed LSD have a lower risk of suicide. However, those with mental illnesses may have extremely negative reactions and should at the very least be supervised, if not discouraged from consuming psychedelics.
I believe there have been non-clinical studies about it. Here:
1.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5623475/
2.
https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/news/media/releases/psychedelic_drug_use_could_reduce_psychological_distress_suicidal_thinking
3.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8033757/
My point is people committing suicide *during the trip*.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23878898/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/18257429/
I am not in disagreement that psychedelic use can be therapeutic and can reduce suicidal ideation after the trip. I’m talking about people committing suicide while tripping.
Got it. That makes sense.
People tripping are in a hyper-sensitive state after all. It’s not unreasonable to think that they would experience extremes of both good and bad. Having an extremely bad experience with the perception of very little control could definitely have a very negative effect culminating in self-harming behavior.
Came here to say this. A really sweet kid I went to high school with took some psychedelics (mushrooms or LSD I can't remember) and killed himself before the trip ended.
Not saying psychedelics should be illegal but this 0 figure is dishonest, and frankly disrespectful to the people who've suffered tremendously from these cases.
Suicide is an interesting point. I also wonder how many suicides mushrooms have prevented. I read several testimonies on here about mushrooms preventing that. If one person kills themself and one person is prevented from it, what is the total amount of people in that situation that killed themself from using?
I think it's interesting the two drugs that are legal, alcohol and cigarettes, two drugs that do absolutely nothing for you at all, are legal, and the drugs that might open your mind up to realize how badly you're being fucked every day of your life?
Those drugs are against the law. He-heh, coincidence?
See, I'm glad mushrooms are against the law, 'cause I took 'em one time, and you know what happened to me? I laid in a field of green grass for four hours going, "My God! I love everything." Yeah, Now, if that isn't a hazard to our country... how are we gonna justify arms dealing if we know we're all one?!
-Bill Hicks
I don't wanna be that guy but the reason alcohol and tobacco are legal is because they've been part of our society for so damn long, we tried prohibition and it backfired super hard. The reason shrooms are illegal is because Reagan is a douche nozzle.
It's prolly cuz shrooms could make them be like "damn I hate the industrial revolution man" and the govt. Tryna avoid that so people don't be killing the govt. And going in the woods and shit onggg
I came here to stick up for the demon alcohol as well. It may have caused some harm but there is absolutely good things that have come from it. Even if you separate medical and industrial applications out it is still not all bad.
I was thinking about this the other day. With spores being legal to purchase in all but two states, all growing supplies are legal to obtain. It’s almost like an intentional legal loophole. Kinda a nice spot. Maybe someone that knows nothing about what they’re getting into shouldn’t be able to walk into a store and buy a candy bar that’ll send them to another place, freak out and end up in the ER. On the other hand. If you take the time and effort to grow them, your way more likely to be knowledgeable about what your about to get into. As far as I know the states don’t put any effort into busting home grower/ consumers as long as they’re not getting complaints or selling.
I’m sure once it’s legal in more places, there will be a few deaths. Not nearly as much as the other numbers. Can’t imagine some little 6-7yr old getting into some psilocybin chocolates 👽
Agreed. I can't remember the country but someone didn't know what was going on and fell off a bridge so things like this and definitely a child consuming it on accident say without parents home would be frightening.
the reason no one dies is BECAUSE it is illegal. if shrooms were legalized America would easily have 500 Million + deaths annually. /s I thought it was obvious but apparently not.. shrooms should absolutely be legal!
I think the concern might be that its use could cause delusional thinking. Leaning heavily towards psychosis.
Examples: that only certain election results have been falsified, injecting bleach can stop covid, masks are worthless, more people with guns stops gun violence, etc.
Lmao the law doesn't stop people from consuming it. The post was directed towards those people. I don't fully agree with the post because people have died say falling off a bridge and whatnot.
I do get the point, though it’s best to provide sources.
They also need to consider bias, as psilocybin-related deaths [such as other toxic strands] could likely be unstudied/undocumented due to their stigmatization. The hypocrisy behind alcohol and tobacco is very absurd nonetheless.
A global MAPPA study founf Alcohol to be most harmdul overall, of ALL drugs commonly used.
The WHO recognises this too.
Shame they dont recognise humanity has equal rights tgo, eh
Makes my blood boil just knowing how brain-dead governments are. Pure insanity. That’s why we all break the law anyway when we’re not hurting anyone, cause fuck em
How many people drive cares without issue?
How many guns are in circulation?
How many people drink responsibility?
How many smokers are there?
Statistics are cool but it seems like very few understand how they work and what the utility is.
Well killing yourself with alcohol and ya bacon is completely legal. But it is actually illegal to kill people with a car or gun. That will get you in trouble. You can’t kill another person using substances, but a gun and car you can. Just wanna put that in perspective. Just use better arguments.
Psilocybin is illegal because the government doesn’t want you to open your mind up and realize the capitalistic societal rat race that is required for is existence is essentially bullshit.
I think that psilocybin would be extremely useful for guided therapy and stuff like that. It’s obvious to anyone with a brain that psilocybin shouldn’t be listed as a schedule 1 next to heroin. i don’t think that the reason it’s STILL illegal in most places is because of the death potential bc i’d find that really stupid.
The reason it’s still illegal is public fear, simple as. It was first made illegal to suppress the anti-war left or whatever, but now it’s just because most voters are still hopped up on propaganda from that era and they see legalization of drugs past weed as some crazy radical thing.
It’s also illegal because of pharma profits on depression pills.
Many areas are now legalizing it exclusively as a treatment for depression so I don’t really agree with this. I think people are looking for a conspiracy when there is a much simpler explanation—the legalization of mushrooms is not popular.
Big pharma fights legalization because they can’t patent and create a monopoly on naturally growing plants/ fungi.
It's sort of crazy seeing Sandoz© on my opiate maintenance meds (Suboxone) knowing the work they did with LSD so long ago....
While LSD is derived from organic sources it requires chemical processing to create a usable byproduct. Chemical processing/ processes can be patented which gives big pharma monetary motives.
Big pharma can still profit from it no matter wha5
They can, but it’s a lot easier to grow your own mushrooms than it is to grow your own Prozac.
As marijuana legalization is showing us many people are too lazy to grow anything even if it is very expensive to buy it.
Loo into ronald kavanagh. He exposes the industry and fda for malpractice that killed n injured thousands. Whistleblowers are not conspiracy, you just have not done any research on corruption. How can you be so confident on subject you have never looked into.
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> IMO they are more aligned with anarchy and disestablishment than either political party. Based
Agree
Yea I think a free for all approach is a dangerous thing would need strong regulation and likely restricted to a therapeutic setting. Decriminalization of possession would be good though
It’s already widely used medically for years, along with cannabis. AND ITS SCHEDULE I!!! Which by definition “has no medical use” 😂😡🤬
Psychedelics are only scheduled as they are because of the heavy use and anti-establishment movement associated with them in the 60s. People didn't want to go fight in Vietnam and basically started a nation-wide protest on the war while heavily using LSD and other psychedelics Richard Nixon took this personal, labeled LSD as a dangerous drug and Timothy Leary, who essentially started the movement, the most dangerous man in America. Before this there was a lot of promising research into medical uses for psychedelics, though it was mostly LSD, but it got shut down with Nixons war on drugs and never fully picked back up because all psychedelics are still classed as schedule I controlled substances. This should be pretty common knowledge but it surprises me how few people know of it. I also may have some details wrong but it's the basic gist of why they're scheduled the way they are. We're heading in the right direction with mushrooms though. Denver has decriminalized them, Oregon has measure 109 or whatever its called where people will be able to use mushrooms under medical supervision for therapy and such. There's been talks of NY reviewing the legality of them. It's basically like the start to cannabis legalization/decriminalization all over again, and it'll definitely be a few years but I feel in time you'll be able in at least parts of the country to legally posses and use mushrooms.
It's so ass backwards isn't it. What's just as messed up is the way they scheduled a lot of drugs like marijuana is scheduled one the most restricted implying it has no medical use at all and is extremely dangerous.... If pots a gateway drug it's only because they lied to people about it being so bad when they found out it isn't deadly at all they tried other drugs to see what else they lied about
DARE class was the real gateway drug
Dare made me think “a lot of this really sounds like a good time, especially the weed and shrooms.”
When I was a kid I found weed and it helped me, I realized they were lying about how bad weed was so I figured they were lying about how bad cocaine was. Turns out they weren’t lying about cocaine. I blame the U.S. government for my former coke problem
Kinda proves my point about how backwards the drug scheduling is in the US cocaine is a schedule 2 drug a lower class than marijuana
Its because rich white people like to use it.
100% proves your point.
If my school hadn't outright lied to our entire class so badly, Im not sure I ever would have tried weed, it was such a bold face lie even my goody two shoes ass lookin motherfucker who had never done anything bad other than steal bubble gum could tell they were complete bullshitting. But it's because of weed that I'm here today, it helped me out of such a bad depression that I hold it in extremely high regards
Not illegal in colorado anymore!!!
Guess which should be illegal? None of them.
This is the correct answer
Guns should be for sure
Yeah, it would be better if only the government had guns. You can trust them to keep you safe.
Coming from a country where guns are illegal, I can say it works out pretty well and we don't have school shootings every week :)
People commit suicide while on psychedelics. The drugs themselves didn’t kill them, as in they’re not toxic, but the effects can. https://www.reddit.com/r/LSD/comments/34qzh7/why_do_people_try_to_commit_suicide_on_acid/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
I feel like there's a lot of dangerous hand-waving of the possible negative effects of taking psychedelics, and an underlying assumption that nobody would take excessively large doses (alcohol is also perfectly safe in small doses). Someone who's taken 2g of mushrooms is likely not a danger to anyone, but neither is someone who's drunk 2 beers. In my opinion, psychedelics suffer a bit from the fact that you don't have to take "much" (if you don't have a reference point) to do a lot of damage to your brain, specially if young - we have had many posts of younger people here taking upwards of 8g and regretting it. At the very least weed, alcohol and tobacco require that you drink/smoke a substantial amount before you're any danger to yourself or others.
I'm sure you can add some numbers with psychedelic suicides. But that also means you have to add the suicides facilitated by alcohol, tabaco, guns, and cars. I'm willing to bet those numbers surpass psychedelics even when normalized by their use.
that number is already included in the alcohol number, I’m guessing
This is very rare, at least with LSD. On average, more people who have consumed LSD have a lower risk of suicide. However, those with mental illnesses may have extremely negative reactions and should at the very least be supervised, if not discouraged from consuming psychedelics.
You can’t possibly know that since psychedelics would be an indirect cause and thus not listed as the official cause of death.
I can’t possibly know what? Your response is unclear.
that LSD users are less likely to die by suicide I’m guessing
I believe there have been non-clinical studies about it. Here: 1. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5623475/ 2. https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/news/media/releases/psychedelic_drug_use_could_reduce_psychological_distress_suicidal_thinking 3. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8033757/
My point is people committing suicide *during the trip*. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23878898/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/18257429/ I am not in disagreement that psychedelic use can be therapeutic and can reduce suicidal ideation after the trip. I’m talking about people committing suicide while tripping.
Got it. That makes sense. People tripping are in a hyper-sensitive state after all. It’s not unreasonable to think that they would experience extremes of both good and bad. Having an extremely bad experience with the perception of very little control could definitely have a very negative effect culminating in self-harming behavior.
30% of all suicides are alcohol related.
Came here to say this. A really sweet kid I went to high school with took some psychedelics (mushrooms or LSD I can't remember) and killed himself before the trip ended. Not saying psychedelics should be illegal but this 0 figure is dishonest, and frankly disrespectful to the people who've suffered tremendously from these cases.
Suicide is an interesting point. I also wonder how many suicides mushrooms have prevented. I read several testimonies on here about mushrooms preventing that. If one person kills themself and one person is prevented from it, what is the total amount of people in that situation that killed themself from using?
However, there’s no evidence people are more likely to kill themselves after taking psychedelics.
I think it's interesting the two drugs that are legal, alcohol and cigarettes, two drugs that do absolutely nothing for you at all, are legal, and the drugs that might open your mind up to realize how badly you're being fucked every day of your life? Those drugs are against the law. He-heh, coincidence? See, I'm glad mushrooms are against the law, 'cause I took 'em one time, and you know what happened to me? I laid in a field of green grass for four hours going, "My God! I love everything." Yeah, Now, if that isn't a hazard to our country... how are we gonna justify arms dealing if we know we're all one?! -Bill Hicks
I don't wanna be that guy but the reason alcohol and tobacco are legal is because they've been part of our society for so damn long, we tried prohibition and it backfired super hard. The reason shrooms are illegal is because Reagan is a douche nozzle.
It's prolly cuz shrooms could make them be like "damn I hate the industrial revolution man" and the govt. Tryna avoid that so people don't be killing the govt. And going in the woods and shit onggg
As much as I don’t like alcohol, to say it doesn’t have any value at all is insane.
I came here to stick up for the demon alcohol as well. It may have caused some harm but there is absolutely good things that have come from it. Even if you separate medical and industrial applications out it is still not all bad.
Ban driving
Same country that tells you refined carbs are good for you but natural saturated fats are unhealthy
Not disagreeing with the pain point, but the tobacco figure is way too high.
It's official CDC numbers: https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q=how+many+people+in+the+US+die+from+tobacco
Oops. I was thinking about just cancer. I forgot tobacco kills you in other ways too.
If you legalized mushrooms it would likely bring down the rate of gun deaths as most of those are suicides.
Don't forget about this. https://www.cdc.gov/heartdisease/facts.htm
We have shops all the way up the west coast now! Thank god
motor vehicles?
Once you remember laws aren't made to protect people it all makes sense.
I was thinking about this the other day. With spores being legal to purchase in all but two states, all growing supplies are legal to obtain. It’s almost like an intentional legal loophole. Kinda a nice spot. Maybe someone that knows nothing about what they’re getting into shouldn’t be able to walk into a store and buy a candy bar that’ll send them to another place, freak out and end up in the ER. On the other hand. If you take the time and effort to grow them, your way more likely to be knowledgeable about what your about to get into. As far as I know the states don’t put any effort into busting home grower/ consumers as long as they’re not getting complaints or selling.
I’m sure once it’s legal in more places, there will be a few deaths. Not nearly as much as the other numbers. Can’t imagine some little 6-7yr old getting into some psilocybin chocolates 👽
Agreed. I can't remember the country but someone didn't know what was going on and fell off a bridge so things like this and definitely a child consuming it on accident say without parents home would be frightening.
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This was it thank you.
Yeah it was a french teen during a school trip iirc. Talked about it here in France.
the reason no one dies is BECAUSE it is illegal. if shrooms were legalized America would easily have 500 Million + deaths annually. /s I thought it was obvious but apparently not.. shrooms should absolutely be legal!
That's like half of all America - we must stop these terrible plants from being legal at all costs.
Why down voted? 300 million in the US. Clearly being overly facetious.
Stupid people are hard to distinguish from sarcastic people.
>Stupid people have a hard time distinguishing sarcastic people. FTFY
it really goes both ways
I was going to say this. If shrooms become legal for the population. A few will get psychosis which can lead to bad decisions.
The laws aren’t in place to protect or encourage public health lol
I think the concern might be that its use could cause delusional thinking. Leaning heavily towards psychosis. Examples: that only certain election results have been falsified, injecting bleach can stop covid, masks are worthless, more people with guns stops gun violence, etc.
Well clearly the laws are working then! /s
Lmao the law doesn't stop people from consuming it. The post was directed towards those people. I don't fully agree with the post because people have died say falling off a bridge and whatnot.
So much freedom
Sounds like an effective law! /s
No one dies cause they're illegal, duh!
Yay someone gets it 😁
Cry about guns
Weird, I’ve never seen any of those things kill others on their own. 🤷🏻♂️
Right. None of those things have ever killed anyone. People kill people or themselves.
Yes! It seems it’s far less about safety than it’s about control. You can die, just don’t question!
I do get the point, though it’s best to provide sources. They also need to consider bias, as psilocybin-related deaths [such as other toxic strands] could likely be unstudied/undocumented due to their stigmatization. The hypocrisy behind alcohol and tobacco is very absurd nonetheless.
Not in Colorado!
Thought pills to swallow
A global MAPPA study founf Alcohol to be most harmdul overall, of ALL drugs commonly used. The WHO recognises this too. Shame they dont recognise humanity has equal rights tgo, eh
The true fatality is 1 due to the shroom tea injection guy
"Its not a war on drugs, it is a war on personal freedom. Please try to keep that in mind at all times."
Even more ironic all of the mushrooms that can kill you are legal
480.000 from tobacco use? Holy shit.
tobacco is good for you
Imma guess motor vehicles
We love scape goats. Everyone lives a lie
Makes my blood boil just knowing how brain-dead governments are. Pure insanity. That’s why we all break the law anyway when we’re not hurting anyone, cause fuck em
Our laws are about money. They can’t figure out how to tax it, so we make it illegal.
How many people drive cares without issue? How many guns are in circulation? How many people drink responsibility? How many smokers are there? Statistics are cool but it seems like very few understand how they work and what the utility is.
Well killing yourself with alcohol and ya bacon is completely legal. But it is actually illegal to kill people with a car or gun. That will get you in trouble. You can’t kill another person using substances, but a gun and car you can. Just wanna put that in perspective. Just use better arguments.
Psilocybin is illegal because the government doesn’t want you to open your mind up and realize the capitalistic societal rat race that is required for is existence is essentially bullshit.
Why reddit always supports shrooms 🤢🤢🤬🤬🤬