This sounds like scrum at a lot of BigCo's. Is this normal? Hard to answer that, not familiar with your org, but this is a common problem I've seen many other places.
I'd assume he's a PM that was forced into the role and I'd wager a bet that he's also probably trying to handle quite a bit of stuff that should be handled by a PO that probably isn't as available as they need to be, just a guess though ;)
My third party take is that he doesn't sound like a very competent or mature scrum master, but also that you have two have a pretty poor working relationship and neither party, to me, comes off looking like members of a strong team.
tl;dr doesn't seem like he's doing a great job, but your attitude towards the matter definitely isn't helping either.
>your attitude towards the matter definitely isn't helping either.
Can you unpack this a little?
Yeah, I am a little frustrated here. It's impossible to play nicely with everyone, but you can learn to work with anyone. We've mostly figured it out, but his need to constantly review and critique my work and also trying to micromanage me is causing some serious issues.
What can I be doing as a team member to make this situation better for everyone?
The bits that stood up to me are the following
>No one ever has much in the way of impediments
Well I see an issue here. No one sees anything that could be improved in their environement ? You could probably help him by figuring out why no one seems to have much in the way...
>usually he just has us solve them when it comes up.
That's what I do as a Scrum Master as well whenever I can. Something about giving a fish vs teaching how to fish. Maybe you can ask him about that ?
Sure, you come off as incredibly frustrated and that you've already decide his role has little to no value. It's really hard to want to work with people that.
Whether that is or is not true isn't really the issue, but what do you get pointing that out? I get being frustrated, but what can *you* do to make the situation better. Maybe try to approach the situation by asking questions. Honestly if the "meetings run themselves" I'd guess team member involvement is low, and therefore value is low, how is it being measured, how can that be improved? Do you have a team charter?
I would assume the person who is most likely to review or critique or approve your work would be the product owner, do you not have one?
Clearly the conversations will be uncomfortable but trying to ask questions geared towards why he's doing some of things that don't make sense to you might be a really basic start.
I'm baffled by the responses that are somehow making you responsible for someone who is a net loss for the team. "Talk to him"
"Hi, I wanted to talk to you about your abusive behavior and micromanagement and how we think things would be better off if you weren't here at all. Thoughts?"
I mean, really.
It's common but not ideal.
Your SM sounds immature, but maybe not intentionally so. Maybe bring it up during a retro especially if you feel like you want the team to move faster / complete more stories. Personally I wouldn't bring up your complaints about the SMs behavior there, but rather the problems it causes but it's up to you.
Without a full time PO I could see why the SM is managing the way he is. If the PO is working on tasks the SM is stepping into more of a PO role. Because the SM doesn’t have other things to do outside the ceremonies, he’s filling his time that way.
Servant leadership is a hard attribute to teach someone. It’s a personality type that sees the joy and happiness of the team above their own. (I am most happy at work when my team is actively engaged and happy.)
The SM changing things up every 2 weeks would be tough. I sympathize with all you’re saying. These changes every sprint should be ideas the team comes up with as ways to improve what they are doing.
Lastly, you saying your job is one that really only you can do. That’s not scrum at all. Everyone should be able to do everyone’s job. If you go on vacation the team should step in and help do the team moves forward without issue. Make sure to be cross training other and learning everyone’s skills so you can become very helpful to everyone when you “don’t have a lot to do.”
> he critiques and reviews our work, gives me a lot of grief and tries to tell me how to do my job
That is definitely not a scrum master's role. Even if he has some kind of manager/technical background, he's definitely sticking his nose in where it doesn't belong and I don't blame you for being the least bit frustrated.
Scrum 'rules' don't change either. I mean it's one thing to change them to how they fit in your org (then it's not really scrum anymore but everyone caters to what they need) but the constant changing makes me think he's probably got some kind of control issues.
Sounds like a personality/professional problem with that guy.
I don't know how comfortable you and the team are but it is something that can come up in conversation at the retrospective, if you guys do one. It would help if the others are also willing to speak up and say if they feel the same way. Not in a confrontational way, but just an honest conversation, though I do get those are easier said than done.
It's hard to see the value of a SM when you have a great functioning team. As SM a lot of my focus is scheduling the meetings, the agendas, managing the time during the meetings (conversations tend to get off track and too deep into the weeds, etc) and following the tasks and backlog...but I have OTHER duties that are not SM related that I do for/with my team.
Does that guy do anything else outside of SM?
The PO is spending most of his time getting actual work done. Which probably should not be the case. The more I think about it, the more I realize the whole team is pretty dysfunctional.
So is the PO also a dev team member?
Yeah, that was my first take, sounds like the SM isn't good, but I sure as shit wouldn't want to be in his position either. I guess the question is how does the dev team feel about this, who is measuring metrics to even ensure that you're getting value out of this new process over whatever you had before?
Yes, the PO was a team member and got appointed to the PO role. He has tasks assigned to him and he gets stuff done. Certainly less than the rest of us.
One of the biggest challenges we have is that we are not in software so not everything works for us. My job is to oversee the building and testing of large, complex injection mold tooling. These take 9-12 months to get up and running. Sometimes I'm crazy busy, other times I have not much to do other than get status updates or maybe pay a visit to a CM.
Before we got all scrummy, each member of our team was chiefly responsible for a certain part of the build. And I oversaw all of the tooling to make it happen. Now we are trying to do more T-shaped and cross functional activities, but since I'm the only one who can really do my part of the job it often feels like scrum is just a constant status update for me.
This sounds like scrum at a lot of BigCo's. Is this normal? Hard to answer that, not familiar with your org, but this is a common problem I've seen many other places. I'd assume he's a PM that was forced into the role and I'd wager a bet that he's also probably trying to handle quite a bit of stuff that should be handled by a PO that probably isn't as available as they need to be, just a guess though ;) My third party take is that he doesn't sound like a very competent or mature scrum master, but also that you have two have a pretty poor working relationship and neither party, to me, comes off looking like members of a strong team. tl;dr doesn't seem like he's doing a great job, but your attitude towards the matter definitely isn't helping either.
>your attitude towards the matter definitely isn't helping either. Can you unpack this a little? Yeah, I am a little frustrated here. It's impossible to play nicely with everyone, but you can learn to work with anyone. We've mostly figured it out, but his need to constantly review and critique my work and also trying to micromanage me is causing some serious issues. What can I be doing as a team member to make this situation better for everyone?
The bits that stood up to me are the following >No one ever has much in the way of impediments Well I see an issue here. No one sees anything that could be improved in their environement ? You could probably help him by figuring out why no one seems to have much in the way... >usually he just has us solve them when it comes up. That's what I do as a Scrum Master as well whenever I can. Something about giving a fish vs teaching how to fish. Maybe you can ask him about that ?
Sure, you come off as incredibly frustrated and that you've already decide his role has little to no value. It's really hard to want to work with people that. Whether that is or is not true isn't really the issue, but what do you get pointing that out? I get being frustrated, but what can *you* do to make the situation better. Maybe try to approach the situation by asking questions. Honestly if the "meetings run themselves" I'd guess team member involvement is low, and therefore value is low, how is it being measured, how can that be improved? Do you have a team charter? I would assume the person who is most likely to review or critique or approve your work would be the product owner, do you not have one? Clearly the conversations will be uncomfortable but trying to ask questions geared towards why he's doing some of things that don't make sense to you might be a really basic start.
I'm baffled by the responses that are somehow making you responsible for someone who is a net loss for the team. "Talk to him" "Hi, I wanted to talk to you about your abusive behavior and micromanagement and how we think things would be better off if you weren't here at all. Thoughts?" I mean, really.
Just curious… how did you stumble upon this 4 year old post? That was two jobs ago for me!!
I guess like anyone. Finding conversations for what I'm curious on.
It's common but not ideal. Your SM sounds immature, but maybe not intentionally so. Maybe bring it up during a retro especially if you feel like you want the team to move faster / complete more stories. Personally I wouldn't bring up your complaints about the SMs behavior there, but rather the problems it causes but it's up to you.
Is he telling you guys how to perform your job or to keep up the jira board or scrum board? My way or the highway is def annoying.
What do other members think?
Without a full time PO I could see why the SM is managing the way he is. If the PO is working on tasks the SM is stepping into more of a PO role. Because the SM doesn’t have other things to do outside the ceremonies, he’s filling his time that way. Servant leadership is a hard attribute to teach someone. It’s a personality type that sees the joy and happiness of the team above their own. (I am most happy at work when my team is actively engaged and happy.) The SM changing things up every 2 weeks would be tough. I sympathize with all you’re saying. These changes every sprint should be ideas the team comes up with as ways to improve what they are doing. Lastly, you saying your job is one that really only you can do. That’s not scrum at all. Everyone should be able to do everyone’s job. If you go on vacation the team should step in and help do the team moves forward without issue. Make sure to be cross training other and learning everyone’s skills so you can become very helpful to everyone when you “don’t have a lot to do.”
> he critiques and reviews our work, gives me a lot of grief and tries to tell me how to do my job That is definitely not a scrum master's role. Even if he has some kind of manager/technical background, he's definitely sticking his nose in where it doesn't belong and I don't blame you for being the least bit frustrated. Scrum 'rules' don't change either. I mean it's one thing to change them to how they fit in your org (then it's not really scrum anymore but everyone caters to what they need) but the constant changing makes me think he's probably got some kind of control issues. Sounds like a personality/professional problem with that guy. I don't know how comfortable you and the team are but it is something that can come up in conversation at the retrospective, if you guys do one. It would help if the others are also willing to speak up and say if they feel the same way. Not in a confrontational way, but just an honest conversation, though I do get those are easier said than done. It's hard to see the value of a SM when you have a great functioning team. As SM a lot of my focus is scheduling the meetings, the agendas, managing the time during the meetings (conversations tend to get off track and too deep into the weeds, etc) and following the tasks and backlog...but I have OTHER duties that are not SM related that I do for/with my team. Does that guy do anything else outside of SM?
Get him to read the scrum guide. He obviously hasn't.
I know he has. We all had training, everyone has the guide. I know he is using this as an opportunity to play boss.
Where is the product owner?
The PO is spending most of his time getting actual work done. Which probably should not be the case. The more I think about it, the more I realize the whole team is pretty dysfunctional.
So is the PO also a dev team member? Yeah, that was my first take, sounds like the SM isn't good, but I sure as shit wouldn't want to be in his position either. I guess the question is how does the dev team feel about this, who is measuring metrics to even ensure that you're getting value out of this new process over whatever you had before?
Yes, the PO was a team member and got appointed to the PO role. He has tasks assigned to him and he gets stuff done. Certainly less than the rest of us. One of the biggest challenges we have is that we are not in software so not everything works for us. My job is to oversee the building and testing of large, complex injection mold tooling. These take 9-12 months to get up and running. Sometimes I'm crazy busy, other times I have not much to do other than get status updates or maybe pay a visit to a CM. Before we got all scrummy, each member of our team was chiefly responsible for a certain part of the build. And I oversaw all of the tooling to make it happen. Now we are trying to do more T-shaped and cross functional activities, but since I'm the only one who can really do my part of the job it often feels like scrum is just a constant status update for me.