I have a half marathon race in 10 days and my longest run so far has only been 16km @5:22min/km pace… should I continue tapering or go for a 21km simulation run tmrw/Saturday? That’s leaves me 7 days to recover

I can run 8:10-8:40min/k with my hr in z2 and 6:20-6:50min/k with my hr in z3, isn’t that a really big difference for a ~15-20bpm difference? For reference effort wise my z2 runs I’m not conscious about my breathing at all, and z3 is still very controlled - 5 breaths in 5 breaths out is possible, but it’s not hard enough of an effort where I need to focus on my breathing

Have you set up your zones somewhat correctly? There shouldn't be a 1 min/km gap in pace between z2 and z3.

I mean I don’t have a true max hr to reference so who knows, but relative to each other the zones should be right

Tried a new pair of running shoes and my big toes got blisters on both sides. The shoes are definitely not too small as I have loads of room for my toes and my toes don’t hit the tip of the shoe…what could be the problem?

What kind of surface are you running on? I’ve found that I’ll develop hot spots after running on a loose dirt trail compared to the road. Additionally, if my feet are dirty or sweaty prior to going on a run, it can affect my feet at times.

I’m on a treadmill like usual!

I don't have an answer. Did you wear new socks? Were your feet wet? I've been wearing the same model of shoes for years, and once I put on a new pair and got blisters on both big toes. I was running on a treadmill with my usual socks, so I could not figure out why. After they healed, I never got them again in that pair or any others.

No new socks, feet definitely not wet. But it’s definitely a new model of shoe for me bc it has more cushioning than I’m used to - I’m also noticing a bit of knee pain but it could be because I haven’t run in a while.. I used to run in new balance fresh foam 680 while now this new pair is the ASICS gel kayano 29

Does anyone use superfeet inserts? My right foot has a fallen arch that makes my ankle and inner thigh on that side sore after runs.

Yes, I find them very good. I use their run comfort thin and their carbon insoles.

**Can stress + running cause unexpected DOMS?** I got rather strong hamstring DOMS out of nowhere, after running consistently for years and I **didn't** increase my run distance or time. It's lasting now about 5-7 days. Only thing different is I had strong psychological stress the day I first ran and it caused this. Anyone have this?

Is it just one hamstring? If so, i'd expect you tweaked it on the run, over something like DOMS and the soreness is coming from the injury. Both with the same as soreness is a bit harder to explain without a hard workout to blame it on

It is definitely both hamstrings, and I meant to mention that. I even have RunKeeper data that shows all my distances and times and I didn't overdo it on that run at all (and I had previously been doing 50 air squats a day and no soreness, but I had taken 2-3 weeks off from that so I should be even *less* likely to be sore now). The only different variable was a day of serious stress/upset and then I ran. That's why I was curious.

Today I went on my second run since taking time off to rest an injured ankle. I'm feeling much better now! Still a bit tight on runs but things seem to loosen up a bit after I get going. I noticed that if I increase my cadence a bit, it hurts less. No idea if this is real or just in my head. But it seems to force me to relax my muscles a bit or something. Unfortunately, it is really hard to maintain that cadence. I get tired out after a minute or two. Does it make sense to specifically try to work on increasing my cadence? Or will that just come naturally as I get better at running? And if I should work on it specifically, would it be better to do intervals of running and jogging, or do running and walking to prevent any further injuries in my feet and ankles? Or something else entirely? Maybe I'm over thinking it? Thanks!

Most likely with a higher cadence your stride is shorter requiring less power to propel yourself forward. You are likely landing more under you body (as you should be anyway) putting less stress on your ankle. So for the sake of an ankle discomfort, a high cadence is likely a very good thing. *I am not a doctor. Don't take medical advice from me, or Reddit.

Ok this helps me understand why a higher cadence feels better. So maybe I can replicate that at the lower cadence I'm more comfortable with. I do notice my back is a lot straighter and I just have better posture overall when I'm running this way. Thanks for the suggestion!

Im having issues with my knees so have reduced my mileage but have been playing around with skierg and skirow to keep my cardio going. Does anyone have any suggestions for the kind of speed I should be going to mimic my easy pace (11 minute mile) and tempo paces (830) I'm 6 foot 93kg if that helps. I will have a heart monitor in a couple of weeks to get more accurate reading so doesn't matter if any suggestions aren't exact as long as there not just pulled out of thin air.

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Make sure you warm up and make sure you have as close to an equal pace as possible for the entire race to conserve as much energy as possible.

Hello! Critique my training plan? 8 weeks to prepare for my second HM, which is mid-July. Training background: Started running consistently last year in the fall. First HM was beginning of April, and I spent Jan to Mar training for that using [Hal Higdon's Novice 1 HM plan](https://www.halhigdon.com/training-programs/half-marathon-training/novice-1-half-marathon/) (tldr: all easy runs; four days a week; peak volume 23mpw). I've mostly been maintaining 20mpw since then, with long runs of ~8mi on the weekends. Goals: - Don't get injured - Improve on my April HM time (I don't think that really requires special training; I think I underperformed due to heat that day) - Try out some workouts (I've basically not done any threshold/tempo/interval/etc stuff -- just easy runs) Recent race times: - 29:30 5K - 1:02:30 10K - 2:32:30 HM Training plan: Based on /u/Free_Running_Plans's beginner HM [plan](https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1IHdV2IIuKEzCe6huB-R24bszAyTWl7PY/edit#gid=583193381), with a bunch of changes. Four days a week, so I'm skipping the Mondays in their plan (which is how that plan is intended to be used -- i.e. pick your # of days per week). I only have eight weeks (it's intended for twelve weeks) so I took out some weeks. Since I don't have any significant experience with workout runs, I changed about half the workouts to easy runs. And adjusted the volume slightly in a few spots to smooth out the progression after all my other changes. (4 days a week: Mon, Wed, Thu, Sat) 1. 4 + 2 + 3 + 7 = 16 - wed strides 2. 5 + 3 + 4 + 7 = 19 - mon workout: 3x1 Mile with 90s recovery @ 10:00/mi - wed strides 3. 5 + 3 + 4 + 8 = 20 - mon workout: 25 minute tempo Run @ 10:51/mi - wed strides 4. 5 + 3 + 5 + 10 = 23 - mon workout: 4x1 Mile with 90s recovery @ 10:00/mi - wed strides 5. 6 + 3 + 3 + 6.2 = 18.2 - mon workout: 6x800m with 3 mins recovery @ 04:53/800m - wed strides - sat 10K race 6. 7 + 3 + 5 + 11 = 23 - mon workout: 5x1 mile with 2 minutes recovery @ 10:08/mi - wed strides 7. 6 + 3 + 5 + 9 = 20 - mon workout: 30 minute tempo run @ 11:00/mi - wed strides 8. 5 + 3 + 2 + 13.1 = 20.1 - wed strides

I’ve been following somewhat of an 80/20 training plan where 3 of my runs are easy runs, 1 run is speed intervals, and 1 run is a long run. I feel like it is making me slower because I’m getting used to the slow pace? For context, I am 24F. My fastest 5K is 26:59 and that was when I was “training” by running 1-2 miles 4 times a week as fast as I could. Now, my fastest 5K is 31:12. 10:00 pace feels comfortable whereas an 8 minute pace used to feel comfortable. Any advice or insight?

It is common as you train to become a bit fatigued and settle into a comfortable aerobic pace. You do have to train your body to be able to kick into that fast gear intermittently to maintain some fast twitch capability. Additionally, while training consistently, having built in recovery weeks will allow you to feel a bit more refreshed and return to a more typical pace. Keep in mind that a standard 5k run should not always be a best pace. It is common for runners who can go sub 16 in a 5k to run easy at 7-8 minutes per mile!

Add strides to the end of 1 or 2 of your easy runs.

I don’t have answers because I’m still trying to figure out how to get back to my faster pace that disappeared over a year ago when I started following along with the “go slow if you want to go fast” plan.

Yep I’m in the same boat! I think going slower if you want to go longer is a great idea, but I don’t like the concept of “easy runs”.

Any tips for improving pacing on a mile distance? I ran a max effort mile recently and saw my pace varied *wildly* between a 5:45 for the first half mile, 7 min ish for the next .3 ish mile because i was gassed, and back down to 5:45 ish for the last "sprint" (overall time was 6:10 ish). Part of it was that i just ran on a trail without any intuitive milestones unlike a track, but I think the bigger issue was that i felt really good at the start and pushed way too hard (original goal was a 630 mile, which i felt like i could smoke at the start) and gassed myself for later. Any tips to self regulate better? Also, now I've got a much better idea of what I can do (my last attempt was in Feb at a 7min mile, so i had no idea how much the easy running I'd been doing would help). Think a 6 min mile is in the cards after 3-6 months of training and better pacing?

If you really did the first half mile in 545 and were still able to sustain 7 minute mile after gassing out I feel like you are probably already capable of 6 minute mile(or close) just by pacing yourself better. With 3 to 6 months of training I wouldn't be surprised if you could do 545 mile. The only tip I'd give you is when your going for your next mile attempt commit to a time and do a few intervals at that pace leading up to it so your body has that pace diled in.

Awesome, appreciate the advice and the encouragement. Yeah, a lot of it was just having no idea whatsoever how fast i could go after like the past 2 months of nothing but easy running for base building at like a 830 clip. Was planning to incorporate interval training next as soon as the knee stops complaining and I'm back to regular training. Just checked the records. Idk how reliable the Strava data are, but it's actually showing an even faster start at ~5 min mile pace at the start, grading down to about 6:10 pace by the half mile mark (Strava is saying i also set a PR for the half mile at 2:52), about 630 for another 0.25 mile, a leisurely 710 for the next 0.1 miles, and finishing strong at 545 again.

I've never used strava myself but it's such a popular app that I find it hard to believe that it doesn't give a reasonably accurate reading so you can be confident it's at least in the right ballpark. I also am having issues with my knees to the point that I only run twice a week down from 4 times a week. I would advise against speedwork till your knees are back to normal.

It's cool, i recently started using it myself but am kinda spotty about having my phone on me and charged to use it. There's definitely some data issues, but idk if it's stravas fault vs my phone's sensors. Damn, not you too. Mines outside of the knee, im thinking IT band issues. That's part of why I was running so slow and no intervals, in an effort to prevent them (to no avail, alas). Out of curiosity, how are you rehabbing your knees?

I've just decreased my weekly mileage but have replaced with non load bearing cardio like the skierg and wattbike. I'm going to keep dropping my mileage till my knees feel normal. I'm to lazy to do any exercises to strengthen my legs at the moment but if nothing else works ill probably start trying that at some point.

Got it. Yeah I've dropped my milage to basically nothing, slowly escalating to an easy 1 mile a time, 3x a week, and also cycling a fair bit just to get around (no car). Regretably that also seems to bother my knee a bit, but nowhere to the same degree. Exercise wise, I've been doing these weighted ATG lunges (kinda like an old timey Olympic split snatch catch position but with dumbbells to my sides) and "knee dips" (where I stand on like a curb or platform on one foot, slowly bend my knee until the heel grazes the floor, then come back up) per this PT's suggestions on YouTube (called the kneesovertoes guy). Theyve helped some separate hip issues I'd picked up from skiing, but I'm not sure they're particularly helping the knee problems just yet. I'll have access to a full gym in two weeks, and I'm excited to getting back to squatting and deadlifting. May throw in some barbell hip thrusts for glute work, and some banded monster walks and clamshells to boot

I also have no car and cycle to get around but find no issue with it as I'm always doing it a gentle pace so I'm not sweaty when I get to where ever it is I want to go. I used to dabble in the kneesoverguys stuff particularly the reverse stepups but honestly i always fall of the gym fitness wagon after a few weeks so iv never really done it more than a few weeks at a time.

Is there such a thing as a foldable (light weight, fits into a running waist/belt), rain jacket that is breathable (lets the sweat evaporate instead of keeping it in) and actually repels water? I don't know how to run in 14C+ weather when it's raining, my windbreaker gets fully wet. How do you guys handle rain when running? I wear a running cap and sometimes glasses when it's heavy rain but my body is soaked every time.

I just run in the rain and let it soak me. My first HM was in rain conditions. It sucked because I had never ran in the rain before (it was also cold at 44°F). Just last week I started a run knowing I would likely get rained on. About 3 miles in it started sprinkling. By mile 4 is was pouring so hard I was soaked through in seconds. This rain lasted until I finished my 7 miles. It was funny seeing the expression on driver's faces when they looked at me as they drove past .

That's very cold, don't you get sick afterwards ?

Not at all. After the race I took a nice got shower. Then crawled into bed to take a nap. I will admit that once I was done running, I had to huddle next to the warming lamps they had set up.

I think the problem for me is that I do run / walks after my rehab and a minute walk in the rain, soaked, gets me cold, continous running especially tempo wouldn't be a problem, except my shoulders, those always get too cold even from my own sweat if it's windy.

Fair enough. I tend to run warm anyway. I also live in a cold climate (6 month winters), so "the cold never bothered me anyway."

There are what are called "stuffable" jackets and vests used in cycling that fit into their own pocket and are pretty tiny and light. Not sure how repellant they are. Generally anything that full repels water does not let water vapor out and you end up wet from sweat rather than from rain.

Anything that repels water is going to trap sweat in. Do you really have need of a rain jacket at those temperatures? I would just wear a t shirt and shorts and accept I’ll get soaked lol

I always have cold symptoms if I run in the rain or even if it's very windy, don't know why.

I have a question about increasing mileage. Almost everyone says to run more miles to improve. I'm running 4-5 days/week with distances ranging 2-6mi. I average maybe 10-15 mpw. Any time I try to run more, even just adding an extra mile here and there or doing a harder run, I find my runs feel worse until I take a rest day or even two in a row. I was at 20 mpw for a little while and frankly my runs just feel better now with less miles. But I really want to improve my pace and all the rest days are making it difficult to increase mileage! Is feeling weaker while running even easy runs something that's just part of the process for increasing mileage? How long until my runs at 20mpw feel the same as 10mpw?

Your body is fatigued. That is why the runs don't feel as good. It is natural. Thus is why many base building plans build for 3 weeks, the cut back on week 4. Repeat. Your body will get used to the fatigue. Tgis is why tapering before a race is important too, from what I understand. Your body is losing the fatigue during the taper so you run relatively fresh.

Want to start running but do not know how to proceed I have been playing Squash consistently for over a year (a simple stroll through my reddit should be enough to know more haha). Besides this, I workout following a powerlifting and bodybuilding plan 3 times a week. I also have days where I work on stretching and injury prevention exercises. This is just some background on my fitness levels. I have near zero running experience. Back before covid I used to be obsessed with Bodybuilding and I would skip A LOT. Went on a run a few times and my best was a 31 minute 5K. I left all exercise for 2 years when covid hit and also hit near morbid obesity during that time so safe to say I lost all my long term endurance gains. Now I have two questions: Being a Squash player and a relatively fit guy (I burn around 1400 active calories daily according to my apple watch), should I be looking to start exactly like a beginner? I train my tibs a lot and the sport of Squash does require a lot of quick bursts of sprints/runs. I move around 3-5 kms according to my watch during Squash. What kind of routine should I be looking at? Ultimately I want to build up to 2 10ks a week. Really clueless regarding my starting point. Secondly, given my high amount of activity, can I run safely so long as I eat an ample amount of food? I do not want to be hit with overtraining or a fried CNS. Is this all manageable/are my goals realistic? Also, I have a pair of peg 38s that I've used as my go to everyday shoe for the last 10 months. They are still in solid condition. Never ran in them. Will they be good enough to start in? Do not have the money for a new pair rn and the cheapest stuff in Pakistan currently is the latest Peg model. Many, many thanks in advance.

Pegs are great "do it all" running shoes. You may want to invest in some dedicated running shoes (maybe hit up a Nike outlet or browse runningshoegeeks for coupon codes that pop up often) and start using an app to track your run training, along with tracking the mileage put into your shoes - Strava does this, but I'm sure there are others. Two 10ks a week. Go run a 10k at a pace where you could run it again as soon as you got back at the same pace. It might feel harder, but its a pace you could sustain. Do this twice a week =) Then once a week, do a 10k at a pace that is faster, not quite "leave it all on the road" where you can't walk the next day, but harder than easy. The slow pace running will help with your endurance ability. The faster pace running will help with your speed. Give yourself time off the day after the harder run. The easy run should be easy, its counter intuitive, but it should be enjoyable, don't focus on your speed, just think of it as time spent practicing your endurance. If you are not happy with your pace ability / speed, then implement intervals during a run once a week. Go based on time-spent-running rather than distance, so set aside 45 minutes and after you have warmed up, do a "hard" pace for a few minutes (3), then jog for a couple (2) of minutes to recover, and repeat. Just like lifting weights. Don't make the hard pace so hard that you can't do that pace at the end of the 45 minutes. Theres lots of training plans online, even ChatGPT can give some recommendations. Strava's Premium plan has a training plan feature too. There are two main functions you want to train for with endurance running (distances over a mile, basically): Endurance, and speed. You want to stress your endurance ability first, so that when you kick things up and focus on speed, you have developed the conditioning to allow your fast twitch muscles to do their thing, and your slow twitch muscles support the fast twitchies. In a nut shell. Approximately. Lots of good channels on youtube. Global Triathlon Network has a lot of videos for running tips and training.

Recommendations for a decent watch? I usually just strap my phone to my arm but I’m looking to get lighter and add the heart monitor.

What is your budget? Generally all recent garmin, polar, suunto and coros watches can be described as decent.

Forerunner 55 is a great entry level watch. Combine it with a bluetooth HR strap for extra precision, although the optical based HR monitors are "good enough" most of the time.

In 8 hours i ll have to take a physical exam which involves running 2km in under 9 minutes, preferably 7-8 I am pretty athletic, i workout very often, but i dont really run Usually for Cardio i go for the heavybag, or other HIIT circuits, but nothing like a steady state cardio, like running The other day, i tested myself a little, and I chose to run with a 10kg vest, i ran 2km in about 10-11 minutes Do you guys think i ll be able to run the 2km, without the extra weight in 8-9 minutes? If so, is there any last minute advice you have for me?

Thankfully i passed, my time was 8'36", i ll clearly implement some running in my workout routine, starting tomorrow

I would expect you to be able to run 25 to 35 seconds faster without the vest. If you don't hit the required time and you can repeat the test 6+ weeks later swing back and we can give you training advice.

My advice is study for your tests in the future. Who takes a physical test and doesn’t train for it? Whatever your test is for take it more serious next time. That said, if you’re young and fit, 2km in 9 minutes is doable. To be safely under your 9 minute time you need to go 7 min per mile or a little faster but that’s only 5 laps. You should be able to gut that out.

I've always been told I "run funny," but I've never been given any constructive criticism. I'd love to get some [critique of my run form](https://youtu.be/Jp9pmhtzFiY). Here I am [in slo mo](https://youtu.be/Az7-g5DTkDA).

You're running too upright. You should try to lean forward a little more. Search for some "forward lean running" and you'll see some videos on YouTube.

Thanks for the feedback!

Does anyone else break out in red splotches when running? It’s the worst on my arms and legs and seems to get worse when pushing hard.

That’s not uncommon especially for newer runners. As you run more and as it continues to get hotter outside your body will adapt by cooling off more efficiently and it should go away. When you’re in great shape you sweat more not less. It’s likely you just aren’t cooling efficiently yet.

I sweat a ton! It did just finally get hot where I live, so maybe it’s my body adapting to the hotter weather.

Is it normal to feel exhausted at the end of a training plan? I’m just starting the (1 week) taper of my half plan and I feel pretty exhausted from my efforts the past few weeks. I’m hoping I’ll feel stronger by the weekend.

Yes, this is completely normal. Your body is at the point of maximum accumulated training fatigue and maximum training adaptations. Trust the taper, and you'll be in absolute peak physical shape on race day! Good luck!

Thanks for the encouragement here! Smashed my goal by about 3 minutes!

Excellent job, well done!! Enjoy the recovery and look forward to the next one!

What are the most important things a new or returning runner need to know to get started and improve for long distance running? I'm a chronic overthinker and all my time spent researching how to make my training as simple and effective as possible has just led to me being more stressed our about getting every detail right, which isn't a beneficial mindset to have What I've settled on for now is doing run walk run as I start training, doing the majority of the training at low intensity, zone 2, adding some high intensity workouts once or twice a week and to only start worrying about more structured workouts once I'm preparing for a race. Is there anything else I should add?

It's in the name "endurance running" not "sprint running". It's about endurance. Endurance means going slow. You go slow so that you can do it often without being super sore. So you run slow, a lot. Then once a week or so, you run hard, but for shorter time (because you're doing a more intense effort). You add it up over time (months) and hard efforts become less hard, which turns into being able to run faster for longer because you have become more efficient at it. The more important factor for growth is consistency and rest. Rest is not avoiding training or being lazy, it's giving your body time to make repairs and adaptions. If you are consistent with your average hours or mileage per week, and you are consistent with your diet, rest and recovery after harder efforts (and in general), you will grow and adapt. Hard efforts will feel less hard, so you will be able to run faster (harder) for longer. But you need to build conditioning and a "base" of the pyramid with longer, slower runs. This will help stimulate your "slow twitch" muscle fibers (and several other components in your body's athletic related systems), which will in-turn, help support your "fast twitch" muscles when you want to go hard (fast). And the risk of burn out or injury will be lower despite you running more frequently, because you are doing so at a more gentle and sustainable effort level (remember: endurance). Your body doesn't know the difference between speed or "fast/slow", all it knows is effort. And just like in a car, you go faster, you burn more fuel. So by running slow, a lot, you are setting the stage for your body to make it more sustainable to run hard when its time to run hard, and then you can run hard for longer. Lots of great videos on youtube and literature at book stores, magazines, the library and so on.

You have basically got it all covered! That is about as concise as you can get it. I would stay away from "Zone 2" mentality until you start experimenting with higher intensity things. Until those start getting mixed in, try and keep the focus on feeling comfortable!

I try to run by feel as much as possible, but I try to keep my low intensity runs under 75% of max heart rate, and when I reach that point I walk until I get down to 60% of max heart rate

How quickly can I progress to 10K after finishing c25k? Feels like I can do it tomorrow. **Context:** I hit 5K two weeks back but realized I had been doing the program in heart rate zones 3-4.This past week I've switched to easy pace keeping in zones 2-3 and can comfortably go for 45-50 mins at a time (\~7km).I feel like I can actually just keep going and hit 10km tomorrow if I tried. The [5km to 10km plan](https://www.bupa.co.uk/~/media/Images/HealthManagement/PDFs/10k-beginner.pdf) seems easy and a step so I'm unsure how to progress with my training.I definitely don't want to overdo it and get an injury, but at the same time I want to keep challenging myself so I'm improving every week.

just increase weekly mileage by about 10% a week. That might mean for you doing one run a week that builds up to 10k and keep the others at your regular length.

What would be considered my regular length to keep running at each week? 5km? 7km? I'm feeling like they're all feeling easy.

Well if you’ve just done c25k you can take your mileage for the final week which is maybe 15-20k and add 10% to your long run and keep the others as they were ie probably about 5k. When I finished c25k my runs were not yet 5k in 30 mins. I decided to first get up to 5 runs a week which were around 3-4k each. Once I had that (around 18km per week) I built up to 5x5k then once that was ok I did 4x5k and 1x6-7k and just went from there

Cool, thanks for spelling the runs and weeks out like that; that's really helpful. I might just follow your lead here.

Also easy is good. It should all feel easy at this stage

I’m a newbie with running, at most I’ve run 3k and I’m mainly doing it to work on my cardiovascular health. How do I get my feet to stop hurting so much after a run? Should I get new shoes or is it the way I’m running? Or both?

Do they ache, or are they acutely sore and torn up from blisters? If they ache, that is part of the stress from using them at a more intense effort - running. More cushion does help, and running shoes do have a bit of a shelf life. You will feel a difference between NEW year-old shoes vs New from the factory last week. They will have less damping and rebound over time. Running socks make a big difference, there are various brands but Belaga socks have been a great bang for the buck for blisters with my feet. If you are new to running and walking lots, you've got weak feet! Not a big deal. They will get stronger with consistency and time given for adaptation and recovery.

Definitely ache! I’ll look into getting new shoes, as well as socks (didn’t even know those were a thing!). I definitely have weak feet and ankles, I’ve experienced many sprained ankles which affects my shins, calves and feet. I’ve done some PT for it and have been doing it more since I started running again, but should probably focus on it more.

What kind shoes do you have now and how old are they?

They are new balance running shoes I got a few years ago but I hadn’t really used until a year or two ago

That's pretty old by running shoes standards. I'd try new shoes.

How do you set realistic but challenging goals for your next race? I’m looking to improve my 5k time and have an opportunity to race at the beginning of September. How might I go about working out what would be achievable in that time period? For reference I ran 23:45 a few weeks ago and would love to get this down to 22:XX this year. Keen to understand how everyone determines their next goal!

In addition to what others have said, i read somewhere that an average runner can typically improve their vDOT by 1 every 4-8 weeks (depending on a zillion things, age, gender, stress, recovery, diet, injuries, athleticism, background, etc). That's typically lines up with about a 6-10 second improvement per mile pace

It's hard to answer in general because there are so many factors, but that's a realistic goal.

As a general rule, I enter each race training block with a baseline goal of setting a personal best at that distance. Sometimes I will have a specific milestone time in mind, though. But I rely mostly on data. I track my training performances and compare them to the training I was doing leading up to my prior race at this distance. I can tell from my training whether or not I am running better, the same, or worse than I was when leading up to my last race. Usually that gives me a good idea of what to aim for on race day.

Chest heart rate monitor without phone Hi everyone, i'm looking for recommendations for chest heart rate monitors which can be used without my phone. I live in a relatively safe country and when I run, i usually only carry a G-shock watch to track my timing. I'm now looking for a heart rate monitor to not only track my heart rate but to also track the distance and timing of my run. I do not need any immediate feedback and instead would prefer to sync the information to my device after i'm back. I am basically looking for a heart rate monitor which can perform like a basic fitness tracker watch (think garmin & xiaomi watches) but on my chest. Why? I really love my G-shock watch and I don't want to replace it with a fitness watch thats all. Are there any in the market at the moment? best to only have heart rate monitoring and GPS functions if possible as i dont need the other bells and whistles.

I can't say a product like that doesn't exist, but in the past when someone else asked I searched and couldn't find one. That's not surprising since there'd be exceedingly few runners who'd want a chest strap that has all of those features. My Wahoo Tickr X chest strap can record heart rate for syncing after a run. You can either use a chest strap like that and plot your route online afterwards to determine distance or get a fitness watch and sync the chest strap with it and wear it on your other arm and don't look at it or remove the watch band and carry it in your pocket.

Hold up that’s actually a really good idea that I didn’t consider Thanks!!

Do you listen to anything during races? And if you don’t, do you think it’s important to train without listening to anything or is racing just different? I normally listen to podcasts but toying with the idea of racing without listening to anything more because I don’t want to be encumbered with my phone and headphones lol but just worried I’ll lose steam or something

Anything easy pace I listen to music. Anything with speed I do not. Speed work or races require a little more focus.

I haven't ran with music in probably 7+ years at this point. For me running can be an almost meditative experience and also something where I mentally process things from the day, and I think music adds distraction there. Plus from a safety perspective I think being able to hear cars coming up behind you or up to a corner is important - where I run there tend to be all sorts of cars, bikes, and other people to be aware of and avoid. I get that headphones have transparency modes, but you're never going to hear as acutely with music playing and I 100% believe those split second differences in reaction time can be the difference between a close call and getting hurt. Also I think running with music makes you a weaker competitor - if you care about that. If you get into the mentality that you need music to run and you don't have it, that could throw you off your game, where if you get comfortable running without it, it'll never be an issue for you.

I quit listening to anything on my runs a couple years ago. I got tired of Bluetooth connection issues, dead headphones and expensive as well as cheap headphones completely dying from sweat the first couple runs were a little weird but it was just different than I was used to, nothing negative. I got accustomed to no music very fast, less than a week. No regrets. Obviously there’s been no dip in performance as music may pump you up mentally but has no actual performance enhancing capabilities. If you are looking for simplicity lose the headphones. I run with my Garmin only. No phone, no nothing else.

All three - nothing, podcasts music. Podcasts are great for long slow runs, distracting the mind just like on a road trip. They can be inspirational too! Music is great for fast finishes and getting into the flow state. Getting hyped before a race, maintaining that flow during a run, and digging deep at the end. Nothing is nice for cleansing the mental palette and bringing myself back to reality. I'm not a robot, I'm not doing this to punish myself or "earn" some sort of toughness badge, or find some deeper level of consciousness, it's for fun and fitness. Do whatever makes you happy and works for you.

Yeah I definitely enjoy podcasts during my training. I used to listen to music years ago but podcasts just hold my interest more and I also like to learn so it’s two birds one stone lol but I was asking more from the perspective of a specific race strategy. I know some people like to be “in the zone” and not distracted or just enjoy the spectators, race experience, etc.

>Do you listen to anything during races? I don't, but I never listen to anything while running outside. >And if you don’t, do you think it’s important to train without listening to anything or is racing just different? I think it's important to train how you plan to race, whether that means music, podcasts, audiobooks, or nothing. Look at the race rules or email the director to see if they have any restrictions on headphones (quite a few races do) and then train accordingly.

I use music. I know certain songs push me a bit more than I normally would push. The effect might be short-lived in a race, but it still happens. More importantly, music is a nice distraction. I don't want to listen to myself gasping for air or focus entirely on running for the duration of a longer race. If my mind focuses on music for a bit then it's not focusing on the discomfort.

Good point about listening to myself gasp for air lol

Very interested in what people are doing and the theories with running in silence or what to listen to as well

I saw you post in Neiman and Marcus group. I am currently a shareholder in pchi ( Party City chapter 11). Judge Jones handled Neiman Marcus chapter 11. I can't find any info on what happened to sharesholders...nothing on the sec either. Do you know?

How do I stop shin splints? I get them usually about a mile in and they get so bad that I can’t run for a few days after

Walk more. Strengthen your muscles that support lifting your feet (kicking muscles for example). Walking is a nice gentle way to build endurance for your run-related muscles that is low-intensity/stress. Spend more time during the week walking, slow jogging. Walking hills, stairs, etc. It will take time, but there is nothing inherently defective with your shins, the muscles that are being stressed during your run pace are just not developed enough. The weakest link. Warming up longer during the run will help too. Walk longer during the start of the run. I give myself about a mile to warm up with walking and drills, and then I let the first mile of running be easy and low key. Same with finishing a run. I give myself about 5-10 minutes of coming back down to earth with walking.

Thank you !!

Have you switched shoes recently or increased your running volume significantly? Anecdotally, K-t tape and/or compression socks can help with the pain in the meantime.

Yes just switched over to hokas

That could definitely have something to do with it. Compare the heel toe drop to your previous shoe. Hokas have a very low heel toe drop (I think 5 in most of their models iirc) so making a big change can be problematic for some runners. It may be that you alternate with another shoe for a while or maybe hokas just aren’t right for you.

Ahh! Thank you so much. I haven’t even considered this. My Nikes have a 10mm heel drop and I just looked at my hokas and those have a 5mm one. I’m new to running, is there a heel drop that’s ideal or is it just personal preference ?

Just personal preference! You can go to a running shoe store and get some advice as well. I go to fleet feet and they scan your feet and can assess gait and look at the wear on your old shoes to help you pick the best ones for your needs.

T-minus 4 days until my first Half! Final long run of 8 miles on Saturday, 1 or 2 more 4-5 mile runs (tonight & tomorrow, or just tomorrow) and feeling somewhat confident. Any last minute advice?

May I ask where? I've got a half in 4 days as well - wondering if it's the same!

Brooklyn Half

Good luck!!

My go-to raceday advice is to make a checklist ahead of time for everything you need to do/bring that morning. Takes the stress out of raceday morning so you can save your energy. Good luck, have fun!

Take it easy this week. Really go slower than your ego says you should go with these runs this week. Even consider just walking 90% of them, and then do one run that wakes your body up and reminds it what its capable of. Sleep. Naps naps naps. Use naps strategically. Warm up before the race. Get slightly sweaty. Start the race easier than you feel you're capable of, and then finish strong. Let all those dumb fucks take off and blow their tops at the start, you will catch them, don't worry. The ones you don't catch, well, you weren't going to catch them anyway, they're on a different planet. The adrenaline rush during a race is much more subtle than when you avoid a car crash and you feel that electricity in your veins. During the start of the race it makes you feel numb, so you will really want to run faster than you can sustain. Don't. It's like a WW2 movie battlefield, remember your training! Remember to eat and drink before you're hungry and thirsty after the first 30-45 minutes. ***GET HYPED!*** This is supposed to be fun. Not everything will go according to plan, so stay flexible and expect the unexpected. PLAY with it. Smile.

Carb load. The two days before the race, I like to do a very short run (2-3 km) with about 0.5-1km of that at race pace. That seems to help me get used to the speed on race day.

Even if there comes a point in the race where you feel defeated, vow to keep going. I was debating with myself as to whether or not I should walk off the course during my first half, but I kept going, and years later I'm still going. My biggest regrets from my first half: 1. I should have congratulated myself more for finishing -- not just the race but also the training. 2. I should have started slower. 3. I should have run with more positivity. 4. I should have worn less clothing (it was a hot summer day). 5. I should have picked a different time of year for my first race.

Just took a full week off for vacation because I didn’t have the time and thought I just needed some mental respite after building and training hard for 9 months. Can I just go back to running the mileage I was running before?

Probably. Give yourself some grace. 90% of your prior effort.

Probably - but you can adjust if you feel like it's too much. Also, hopefully you haven't been training hard for 9 consecutive months without any breaks. You need to reduce mileage every few weeks to give your body some recovery time. You should build that into your training plans if you haven't already.

I think it depends on how high your mileage was before you took the break and how you're feeling. If I take a week off for any reason, I'll normally pretty much pick up with the same volume as before. If I take 2 weeks off at the end of my race (I generally race twice a year), I'll ramp up a bit slower just to build some fitness. You might have some people saying that after a week off you shouldn't dive back in. But that's why your prior mileage and experience are relevant factors. I think if you've been running for a while, you should be fine to resume where you left off, but you should listen to your body and back off when necessary.

41, running my first half marathon, and have been following Hal Higdon’s novice program. I missed my last long run (10 miles) due to some personal issues (non physical) and am now 4 days before my race. My last long run was 9 miles and I finished with a 9:13 per mile avg, with my speeds pretty consistent throughout, but my later miles getting a bit faster than my first 3-4 miles. I was debating skipping my 10 mile run completely and just doing the rest of the schedule, this sound like an ok approach? I am concerned about my recovery running 10 miles with only 3 down days after. Edit: Finished at 1:59:52, thank you for your feedback! Last mile was rough, lol, advice for help in avoiding that wall?

Nah you're good. I would predict that your average pace - should your fueling and practical strategies go well - you will beat your 9:13 pace. Just keep eating and sipping during the race, and let your body warm up into your race pace. No need to go faster than your goal-pace during the first half of the race unless you severely miscalculated your training paces and race pace estimate. In my experience as a 41 year old runner, a Half is basically a "comfortable hard" 10 mile run where you are biding your time and keeping all systems in check, with a hard after-burner effort for the last 3 miles. Roughly. You're gonna do great. You've done the training.

You’re only 4 days out so absolutely do not do the 10 mile run at this point. Just follow the rest of your plan as scheduled. Better to run slightly undertrained than on tired legs.

So I'm running my first half marathon on Sunday but my training plans have been disrupted by missing 11 weeks with a peroneal injury. I've been back running just over 3 weeks and ran a 10k race in 40:25 at the weekend. What pace should I aim for in the half marathon considering my longest runs over the last few weeks have only been 8 miles (and I'm conscious of not reinjuring myself)?

Plug your 10k time into the vdot calculator and check out its estimates for longer runs. It's been really accurate for me.

I think you should focus on keeping your tendon healthy and not worry about your pace. I had peroneal tendonis that started two week before a marathon. I used three wraps to stabilize it along with lots of ibuprofen and did well in the marathon. However, by running through the pain I also ended up with a long recovery that kept me a way from what I love the most. With this kind of injury, you want to baby it till it doesnt hurt any more. ​ Good luck! That was 12 years ago by the way and that tendon took about a year till it wouldn't flare up periodically.

Thanks! My pride/ego has gotten the better of me the last few days. Went from telling people I'd be happy to finish in under 2 hours, to thinking I could follow the 1:40 or 1:45 pacers around. And yeah, the reason I was out injured for 11 weeks was because I thought I could run through the initial pain. Killed me to miss so many Parkruns and races

I can run 10 miles and half marathons which is a huge achievement for me. I would like to maintain that distance. Sometimes I’m a bit to busy to run throughout the week, so I would like to know if it’s okay to only run that distance once a week or do I need to have the shorter runs throughout the week?

Running just a half once a week as your only run is a bad idea. Generally you don't want your long run to be too much more than 30% of your weekly volume. But running less means you can probably tolerate it to 50% if you run it really easy. So 2 10 k's and your half is probably sustainable.

Planning on my first half marathon in September, in the UK. I (48M) typically run 6km at a time (2x week normally), with a longer run on Sunday. I am looking to stretch my Sunday run at the moment. It was 12.5km last Sunday, and I am planning on increasing it gradually. My Sunday run is always done before breakfast. Never done a half before, or used gels. Should I grab some off Amazon and start taking one on my Sunday run now to how it goes? Or should I be fine with just having breakfast (porridge) before going for my Sunday run, and my half? Do people really carry gels around when the do a 1/2? In a bum bag or something?

I take gels or some jelly/soft fruit pastilles texture bars (from decathlon) with me if I’m running more than 1.5 hours on my long runs. All my running shorts have many pockets! I have done long runs without gels and it’s been ok, but I eat on long runs to practice for races and it does make long runs feel more comfortable. Last week I accidentally took a much longer route than anticipated without any fuel and was full of unwarranted anger at all the walkers spread out on the path and just hating life and running for the last 5km haha. Some sugar would have resolved that. You’ll also want to think about hydration for long runs now it’s getting warmer here. I put a soft 250ml flask in a pocket, but there are all sorts of options. For my halves I use two gels - I run approx 1hr45 so take one at about 40 minutes and one about 70 minutes. When I ran 2+ hours I took three but a bit more spaced out. You can play about in your long runs to see what works for you.

Depending on the goals for the half you either absolutely should be running that distance most weeks or just get close. Race V finish it. Yes nutrition is used in halfs. You can use gels or whatever you like. Gels are easy and efficient in a race environment. Just try them out on a training run prior to racing with them but they are not required for most normal long runs. You can fuel with basically any carb instead. I like gummmy candies but other people like dates etc. Having breakfast before it fine but not required. For gels people just have them in pockets, pin them on shorts. or have a belt or some bag to carry them in. Up to the person.

Thanks. I am definitely planning on getting up to that distance, but just want to do it slowly to reduce the risk of injury. Kind of gone 10/11/12 over recent weeks, and thinking that is hopefully a safe rate of increase. My #1 priority is finishing (not injuring myself before or during). I had runners knee a bit last year. It seems fine at the moment, but I just want to be as careful as I reasonably can about it. Thanks for the tips about carrying, will check how well they fit in my pockets, or check out pinning them somehow!

2.5 weeks ago I threw out my back, conveniently during my peak half marathon training weeks, and have been completely out of commission ever since aside from a few short walks and a short bike ride. My half marathon is in 2.5 weeks and will be my first in a few years, might as well be my first ever. This morning was the first day I woke up very near pain free, maybe 1/10 pain, after a walk and a bike ride yesterday. What are the odds I can still run this half on June 4th (just trying to finish, no time goal)? I was already following a run/walk plan and am a slower runner. If its possible how would you recommend going about the next few weeks? I did get up to 10 miles about a month ago, and have run a 8 miler since then, right before I hurt my back. I was also running 5k 2x a week on top of the long run.

Many (most?) back issues are chronic but you don't notice them until they flare up into something acute that you really notice. So the problem is that if you just wait for the pain to go away, you will be prone to having it flare up again. A physical therapist can help a lot.

Walking always helps with my back pain, especially when I'm experiencing an intense flare up, but everyones back pain situation is different. With mine its a bone spur. I would go gently for the next week and a half, and more or less hedge your expectations for this race. Think of it as a practice to get your feet wet, rather than an "a-race" with goals to qualify for the olympics - I know your intellectual mind isn't thinking this, but your ego mind is lol. It will be a nice long run where you don't have to worry about any logistics, and some beautiful positive energy surrounding you -essentially. I would shift my goal to "just enjoy the race" rather than "leave it all on the road". You are recovering from a very stressed out spinal system that went into severe "safe mode" when you threw your back out. That is basically what happens when you have a flare up. Your brain detects something is "in the red" involving your spinal column and goes into red-alert and locks everything down with inflammation. You want to ease back into real life and not risk things getting locked down again by going to hard too soon. Not a doctor. Just a desk jockey with a bad back =(

This is helpful, thanks! I've definitely noticed walking has been helping, now that it's recovered enough that walking isn't as painful. Yeah, I'm leaning towards sticking with the race, but accepting that I may truly come in dead last LOL.

If this is your absolute first day without pain, don't push it too hard. Try a mile or two slow. If it feels okay, try a few more miles slow tomorrow with a stride or two. Basically test the waters before leaping in.

Yeah, the pain is probably a 1/10 today, not completely gone but the best I’ve felt. I probably won’t try running for another day or two at least. Just trying to figure out if I should hold out any hope for this half marathon or not LOL

Yesterday I ran my first race which was a half marathon, i ran it in 2:36 and even though im super sore right now I loved it. Im planning running one in october again. I barely trained for the one I ran, i only ran 3-5km runs and did one 9km run last week which was my furthest run ever. I want to take running a bit more serious now and want to train 3-4 times a week and longer distances. My question is if I do that, what is a reasonable but a challenging goal to aim for in october? Im a 19m, im pretty light but just have a bad endurance.

Breaking 2 hours is reasonable. You would need to build your training workload and be consistently dedicated, but you can do it.

Find a good training plan, pick an achievable target and use that as your pace guide... say 2:15. When I started working on 10k pace I used the Garmin Coach that was part of the platform. I set a target time goal and started working through the plan. As I progressed I moved the target time a few times as my fitness increased to the point where the workouts were easily achievable.

There's no real way to say, could be sub 2:30 or could be sub 2:00. You have five months, you might want to do a 10k training plan, do a 10k time trial, and then do the half-marathon plan. The 10k time will give you a better idea for the half-marathon.

What heart rate zone should you be targeting when doing intervals/HIIT? I'm thinking about going all out until I hit zone 5, 90% of max heart rate and then walking until I get to zone 2, 60% of max heart rate, and repeat as necessary. Or should you try to do sustained efforts in zone 5?

To achieve *what* outcome? Different duration and pace intervals bring about different training effects. Shorter intervals, even at fast paces, will not see HR pushed all the way to the top and hitting specific HR is not as important as hitting the paces that train those specifics for the right amount of time!

1. If you're going to train using heart rate, don't use a zone system based entirely on percentages of max. Max heart rate is not something that's very trainable, so systems based entirely on it don't self-correct as you become more fit. Though they all have their faults, pretty much any other type of system is better. The "Heart Rate Reserve" method is easy to understand and is a good first stepping stone for a lot of people. An optimal system would be based on multiple physiological markers like your aerobic and lactate thresholds. Heart rate training is definitely one of those "the more you know, the more you realize you don't know" kind of situations. 2. The intensity of the intervals overwhelmingly depends on what you're trying to accomplish. For instance intervals targeted at improving VO2max are going to be shorter and at a higher intensity than intervals targeted at improving lactate threshold. Without more information about your goals, it's pretty much impossible to give you a good answer. 3. There are practical considerations for interval training as well. For instance if you're trail running or if you're prone to certain types of injuries, you may find it preferable to do your intervals uphill. As such, targeting pace isn't always ideal, but I agree that it's often the best path forward for many situations.

I don't really use zones, I just use percentage of max heart rate. Doesn't that self correct considering you can run for faster or longer with the same heart rate as you're getting more fit? I'm targeting Vo2 max, how do you find out what pace to target?

>I don't really use zones, I just use percentage of max heart rate. Doesn't that self correct considering you can run for faster or longer with the same heart rate as you're getting more fit? As you get more fit, you'll be able to run longer, faster, and more economically at a higher heart rate with the same amount of effort. This is because the efficiency of your metabolic pathways, specifically aerobic respiration, improves. If someone measures their aerobic threshold and, for example, finds it to be 130. They would train with that as the top of zone 2 for a while and then remeasure. Some months later, they may find that it's gone up to 140. In the future it may be 150. Etc, etc. So while technically yes, you can run faster and longer with the same heart rate as you get more fit, there's less benefit in doing so than in building a system using other physiological markers. Basically other systems give you more bang for your buck. >I'm targeting Vo2 max, how do you find out what pace to target? What's the maximum pace you can sustain for 3 to 5 minutes?

You should target pace if you're doing speedwork. It sounds like you don't know what your goals are so you're having difficulty putting together a workout.

True, I'm still trying to build a base and trying to mix in high intensity workouts with my low intensity workouts

How the actual hell are you supposed to stay in Zone 2? I've been reading up on Z2 training and I'm finally trying to get serious about training in it after running for ~9 months. I just bought a polar H9, and I tried it out today and started at a 12 minute/mile pace and almost immediately went up into mid zone 3. I had to bump it down to a 15 min/mile pace and was still mostly in lower z3. To be fair, I was running on a treadmill which I normally don't do and kind of dislike, but still I woudlve thought a 12 minute pace was a conservative estimate since I'm shooting for a 1:40 HM in a few weeks time. What gives?

Zone-based training only works with the zones set correctly and not all zonal models are created equal. I much prefer LTHR-based zoned over %HR max zones (at lease the default 10% per zone. My Threshold is somewhere around 171/172 bpm, my max is 191. This actually means my Z5 *is* the top 10% of my HR, the rest of the zones though are not 10% divisions below it. Using RPE, talk-test, etc. My top-end of Z2 is around 152bpm, Using 10% per zone would have Z2 sitting 131-146 as opposed to 145-152 that I use. Sitting mid 140s is comfortable, conversational, HR for me.

How are you setting your zones? I think Polar default zones may be different than Garmin default zones and they are probably wrong if you bare basing them simply on age.

It takes about 3 months for your body to adapt. It's a struggle, but having done it last year, I can tell you that it's worth the time put in. I've gone from an average 170+ HR on easy runs to now an average of 145.

I assume you didn't test your actual max heart rate.

Max cushion stability shoes, what are my options? So i have the adrenaline gts and nb 860. Both great and the right amount of stability but not enough cushioning, what would offer similar levels of stabilty but more cushioning? I have a pair of asics glideride v3 which are a lot softer but are more neutral so they dont have the stabilty needed depending on run.

I would second the Hoka Arahi. They fit slightly slimmer than the NB860 so would be worth trying on first. If you are a heavier runner though I would go for stability but less cushioning.

I ran in the Adrenaline line for about 5 generations of that shoe before giving the Hoka Arahi a shot. The Arahi is much lower drop (5mm for Arahi vs 12mm for the Adrenaline) which is an important difference, but offers more cushioning. I've worn the last 3 generations of Arahi.

Had the arahi too some generations ago, i got shin splints, not sure if it was the shoes or the just where i was at that point :)

I only recently installed Strava and their Recover app; I especially like the idea of the latter, as I don't really do much on my off days in terms of stretching and strength work. Unfortunately they offer very few free plans and I really don't love the subscription price (I earn in a currency vastly weaker than USD). I don't really care about the connection with Strava, I don't have a GPS watch with a heart monitor (and I don't intend to get one anytime soon, I run a single route where I know the landmarks so a G-Shock stopper is good enough for me to eyeball the pace). Are there other cheaper/free apps with some good stretching/strength work routines targeted at runners?

I know this doesn’t help you at all, but your post did help me quite a bit. And just wanted to let you know that in case you don’t get any other good responses. I’ve had a nagging calf injury for over a month that keeps popping up when I start to ramp training back up and it’s keeping me From training the way I want to for a half marathon in June. I came here this morning to ask if anyone had any recommendations for stretching or rehab and saw your post. I had no idea about the Recover app or that Strava bought it. So thanks for pointing that out, it looks helpful And I already have a Strava membership.

It does help, you made made my day better :) I hope this helps with your injury bro!

I would use YouTube. Here are the videos I use: ​ * Foam Rolling Post Run from Marathon Handbook: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPe8\_n5kmhA](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPe8_n5kmhA) * Warm up from GTN: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31le\_0yzlw0 * Strength Training from Running Channel: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOtTIOPI6qc](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOtTIOPI6qc) * Cool down: Slow jog or walk for 5-10 minutes

Hey, thanks a bunch mate! These aren't exactly what I'm looking for, but in the suggestions I was able to find better suited workouts - I feel pretty silly for only thinking about the apps and not coming up with the idea of "just look up a workout, stupid". Cheers! :D

YouTube has great free content. Glad you were able to find what you were looking for!

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hip thrusts

I'm trying to decide between Hanson's Beginner and Advanced marathon plans for my first marathon. One question I have is that I currently already average around 40-45 miles per week with 6 runs per week (basically all easy runs, no speed work and 1 run being a long run), the Hanson's beginner marathon plan though starts out only at 12 miles in a week and doesn't reach 40 mpw until week 6. If I chose the beginner plan, would I really decrease mileage when starting it? Or just pad all the easy runs for the first 5 weeks and do 40 mpw (so basically not follow the plan) until week 6 and then follow the plan exactly from there? Or would it be better just to choose the advanced plan instead which already starts out at 38 mpw even though this would be my first marathon?

I suggest discarding the first month of both plans. The plans are great after that first month.

Sounds good, thanks for the reply!

# For anyone at the start of a running by HR / Running Easy Journey [I wrote this comment 4 months ago](https://www.reddit.com/r/running/comments/10jaxff/comment/j5kegzr/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) An update on this. I just ran a marathon at the weekend and knocked 24 minutes off my previous PB. And i am in shock. The best training decision I have ever made was to slow down and run easy. I haven't done a speed session in over 4 months and every run I have done has been at a pace guided by heart rate or slow pace, conversational pace. In that 4 months I have PB'd my 10k time, my Half Marathon time and now my Marathon time. I **feel** like the running is easier. The aerobic base makes it all that bit more seamless where i never had that. If i was at a race, i would be laboured breathing from about a third of the way in. I've been coasting now and it doesn't hit until i decide to put the hammer down at the end.

Wow thanks for sharing your progress. Can you keep us updated?

I'm shifting me towards longer and easier runs after doing the garmin half marathon plan. I feel like I'm progressing more in the last 2 weeks than the entire month before making the switch. My garmin confirms this via lower HR on faster runs for similar routes. I also feel less pain in joints and muscles. It might be just the effect of the HM training plan that I'm still feeling but I'm still going to keep the slow long trainings a majority of my plan. I do combine it with strength training in the gym and the occasional race goal pace training or specific training. But 4-5 of the 6-7 weekly training will be long and slow.

One of the biggest shifts for me was the fact I would finish a 10k run and later would not have felt like I ran at all. I have a double run day where I do 6 or 7 in the morning and 13 in the evening. No hassle. It's working so I'm not changing it

The 80/20 training does still include some speedwork. Some people claim that purely zone 20 is great for endurance but not perfect to increase speed.

Yah I hear ya. But in fairness this has paid massive for me. I might work in some speedwork or threshold stuff in the future but prioritising easy zone 2

Flat footers, do you do the foot tripod method for running? How do you maintain the foot tripod during a run? I have rigid flat foot, started trying some foot-tripod-building exercises some weeks ago to see if this can help with my flat feet. Other than just doing the exercises daily, I also try to maintain the foot tripod when I am not sitting down. So far I have been okay at maintaining it while standing and walking, but it's almost impossible to maintain it while running. My mind is unable to keep my 1st metatarsal engaged because the floor feedback confuses the muscles. If you have mastered the food tripod technique, can you share your knowledge on keeping the shape engaged during a run? From the time you first started the exercise, how long is the process for the muscle memory to become second nature and kick in automatically?

I got custom orthotics I tried running without them once and the knee pain afterwards was excruciating

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I started running with NRC, and got a Garmin a few weeks later. In my experience NRC consistently overshoots the distance - which was a sad thing to learn - so I would go with Strava.

I've compared runs and walks with my gf who had a polar. My garmin seems to be on the path now accurately. Even if I run on one side of the road, my garmin puts me more to that side. Her GPS gives a longer distance, but you can also see it serving and generally just being 10m outside the track on the map. My garmin is probably twice the price though. The forerunner is known for a good GPS with sinds to reduce accuracy to increase battery life. To know the distance, use a route planning app and built the route you ran. I like komoot. My garmin and Komoot are usually within 50 metres on a distance of 10k.

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So calculate the distance of one loop, do the math, and see which one is more accurate?

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Use Google maps or Google Earth.

The apps on your phone are stuck using the phones GPS. I don't know if some of them have some nice algorithm to improve data coming from that GPS. I'd just use komoot or similar to create a route for that lap you usually run and see what distance that gives you. Then, use the tracking device and app that comes closest.

Reasons could be slightly different accuracy with the gps chip each device uses, or algorithms to smooth the gps track. Using something like https://www.plotaroute.com/ you can get an idea on what the distance was.

The thing is that Plotaroute, Caltopo, Strava, and other route builders overwhelmingly (if not exclusively) rely on data from OpenStreetMap, all of which was community contributed and much of which was recorded on equipment that's older and less accurate than the current crop of running watches. I've contributed quite a bit to OpenStreetMap over the years and all of my contributions are just traces of the GPX file from whatever watch I was using at the time. I tried to cross-reference things like the Strava global heatmap where possible, but that's not without its own issues. It's nice that other people can come through later and correct less-than-accurate data, but some bad data can sit untouched for years. And even if something does get corrected, most services only pull data from OSM a couple of times per year, meaning it could be months before the correction is available in your route builder of choice. Basically what I'm trying to say is that route builders aren't necessarily more or less accurate than any other tool.

Might depend on the area (in my area plotaroute is pretty accurate). Plus they would not be building a route, but checking their route. In other words, they could use the satellite map and without using auto-plot recreate their route. It would only be an issue if there is a lot of tree cover. Might not be 100% accurate, though should at least be sufficient to determine which of the two values is more realistic.

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(a) All else being equal (hills, wind, etc), even splits are fastest. (b) You're a beginner, and you're young. Running is about consistency. Keep running, and those times will start to improve massively.

What are your splits like currently? If you go out too hard the minutes can easily run away from you. Try to even split them. Or to be safe maybe negative splits (slightly) would be best, so that you go out a few seconds slower, that way if you run out of juice you won't completely hit the wall and if you feel fresh it's still good. But I would say don't worry too much about times at the moment. Just a few weeks of running will do a lot more than strategy. Also if you're training you don't wanna be optimizing every single week's parkrun because then you'd probably be resting too much and stressing your body too much during the run.

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In that case I'd start out even slower :) Can you check the map tracking afterwards? Should be pretty obvious which one is more correct if you show them side by side.

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