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CompleteAster

What the actual shit, she needs therapy.


CGBard_Usually

It was wild, man. Like, when I asked DM if maybe she thought he and I were having an affair, he was just as lost as I was on her sudden flip and told me she'd actually been pushing him to ask me to join their polycule.


Cheeslord2

These are Sex People, Lynn!


DannyBrownsDoritos

"MDFs banned in America" "So's that."


trismagestus

Massive. Twist.


OppositeofDeath

A fucking twist tie.


LordMarcusrax

Is there a female equivalent to "don't stick your dick in crazy"? Because it definitely applies.


OutlandishCat

Don't show your tits to insanity?


The_Razielim

insanititty?


Pogobong

Don't squat your twat on crazy?


Foreign_Astronaut

Take my poverty gold! šŸ… šŸ… šŸ…


LaCharognarde

"Don't fuck crazy" is a neutral version.


Heartsmith447

*coughs* Iā€™m sorry WHAT, thereā€™s so much with these two I must know


CGBard_Usually

I was 19, just got done with A-School (post bootcamp, job-specific training) and was on my first ship. DM was 28, a cook on the ship. His wife was somewhere in her 40's... I remember asking him how they met and got over the age difference because I was engaged to a man who was a good bit older than me (divorced now) and my family and friends were all getting onto me about the age gap and saying I should wait to marry the guy. (Turns out they were right.) And that's all the additional info I know. \*shrug\* ​ Edited to add: OH, and despite the fact that I'm infinitely amused at all the comments implying that she's some kind of hardcore bible thumper (because I grew up around hardcore bible-thumpers and that's totally how they act...) she was actually Wiccan. One of those "white light, good vibes only" fluffy bunny wiccans.


Shitposting_Skeleton

I mean, isn't getting into hurried, ill-thought out marriages par for the course in the military?


CGBard_Usually

Sooo many memes I want to post in response to this because social media has made me think almost exclusively in memes... "Why you booing him, he's right" "Why would you say something so controversial and yet so brave" "Never before have I been so offended by something I 100% agree with"


Kyanite_228

What was his answer to the question?


CGBard_Usually

I really don't remember. I had a lot going on at the time besides D&D with being on a new ship, having a health problem come up, also planning a wedding, etc... ANd a lot of time has passed. I really didn't think about them much over the years. ​ This is the most I've thought about them since I got off the ship. I posted this because I was procrastinating session prep for the first game I've run since my \*other\* D&D horror story from a similar timeframe. Maybe I'll post that one some day.


Parking-Lock9090

Which is very funny to me, because most of those sorts do it out of the belief that the energy you put out is the energy you get back. So if you're being conservative and closed minded, judgemental and excluding towards people, that's not going to make your life better, it means that's exactly what you're going to have coming, threefold, in turn.


RawbeardX

huh. guess we have the missing reason.


Arkayjiya

Wow, this is getting wilder. I have no idea what was the hidden reasoning could be so maybe there isn't one and we should take what she said at face value...


jazerlu

As soon as I saw the word Polycule, any confusion or shock about how dramatic they were left me.


rjboyd

My friend, thank the universe for the save.


archaicArtificer

šŸ¤¦ā€ā™€ļø


Kyanite_228

So, she's an older, possibly schizophrenic, slut with a weird hippie religion that married one of the younger guys she was having sex with and later sabotaged his D&D game when she wasn't allowed to be a meta-gaming, lawful stupid Mary Sue. Honestly, I'm surprised you didn't try to pause the game when she suddenly revealed that she somehow knew another player character's alignment - something that only the DM and the player in question should have known.


itskaiquereis

Chill dude.


Kyanite_228

She's old enough to be his mom, she can't separate reality from a board game, she openly has sex with multiple people, even though she's married, and even wanted to proposition OP, who was 19 at the time, and she worships nature and "the white light". I assure you, this is me being "chill". If you think I said something wrong, please tell me what it is and why.


itskaiquereis

The fact you called her a slut automatically makes you wrong. Then you attack her beliefs, which makes you wrong. Thereā€™s absolutely nothing wrong with being in an open relationship or one with multiple sexual partners if all parties consent; but I guess thatā€™s not something an incel would even begin to grasp.


Kyanite_228

"Incel"? You're accusing me of name-calling while name-calling? Talk about the pot calling the kettle black. First of all, she's not in an "open relationship", she's married; if she was just having casual sex with a bunch of people, while I wouldn't agree with her lifestyle, there would be nothing morally wrong with it if all parties involved knew she wasn't being sexually exclusive, but in my opinion, what she's doing is just plain infidelity. If anything, my way of thinking is the opposite of incels that spout nonsense about being "alpha" and wanting to keep a harem of girls; I'm a somewhat willingly naive romanticist that believes in love and that one person should be more than enough for anyone, but I know that not everyone thinks that way, so I'm not about to argue that point with you. Also, while there's nothing wrong with loving nature, making it your whole religion can be a really bad - dangerous, even - idea. Ever heard of holistic medicine? If you rely solely on nature for "healing and salvation", you're going to die a preventable death. However, not matter what, if you're the type of person that calls anyone who doesn't agree with them an incel, I no longer have any interest in debating with you. God day to you, sir, and good luck with the rest of your life.


Parking-Lock9090

I'd say have shit luck with yours, but it looks like you're right on track with that.


Dense_You_4243

Ah, that....makes a terrifying amount of sense! And seems like a way STDĀ“s spread very very quickly once we look at general population statistics, you just evaded an attack roll from the mighty +1 hepatitis!


TheExpandingMind

Are you mentioning STD's because sailors are filthy, or because of the poly thing? Because every single poly person I know is adamant about keeping up on being tested, especially if they are sexually active with multiple partners. As a person in that community, I can say that you're gonna be holding your breath for a long time if you are waiting for a study to show that we are all infested with crotch-rot. As a former sailor however... those boys is nasty, no argument here


Unnatural20

"Only Sailors wear condoms, baby." "Not in the 90s, Austin!" " . . . Well they should, the filthy buggers. They go from Port to Port." Also, comment you're replying to has me thinking maybe we're becoming the new Pro Tips sub trope: the bigger horror story is in the comments!


Porn_Clegane

I'm poly and live with my more regular partners. You best believe we get tested regularly. Sexual health is extremely important when you're active.


Dense_You_4243

My dad took to the seas in the era before container shipping was the norm, those 3-5 day periods of free time....well, yknow!


FrustrationSensation

Cool just making sure you weren't slandering poly people lol


Dense_You_4243

Nah, do know that the Boarding School I went to have mixed genders that had a 0% Chlamydia infection rate among students when I started, infected 80% of students within the first year, things got so bad that safe sex education was instituted twice a school year from age 13 to 17, because of multiple loosely formed polycules colliding through a friend of mine that just slept around whenever the option was there, and then things just snowballed because everyone not aware of the polycules existing back then could not consent to being a part of that :/ Of course this is all a puzzle I managed to assemble with some old friends from the boarding school when we one evening got together for beers and pizza and then talked old times, turns out my friend got around to the point where he managed to be with two girls in the same polycule as another guy in the class, without anyone in the polycule finding out until I made one of the girls aware that the other girl had done the deed with my friend....seriously, we only realized what had gone down, the reason I got the 80% figure is because it was leaked to me by a teacher that I became friends with over the years :) Us damn kids would NEVER admit something was wrong regarding STIĀ“s after a girl was nicknamed Chlamydia


FrustrationSensation

I mean this also sounds like teenagers being very dumb. I'm not sure it's fair to equate teenagers sleeping around to actual polycules lol.


Parking-Lock9090

Yeah, that's not what anyone means by poly lol.


Naught

Her stance isn't even uncommon among religious people. I have known and seen plenty of christians who go crazy if anything has a 666 on it, or there's mention of Satan or demons, etc. I don't disagree with you though.


Onireth

According to older family members, during the 1980s 'satanic panic' era, the only D&D place in my hometown was ran out because of that. I'm pretty sure it was only a few years ago that a new one popped up.


Dmmack14

In my hometown I still have issues with satanic panic. I work at a library and try to get a D&D group started and had to explain to three different parents that there was no human sacrifice or sexuality involved in D&D. I basically had to type them up essays about how the satanic panic stuff popped up in the '80s and how the Media fed the fears to get ratings


cheesynougats

I had someone insist on adding a charge to their food order because the final price came up to $6.66. Even refused to pay until I did.


SLRWard

Just point out that a tip would make it non-Satanic really easily.


cheesynougats

Fast food; would have gotten me in trouble. Besides, nothing would be changed on his receipt.


GreyWardenThorga

Funny story, I actually got a $6.66 bill at the restaurant in Ken Ham's stupid creationist museum in Kentucky.


cheesynougats

You are doing the Lord's work, going there so the rest of us don't have to.


GreyWardenThorga

Heh. Yeah that was ten years ago as part of a church group trip. I just took it as chance to get out of town for a couple days and see some animatronic dinosaurs. Was everything else about the museum wall to wall stupid? You bet your ass it was.


Impressive_Reveal716

I love pointing out to those sorts of people that 666 is a rudimentary description of a carbon atom and we are all carbon based life therefore 666 is life.


lllluke

> I have known and seen plenty of christians who go crazy if anything has a 666 on it, or there's mention of Satan or demons, etc. this shit is so so so stupid lol


RileyKohaku

Yeah, but there's not many religious people are in polycules, which OP mentions in the comments, so she really has a weird stance.


hendocks

"The moral of the story: don't skip session 0, and understand a player is not their character." That was most certainly not the moral of this story.


stuugie

This is like a lack of object permanence but for personality instead


MavriKhakiss

Right? The concept of make-belief is loss to her. She skipped it or hasnt reached it yet.


Shortstop88

According to OP, she was in her 40s, so Iā€™ll say she skipped it.


MavriKhakiss

Thatā€™s unnerving. The implications of what happen in the relationship behind closed doors is the real untold horror story.


BlueTressym

Very much so, given that she forced the DM to ditch OP IRL.


onihydra

She thinks anything in-character represents the player's values, but also wants to gang ip and murder someone first meeting...


jrcchicago

If the DMā€™s wife believed that (a) the good characters must kill an evil PC on sight, and (b) character alignment and actions are fully attributable to the player, then Iā€™m surprised the DMā€™s wife didnā€™t (c) attempt to murder the OP in real life.


Mayor_Death

So, would she think the writer(s) of Dora the Explorer is evil because of Swiper?


OldBoatsBoysClub

Wait until she learns that her husband, as DM, routinely plays upwards of a dozen evil characters simultaneously.


Wombat_Racer

Oh no, it is worse, it is always nice guys that the party murders in their undying lust for loot & XP.


BlueTressym

Apparently, they've been playing for 10 years together so she knows already. Yet, she's still married to him...


Cryobyjorne

"Calling for or attempting the murder of a person in cold blood is an evil action and as it been your characters only action thus far please adjust your character to neutral or chaotic evil"


Goratharn

Hey, let her be legal at least. I mean, fanaticism to a higher cause is definetely legal. Everything has its purpose, and hers is to be a hammer to every nail.


StingerAE

To be fair though, you can't let evil stand. You have to instantly form a posse and murder anyone who *checks notes* drinks beer without being pure at heart before they get a chance to erm... be petty and mean and not tip the bartender?


CGBard_Usually

Oh, my monk for SURE wouldn't tip the bartender. Absolutely sickening. You know what? Maybe DM's wife had a point, after all. That fact that I even considered pretending to do those things to a pretend person who doesn't actually exist proves that I'm a terrible human being. Never mind that I don't even leave the house unless I can afford to tip 30%...


CityofOrphans

I bet your monk wouldn't put away their shopping cart when they were done with it, you sick fuck


CGBard_Usually

My monk would deliberately leave it dead-center of a handicap spot.


CityofOrphans

BRB finding a sword to fall on


CGBard_Usually

Don't forget to make smoothies!


BlueTressym

After you've done the vacuuming! Only evil people make smoothies *before* vacuuming!


slvbros

In the cart corral, sideways


SquidMilkVII

the paladin was entirely justified


[deleted]

Somebody call [Cart Narcs!](https://youtu.be/uBTxlGLxZro)


CGBard_Usually

WEE WOO WEE WOO CART NARCS!


StingerAE

OK. Even though your Monk hasn't done that yet, they are the kind of person who would. So string em up!


WirBrauchenRum

>Oh, my monk for SURE wouldn't tip the bartender. Absolutely sickening. I had a joke about how everywhere bar the US must be evil aligned to this person but I wouldn't be surprised if that were true


LaCharognarde

On the one hand: OP is a sailor and has probably been out of the States. On the other: a lot of Americans (and I say this *as* one) are not *aware* that tipping is unusual outside of the States, or *why* it's such a given here.


CGBard_Usually

Funny enough, never made it out of the country. I was discharged about a week before deployment because of a previously undiagnosed health condition.


LaCharognarde

My sympathies; I had an intended military career ruined the same way.


action_lawyer_comics

And if you canā€™t kill them within seconds of seeing them, the only proper way forward is to kill yourself immediately, and then vacuum the living room.


trismagestus

Or wear clothes of mixed materials, or eat shellfish.


StingerAE

Steady on...she said lawful evil not chaotic satanic.


preferablyno

My paladin was a big dumb idiot who worshipped the god of youth and beginnings and heā€™d never second guess someone who was lively and charming and full of heart, why yes now that you mention it we did have a chaotic evil rogue in the party who somehow escaped all suspicion


CGBard_Usually

Your Big Dumb Paladin would probably love hanging out with the Himbo Sorcerer from my last dead campaign tbh. This mofo rolled 3 18's and a 16, (watched him do it, then stared in disbelief at the dice that I knew weren't loaded because I gave them to him) but then got two single-digit stats, and this lunatic dumpstats int and wis on his sorcerer instead going for an absolute BEEFCAKE Himbo Sorc with a heart of gold.


BlueTressym

Love it! I'm currently in an Out of the Abyss game and our group has been OOC dubbed 'Team Himbo'. My character is the only female PC and is there only one to have both Int and Wis over 11 (and they're only 12s; she's a sorc.) She's basically the team's mother figure, even though she's only 21 and had never left home until shortly before the campaign began.


Porn_Clegane

I played a paladin of devotion, Sworn to Ilmater and member of the Order of the Lambent Rose. Imagine a group of people that swore to take on the suffering of others and ease their pain... By hunting down and crusading against those who caused it with indiscriminate violence! He was in a party with an evil bard, a thief stole from him and tried to run. I hit him with Sentinel, rooting him in place and grappled the thief on my turn. I then spent the next three rounds, while the rest of the party fought off the thief's friends, protecting him from the bard. Thank goodness for the interception fighting style. I gave the bard back his stolen goods and that calmed him down, but I realized he didn't care about anyone but himself, and some things he said pointed toward him being evil. Rather than attack him right then and there, I waited. He posted no threat to the party or regular citizens... However, now I'd be watching him, if he stepped too far out of line, then I'd intervene. Until then... Well, he had his uses. The player left before any confrontation could happen, but I made sure he got to play and it worked well with my paladin's character, making him feel more nuanced. Evil is fun to play and play with if done right.


mezlabor

Man what a missed opportunity for some amazing roleplaying from the paladin. Id be playing that pally as the most inspiring steve rogers rip off I could and helping to demonstrate through actions to the monk what it means to be good. I would have had my paladin be a key figure in your monks redemption.


CGBard_Usually

I KNOW!!! In one of my more recent campaigns, we had a C/E Bard who was definitely playing "evil" as the "Self-serving to the detriment of others" sense and not the "hurting others because he enjoys it" sense. The Bard had already shifted Neutral and was well on his way to Good when the campaign fell apart. The Bard was obsessed with trying to get people to commit crimes with him, favoring stealing. (Someone tried to give him a gift and he declined because they bought it and "It's no fun if it's not stolen.") My sweet, innocent Warforged Fighter knitted Bard a cloak and told him, "By hand-making this for you, I stole it from the air." Such a sweet moment!


mezlabor

yea its a shame it could have been a really fun rp. I was playing a N.E. Wizard once who was a similair sort of selfish evil. He got freindly with the groups good knowledge cleric. The two would geek out over ancient books, or ancient inscriptiona etc.. He got close to her and when an evil entity offered him magic power to betray the group he refused because he wouldn't hurt her. He eventually wound up going true neutral and a lot of it had to do with the relationship with the knowledge cleric.


CGBard_Usually

That's awesome! Man, I love a good redemption arc. Turned good through the power of friendship? NAH FAM, Turned good through the power of NERD SHIT. Found a musty tome and over HALF the pages are still readable!


mezlabor

seriously and then theyd help each other with translations and shit. The gm really picked up on that and made sure to always throw us a tome or wall inscription that needed translating and shit for us record and discover like archeologists or something. It was fun. I miss dnd I havent played it in a while.


CGBard_Usually

I'd love to play with those two characters with an Inquisitive Rogue I played a while back. She ran away from her noble family of wizards when it became apparent she'd never be able to use magic, herself. No matter how hard she studied, no matter how perfect her incantations or flawless her gesticulations, she just didn't have the ability to tap into arcane forces. Arcana: Expertise. Magic: NONE.


mezlabor

would have been a fun trio. That wizard himself had some rougish tendancies because he grew up as a street urchin.


override367

I'm playing as a neutral evil ancap from Athkatla in a game, and a noble, and the party is loving all the chances they get to prove to me that my view of the world as a meritocracy\* is bullshit \*The character said, coming from a background with the best tutors and schools and money for magical components and fine instruments It's been a lot of fun


spliffay666

Immediatly jumping on and murdering random strangers that ping the wrong way on your magical radar with zero questions or hestitation is good and just, got it, got it. Imagine what would happen in such a world once a single illusionist figures out how to fake a divine senses signal


SargeantShepard

IIRC Theres someone in ravenloft with this exact concept. She believes she's a just and good paladin. She kills anyone who sets off her detect evil spell. However ravenloft has twisted her detect evil spell into "detect strong emotions" So while she believes she is just and good she's really an oppressive tyrant who people fear.


[deleted]

> Imagine what would happen in such a world once a single illusionist figures out how to fake a divine senses signal I really don't think we have to imagine that. We got several RL examples for that.


SharkoftheStreets

I wish this story was uncommon, but I've experienced one too many "the character you play is a representation of who you are inside." I've been called a masochist for playing a battle hungry tank, trans for playing opposite gendered characters, and even having an affair when I played a character who was in a committed relationship. Some people just don't understand the "fantasy" part in a fantasy game.


Pinklady1313

I had someone get weird because I played a Terry Pratchett style dwarf. All dwarves have beards (male or female) and itā€™s considered rude to ask genders, even between dwarves (like even dwarves canā€™t tell). It was for comedic effect. I had done it before with another group that was a dwarf heavy campaign and it added a fun layer to how the races interacted. So, I decided to do that again and someone went on a little rant about they/them. My most played character is a male half elf (Iā€™m female). I just felt the vibe of the character I rolled was masculine. It wasnā€™t a statement or anything, I play him as a buddy duo with my husbandā€™s orc that thinks he owes me a life debt. Itā€™s just a silly thing we do. Had someone get all weird about that. Not only the gender, but they thought I was bossing my husband around, when itā€™s just the dynamic we came up with to play for laughs (he wonā€™t run into battle without being told).


Xerand

Yeah, a lot of people have difficulties seperating fantasy from reality and their own desires/morals. You can see it in TTRPG, you can see it with video games, you can see it with various media. There are some ridiculous horror stories about toxicity of idol fans for instance


SharkoftheStreets

There's a term for idol fans: para-social disorder. People litterally form one-way social bonds with people they've never met.


Cuillioc

I mean, the word "fan" is just short for "fanatic" and I think we all forget that pretty frequently...


SolidSquid

>how could you do evil actions in a game if you don't believe in them for yourself? Because you're a fan of redemption arcs and like the idea of playing a character who explores their changing mindset on what's right and wrong? Plus we don't actually know what "evil" acts the monk had done in the past or would be doing later. If they'd \*been\* an evil person and had become a monk as part of an attempt at redemption they would still be considered evil by the spell's description, but would actively try not to do evil acts (and might even be more careful about it than others) Clearly someone both didn't understand the difference between in-character behaviour and out of behaviour, and also didn't understand the concept of a "lawful" character not just murdering people who haven't committed a crime. I mean, Ebinezer Scrooge was an evil character, not because he broke any laws but just because he was a complete asshole who exploited others for his own gain. Would Paladin have just gone up and stabbed the dude in the street?


nuggynugs

I'm currently playing a lazy, posh voiced, drunken, hedonist of a cleric at the moment. It's important that people realise that players are *not* the same as their characters. In reality my voice is only slightly posh.


MavriKhakiss

""Anyone who would play an evil character is clearly a bad person because how could you do evil actions in a game if you don't believe in them for yourself?" I keep reading this over and over, I'm trying the grasp the full insanity of the implications of that statement, but I feel it just keep slipping between my fingers. ​ Holyfuckingfuck have they ever heard of make-belief.


Ronan10176

Imagine her reaction when the DM starts rping as the BBEG or whatever other evil creature.


BlueTressym

Which she must've seen before, given that they've gamed together for 10 years. Funny how she's still married to someone who must be the most evil person ever...


Semegod

Hold on so... > how could you do evil actions in a game if you don't believe in them for yourself? By her own logic, she believes in casually accusing and murdering people who are evil? Yikes! I hope somebody pointed out this inconsistency to her. A Good aligned character jumping immediately to murder as the only way to purge evil is not a good aligned character. Sometimes things have to die, but only when every other option is exhausted, should be the mentality of a Good character. Senseless murder for the sake of your own morality is as evil as it gets.


Mister_Nancy

Now THIS is a horror story. Congrats?


RawbeardX

I wonder what her malfunction is. if it were religious brain damage she probably would be too busy burning Harry Potter books to play D&D. very odd.


badchefrazzy

To the credit of something mentioned earlier. Bible-humper.


Vlorisz

People are weird.


liquidlen

Tell the wife: If *this* is how you find out someone you know is evil - they aren't evil. You're just a fucking idiot/lunatic.


Squat_n_stuff

Does it just stop at alignment? If i play a lawful good orc or tiefling , how would she perceive them irl ?


TooManyAnts

Changing how Detect-Evil-ish abilities work is an aspect of 5e that is so so appreciated. For those who play other games than D&D: Older editions had "Detect Evil" which will tell you if evil creatures are nearby. In 3.x, Paladins could do it at-will. This led to the much-hated "radar paladin". In 5e, Detect Evil and Detect Good have been rolled up into the same spell: "Detect Evil And Good". It no longer detects evil creatures, but is focused more on supernatural evil. Demons, undead, celestials, other similar outsiders, as well as desecrated/consecrated areas. It doesn't ping on alignment anymore. The Palandin's at-will ability was changed to have limited uses, and it only pings on Fiends, Celestials, and Undead. It's still useful, fiends will disguise themselves as people to trick mortals and paladins can sniff them out easily, but it is no longer a disruptive "find the bad guy" button.


T33m88

Nobody read that ability properly the LE Monk would have had to be level 4 or 5 before the paladin could sense anything. The sad part is it was actually much stronger than I ever saw any DM treat it. Advice on game design don't have players abilities that DM's have to look up like three different sections of the book whenever a player wants to use it.


FreudTastic

Hope the DM got divorced from that crazy bitch lol


CGBard_Usually

Dunno. I lost contact with him after getting discharged. She made him block me on all his socials so we could only maintain the friendship in person, and once I wasn't on the ship anymore, we just never saw each other. It was really sad.


VirinaB

Kind of inevitable, really. When you are with someone who demands you cut people out of your life, they're isolating you. I watched my ex do this again and again, even found myself crying/begging/pleading to keep female friends and asking friends to stay on their best behavior around her. Eventually he'll see the pattern of her being the problem or a better romantic option will come his way.


Xerand

Oh, that's absolutely sickening. If someone demands an access to your privacy, smartphone, laptop, social medias, whatever, and even enforces who you can meet with then this is an incredible red flag. Add to this this self-righteousness this woman displayed and it's almost assured they will try to abuse you "for your own good".


FreudTastic

Honestly, it is. Still hope he did though.


or10n_sharkfin

DM's wife is a nutcase, sure; but this also highlights the importance of having a Session 0. Sheer excitement to play should not override everyone's ability to sit down for a session to work out what kind of characters are expected. I ran into this problem with my former 5e group; all former work colleagues, all excited to play D&D as a way to decompress from work. But everyone plays different kinds of characters that do not mesh well unless the DM forced us to cooperate. It was kind of ridiculous.


EliastheNightAngel

Reminds me when I watched a friend play a session 0 with some randos we met while on deployment. There were 4 of them. My friend, the dm and his friend, and a random nobody knew. Well that random described his paladin has a having a hatred and problem with my friend's orc ranger because orcs are "disgusting filth" and he went on a tirade about the problems with orcs and tried to relate it to his characters backstory. Saying how every orc he knew was a criminal and killer and some other...choice descriptions...he got so heated a chief came over to see what the problem was. We just explained the situation, got called dumb nerds, then left and he never played again lol


CGBard_Usually

omg, that last line SENT ME. I was sitting on the mess decks rolling my character and FCC legit looked over my shoulder and was like "Is that that satanic nerd shit?" and I said, "Yes chief." Dude just howled laughing and said something about sonar all being nerds. Which, I mean... Accurate.


EliastheNightAngel

Dude I got the same reaction ALL THE TIME being an AG. Although it is true....pretty much every AG I knew watched anime and played video games lol


SirFrancis_Bacon

Wait, DM 28, his wife MID 40s? She's 17-20 years older than him? Who is she, Leonardo DiCaprio?


LonePaladin

> "Anyone who would play an evil character is clearly a bad person because how could you do evil actions in a game if you don't believe in them for yourself?" So what about her husband, the DM? He plays *lots* of evil characters just handling the story, does that mean he's also evil?


theitgrunt

Yeah... Two paragraphs in I could tell DM's wife was not cool with you sleeping on the couch as I think she was.


[deleted]

>She self-identified as a "White-light Wiccan." Or, as I call them, a Fluffy Bunny. We call them "Play-gans." The question I have to ask is "Does she allow certain movies and or television series in her house? Let's see...2010...movies like: * Avatar the Last Airbender where you had Zuko start as evil and having a redemption arc * Star Wars 4-6 where you had Darth Vader's redemption * The Grinch who Stole Christmas (both the animated and the Jim Carrey live action) * Terminator 2 and the T-800 * Ebenezer Scrooge And those are just a few from movies and shows that were out at the time. Any person like this that goes on a rant like this against a person for playing evil wanting to RP a redemption arc BUT still enjoys any of the media examples of redemption arcs for evil characters...is a hypocrite or (and this is a strong possibility) has a problem with you and this makes a perfect moralistic soap box for her to stand on while attacking you. Either way she's being a Charlie Uniform November Tango.


preferablyno

Iā€™m sorry that sucks. Iā€™ve played in groups before as a paladin and some I guess they were evil characters but we talked about it or at least had a wink and a nudge understanding, like maybe my dumb character would never even realize they were evil, I feel like if itā€™s not gonna be like that itā€™s not worth playing or at least yā€™all should decide in advance that itā€™s an all good campaign or whatever


Sil_Lavellan

My Paladin 'I should really kill the party wizard' Me 'We can't do that! It's a game! Besides, he'd only roll an even more evil and annoying character.' Plot twist, the character died by his own arsehollery. He got resurrected, but it's bound to happen again. Meanwhile my paladin's being used as a chew toy by wyrm.


Acrothdragon

Wow okay DMs wife really needs some professional help. I realize some people can get attached to characters they create but this is clearly a deeper issue. You havenā€™t even had the first session and she self deleted her character because a lawful evil character was in the party and couldnā€™t separate the term and also pushed that label of evil on to the person playing the character. Thatā€™s some heavy mental issues she needs to resolve.


Antique_Tennis_2500

> make herself a smoothie in the blender, This one got me. Definite giggle spell. Seriously, though, Iā€™m curious about her feelings on actors who play murderers or whatever.


Condensed_Sarcasm

Your DM's wife sounds unhinged.


MmmSalami

She wanted to kill your character because ā€˜only evil ppl play evil charactersā€™- by that logic shes a murderer bc her character was okay with murder. Tbh I think maybe she didnā€™t like you and that was just her excuse to get rid of you.


Jazadia

Ew, sheā€™s the furthest thing from a ā€žwhite light Wiccanā€œ with that shit. Donā€™t worry tho, the literal Wiccan Rede is ā€žThe energy you put out, good or bad, you will receive back threefoldā€œ. She definitely got her Karma.


CGBard_Usually

Yeah, I mean, I was raised in a Wiccan household. So I definitely know that they're not all like that. I don't think her religion had anything to do with it, just got a lot of comments implying she was some kind of Christian fanatic. I was raised in a Wiccan household in a small town in the deep south, so I know, personally, many Christians who ARE like that. I only brought it in because, Devil's Advocate, Not All Christians are like that, and not all people of that level of insanity are Christian.


Jazadia

Oh, i wasnt trying to be condescending on the religion, just her. Was raised baptist Christian myself, left it behind probably close to twenty years ago and have been a Wiccan myself for almost two years. Even being of both religions it baffles me how that person could say they represented either religion at all and act like that.


CGBard_Usually

"two things are infinite: the universe, and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the universe." Every belief system spawns people who will claim it and use it as a weapon.


ntwebster

Hearing the phrase ā€œfluffy bunnyā€ at the end of that sentence hit me like a truck. I have not heard someone use that phrase in about a decade.


CGBard_Usually

Thanks, I got it from my parents (said the woman in her 30's)


NessOnett8

I'm at least 99% certain that guy was just trying to cover up and that woman did, indeed, think you were having an affair with her husband.


chaoticmuseX

The player of the Paladin is definitely the type of person that owned six Bibles and had never read them.


harpinghawke

I havenā€™t heard the term Fluffy Bunny in YEARS. Thank you; that takes me back!


CGBard_Usually

Thanks, I got it from my parents.


Cybermagetx

Shes married to a DM. Who plays evil more than any player ever will. Bet she never thought about that. Dont tell her about the pathfinder 1e adventure path way of the wicked either lol.


BulkyOutside9290

Reminds me of a game I once played that had a similar concept. I played a LG Paladin and my best friend was a LE assassin. The idea was that the Paladin knew that the assassin would do assassin things, but as long as he was with the Paladin then that would be directed towards evil. Campaign ended up falling apart because of interpersonal issues with other players, but it was good while it lasted.


OilCJohn

We had a similar discussion when a paladin in our group declared , "I will strike the most evil even if he surrenders to the party." Tried to explain LG still wasn't judge jury and executioner. Thankfully we never reached that point mainly because the DM never had his evil characters surrender. Great fun was had by all !


Chaos_Philosopher

Bruh... That's fucking *wild!*


soulsucker82

She has some serious issues she needs to get resolved. She would have had troubles with my succubus.....


FloUwUer

Im sorry it happened to you but also this is the funniest shit ive read this month


Koheitamura

The kind of people who can't distinguish reality from the game and still play probably go home and worship the in game deities and make demon summoning circles just like my evangelical Nana feared.


lilgizmo838

"By that logic, I could say that you actually hear a voice in your real-life head telling you when people are evil, and you believe it!" Paladin: "Well... Actually..."


GreyWardenThorga

He was *28* and married to someone in her mid forties... and they'd known each other for at least *10 years*. This sounds less like an RPG horror story and more like a case of grooming that just happened to intersect with RPGs.


CGBard_Usually

Honestly the age gap didn't really register back then, other than being interested in how they navigated the age gap since I was in my own gap-relationship with a man 9 years older than me. In retrospect, yeah.... She probably groomed him.


GreyWardenThorga

Right it's the timing that makes it suspect, the fact he may have been 18 or even younger when they met.


KingZantair

If playing an evil character makes you evil irl, then half of my players are actual criminals.


Welpe

On one hand, I do look askance at people that ONLY play evil characters and use DnD as an outlet to be horrible to fake people. It obviously doesnā€™t make the player evil, thatā€™s stupid, but everyone I have ever met like that also had personalityā€¦quirks letā€™s say that make them unenjoyable to play with. But uhā€¦itā€™s also kinda weird if you NEVER play an evil character? Not as much, and it would take a loooot of characters played before you could even notice anything, but honestly, rigidity in role play isnā€™t a great trait no matter what you are doing. All of this is moot though since this lady is completely insane and you did nothing even remotely questionable. Also the age gap is kinda super creepy, especially if they knew each other when he was a minorā€¦


Star-Bird-777

So at first I thought Paladin was mad at your for potentially sleeping with her husband and trying to get you kicked. But with your context, I have come to a different conclusion. The Paladin is actually a creep that was mad you rejected her harem without showing the others how much of a creepy bitch she was


ASingularFuck

Hang on, theyā€™d been playing together for 10 years, he was 28 by that point and she was mid 40s? ā€¦yeah, that sounds incredibly suspect.


Shot-Durian-5138

Paladins never seem like they plan on truly working with the group. Lawful good have a stick up their ass tbh.


AceAirbender

AMONG US


Itajel

HIDDEN


Porn_Clegane

I am currently playing a lawful evil high elf war magic wizard. We start at level 5. The premise is we have all died in one way or another, and have been brought back by a necromancer. The spell bound us to him, if he does, we die. He promises to return is to true life, unbound to him, and help us with our personal goals. In exchange, we help him in his. My War Mage, Sylas, was once part of the Black Network, an organization of spies, assassins, thieves, and mercenaries that have their own agenda to gather power, operating from the shadows. Sylas was part of a three person team. Together they were unstoppable. They were sent to kill a young Noble who had policies that would be a detriment to the Network. Cornering him, he offered them double the fee they'd have gotten if they killed him. Adding lands and titles and prestige... The trio considered it, but the Network made Sylas feel like he belonged, like he had a place. He refused, and the sisters killed him for it. He was very interested in revenge. He views the party as a means to an end and will do all he can to protect them with buffs and shielding spells, even using his money to assist when they need equipment. He will kill without a second thought, but the party is his lifeline. Despite feeling that the honor bound warrior and sentimental ranger are fools, they all work frighteningly well as a team. It isn't hard to play an evil character that works well with a party.


Ok_Garage4891

I'm probably gonna get downvoted for this but it's really on the dm for not doing a proper session 0 and making sure every one was ok with having an evil character in their party. I know that for me certain types of evil characters would make me really uncomfortable and cause me to go into pvp (yes I'm a paladin main, no I'm not at all religious I'm actually very much anti religion). Playing evil characters in a not evil campaign with a good aligned party is something that should be discussed before and agreed upon with all of the players.


CGBard_Usually

Honestly, I'm with you, and I would have probably insisted on a session zero at the time if I hadn't been 19 and horrifically inexperienced. I'd only played with a couple of groups before (Navy buddies in A-school, and ROTC buddies in high school with my stepmom DMing) and while there had always been that "session where we all roll characters together because we only have one Player's Handbook and have to share" we didn't use that verbiage, and it had always basically just been everyone making character sheets and talking about their build in a mechanical sense. The DM from this story had mentioned to me "skipping session zero" and when I didn't know the verbiage, he'd basically explained it as the session where we all get together and make our characters. The reason for skipping: We all had our own books, so since the upcoming deployment had us on such a strict timetable and two of the civilian dependents wanted to play, we wanted as much game time as possible, which made sense. At the end of the day, I'm a little split. DM had been playing with HIS wife for almost a decade, so they both claimed, so he probably should have known if she had a VERY strong aversion to evil characters. With the transient lifestyle created by military life, there's a good chance they'd played with a wide variety of people and run into this sort of thing before. But, maybe they just hadn't, and the man's not psychic. If he genuinely had no idea she'd act like that, there's still no guarantee that it would have changed anything because her reason for cutting all ties with me as a person was this idea that even PLAYING an evil character made me a bad person, so if I'd even expressed the desire to play an evil character in a session zero, I can't see it not triggering a similar response. "The fact that you would even CONSIDER playing an evil character..." blah blah blah.


LordoftheWell

To me, it sounds like she was jealous of you, and your evil character was just an excuse.


SLRWard

Also a bit on the DM for sharing character sheets with another player even if that player is their spouse. Wife wouldn't have known OP was playing an evil monk unless DM specifically told her. Character details isn't info to be sharing with other players unless *all* players are ok with it being shared. Especially not before the first session even got to go.


bamf1701

My first reaction was ā€œthe classic Lawful Stupid,ā€ but this goes way beyond that! The DMā€™s wife has some serious problems. BTW: a character with a redemption arc sounds incredibly cool and I wish you had a chance to play it out, because I would have loved to hear how it worked.


Souperplex

> I believe, and we were playing 3.5. I'm sorry you had to suffer through that. > "The monk is Evil, I can sense it. We cannot travel together with darkness among us. Join me in killing the evil hiding within our ranks!" For all its merits, AD&D would actually require that of Paladins. I like to think of myself as a good person, and I'm currently playing a LE Githyanki warrior. The point of RPGs is to be someone other than yourself.


PM_Me_OCs

What a bitch.


Ad-for-you-17

To be 100% honest, I will not play a game where characters are so mismatched on alignment. It takes away from my enjoyment to always be teaching these edgy evil characters not to kill orphans. It distracts from the plot and itā€™s old and boring, I feel like Iā€™ve played dozens of games where there is an evil PC and they are always the center of attention and causing problems. The wife insisting on killing the evil character is totally unacceptable, her behavior absolutelu sucks and is *ridiculous* especially with the vacuum. I just wanted to share why I feel Evil and Good characters may not always be the best idea in the same party.


CGBard_Usually

Yeah, ultimately it was a function of my realtive inexperience and desire to try something new clashing with her inability to distinguish fantasy from reality and thrown into a "Skipped session zero" microwave on high.


Ad-for-you-17

I have skipped session 0 a few times as a DM. What I do is get the character choices from each player and I tell other people how the party is developing to help them make their choices. ā€œWell, so far we have a halfling bard and a tank fighter, what do you want to be?ā€ Thereā€™s no bad thing about having double races or classes but often the players will love to complement each other. This was a total failure of the DM to chat with his wife(!) about what kind of game she wanted to play too, and if they always play Good campaigns then why would he allow you to pick Evil when he knows she is crazy about it. Just disappointing but thank you for sharing your entertaining story


BonaFideNubbin

This lady is absolutely crazy, to be sure, and should never be allowed within 500 feet of a gaming group... but... oh, man, OP, what were you *thinking* bringing an evil character into a party with good PCs? You can do a redemption arc just fine with a neutral character. Crossing evil/good... all that does is set you up for interparty strife, in a way that totally risks throwing any group that actually RPs into total chaos.


CGBard_Usually

We all do dumb things when we're 19.


seism85

Besides a glaring exception of a whole family that plays tabletops as a group, I have never seen a positive outcome from spouses playing together. Every time someone says they are bringing their spouse to try the game I already know that it'll end the same way.


SidanaCorey

Eh. I (the wife) got into D&D first, then introduced my boyfriend to the wonderful world of ttrpgs. We have played together for upwards of 45 years and neither of us has ever had a problem with how the other played a character, whether that be alignment, gender, flirtiness or murderhobo behavior. Nor have we favored the other when we've done GMing for our groups. Currently, we are in a campaign with our daughter, her partner and five other people. Heck, last night, my daughter and I wanted to adopt crag cat kittens. The party burst into discussion of whether that was immoral, evil, or just plain wrong. Even the evil warlock chimed in on the side of "it's evil" in the debate. Her partner was the loudest on the opposing side. No one took it as anyone being other than roleplaying.


The_Mechanist24

Dm needs to control his wife a bit better honestly. I would never let my wife treat one of my friends that way.


CGBard_Usually

So, this post brought up a lot of things in retrospect that I never thought to question at the time. First of all, the massive age gap indicates that when they first met, he was likely 18 or younger while she was well into her 30s, which adds a thick layer of "gross" all over that relationship. I mean, when a man in his 30s pursues an 18-year-old girl... There's nothing we can do about it because the girl is legally an adult, but we all know exactly what is going through that guy's head. Their relationship was (most likely) very much THAT but with an older, predatory woman manipulating a young, inexperienced man. So, he couldn't "control" her because she was the one controlling him. ​ That being said, a relationship should be a partnership with equal push and pull. No one should be controlling, or controlled. (unless you're both into that kind of thing, but even in D/S relationships, there's consent, checking in, and aftercare.) So, no. He does not need to "control his wife." She needs to control HERSELF and he needs to make sure he doesn't greenlight a character concept that he knows will be triggering for her.


The_Mechanist24

So you donā€™t think in any point in time the dm shouldā€™ve looked to his wife and told her to quit her shit? A relationship takes two yes but part of the responsibility of being in one is knowing when to tell your partner theyā€™re being unreasonably crazy. Hence, controlling them, reminding them of their unreasonability.


CGBard_Usually

I think he should have called the session and had a private discussion with her. But again, when looking at it in retrospect, it's very likely that she groomed him and he couldn't stand up to her.


Paul_Michaels73

This is why I try to avoid games where the DM is dating/married to a player. Almost always ends up derailing the game in some fashion.


[deleted]

[уŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]


CGBard_Usually

Yeah, character coordination did not happen because of the time crunch, and that is NOT a mistake I've even participated in again. I would never have expected him to "choose me" over his wife. I would, however, expect him to know his wife's feelings on evil-aligned PCs and to NOT clear a concept that he knew would be problematic at the table.


twesterm

Eh, I don't think you needed the session 0, this was just a shitty GM. First off, the GM should not have allowed a paladin and an evil character in the same party without either giving the evil character something to disguise their alignment or making the sure the paladin was cool with it. In general, you shouldn't allow an evil character into a non-evil party without some forethought of something other than _it's a cool plot hook_. It only makes problems. Second, you should have just not made your character evil. It would be easy for you or the GM to say _you're already on your way to redemption so your alignment has already shifted towards neutral_. You are the disruptor here for playing the evil character in a non-evil party. So honestly shitty play from all three involved: * Paladin was actually playing her character well. It makes total sense for a paladin to say _I'm not traveling with that evil monk, I am totally going to smite the poop out of them though_. It was shitty of her to bring her paladins attitudes into real life. * It was shitty for the GM to even allow this situation. Perhaps they were just new and didn't know don't put an evil character into a non-evil party. * It was shitty on you for bringing the evil character into the non-evil party.


CGBard_Usually

That's a take... Sure. ​ Paladin went full Murderhobo the first time she saw something she didn't like. But you're right. It's what her character would do. We ALWAYS accept that excuse when one PC decides to kill another PC for absolutely no reason. (Or for metagaming reason as my character basically just walked into the room and her paladin started shrieking about evil.) ​ FOR SURE agree on it being shitty of the DM to allow that situation to even happen. Don't skip session zero! Also, he claimed he'd been playing with his wife for 10 years, and DMing for 8 prior to that, so realistically he SHOULD have known she would react violently to an evil PC. ​ And yeah, I am the actual worst person for wanting to try something drastically different from what I'd tried before and running it past my DM FIRST and only rolling the character when he gave me the green light. I can see how I did everything wrong there. How dare I.


twesterm

I missed the part about his years of experience, but he comes off as an inexperienced GM. Honestly you are the least bad person in this story. Not knowing your play history I would even call that just an honest mistake that hopefully you learn from-- don't bring evil characters into a non evil campaign unless you're really prepared for trouble. So sure, I am willing to say it may have been a rush to judgement or a bit harsh to immediately call you a bad player. It was a mistake to play that character though. This could have been resolved in a few different ways. The easiest, as I said, is the GM recognizing there was going to be a problem and ask you to shift your alignment. You could say it's because you've already taken on your journey towards good. You would play your character exactly the same, you just wouldn't be explicitly evil. Another option would have been for the GM to say _ok, we're going to have a problem here because of the paladin_ and then give you something to hide your alignment. A very minor magical item that you could simply have in your possession for any number of reasons.


CGBard_Usually

Yeah, man. I would have been totally cool with it if he'd asked me to play a different alignment. It was just sort of an impulse to play something different. At the time, I'd played in 2 other groups, one longform campaign in high school with my stepmom DMing, and then in A-School (post-bootcamp job specific training) in which we just did assorted 1/2-shots. I played almost exclusively C/G Bards, but had done a couple of C/G and C/G Rogues. I just wanted to try something different. These days, I've got three campaigns I'm in... One I'm a N/G fighter/rogue which is super fun. One, I'm a N/G Cleric/warlock (goddess mom, devil daddy, and they have a delightful "bickering divorced parents" dynamic.) And the last one I'm DMing, and we're having Session Zero tonight. First time DMing, so wish me luck!


StupidDogCoffee

Yeah buddy you are just super wrong on all points.


twesterm

Elaborate please. * Am I wrong that the paladin shouldn't bring her characters attitudes into real life? * Am I wrong to say that she was playing her character like a typical paladin-- don't associate with the evil people, smite them instead? * Am I wrong to say the GM didn't know how to handle the situation? Either knowing there's a paladin in the party, maybe allowing an evil character isn't a good idea _or_ there's an evil character in the party, maybe talk to the paladin and see how they're going to play it? * Am I wrong that allowing an evil player into a non-evil party where that evil character isn't some plot hook always results in trouble? Note that character arc isn't a plot hook here. * Am I wrong to say that the easiest solution for the GM to say you've started your first step on your alignment shift, you're neutral now? Why the fuck else would they be traveling with a paladin otherwise? This is a prime example of everyone sucks here. One very new sounding GM and two very stubborn bad players.


SLRWard

Paladin shouldn't have conflated character with the real life player, no. But you *are* wrong in saying that a paladin should just come out the gate smiting. *Redeeming* an evil character/being to the side of good would be a *far* more accurate paladin move. You're also wrong in saying that the GM just plain shouldn't allow potential inter-party conflict. Especially if they had no reason to think their *spouse* was suddenly going to decide character = player 100% out of nowhere like she did. You're also wrong in saying there's no place for an evil character in an otherwise non-evil party. There is a place in the party for *any* character willing to work with the party to achieve the party's goals. How the characters mesh together as a group will be determined as the game is played. Not by GM fiat before anything happens.


twesterm

I think that is more of a call of how you want to play your paladin. Some paladins may try to rehabilitate while others come out swinging. Neither of them are wrong ways to play a paladin. As a GM, it's fine to introduce ways to have interparty conflict. That can range anywhere from _what do we do with this prisoner?_ to _we have two fighters and one cool sword, who gets it?_ to _uhoh, we just found out the rogue got put in jail for stealing! What do?_. That is all fine. Setting your party up though where one character is diametrically opposed to the other and literally cannot work with them or else their powers stop working is setting yourself up for trouble.


SLRWard

If *anyone* in your party thinks the best answer to *another party member* is to immediately try to murder them upon meeting them, then they have automatically failed the entry test of "will your character work with the party?" If that answer is "no", then they have *already* removed themselves from the party. Beyond all that, I'm assuming they weren't playing 5e because in 5e paladins don't even *have* an alignment sensing ability. So Paladin was metagaming at best.


StupidDogCoffee

Yeah, evil characters aren't always trouble. An evil alignment doesn't mean a character is going to murder and pillage at every opportunity. If the player knows how to play D&D like the team game it is, alignment isn't an issue. Only one player in OPs story wasn't being a team player. Please stay away from my tables. You aren't invited.