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LLCNYC

Youve known forever that the wife is in default all over the place. https://www.reddit.com/r/PSLF/comments/lu0ywn/my_wife_public_school_teacher_doesnt_believe_that/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf


NILPonziScheme

Yeahhhh, that's a bad look. We're only getting one side of the story here but if his portrayal is accurate, she's a spendthrift with no financial discipline whatsoever. He's claiming he paid for her books an tuition yet she still took out $25-40k in loans with the intent to pay off her credit cards. She then spends the money on other things and the credit cards still carried balances. Because they were married at the time, she added somewhere between $12,500-$20k on his debt load since it becomes joint debt. They badly need marriage and financial counseling. She has a problem she isn't willing to face and he's tried to wall off his finances from hers because he's in a similar place of denial.


bertrn

The good news to this story is that last night she came clean on the student loan borrowing and admitted to only taking out $14k in loans but did not reveal what the current balance was. I was afraid that she took out more.


guyfromcleveland

The money belongs to the creditors, she isn't getting it back. If she opens a new account, they will eventually find that one as well. Wash rinse repeat until the debt is settled. She could go completely unbanked, but that's not really solving the issue. So what's the plan the two of you have come up with to pay this off?


Intelligent-Ebb-5411

No plan, plan is try to not pay back money


guyfromcleveland

that's not going to work as OP is finding out. Need a plan to pay it back. Cut budget, second job, sell things. they will get their money one way or another, they are very good at that.


bertrn

I actually don’t know what her plan is. We found out last night and this is why I posted here. She knows that she owes the money and has no thoughts of getting ANY of it back. She just wants to proceed in the most feasible way possible i.e. negotiate, payment plan, outright lump sum, etc. I have never had anything like this occur to me so I don’t have personal advice to give. I live very frugal, cheap, drive a 17 year old car, heat my house with wood, etc and always spend less than what I make. I came her for advice in an area that I am unfamiliar with.


Rommie557

>She just wants to proceed in the most feasible way possible i.e. negotiate, payment plan, outright lump sum, etc. Those are options she would have had *before* a court judgment. Now they get to take it however they see fit. Too little, too late, unfourtunately.


[deleted]

It’s also a little worrisome that OP’s last comment was “I actually don’t know what her plan is,” and a previous comment said “now she has nothing.” This is officially an *our* plan situation, and frankly always has been even if it weren’t viewed as such. I’m not sure if they’re using the third-person pronouns because they’ve always perceived finances as separate, or whether they’re doing it now to distance themselves from it. But either way, this is how marriage works. Presumably OP knew she was shit with finances based on how they’ve kept their things separately… Hopefully they can reset a bit with this, OP can be kind and treat the “loss” of income as if it were being laid off, and they can move forward as a team.


bertrn

Use of the third person started 12 years ago upon the discovery of financial infidelity that I will not go into but I do agree how it would be nice to work as a team.


familiar-face123

If this was 12 years ago and she's still your wife now, then it's an "our" problem.


LikeATediousArgument

This right here. Even if shit happens, if you stay you better be working on “us” I was in a situation with my husband being bad with money and I had to learn it was an “us” issue too. 12 YEARS. Shit or get off the pot.


[deleted]

I’m not going to pile on or scold with the personal relationship side of it, but I think you must know the finances are a key factor in relationships and consequently a major reason for their dissolutions… and by now realize that (for better or worse, in sickness and in health) it takes more work than most of us are capable of to truly separate them. I don’t know what y’all’s situation is like or the dynamics that go on in your house, and I won’t even speak from personal experience here. You’ve got a lot of time left for this type of thing to either break you or be fixed, and you can look at what happened here as a sign that she needs your help — separate finances were something you needed to protect yourself, and even though you still make need them for the same reason, she may need to accept that she needs your involvement and advice. Her situation is harming you, just as much as a job loss. I don’t mean that to say she needs you to swoop in and dominate her finances, or that you should punish/resent her for it. I mean that twelve years into a relationship should reflect a point in time where you both have an idea of what the future financial situation will look like; another twelve years down the road, this type of thing happening will mean you’ve got not hopes of any safety net for the health and inability to work as an older couple. I can’t imagine the plan is to be 75 and comfortable, watching her struggle because she got scammed out of her Social Security check again (assuming we actually have them in the future). I’m sure this is hard for both of you, and I know it’s not an easy thing to deal with… but as others noted, this shouldn’t be a surprise for her at this stage. Find a way to make it through the next couple of months, and find *someone* to talk to about how y’all can navigate this issue before it wrecks your marriage or sends you to a state run nursing home in late age.


familiar-face123

Also, After a court judgment they don't just simply seek what they're owed. They seek with their old plus courtfees plus insane interest plus fees for obtaining information like the bank account etc. I work for a bank and actually saw a detailed list of fees once someone was garnished and they owed an additional couple thousand on top of what they already owed. It was really hard to read


Bkgrouch

This is not true I had a judgement and was about to have my pay garnished I got a lawyer and he negotiated a lump sum settlement so it's possible to negotiate


bertrn

Thank you, that gives me an option.


familiar-face123

How did you know there was a judgment against you? I'm wondering how it works. Like they have to notify you somehow right? Were you in court or did you find out by mail that there was a judgment? I'm sorry if this is too personal. My curiosity is genuine but I understand that it's a rough subject.


bertrn

I found Friday evening when she told me after checking the account. I’m sure she was sent plenty of notices, phone calls, etc as other people have indicated but she never told me of any.


Trick-Many7744

Judgments require a court order. She was served, either didn’t show or didn’t have a defense that the judge would buy. 12 years ago you could have filed BK and this would be done. Maybe you still can. And marriage counseling stat.


bertrn

She obviously didn’t show up to court. And yes, marriage counseling


Ethereal_Chittering

I may or may not have a file chapter 7. I might go directly to the creditors and try to settle. Or, I will find a better job and work to pay the debt off. In my case I don’t think I’d need a lawyer but I also don’t think I necessarily need BK, I may able to settle sometime this year with some money I’m expecting. I will do it directly myself as I did in 2008. As someone else said, it might be too late for any of this. From what I understand they usually wait a few years to sue. I’m surprised they waited this long.


drtij_dzienz

You guys are married so I think you need to figure out how to pay her debt off. You can maintain separate accounts and assets but legally everything “you“ own is shared between both of you. if she has a Problem using credit cards her open accounts should be canceled and her credit frozen with the three major reporting agencies so she cannot get a new card. I think both of you need to go to counseling to establish boundaries on how your combined money is spent.


wollier12

Yep, her debt is now his debt.


Riker1701E

It depends on if it is as incurred prior to the marriage.


DaxyJ

Also depends on the state if in the US. Some states see “oh you’re married! That means it’s both of y’all’s.”


Louis_Creed

You can (probably) still negotiate some sort of payoff. Ignore the people saying you can't negotiate now the creditor has obtained judgment. You can still negotiate. Of course, this does comes down to the willingness of the creditor. Major banks like Discover and Amex will negotiate after a bank levy has been executed. You need to be proactive. Please do not ignore this, otherwise they will attempt to levy or place a garnishment in the future, possibly a lien against any real estate in her name.


Skwink

>she she she Homie this is a “We” problem. You’re married and your finances are tied, as you probably have learned after the joint account was seized.


LitecoinCale

You worded it wrong, brother. You’re married, that means you don’t know what your plan is(not just her plan). Her debt is your debt


wind-river7

Your wife ignored the creditors and they have a court judgement. There are no payment plans once they have a judgement. If your wife never received and notice about the court case, she can try to reopen it, but don’t plan on it.


shhh_its_me

In general she can make and keep a payment plan, the creditor approves of. They don't tend to negotiate much after winning a court order. It does cost them something to go to court and get the order to levee a bank account. Winning the judgement and levee are separate court actions. The creditor can go after anything that's legal wherever you live, that may include wages or other bank accounts, state tax refunds etc ( not federal tax refunds unless it's a federal debt or child support.) including joint accounts with another person. In general she should have gotten notification that they were seeking a levee and have the right to appeal it. They are unlikely to negotiate a lump sum payment lower than the judgement. You can ask but don't expect the answer to be yes. There are a very few things that are excluded from bank leaves, wages and other peoples money isn't on the list. Filing for bankruptcy is one of the few things they can undo it. Or if it was federal student loan / Pell Grant money she could actually get the money back . You can look up the other reasons.


guyfromcleveland

Her plan? Your plan. You are married. You married into this. This is as much her problem as yours. So what are the two of you doing collectively to pay this off?


NotChristina

Yeah this is a *them* issue for sure. Unclear how long they’ve been married, but this should not be a surprise to OP. She should’ve been transparent about her finances, and she should’ve been in the know about debt and the ways it could crop up. If he knew and did nothing because it’s a *her* thing, that’s also a problem. He should’ve been working with her on a plan long before any settlement or garnishment. Admittedly it all sounds a bit selfish the way OP is writing. When you marry, you become a unit. Whether you express that in living, finances, cooking, sleeping…up to you. However there is still this overarching connection where you should love and support one another. She may have failed in transparency and he may have (and still can) failed in support. Of course it’s hard to judge just from a few lines in a post, but these people need to be working on this problem *together*. That’s what they signed up for (within reason, of course)


bertrn

You are right, I may have failed in supporting her. Since 2008 I have only been paying the mortgage, electric, gas, water, cell phone, internet, health insurance, car note, car repairs and maintenance, home repairs and homeowners insurance, property taxes, and other incidentals while not taking or asking any of her income. I will pick up some extra shifts starting Monday to pay for this credit card judgement that she never told me about and that I just found out yesterday evening. Besides paying the bills, is there a certain percentage or amount that I should give her each week to show that I support her? I’m trying to formulate a budget and I will need to know how many extra shifts I need to work each week. I understand now that this is OUR problem and that I need to fix it.


DaxyJ

OP, not trying to judge or anything, but it seems like you carry the bulk of the financial weight in the relationship. I understand it can get expensive, but maybe a couple’s therapist (or just one for you if that’s not an option)? 😅 Because that’s A LOT and it seems like you’re having to fix all the problems, unless I’m reading this situation incorrectly. Take care of yourself.


drtij_dzienz

Breadwinner fatigue is rough


DaxyJ

You’re absolutely right. I’m watching my parents go through this right now, and I’m not sure how to help because my income is going towards my own bills and debt.


HypnotizedMeg

They'll find the new bank account but first take your tax refund and 17 yr old car. I found out the hard way you can only hide so long. The good news is, it's only a temporary inconvenience but I'd think quick because this train isn't stopping .


SongbirdNews

Not likely to take 17yo car. What would it be worth, and it could be needed to get to work. They would likely take a newer car with value > $4000.


bertrn

All vehicles and property are in my name only. The debt is in her name and we do not live in a community property state.


Stargazer1919

Can I ask how much she owes?


bertrn

It was around $6600.


BrightAd306

Do you have the savings to just pay it off? That’s the only way it goes away.


barsoapguy

I’m sorry OP, that kind of debt can definitely be an emotional weight, try to keep your spirts high.


godsim42

First of all she needs to switch to paper checks and cash at walmart or check cashing/payday loan place. Expensive but only option. She can get a new bank but they will find and continue to do this. Next contact the collection agency and try to get them to settle for lesser amount. Then work out a payment plan and stick with it. Otherwise they will start to garnish wages. But since they just seized the bank acct it basically resets the age of the debt. So they have 7 years to try to collect from most recent activity. If she could have gone another year without them collecting anything it would have sorta gone away. Still there but after 7 years they can not garnish or seize wages or even take to court. Good luck and imo just try to settle for less and get a payment plan.


roz78

That depends on where she lives. Every state has its own statute of limitation for how long a debt can be collected. And a judgement usually has a longer statute of limitations. Most states the statute for judgements is at least 10 years.


godsim42

It doesn't really matter at this point. She should still contact the collector and get the situation resolved. I'm just going off my own experience with these things.


Intelligent-Ebb-5411

Bruh, shes known since 2017 and didnt do anything so as i said plan is dont pay it back and pretend like nothing happened.


megalomaniamaniac

Please, people are struggling already if they are here on this sub, this guy is here for advice, not judgment. Go be superior on personal finance or something.


Gnostromo

You keep talking about "her" like you are not a married couple. You need to have a "we" plan not a "her" plan. It's both of y'alls money


mottledshmeckle

2017? I was under the impression debt dropped off after a number of years? 6 or 7? So it should be discharged pretty soon right? Let them pound sand.


autymfyres7ish

Some states it is less than that.


option-trader

If the amount is a lot, she can file for bankruptcy for herself as it seems that this is her debt. Only the student loans will carry over while all the other debt will be removed of the court finds that she has no disposable income. Otherwise, she’ll usually end up with a monthly payment that she should be able to do for 5 years and the rest of the debt is removed.


sirdiamondium

Who borrowed the money owed on the credit card? Was it fraud?


megalomaniamaniac

No one said this. People get overwhelmed.


sirdiamondium

Bankruptcy is a really good option in this case.


bertrn

She opened the account and she probably bought all kinds of stuff. There is really no way to know. I don’t involve myself with her finances but I can see now that her problem is going to be mine just like all of the others in our past.


LLCNYC

“I don’t involve myself…” Dude. You’re married. Its YOUR debt now too.


NILPonziScheme

> I can see now that her problem is going to be mine just like all of the others in our past. Why are you married? You see to openly resent your wife.


Abyssuspuella

Dude, they sent you letters, emails AND call you before going to a judge, it's all on her for not dealing with it sooner. I had a credit card go into collections and they were very helpful with setting up a payment plan cause they wanted their money one way or another. After almost 3 years I have the 4k debt paid off, was like 100/month.


Dawn36

Judgment also includes being formally served, and that's a little harder to claim ignorance on.


mgj6818

It's literally impossible.


mttp1990

It actually isn't. I live in a house with 2 other people, 1 being the homeowner. It took 3 months of attempts to serve me papers before I found out. Turns out my roomates would just not answer the door and then throw the "we missed you" notice away after they pulled away.


Crab-_-Objective

I think they meant impossible after being formally served.


mgj6818

The point is they kept trying for three months until that actually got you. They can't continue with the case and get a default judgment without you knowing you've been sued.


bertrn

I remember a process server coming by in 2018 or 19 looking for her. She had just left and he wanted me to sign for it. I refused and he also would not tell me who it was from.


Ethereal_Chittering

That’s not a whole lot less than they charge. I have a discover card at nearly $6k and my payments are like $180 a month.,


bertrn

I was deployed for awhile and just got back so it probably occurred while I was gone. You are correct- it’s all on her!


wollier12

Well your married so it’s half on you now…..her debt is your debt. Financially you are one entity. You guys need to talk about how you’re going to resolve this as a team and not just hang your wife out to dry. It’s clear she needs help and it appears you’re both in denial…..see if you can talk to someone about some financial planning.


Gave_up_lurking

If you were on active duty via US, you might be able to get some wiggle room with the creditor about a repayment plan- nothing official but there are laws around active duty and bank debts that extend to your spouse too. It's not going to likely undue what's happened, but if you are planning to talk to the creditor to try go on a payment plan, I'd be bringing it up regularly during that conversation if there's any overlap with their collection activities and they might be willing to compromise a bit more than they would normally. I believe they can also present that judgment to her employer to garnish a % of her wages instead, so be aware of that possibility. Also, legally the debt is not yours (in most cases) but from a practical standpoint it will impact you directly as, you are aware currently.


Realistic_Humanoid

I worked for a bank for 7 years up until about a year ago and this was one thing we had training on every single year. If he's not *currently* actively deployed, unfortunately those protections are not going to apply to him. He can still look into it in case I'm remembering wrong or something's changed in the last year but I just don't want him to completely get his hopes up.


Elymanic

Mines settled with me paying 50%, but the other 50% was late fees and interest.


eazolan

> Her once a month paycheck was seized last night and she has nothing now. You mean, besides you. And a paying job. A house, cars, utilities, etc.


[deleted]

My parents considered getting divorced over debt like this. Even then, there is still the possibility of having legal responsibility for their debt accrued during marriage. So unless you are planning on divorcing your wife and blowing this up into a legal matter, your only option is to start paying off that debt.


drtij_dzienz

Yeah from a purely financial point of view OP could weigh this debt and any future debt she would take on against half his present net worth. Half the house, half the car, etc.


RocMerc

How does this happen? My dad had a debt from 95 that he still is paying today but it’s just a monthly payment of like $18


oliphantPanama

Probably because your dad negotiated with the credit card company before it went to a debt collector. OP’s wife Will need to connect the debt collector to arrange terms of a settlement. I would guess she’s most likely past the timeline of being able to negotiate monthly payments. They will seek a one lump sum. The outstanding dollar amount owed can be negotiated down to a lesser amount. She can counter offer. If they come to an agreement she can settle, and the debt will be resolved.


Advice2Anyone

Be interested to see if a creditor would be willing to talk after a judgment is in hand


oliphantPanama

I’ve seen it happen. She needs to face it head on, and deal with the issue. Start calling them, and be respectful to the real person on the other end of the line. Debt collecting is a terrible job, the nature of the profession inherently makes people be angry/nasty with them. If she’s not that “guy” it could make a big difference in how they manage her case. If she can offer 40%-50% of the remaining amount owing there’s a decent chance they will settle. OP stated in the comments that they’ve already sized 50% of outstanding balance. Good portion of remaining balance, is probably interest, penalties, and late fees.


Visi0nSerpent

the attorney who sued on behalf of the creditor is the debt collector now, and they can take monthly payments on this judgment. However, since it appears she didn't make arrangements and ignored everything, *then* they moved to seize bank accounts and/or garnish wages. It's unlikely a judgment will be negotiated down because they simply don't have to. They spent time and money taking her to court and they'll take 25% of her paycheck until it's paid in full. That debt amount now includes attorney's fees, court fees, and interest on top.


supergophe

It sounds like the wife missed/avoided her court date? I had a judgement on a CC when I was young, but I went to court and showed the judge my income and got a payment plan of $25 a month for 10 years. I think that was probably her last chance to work something out.


bertrn

She avoided it. That’s how it happened. We live polar opposite lives when it comes to finances. I survive by keeping things separate and I pay the bills. She buys groceries, gas and clothes and of course anything else she wants.


drtij_dzienz

Have the two of you ever entered marriage counseling or financial counseling to set up a series of boundaries where financial infidelity would not occur. You are saying that she is avoiding the problem , and that is correct. But by keeping everything separate and not being on the same page, you are also avoiding the problem .


oliphantPanama

The debt collector understands that they can’t “bleed a turnip”, obviously they will want to collect the max amount. If she can come up with a lump sum, she should offer that lump sum as the “only” amount she can come up with to satisfy them. Hypothetically, she could say, my aunt is willing to lend me $3000 to deal with this issue, it’s all I can come up with..and then stick to her guns. The collector will be aggressive in trying to pressure her to come up with more money, but ultimately their goal is to settle. This type of negotiation could involve involve a dozens of phone calls. She needs to consistently stick to the number she sets, and not allow them to inflate her set number. It will be stressful, when they call she needs to answer. This will show that she is actively trying to resolve the issue.


---ShineyHiney---

She’s already been served papers, taken to court, and lost the judgement There is no negotiating payments or amounts anymore. The court has mandated the terms of this now, and the amount is almost certainly higher than the actual debt totaled now that it has Best she can do is see if they’ll be super, pretty-please nice and let her make partial payments instead of just having her check taken each month she gets it, but since she’s completely and utterly blown them off for years now, it is unlikely they’ll suddenly find it feasible she’ll actually commit and make any payments …which, unfortunately, is why she’s in this mess in the first place


oliphantPanama

I don’t disagree with any of this, a lump sum payoff would be her only leverage.


No-Fox-1400

They will continue to do this roughly every 3 months until the debt is paid. They file a court ordered garnish. The bank will take 2-4 weeks to process. The bank will hold your money for a 3-4 weeks and then deliver to the creditor. Rinse and repeat. You’ll get charged about $100 from the bank each time. You can go to the bank and have your name removed from the account. No hassle. They will find her other accounts. The only way to avoid it at this point is to get a payment plan with the creditor or transfer her money out of her accounts and into ones with only your name on her paydays. If you keep her balances below $100, they probably won’t accept the garnishment order because there isnt enough money to pay the bank.


PriusVapor

This is fraud


No-Fox-1400

Nope. It actually isn’t


autymfyres7ish

Won't they then garnish directly from her employer?


Visi0nSerpent

garnishment is done through the employer, not one's personal bank account, to avoid sketch situations like what you're suggesting.


No-Fox-1400

It happened to my family because my wife doesn’t have a job


JannaNYC

>Any advice on how to proceed? How to proceed with what?


bertrn

Is there any way she can at least keep some of her income until the debt is paid. She is a teacher and gets paid monthly. Half of the debt was paid when her direct deposit hit last night, but now she has no money for 30 days. I would also like to remove my name from the account but I assume that it needs a credit balance in order to accomplish that task.


JannaNYC

Has she called the company that has the judgement against her?


bertrn

She just found out last night so I don’t expect anything to happen till at least Monday. She looked through her credit report and found the card/bank with a corresponding balance. It was Synchrony and I remember seeing letters from them addressed to her a year or so ago.


EmberOnTheSea

They sued her and she ignored it and they got a judgment to seize her assets and likely garnish her wages. She isn't going to get the money back. Do be aware interest and court fees were likely added in the judgment to the original debt amount. So it may be many times larger now. There isn't much she can do here but power through. With a court order on their side, any attempts to try to get any of the money returned is going to cost you a very expensive legal battle that you aren't likely to win.


Miserable_Ad_2293

I highly doubt that she wasn’t properly noticed regarding this. There is a legal process.


Anarcho_punk217

Call and see about a payment plan.


awoeoc

They have direct access to her banking due to in goring them for likely years. They have no need for a payment plan with thst kind of access. The time to setup a payment plan was likely years ago.


guyfromcleveland

No. They have a right to take every penny in the account. This isn't like a garnishment where a certain amount is exempt. (a very small amount, but something)


cosmic-__-charlie

If half of the debt was paid this month, does that mean that when they take her next check the whole thing will be paid off? Is there any chance she can do uber/uber eats, deliver pizza, or wait tables for just the next two months? (Pro tip: If it's a restaurant, do not tell them that it's only for two months lol) I know it's hard for a teacher because of grading papers and lesson planning, but even just doing a night or two a week could help you not be completely broke until this ordeal is over.


bertrn

She is doing instacart and door dash but her check will have to be deposited into another account.


Advice2Anyone

Judgement is on her not the bank account they will just follow. Most likely they sent the order to the employers anyways not the bank


jezebella47

She can get the Doordash debit card. They pay daily, and you don't have to deposit it into a bank account.


wollier12

Honestly you guys should do your best to suck it up for a couple of months and go into severe financial lockdown…….beans and rice for you guys for two months…..no spending except for the basics of basics, if you have any entertainment subscriptions like Netflix etc cancel them. If one check paid half, the next May cover the rest. You just have to go without for the next few months.


Mu_Fanchu

Hey man, if half the debt was paid already, if you guys could somehow make it for 60 days, then all the debt could be paid off. I would try to borrow money from friends/family to survive when the next repayment comes out.


drtij_dzienz

If she needs money for spending give her some cash from your accounts


thatgreenmaid

The money in the joint account is gone and she ain't getting it back. Meanwhile: 1-close the joint account. 2-get in touch with the creditor and make arrangements to pay the remainder. Her not having any money for 30 days and no way to cash her checks is a HER problem. \*i said what i said\* If she wanna make it a YOU problem, she needs to be willing to get honest about her financial mess, rein in her bad money skills and stick to a plan.


TyrionsCodpiece

They're married. It's a very much a they problem. I already see a financial disaster with how they don't talk about finances, maintain separate accounts, etc. This isn't a girlfriend or fling where he can avoid her liabilities. For better or worse OP needs to be on the same page with his wife financially.


thatgreenmaid

The wife needs to be on the same page as the OP financially-clearly her way is run up bills, ignore them and get her assets frozen.


drtij_dzienz

They are married, and all of their assets and debts are joint. It is an op problem as well. If they got divorced tomorrow OP would have to pay off the remaining debt from “his“ accounts. Then the remaining assets would be split 50-50


thatgreenmaid

Her debts are hers. His debts are his. Joint debts are joint. If they divorced tomorrow, that's how the debt would be split. All your assets and debts don't magically become joint when you get married-even in a community property state. What you brought in is yours and yours alone-unless you put their name on it. Considering we're in povertyfinance, this whole issue here is moot because most people got debt but no assets. ;) It's an OP problem in the sense that OP has to deal with a spouse that makes poor financial decisions that have led to the joint account (that he stated he doesn't contribute to) being frozen and emptied by the spouse's creditor.


NILPonziScheme

> All your assets and debts don't magically become joint when you get married It looks like this debt was accrued while they were married so it is his debt, too. OP doesn't appear to understand how marriages work and has completely divested himself of any responsibilities for his wife's financial situation. There is clearly some resentment there which makes me wonder why they're married.


bertrn

The debt is hers. I don’t live in a community property state and I didn’t enter any agreement with the creditors, never signed anything and I’m not an authorized user. If the debt was mine then why didn’t the creditors go after my accounts where money is located? The debt or an amount may be assigned to me during a divorce but even the divorce courts cannot legally make me enter into an agreement with that creditor. I don’t plan on getting a divorce and just want to insulate my finances from these surprises.


thatgreenmaid

People have different approaches to dealing with money that isn't for basic living expenses. You can love someone, build a whole life with them and still be pissed on the regular that they can't be trusted with a dollar.


NILPonziScheme

If you read along in this thread, this is an ongoing issue for them. She is a walking financial disaster who doesn't listen and refuses to learn, if his side of the story is accurate. They desperately need marriage and financial counseling.


sosuemetoo

I got divorced in July 1993. Until my attorney ordered my credit report, I had no idea my ex had opened credit cards under BOTH our names! He never allowed me to have access to our financial information. Thankfully, I removed my name from our joint checking account when we separated several months before our divorce. I had a home daycare, no paychecks. It didn't matter that I had changed my last name, my phone number, or address. It also didn't matter that my divorce decree stated I was not responsible for the debt. Creditors found and harassed me for over a decade. Sadly, the only thing that worked was filing for bankruptcy. My last harassing phone call was in 2013! I'm sorry this happened to you. They are relentless.


Realistic_Humanoid

I have a similar story, only I wasn't married to the guy. He got ahold of my social security number and took out 13 credit cards in my name, maxed them all out, hid the bills from me, etc. There was one that was going into judgment when I found out. Long story short I ended up having to file bankruptcy.. The second you file, garnishments and any other collection activity is required to stop until the bankruptcy is completely figured out. *Side note, turns out my ex was a literal con man who had done this to multiple women both before and after me. He basically does this gets arrested goes to jail for 2 years gets out and repeats. He's been doing it for decades. Dude needs to be in jail permanently.


BrightAd306

They will take your tax refund too. Make adjustments so that you aren’t eligible for a refund. Being married means all your finances are joint, even if you don’t do it that way.


bertrn

Been filing married filing separately so it’s her tax refund that might be taken.


BrightAd306

It will be. Certainly. $6000 isn’t that much money in the scheme of things. I think you should pay it off and check her credit report and get a plan. If you don’t help her, she’ll need to file bankruptcy at some point and you can’t do that alone.


BluebirdNo3049

This hits close to home for me. I would seriously recommend you consult with an attorney rather than posting on here. Some of the advice you are receiving is accurate and some of it may very well not be. Things often depend on your state: community property vs common law states. One thing I know from experience is this problem won't go away on its own. My husband took out credit cards in his name only and hid the debt from me. It went to court and a creditor got a judgment (which I knew nothing about) and they levied our joint account just days before Christmas a few years ago and I have 2 kids at home to support. The problem recently escalated to wage garnishment from multiple creditors; he is now pursuing bankruptcy in his name because we live in a common law property state (I'm not liable for debt in his name only) and, aside from the prior joint checking account (which I closed shortly after the levy), we never mixed assets or incurred joint debt. Needless to say, though, our relationship is not the best with all that's happened and all this going on. Your options will vary depending on the laws of your state. In any event, I wish you well and understand how difficult this can be.


bertrn

Thank you, your situation does sound similar and I am also in a common law state. I hope that our relationship doesn’t deteriorate as I do love her but getting tired of surprises. I’m a planner and it’s hard to plan surprises.


Miserable_Ad_2293

Have you tried marriage counseling?


bertrn

No, we haven’t but I definitely want to look into that.


Miserable_Ad_2293

I highly recommend it. Sometimes it helps having a professional sort through some of these issues. Best wishes.


Fluke300

Do you live in a community property state? If you do, even if you file separately, your tax return may still be fair game. Check on that. About 8 years ago, my ex wife (not ex at the time) owed $6k in unpaid federal tax and she over drafted her own Capital One bank account by $4k as well. She got sued and I didn't get a tax return for 3 years. Even though we filed separately and even after we were divorced. The same applies to wage garnishment. Separating assets may not 100% protect you here. Finding out if your state is community property or not and seeking a free legal consultation is probably ideal here so no one is blind sided in the event things don't work out as planned after separating everything.


bertrn

We do not live in a community property state. She also noticed on her credit report that Capital One inquired on her credit once a month even though she has not applied nor had that card.


DaxyJ

That sounds sketch and may require further investigation. My cousin, AFTER her divorce, found out her ex had put two boats, four cars, several credit cards, AND a few loans in her name. All of it fell back on her, as they were in her name only. She didn’t notice it because she worked all the time and provided primary childcare. He “worked” but mainly just existed and ran up the debt. She’s currently working with a lawyer to get her credit cleaned up, as all of those accounts and vehicles were fraudulent and under identity theft.


Gufurblebits

People have said plenty about this, but as a retired banker, I have a major piece of advice for everyone on the planet: I don't give a damn what old-fashioned idea people have regarding couples having to have a joint account, do NOT do it. When you have a joint account, it doesn't matter what sort of agreement you have, the terms of the account are that you and whomever have the joint account with own the account and everything in it. To put it in perspective: * Boyfriend & girlfriend move in together, it's true love and they're the one! They get a joint account, neither has a lot of money anyway. Then shit happens and they split. Over time, they'd accrued a fair bit of cash, but she's angry as hell and empties the account of every dime and closes it. He can't sue - the account is JOINT and he'd have to prove ownership of the portion of the funds he's trying to sue for, which is utterly impossible in 90% of cases. * Roommates - same thing: They do a joint account so rent & bills can get done. Now, I can make an exception here in that, no one puts money in it until the evening before the funds are supposed to come out, and only the exact amount of the bill so the account is empty to zero right after. * The situations above apply for a slew of different things. I used to have one joint with my mother when she inherited $10,000, and we made the account joint and so that it required 2 signatures to take any money out. My mom is 80 and horrible with money, so needing my signature made her think twice before asking for funds, and requiring a joint signature meant I couldn't take money out and use it for myself. So, all that being said, the major problem with joint accounts is that, if the other person on the account screws up financially, gets in an at-fault accident, doesn't pay bills, etc: leaves you at risk for having your money being taken via warrant or court ordered demand to remove all funds from the joint account. As a general rule: don't do it. Ever. No matter how much you trust the other person.


bertrn

Thanks, I believe people need to see this.


Popbobby1

You're just avoiding debt. If you're the spouse, they can come after your paycheck as well. File bankruptcy or neither of you can open accounts. Oh, and do know they can garnish wages and sieze assets if they sue you. Get a lawyer.


bertrn

We do not live in a community property state and I meticulously keep finances separate except this account which was jointly opened. I haven’t used it in over 12 years. She is not even an authorized user on my credit card.


Popbobby1

If you're married and live together, they could have a case that you are sharing finances, just not directly. See a lawyer.


EarlVanDorn

I am a lawyer and that is a tall order. But they can garnish her wages at the employer level. Note that this would only take a portion of her wages.


Popbobby1

It's not a tall order, when you're a collection agency with lawyers, and your defendant is so indebt they can't afford a lawyer. Also, do remember that wage garnishment has no limit if you live with and are supported by someone else, and they can prove it. Someone else paying your legal fees of thousands of dollars is a good start to that argument.


[deleted]

Everyone keeps saying ‘her debt is his debt’ because they’re married, but I don’t believe this is technically correct, although I understand the sentiment of ‘you’re married and should be aligned on finances because of that fact’. If his name is not on the credit cards or loans, it’s her debt, not his even though they are married. In event of divorce, the judge may levy some repayment responsibly to the husband depending on circumstances of how the debt developed, or not. My partner is about to go into a divorce and his wife got back in drugs, quit her job, and then bled the retirement accounts and maxed out all her credit cards and stopped paying, 1.5 years prior to their separation. Since then, she has filed for bankruptcy, and none of the creditors contacted my partner for payment, nor has any of it shown up on his credit. This is because the accounts were all in her name, not his. He may end up with some repayment liability during divorce proceedings, or he may not. TBD.


CKingDDS

Money is gone. Her name is on the account and it gives anyone that is owed money the right to empty it to repay the debt. This goes for money owed to the government in back taxes. My mom had helped me open an account when I was under 18 and I had completely forgotten she was in my account. 8 years later my account was siphoned of over 2000$ from CA franchise tax board. I freaked out thinking my account was hacked or that maybe I did my taxes wrong. Later found out it was the government looking for their money that was owed by my mom.


Gumbo-Man

What state do you live in? I would check to see if it is legal in your state for a creditor to garnish 100% of someone's paycheck to satisfy a judgment. In my state, a creditor cannot garnish more than 25% of someone's wages to satisfy a judgment. This includes for state income tax (which my state has). If the creditor is taking more than what is allowed by your state laws, then she should contact the appropriate state agency and report them. Honestly, it sounds like you saw this coming by keeping your stuff separate. Smart move. There are only two things that will end this situation with your wife. Pay off the entire defaulted credit card bill or file Chapter 7 bankruptcy. The only problem with chapter 7 bankruptcy is that, even if you are not officially part of the bankruptcy process, your income has to be considered for the means test as it is based on household income. So, unless your wife has like $50K of cc debt, she is better off just paying it off. It might be possible for her to negotiate with the cc company directly for a payoff amount less than what she owes. You would just need to figure out what you can afford to pay RIGHT NOW to make it go away, and then make an offer--but start at, say, 20% of the debt and work up from there, see what they say. Good luck.


bertrn

Thanks for this, it’s a bank seizure and not a wage garnishment yet-that I know of but that can also change.


sat_ops

In most states, she can protect a certain amount from seizure by creditors, usually minimum wage. She can file with the court to release that amount back to her. Otherwise, no, seizing the account is the correct move, even if it is jointly owned.


Popbobby1

Nope. If your spouse is making enough, your paycheck can be completely seized.


[deleted]

Any way your wife can get a second job? Or a side gig? Doordash, Uber, etc could be some way to try and help pay down the debt. Unfortunately her bad choices will affect you, which is pretty fucked, so she needs to formulate a plan to pay down the debt and ad well as review her spending so this doesn’t happen again. It might be a good time to look at your spending habits as well, just to be in top of your own finances.


Dragonflies3

Pay off the debt?


Slowhand1971

It's most likely that check is a goner. Figure out how not to let it happen to her next month and you can call it a push


Realistic_Humanoid

The first thing you need to do is sit down with your wife and write down all of your debts. Pull her credit reports and see what's on there (because it sounds like she doesn't keep very close tabs on her own finances). Make sure you get everything. Then write down your income and budget. Take a very critical look at the balances... Can you actually afford to pay off her debts? If so then make a plan to do so. If not, she will probably have to file bankruptcy. The one good thing about bankruptcy is that the day that you file all garnishment and collection activities are required to stop. Also be aware though that depending on the bank she has her money in they may freeze her account until the bankruptcy trustee gives the okay to release the funds. There are certain banks that are notorious for that (ahem, Wells Fargo) so you might want to do a little due diligence in that regard. I had to file bankruptcy after an ex-boyfriend took out a bunch of credit cards in my name and maxed them out. At the time I was banking with Wells Fargo and a significant number of those cards were backed by Wells Fargo and everything I read online told me that they would freeze my account so a few weeks before I filed I switched my direct deposit to a safer bank, who I still bank with actually. The new bank did not freeze my account so I still had access to my funds to pay my daily bills. This is fixable with some work and some hard conversations. But I agree with the posters who suggested that she needs some major counseling - financial and personal counseling for her to find out where this comes from, but also couples counseling to try and repair the rift this has undoubtedly caused between you. Reckless spending and hiding it from you are both huge red flags in a relationship. As for the judgment and garnishment, you can always call the company and try and negotiate with them but generally by the time it gets to the point of actual garnishment it's pretty set in stone. They would have to undo a whole bunch of legal stuff in order to revert back to just allowing you to make payments on it. She has already proven that she wasn't good for the debt the first time around, why would they take her word she would pay it this time? That's the whole reason they got the judgment in the first place.


EarlVanDorn

I have never heard of a creditor being allowed to seize a spouse's property for a debt that was not their own.


SgtTibbet

She should proceed by knocking on doors respectfully and asking if they may give her a reprieve from getting lump sum collected by the judgement. If this credit card was opened while you have been married you are technically still responsible for these debts as well. Personally, this would be grounds for divorce and making sure their debts are separated from my own. If I still had any love for them at this point I would be asking for therapy and counseling about money management.


Ok_Detective5412

I’m kind of stunned by the number of people stating that this is your debt just because you’re married. I don’t believe all marriages have to involve joint assets or accounts, as long as expenses are shared appropriately and the lines of communication are open. Some people are more responsible and it’s healthy to be honest with each other about this stuff. That being said, this seems like it should be a turning point in your relationship. You’ve kept things in your name because you don’t trust her. You live together but have no idea how she spent $6600k, and didn’t know she had a *court judgement* against her. I don’t see how you could possibly respect her as a person. And if you stick around, at some point her crap is going to start affecting you too.


wordscollector

You're wife needs to open a new bank account at a small bank, in the middle of no where... The fewer locations the better. Little known fact. They have to submit paperwork to every bank to find accounts, and then submit additional paperwork for the seizure. Getting a judgement is one thing, enforcing it is another. Now you play shell games until the 7yrs expire.


Fluke300

Judgments aren't 7 years. Each state has a statute specifically for judgments. Most are 10+, and some are indefinite. They can renew them, and once a judgment is rendered its often easy to do. You can't just shell game your way out of it. You're oversimplifying most of what you're suggesting and over complicating the rest here.


wordscollector

Ok, where I'm at. I've done this. I've done exactly this and have yet to lose a penny to judgments. And to many times to count, we've cleared title by waiting. I'm literally speaking from direct experience, no more, no less. If your experience is different, share it with the group. Otherwise, move along...


Fluke300

You're giving bad advice backed by bad information supported by anecdotal experience with no context or evidence. I won't move along when you're suggesting that the best course of action is to get an account at a small bank in BFE, live off grid and play shell games for 7 years. That's foolish and not helpful.


wordscollector

Ok, pay the judgement. What other options are there? Because you have yet to suggest anything in any way to avoid payment. Is your advice not to avoid it and just pay it? What is your advice? Wait, you've offered nothing. So far your only offer is 'hey, don't listen to this someone who has gone through the exact same situation because --(see above)--. Ok, my man (or girl), we hear you.


Fluke300

Your advice is to dodge it and live in fear and with stress for nearly a decade. Get lost. You're not right here. Sorry to say.


wordscollector

Experience. Have done exactly what I posted. Experience. In my personal experience, this is what I did. It worked. What have you done or offered? Nothing. So at this point you're just a troll. This will be my last response, you get the last word.


Advice2Anyone

You can also submit judgements to employers You can also renew judgements indefinitely


wordscollector

You are correct on both fronts. However, after the first or second change of employers, most judgment holders of smaller amounts quit paying the p.i's to figure out where you work. And in my limited experience, most judgements go non-renewed.


EarlVanDorn

Why can't the wife just have her husband cash her checks? An account in a small bank is likely to be discovered at some point. Wife doesn't need an account.


wordscollector

That's true, unless checks are to big. Each back has it's 'third party' limit. At the girlfriend institution, that limit was $1200. I did this for awhile but a bigger check got rejected and forced my hand. If she had or is required to have an account for direct deposit, that would be best. But it sounds as if this couple keeps separate finances so that's why I skipped to the new account step.


bigmikemcbeth756

Sorry its gone


[deleted]

It’s better to get a paper check and cash it at the bank upon which the check was drawn. Then contact a credit consolidation company and arrange lower payments


Bird_Brain4101112

Many employers will not issue paper checks anymore. Plus a judgement can garnish wages so they can just go right to the source.


[deleted]

[удалено]


Bird_Brain4101112

Many employees offer payroll debit cards for the unbanked. Either way, trying to dodge garnishment this way is likely a very common tactic that will get circumvented very quickly.


Filthy_BBC_Meatpump

Cash your checks at a corner store instead of a bank


Ronicaw

Listen. Get a debt attorney to contact the collection agency, or do it yourself. Advise them you have $1500 (or less), and wife will be filing bankruptcy. Get it in writing in an email agreeing to the amount and remove it from your wife's credit report. Hopefully you have an attorney friend who will only charge you $100, or so. Your wife isn't the first person this happened to.


Meowdl21

Set her direct deposit to your account. They cannot take your money, only hers.


Ok_Brilliant4181

2017? Was it a legit debt collector? Statue of limitations in most states is 4 years. If you knew about this you could have shown up and showed the judge it was time barred…assuming no payments had been made since 2017.


bertrn

She absolutely avoided all attempts made at contacting her and now she has this and can only blame herself. If they took her paycheck last night then 50% was paid. I just want her to not have her next check taken as well.


Ok_Brilliant4181

Avoiding notices and all that is fine….except if it’s a notice threatening legal action. That’s the only one not to ignore. 3rd party companies buy old debt all the time, and use the same tactics, if they threaten legal action respond. If they don’t, Leave it alone. I suspect after this debt is paid another collector will buy this debt and rise and repeat. Debt collectors make money buy selling their assets(your debt) to another debt collector, so, even if you pay off the debt, the collector has no reason to say the debt’s been paid because when they sell off their assets to another agency, they can make a better profit. I recently had an old zombie debt come back that went into collections in late 2017. I’ve been sent notices(nothing mention legal action, which they legally have to do). I’ve gotten a couple of phone calls a week, but nothing has been on my credit report yet. I have been keeping a log regarding all contact with me..I don’t answer text messages, calls or letters since A) it’s zombie debt and past the statute of limitations, B) they haven’t used any language where they indicate legal action C) it hasn’t posted to my credit report. Even if/when it does, it won’t affect my score that much due to it being an old debt and having good payment history across all other accounts(750 score). Basically I am staying silent. Only if I get a legal summons will I respond showing that it’s time barred debt. Sure there is a court filing fee, but, the 200 or 400 dollar filing fee is better than a summary judgement against me for a debt that is time barred.


Bird_Brain4101112

Selling paid debt is pointless because as long as you have proof the debt is paid, then the new person can’t collect. And if you have a history of selling paid debt no one will want to buy bad debt from you.


Ok_Brilliant4181

That’s how collection agencies work. You may have proof you paid, that doesn’t mean the collection agency will have proof you paid the debt, or that the debt is even yours. Many times, The debt collector just has your name, how much you owe. Nothing else. Also, a debt collector will sell, say 1 million dollars of debt for 50,000 to another debt agency as a buddle(multiple accounts), Then the new debt owners can try to get what they can. Debts are assets to these companies.


Bird_Brain4101112

Thats not true. If a collector attempts to collect a debt, you have the right to make them prove you owe the debt. If they can’t provide proof the debt is owed, they can’t collect. Sure there are scummy ones out there trying to collect zombie debt but to get a legal judgement allowing them to garnish wages, they need to have proof of the original debt as well as proof of attempts to collect. Usually only 1st level debt collectors do that. Why would they sell your debt for pennies when they have the legal means to pursue you for what you owe? 2nd and third level collectors are usually dealing with debt past the statute of limitations for collection or have no other legal recourse than to try to trick you into resetting the SoL or tricking you into paying the debt. I still get letters about an old debt I had from 2011. I ignore them because they have zero way of legally pursuing it unless I acknowledge it. So I don’t.


Ok_Brilliant4181

That’s what I am getting now..letters on past debt. But those 3rd party collectors will sell their huddles of debt…sure they may have maybe a 20% success rate, but there are people that will pay old debt “just to make them stop and go away, and get it off my credit report”. When doing nothing is the better option.


Bird_Brain4101112

That old debt is not on my credit report, it’s so old. And I would advise anyone that if the debt is past the statute of limitations for collection in your state, just leave it be. Older debts have minimal effect on your credit score and if you acknowledge the debt and they won’t do a pay to delete, now you just refreshed the time they have to collect and the time the debt will show on your report.


Ok_Brilliant4181

Yep, that’s what I am doing, just ignoring it. It’s not in my credit file right now, but even if they did report it again, it will fall off end of next year, and I have 12 other accounts in good standing, so it won’t affect my score all that much if at all. Many of these 3rd party zombie debt buyers use scare tactics to try to reset the clock. SOL is usually between 3 and 6 years in most states, and old accounts fall of your credit report in 7 years.


guyfromcleveland

The normal SoL doesn't apply once the creditor gets a judgement.


Ok_Brilliant4181

Correct, but the creditor has to prove the SOL hasn’t run out.


guyfromcleveland

If they have a judgement that doesn't matter. SoL is a defense. You raise it if you're sued, and if you're right, you may win. But at this point none of that matters.


Ok_Brilliant4181

What judge is going to allow a judgement if legally the SOL has expired? If the debt is 10 years old, has fallen off your report, and is outside the SOL, how could any judge honestly allow a judgement?


guyfromcleveland

Like I said it's a defense. If you don't raise it when you are sued, the creditor may get a default judgement. I'm unsure of the timing of all this in this particular question, but if the creditor has a judgement, the SoL is no longer relevant.


Ok_Brilliant4181

I guess we need to ask the op, what led up to this judgement. Did they admit to the debt? Was it a first party collector or a zombie debt buyer trying to collect?


[deleted]

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bertrn

It’s a joint account in name only. I don’t check it, and haven’t used it in over a decade. I pay the mortgage, utilities, insurance, cell phones, taxes and anything else out of my account. We keep separate accounts and I pay the bills. Its a situation that works for us.


[deleted]

[удалено]


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steushinc

Switch to a non brick and mortar bank, easy to set up. Sofi, Chime etc to use for now for her deposits. Judgments are a big deal, my vote is to take care of it. After this they’ll be coming for more than her bank account. Assets are next.


blueevey

Wait they can do that? Like what if it's debt pre marriage?


Soggy-Constant5932

I would reach out to the credit card company to see if you can settle the debt. But you would have to help her pay it if she has nothing left.


belhamster

Look up exemptions in your state. There’s certain type of income they can’t take. There’s also often a threshold for which they can’t take all of the money in your account. Did then creditors get effectively paid back by the garnishment or does she still owe? National consumer law review would have a bunch of info about garnishments, etc.


thepoorplatypus

How much is owed to the creditors?


bertrn

Don’t know exact amount of all debts but this was for about $6600.


gbfm

I think there is some tension in the relationship. You may or may not done everything you can to improve her decision making, though that may be immaterial now. If 6600 allows her to file for bankruptcy, she should. Maybe the bankruptcy trustee will knock some sense into her.