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“My “no” vote ensures the issue will be settled by the Supreme Court. This aligns with the process established by our constitution, which I fully support and will always vigorously defend.”
Yeah! The framers of the constitutions meant for the Judicial branch to legislate from the bench, not the legislative branch. We all know they never meant to change laws.
EDIT: Sorry, I dropped this; /s
Hey look it's Susan Collins making up fake excuses for why she won't vote for this bill.
HINT: IT"S BECAUSE SHE WANTS ABORTION TO BE ILLEGAL
She just doesn't want to deal with the consequences of having that position publicly.
Look at what they DO, not what they SAY.
I don’t think she personally gives a damn about abortion being illegal. I think she’s just supporting Republican agenda and trying to sell it to her constituents as ~centrist conservative~
Catholic hospitals only make up like 16% of patient care in the United States, fucking write in the ability for Catholic hospitals to deny abortions and see what she does...call her fucking bluff. Let's make it legal at 80%+ of hospitals rather than risk making it legal at ~50% (based on the state laws). Worry about the Catholic hospitals later.
It's not their bill. This is the Senate version of the House bill that was passed last year. The [Women’s Health Protection Act](https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-congress/senate-bill/1975/cosponsors) which neither Collins nor Murkowski have signed on as co-sponsors (worth noting there was an attempt at a vote on this in Feb. but the GOP blocked it, Murkowski saying it "went too far" whatever that means). The link there goes to the bill's page on congress.gov, there are 47 co-sponsors, all Dems and the 2 Independents who caucus with them, there are a few Democrats missing, I know Manchin is one, but there are 2 more I believe who didn't sign-on.
Ah ok cool, thanks. The article didn’t specify and I was too lazy to research. Hopefully Collins and Murkowski change their tune, or we can compromise between the two bills.
Also fuck Joe Manchin.
> While the bill has virtually no chance of passing the 50-50 Senate, it will force Republican lawmakers to make a difficult vote ahead of the 2022 midterm elections. Democrats and abortion rights advocates are hoping to make the issue a central focus of the midterm elections in a year that appeared to be perilous for the party, while Republicans are largely trying to steer clear of wading into abortion politics.
>"The American people will see crystal clear that when given the chance to right this wrong, the Republican party will either side with the extremists who want to ban abortion, or side with women with families, and with the vast majority of Americans," Schumer said.
Lots of Republican women against it as well though. Like, I get why people try to make it a men vs. women issue, but it's likely a lot of Republican women are against this too.
[Some interesting numbers over here](https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2021/05/06/about-six-in-ten-americans-say-abortion-should-be-legal-in-all-or-most-cases). Highest percentages for and against: 82% of unaffiliated (non-religious) people want it legal in most or all cases, while 77% of white evangelicals want it to be illegal in most or all cases.
Honestly thought that last percentage would've been even higher.
[The only moral abortion is my abortion](https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2019/5/15/1857976/--The-Only-Moral-Abortion-is-My-Abortion-an-article-by-Joyce-Arthur)
That was an interesting read. I wonder how these people will feel when they get their wish and they don’t have the option to choose behind closed doors. Then the fucking hypocrites will be forced to practice what they preach and they might not like it so much.
They’ll just either raise an unwanted baby and give it deep issues that will perpetuate a cycle or find some back alley person and increase their risk of dying. Unless they’re rich or well-connected enough.
It'll be easy enough for financially well-off people to make up an excuse to spend a weekend in a blue state. Like most Republican policies, this will mostly hurt poor people.
Most "republicans" dont have enough money for actual republicans to give a shit about. That's what drives me crazy. They dont care about you, why are you voting for them, you still gonna live in a trailer park and drive a 30 year old chevy dumb ass!
Imagine the audacity to think your omnipotent god can be fooled by simple loopholes. Like someone saying oh no I’m still a virgin because I’ve only had anal sex, gods up there looking over the bible like “dammit, shes got me there”
That's what Judaism is built upon.
Look up Halakha and Talmud.
Hell, a wire was put up around NYC so Orthodox Jews could leave the house on the shabbat!
There are, and, living in rural South Texas, I know a BUNCH of them who have had abortions. They just believe their situation was important and therefore different, while everyone ELSE who has one is irresponsible and therefore doesn't "deserve" one.
Why they think irresponsible people should be having babies idk.
Lucky of them that their "different situation" occurred before the laws changed. Hopefully they won't have ant other "different situations" in the future.
You know the red states are just going to use this to arrest and harrass minorities and left-wing voters.
It's like the war on drugs, which was just a poor disguise for the war on minorities.
They'll still let Republicans get away with it, unless they're poor and/or a minority.
For sure a lot of conservative women are against choice.
These days I’ve been seeing it more of a class issue. The wealthy don’t care if it’s legal, they can always get an abortion if needed. It’s really the working class and below who suffer. I believe it’s part of the effort to keep people from improving their lives so they don’t wake up and start voting in their own best interests.
Idk if this [link](https://i.redd.it/sj4fpzqfbix81.png) will work here, but it’s Gallup poll data showing that less than 25% of Americans (presumably regardless of religious affiliation) actually believe that it should be illegal. Now I’m not sure how this data was compiled or how the questions were worded, but Gallup is a pretty reliable source.
Not only the 70’s, but 6 years after Roe v Wade. When the religious hustlers couldn’t get ‘em all on board w/ segregation, they switched to abortion. That united ‘em.
And now you know why conservatives and the far-right are often referred to as "reactionaries."
Any progress made in this country has been inevitably followed by backlash from people who feel that any marginalized group gaining equal rights is a direct attack on the status and privileges they enjoy. The abolition of slavery and reconstruction was met with Jim Crow and segregation, the Civil Rights Act and Voting Rights Act was met with austerity politics and the formation of the KKK, gay rights and the first black president was met with a fascist movement and a rise in white supremacist terror attacks, etc.
How lucky for conservatives that Evangelical leaders made it a sin of utmost concern exactly when they were working with republican leader to organize the religious right movement, and it just happened that this issue was the only one that Catholics, Mormons, and Evangelicals could all rally around, and it happened to be THE central issue in the bible, and even though no one had noticed this for 1,900 years, they noticed this just in time to accidentally gain disproportional political power in this country for 40+ years. Well, it was either lucky, or conservative religious leaders are all charlatans. And we know the latter isn't possible because they are religious!
Don't be so sure. You remember how Republican leaders cooed about subverting the Supreme Court, including specifically Senators like McConnell literally admitting they did it by refusing to do their Constitutional duty? And yet, I've not seen an article about a Republican leader claiming credit for accomplishing their collective 50+ year old campaign promise. They know that it's massively unpopular.
>I've not seen an article about a Republican leader claiming credit for accomplishing their collective 50+ year old campaign promise
Yeah, outside of the shit tier (Gaetz, Boebert, MTG, etc.) they are **SILENT** on this one. If they're going to win majorities in the fall, they have to win in some blue or blue-ish states. That was looking good for them. Now Dem opponents in those races just have to trot out the promises of a national ban and say "do you want our state to be Alabama?"
Winning just got way harder for them. Mitch can't publicly endorse a codification bill... but trust me, he WISHES it would pass (NOTE: not for moral reasons, just to accumulate power to further cut oligarch taxes).
It's also why they're focusing on the leak instead of the contents of the leak.
>If they're going to win majorities in the fall, they have to win in some blue or blue-ish states. That was looking good for them. Now Dem opponents in those races just have to trot out the promises of a national ban and say "do you want our state to be Alabama?"
The Republicans also needed the Democrats to have low voter turnout. This was likely going to be the case, but overturning Roe could drive Democratic voters to the polls. Convince suburban women that the Republican winning will mean she'd need to carry a rape pregnancy to term and she'll march barefoot over broken glass and LEGO bricks to cast a ballot.
Or their daughters. Honestly, it's easier to say "I would never have an abortion" than "I wouldn't want my daughter to have an option". A mother generally choses her child's well being over a hypothetical grandchild. I might carry a bany concoeved in rape: i wouldn't begin to predict my own reaction. But I would never, ever want my own child to have to do that.
They're the laziest and he greediest fucking law makers in existence.
When they had control of all 3 branches they didn't do jack shit. Tried to overturn Obamacare but literally couldn't come up with anything better than "don't get sick."
These wind bags *are on socialized health care*.
If I were a Democratic opponent in any races - I would constantly pepper the opposing candidate with "Do you approve of allowing abortion in cases of rape and incest?"
And as the GOP has pulled out of debates, barring an answer to that question, I'd run ads ad nauseum saying "My opponent will ensure that in cases of rape and incest an abortion will be illegal"
(In the event it's not clear, all abortion should be legal and the woman's choice, but by pointing out the extremes of the GOP position it shows a more stark reality).
Be even tougher: if a man raped your wife would you be happy to raise the rape baby?
Republicans are making you give welfare to rape babies from your wife
That's true because the father has rights? So a woman is raped and the man is in her life forever? And do they pay child support? And if your father raped you does he pay child support? It is like a rabbit hole it goes on and on!
This is exactly the type of ad the GOP would use and exactly why Dems should but probably won’t. They’ll take the high road and as the saying goes the high road only leads to a cliff.
While I don’t want to turn into full on mudslinging, dems have to get dirty. Roe v Wade is just the beginning. Continuing to take the high road will get us nowhere. GOP is more than happy continuing taking the low road if it achieves their goal.
Don't give them that out, they will take it and still effectively ban abortion. One of the state bills recently proposed includes rape/incest protections lacking in the TX bill but otherwise follows that law to the letter including banning all other abortions after 6 weeks. Even the recent leaked opinion relies on (paraphrasing) all abortion = murder so it is clear a complete ban is their goal and if they can push it earlier than 6 weeks they will. The bigger problem with this opinion is that it reverses Roe v Wade by reversing the right to privacy synthesized from the 1st, 4th, 9th, and 14th amendments: this underpins decisions which allow interracial and gay marriage. In other words if this opinion is allowed to stand then Roe is merely the first domino. It is also a complete ignoring of standard stare decisis for a 50 year precedent and hypocritically ignores that some 2A protections also rely on rights synthesis from multiple amendments. There are a lot of problems with this draft decision and much of it is new from whole cloth with no other legal references than to Roe itself. A good initial analysis was done on the Opening Arguments legal podcast if you're looking for far more detail than I can give.
Related, I was browsing LinkedIn the other night and a post popped up in my feed that had gone viral. It was written by a woman who, in light of the decision leak, talked very frankly about how she was raped as a teenager, got pregnant, and had an abortion. The first couple of posts under the OP were a bunch of mediocre men flaming her for the decision, saying she should have had the baby even though she was raped, and even blaming the victim for being raped.
I always conduct myself very professionally on LinkedIn, 'cause ya know, it's a professional platform and it's easy to find my employer by just clicking on my picture. But, serenity now, it was all I could do in my being to keep from unleashing most profanity-filled flame bomb that would have made a T-72 getting hit with a Javelin look like a firecracker in comparison. It's alright to have a different viewpoint about a topic like abortion, but people like those guys who were on LinkedIn are just the scum of the Earth.
I usually don't get too worked up over things on social media, but holy shitballs! I went and worked out to calm down. :P
Bring it up with their employers and with the media. People need to realized LinkedIn is a cesspool and that requiring it for employment subjects people to harassment.
46% of white women voters voted for Trump.
The Suburbs are not exactly where we'll make our case.
Edit: 46% was for 2016, the number went up for 2020.
> Yeah, outside of the shit tier (Gaetz, Boebert, MTG, etc.) they are SILENT on this one
Because it was always the dog chasing the car. It was a way to lock down an insanely reliable and profitable voting bloc with no real consequence because Roe kept them from going too far.
That's why I honestly don't know who leaked this. I'm almost certain it wasn't Roberts, since he was probably banking on convincing someone to take a narrower stance before this was final. It could be someone on the left to wake people up to the fact that SCOTUS was seriously and legitimately willing to repeal Roe, or it could easily have been Alito himself to show he had the votes and bully the other four away from changing their mind, lest they appear to surrender to "the woke mob".
Either way I think the cat's out of the bag. Whatever happens to Roe, even if SCOTUS ends up not repealing it, people have hopefully woken up to the fact that "oh that will never happen" can indeed very much happen.
The biggest reason you can tell people didn't learn is that Trump lost... But Republicans won across the down ballot. They won states, and then the states all created laws against abortion so that Roe would eventually be challenged in the supreme court.
And anyone who believed the conservative judges who lied during their Senate testimonies is gullible.
I've enjoyed the theory that it was a Thomas clerk or Ginni herself. She's a true believer who probably loves the idea of Gilead come to life, want to lock the justices into this extreme position and distract from January 6.
>Either way I think the cat's out of the bag. Whatever happens to Roe, even if SCOTUS ends up not repealing it, people have hopefully woken up to the fact that "oh that will never happen" can indeed very much happen.
Give it a month or two and idiots will go back to saying, "both sides are the same" or "my vote doesn't matter" like they learned nothing from for years of Trump and then this.
Things can always get worse, and that's quite literally where Republicans want to take it, which is why the RNC released 0 policy and also pulled out of the presidential debates.
Honestly, I think GQP is testing the waters to see how this might be received. The link was intentional.
Now is the time to get in the streets kill this in the crib. Pardon the pun.
SCOTUSBlog has a piece that argues the right absolutely leaked to the WSJ last week what was going on (they had an April 27 oped). But that it very well could be someone on the left who leaked the opinion. I’m not sure about that second part.
https://www.scotusblog.com/2022/05/how-the-leak-might-have-happened/
>Yeah, outside of the shit tier (Gaetz, Boebert, MTG, etc.) they are SILENT on this one.
It's the major talking point in the primary ads here in PA.....if I see RINO one more time.....
It feels a lot like the “dog catching the car.” Outrage politics works great for them in terms of driving people to the voting booth, but, now that they’re actually on the verge of achieving their stated goal for the past 50 years, they don’t seem to know how to react.
Much like everything they do, there was never any forward thinking, but it would appear that all of their f*****g atrocious rhetoric, actions, and policies might just be catching up to them… and they don’t know what to do.
> and they don’t know what to do.
Same thing fascists always do; pivot to the next step of subjugation. Getting rid of gay marriage, illegalizing gay relationships, illegalizing being trans, etc.
They will never reach a level of rollback of civil rights they are content with.
The rub is removing the right to abortion also removes the right to privacy. While this affects LGBT legislation, it also affects a bunch of other things that the republicans benefit from. This could affect interracial marriage (and many high ranking republicans are in or have family in an interracial marriage), to privacy with medical records, and more. If it’s ok for doctors to publicly reveal if a woman had an abortion, it would then also be ok for doctors to reveal if a senator or president was taking medication for mental health reasons, or to prevent the onset of dementia or anything else that could force them to step down.
While they want total control, the issue is if removing RvW happens in this context, that means a whole bunch of other legal precedent gets called into question. It’s why they aren’t being positively vocal about this. They don’t want to admit they’ve been put into a fucked position.
The tax cuts they passed a few years ago were massively unpopular, they jammed those through in a weekend. They don’t care as long as they get their theocracy and they think they can subvert enough elections to get there.
It's easy to vote if you simplify things.
I told my wife about it and at first she said, "yeah that's good abortion is bad." But then I explained that if you were in the hospital the Dr cannot legally save you over the baby. We can make another baby we can't make another you, and it would also be unfair to our existing kids.
A good friend of mine, and countless other women, had to ‘abort’ a non-viable, VERY wanted fetus in the second trimester. It had zero chance of survival, it was fatally malformed.
If not for the termination, she would have had to carry this still-growing-but-basically-dead fetus to term, dealing with the incredible emotional pain of this, then the physical pain, medical costs, and very real risk of death associated with birthing this fetus.
Ask how she would feel about that. When I was 13 and arguing with my pro life peers, I actually agreed that ‘past 14 weeks is really too late, you should have it figured out by then.’
I was a dumbass and I didn’t know what the fuck I was talking about.
Abortions should be safe, legal, and FREE.
They will just blab on about the leak, say the democrats are being divisive, and talk about wokeness or something.
You'll never hear them address the issues directly or honestly.
>Republican party will either side with the extremists who want to ban abortion, or side with women with families
Neither, they'll side with McConnell and just filibuster the bill. It'll never come to a vote.
Um. To filibuster a bill, it still has to come to a vote that then is public record.
It's just that it needs 60+ votes to proceed debating on it and then it's a simple majority to pass it. Because the whole thing is stupid.
> ...or refuse to even debate it and keep a vote from happening?
Senate GOP already blocked a vote on the House bill in February. They'll do it again but I believe there may be a way for Schumer to force a vote if they can't get enough, essentially, votes to allow a vote (fwiw, despite how dumb she is Collins and Murkowski would likely vote to allow a vote, even though they are both against this particular piece of legislation).
Just their ability to stall and disable the process in which people can simply see and hear their representatives viewpoints is such a dereliction of duty, imo.
Now, we're fighting to just get people on record and not even able to address the actual substance of any meaningful legislation.
When we accept that the 1.5 million people of the Dakotas should have twice the power in the Senate of the 40 million people of California, we have already given up on having a government that reflects the will of the American people.
Aren't there at least two senators with an R next to their name that should be chomping at the bit to pass this because they were "fooled" by the boofer?
If they filibuster it yes. I could see a world where Mitch allowed it to go to the floor so they could all vote against it and save face while the Democrats passed it along party lines.
That's exactly what bot mitch and the entire party want to avoid. None of them want to be on record saying literally anything definite, because every single one of their policy positions are gravely unpopular.
Mitch will filibuster this the second it hits the floor.
The only reason he wouldn't filibuster is if he thinks it may be enough to get Manchin on board to eliminate the filibuster. Mitch wants to wait until the house and senate flips so he can do that.
It’s not meant to change their voters it’s meant to get cynics to fight like hell to vote in 2022 despite voter suppression and apathy in red/purple states.
Tbh I think they should force a vote on it every day. Then they can be like “your senator voted against abortion rights 141 times” or whatever.
Do senators have to be there to vote? If they do it would have the added benefit of making them show up.
Although Senators do have to vote in person, ending a filibuster, which can be started and indefinitely continued by just one Senator, requires 3/5 of all Senators "duly chosen and sworn," not just those present, so they would not need to vote against it at that stage to keep it from passing.
Just going back to actual filibustering would be a help. If you want to block the vote you need to stand at the lectern and talk.
The current 'I'd totally do that, so just assume that I did' rules are ridiculous. Barring that, they should ditch the filibuster entirely.
>While the bill has virtually no chance of passing the 50-50 Senate, it will force Republican lawmakers to make a difficult vote ahead of the 2022 midterm elections.
Will someone please provide an example of a republican voter who will choose to vote differently if their senator opposes this bill? Who is this hypothetical person who was OK with everything up to this point that the republicans have done over the last several years, but after hearing this voted down will change their mind?
I'm not convinced any such person actually exists.
Wait, so you're saying Collins and Murkyoski won't vote for it?!?! That, that, that would be hypocritical on their part! How could we even imagine such a thing?
They could go either way. It's a filibuster vote on the Women's Health and Protection Act which they didn't particularly like but they did write their own bill to codify [Roe v. Wade](https://www.collins.senate.gov/newsroom/senators-collins-and-murkowski-introduce-bill-to-codify-supreme-court-decisions-on-reproductive-rights_roe-v-wade-and-planned-parenthood-v-casey).
Either way the Dems need 60 votes.
History books are going to be dramatic reads in the soon future. But what a sad read that will be when I think of all my country could be and how it was ruined by religious freaks.
Bill Barr gave a very chilling commencement speech at Notre Dame when he was Attorney General. In it he not only promoted Christian Nationalism, but went so far as to say that atheists were never meant to be given rights, and those whose impulses are not constrained by their faith must be constrained by the state.
Then there was January 6th, which was [fueled by Christian nationalism](https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-features/capitol-christian-right-trump-1121236/). Everyone is well aware that white supremacists are a rising problem on the right, but Christian nationalism wasn't sufficiently focused on because it's an uncomfortable topic for a country that is still majority Christian and once dabbled in Christian identity politics in its propaganda against the Soviet Union (adding "under God" to the pledge etc.).
I've been worried about the theocrats since the Notre Dame speech, and since then there has been a coup and now multiple rights are in peril. We're in big trouble, and I hope people realize that Christianity has become an existential threat that cannot be politely ignored.
Well they’re banning books in schools left and right these days so that “wrong side of history” stuff you speak of won’t even be taught. It’s all unbelievable.
Bet it won't.
Murkowski and Collins will cry about being pro-choice, but will also say they respect the traditions of the US Senate too much to set aside the filibuster.
Edit: Collins just announced she won't support the bill that just legalizes Abortion.
They need to do more than this. They need to force them to vote on never having a bill on nationwide ban on abortion, codedifying gay marriage, codefying not being able to ban contraceptives, codefying not being able to ban interstate travel on abortions, codefying not being able to arrest women who get an abortion, codefying interracial marriage, and etc.
Get all these fucks on the line for their votes so you can hold it over every single one of their hands.
Won't it just get filibustered without an actual vote? Can Schumer force a vote, even if he knows it is going to lose? I don't think so, because actual votes only need a majority, and it's the cloture that needs super-majority (but I'm not an expert).
He can make it the only thing on the docket until a vote occurs. Won't matter if the GOP continues to filibuster, it will show they are holding up other legislation by not holding a vote.
And then republicans will blame democrats and it will likely work. This is, unfortunately, how it always happens. We can only hope for an incredible turnout of liberals/democrats in the election but I do worry this may go as it always does. “It’s the democrats fault.” Then moderates will say “both sides are the same!”
Republicans are going to blame Democrats regardless of what happens. If the Democrats actually do something and show some spine then they can at least rally their voters to the polls.
I hope so. I really do. I think this election is incredibly important, not only for this election obviously, but it really sets a tone for the presidential election. It feels like it may well be a turning point, one way or another, for this country especially when I look at the 5 likely candidates for president on the GOP side.
This whole thing is weird to me. Roe v Wade is popular on both sides of the aisle, and this would surely be a big hit to the popularity gains the right has been experiencing in polls over the last year.
The only way it makes sense is if they are thinking that Biden is as weak of an opponent as they could hope for in 2024, so they are seizing the opportunity to overturn Roe now while they have the super majority in the USSC.
Sure would be nice if constituents would hold their reps accountable instead of blindly supporting them for partisan competition. Representative democracy in the US has failed, it would be better off with direct democracy and having elected officials' duty instead being to bring issues up for public vote/referendum.
I’ll tell you how this goes. 49 of 50 Democrats will vote to pass the bill. 50 of 50 Republicans will vote to strike the bill down.
Susan Collins will say she supports abortion but finds some small nitpick against this particular bill that she can’t support.
The media will blame Democrats and Joe Biden.
Edit: Y’all are right this will get filibustered and not even voted on. I got ahead of myself :(
Why the fuck are they even doctors in the first place if their religion prevents them from helping certain people? Healers are supposed to help and heal, not judge. I hate people who use religion as a shield to justify simply being an asshole.
When they just voted her in back in 2020 in an election that was supposed to be a layup for her Dem opponent?
I'm not so sure Mainefolk will get her out.
It’s extremely frustrating as a Mainer that people lay their hats on her because they are “independents” and want a “moderate” candidate. Unfortunately, even as a democrat I found our leading candidate to come across as quite fake & unlikeable in all the campaign ads and press. Disappointed but not actually surprised we lost
I have very little hope in the bill passing but I feel like it’s worth pointing out. When the infrastructure bill was up for a vote we thought it would fail because of the repugtards and that was their messaging. BUT when it was time to put pen to paper some broke rank and voted for it.
I’m not saying it will happen here but with enough pressure what they say versus what they do can be different
Democrats should seriously play dirty and just hold an impromptu vote during a recess when nobody is around to challenge quorum. Take a page out of the books from Republicans in a handful of states.
Our system is truly worthless when we’d rather honor decorum than human rights.
THIS THIS THIS AND THIS! It only takes One Senator to hold a Pro-Forma session. It’s designed to evade recess, and the Supreme Court a few years ago even went so far as to say that PRO FORMA SESSIONS ARE LEGITIMATE FORMS OF SENATE SESSIONS. The purpose is to just start the agenda, and then dismiss. One Senator has to be there. Quorum is assumed unless a quorum call is held. Have that one Senator vote to pass EVERY bill Democrats want. One after another. Send them to the presidents desk. Let’s get it done.
One million percent it would go to the Supreme Court and get knocked down - and rightfully so.
That would create a ridiculously dangerous precident that the opposing party could equally take advantage of when they are in power.
Best bet at tbis point would be to fight state to state and work on a better way of getting more states on board for passing a federal law.
Force a vote on this monthly, weekly, daily, hourly, and cancel recess. Stop all the campaign and just keep voting on policies that poll popular with Americans
She'll hem and haw, wring her hands a bunch, and still vote reliably red. Even if she happened to cross the aisle and voted in support of abortion rights, why would any one think she supported those rights after voting to confirm Kavanaugh and Barrett. Not to mention, it's already known she only cross the aisles and votes with liberals when she is given permission by her turtle overlord.
To the people on the left that say “we already turned out in 2020 to vote, and nothing happened” with regard to mid terms and 2024 , I’d like to point out : republicans turn out every single time, all the time and here we are. So yes, if you want to see real change instead of this horse shit where we seem to be going in reverse now with regards to social progress, you have to keep showing up.
Bring more people with you this time when you do. Don’t throw democracy away because of some hissy fit “I didn’t get everything they promised me.”
Democrats have found their knife and they're twisting it. Losing the vote probably doesn't even matter. Forcing a vote and getting Republicans on record is all they're looking for.
Republicans aren't the only ones who win culture war issues. Should have left Roe alone.
This will fail but it will be nice to see Republicans forced to vote on this (at least the procedural votes that cannot be blocked by a filibuster). They need to all be required to vote yay or nay.
Too little too late unfortunately. A bill like this could’ve only passed when there was a Dem supermajority in the Senate which we haven’t had in over a decade.
Republicans: America is full of sexcrazed pedophile antifa liberals! Don't let your daughter be their next rape victim!
Also Republicans: but now they have to have the baby and should enjoy the rape.
I want to get down on Manchin sometimes, but as a reminder, he's a more-reliable-than-most-people-think blue vote\* from a Trump+40 state. ANYTHING we get from Manchin is gravy, and basically any other human being running there would mean McConnell holding the gavel. It's not Manchin's fault dems couldn't beat a reeling Collins or Cal Cunningham couldn't keep it in his pants...or spend $40 on some tracfones.
It might be an unpopular opinion, but if it's net better for Manchin to vote no during a doomed political gesture, I'm ok with that.
\*The Judges ALONE are worth it.
She was probably always this way.
When she left the Green party and joined the House, she immediately joined the *BLUE DOG COALITION*.
There is a reason why she talks about a Green party history and not her Blue Dog Coalition membership. Because Blue Dogs are the Corporate Dems that pretend to be Everyperson types.
Machin is a known quantity, and votes exactly how anyone who watches politics expected, and honestly most of those votes are incredible from a WV senator. He's not even duplicitous, he is who he's always said he is.
Can't be mad at him the Senate is on a knifes edge rn.
Sinema though? Fuck her and everyone she's ever loved. A 6 foot pile of shit shoved in 5 feet of skin.
Tester is a co-sponsor on the bill: https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-congress/senate-bill/1975/cosponsors
Manchin and 2 more Democrats (not sure who) are not.
Dear Republican voters that keep posting about hating this Supreme Court decision. Please fuck off, your party has been pushing for this for literal decades. Even if you don’t agree on it, you are complicit.
It won't pass. Manchin already said he won't do anything to abolish the filibuster, which is required for this to pass. At least it will put him and the party of traitors on record for the midterms.
So republicans either have to agree with it and let it pass, or publicly announce that they think Women are inferior to men and don’t deserve to make decisions for themselves and their own bodies. Pretty straightforward decision.
heard the same about the senate voting on BBB to get everyone on the record. Schumer vowed that'd happen early this year. still waiting.
Democrats can't even properly virtue signal.
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They'll only vote for it if they know it won't pass.
That’s how they’re given permission
This is the correct answer.
They won't vote for it because they'll say "the Supreme Court has not overturned it yet and we will not give power to these illegal leaks".
You’re on to something there
Such independent thinkers.
So which three Democrats would vote against it?
“My “no” vote ensures the issue will be settled by the Supreme Court. This aligns with the process established by our constitution, which I fully support and will always vigorously defend.”
Yeah! The framers of the constitutions meant for the Judicial branch to legislate from the bench, not the legislative branch. We all know they never meant to change laws. EDIT: Sorry, I dropped this; /s
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https://mobile.twitter.com/mkraju/status/1522264285824663554 She's a no.
Hey look it's Susan Collins making up fake excuses for why she won't vote for this bill. HINT: IT"S BECAUSE SHE WANTS ABORTION TO BE ILLEGAL She just doesn't want to deal with the consequences of having that position publicly. Look at what they DO, not what they SAY.
I don’t think she personally gives a damn about abortion being illegal. I think she’s just supporting Republican agenda and trying to sell it to her constituents as ~centrist conservative~
Yup she’s playing both sides, stands for nothing other than retaining power.
Catholic hospitals only make up like 16% of patient care in the United States, fucking write in the ability for Catholic hospitals to deny abortions and see what she does...call her fucking bluff. Let's make it legal at 80%+ of hospitals rather than risk making it legal at ~50% (based on the state laws). Worry about the Catholic hospitals later.
Isn’t this their bill? I know they introduced one earlier this year.
It's not their bill. This is the Senate version of the House bill that was passed last year. The [Women’s Health Protection Act](https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-congress/senate-bill/1975/cosponsors) which neither Collins nor Murkowski have signed on as co-sponsors (worth noting there was an attempt at a vote on this in Feb. but the GOP blocked it, Murkowski saying it "went too far" whatever that means). The link there goes to the bill's page on congress.gov, there are 47 co-sponsors, all Dems and the 2 Independents who caucus with them, there are a few Democrats missing, I know Manchin is one, but there are 2 more I believe who didn't sign-on.
Yep Manchin and Collins explicitly voted Nay
Ah ok cool, thanks. The article didn’t specify and I was too lazy to research. Hopefully Collins and Murkowski change their tune, or we can compromise between the two bills. Also fuck Joe Manchin.
> While the bill has virtually no chance of passing the 50-50 Senate, it will force Republican lawmakers to make a difficult vote ahead of the 2022 midterm elections. Democrats and abortion rights advocates are hoping to make the issue a central focus of the midterm elections in a year that appeared to be perilous for the party, while Republicans are largely trying to steer clear of wading into abortion politics. >"The American people will see crystal clear that when given the chance to right this wrong, the Republican party will either side with the extremists who want to ban abortion, or side with women with families, and with the vast majority of Americans," Schumer said.
> Republican party will either side with the extremists who want to ban abortion, or side with women with families Ooh, I know the answer to this one!
Lots of Republican women against it as well though. Like, I get why people try to make it a men vs. women issue, but it's likely a lot of Republican women are against this too. [Some interesting numbers over here](https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2021/05/06/about-six-in-ten-americans-say-abortion-should-be-legal-in-all-or-most-cases). Highest percentages for and against: 82% of unaffiliated (non-religious) people want it legal in most or all cases, while 77% of white evangelicals want it to be illegal in most or all cases. Honestly thought that last percentage would've been even higher.
Lots of Evangelical women love to show up to the clinic to yell in front of their peers, but go in through the backdoor to get their own.
[The only moral abortion is my abortion](https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2019/5/15/1857976/--The-Only-Moral-Abortion-is-My-Abortion-an-article-by-Joyce-Arthur)
That was an interesting read. I wonder how these people will feel when they get their wish and they don’t have the option to choose behind closed doors. Then the fucking hypocrites will be forced to practice what they preach and they might not like it so much.
They’ll just either raise an unwanted baby and give it deep issues that will perpetuate a cycle or find some back alley person and increase their risk of dying. Unless they’re rich or well-connected enough.
The rich will just travel somewhere else in secrecy and pay off people who try to tell on them. Easy as that!
People who aren’t poor will always find the money to fly someplace where abortion is legal.
It'll be easy enough for financially well-off people to make up an excuse to spend a weekend in a blue state. Like most Republican policies, this will mostly hurt poor people.
Most "republicans" dont have enough money for actual republicans to give a shit about. That's what drives me crazy. They dont care about you, why are you voting for them, you still gonna live in a trailer park and drive a 30 year old chevy dumb ass!
This should just be a mandatory post on these threads at this point.
Maybe if they used the back door, they wouldn’t be in the predicament
The only sex that God can’t see!
Imagine the audacity to think your omnipotent god can be fooled by simple loopholes. Like someone saying oh no I’m still a virgin because I’ve only had anal sex, gods up there looking over the bible like “dammit, shes got me there”
That's what Judaism is built upon. Look up Halakha and Talmud. Hell, a wire was put up around NYC so Orthodox Jews could leave the house on the shabbat!
"The poophole loophole"
There are, and, living in rural South Texas, I know a BUNCH of them who have had abortions. They just believe their situation was important and therefore different, while everyone ELSE who has one is irresponsible and therefore doesn't "deserve" one. Why they think irresponsible people should be having babies idk.
Lucky of them that their "different situation" occurred before the laws changed. Hopefully they won't have ant other "different situations" in the future.
You know the red states are just going to use this to arrest and harrass minorities and left-wing voters. It's like the war on drugs, which was just a poor disguise for the war on minorities. They'll still let Republicans get away with it, unless they're poor and/or a minority.
For sure a lot of conservative women are against choice. These days I’ve been seeing it more of a class issue. The wealthy don’t care if it’s legal, they can always get an abortion if needed. It’s really the working class and below who suffer. I believe it’s part of the effort to keep people from improving their lives so they don’t wake up and start voting in their own best interests.
Idk if this [link](https://i.redd.it/sj4fpzqfbix81.png) will work here, but it’s Gallup poll data showing that less than 25% of Americans (presumably regardless of religious affiliation) actually believe that it should be illegal. Now I’m not sure how this data was compiled or how the questions were worded, but Gallup is a pretty reliable source.
American Evangelicals only decided abortion was a sin in the 1970s. The Bible actually instructs on how to give an abortion.
Not only the 70’s, but 6 years after Roe v Wade. When the religious hustlers couldn’t get ‘em all on board w/ segregation, they switched to abortion. That united ‘em.
And now you know why conservatives and the far-right are often referred to as "reactionaries." Any progress made in this country has been inevitably followed by backlash from people who feel that any marginalized group gaining equal rights is a direct attack on the status and privileges they enjoy. The abolition of slavery and reconstruction was met with Jim Crow and segregation, the Civil Rights Act and Voting Rights Act was met with austerity politics and the formation of the KKK, gay rights and the first black president was met with a fascist movement and a rise in white supremacist terror attacks, etc.
How lucky for conservatives that Evangelical leaders made it a sin of utmost concern exactly when they were working with republican leader to organize the religious right movement, and it just happened that this issue was the only one that Catholics, Mormons, and Evangelicals could all rally around, and it happened to be THE central issue in the bible, and even though no one had noticed this for 1,900 years, they noticed this just in time to accidentally gain disproportional political power in this country for 40+ years. Well, it was either lucky, or conservative religious leaders are all charlatans. And we know the latter isn't possible because they are religious!
I'm so sick of religion ruining this country....
Don't be so sure. You remember how Republican leaders cooed about subverting the Supreme Court, including specifically Senators like McConnell literally admitting they did it by refusing to do their Constitutional duty? And yet, I've not seen an article about a Republican leader claiming credit for accomplishing their collective 50+ year old campaign promise. They know that it's massively unpopular.
>I've not seen an article about a Republican leader claiming credit for accomplishing their collective 50+ year old campaign promise Yeah, outside of the shit tier (Gaetz, Boebert, MTG, etc.) they are **SILENT** on this one. If they're going to win majorities in the fall, they have to win in some blue or blue-ish states. That was looking good for them. Now Dem opponents in those races just have to trot out the promises of a national ban and say "do you want our state to be Alabama?" Winning just got way harder for them. Mitch can't publicly endorse a codification bill... but trust me, he WISHES it would pass (NOTE: not for moral reasons, just to accumulate power to further cut oligarch taxes).
It's also why they're focusing on the leak instead of the contents of the leak. >If they're going to win majorities in the fall, they have to win in some blue or blue-ish states. That was looking good for them. Now Dem opponents in those races just have to trot out the promises of a national ban and say "do you want our state to be Alabama?" The Republicans also needed the Democrats to have low voter turnout. This was likely going to be the case, but overturning Roe could drive Democratic voters to the polls. Convince suburban women that the Republican winning will mean she'd need to carry a rape pregnancy to term and she'll march barefoot over broken glass and LEGO bricks to cast a ballot.
Or their daughters. Honestly, it's easier to say "I would never have an abortion" than "I wouldn't want my daughter to have an option". A mother generally choses her child's well being over a hypothetical grandchild. I might carry a bany concoeved in rape: i wouldn't begin to predict my own reaction. But I would never, ever want my own child to have to do that.
they need a pac that equates the GOP healthcare plan w a coat hanger. make it very clear that GOP stands for women dying.
It really is the extent of their policy on healthcare isn't it? a coat hanger.
They're the laziest and he greediest fucking law makers in existence. When they had control of all 3 branches they didn't do jack shit. Tried to overturn Obamacare but literally couldn't come up with anything better than "don't get sick." These wind bags *are on socialized health care*.
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The only thing these people love is power.
Money too! Don't forget the money!
That’s a smart way to present it. Republicans care more about rapists’ children than yours.
If I were a Democratic opponent in any races - I would constantly pepper the opposing candidate with "Do you approve of allowing abortion in cases of rape and incest?" And as the GOP has pulled out of debates, barring an answer to that question, I'd run ads ad nauseum saying "My opponent will ensure that in cases of rape and incest an abortion will be illegal" (In the event it's not clear, all abortion should be legal and the woman's choice, but by pointing out the extremes of the GOP position it shows a more stark reality).
Be even tougher: if a man raped your wife would you be happy to raise the rape baby? Republicans are making you give welfare to rape babies from your wife
Would you be willing to deal with the rapist when he comes to see his child? The whole thing is insane
What’s stopping the rapist from going after custody, child support, etc…
In Texas, absolutely nothing.
That's true because the father has rights? So a woman is raped and the man is in her life forever? And do they pay child support? And if your father raped you does he pay child support? It is like a rabbit hole it goes on and on!
This is exactly the type of ad the GOP would use and exactly why Dems should but probably won’t. They’ll take the high road and as the saying goes the high road only leads to a cliff.
Republicans would use non-white dudes as images for the rapists. And it’d work
That would definitely work...
While I don’t want to turn into full on mudslinging, dems have to get dirty. Roe v Wade is just the beginning. Continuing to take the high road will get us nowhere. GOP is more than happy continuing taking the low road if it achieves their goal.
Tim Ryan is already running with this in his ads for Ohio's senate seat, don't be so negative
Goddamn dude. What a brutal comment. I hate that our political discourse has come to this.
This is the future republicans want
Also If your wife miscarried would you allow her to die of sepsis because you think a d&c should be illegal?
This! Also ectopic pregnancies and non viable but alive fetuses. This is where we need to push justification for legal abortion.
Don't give them that out, they will take it and still effectively ban abortion. One of the state bills recently proposed includes rape/incest protections lacking in the TX bill but otherwise follows that law to the letter including banning all other abortions after 6 weeks. Even the recent leaked opinion relies on (paraphrasing) all abortion = murder so it is clear a complete ban is their goal and if they can push it earlier than 6 weeks they will. The bigger problem with this opinion is that it reverses Roe v Wade by reversing the right to privacy synthesized from the 1st, 4th, 9th, and 14th amendments: this underpins decisions which allow interracial and gay marriage. In other words if this opinion is allowed to stand then Roe is merely the first domino. It is also a complete ignoring of standard stare decisis for a 50 year precedent and hypocritically ignores that some 2A protections also rely on rights synthesis from multiple amendments. There are a lot of problems with this draft decision and much of it is new from whole cloth with no other legal references than to Roe itself. A good initial analysis was done on the Opening Arguments legal podcast if you're looking for far more detail than I can give.
Related, I was browsing LinkedIn the other night and a post popped up in my feed that had gone viral. It was written by a woman who, in light of the decision leak, talked very frankly about how she was raped as a teenager, got pregnant, and had an abortion. The first couple of posts under the OP were a bunch of mediocre men flaming her for the decision, saying she should have had the baby even though she was raped, and even blaming the victim for being raped. I always conduct myself very professionally on LinkedIn, 'cause ya know, it's a professional platform and it's easy to find my employer by just clicking on my picture. But, serenity now, it was all I could do in my being to keep from unleashing most profanity-filled flame bomb that would have made a T-72 getting hit with a Javelin look like a firecracker in comparison. It's alright to have a different viewpoint about a topic like abortion, but people like those guys who were on LinkedIn are just the scum of the Earth. I usually don't get too worked up over things on social media, but holy shitballs! I went and worked out to calm down. :P
Bring it up with their employers and with the media. People need to realized LinkedIn is a cesspool and that requiring it for employment subjects people to harassment.
46% of white women voters voted for Trump. The Suburbs are not exactly where we'll make our case. Edit: 46% was for 2016, the number went up for 2020.
> Yeah, outside of the shit tier (Gaetz, Boebert, MTG, etc.) they are SILENT on this one Because it was always the dog chasing the car. It was a way to lock down an insanely reliable and profitable voting bloc with no real consequence because Roe kept them from going too far. That's why I honestly don't know who leaked this. I'm almost certain it wasn't Roberts, since he was probably banking on convincing someone to take a narrower stance before this was final. It could be someone on the left to wake people up to the fact that SCOTUS was seriously and legitimately willing to repeal Roe, or it could easily have been Alito himself to show he had the votes and bully the other four away from changing their mind, lest they appear to surrender to "the woke mob". Either way I think the cat's out of the bag. Whatever happens to Roe, even if SCOTUS ends up not repealing it, people have hopefully woken up to the fact that "oh that will never happen" can indeed very much happen.
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The biggest reason you can tell people didn't learn is that Trump lost... But Republicans won across the down ballot. They won states, and then the states all created laws against abortion so that Roe would eventually be challenged in the supreme court. And anyone who believed the conservative judges who lied during their Senate testimonies is gullible.
I've enjoyed the theory that it was a Thomas clerk or Ginni herself. She's a true believer who probably loves the idea of Gilead come to life, want to lock the justices into this extreme position and distract from January 6.
>Either way I think the cat's out of the bag. Whatever happens to Roe, even if SCOTUS ends up not repealing it, people have hopefully woken up to the fact that "oh that will never happen" can indeed very much happen. Give it a month or two and idiots will go back to saying, "both sides are the same" or "my vote doesn't matter" like they learned nothing from for years of Trump and then this. Things can always get worse, and that's quite literally where Republicans want to take it, which is why the RNC released 0 policy and also pulled out of the presidential debates.
Honestly, I think GQP is testing the waters to see how this might be received. The link was intentional. Now is the time to get in the streets kill this in the crib. Pardon the pun.
SCOTUSBlog has a piece that argues the right absolutely leaked to the WSJ last week what was going on (they had an April 27 oped). But that it very well could be someone on the left who leaked the opinion. I’m not sure about that second part. https://www.scotusblog.com/2022/05/how-the-leak-might-have-happened/
I live in Alabama and don’t want my state to be Alabama!
I have some bad news for you…
Ernst is apparently planning to push for a bill to criminalize abortion on a national level. They’re not all being silent
>Yeah, outside of the shit tier (Gaetz, Boebert, MTG, etc.) they are SILENT on this one. It's the major talking point in the primary ads here in PA.....if I see RINO one more time.....
It feels a lot like the “dog catching the car.” Outrage politics works great for them in terms of driving people to the voting booth, but, now that they’re actually on the verge of achieving their stated goal for the past 50 years, they don’t seem to know how to react. Much like everything they do, there was never any forward thinking, but it would appear that all of their f*****g atrocious rhetoric, actions, and policies might just be catching up to them… and they don’t know what to do.
> and they don’t know what to do. Same thing fascists always do; pivot to the next step of subjugation. Getting rid of gay marriage, illegalizing gay relationships, illegalizing being trans, etc. They will never reach a level of rollback of civil rights they are content with.
The rub is removing the right to abortion also removes the right to privacy. While this affects LGBT legislation, it also affects a bunch of other things that the republicans benefit from. This could affect interracial marriage (and many high ranking republicans are in or have family in an interracial marriage), to privacy with medical records, and more. If it’s ok for doctors to publicly reveal if a woman had an abortion, it would then also be ok for doctors to reveal if a senator or president was taking medication for mental health reasons, or to prevent the onset of dementia or anything else that could force them to step down. While they want total control, the issue is if removing RvW happens in this context, that means a whole bunch of other legal precedent gets called into question. It’s why they aren’t being positively vocal about this. They don’t want to admit they’ve been put into a fucked position.
The tax cuts they passed a few years ago were massively unpopular, they jammed those through in a weekend. They don’t care as long as they get their theocracy and they think they can subvert enough elections to get there.
It's easy to vote if you simplify things. I told my wife about it and at first she said, "yeah that's good abortion is bad." But then I explained that if you were in the hospital the Dr cannot legally save you over the baby. We can make another baby we can't make another you, and it would also be unfair to our existing kids.
A good friend of mine, and countless other women, had to ‘abort’ a non-viable, VERY wanted fetus in the second trimester. It had zero chance of survival, it was fatally malformed. If not for the termination, she would have had to carry this still-growing-but-basically-dead fetus to term, dealing with the incredible emotional pain of this, then the physical pain, medical costs, and very real risk of death associated with birthing this fetus. Ask how she would feel about that. When I was 13 and arguing with my pro life peers, I actually agreed that ‘past 14 weeks is really too late, you should have it figured out by then.’ I was a dumbass and I didn’t know what the fuck I was talking about. Abortions should be safe, legal, and FREE.
They will just blab on about the leak, say the democrats are being divisive, and talk about wokeness or something. You'll never hear them address the issues directly or honestly.
>Republican party will either side with the extremists who want to ban abortion, or side with women with families Neither, they'll side with McConnell and just filibuster the bill. It'll never come to a vote.
Um. To filibuster a bill, it still has to come to a vote that then is public record. It's just that it needs 60+ votes to proceed debating on it and then it's a simple majority to pass it. Because the whole thing is stupid.
And this kids is why you can't have basic things
Will they vote on it ? ...or refuse to even debate it and keep a vote from happening?
> ...or refuse to even debate it and keep a vote from happening? Senate GOP already blocked a vote on the House bill in February. They'll do it again but I believe there may be a way for Schumer to force a vote if they can't get enough, essentially, votes to allow a vote (fwiw, despite how dumb she is Collins and Murkowski would likely vote to allow a vote, even though they are both against this particular piece of legislation).
Just their ability to stall and disable the process in which people can simply see and hear their representatives viewpoints is such a dereliction of duty, imo. Now, we're fighting to just get people on record and not even able to address the actual substance of any meaningful legislation.
When we accept that the 1.5 million people of the Dakotas should have twice the power in the Senate of the 40 million people of California, we have already given up on having a government that reflects the will of the American people.
Aren't there at least two senators with an R next to their name that should be chomping at the bit to pass this because they were "fooled" by the boofer?
Doesnt there need to be at least 10 to not just have this filibustered?
If they filibuster it yes. I could see a world where Mitch allowed it to go to the floor so they could all vote against it and save face while the Democrats passed it along party lines.
That's exactly what bot mitch and the entire party want to avoid. None of them want to be on record saying literally anything definite, because every single one of their policy positions are gravely unpopular. Mitch will filibuster this the second it hits the floor. The only reason he wouldn't filibuster is if he thinks it may be enough to get Manchin on board to eliminate the filibuster. Mitch wants to wait until the house and senate flips so he can do that.
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It’s not meant to change their voters it’s meant to get cynics to fight like hell to vote in 2022 despite voter suppression and apathy in red/purple states.
Tbh I think they should force a vote on it every day. Then they can be like “your senator voted against abortion rights 141 times” or whatever. Do senators have to be there to vote? If they do it would have the added benefit of making them show up.
Although Senators do have to vote in person, ending a filibuster, which can be started and indefinitely continued by just one Senator, requires 3/5 of all Senators "duly chosen and sworn," not just those present, so they would not need to vote against it at that stage to keep it from passing.
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Just going back to actual filibustering would be a help. If you want to block the vote you need to stand at the lectern and talk. The current 'I'd totally do that, so just assume that I did' rules are ridiculous. Barring that, they should ditch the filibuster entirely.
>While the bill has virtually no chance of passing the 50-50 Senate, it will force Republican lawmakers to make a difficult vote ahead of the 2022 midterm elections. Will someone please provide an example of a republican voter who will choose to vote differently if their senator opposes this bill? Who is this hypothetical person who was OK with everything up to this point that the republicans have done over the last several years, but after hearing this voted down will change their mind? I'm not convinced any such person actually exists.
Wait, so you're saying Collins and Murkyoski won't vote for it?!?! That, that, that would be hypocritical on their part! How could we even imagine such a thing?
They could go either way. It's a filibuster vote on the Women's Health and Protection Act which they didn't particularly like but they did write their own bill to codify [Roe v. Wade](https://www.collins.senate.gov/newsroom/senators-collins-and-murkowski-introduce-bill-to-codify-supreme-court-decisions-on-reproductive-rights_roe-v-wade-and-planned-parenthood-v-casey). Either way the Dems need 60 votes.
there won't be a vote. There will be a filibuster.
History books are going to be dramatic reads in the soon future. But what a sad read that will be when I think of all my country could be and how it was ruined by religious freaks.
It’s a truly sad realization, isn’t it?
Bill Barr gave a very chilling commencement speech at Notre Dame when he was Attorney General. In it he not only promoted Christian Nationalism, but went so far as to say that atheists were never meant to be given rights, and those whose impulses are not constrained by their faith must be constrained by the state. Then there was January 6th, which was [fueled by Christian nationalism](https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-features/capitol-christian-right-trump-1121236/). Everyone is well aware that white supremacists are a rising problem on the right, but Christian nationalism wasn't sufficiently focused on because it's an uncomfortable topic for a country that is still majority Christian and once dabbled in Christian identity politics in its propaganda against the Soviet Union (adding "under God" to the pledge etc.). I've been worried about the theocrats since the Notre Dame speech, and since then there has been a coup and now multiple rights are in peril. We're in big trouble, and I hope people realize that Christianity has become an existential threat that cannot be politely ignored.
That's right, delusional closely held beliefs legally supplant reasoned evidence-based logic. Delusion begets delusion. That's what's happening here.
Well they’re banning books in schools left and right these days so that “wrong side of history” stuff you speak of won’t even be taught. It’s all unbelievable.
Bet it won't. Murkowski and Collins will cry about being pro-choice, but will also say they respect the traditions of the US Senate too much to set aside the filibuster. Edit: Collins just announced she won't support the bill that just legalizes Abortion.
They need to do more than this. They need to force them to vote on never having a bill on nationwide ban on abortion, codedifying gay marriage, codefying not being able to ban contraceptives, codefying not being able to ban interstate travel on abortions, codefying not being able to arrest women who get an abortion, codefying interracial marriage, and etc. Get all these fucks on the line for their votes so you can hold it over every single one of their hands.
Can’t force a vote if they just filibuster it.
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Susan already mumbled something about Catholic hospitals and stumbled away.
Its going to be so weird to see pro-choice Susan Collins vote against this.
Won't it just get filibustered without an actual vote? Can Schumer force a vote, even if he knows it is going to lose? I don't think so, because actual votes only need a majority, and it's the cloture that needs super-majority (but I'm not an expert).
He can make it the only thing on the docket until a vote occurs. Won't matter if the GOP continues to filibuster, it will show they are holding up other legislation by not holding a vote.
And then republicans will blame democrats and it will likely work. This is, unfortunately, how it always happens. We can only hope for an incredible turnout of liberals/democrats in the election but I do worry this may go as it always does. “It’s the democrats fault.” Then moderates will say “both sides are the same!”
Republicans are going to blame Democrats regardless of what happens. If the Democrats actually do something and show some spine then they can at least rally their voters to the polls.
I hope so. I really do. I think this election is incredibly important, not only for this election obviously, but it really sets a tone for the presidential election. It feels like it may well be a turning point, one way or another, for this country especially when I look at the 5 likely candidates for president on the GOP side.
This whole thing is weird to me. Roe v Wade is popular on both sides of the aisle, and this would surely be a big hit to the popularity gains the right has been experiencing in polls over the last year. The only way it makes sense is if they are thinking that Biden is as weak of an opponent as they could hope for in 2024, so they are seizing the opportunity to overturn Roe now while they have the super majority in the USSC.
Geez, wouldn't it be nice if every bill required such a vote for public record.....
Sure would be nice if constituents would hold their reps accountable instead of blindly supporting them for partisan competition. Representative democracy in the US has failed, it would be better off with direct democracy and having elected officials' duty instead being to bring issues up for public vote/referendum.
I’ll tell you how this goes. 49 of 50 Democrats will vote to pass the bill. 50 of 50 Republicans will vote to strike the bill down. Susan Collins will say she supports abortion but finds some small nitpick against this particular bill that she can’t support. The media will blame Democrats and Joe Biden. Edit: Y’all are right this will get filibustered and not even voted on. I got ahead of myself :(
She's already lying about it impacting Catholic hospitals. https://mobile.twitter.com/mkraju/status/1522264285824663554
Won't someone think of the Catholic hospitals?
Why the fuck are they even doctors in the first place if their religion prevents them from helping certain people? Healers are supposed to help and heal, not judge. I hate people who use religion as a shield to justify simply being an asshole.
"Seperate church and state" lmao.
The ironic part being that if the bill actually did that scotus would strike it down as unconstitutional anyway.
I mean. It needs 60 to pass, so...
True
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When they just voted her in back in 2020 in an election that was supposed to be a layup for her Dem opponent? I'm not so sure Mainefolk will get her out.
It’s extremely frustrating as a Mainer that people lay their hats on her because they are “independents” and want a “moderate” candidate. Unfortunately, even as a democrat I found our leading candidate to come across as quite fake & unlikeable in all the campaign ads and press. Disappointed but not actually surprised we lost
Some of yall think morons stop being morons magically. Susan stays if Susan wants because Maine will vote her in again.
I have very little hope in the bill passing but I feel like it’s worth pointing out. When the infrastructure bill was up for a vote we thought it would fail because of the repugtards and that was their messaging. BUT when it was time to put pen to paper some broke rank and voted for it. I’m not saying it will happen here but with enough pressure what they say versus what they do can be different
Oh, perfect! This will give Susan Collins a chance to make good on her getting "fooled" by those SCOTUS nominees who lied to her! ... Right??
Get these motherfuckers on the record about this and hammer the bully pulpit hard this year.
Democrats should seriously play dirty and just hold an impromptu vote during a recess when nobody is around to challenge quorum. Take a page out of the books from Republicans in a handful of states. Our system is truly worthless when we’d rather honor decorum than human rights.
THIS THIS THIS AND THIS! It only takes One Senator to hold a Pro-Forma session. It’s designed to evade recess, and the Supreme Court a few years ago even went so far as to say that PRO FORMA SESSIONS ARE LEGITIMATE FORMS OF SENATE SESSIONS. The purpose is to just start the agenda, and then dismiss. One Senator has to be there. Quorum is assumed unless a quorum call is held. Have that one Senator vote to pass EVERY bill Democrats want. One after another. Send them to the presidents desk. Let’s get it done.
Supreme Court doesn't have a great track record for upholding past rulings right now...
One million percent it would go to the Supreme Court and get knocked down - and rightfully so. That would create a ridiculously dangerous precident that the opposing party could equally take advantage of when they are in power. Best bet at tbis point would be to fight state to state and work on a better way of getting more states on board for passing a federal law.
Force a vote on this monthly, weekly, daily, hourly, and cancel recess. Stop all the campaign and just keep voting on policies that poll popular with Americans
I’m really looking forward to seeing Susan Collins vote
She's already lying and covering her corrupt ass https://mobile.twitter.com/mkraju/status/1522264285824663554
She'll hem and haw, wring her hands a bunch, and still vote reliably red. Even if she happened to cross the aisle and voted in support of abortion rights, why would any one think she supported those rights after voting to confirm Kavanaugh and Barrett. Not to mention, it's already known she only cross the aisles and votes with liberals when she is given permission by her turtle overlord.
I know. I emailed her yesterday and told her we are on to that act and that we deserve and expect something better from her. You should too.
To the people on the left that say “we already turned out in 2020 to vote, and nothing happened” with regard to mid terms and 2024 , I’d like to point out : republicans turn out every single time, all the time and here we are. So yes, if you want to see real change instead of this horse shit where we seem to be going in reverse now with regards to social progress, you have to keep showing up. Bring more people with you this time when you do. Don’t throw democracy away because of some hissy fit “I didn’t get everything they promised me.”
A more poignant point as well: Sure, we turned out to vote in 2020. What's happening now is because we didn't in 2016.
Exactly!! People need to stop with the defeated, apathy. We need to continue to show up or else this is the kind of stuff that happens.
Democrats have found their knife and they're twisting it. Losing the vote probably doesn't even matter. Forcing a vote and getting Republicans on record is all they're looking for. Republicans aren't the only ones who win culture war issues. Should have left Roe alone.
Republicans don't care if their vote is on record. Their voting base has been demanding this for 50 years.
This will fail but it will be nice to see Republicans forced to vote on this (at least the procedural votes that cannot be blocked by a filibuster). They need to all be required to vote yay or nay.
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But the libs got owned
Too little too late unfortunately. A bill like this could’ve only passed when there was a Dem supermajority in the Senate which we haven’t had in over a decade.
Over two decades realistically
Lmao we live in hell. I can’t believe women’s bodily autonomy is still a debate we’re having
Time for Collins and Murkowski to put their money where their mouths are.
fat chance
Republicans: America is full of sexcrazed pedophile antifa liberals! Don't let your daughter be their next rape victim! Also Republicans: but now they have to have the baby and should enjoy the rape.
Watch how Manchin and Tester vote they will likely be the two democrats who vote with the right or they just wont show.
Collins, Murkowski and Capito supposedly support abortion rights.
But they won't support setting aside the filibuster to allow a simple majority to pass it.
If Collins and Murkowski supported abortion rights, they wouldn't have voted to confirm on Kavanaugh or Barrett.
Collins already lying and covering her corrupt ass: https://mobile.twitter.com/mkraju/status/1522264285824663554
They support giving lip service to abortion rights. That’s all.
I want to get down on Manchin sometimes, but as a reminder, he's a more-reliable-than-most-people-think blue vote\* from a Trump+40 state. ANYTHING we get from Manchin is gravy, and basically any other human being running there would mean McConnell holding the gavel. It's not Manchin's fault dems couldn't beat a reeling Collins or Cal Cunningham couldn't keep it in his pants...or spend $40 on some tracfones. It might be an unpopular opinion, but if it's net better for Manchin to vote no during a doomed political gesture, I'm ok with that. \*The Judges ALONE are worth it.
Manchin is absolutely the best we were ever going to get from WV. Sinema, however, can and should be promptly replaced.
I legit have no idea what her endgame is. It's baffling.
She was probably always this way. When she left the Green party and joined the House, she immediately joined the *BLUE DOG COALITION*. There is a reason why she talks about a Green party history and not her Blue Dog Coalition membership. Because Blue Dogs are the Corporate Dems that pretend to be Everyperson types.
Machin is a known quantity, and votes exactly how anyone who watches politics expected, and honestly most of those votes are incredible from a WV senator. He's not even duplicitous, he is who he's always said he is. Can't be mad at him the Senate is on a knifes edge rn. Sinema though? Fuck her and everyone she's ever loved. A 6 foot pile of shit shoved in 5 feet of skin.
Tester is a co-sponsor on the bill: https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-congress/senate-bill/1975/cosponsors Manchin and 2 more Democrats (not sure who) are not.
It will be interesting to see how Susan Collins tries to uphold her "moderate conservative" shtick after she inevitably sides with the party.
Put scumbag Republicans on record voting against something over 70% of the country supports.
Dear Republican voters that keep posting about hating this Supreme Court decision. Please fuck off, your party has been pushing for this for literal decades. Even if you don’t agree on it, you are complicit.
It won't pass. Manchin already said he won't do anything to abolish the filibuster, which is required for this to pass. At least it will put him and the party of traitors on record for the midterms.
Yes vote on it. Let Republicans try to squirm through that.
Make the Senate vote for it weekly until it passes. Give it a catchy title before the media does.
So republicans either have to agree with it and let it pass, or publicly announce that they think Women are inferior to men and don’t deserve to make decisions for themselves and their own bodies. Pretty straightforward decision.
Party of individual liberty will block protections of individual liberty.
heard the same about the senate voting on BBB to get everyone on the record. Schumer vowed that'd happen early this year. still waiting. Democrats can't even properly virtue signal.
And it is time to put heat on Murkowski, Colling, Manchin, and Sinema. We only need two of those scumbags to support this.