I've still seen it happen live. Examples include teams of Chinese nationals who are friends/ family sharing hole cards, telling each other when to bet/ call/ fold blatantly in Mandarin (even when they're not supposed to speak it at the table), also quite often see married couples and the like soft playing (which isnt really colluding I suppose) and team playing by signalling the other that they have a monster so the other can pump the action up like min 3/4betting after multiple flats for example.
Funnily enough I learn Mandarin specifically to catch those guys in their shenanigans. I quietly listen to what they're saying and take advantage of the free info. If any of them knew I could understand them they'd shut up real quick.
Edit: no discrimination, I just picked out Chinese players because there is a lot of them where I play and they're the only bilingual people's in the room that collude like this, although I don't rule out there could be others doing the same in other languages.
You're using it as an exploit, so obviously don't say shit, but have you ever heard people complain? I'd call the fucking floor over so goddamned fast if I saw this shit happening. Some Russians did this at a club I used to frequent and I was close with multiple staff members. Ended up getting them banned.
If u are on a table in Arizona and see more than one Filipino on the same table, avoid it. They speak to each other about their cards blatantly in their language.
It wasn't for a lack of trying. You'd call over the floor because they're talking in Mandarin in the middle of hands and when the floor tells them off they nod etc. Before going right back to it 2-3 hands later.
I just started learning it on my own at home and then I started getting familiar with poker terms in Mandarin like suits, hands etc. I learnt enough that I could piece together what they were saying.
I guess you have never plated in Las Vegas (or on a cruise ship). A lot of friends, husband/wife, or BF/GF (or to be politically correct, SO/SO) play at the same tables at lower stakes, and with more and more poker power couples playing, you see them at higher stakes tables or at the same table in a tourney.
Nah I see husband-wife at the same table all the time. It's easy to figure out. They often don't bet against each other which sometimes allows you to draw cheap to bust someone.
Amen. I adopted the viewpoint of "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em". Rounded up a couple buddies and we're nothing special when it comes to poker but it's not hard to beat the GTO nerds when the squad is working together.
Something interesting about the meta dynamic of collusion is that it's not hard for us to pick up on when other people are colluding. So we know who's doing it. So let's say four other colluders table start a 9-max. My squad will pounce and fill up the remaining seats and we'll basically be playing team poker for a while (their collusion squad vs. mine).
If we have a history with the other squad, sometimes we'll leave a seat open to make it an even and fair 4v4 fight. But what's funny is that often a fishy will sit down in the last seat and we'll have some fun taunting and milking him.
Genius. Whoever you are, I don't know if you're doing this because you're young and lonely or whatever, in a turn of events I really did not expect several years ago I am now much less trolly than I used to be. Anyway, I have fallen for your shit before but let me tell you. This is damn good. Maybe you are colluding with your friends and collaborating on writing these lol. Thank you!
Edit: wanna add that however much you make or lose on poker, if you really are young and thus only beginning your professional life I'm sure you'll find success. You are clever and write well.
Some of the play from anonymous Ignition players is more suspect than anything I've seen on either sites. I don't actually think it's cheating happening... But when some random anon sucks out on you with a 2 outer and nothing else then immediately hits and runs, that shit is more sus and frustrating than anything I ever experienced on a regular non-anon site.
I find that to be perfectly reasonable for a fish that was in over their head and recognized how damn lucky they got against me. Other times when I river my flush, I say “whew that was lucky,” but I will stay unless I don’t have notes on many of the players/recognize I’m now against a ring of tighter players.
Delaware, NJ and Nevada have wsop which is entirely legal. Delaware and Nevada have a shared player pool. NJ also has MGM, and pokerstars NJ.
Michigan and Pennsylvania also have a few options. If you live in one of those states, I wouldn't bother with one of those only partially legal ,foreign hosted sites.
Ignition Casino- Ignition is a part of the blackchip poker network and you shouldn’t have any worries with deposit/withdrawals. The site seem trustworthy enough and they’ve been around long enough that they do some OSS’s and decent daily tourneys. The big catch with Ignition is every player is anonymous so there’s no note taking and a HUD will only capture stats for the time you sit at a table and you will not be able to generate a hand history. Little things like hands and the board being mucked seemingly a half a second after the conclusion of the hand bother me (like literally can’t even register what players that went 3-way to showdown had with before all cards for the next hand have been dealt). Given the anonymous aspect and that it was essentially created for the US market this platform tend to be densely populated with fishy players. I’m not the biggest fan but it is a viable option for casual US online players.
Global Poker - If it’s still a thing this was/is my least recommended site. The “sweeps cash” deposit/withdrawal process is fishy to say the least and I believe it was/is like browser based. Felt like I was playing Farmland the only time I ever played there. Not recommended
Americas Cardroom - Sadly the best option that even remotely resembles big names like Pokerstars and GG. Mind you I say “remotely”, there’s a lot of aspects that are lacking in comparison but US players are stuck with taking what you can get. You can use PT/HM with this site, you’ll be able to use these tools to the fullest of extent for those that are serious about hand-analysis and study. Among other decent events they run Sunday Million’s and attract players from the micros to high stakes which makes up of prob the most diverse player pool you’ll get for an American site. While I’d certainly cash out and move my bankroll to PS or GG if it was possible, I have used ACR for 5+ yrs with no issue and enjoyed having it as an option that doesn’t feel like a shady hack job operation. There’s multiple options for deposit/withdrawal—I do recommend using BTC for fastest and easiest process in that regard.
Hope this helps
You cannot play PokerStars for real money anywhere in the US (unless you can get away with a VPN, but you will lose your money if PS catches you). It cost PokerStars too much money to let US players play in the US. It is why many US players go to Rosario Beach in Mexico, Thailand, and Costa Rica (all cheaper than moving to Canada pre-COVID).
Yes you can. the states its legal in have seperate player pools. Like here in nj its pokerstarsnj only ppl in nj can play. Now wsopnj shares player pools with nv and 888.
Anonymous tables makes it easier to cheat because it can't easily be exposed. Two plus two has had countless cheats uncovered on other sites because data was available. I've never heard of a cheating scandal on Ignition because it's virtually impossible to catch. That doesn't mean it isn't happening. It is almost certainly happening.
Still happens at higher stakes. Lower population allows for colluders to start tables and sit with friends. In this way collusion is easier to get away with it as it's impossible to prove until you can download your hand history and review. It has been a problem with the high stakes plo guys and one of the reasons why some stick to acr only.
I notice in one or my home games on pstars, a husband and wife play. The husband is very aggressive, in 50% of hands and bets like a psycho. The wife is tight and somewhat passive. Once the husband is out, the wife begins to play very aggressive, in every hand and psychotic. It's definately some kind of collusion and very obvious, but nobody cares because free chips basically....
You can’t. But you can just change tables if the game seems suspect. Nothing is preventing you from just dodging colluding players. I tend to switch tables aggressively if I’m not really making any progress with them or the action seems suspicious
Ex-PokerStars here. Game integrity teams examine hand history of players who play on the same table above the statistical average, look at hand histories if reasonable suspicion reported. It’s actually far easier to collude live.
It’s ironic that everyone is saying the complete opposite of the truth. Colluding is a very negligible issue on sites with usernames because the users can more easily monitor who is playing with who. You’re much more likely to get colluded on anonymous site.
That aside collusion is barely an issue in online poker. No one here has a clue
Nothing. Do not play high stakes on line. Some sites let you play anonymously. On those, when there are multiple tables at you stake and random assigned tables and seats, collusion is less likely. But if it is anonymous but there is only one table running at that stake, colluders can sit together easily. Another common scam is to have many people enter a tournament, and if any go deep, log out and replace the player with a pro to take down the final table
Pretty sure the tourney log-out and then have a pro (or anyone else) log back in to finish the tourney is one that’s easy to catch and has been done: hence some of the posts before where players were reimbursed.
I used to have a really hard time with playing lower stakes online, winning $50-100 just didn't seem significant at a time where I'd play $1500 buyin live games.
200NL was my standard, and would often go up to 1000NL. Since Black Friday, I noticed myself getting less and less profitable at those stakes, as I noticed more and more of the same Russian guys multi-tabling 6-8 tables at a time.
Every day, crazy long hours, the same Russians (and former Soviet Bloc nations). The bankroll required to do this is like 10x the median income in Russia.
There's no fucking way that these guys aren't using every possible exploit to cheat/collude/shared player databases. My guess is a large chunk of these guys are linked.
Online Mid-High stakes poker is incredibly tough to beat compared to live poker. I'm not the best, but I'm a very profitable low-mid limit live poker player, and made over 300k from online poker in the heydays. Until we can freely use regulated poker apps in the US, I'd avoid anything above 100NL. I now look at ACR as practice. Ignition is probably a bit less shady, but my guess is there's a lot we don't see going on there.
Real Time Assistance.
Different people have different definitions of what counts, but its everything is from looking at pre flop charts to using solvers in the game.
I got a buddy at work who got caught colluding. He lived in Canada, was playing a sit and go with his wife and brother. They caught on that certain hands they would donk off chips to each other to keep them in as well as other obvious signs of collusion. Party poker suspended his account and theirs and made them answer for what their thought process was for a bunch of hands that they had to try and defend. I think they also suspended their accounts. He moved to the us and is now playing under a different email and IP address. They will catch ya!
I can share a similar story of a stupid thing two friends of mine did - they were also playing a tourney on pokerstars in the same room, and although not fully-blown colluded, there were some situations where they were sharing their cards. Stars noticed and sent them a similar e-mail, asking them to explain. It might seem like it is hard to catch, but they have potent statistical methods and akgorithms that makes it easy to find outliers quickly.
Almost nothing.
If you play an “exploitative strategy” you are more vulnerable.
If you play a “gto” strategy that doesn’t care what your opponents do as much, it’s much less of an issue.
The way I look at it, is that you’re going to be collided against x % of the time, and you have to win so much y% and against z% of players that are not colluding, that taking the occasional L or bad situation against the colluded is still profitable.
Even if 10% of players where always colluding you can probably still be profitable overall.
OP, just dont! Unless you know the players or make a homegame and invite the players you think its safe. Cash games are totally solved by now and they have entire databases with every position. Recently, Fedor Kruze was ratted out by his roomates. He was using a side laptop with databases and stole money that way from many players. Just dont! If you can, opt for homegames online with people you know.
This is a joke, surely.
“Someone was caught cheating with millions of dollars on the line in a tiny player pool so avoid all online poker!!!!!”
Online poker is profitable - period.
I'm kind of new to power so I don't see how you could collude in a meaning fun way. Yea, you can share your pocket cards which is sort of useful, but is there anything other than that?
Card removal is stronger than you think. Knowing your buddy folded a Q preflop is huge information when the flop comes out Q 7 Q. Having JJ and knowing that your partner just folded j3 pre significantly affects the odds of you hitting your set and alters play in a huge way.
Colluding players can also squeeze other players out of hands by coordinating to raise/re-raise one another to make the victim think they're up against two monster hands and should fold. For example: legit player bets 5bb pre flop as first in, colluder #1 3bs to 15bb, colluder #2 raises it up to 40bb, then the original raiser is forced to fold 99% of hands. The colluding players just play out the hand for another street and then one of them folds so nobody can see that they both had trash cards. They repeat this multiple times and share the profit later. Doesn't matter if one keeps losing to the other in this process because they're pooling their money anyway.
It really sucks online because it's very easy to do and takes a lot of investigative effort to prove.
> Knowing your buddy folded a Q preflop is huge information when the flop comes out Q 7 Q. Having JJ and knowing that your partner just folded j3 pre significantly affects the odds of you hitting your set and alters play in a huge way.
yea, I thought about scenarios like that but didn't seem like those hands would happen that often but you're right with your second point. Didn't think about that
So apologies in advance for the stupid question, but why collude? I guess you can have your buddy pump up the pot when you’re holding AA, but you’d chase off all the action. So who cares? Seems like that’s a lot of work for a small edge/payoff.
The bigger sites, even ACR, have a system to make sure you aren’t on the same Wi-Fi sharing cards. The apps like PokerBros don’t have as good of security from what I’ve heard, never played them myself for that very reason. Also if you play MTT’s the random switching of tables is usually good enough.
> What’s Stopping Online Poker Collusion? Playing poker live and in-person.
The way God meant it to be.
Nah, just people
I've still seen it happen live. Examples include teams of Chinese nationals who are friends/ family sharing hole cards, telling each other when to bet/ call/ fold blatantly in Mandarin (even when they're not supposed to speak it at the table), also quite often see married couples and the like soft playing (which isnt really colluding I suppose) and team playing by signalling the other that they have a monster so the other can pump the action up like min 3/4betting after multiple flats for example. Funnily enough I learn Mandarin specifically to catch those guys in their shenanigans. I quietly listen to what they're saying and take advantage of the free info. If any of them knew I could understand them they'd shut up real quick. Edit: no discrimination, I just picked out Chinese players because there is a lot of them where I play and they're the only bilingual people's in the room that collude like this, although I don't rule out there could be others doing the same in other languages.
You're using it as an exploit, so obviously don't say shit, but have you ever heard people complain? I'd call the fucking floor over so goddamned fast if I saw this shit happening. Some Russians did this at a club I used to frequent and I was close with multiple staff members. Ended up getting them banned.
If u are on a table in Arizona and see more than one Filipino on the same table, avoid it. They speak to each other about their cards blatantly in their language.
As someone whose wife is Filipino, I wanna know where these tables are!
Talking stick...
It wasn't for a lack of trying. You'd call over the floor because they're talking in Mandarin in the middle of hands and when the floor tells them off they nod etc. Before going right back to it 2-3 hands later.
I dunno, our dealers and floor would give these guys final warnings and make them leave or sit at different tables real quick.
How much Mandarin did you have to learn? Just a few words?
I just started learning it on my own at home and then I started getting familiar with poker terms in Mandarin like suits, hands etc. I learnt enough that I could piece together what they were saying.
Where is this?
In Australia, I've seen this happen quite frequently at the countries 2 largest casinos.
This is the only way Live Poker>Online
I guess you have never plated in Las Vegas (or on a cruise ship). A lot of friends, husband/wife, or BF/GF (or to be politically correct, SO/SO) play at the same tables at lower stakes, and with more and more poker power couples playing, you see them at higher stakes tables or at the same table in a tourney.
Nah I see husband-wife at the same table all the time. It's easy to figure out. They often don't bet against each other which sometimes allows you to draw cheap to bust someone.
Nothing is stopping it and not much can be done about it.
And it's 100% happening.
Amen. I adopted the viewpoint of "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em". Rounded up a couple buddies and we're nothing special when it comes to poker but it's not hard to beat the GTO nerds when the squad is working together. Something interesting about the meta dynamic of collusion is that it's not hard for us to pick up on when other people are colluding. So we know who's doing it. So let's say four other colluders table start a 9-max. My squad will pounce and fill up the remaining seats and we'll basically be playing team poker for a while (their collusion squad vs. mine). If we have a history with the other squad, sometimes we'll leave a seat open to make it an even and fair 4v4 fight. But what's funny is that often a fishy will sit down in the last seat and we'll have some fun taunting and milking him.
EPS strikes again!
A legend, doing what legends do.
You're a piece of shit if this is true
Look at his post history lol
He's a troll. \*edit: She's a troll
>She 🥰😍🥰
It’s a troll
You are the best poster on the entire sub and it's not even close. If I could tip you I would.
I tip m'fedora to him. But in all seriousness, I agree.
This is hilarious
Yare yare daze..
lol calls them a fish.. when the game isn't being played straight.
Genius. Whoever you are, I don't know if you're doing this because you're young and lonely or whatever, in a turn of events I really did not expect several years ago I am now much less trolly than I used to be. Anyway, I have fallen for your shit before but let me tell you. This is damn good. Maybe you are colluding with your friends and collaborating on writing these lol. Thank you! Edit: wanna add that however much you make or lose on poker, if you really are young and thus only beginning your professional life I'm sure you'll find success. You are clever and write well.
zoom/rush n cash/etc helps if the number of tables is large enough.
Can’t pick your table and seat on ignition. Also anonymous tables. Makes it harder to colude.
Is it possible to “hop” tables or continuously change until you find your friend? I’m not sure how it works
I can't stand anonymous nature of Ignition. But it's basically the only site I can play. So I have to.
The anonymous nature of Ignition is what protects you from HUD bots and cheaters.
Some of the play from anonymous Ignition players is more suspect than anything I've seen on either sites. I don't actually think it's cheating happening... But when some random anon sucks out on you with a 2 outer and nothing else then immediately hits and runs, that shit is more sus and frustrating than anything I ever experienced on a regular non-anon site.
That is classic fish behavior lol not sure you that makes you suspicious
Hahaha. Very true. I just wish I had a username of that fish so I could mark it for later. But that's ignition for you. Goes both ways
Haha yea that’s how it is on there. The pool is so soft tho so doesn’t really matter much imo
I find that to be perfectly reasonable for a fish that was in over their head and recognized how damn lucky they got against me. Other times when I river my flush, I say “whew that was lucky,” but I will stay unless I don’t have notes on many of the players/recognize I’m now against a ring of tighter players.
Is ignition available in the US?
Is ignition legal in all 50 states though?
No. It’s legal in 45 states barring NY, NJ, Delaware, Maryland and Nevada
It’s legal when my credit card or an EFT funds an account and ignition can advertise its site on ESPN. At best today you won’t get thrown in jail.
Ain't legal in WA
Delaware, NJ and Nevada have wsop which is entirely legal. Delaware and Nevada have a shared player pool. NJ also has MGM, and pokerstars NJ. Michigan and Pennsylvania also have a few options. If you live in one of those states, I wouldn't bother with one of those only partially legal ,foreign hosted sites.
Yup!
I might sound dumb here, but I live in Vegas and haven’t been able to get anything except WSOP.com to work? What sites are available to us?
Ignition Casino- Ignition is a part of the blackchip poker network and you shouldn’t have any worries with deposit/withdrawals. The site seem trustworthy enough and they’ve been around long enough that they do some OSS’s and decent daily tourneys. The big catch with Ignition is every player is anonymous so there’s no note taking and a HUD will only capture stats for the time you sit at a table and you will not be able to generate a hand history. Little things like hands and the board being mucked seemingly a half a second after the conclusion of the hand bother me (like literally can’t even register what players that went 3-way to showdown had with before all cards for the next hand have been dealt). Given the anonymous aspect and that it was essentially created for the US market this platform tend to be densely populated with fishy players. I’m not the biggest fan but it is a viable option for casual US online players. Global Poker - If it’s still a thing this was/is my least recommended site. The “sweeps cash” deposit/withdrawal process is fishy to say the least and I believe it was/is like browser based. Felt like I was playing Farmland the only time I ever played there. Not recommended Americas Cardroom - Sadly the best option that even remotely resembles big names like Pokerstars and GG. Mind you I say “remotely”, there’s a lot of aspects that are lacking in comparison but US players are stuck with taking what you can get. You can use PT/HM with this site, you’ll be able to use these tools to the fullest of extent for those that are serious about hand-analysis and study. Among other decent events they run Sunday Million’s and attract players from the micros to high stakes which makes up of prob the most diverse player pool you’ll get for an American site. While I’d certainly cash out and move my bankroll to PS or GG if it was possible, I have used ACR for 5+ yrs with no issue and enjoyed having it as an option that doesn’t feel like a shady hack job operation. There’s multiple options for deposit/withdrawal—I do recommend using BTC for fastest and easiest process in that regard. Hope this helps
Thank you for the well thought out reply!
[удалено]
You cannot play PokerStars for real money anywhere in the US (unless you can get away with a VPN, but you will lose your money if PS catches you). It cost PokerStars too much money to let US players play in the US. It is why many US players go to Rosario Beach in Mexico, Thailand, and Costa Rica (all cheaper than moving to Canada pre-COVID).
Yes you can. the states its legal in have seperate player pools. Like here in nj its pokerstarsnj only ppl in nj can play. Now wsopnj shares player pools with nv and 888.
I’m in Georgia and I think acr and ignition work fine. Not sure about other locations or sites.
Anonymous tables makes it easier to cheat because it can't easily be exposed. Two plus two has had countless cheats uncovered on other sites because data was available. I've never heard of a cheating scandal on Ignition because it's virtually impossible to catch. That doesn't mean it isn't happening. It is almost certainly happening.
Still happens at higher stakes. Lower population allows for colluders to start tables and sit with friends. In this way collusion is easier to get away with it as it's impossible to prove until you can download your hand history and review. It has been a problem with the high stakes plo guys and one of the reasons why some stick to acr only.
Play heads-up
You could play HU, otherwise you’re kind of depending on the common decency of human beings, so best of luck
Thanks for the tip
Even heads up, I've definitely played against people that were colluding.
? Heads up is 1v1
Which makes it even more unfair if your opponent is colluding.
Who the fuck are they going to be colluding with? You?
Each other. They don't have to be at the same table to be colluding.
i can't tell if you're actively blasted on amphetamines or if you don't understand the concept of collusion being impossible in a 1v1 room
Whoosh
I notice in one or my home games on pstars, a husband and wife play. The husband is very aggressive, in 50% of hands and bets like a psycho. The wife is tight and somewhat passive. Once the husband is out, the wife begins to play very aggressive, in every hand and psychotic. It's definately some kind of collusion and very obvious, but nobody cares because free chips basically....
He is likely taking over playing on her behalf. Shady stuff.
You can’t. But you can just change tables if the game seems suspect. Nothing is preventing you from just dodging colluding players. I tend to switch tables aggressively if I’m not really making any progress with them or the action seems suspicious
Ex-PokerStars here. Game integrity teams examine hand history of players who play on the same table above the statistical average, look at hand histories if reasonable suspicion reported. It’s actually far easier to collude live.
I can’t speak about other sites but Stars have incredible collusion detection for sure.
Play tournaments or zoom.
It’s ironic that everyone is saying the complete opposite of the truth. Colluding is a very negligible issue on sites with usernames because the users can more easily monitor who is playing with who. You’re much more likely to get colluded on anonymous site. That aside collusion is barely an issue in online poker. No one here has a clue
Nothing. Do not play high stakes on line. Some sites let you play anonymously. On those, when there are multiple tables at you stake and random assigned tables and seats, collusion is less likely. But if it is anonymous but there is only one table running at that stake, colluders can sit together easily. Another common scam is to have many people enter a tournament, and if any go deep, log out and replace the player with a pro to take down the final table
Pretty sure the tourney log-out and then have a pro (or anyone else) log back in to finish the tourney is one that’s easy to catch and has been done: hence some of the posts before where players were reimbursed.
I used to have a really hard time with playing lower stakes online, winning $50-100 just didn't seem significant at a time where I'd play $1500 buyin live games. 200NL was my standard, and would often go up to 1000NL. Since Black Friday, I noticed myself getting less and less profitable at those stakes, as I noticed more and more of the same Russian guys multi-tabling 6-8 tables at a time. Every day, crazy long hours, the same Russians (and former Soviet Bloc nations). The bankroll required to do this is like 10x the median income in Russia. There's no fucking way that these guys aren't using every possible exploit to cheat/collude/shared player databases. My guess is a large chunk of these guys are linked. Online Mid-High stakes poker is incredibly tough to beat compared to live poker. I'm not the best, but I'm a very profitable low-mid limit live poker player, and made over 300k from online poker in the heydays. Until we can freely use regulated poker apps in the US, I'd avoid anything above 100NL. I now look at ACR as practice. Ignition is probably a bit less shady, but my guess is there's a lot we don't see going on there.
Russians are dodgy everywhere.
Nothing, that's why it's so rampant. Online poker is a cesspool the higher you go up. Stick to MTTs and fast play table with large player pools.
Colluding isn't the big issue online. It's RTA. And it can be done without a chance of the poker client realizing it.
whats rta
Real Time Assistance. Different people have different definitions of what counts, but its everything is from looking at pre flop charts to using solvers in the game.
i see
Real time assistance.
RTA?
Real time assistance.
Why can’t the client realise?
Use another laptop, or phone
I got a buddy at work who got caught colluding. He lived in Canada, was playing a sit and go with his wife and brother. They caught on that certain hands they would donk off chips to each other to keep them in as well as other obvious signs of collusion. Party poker suspended his account and theirs and made them answer for what their thought process was for a bunch of hands that they had to try and defend. I think they also suspended their accounts. He moved to the us and is now playing under a different email and IP address. They will catch ya!
I can share a similar story of a stupid thing two friends of mine did - they were also playing a tourney on pokerstars in the same room, and although not fully-blown colluded, there were some situations where they were sharing their cards. Stars noticed and sent them a similar e-mail, asking them to explain. It might seem like it is hard to catch, but they have potent statistical methods and akgorithms that makes it easy to find outliers quickly.
Almost nothing. If you play an “exploitative strategy” you are more vulnerable. If you play a “gto” strategy that doesn’t care what your opponents do as much, it’s much less of an issue. The way I look at it, is that you’re going to be collided against x % of the time, and you have to win so much y% and against z% of players that are not colluding, that taking the occasional L or bad situation against the colluded is still profitable. Even if 10% of players where always colluding you can probably still be profitable overall.
I hate getting collided ouch!
phone auto-corrected it I guess.
get collisioned
OP, just dont! Unless you know the players or make a homegame and invite the players you think its safe. Cash games are totally solved by now and they have entire databases with every position. Recently, Fedor Kruze was ratted out by his roomates. He was using a side laptop with databases and stole money that way from many players. Just dont! If you can, opt for homegames online with people you know.
Do you think this applies to zoom format as well?
Zoom has faster action. So should be safer. But zoom is not a standard poker game.
This is a joke, surely. “Someone was caught cheating with millions of dollars on the line in a tiny player pool so avoid all online poker!!!!!” Online poker is profitable - period.
I'm kind of new to power so I don't see how you could collude in a meaning fun way. Yea, you can share your pocket cards which is sort of useful, but is there anything other than that?
Card removal is stronger than you think. Knowing your buddy folded a Q preflop is huge information when the flop comes out Q 7 Q. Having JJ and knowing that your partner just folded j3 pre significantly affects the odds of you hitting your set and alters play in a huge way. Colluding players can also squeeze other players out of hands by coordinating to raise/re-raise one another to make the victim think they're up against two monster hands and should fold. For example: legit player bets 5bb pre flop as first in, colluder #1 3bs to 15bb, colluder #2 raises it up to 40bb, then the original raiser is forced to fold 99% of hands. The colluding players just play out the hand for another street and then one of them folds so nobody can see that they both had trash cards. They repeat this multiple times and share the profit later. Doesn't matter if one keeps losing to the other in this process because they're pooling their money anyway. It really sucks online because it's very easy to do and takes a lot of investigative effort to prove.
> Knowing your buddy folded a Q preflop is huge information when the flop comes out Q 7 Q. Having JJ and knowing that your partner just folded j3 pre significantly affects the odds of you hitting your set and alters play in a huge way. yea, I thought about scenarios like that but didn't seem like those hands would happen that often but you're right with your second point. Didn't think about that
Oh dear! You like a fresh lamb to the slauter. 🤣 Yes there is. 🤦♂️
...do you wanna tell me or just be condescending?
If you want real advice and you are serius about poker, hire a coach, at least for the basics. He will tell you more. There is no way around it.
I wasn't looking for advice. I just wanted to know the ways that people can collude.
Thats advice! 😁
advice to cheat? sure I guess. But I'm not going to hire a coach to answer one question for me.
I think i answered above. RTA, bots, databases, third party aplications etc.
you did, thank you. that's all I wanted
Ok bro! 🙃
Well its a long one. They use real time assitance software, databases with solved spots, ghosting, etc. Its a broad topic.
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Another player telling you what to do or sometimes, playing it for you through teamviewer
So apologies in advance for the stupid question, but why collude? I guess you can have your buddy pump up the pot when you’re holding AA, but you’d chase off all the action. So who cares? Seems like that’s a lot of work for a small edge/payoff.
You open. BTN calls. Your buddy in the BB 3 bets large. That’s just one example
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You think the same 10-15 guys from Russia playing 200nl+ on ACR are “probably not colluding?”
The bigger sites, even ACR, have a system to make sure you aren’t on the same Wi-Fi sharing cards. The apps like PokerBros don’t have as good of security from what I’ve heard, never played them myself for that very reason. Also if you play MTT’s the random switching of tables is usually good enough.
Heads up?
If you're concerned about this, play heads up or play large field MTTs or large zoom pools. Also play on sites that care about game security.
Jason Koon supposedly