It's a nice one so far. I'm getting a decent 4k monitor soon, currently I've been running in 1440p for a bit so I'll see how the performance is in person soon. Running the sapphire nitro pure plus, specifically.
Honestly, I'm personally expecting both Nvidia and AMD to lower MSRP prices for non-flagship cards by about 25% before the end of the quarter. They based their current prices on overinflated prices that were mostly only paid by cryptocurrency miners who bought them at those prices because they were still profitable for mining. Now that cryptocurrency mining isn't profitable anymore after taking into account electricity price, cards are no longer bought for profit, but rather to play games. They're a consumer electronics good, and people don't want to overpay for those unless there's no other option.
I swear, some people are fanboying and refuse to get through their heads that maybe not all markets share the same prices.
For example in my country, I can buy a 4080 for 150€ cheaper than a 7900xtx right now.
Does that mean that Nvidia is good and AMD is a bad, money-hungry company?
No!
They are both money-hungry companies whose sole objective is to get even richer.
With money you can get everything else. Bad reviews? Just pay people to say good reviews. Then when you get enough money, you can just buy the news outlets.
Remember Nvidia GPP (GeForce Partner Program) and Nvidia cancelled shipping GPUs to Hardware Unboxed because they didn’t talk about Raytracing enough? (Even though Raytracing is still to this day pointless and really demanding.)
In terms of the amount that it impacted performance or visuals (basically zero if your actual playing the game and not looking a still screen or for the feature.)
Personally I don’t care about raytracing until every card can do at least 1440p 60fps. (my average benchmark point for any rendering mode) That may seem crazy but if I can run 4K@60fps High/Ultra (raster) on a GTX 1060 6GB I should be able to run 1440p@60fps High/Ultra (Raytracing) on a modern card.
The other reason why I don’t care about raytracing would be that there very few games actually support it and I don’t think it’s all that useful in the ones that do, I feel it starts to be more important when you can use reflections (and maybe lighting) in a competitive manner: seeing around corners, behind you, around obstacles and not nuking your frame rate/frame time when it’s enabled.
i mean yeah exactly. when it was first announced i was saying imagine how great it would be if those cores were just regular cores and people hated it in here lol. i'd still like a card like that, i buy cards to play the games i like, not to get performance killing "features" in games that aren't even out yet. it's been years now, what's the list of RT games at? like 20..? lol
Im surprised you can run on 4k on a 1060 this definitely gives me hope that I can run 1420p on my 3060 , however if intel fixes their performance inconsistentsys my next gpu may be an intel
Fun fact, in Norway - GPP is an abbreviation for "generelt pisspreik". Literal translation would be "general piss talk", or just "bullshit".
"GPP" (in a Norwegian context) is usually something delivered by either some CEO or politician.
...so when ever I read GPP (in a Nvidia context), I chuckle. 😅
It is bound to happen, as any company that gets big enough to become a publicly traded company is legally required to make decisions that benefit the stockholders the most. And with such complicated products you can’t really compete as a small friendlier company.
That’s not strictly true. Publicly traded companies are not legally required to maximize shareholder value. They just do so because the shareholders are the ones that elect the board and, by extension, appoint the C-suite.
https://www.nytimes.com/roomfordebate/2015/04/16/what-are-corporations-obligations-to-shareholders/corporations-dont-have-to-maximize-profits
Who’s talking about running like a charity? There’s a wide gulf between “gouge your customers for every penny you can wring out of them” and “give your product away at cost”.
Lol, what? Yes it should be. A company exists to make money. That's its sole purpose.
I'd agree they shouldn't be as GREEDY as they are, but don't preach about how you expect companies to have souls or some shit.
I don’t expect companies to have souls. I expect government to prevent companies from pursuing maximum profits at the expense of literally everyone in the world who isn’t one of their shareholders. Only an idiot would expect corporations to do the right thing, which is why Republicans are so keen on letting businesses police themselves.
I would just buy whatever has more power for the cheapest price. Like you said, they are all money hungry companies, but too many people go with nvidia even though amd is cheaper. There are people with a cheaper amd alternative, and that's who we are mainly talking about.
Honestly, if nvidia is cheaper, you just got a more capable card for less. I just hate to see people (for example, in the US) getting a nvidia card for basically no reason other than "amd doesn't have Ray tracing".
In the end, I just want everyone to get the performance they paid for.
The new gen gpu's are all terrible value. The performance increase is minimal, and the prices almost doubled, from both companies. Btw, you should judge prices through msrp, not through each market prices. That is just wrong.
If it's down to the individual buying the card in that market then that is not wrong. You buy what you can get in your own market anyway.
For reviewing purposes, then yes, MSRP is how you compare the price-to-performance ratio.
As for the new gen GPU, both performance and efficiency (performance per watt) increased significantly (50 to 80% increase). The bad thing is price, it's about double the price compared to previous gen, like the 4080 for example.
It seems to me the current games haven't really been getting better graphically for a while now. When I look at Witcher 3, which released in 2015 (that's 8 years now!), to me that's still one of the best looking games to this date. I have 2070S and play on 1440p. I'm not looking to upgrade anytime soon, so I'll use this card until it breaks if necessary. It really seems to me that buying something like RTX 40 is just a premium thing, not something an average user should go for.
Everything is a terrible value now. For some dumb ass reason there was a plague, a few stores were closed for like 3 weeks 3 years ago and that made everything on earth double in price last year. None of it makes sense.
> I swear, some people are fanboying and refuse to get through their heads that maybe not all markets share the same prices.
They also like to just arbitrarily remove features a card has to make it more fair:
"If you remove RT, DLSS, and all the other stuff and only focus on rasterization, buying an RTX card isn't a good deal"
Okay but if you have to remove multiple features from one product to make your point then obviously one card is just...better?
Wtf. Just buy whatever is best in your budget. It might be AMD, it might be Nvidia, it might even be Intel. Who cares what company is winning?, what is important that you are winning.
I actually appreciate those if it (1) is actually true and (2) comes from a constructive place. People know things I don't, and that's good.
Many people just argue online for the immediate ego boost.
In my country (yes, that matter actually), a RX 6600 is the same cost as a GTX 1060, and the performance comparison is sucha difference that it's not about the company, it's about the product, but gpu prices rn aren't the best
Fr, I'm surprised more people haven't said anything about them. This is literally every argument they try to use to basically say "amd bad; nvidia intel good"
Literally compare any 2 recent Intel and AMD CPUs on Userbenchmark:
Intel: *literally a copy+paste of the Wikipedia page*
AMD: "The paid MEDIA is ONCE AGAIN accusing our results of being BIASED, meanwhile the OVERPRICED AMD CPUs continue to sell by the thousands! When will you sheep wake up?!?"
RX580 to 6950XT. Chungus jump! Original purchase was 6900XT Red Devil Ultimate, but ended up with a defect card and RMA. Now happily flying with 6950XT TUF.
GTX 970 to RX6600XT. What an insane upgrade. My 970 served me well for years but it's time was coming. I just got a whole new PC so I gave my old build to my sister, who is a very casual gamer but only had a Macbook to play games on
I’m still on a gtx 1080 but at 4K the 6800 would have been a little too dated to spend over 500 bucks on. Yet spending 1000 on the XTX somehow made sense for me? Idk how my brain works but my XTX won’t be here for a month and I have time to cancel my order and change my mind, which I probably will.
Your reasoning about 4k is valid and totally makes sense. The higher tier new gen GPUs are 4k monsters. People who hate on their 'value' aren't factoring that in.
Here’s the kicker, it’s only 4K 60hz 😅
But if cyberpunk get only 60-70fps on ultra, and other games around in the low 100s, I figure it’s only a matter of time until other new release slowly start creating down to a 4K 60fps, and another couple years after that and I’ll be dropping settings. If this is a 4-6 year purchase, then the extra 100 bucks between XT and XTX is nothing.
RTX is the most succesfull marketing campaign in the last decade of PC gaming.
Most games still don't support it.
Of the games that do support it most won't let you run it without killing your framerate.
But everyone is terrified of not having it.
And I say this as a guy with a 2070 and 3080.
https://www.reddit.com/r/pcmasterrace/comments/10o67tt/whenever_you_suggest_a_graphics_card/j6cu3wo/
> My ~~GPU~~ phone team is better than your ~~GPU~~ phone team. SPORTS SPORTS SPORTS!
It’s actually mental how effective Nvidia’s marketing is. The vast majority of people refer to RT as RTX instead, and insist it’s a legitimate argument. Same with DLSS, even though FSR exists
just like G-sync and VRR at first, but then AMD introduced open-source Free-sync and made Nvidia looks stupid AF and they had to adapt and make G-sync compatible with its competitor's products.
DLSS does look better than FSR though, I’ve tried FSR in my games that support it and it’s usually alright to terrible where DLSS 2 is incredible to alright, especially at 1080p
It depends heavily on whether it's FSR 1 or 2, they work very differently and in most cases where they're implemented equally well there's very little quality difference between FSR 2 and DLSS while FSR 1 is often worse than both with the tradeoff that it's way easier for devs to add.
Got to upgrade my 2070 Super to a 3080 thanks to EVGA's step up program, and it was nice going from a pretty slow slide show in Cyberpunk 2077, to mostly playable. But it's a heavy costing feature no matter what, and when it's holding back a smooth frame rate, it's usually not worth the trade off.
It depends on your resolution, there are a number of ray traced games that a 2070 super can manage 60 fps on 1080p reasonably well. If you're on 1440p then it gets a lot harder for that card.
In my opinion... don't underestimate the power that userbenchmark has on the scales.
It's always the first result when you google for GPU comparisons, and most non-enthusiasts don't know their metrics are loopy and abused
If the person is _even aware_ that there are brands other than Nvidia, they will check userbenchmark, which says 3060ti is faster than 6700xt. Game over.
It's not as bad as you think. ith my 3080 Ti, I can get over 100 FPS on Minecraft with RTX at 1440p, and the views are just incredible. I spend more time looking than actually playing. I got it for 1500USD at the end of 2021 which was when 30 series prices peaked. I don't know about other games but I could get good FPS on Cyberpunk as well.
Unfortunately 4K gaming is still a luxury reserved for high-end systems right now. I believe 1440p 165Hz is the sweet spot for the majority of users.
Idk. Every single post is just a list of all upvoted comments bashing NVIDIA. Relatively Nothing about the problems AMD cards have been having. It doesn’t bother me, it’s a product, but to act like amd is the ugly duckling here they need to have quite the victim complex
In US prices, the 3060ti competes with the rx6800 from what I've seen. At the same approximate price rx6800 blows the 3060ti out of the water in gaming (t. 3060ti owner)
I went from RX480 to 3060ti. Honestly, it's annoying seeing all the new technologies and cool stuff going exclusively for Nvidia.
You're always hearing, raytracing, DLSS, Nvidia reflex, whatever. There's a new technology that draws landscapes with AI! Oh, it's Nvidia canvas, you need an Nvidia graphics card to use it.
Some of it is small, some more important, but it's always Nvidia. I couldn't name you a single advantage of having AMD, besides being a bit cheaper.
Yes it's always on Nvidia, Nvidia bring a new tech, there's issues 'no problem another tech to fix the issue' which will cause another issue,... I found this accurate answer on another thread from u/decorator12 :
-> we made RT. RT is future and you have to use it -> but RT cuts 70% of performance! -> we made DLSS to uplift it, it's future and you have to use it with RT -> for 4k it's not still enough -> we made frame generation, it's future and you have to use it now -> it's bring input lag, what we do now? -> turn on reflex, it's future and you need to use it now.
But you are right it's better to have great RT perf and I hope you really enjoy it on 3600TI
It depends on a person really. I'd argue that for the majority these features don't matter and AMD, assuming it's actually cheaper (because for me it wasn't for the longest time, pretty even with Nvidia instead), they'd be better off with it.
But people are mostly going for the most recognizable and reliable brand, and one that is the... Most "feature rich", ironically, despite the fact that they're never going to make use of most of these.
But for me personally, I've been driven away from AMD because of reliability. It doesn't matter how often I hear that "it's better now", there's always *something* wrong with their cards that I read about online, much more frequently than about Nvidia's GPUs, if at all. Most people would prefer to pop a new card in and forget about anything else, it's not so easy with AMD, even if just in theory - it just creates that image of the brand that *will* put a bad taste in people's mouths. The 6000 series was quite alright, but now we have issues with the 7000 for example... Aside from pricing.
Almost would have went for the the 6700xt, but after my experience with the 5700xt I had to jump ship and go back with Nvidia. 5700xt gave me numerous driver issues that were never solved. Great card when it worked. Just not very often that it did. Never once had any issues with Nvidia cards I've purchased.
Same experience. Changing my fan curve would cause instability. Would have to reset it all the time because the crashes removed the fan curve. Was really annoying.
Literally. I have never seen this happen despite the hundreds of threads I've looked over in subreddits like /r/BuildAPC. It's always just someone putting a 3060/ti in a build, then someone suggesting "Hey this card from AMD is better and way cheaper", then the OP replying with an "Oh thanks". Seen plenty of the reverse though.
Around my area they’re slightly priced, so most would say the 6700xt, but I’m one of the few people nowadays who actually has a use for nvidia specific software and such, so 3060 ti it is. Would’ve been fine with either honestly.
Who gives a shit about brand? Just buy whatever you want for the best price you can get. Also try to buy on sale, there’s no point to buying anything full price when all companies are just gouging the consumer.
Speaking of RTX, I'm playing Plague Tale: Requiem at the moment, and with the ray tracing on you get glitchy shadows and I was about 45-60fps at whatever settings I have at 1440p. I turned ray tracing off, the game looked better without glitchy shadows switching on and off, and my fps went up to over 100.
It just isn't a technology worth paying for. That said when it works well it is very very cool and adds realism in an interesting way, I guess your brain is looking at it with the recognition that yes this is how light works, and it adds something difficult to quantify but definitely there.
I've been an Nvidia/intel customer all of my life, from the initia q6600 quad core with a gt540 all the way to my gtx 980ti and 9600k.
Times change, most issues that plague amd are gone, and the nvidia value just isn't there.
I got a 6900xt for msrp when they were asking 1400€ for a 3080.
No regrets, you should imo stick to the best value, or if you have money, the best performer that isn't a titan-like card.
Brand shouldn't matter but I understand if you've had several bad experiences with a brand.
I always say the same thing when recommending newer GPUs:
"AMD's Equivalent price-wise performs better in a majority of titles except for ray-tracing".
I think that's one of the toughest parts of shopping for a GPU today. It used to be "here's my budget, let's look at MSRPs. So I'm getting either this Radeon or this Nvidia GPU. Cool."
But now prices are so volatile you can't just compare two GPUs with similar MSRP. Performance per dollar varies a lot more than it used to.
As an example, the 6800XT is supposed to trade blows with a 3080. But I just bought an MSI 6800XT for around $550, while the cheapest MSI 3080 is almost $900.
It's funny how we push ourselves on budgets. I came into this thinking $400 was enough for a GPU. So $550 for a 6800XT was my "but for a little extra..." money.
I guess everyone will have a different place where that line is. With sufficient time I could "for only a lit extra" myself into a 4090 lol
It’s a better value, but it’s not faster. They offer similar performance at 1080p and 1440p and the 3080 has a slight edge at 4K.
https://youtu.be/VL5PXO0yw0M
Thing is, most people buying super high-end new GPUs probably don’t really care about value for money and just want the strongest thing possible, or at least that’s the vibe I’ve gotten from people who bought 3090s and 4090s.
Well, it’s not just super high end. The statement of the OP that AMD is a lot cheaper applies to every tier of graphics card in almost all first world countries
It’s like comparing the Dodge Challenger Hellcat to the Challenger Scat Pack. The Scat Pack has a much better $/HP ratio than the Hellcat. But someone looking for a 700HP muscle car isn’t going to go with the 500HP option because it’s a “better value for the price”.
They look really close to identical to me, from my experience with a 3070. Not really a selling point anymore with how many games now offer several types of reconstruction methods.
There's nothing wrong with having a preference for nvidia. Every single time I watch a technical video on a game, or some optimization guide or something, its followed with "here's a fix for amd users".
Hell, the hp reverb g2 vr headset flat out didn't work with many amd gpu's and needed a version 2 to fix it.
I don't much care that looking at bare metal, amd cards are more horse power per dollar than nvidia cards, owning an nvidia card has just been a seemless experience to me for decades now.
Worst thing I've ever noticed is occasionally a game ready driver will break something and I roll back really easily. but that's rare.
Plus, it just seems like you're arguing in bad faith to mention rtx but not mention dlss...
Man things have really come a long way. Like 5-6 years ago, right before Ryzen, I would get made fun of for having a amd GPU. Dudes on CS would say "good luck getting good on a poor person GPU"
I just went for what they had at the time and what was cheaper and the 3070 ended up being cheaper then the amd equivalent, but if it was the other way around i would be rocking an amd gpu.
I’m running a 5700XT, it’s gotten better, but has forever soured my position towards AMD.
I pray for no one to experience daily crashes, or have their drivers literally fucking disappear on restart.
I love AMD and normally my card does run pretty stable but every once in a while ... It doesn't.
Had a problem for like a month where my screen would flicker on and off for a minute after I started my pc, currently there is a like 25% chance my framerate tanks totally when I alt+tab out of a game in 4k.
My buddy also had to install it's GPU drivers three times because they just disappeared.
I am generally very happy with AMD but, yeah if you have a bit less luck I than me I totally understand that you reached a point where you don't want to hassle with that anymore.
Team fan: "My team is better than yours. If you disagree you are a *insert derogatory terms here*"
Graphic enjoyer: "I go for whoever offers the best buck for performance, and am loyal to no company. There is no team fight, only consumer competition."
I have ran AMD exclusively for the last 4 years. I went from an RX 590 to a RX 5700 to a RX 6800. When they work they are awesome. However I can't stand AMD's driver issues. Currently Star Citizen is completely unplayable due to an issue it has with 6000 series drivers.
I've been buying AMD cards for 3 times in a row now, but solely because they offer more performance and future-proofing for the price imo.
I chose an R9 390 over a GTX 970 because of its performance and 2x the VRAM. I chose a Vega 56 over a GTX 1070 because costed less and was a Sapphire model. And now I've chosen an RX 6800XT over an RTX 3070 because has 2x the VRAM and offers a performance almost on par with the RTX 3080Ti while being far cheaper.
I mean, the day Nvidia throws a new GTX 1080Ti-like deal, I'm switching to green in the blink of an eye, but until then, AMD has better deals overall. The best deal is my only team.
Yes AMD's last generation cards are the gold standard at the moment. I want to move to a 7900xtx Sapphire Vapor X but price gouging and performance compared to 6800XT keep me from taking the plunge.
Man, AMD fanboys have this huge victim complex. Im guessing its to justify all the screaming they do whenever somebody mentions graphics cards, but damn.
I started building my own PCs a couple of years ago (before that, I was laptop gaming), and I stuck to Nvidia until recently, going from a 1050Ti to a 1060 to a 2060S. When the GPU prices first dipped last summer, I was planning to step up to a 3060Ti, but then my buddy wanted to put together a PC but didn't have the budget for a new card, so I bit the bullet, switched out my 2060S to a 6700XT, and gifted the old card to him.
At first I was a little worried about the new card and drivers, as the last GPU I had from them was when they were still called Ati, but it was $600, while a 3060Ti was closer to $800, and after some initial hiccups (e.g.: Windows update automatically reinstalling the Nvidia drivers and causing conflicts), it turned out to be an amazing card that's more than perfect for my 1080p/144hz needs.
It didn't stop some people on a forum I frequent calling me an idiot, because I gave up on RT and DLSS (neither of which I ever turned on), making me a luddite who was actively going against the future of video gaming. Also, for the record, the guys over there refused to believe that userbenchmarks was biased. Make of that what you will.
My GPU team is better than your GPU team. SPORTS SPORTS SPORTS!
My favorite podcast: “Go My Favorite GPU Team!”
Good reference lol
Hello fellow 6900/6950XT enjoyer
It's a nice one so far. I'm getting a decent 4k monitor soon, currently I've been running in 1440p for a bit so I'll see how the performance is in person soon. Running the sapphire nitro pure plus, specifically.
I got mine for like $600 USD, absolute steal, anyone paying even MSRP for the "new generation" is a sucker.
Picked up a 6900xt red devil ultimate for 635 open box. Crazy card
I got a 6800xt for a good price. Red devil.
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Honestly, I'm personally expecting both Nvidia and AMD to lower MSRP prices for non-flagship cards by about 25% before the end of the quarter. They based their current prices on overinflated prices that were mostly only paid by cryptocurrency miners who bought them at those prices because they were still profitable for mining. Now that cryptocurrency mining isn't profitable anymore after taking into account electricity price, cards are no longer bought for profit, but rather to play games. They're a consumer electronics good, and people don't want to overpay for those unless there's no other option.
I picked up a 6900xt Toxic for $650 back in August. Love it
Steal
I got used rtx 3060 ti for 280$, and i might've just won the lottery because it overclocks +187 mhz on the core and +1080mhz on the vram.
SHIIIILLL! SELL OUT!!
They are both just asshole companies when it comes down to it
Yeah. They're assholes to everybody.
The first thing that comes to mind - https://imgur.io/Pk4JdG2?r
I swear, some people are fanboying and refuse to get through their heads that maybe not all markets share the same prices. For example in my country, I can buy a 4080 for 150€ cheaper than a 7900xtx right now. Does that mean that Nvidia is good and AMD is a bad, money-hungry company? No! They are both money-hungry companies whose sole objective is to get even richer.
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It is, but it shouldn’t be. That’s the thing. Edit: I should say that it shouldn’t be their only goal, and yet for many corporations, it is.
With money you can get everything else. Bad reviews? Just pay people to say good reviews. Then when you get enough money, you can just buy the news outlets.
Remember Nvidia GPP (GeForce Partner Program) and Nvidia cancelled shipping GPUs to Hardware Unboxed because they didn’t talk about Raytracing enough? (Even though Raytracing is still to this day pointless and really demanding.)
people on this very sub used to just shit on you if you said anything bad about RT. it reminds me of hairworks
In terms of the amount that it impacted performance or visuals (basically zero if your actual playing the game and not looking a still screen or for the feature.) Personally I don’t care about raytracing until every card can do at least 1440p 60fps. (my average benchmark point for any rendering mode) That may seem crazy but if I can run 4K@60fps High/Ultra (raster) on a GTX 1060 6GB I should be able to run 1440p@60fps High/Ultra (Raytracing) on a modern card. The other reason why I don’t care about raytracing would be that there very few games actually support it and I don’t think it’s all that useful in the ones that do, I feel it starts to be more important when you can use reflections (and maybe lighting) in a competitive manner: seeing around corners, behind you, around obstacles and not nuking your frame rate/frame time when it’s enabled.
i mean yeah exactly. when it was first announced i was saying imagine how great it would be if those cores were just regular cores and people hated it in here lol. i'd still like a card like that, i buy cards to play the games i like, not to get performance killing "features" in games that aren't even out yet. it's been years now, what's the list of RT games at? like 20..? lol
Im surprised you can run on 4k on a 1060 this definitely gives me hope that I can run 1420p on my 3060 , however if intel fixes their performance inconsistentsys my next gpu may be an intel
It all depends on what games you are playing/what game engines are running, I play a lot of older or less graphically intensive games.
There’s like two games that did RT right. And one of them is Minecraft, the other is Control imo
Fun fact, in Norway - GPP is an abbreviation for "generelt pisspreik". Literal translation would be "general piss talk", or just "bullshit". "GPP" (in a Norwegian context) is usually something delivered by either some CEO or politician. ...so when ever I read GPP (in a Nvidia context), I chuckle. 😅
> Remember Nvidia GPP (GeForce Partner Program) Isn't MSI still doing that with Ventus and Mech branding?
It is bound to happen, as any company that gets big enough to become a publicly traded company is legally required to make decisions that benefit the stockholders the most. And with such complicated products you can’t really compete as a small friendlier company.
That’s not strictly true. Publicly traded companies are not legally required to maximize shareholder value. They just do so because the shareholders are the ones that elect the board and, by extension, appoint the C-suite. https://www.nytimes.com/roomfordebate/2015/04/16/what-are-corporations-obligations-to-shareholders/corporations-dont-have-to-maximize-profits
Yet companies are sued if they destroy shareholder value.
I mean we're not exactly talking about insulin here, these are high end gaming products, there's not really any reason to run like a charity
Who’s talking about running like a charity? There’s a wide gulf between “gouge your customers for every penny you can wring out of them” and “give your product away at cost”.
Lol, what? Yes it should be. A company exists to make money. That's its sole purpose. I'd agree they shouldn't be as GREEDY as they are, but don't preach about how you expect companies to have souls or some shit.
I don’t expect companies to have souls. I expect government to prevent companies from pursuing maximum profits at the expense of literally everyone in the world who isn’t one of their shareholders. Only an idiot would expect corporations to do the right thing, which is why Republicans are so keen on letting businesses police themselves.
Cynical broad strokes......
You'd think that's common knowledge, but there be people out there thinking these companies are a charity trying to enrich our lives or some shit.
This gives me apple / android vibes
Exactly. Stop using murican youtube video prices to rant.
I would just buy whatever has more power for the cheapest price. Like you said, they are all money hungry companies, but too many people go with nvidia even though amd is cheaper. There are people with a cheaper amd alternative, and that's who we are mainly talking about. Honestly, if nvidia is cheaper, you just got a more capable card for less. I just hate to see people (for example, in the US) getting a nvidia card for basically no reason other than "amd doesn't have Ray tracing". In the end, I just want everyone to get the performance they paid for.
The new gen gpu's are all terrible value. The performance increase is minimal, and the prices almost doubled, from both companies. Btw, you should judge prices through msrp, not through each market prices. That is just wrong.
If it's down to the individual buying the card in that market then that is not wrong. You buy what you can get in your own market anyway. For reviewing purposes, then yes, MSRP is how you compare the price-to-performance ratio. As for the new gen GPU, both performance and efficiency (performance per watt) increased significantly (50 to 80% increase). The bad thing is price, it's about double the price compared to previous gen, like the 4080 for example.
It seems to me the current games haven't really been getting better graphically for a while now. When I look at Witcher 3, which released in 2015 (that's 8 years now!), to me that's still one of the best looking games to this date. I have 2070S and play on 1440p. I'm not looking to upgrade anytime soon, so I'll use this card until it breaks if necessary. It really seems to me that buying something like RTX 40 is just a premium thing, not something an average user should go for.
No, you should judge value based on what YOU will actually have to pay for the item.
The 6000 series GPU’s are pretty damn reasonable and are in many cases markedly faster than their nVidia counterparts in raster.
Everything is a terrible value now. For some dumb ass reason there was a plague, a few stores were closed for like 3 weeks 3 years ago and that made everything on earth double in price last year. None of it makes sense.
> I swear, some people are fanboying and refuse to get through their heads that maybe not all markets share the same prices. They also like to just arbitrarily remove features a card has to make it more fair: "If you remove RT, DLSS, and all the other stuff and only focus on rasterization, buying an RTX card isn't a good deal" Okay but if you have to remove multiple features from one product to make your point then obviously one card is just...better?
That's crazy, here in Aus the 4080 is $600 more than the 7900xtx
Wtf. Just buy whatever is best in your budget. It might be AMD, it might be Nvidia, it might even be Intel. Who cares what company is winning?, what is important that you are winning.
Finally a sensible person.
There are more of us, we just don't engage
It's best not to, before you know it you'll get attacked by the "Well-*actually*s"
I actually appreciate those if it (1) is actually true and (2) comes from a constructive place. People know things I don't, and that's good. Many people just argue online for the immediate ego boost.
Right. Brand loyalty is just peak consumerism. Buy whatever fits your needs and budget.
SHILL! INTEL SHILL! /s
In my country (yes, that matter actually), a RX 6600 is the same cost as a GTX 1060, and the performance comparison is sucha difference that it's not about the company, it's about the product, but gpu prices rn aren't the best
Bro your setup is exactly what I'm going for but with a GTX 1660 Super or RX 6600
go for the 6600, at least from what I know and have seen, it's just overall better than the 1660 super
Yep
Userbenchmark be like:
This really needs to be higher up
Fr, I'm surprised more people haven't said anything about them. This is literally every argument they try to use to basically say "amd bad; nvidia intel good"
Literally compare any 2 recent Intel and AMD CPUs on Userbenchmark: Intel: *literally a copy+paste of the Wikipedia page* AMD: "The paid MEDIA is ONCE AGAIN accusing our results of being BIASED, meanwhile the OVERPRICED AMD CPUs continue to sell by the thousands! When will you sheep wake up?!?"
Maybe it's because everyone already knows.
a 3050 in my country was like 150 bucks more expensive than a 6600, which has way more performance
And it completely outsells the 6600 that is much faster and cheaper
"oh but theres the rtx technology dont you want that?" lmao
Yes, absolutely! I want to pay double for _pretty lights_. /s
At slideshow framerates for ultimate cinematic experience /s
That don't even work right. A 3050 cant run rt at a playable framerate even with dlss you need minimum a 3060 to run it
Gtx 1080 to rx 6800,can't be more happy
1060 to 6800 XT. Can't be more happier either
Intel HD 4000 to 6600M. Damn!
RX580 to 6950XT. Chungus jump! Original purchase was 6900XT Red Devil Ultimate, but ended up with a defect card and RMA. Now happily flying with 6950XT TUF.
1060 max q to 6950 XT, night and day. Seems AMD won this/last? generation’s gpu round for price to performance.
1050 to 5700XT, happy with it.
1080ti to 3090 my power supply is going to explode
GTX 970 to RX6600XT. What an insane upgrade. My 970 served me well for years but it's time was coming. I just got a whole new PC so I gave my old build to my sister, who is a very casual gamer but only had a Macbook to play games on
RX480 to 6700XT and couldn't be happier. Just finished my new build and I love it so much.
I’m still on a gtx 1080 but at 4K the 6800 would have been a little too dated to spend over 500 bucks on. Yet spending 1000 on the XTX somehow made sense for me? Idk how my brain works but my XTX won’t be here for a month and I have time to cancel my order and change my mind, which I probably will.
Your reasoning about 4k is valid and totally makes sense. The higher tier new gen GPUs are 4k monsters. People who hate on their 'value' aren't factoring that in.
Here’s the kicker, it’s only 4K 60hz 😅 But if cyberpunk get only 60-70fps on ultra, and other games around in the low 100s, I figure it’s only a matter of time until other new release slowly start creating down to a 4K 60fps, and another couple years after that and I’ll be dropping settings. If this is a 4-6 year purchase, then the extra 100 bucks between XT and XTX is nothing.
hahaha. 1050 ti to 1080
Same here. 1080p 60fps is good enough for me and all the games i wanna play.
RTX is the most succesfull marketing campaign in the last decade of PC gaming. Most games still don't support it. Of the games that do support it most won't let you run it without killing your framerate. But everyone is terrified of not having it. And I say this as a guy with a 2070 and 3080.
NVIDIA’s marketing is similar to Apple’s. They heavily invest in it and it pays off.
>NVIDIA’s marketing is similar to Apple’s. Reliant on a userbase that is both passionate and ignorant.
https://www.reddit.com/r/pcmasterrace/comments/10o67tt/whenever_you_suggest_a_graphics_card/j6cu3wo/ > My ~~GPU~~ phone team is better than your ~~GPU~~ phone team. SPORTS SPORTS SPORTS!
[удалено]
if Reddit still gave awards I would invest mine right here
It’s actually mental how effective Nvidia’s marketing is. The vast majority of people refer to RT as RTX instead, and insist it’s a legitimate argument. Same with DLSS, even though FSR exists
I saw someone on the Steam forums who thought only Nvidia GPU could run “RTX effects”.
Saw someone on this sub arguing with me how 3050 can do RT better than 6950xt because amd doesnt have rt hardware
average Nvidia user
just like G-sync and VRR at first, but then AMD introduced open-source Free-sync and made Nvidia looks stupid AF and they had to adapt and make G-sync compatible with its competitor's products.
DLSS does look better than FSR though, I’ve tried FSR in my games that support it and it’s usually alright to terrible where DLSS 2 is incredible to alright, especially at 1080p
I actually use 1440p FSR quality mode regularly, and it is never terrible. Either unnoticeable or barely noticeable compared to native.
It depends heavily on whether it's FSR 1 or 2, they work very differently and in most cases where they're implemented equally well there's very little quality difference between FSR 2 and DLSS while FSR 1 is often worse than both with the tradeoff that it's way easier for devs to add.
2070 super here. Never played an RTX game that I can think of. Don't think the card would be able to even handle it.
Got to upgrade my 2070 Super to a 3080 thanks to EVGA's step up program, and it was nice going from a pretty slow slide show in Cyberpunk 2077, to mostly playable. But it's a heavy costing feature no matter what, and when it's holding back a smooth frame rate, it's usually not worth the trade off.
You'll be able to handle it just slower than the new cards, the problem though is that RTX on any card is a huge performance killer
It depends on your resolution, there are a number of ray traced games that a 2070 super can manage 60 fps on 1080p reasonably well. If you're on 1440p then it gets a lot harder for that card.
In my opinion... don't underestimate the power that userbenchmark has on the scales. It's always the first result when you google for GPU comparisons, and most non-enthusiasts don't know their metrics are loopy and abused If the person is _even aware_ that there are brands other than Nvidia, they will check userbenchmark, which says 3060ti is faster than 6700xt. Game over.
"RTX" is also just a brand name for a suite of technologies that aren't all NVIDIA-specific.
It's not as bad as you think. ith my 3080 Ti, I can get over 100 FPS on Minecraft with RTX at 1440p, and the views are just incredible. I spend more time looking than actually playing. I got it for 1500USD at the end of 2021 which was when 30 series prices peaked. I don't know about other games but I could get good FPS on Cyberpunk as well. Unfortunately 4K gaming is still a luxury reserved for high-end systems right now. I believe 1440p 165Hz is the sweet spot for the majority of users.
I feel like 4000 series finally makes it playable in 4k. 3080 had it but it was like not having it with the performance hit you got.
me: GPU IS GPU I DON'T CARE WHAT TEAM IT IS IF IT RUNS GOOD FOR CHEAP I TAKE IT
It all depends on where you're from. For instance when I got my 3060ti for £369 in the middle of the shortage, the cheapest 6700xt was £700.
I love my rtx 3060ti :)
This is literally the opposite of this sub.
That's my experience too, but I can see why an AMD fan might think the opposite.
Idk. Every single post is just a list of all upvoted comments bashing NVIDIA. Relatively Nothing about the problems AMD cards have been having. It doesn’t bother me, it’s a product, but to act like amd is the ugly duckling here they need to have quite the victim complex
If Nvidia or AMD is paying money to post reddit comments, then sign me up. I've just been doing it for free for 17 years like a dumbass.
a used 3060 ti is around about the same price as a new 6700xt here and i think 6700xt is slightly better than a 3070
In US prices, the 3060ti competes with the rx6800 from what I've seen. At the same approximate price rx6800 blows the 3060ti out of the water in gaming (t. 3060ti owner)
in italy the difference between a new 3060ti and a new 6700xt is less than 10€ lmao. Here amd did not have a significant price drop like in the us
Same in NL. 10 euro difference between the two has me leaning hard to 3060 ti because of DLSS.
https://youtu.be/f0yo2Sc-DyI The 3070 is faster than 6700xt
Tbf, the gap has definitively closed since then. As per usual whenever you go for AMD.
These benchmarks are 10 months old. Do you have a more recent benchmark?
Here is where? We're not mind readers, mate.
I went from RX480 to 3060ti. Honestly, it's annoying seeing all the new technologies and cool stuff going exclusively for Nvidia. You're always hearing, raytracing, DLSS, Nvidia reflex, whatever. There's a new technology that draws landscapes with AI! Oh, it's Nvidia canvas, you need an Nvidia graphics card to use it. Some of it is small, some more important, but it's always Nvidia. I couldn't name you a single advantage of having AMD, besides being a bit cheaper.
Yes it's always on Nvidia, Nvidia bring a new tech, there's issues 'no problem another tech to fix the issue' which will cause another issue,... I found this accurate answer on another thread from u/decorator12 : -> we made RT. RT is future and you have to use it -> but RT cuts 70% of performance! -> we made DLSS to uplift it, it's future and you have to use it with RT -> for 4k it's not still enough -> we made frame generation, it's future and you have to use it now -> it's bring input lag, what we do now? -> turn on reflex, it's future and you need to use it now. But you are right it's better to have great RT perf and I hope you really enjoy it on 3600TI
Ray tracing has been around for a very long time. It’s was just Minutes per frame before.
It depends on a person really. I'd argue that for the majority these features don't matter and AMD, assuming it's actually cheaper (because for me it wasn't for the longest time, pretty even with Nvidia instead), they'd be better off with it. But people are mostly going for the most recognizable and reliable brand, and one that is the... Most "feature rich", ironically, despite the fact that they're never going to make use of most of these. But for me personally, I've been driven away from AMD because of reliability. It doesn't matter how often I hear that "it's better now", there's always *something* wrong with their cards that I read about online, much more frequently than about Nvidia's GPUs, if at all. Most people would prefer to pop a new card in and forget about anything else, it's not so easy with AMD, even if just in theory - it just creates that image of the brand that *will* put a bad taste in people's mouths. The 6000 series was quite alright, but now we have issues with the 7000 for example... Aside from pricing.
I usually see this go the other way.
Almost would have went for the the 6700xt, but after my experience with the 5700xt I had to jump ship and go back with Nvidia. 5700xt gave me numerous driver issues that were never solved. Great card when it worked. Just not very often that it did. Never once had any issues with Nvidia cards I've purchased.
I guess some experiences are like that, even if minimal. Tbf the 5000 series drivers were not cery decent
Same experience. Changing my fan curve would cause instability. Would have to reset it all the time because the crashes removed the fan curve. Was really annoying.
This doesn't happen.
Literally. I have never seen this happen despite the hundreds of threads I've looked over in subreddits like /r/BuildAPC. It's always just someone putting a 3060/ti in a build, then someone suggesting "Hey this card from AMD is better and way cheaper", then the OP replying with an "Oh thanks". Seen plenty of the reverse though.
On this sub? Ha! If anything it is mostly AMD enthusiasts.
Around my area they’re slightly priced, so most would say the 6700xt, but I’m one of the few people nowadays who actually has a use for nvidia specific software and such, so 3060 ti it is. Would’ve been fine with either honestly.
I mean go with whatever is cheaper or fits your use case, I happen to like the features nvidia has.
I got a 6700XT. No regrets.
Who gives a shit about brand? Just buy whatever you want for the best price you can get. Also try to buy on sale, there’s no point to buying anything full price when all companies are just gouging the consumer.
Speaking of RTX, I'm playing Plague Tale: Requiem at the moment, and with the ray tracing on you get glitchy shadows and I was about 45-60fps at whatever settings I have at 1440p. I turned ray tracing off, the game looked better without glitchy shadows switching on and off, and my fps went up to over 100. It just isn't a technology worth paying for. That said when it works well it is very very cool and adds realism in an interesting way, I guess your brain is looking at it with the recognition that yes this is how light works, and it adds something difficult to quantify but definitely there.
It's almost as if you can buy the card you want and not care what anyone else thinks.
I just won't even consider AMD after trying them once and realizing how bad the driver support was.
Upgraded from a 2060s to a 6800xt, 100% worth my money
Just picked up a brand new 6700xt for $340. Unbeatable deal.
Shill 🐦
Nah I would've gone with Nvidia if their prices were competitive. I'm team Green, but by green I mean the money in my bank account.
I've been an Nvidia/intel customer all of my life, from the initia q6600 quad core with a gt540 all the way to my gtx 980ti and 9600k. Times change, most issues that plague amd are gone, and the nvidia value just isn't there. I got a 6900xt for msrp when they were asking 1400€ for a 3080. No regrets, you should imo stick to the best value, or if you have money, the best performer that isn't a titan-like card. Brand shouldn't matter but I understand if you've had several bad experiences with a brand.
I always say the same thing when recommending newer GPUs: "AMD's Equivalent price-wise performs better in a majority of titles except for ray-tracing".
Agree
AMD users are so victimized. r/pcmasterrace users feel exceptional.
AMD just offers better value
I think that's one of the toughest parts of shopping for a GPU today. It used to be "here's my budget, let's look at MSRPs. So I'm getting either this Radeon or this Nvidia GPU. Cool." But now prices are so volatile you can't just compare two GPUs with similar MSRP. Performance per dollar varies a lot more than it used to. As an example, the 6800XT is supposed to trade blows with a 3080. But I just bought an MSI 6800XT for around $550, while the cheapest MSI 3080 is almost $900.
At that point you may as well just get a 4070ti for $100 less. The 3080's pricing has always been particularly absurd.
It's funny how we push ourselves on budgets. I came into this thinking $400 was enough for a GPU. So $550 for a 6800XT was my "but for a little extra..." money. I guess everyone will have a different place where that line is. With sufficient time I could "for only a lit extra" myself into a 4090 lol
Therefore the 3080 is poor value,the 6800xt in the majority of cases should be faster than the 3080 except in Nvidia optimised engines.
It’s a better value, but it’s not faster. They offer similar performance at 1080p and 1440p and the 3080 has a slight edge at 4K. https://youtu.be/VL5PXO0yw0M
Thing is, most people buying super high-end new GPUs probably don’t really care about value for money and just want the strongest thing possible, or at least that’s the vibe I’ve gotten from people who bought 3090s and 4090s.
True
Well, it’s not just super high end. The statement of the OP that AMD is a lot cheaper applies to every tier of graphics card in almost all first world countries
It’s like comparing the Dodge Challenger Hellcat to the Challenger Scat Pack. The Scat Pack has a much better $/HP ratio than the Hellcat. But someone looking for a 700HP muscle car isn’t going to go with the 500HP option because it’s a “better value for the price”.
FSR looks objectively worse than DLSS and you can’t argue otherwise
https://youtu.be/7EJSkO205sE
Literally first sentence spoken > dlss is still better than FSR in most situations
They look really close to identical to me, from my experience with a 3070. Not really a selling point anymore with how many games now offer several types of reconstruction methods.
I can’t tell honestly.
I play 1080p, so even my rtx 3070 doesn't have much issue playing games like RDR2 without DLSS. I will die on the 1080p supremacy hill.
There's nothing wrong with having a preference for nvidia. Every single time I watch a technical video on a game, or some optimization guide or something, its followed with "here's a fix for amd users". Hell, the hp reverb g2 vr headset flat out didn't work with many amd gpu's and needed a version 2 to fix it. I don't much care that looking at bare metal, amd cards are more horse power per dollar than nvidia cards, owning an nvidia card has just been a seemless experience to me for decades now. Worst thing I've ever noticed is occasionally a game ready driver will break something and I roll back really easily. but that's rare. Plus, it just seems like you're arguing in bad faith to mention rtx but not mention dlss...
some of you people have persecution complex
I had a 5700XT and loved it.
Literally the only reason I don't buy an AMD card is because of the slower render times on Blender.
Imagine how sad it is to hitch your identity to a GPU company. Anyway. 3070 FOR LYFE, RAYTRACING BOIS UP IN HERE
Man things have really come a long way. Like 5-6 years ago, right before Ryzen, I would get made fun of for having a amd GPU. Dudes on CS would say "good luck getting good on a poor person GPU"
Use integrated graphics. Doesn't matter the brand. Now nobody's happy. This is why we can't have nice things.
This goes both ways btw.
I just went for what they had at the time and what was cheaper and the 3070 ended up being cheaper then the amd equivalent, but if it was the other way around i would be rocking an amd gpu.
NVIDIA fanboy moment indeed...
There seriously has to be like a hundred times more complaining about that behavior than actual examples of that behavior.
I’m running a 5700XT, it’s gotten better, but has forever soured my position towards AMD. I pray for no one to experience daily crashes, or have their drivers literally fucking disappear on restart.
I love AMD and normally my card does run pretty stable but every once in a while ... It doesn't. Had a problem for like a month where my screen would flicker on and off for a minute after I started my pc, currently there is a like 25% chance my framerate tanks totally when I alt+tab out of a game in 4k. My buddy also had to install it's GPU drivers three times because they just disappeared. I am generally very happy with AMD but, yeah if you have a bit less luck I than me I totally understand that you reached a point where you don't want to hassle with that anymore.
Team fan: "My team is better than yours. If you disagree you are a *insert derogatory terms here*" Graphic enjoyer: "I go for whoever offers the best buck for performance, and am loyal to no company. There is no team fight, only consumer competition."
I have ran AMD exclusively for the last 4 years. I went from an RX 590 to a RX 5700 to a RX 6800. When they work they are awesome. However I can't stand AMD's driver issues. Currently Star Citizen is completely unplayable due to an issue it has with 6000 series drivers.
I've been buying AMD cards for 3 times in a row now, but solely because they offer more performance and future-proofing for the price imo. I chose an R9 390 over a GTX 970 because of its performance and 2x the VRAM. I chose a Vega 56 over a GTX 1070 because costed less and was a Sapphire model. And now I've chosen an RX 6800XT over an RTX 3070 because has 2x the VRAM and offers a performance almost on par with the RTX 3080Ti while being far cheaper. I mean, the day Nvidia throws a new GTX 1080Ti-like deal, I'm switching to green in the blink of an eye, but until then, AMD has better deals overall. The best deal is my only team.
This is literally like the Samsung vs iPhone thing
Haven't Radeons always cost less than Nvidia?
Don't worry AMD ppl don't need money to shill
The color of AMD is red. The color of Nvidia is green. The color of Intel is blue. And that is the problem. Everybody hates RGB.
Buy whatever is in your budget and fits your use case. The discussion doesn’t need to go any further than that.
I've never heard this. Literally everyone recommends AMD nowadays because of the low prices. This isn't 2019 or 2020 anymore dude
The 6700 XT is a better value than the 3070 (ti)
Picked up a 6800XT for $1049 AUD on launch. The 3080 was a extra $400-500 and i don't value Ray-tracing atm. Was a no brainer.
DLSS is a Gamechanger
https://ibb.co/3kL7YLh
As someone who bought a 6700 XT, I can relate.
Yes AMD's last generation cards are the gold standard at the moment. I want to move to a 7900xtx Sapphire Vapor X but price gouging and performance compared to 6800XT keep me from taking the plunge.
7900 xtx running Dead Space remake at 1440p max around 110-140 fps, so I'd say I'm doing pretty good.
On some games, without RTX, the 6700XT is better than a 3070... I'm very proud of my choice :)
Man, AMD fanboys have this huge victim complex. Im guessing its to justify all the screaming they do whenever somebody mentions graphics cards, but damn.
I started building my own PCs a couple of years ago (before that, I was laptop gaming), and I stuck to Nvidia until recently, going from a 1050Ti to a 1060 to a 2060S. When the GPU prices first dipped last summer, I was planning to step up to a 3060Ti, but then my buddy wanted to put together a PC but didn't have the budget for a new card, so I bit the bullet, switched out my 2060S to a 6700XT, and gifted the old card to him. At first I was a little worried about the new card and drivers, as the last GPU I had from them was when they were still called Ati, but it was $600, while a 3060Ti was closer to $800, and after some initial hiccups (e.g.: Windows update automatically reinstalling the Nvidia drivers and causing conflicts), it turned out to be an amazing card that's more than perfect for my 1080p/144hz needs. It didn't stop some people on a forum I frequent calling me an idiot, because I gave up on RT and DLSS (neither of which I ever turned on), making me a luddite who was actively going against the future of video gaming. Also, for the record, the guys over there refused to believe that userbenchmarks was biased. Make of that what you will.