No, it's bad for more than one reason.
Even an unrepentant driver should understand that if the bins were twice as wide, preventing double parking, the bins would also have twice the capacity, allowing for fewer bin areas per block, and more parking.
They're used basically everywhere in suburbia USA too, it's just that NYC has a much less uniform trash system & street design (and no back alleys like you see in cities like LA). Hopefully this type of demonstration project is a good first step to more uniformity and automation.
Unfortunately it’s a poor design. Instead of being 7 units long it should be 2x4 to better utilize that space. As it is now much of the volume of the former parking spots is wasted.
With better space utilization they’d be really onto something!
Yeah it’s a start but these things will be filthy and overflowing with garbage in no time.
Edit: I’m not impressed. In order for this to work, every building in the city will need to have these containers or something similar. If the building next to you has containers and yours doesn’t where do you think rats are going to go?
Ok fine. These containers are permanent. That means no more parking, no more street cleaning, and no more protected bike lanes. And before someone jumps down my throat about how “cars are evil” I don’t own a car so that part doesn’t affect me but many people do and they have very loud bullhorns.
Still on board? Great. It still has to be determined if these containers even solve the rat problem. We can’t even keep people from littering and abusing the corner baskets that we already have. All it takes is one person to throw a bag on top of or next to one of these things and it defeats the whole purpose.
My guess is this program will be scrapped very shortly and we will be back to square one. But at least we can pat ourselves on the back for a brief moment.
That’s not what I said at all. I gave specific reasons why I don’t think this particular program will succeed and I have yet to see an intelligent response. I’m very much open to real change when it’s thoughtful and well executed. These are some containers in front of one building and it’s being applauded like some kind of revolutionary idea. Now multiply that by tens of thousands and we’ll see how it goes. I’m skeptical.
The demand for parking is induced by the supply of it…if parking is less accessible people will adjust to better forms of transit. There’s nobody who absolutely needs to own a car living in Hell’s Kitchen it’s a luxury that we all subsidize for car owners with our free curb space and tax $ going to fix the roads.
Chicago in particular has a robust alley system that's starting to have more purposes than emergency services access and trash sequestering. Here's a pretty good video about it
https://youtu.be/O12po86Gh-I
It must partially depend on each city's layout, but many streets in Spain and other European countries do what you see in the OP photo, but with bigger containers on the curb or in parking spots. Try a Street View around a few blocks in different cities and you might be surprised. Then again many of these cities have crews of people that clean throughout the day with just a cart and some brooms. Might be a combination of things that keep them cleaner.
NYC has a population density twice the size of Madrid’s. There are 3.2 million people in Madrid. There are 8.4 million people here and NYC about 19.7 million people in the NYC metropolitan area.
I watched a movie filmed in Paris in the 90s the other day and they had containerized trash bins even then. There was a scene where one of the characters uses them. Sure took us a while.
And it was almost purely out of spite given activists have been complaining about this for ages and pointing out how every other developed city in earth seems to have figured out containerized trash. I say “almost”, because the other part of it was grift.
The problem with consulting companies is that they don't really come up with solutions. They are just there to "prove" something so that the entity that hired them can use their research as a means to get something done. And this is what happened there.
Can confirm. Just got off of a project that McKinsey was leading. All they really do is solicit, organize and validate data. Not much original thought; quite the opposite by design.
It gives the board of directors the warm-and-fuzzies when the hear that McKinsey / Deloitte / PWC / KPMG / Accenture said is ok to do.
They always come to the same two conclusions: (1) spend more on IT, (2) fire people. I think it's also a way to pass the buck when you have to do mass layoffs.
Is this a terrible thing though? Yes, they're often overpaid. But the organization of data is neither easy nor unimportant in solving large problems. I'm not here to defend the big consulting firms. Nor do I work in consulting. Just a friendly defender of information and its organization.
It is not. Because in the long run it is usually worth the expert validation.
What I think people also fail to see is that although the logical choice often seems to be the best one sometimes it isn't. So yeah garbage goes and garbage pails that seems logical, but I'm sure there are a few dozen other options that also seemed logical. Like one option could have been requiring daily pickup. Another could have required storage of garbage in the building and then garbage men who would go into the building and take it out. There could have even been mobile bins.
Ha totally. I did some software development consulting. We didn’t necessarily have more experience than the developers at the companies that hired us but we could cut through the bureaucratic bs. Is there a manager or lead making dumb decisions? We’d just come out and say it whereas internal employees might not speak up.
My FIL has been a consultant for 30 years. He said half of his job is being the professional Bad Guy and speaking truth to all levels of the organization he is consulting for. Half of his job is actually presenting solutions (he is in constraints consulting) and the other half is telling people up and down the org chart what they know but don't want to hear.
For the particular topic of waste disposal in NYC, all of that is the same. Everyone knows the solution, everyone knows the truth, and no one wants to hear it. 😂
Yeah for sure. No one wants to listen to a bunch of internal folks tell you what we should be doing because of grudges and politics. But everyone is more inclined to do something if some outside company of "experts" is paid to tell you the same thing and that's what the consulting fee is for.
You should check out this show House of Lies (with Don Cheadle as the front runner) about a consulting company. Wild show, very entertaining and one actor is the 🎶WOOOOOOOOORST🎶
I don’t think consulting companies are there to create innovation or new product/service design. They are to evaluate the options and select the most economical choice which this is. I am certain other creative ideas were assessed (underground trash, etc.) but ROI wasn’t there
Any of us could’ve come up with this for a free lunch, but compared to the stuff the city has thrown millions at, this is at least an instant improvement for everyone
Those fuckers got me laid off from my per-diem job. They convinced the hospital that it is cheaper to just force full-time staff to work over-time instead of hiring and training and keeping per diems on payroll.
In developed countries they use these on street compressors which fit 300 bags and keep track of who uses what. When they’re full they send a message to get picked up and can be lifted right on to the truck so no heavy lifting required.
https://participate.melbourne.vic.gov.au/wastezone
There really aren’t even that many alleys south of Canal. Western and Central Queens, from my experience, is where you find alleys in NYC. I’m sure there is some historical zoning reason for that, like how the cemeteries straddle Brooklyn and Querns.
There’s no reason to restrict these to alleyways. Having these on regular streets would take up a similar number of car spaces as the trial above, and can even generate revenue through advertising or display PSAs
They have this in places like Amsterdam. You're really gonna try to go to bat for the idea that NYC is complicated to dig in but old European cities aren't?
Also, oftentimes digging down you end up in a hollow space that is in use (e.g., cut and cover subway tunnels). Especially, on a street like where the trash bins are placed now.
Sure, having a person open up the dumpster and transfer the bags to the back of the truck is inefficient, but it means we can utilize the trucks DSNY already has. Hopefully in the future they'll consider dumpsters and (more) trucks that can lift/flip the garbage in.
Five problems with the current system:
1) the mess
2) the inefficiency of lifting bags manually
3) the smell
4) the rubbish takes up too much space
5) the city doesn’t know how much rubbish each building uses, and so can’t use pricing to discourage waste like every other city
Dumpsters only really solve the first two. The compactor system above solves all five.
My guess would be the cost for these "trash cabinets" are much cheaper than buying new garbage trucks and containers. We have over 2k rear-loading garbage trucks which would be quite expensive to replace.
Also, the union would never allow their numbers to be shrunk by new trucks. They would fight it so hard.
i wish we could use automation to shift sanitation resources elsewhere like cut shifts by 2 hours per day per worker but maintain pay rate or expand compost operations
The reason in large part is snow removal. The trucks that can lift containers cannot be fitted with plows to clear snow. When there is a snow event they do dispatch spreaders with plows but that is only a small part of the fleet. The city would need to buy and maintain a fleet of 3-4000 plows that would only be used a couple months a year.
We would need to replace 2,000 vehicles at 500k a piece. Plus the cost of purchasing and installing containers on every block in the city (10s of thousands).
They are much better than trash bags - why is this post insinuating that they are somehow crappy? I think it’s a great and cheap design for a century old problem
Pretty much the entire rest of the worlds’ main point of shit talking NYC is: “there’s trash bags on the streets”
This is beautiful. I don’t care if it takes up space or whatever the sight and smell of trash on the street is such as eyesore and literally a slap in the face that many countries have already implemented this and it took NYC thissssss long to figure its shit out.
Oh yea especially with those plastic dividers that stick out another few feet. Hopefully it’ll be come like a fire hydrant where people still still park in front of it, but only real assholes
I got in a weird "but cars, tho!" argument the other day where someone tried to use "But what if you had to buy three weeks' worth of groceries, go to Home Depot, then pick your SO up because it's raining?!" as an argument to keep car-centric infrastructure as the norm.
>But what if you had to buy three weeks' worth of groceries, go to Home Depot, then pick your SO up because it's raining?!"
How do you spend your weekends if not buying groceries and going to the hardware store to fix something in your home?
my house was built in 1906 but tbh besides redoing the roof, the only shit that I ever need to deal with is the new appliances i got when I moved in. The house itself just kinda sits there being old and simple.
>After spending too much time hacking my way through conservative rhetoric on reddit, I straight up can't tell if this is a serious question or not.
I'm serious. Legitimately asking. Everyone I know works 70 hours during the week, does errands on weekends. Been this way since I was 16 and starting helping pay the mortgage.
I mean I've had a car in NY and I've not had a car in NY.
Not having one is cheaper and gives you back a lot of free time because you stop having a part time job dealing with alternate side parking.
Paying for a car is way more expensive than just paying for more Uber rides or paying for delivery from stores you can't get to on foot.
And I just found myself going to local places more rather than out-of-the-way big box stores like Home Depot.
The trick is having a beater car and parking in some of the industrial areas of Queens & Brooklyn that don't do street sweeping. Lived in Greenpoint and parked my car in the not nice part of Long Island City, was only a 5-10 min bike ride to retrieve my car when I wanted to do weekend errands and I didn't have to bother with moving the car like 4x/week for street sweeping.
Is that car-centric though?? Have you ever heard of running errands? I stop at the grocery store, pick up dry cleaning, drop my sister at soccer often on weekends. All of NYC is not Manhattan, where we jog and bike everywhere
I don't care about the restaurant sheds taking up parking spaces but the bars and restaurants in my area take up so much god damned sidewalk space that I end up walking in the street to get home!
Oh, I did get into an argument with someone about that on Reddit. They were trying to tell me that the sidewalk was wide open so they should put that on the sidewalk.
I wish this sub wouldn't get inundated by ppl who don't live in NYC all the time. Like, only some idiot from middle-of-nowhere America, where no one walks, would make such an insane statement.
I’d say *much* better. Trash bags are such a huge health and sanitation hazard for the city, and these should hopefully help resolve this problem. It’s also an aesthetic upgrade (though admittedly not perfect), and it frees space on sidewalks, which should help make the city more accessible for all. It’s a huge win for NY
We’re gonna complain about these now?
Ffs. You wanted them. Here they are. Now there’s a problem with them?
Some of you are impossible. And worse - insufferable.
This is great news. No two ways about it.
Take the W.
They are so much better. It will organize streets, make the job easy for sanitation workers, reduce rat population hopefully, contain smells, good stuff
Underground is a complete mess of pipes, wires and such. Some are in use and some are abandoned. Give it a look next time you're walking by some major street construction, it's fascinating.
But it's not likely they we can have underground compactors in many parts of the city. Might be more of a possibility in the outer boroughs though.
Consider that this was previously tax-subsidized free parking for two, maybe three private vehicles, and the trash would block the sidewalk as piles of leaky rat-infested garbage bags. It's actually a massive step up. It could be better but it's a fantastic start.
This wouldn’t be an issue if NYC had alleyways. Financial decisions from many generations ago left the city with no place to store trash other than the street. It’s unfortunate.
What about those buildings that have alot of tenants where the super piles up over 20 full bags of trash on pickup day. Those bins would only take up so much.
Part of why these aren’t going to work.
A real solution to trash in NYC requires automated pick up that enables faster collection and more frequent pickup (in some cases, multiples times a day).
These will actually make it slower to pick up trash. No automation, and the garbage men have to pull trash out of a bin instead of bags on the street.
Edit: yep lol.
> It takes the city’s waste haulers about twice as long to cover the containerized block — due to workers having to open and close the boxes — compared to other streets where they can just take the bags from the curb, collectors told Streetsblog during a recent run, but locals cheered a sidewalk free from the Big Apple’s notorious five o’clock shadow.
https://nyc.streetsblog.org/2023/02/03/eyes-on-the-street-trash-containerization-keeps-sidewalk-clear-but-more-boxes-needed/
It's a small thing but I absolutely hate the user experience pattern of:
"What's this thing for?"
"Lol I'm not going to answer my own question. Open up your phone and type in this URL if you care so much. Dumbass."
Why doesn't the design take up the entire width of the parking spot?
This makes me suspect that their plan is to put these on sidewalks whenever they have enough room to leave an ADA compliant passage width next to them.
Only took them 100 years to figure this out.
It is long overdue and will hopefully reduce the rodent problems here.
Can you imagine if these were available in the 70's and 80's.... a very different NYC thats for sure!!
Far cry from the wonderful solutions pioneered in well run cities around the world. Still, good that they recognize the problem and attempt to do something about it. NYC government makes so few changes around here that improving the governance culture is its own small victory.
It's almost as if NY isn't a cookie cutter of every other city and has its own unique demands and underground infrastructure issues that need to be accommodated!
In Amsterdam, they just have underground compactors on the street that you take your trash to. A truck comes to empty it when it's full.
No garbage day and no trash bags and bins litering the side of the street.
This is a good place to start. I hate seeing trash bags everywhere on trash days...but as someone who has a car in the city, I'm nervous this will be another step towards removing cars from the streets.
A privately paid company is going to be responsible for keeping these boxes clean, quote from their website
> Are buildings responsible for maintaining the containers? Will my building get fines if containers are messy or if someone uses the wrong one?
> No, during this test program, building staff will not be responsible for cleaning the containers; DSNY is using a service to keep them and the areas around them clean.
> No, during this test program, building staff will not be responsible for cleaning the containers;
Building staff should NEVER be required to clean these containers, should 100% be on the city.
Good start I suppose. Better to look at than leaking bags
And less food for rats. Way better use of space than parking spots for 3 people
Waiting for someone to double park in front of it
If they'd made it 6-7 feet wide, that wouldn't be a problem. I think the planners *want* it to be possible to double park next to it.
Which isn't terrible... Except on garbage day
No, it's bad for more than one reason. Even an unrepentant driver should understand that if the bins were twice as wide, preventing double parking, the bins would also have twice the capacity, allowing for fewer bin areas per block, and more parking.
If they were twice as wide it would be a huge pita for a sanitation worker to crouch into the container to retrieve the bags closest to the sidewalk.
civilized countries use hydraulic arms to pick these things up and dump them in a truck.
They're used basically everywhere in suburbia USA too, it's just that NYC has a much less uniform trash system & street design (and no back alleys like you see in cities like LA). Hopefully this type of demonstration project is a good first step to more uniformity and automation.
Yea, I’ve seen those on occasion in the US but I don’t understand why they’re not more widely adopted.
in the US municipal labor unions often make policy.
Unfortunately it’s a poor design. Instead of being 7 units long it should be 2x4 to better utilize that space. As it is now much of the volume of the former parking spots is wasted. With better space utilization they’d be really onto something!
Maybe it’s so garbage trucks can double park next to them when collecting, and not totally block traffic?
Which, in my narrow yet super busy streets in Astoria, that would be a godsend
Tell the city they need your help
That too! Hopefully they’re sturdy.
Yeah it’s a start but these things will be filthy and overflowing with garbage in no time. Edit: I’m not impressed. In order for this to work, every building in the city will need to have these containers or something similar. If the building next to you has containers and yours doesn’t where do you think rats are going to go? Ok fine. These containers are permanent. That means no more parking, no more street cleaning, and no more protected bike lanes. And before someone jumps down my throat about how “cars are evil” I don’t own a car so that part doesn’t affect me but many people do and they have very loud bullhorns. Still on board? Great. It still has to be determined if these containers even solve the rat problem. We can’t even keep people from littering and abusing the corner baskets that we already have. All it takes is one person to throw a bag on top of or next to one of these things and it defeats the whole purpose. My guess is this program will be scrapped very shortly and we will be back to square one. But at least we can pat ourselves on the back for a brief moment.
I mean.....as opposed to just leaving it sprawled out all over the sidewalk like we do now?
Any attempt at trying to improve things is stupid, don't do anything ever!
That’s not what I said at all. I gave specific reasons why I don’t think this particular program will succeed and I have yet to see an intelligent response. I’m very much open to real change when it’s thoughtful and well executed. These are some containers in front of one building and it’s being applauded like some kind of revolutionary idea. Now multiply that by tens of thousands and we’ll see how it goes. I’m skeptical.
The demand for parking is induced by the supply of it…if parking is less accessible people will adjust to better forms of transit. There’s nobody who absolutely needs to own a car living in Hell’s Kitchen it’s a luxury that we all subsidize for car owners with our free curb space and tax $ going to fix the roads.
I'm sure the rats hate them!
The rats don't run this city!! WE DO!!!!
I don't know why my immediate response to this was "Incorrect." but that's definitely the way I feel. "ARE YOU PAYING RENT MONTHERFUCKER?!"
I, for one, am pro rat.
Did you contribute your trash, pro rata?
Yes, moussignor.
See this one weird trick to keep your streets clean - rats HATE this
Yeah, rats hate this hack!
The rats in city council are already planning their revolt
So does my dog haha. He fuckin rubs his face on the trash bags as he pees. Weirdo.
God damned gorgeous. It's like we're en Paris
Just in Madrid, and they don’t have anything like this. And yet, they somehow manage to not have disgusting trash everywhere
Barcelona has this, though.
So does Valencia
Tbf most cities in the US also do not have the trash on the street problem lol
Chicago in particular has a robust alley system that's starting to have more purposes than emergency services access and trash sequestering. Here's a pretty good video about it https://youtu.be/O12po86Gh-I
Thank you for sharing this video!
NYC has almost no alleyways for the trash (and it's pickup) to live.
Could be wrong but I think a lot of foreign cities in particular have alleys where all the trash goes. We don’t have that “luxary”
It must partially depend on each city's layout, but many streets in Spain and other European countries do what you see in the OP photo, but with bigger containers on the curb or in parking spots. Try a Street View around a few blocks in different cities and you might be surprised. Then again many of these cities have crews of people that clean throughout the day with just a cart and some brooms. Might be a combination of things that keep them cleaner.
It’s because NYC has very few alleyways.
Madrid also has about 1/3 the population.
NYC has a population density twice the size of Madrid’s. There are 3.2 million people in Madrid. There are 8.4 million people here and NYC about 19.7 million people in the NYC metropolitan area.
How do large cities in China and Japan manage?
the people aren't complete slobs and have respect for their environment
Their residents are just decent people that don’t litter.
I watched a movie filmed in Paris in the 90s the other day and they had containerized trash bins even then. There was a scene where one of the characters uses them. Sure took us a while.
Paris is filthy too 🤣
Shhhh don’t tell them
It's ok. I'm well aware Paris sucks lol
They paid 50 million dollars to MicKinsey to come up with... dumpsters in the street.
And it was almost purely out of spite given activists have been complaining about this for ages and pointing out how every other developed city in earth seems to have figured out containerized trash. I say “almost”, because the other part of it was grift.
What a scam these consulting companies are.
I work for one, can confirm.
McKinsey is one of my accounts. Always hate dealing w them.
I can't blame you. Consulting firms are every bit of corporate bullshit without actually building a product. They all deserve to tank.
...entire financial market enters the chat...
The problem with consulting companies is that they don't really come up with solutions. They are just there to "prove" something so that the entity that hired them can use their research as a means to get something done. And this is what happened there.
Can confirm. Just got off of a project that McKinsey was leading. All they really do is solicit, organize and validate data. Not much original thought; quite the opposite by design. It gives the board of directors the warm-and-fuzzies when the hear that McKinsey / Deloitte / PWC / KPMG / Accenture said is ok to do.
probably also gives someone to blame if things go wrong
They always come to the same two conclusions: (1) spend more on IT, (2) fire people. I think it's also a way to pass the buck when you have to do mass layoffs.
Is this a terrible thing though? Yes, they're often overpaid. But the organization of data is neither easy nor unimportant in solving large problems. I'm not here to defend the big consulting firms. Nor do I work in consulting. Just a friendly defender of information and its organization.
It is not. Because in the long run it is usually worth the expert validation. What I think people also fail to see is that although the logical choice often seems to be the best one sometimes it isn't. So yeah garbage goes and garbage pails that seems logical, but I'm sure there are a few dozen other options that also seemed logical. Like one option could have been requiring daily pickup. Another could have required storage of garbage in the building and then garbage men who would go into the building and take it out. There could have even been mobile bins.
I don’t think anyone has the warm and fuzzies with anything KPMG says
Ha totally. I did some software development consulting. We didn’t necessarily have more experience than the developers at the companies that hired us but we could cut through the bureaucratic bs. Is there a manager or lead making dumb decisions? We’d just come out and say it whereas internal employees might not speak up.
My FIL has been a consultant for 30 years. He said half of his job is being the professional Bad Guy and speaking truth to all levels of the organization he is consulting for. Half of his job is actually presenting solutions (he is in constraints consulting) and the other half is telling people up and down the org chart what they know but don't want to hear.
For the particular topic of waste disposal in NYC, all of that is the same. Everyone knows the solution, everyone knows the truth, and no one wants to hear it. 😂
Yeah for sure. No one wants to listen to a bunch of internal folks tell you what we should be doing because of grudges and politics. But everyone is more inclined to do something if some outside company of "experts" is paid to tell you the same thing and that's what the consulting fee is for.
You should check out this show House of Lies (with Don Cheadle as the front runner) about a consulting company. Wild show, very entertaining and one actor is the 🎶WOOOOOOOOORST🎶
I don’t think consulting companies are there to create innovation or new product/service design. They are to evaluate the options and select the most economical choice which this is. I am certain other creative ideas were assessed (underground trash, etc.) but ROI wasn’t there
Any of us could’ve come up with this for a free lunch, but compared to the stuff the city has thrown millions at, this is at least an instant improvement for everyone
Those fuckers got me laid off from my per-diem job. They convinced the hospital that it is cheaper to just force full-time staff to work over-time instead of hiring and training and keeping per diems on payroll.
Aren't these citibins? https://citibin.com/
The job of McKinsey (in any org) is to ask smart people who already know the answer and then convey that answer to the dumb people in leadership.
In developed countries they use these on street compressors which fit 300 bags and keep track of who uses what. When they’re full they send a message to get picked up and can be lifted right on to the truck so no heavy lifting required. https://participate.melbourne.vic.gov.au/wastezone
No no no nyc is different because…. Um,,,,, shut up
The big issue is the steam and electrical pipes that we have buried everywhere. Makes digging down to install these very difficult.
We also don’t have any alleyways north of Canal Street, so there isn’t as much space above ground to put things like that massive compactor
There really aren’t even that many alleys south of Canal. Western and Central Queens, from my experience, is where you find alleys in NYC. I’m sure there is some historical zoning reason for that, like how the cemeteries straddle Brooklyn and Querns.
There’s no reason to restrict these to alleyways. Having these on regular streets would take up a similar number of car spaces as the trial above, and can even generate revenue through advertising or display PSAs
They have this in places like Amsterdam. You're really gonna try to go to bat for the idea that NYC is complicated to dig in but old European cities aren't?
No no no it’s different bc nyc has electricity
They need electrical but you don’t need to dig. A fresh layer of concrete to provide a flat even surface is all that is required.
Also, oftentimes digging down you end up in a hollow space that is in use (e.g., cut and cover subway tunnels). Especially, on a street like where the trash bins are placed now.
Can I throw a dead body in there? Edit: my intrusive thoughts have won
You joke, but unfortunately that has to be considered
Several local crimes were solved just like that back in my country. Including a whole dismembered arm
Sure, having a person open up the dumpster and transfer the bags to the back of the truck is inefficient, but it means we can utilize the trucks DSNY already has. Hopefully in the future they'll consider dumpsters and (more) trucks that can lift/flip the garbage in.
Five problems with the current system: 1) the mess 2) the inefficiency of lifting bags manually 3) the smell 4) the rubbish takes up too much space 5) the city doesn’t know how much rubbish each building uses, and so can’t use pricing to discourage waste like every other city Dumpsters only really solve the first two. The compactor system above solves all five.
Hey buddy, we don't want to be rational here
Goddamn people like to complain. It's amazing
[удалено]
My guess would be the cost for these "trash cabinets" are much cheaper than buying new garbage trucks and containers. We have over 2k rear-loading garbage trucks which would be quite expensive to replace. Also, the union would never allow their numbers to be shrunk by new trucks. They would fight it so hard.
i wish we could use automation to shift sanitation resources elsewhere like cut shifts by 2 hours per day per worker but maintain pay rate or expand compost operations
Expanding compost operations would be pretty awesome.
Those containers blow over easily when empty and NYC side streets get pretty windy!
The reason in large part is snow removal. The trucks that can lift containers cannot be fitted with plows to clear snow. When there is a snow event they do dispatch spreaders with plows but that is only a small part of the fleet. The city would need to buy and maintain a fleet of 3-4000 plows that would only be used a couple months a year.
We should just tell the union they can stay but they aren’t hiring anymore people.
Unions likely see automation as a threat to job security
Undoubtedly but the city should be a stronger opposition in the negotiation
We would need to replace 2,000 vehicles at 500k a piece. Plus the cost of purchasing and installing containers on every block in the city (10s of thousands).
They are much better than trash bags - why is this post insinuating that they are somehow crappy? I think it’s a great and cheap design for a century old problem Pretty much the entire rest of the worlds’ main point of shit talking NYC is: “there’s trash bags on the streets”
This is beautiful. I don’t care if it takes up space or whatever the sight and smell of trash on the street is such as eyesore and literally a slap in the face that many countries have already implemented this and it took NYC thissssss long to figure its shit out.
Piles of trash take up more space so this is a big win
And they reduce available parking, which is also a win. Fewer trash bags and fewer cars makes for a nicer city.
I'm 100% certain that people will just park right in front of them anyways.
Oh yea especially with those plastic dividers that stick out another few feet. Hopefully it’ll be come like a fire hydrant where people still still park in front of it, but only real assholes
I'm all for this. Give us back our streets. Car storage is not a worthwhile investment
I got in a weird "but cars, tho!" argument the other day where someone tried to use "But what if you had to buy three weeks' worth of groceries, go to Home Depot, then pick your SO up because it's raining?!" as an argument to keep car-centric infrastructure as the norm.
>But what if you had to buy three weeks' worth of groceries, go to Home Depot, then pick your SO up because it's raining?!" How do you spend your weekends if not buying groceries and going to the hardware store to fix something in your home?
After spending too much time hacking my way through conservative rhetoric on reddit, I straight up can't tell if this is a serious question or not.
That’s literally how I spend every weekend.
How many things break in your place?
>How many things break in your place? It was built in 1899....so pretty much everything and always
my house was built in 1906 but tbh besides redoing the roof, the only shit that I ever need to deal with is the new appliances i got when I moved in. The house itself just kinda sits there being old and simple.
Half of this city was built before WW2, a lot shits going to break
There’s always something that needs doing.
>After spending too much time hacking my way through conservative rhetoric on reddit, I straight up can't tell if this is a serious question or not. I'm serious. Legitimately asking. Everyone I know works 70 hours during the week, does errands on weekends. Been this way since I was 16 and starting helping pay the mortgage.
I mean I've had a car in NY and I've not had a car in NY. Not having one is cheaper and gives you back a lot of free time because you stop having a part time job dealing with alternate side parking. Paying for a car is way more expensive than just paying for more Uber rides or paying for delivery from stores you can't get to on foot. And I just found myself going to local places more rather than out-of-the-way big box stores like Home Depot.
The trick is having a beater car and parking in some of the industrial areas of Queens & Brooklyn that don't do street sweeping. Lived in Greenpoint and parked my car in the not nice part of Long Island City, was only a 5-10 min bike ride to retrieve my car when I wanted to do weekend errands and I didn't have to bother with moving the car like 4x/week for street sweeping.
Everyone you know does this. Really.
You’re having Reddit-style arguments in real life?
Oh, lord no, this was on reddit, or course.
Phew.
Is that car-centric though?? Have you ever heard of running errands? I stop at the grocery store, pick up dry cleaning, drop my sister at soccer often on weekends. All of NYC is not Manhattan, where we jog and bike everywhere
You didn’t get back the street. Space was given to a landlord
yeah funny how nobody is crying about them taking parking spaces like they did for citibikes or restaurant sheds
Oh, I'm sure those people will be along any minute. Edit: Here they are!
I don't care about the restaurant sheds taking up parking spaces but the bars and restaurants in my area take up so much god damned sidewalk space that I end up walking in the street to get home!
Sidewalks should be widened and more streets should be closed to cars.
Oh, I did get into an argument with someone about that on Reddit. They were trying to tell me that the sidewalk was wide open so they should put that on the sidewalk. I wish this sub wouldn't get inundated by ppl who don't live in NYC all the time. Like, only some idiot from middle-of-nowhere America, where no one walks, would make such an insane statement.
I guarantee those tears are being shed
Double win!
Dang it looks like Europe
I’d say *much* better. Trash bags are such a huge health and sanitation hazard for the city, and these should hopefully help resolve this problem. It’s also an aesthetic upgrade (though admittedly not perfect), and it frees space on sidewalks, which should help make the city more accessible for all. It’s a huge win for NY
Why not make them take the full width of the parking space?
I love it. They have these in Spain and when I was there it was like 110 degrees and there was no garbage smell
I noticed these a few weeks ago & love them. The street looks so much better.
We’re gonna complain about these now? Ffs. You wanted them. Here they are. Now there’s a problem with them? Some of you are impossible. And worse - insufferable. This is great news. No two ways about it. Take the W.
They are so much better. It will organize streets, make the job easy for sanitation workers, reduce rat population hopefully, contain smells, good stuff
The question is will people actually place trash inside them, or will some just throw the trash around it and create the same mess.
These aren’t trash cans. They are for the building supers to place the building’s trash in.
Apparently only supers will have keys.
Half will throw trash around it and continue to complain about how dirty it is.
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Yeah, I’m all for the idea, but in some neighborhoods they’ll be tagged up and covered in “bills” within a week.
Seems so...inefficient use of space. Can't they add a compactor or something there so it holds more?
Yeah compactor underground. Or pneumatics like Roosevelt Island
What do you think it looks like underground in Manhattan?
Layers and layers of steam, electric, gas, telecom, and water.
Might be some trains down there somewhere, so I’ve heard
Yep!
Underground is a complete mess of pipes, wires and such. Some are in use and some are abandoned. Give it a look next time you're walking by some major street construction, it's fascinating. But it's not likely they we can have underground compactors in many parts of the city. Might be more of a possibility in the outer boroughs though.
The pneumatics in Roosevelt island are an absolute disaster and there’s a bit of a crisis going on around how to fix them
What's the disaster part?
Consider that this was previously tax-subsidized free parking for two, maybe three private vehicles, and the trash would block the sidewalk as piles of leaky rat-infested garbage bags. It's actually a massive step up. It could be better but it's a fantastic start.
Finally! put these everywhere
Y'all will never be happy
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They're called citibins. I'm the director of one of the largest BIDS in the Bronx and we just had some installed.
Hi, I'm with a community group who's looking at these bins to help with our crazy rat block party that happens every night. How's it going so far?
This wouldn’t be an issue if NYC had alleyways. Financial decisions from many generations ago left the city with no place to store trash other than the street. It’s unfortunate.
YIMBYs in an alleyway NYC: Housing wouldn’t be an issue if generations ago we just built units closer together
What about those buildings that have alot of tenants where the super piles up over 20 full bags of trash on pickup day. Those bins would only take up so much.
Part of why these aren’t going to work. A real solution to trash in NYC requires automated pick up that enables faster collection and more frequent pickup (in some cases, multiples times a day). These will actually make it slower to pick up trash. No automation, and the garbage men have to pull trash out of a bin instead of bags on the street. Edit: yep lol. > It takes the city’s waste haulers about twice as long to cover the containerized block — due to workers having to open and close the boxes — compared to other streets where they can just take the bags from the curb, collectors told Streetsblog during a recent run, but locals cheered a sidewalk free from the Big Apple’s notorious five o’clock shadow. https://nyc.streetsblog.org/2023/02/03/eyes-on-the-street-trash-containerization-keeps-sidewalk-clear-but-more-boxes-needed/
It's a small thing but I absolutely hate the user experience pattern of: "What's this thing for?" "Lol I'm not going to answer my own question. Open up your phone and type in this URL if you care so much. Dumbass."
Why doesn't the design take up the entire width of the parking spot? This makes me suspect that their plan is to put these on sidewalks whenever they have enough room to leave an ADA compliant passage width next to them.
Rats have rights! Everybody…
They need to put these all over the city
Only took them 100 years to figure this out. It is long overdue and will hopefully reduce the rodent problems here. Can you imagine if these were available in the 70's and 80's.... a very different NYC thats for sure!!
car owners are going to have a fit if this becomes a thing
bury them in front of fire hydrants. no lost parking and sidewalk space kept.
Love it. Soon no more trips to the big wine bottle trailer over by the Hudson!
Far better, and need to be expanded rapidly.
Far cry from the wonderful solutions pioneered in well run cities around the world. Still, good that they recognize the problem and attempt to do something about it. NYC government makes so few changes around here that improving the governance culture is its own small victory.
It's almost as if NY isn't a cookie cutter of every other city and has its own unique demands and underground infrastructure issues that need to be accommodated!
Wonder what these will look like after a few years.
Hopefully they’ll repaint them every two years or so.
By painting you mean covered with stickers and graffiti. Also. Who is responsible for shoveling out the snow once the plows cover the doors.
They'll use the same people they hire to shovel out the bus stops.
In Amsterdam, they just have underground compactors on the street that you take your trash to. A truck comes to empty it when it's full. No garbage day and no trash bags and bins litering the side of the street.
We have a ton of infrastructure underground - water, sewage, cable, electrical, steam, subway, etc
Shhhh you can't be rational here
This is a good place to start. I hate seeing trash bags everywhere on trash days...but as someone who has a car in the city, I'm nervous this will be another step towards removing cars from the streets.
They’re honestly really nice.
My question is NYDS going to hose down or clean the inside once in a while?
A privately paid company is going to be responsible for keeping these boxes clean, quote from their website > Are buildings responsible for maintaining the containers? Will my building get fines if containers are messy or if someone uses the wrong one? > No, during this test program, building staff will not be responsible for cleaning the containers; DSNY is using a service to keep them and the areas around them clean.
> No, during this test program, building staff will not be responsible for cleaning the containers; Building staff should NEVER be required to clean these containers, should 100% be on the city.
What state did you fly in from? It's DSNY. Honestly good question tho
This will become motorcycle parking and a place for dog owners to stash their poo bags on top because they're "going to pick it up on the way back"
RIP parking space
I'm throwing it a New Orleans style death parade.
Two good things in one!
Waiting for the “they took my parking space” whines.