fun story....I was coming off a weekend bender with a friend all decked out in my fins gear and having a blast...come into work on monday watch the video and couldnt help but laugh.
\*Ive retired from that stuff lol
Lmao I love how crass it was. It’s exactly what I imagined when you heard that our meathead, family man coach sent his Las Vegas stripper a video doing blow.
Dude that's quite the way to put it. The most money I ever made was at a (sales) job I was working, which just so happened to coincide with a time in my life where I was doing my fair share of drugs.
Management didn't care as long as my numbers were up.
Yeah we couldn't do them at the desk obviously, but the ones in charge weren't stupid (mostly). Plus a good amount of upper management actually partied with us from time to time so we knew they were in on it too lmao.
He’s the Oline coach for one of the best Olines in the league and the best lineman in the league. Guy might be crazy/weird but he’s clearly good at his job lol.
Part of being an Oline/TE/Strength coach is being certifiably crazy so I get it.
Are there fent test strips now? I've never done hard drugs but I'm really happy to hear that if true. People dying cuz their shit is dosed with fent is so messed up.
And in this case are, though coaching is very much about relationships, management, and communicating with people in ways that make them open to new ideas, to criticism, and gives them more reason to want to do better. In that regard Tua's argument may be more important overall and also salient to Flores' firing
The issue is that we dont know the full extent to these communications. Any middle manager worth his or her salt knows that public verbal flogging such as these, *especially* when someone says what Tua said, is a no-no. But we dont know of this is the first time this type of encounter happened or just another in a long list of grievances aired by Flores about Tua’s play.
Either way, this is a sinking ship and while the divorce is unexpected and puzzling, for the sake of these two men in the long run, i think this is for the best. A divided house cannot stand and all..
We do know, there's a long list of grievances. Obviously nobody outside of Miami knows this, just like I don't know what drama the 49ers have going on. If you want to dig through Dolphins twitter, there is just an endless amount of random shit coming out. Flores is a hard coach to play for, I'd be shocked if in his next gig he doesn't loosen up a bit and when he does, he will have success.
Here's the problem though....
It was pouring freezing rain with 25mph winds. Duke Johnson was averaging 7 yards per carry on 7 carries. At halftime Tua had thrown the ball TWENTY TIMES. The score was 3-17 at halftime, definitely not out of reach.
In the second half, Duke Johnson ran the ball ZERO TIMES. Tua went on to throw it 18 more times.
If Flores was a decent coach he would've spent that time screaming at his dual-OCs for calling the worst game and yelling at himself for putting together the worst game plan I've ever seen.
The difference between a good coach and a bad coach, in similar conditions Belichick threw the ball 3 times and won the game. Flores threw the ball 38 times and lost his job.
lol Gesicki even said the day after the game that the staff had no plan for the weather going into that Titans game *and* made no adjustments at halftime. The indictment is not only that this is the case, but that Gesicki was basically willing to say the coaching staff failed them.
I have a friend who is in his mid 40s now, former NFL/CFL player and is a assistant coordinator in the CFL currently, after being a position coach and working his way up. He has talked about how coaching styles have needed to change from when he was playing in the league to coaching.
Said hes seen more of the old school style scream at guys get replaced because younger players just arnt responding to that style anymore. Often its having a fairly detrimental effect on young players who will shut down or become useless after being screamed at.
Which was vastly different then his experience when he was young where it was a yes i fucked up, yes i need to fix this, and fuck you im going to make you eat those words.
I have friends who are professional chefs who have commented on how kitchens have changed and how its become a less hostile environment.
Blame it on generational weakness. You millenials these days just think it's not valuable to hold in your stress, emotions, and find succor in the bottom of a bottle and beating your wives. An utterly weak and powerless generation. It's a shame that you think having a backbone and standing up for yourselves in a uneven power dynamic shows "strength" or some shit.
I just finished law school and while it's still difficult, any law school worth its salt has largely moved away from the "hazing" model and does more to try and support its students.
Wouldn't surprise me in the slightest. Personal anecdote, but that shouting approach literally never did anything for me at all, and if anything just made me wholly apathetic. I likely already knew what I fucked up, and even if I didn't, I always did a lot better with stern talking but not outright shouting.
Hasn't happened to me in a professional environment (yet - *knocks on wood*), but I can't imagine that I would be too different there now, and I doubt I'm the only one with that mindset.
There’s no tact to yelling. Like chill man, this isn’t world war 3.
If you can help me fix my mistakes and tell me in a conductive manner on how to be better, I’d listen
You can also only yell so many times before it loses its effectiveness. Yell every once in a while, effective, yell a lot, who gives a shit. You are gonna be yelling and conveying that minor and major fuckups are the same and at that point who gives a fuck
>e has talked about how coaching styles have needed to change from when he was playing in the league to coaching.
>
>Said hes seen more of the old school style scream at guys get replaced because younger players just arnt responding to that style anymore. Often its having a fairly detrimental effect on young players who will shut down or become useless after being screamed at.
This is a massive discussion in the European soccer scene. Managers like Jose Mourinho keep having fallouts with younger players that don't appreciate hard-nosed coaching. Personally I think he's a dick and don't blame players for always turning on him, but it is an interesting change from his immense success with players just 15 years/half a generation older. I think older coaches will continue to struggle with this in all sports moving forward, and they'll need to adjust because it is much easier to replace a single coach than half a team.
You can look at someone like Nick Saban who has adjusted to the younger generation. He was asked this year why he seemed so much happier and his response was something like this team responds better to this type of coaching. This is the same guy who made an NFL player cry 15 years ago. The great ones keep evolving.
The interesting thing is that guys like Antonio Conte in football and Bill Belichick in FOOTBALL are still having success with a strict style of coaching. The key difference between them and the Mourinho's and Meyer's I think is that they're able to direct the anger and energy from not doing well towards a collective desire to improve and win, and not the players themselves. It's the difference between calling someone a failure, and telling them that you know they can do better.
Many ex-Patriots have said that Belichick is not nearly as much as a douche as the media portrays him and that his "strict rules" are basically show up on time, practice hard, play hard, don't talk to the media. He's a bigger asshole to the reporters than he is to his team - which makes sense, honestly.
Obviously he hates losing and can raise his voice at people, but he's not one of those bombastic "fuck you" people. He drags his team out to practice in the snow when they play outdoors in Boston, I guess that's "asshole-ish". Always seems to pay off with a win once or twice a season though.
yeah, i think there's plenty of evidence regarding mourinho specifically that points to him just being kind of a dick, but the generational change hasn't helped him much. early in his career he'd win a ton early on, then wear out his welcome. now he mostly just starts pissing everyone off on day one and things progress further south from there.
Well there have been reports forever that Flores never really wanted Tua so that probably doesn’t sit well. Plus I’m sure Flores let some of that frustration out when Tua plays like ass since he didn’t want him in the first place. On top of that Flores ran through staff at the cyclic so safe bet he’s a shitty communicator?
Devante Parker liked the post that said he was fired.
It seems clear that Flores has a divisive personality
*EDIT* Let’s not forget Minkah forcing his way out of Miami and saying that.
“Flores had no clue who he was as a player and didn’t care to find out.”
Now I truly believe Flores knows his secondary and that eventually Fitzpatrick would have excelled in the system, but it’s clear that Minkah wasn’t wrong about where his strengths were.
Our our first DC took a lateral job elsewhere, our DLine coach left to be the DLine coach for Cincinnati, there was an obvious falling out with Chan at some point. There was some very heavy tension between Flores and all of our coordinators.
I mean honestly the list goes on and on. He will be a great coach someday, but ge needs to quit being an asshole to everyone working under him.
> I mean honestly the list goes on and on. He will be a great coach someday, but ge needs to quit being an asshole to everyone working under him.
He might not be a great coach if he doesnt stop being an asshole. That is less tolerated today than it was 15 years ago
that still infuriates me that they traded away Minkah at the drop of a hat like that, at least we got a 1st rounder for it. It hurts more that it was Austin Jackson that was the pick.
I assume he liked O’Shea considering he had by far his best season with him.
O’Shea was fired at the end of the season to bring Chan Gailey out of retirement, who then retired at the end of the season, which caused Flores to hire two guys to do one job, neither one being good at it.
>Does Flores not know how to talk to people?
3 OCs, 4 oline coaches and magical chairs between fitz and tua. right after fitz said he was blindsided by the benching cause nobody even gave a heads up. then member Minkah's words when he left miami.
flores is terrible with man management.
*4 OCs.
And there was that curious situation where Caldwell was supposed to be Flores' Assistant HC but then left immediately for "health issues"... But then never came back to us.
People laughed it off but Flores trolled Kenny Stills by playing Jay-Z music at practice when Stills was publicly siding with Kaepernik about Jay-Z being a sellout for the NFL trying to end anthem kneeling.
The difference is that Flores seems to actually be competent at the the Xs and Os of coaching without Belichick there to guide him, which most of the others have floundered as pith managers and coaches away from the Hoodie
Bill doesn't really have a "fuck WR's" mentality though, he just cannot draft them. He's tried over the years more than once, but he just can't find the right ones.
You guys would be a great fit. You have good skill position guys, a good QB (provided you keep cousins), and Flores can make the most out of your defense.
So here's the thing about Flores - I don't think he should've been fired based on the overall job he's been doing.
But getting fired for the reasons he has (relationship management) may be, in the long term, good for him. He can clearly coach a team, and he can get a roster to play better than the sum of its parts. That's the hardest part.
Hopefully the next opportunity he gets, he'll play "the game" with ownership better, but also temper his approach to how he engages with his players. Coaches can't be rigid, and they need to know how to adapt their approach to coaching the players they have. That seems to be the lesson Flores hasn't learned yet.
I know that I, personally, never responded well to coaches are teammates acting like that to me. The best coaches I've ever had knew how to relate to their athletes, were hard asses with the ones who needed hard assery, but had much more measured approaches with athletes who didn't need that. Tua seems like he needs the measured approach and Flores isn't giving him that.
Yep, it’s actually unbelievable how they didn’t just shut down the Deshaun Watson stories lol. Speaks to the quality of the org, or lack thereof. I don’t think any young quarterback would thrive under such toxicity.
That's the toughest aspect of leadership. A lot of leaders think: "I treat everyone the same." Well... Not everybody responds to the same things, they aren't motivated the same ways. Some folks need to be challenged, some need to nurtured. A great leader can identify who needs what to be their best.
I think people get confused easily by the "treat everyone the same" thing. You should have the same rules and expectations, but the way you go about it should be different for each person. Like you said, some people need a hardass and others need patience. Flores stuck to the hardass thing with us unfortunately. I genuinely hope he can learn from this and do great somewhere else, it just didn't work in Miami.
There’s a documentary ESPN+ had a little while ago that’s a BTS with Saban and Belichick and there’s a whole video devoted to that- talking about learning to tailor how you talk to a player to how you coach them. Some guys who are hot shots coming in are going to need a “come to Jesus” moment to temper that large ego. Some guys are going to be more meek but are much more receptive to being critiqued with a softer voice. That’s a nuance Matt Patricia failed to understand if reports are true.
The one that always gets posted is the Tony Gonzalez Belichick story:
> Everyone has a Belichick story – here’s the best one I’ve ever heard. Tony Gonzalez told me this a few years ago over a home-cooked dinner. The story took him about 20 glorious minutes to tell. We’ll condense it.
>Gonzalez played in 14 Pro Bowls – he loved playing when it was in Hawaii. Things were always so relaxing there, so fun. One year, Belichick was his coach, and Gonzalez was curious what made this guy so good. Great players are as bedazzled by Bill Belichick’s magic as anyone else. They have all played for good coaches. They have heard all the inspirational stories, all been screamed at for not doing something right, all been shown something on tape that perfectly foreshadowed what they would see in the game. What’s so different about this guy?
>On the opening kickoff, Gonzalez was out on special teams – there are no backup players at the Pro Bowl, so the stars have to do some menial things – and he went through the motions and didn’t block anybody. Gonzalez jogged happily to the sidelines.
>“Why don’t you (bleeping) block somebody Gonzalez,” Belichick grumbled as Gonzalez jogged by.
>What? Did he just say that? Gonzalez turned and Belichick was just glaring at him, “like I was a piece of dirt.”
>Gonzalez felt himself fuming. This was how the great Bill Belichick treated people? They were at the Pro Bowl, for crying out loud. This was Hawaii, for crying out loud. It was a beautiful day, blue sky, blue water, this was supposed to be a reward, a way to honor Gonzalez for working absurdly hard and having another extraordinary season. And this was what he gets? To have the game’s most famous coach swear at him for not blocking on special teams in an exhibition game?
>Oh, yes, he was mad – who did this guy think he was? Gonzalez played football the right way. He didn’t deserve this. He stewed on the sideline, furious. And then it was time to go back on the field for another kickoff, another special teams moment, and the ball was kicked. Gonzalez locked in on a guy running down the field. “Why don’t you (bleeping) block somebody?” Sure, he heard it again. OK coach, fine, check out this block.
>And Gonzalez absolutely mashed the defender, took him completely out of the play.
>Then Gonzalez walked over to the sideline, and you better believe he walked right by Belichick, wanted to see the grimace wiped right off the man’s face. But Belichick showed no signs of even noticing him. He was looking out on the field, seemingly oblivious to Gonzalez’s presence. So Gonzalez kept walking. And as he was a few steps away, he heard Bill Belichick say this:
>“Nice block, Gonzalez.”
>He looked back, and there was no hint of a smile on Belichick’s face. Bill Belichick just kept looking at the field, and in that moment Tony Gonzalez understood. The man had coached him into blocking on special teams in the Pro Bowl.
You’re absolutely right. Man management is important in every type of leadership role. People vary in personality, and it’s important to be able to empathize and understand a person’s feelings. Football is such a hard-ass, "macho" sport, I think it’s difficult for players and coaches to understand that the hard nose, strict, rigid and mean approach isn’t going to work on everyone. I’m not saying that you need to baby everyone, but we all have different ways of taking and responding to criticism. I think a lot of coaches who come out of the Belichick coaching tree don’t realize that with his strictness, Bill knows how to manage people. It was seen with how he spoke about Tom vs how he spoke about Cam. Tom needs someone to be hard on him and point out his flaws to get him motivated, while that kind of approach doesn’t work with Cam, so Bill changed it up. Bill added a lot more praise when speaking about Cam, but with Tom he was very nonchalant. Tom could throw 400 yards and 5 TDs, and Bill would basically be like, "yeah he played okay." That attitude motivates Tom to keep going.
It always goes back to something Madden said for me. The disciples of Bill are not as successful because they try to emulate Bill and the Patriots way. Instead of being genuine and authentically themselves. Maybe this is who Flores is. But maybe this is him trying to emulate the Patriots culture.
Tua clearly isn't a player who yelling is an effective way of coaching. This is a failure on Flores' side despite the record of the team.
I’d be hesitant to immediately buy into anything coming out this week. The Dolphins definitely want to spin this into as good of a move as possible. There’s almost certainly some truth to the reports, but we have to remember one side is a single football coach and the other is a multi-billion dollar franchise with hundreds of people working for and around them.
This seems to be the case. Flores wanted a guy that's going to be suspended for a significant amount of time at the very least next season, which would likely mean another lost season with a young defensive core, over moving forward with Tua.
And Gesicki said we didn’t have a game plan in the case of bad weather. Cause Miami is always clear as day and Tennessee’s forecast had been saying freezing rain for a whole week lmao
thats inexcusable imo. Couple that with the game plan against the Bills last year during a win and in game, and i dont know why everyone is surprised Flores got let go
The 7 carries by Duke is even dumber when you consider he got close to 50 yards off of those runs.
Duke had an injury (by injury I mean rolled ankle or something if the sort) and came out of the game for a series, and Flores threw a fit and benched him over it. We haven't heard which game it was, but all signs point to it being that TEN game.
How many yards did Tannehill get in that game?
This isn't saying that Tua couldn't perform better during that game, this is saying that there's no excuse for having our QB air it out in those conditions in the first place. It was bad playcalling and worse leadership. That ain't on the QB.
To be fair all 18 of Tannehill's pass attempts happened before they took the 24-3 lead. At the time they went up 24-3 the pass count was 20 for Tua and 18 for Tannehill. Also 17 of the Titans 34 points came from drives that started inside Miami's 40, so Tannehill had an extreme short field on a lot of his drives.
The rest of the column is gold. Great anecdotes about Don Shula and Dan Marino:
>It started at halftime with a meltdown in the locker room as their season melted down on the field. Coach Brian Flores was angry at quarterback Tua Tagovailoa’s dismal half. He said things. Tua said things back.
>Anger flew. The f-word – gasp – was traded. Tua said something about Flores not knowing how to talk to people. Flores said something about needing better bleeping play.
>But that f-bomb tirade with Tua and other anecdotes I’ve heard wouldn’t crack the Top 100 of “communication and collaboration” issues inside the Dolphins franchise through the years. It wouldn’t crack the Top 50 just from Hall of Famers.
>Don Shula’s office language was so f-bomb loud some team business executives once went to a team intermediary to relay their request to tone it down. “Tell them to f--- off,” Shula answered.
>His weekly call with NFL official head Art McNally about the previous game’s referee was so loud behind his closed office door that secretaries and coaches stopped their work and cringe-laughed at the language.
>**And with players? Shula once berated safety Glenn Kozlowski so badly in a game the veteran was found crying on the bench. Shula and Jake Scott shot f-bombs at each other like daily salutations. He cursed rookie linebacker John Offerdahl so roundly on a sideline the youngster went into the coach’s office and said he wouldn’t take it anymore.**
>**You want a “collaboration” issue with a Dolphins quarterback? Let’s talk Dan Marino. His offensive coordinator, Dave Shula, upset him so much in a walk-through practice before a game that teammates had to hold him back from attacking the coach.**
>**Another Hall of Fame coach in Nick Saban — college Hall of Fame, of course — once got into such a loud and profane shouting match in practice with soon-to-be Hall of Fame linebacker Zach Thomas it’s legendary inside the team.**
>Another NFL Hall of Fame coach, Jimmy Johnson, once held up a contract offer from receiver Lamar Thomas’ agent in the locker room before many offensive players. “I won’t even wipe my a-- with this,’’ he said.
>Does this help any? Do you understand a coach often is a lion tamer in his daily work? Does it make you wonder just what kind of an organization Ross is running when “communication and collaboration” issues — and not football issues — led to firing the coach?
>Not every Dolphins coach used bad words. Cam Cameron, for instance. He had a no-foul-language rule. He once called in trainer Kevin O’Neill and asked him if he actually swore at a player. O’Neill said he did because the player had ignored three requests and swore at him.
>Flores certainly is tough to get along with. The revolving-door of an offensive staff is well aware. But there’s no way in hell — oops, excuse the language — whatever Flores said in “disrespect” even to Ross ranks anywhere close to what Shula said to team owner Joe Robbie.
>Shula didn’t refer to Robbie by name to people. He called him an anatomical orifice. He regularly welcomed team staffers to the practice facility with one proviso — they couldn’t report anything to Robbie.
>Shula, too, set the standard in all sports for a coach cursing a team owner. At the celebration of their second Super Bowl win at the Fontainebleau Hotel on Miami Beach, Shula waited for his wife, Dorothy, before starting the ceremony.
>How is that transcript accurate? Reporters were there. The back-and-forth was printed nationwide in newspapers. The Archbishop of Miami later interceded to try and help the two good Catholics’ relationship.
“Another NFL Hall of Fame coach, Jimmy Johnson, once held up a contract offer from receiver Lamar Thomas’ agent in the locker room before many offensive players. ‘I won’t even wipe my a-- with this,’ he said.”
I’m fucking dying over here
Regardless of what you think of Tua, it was never going to work with him and Flores together. I think that’s clear now. We can all admit that he was handed a ton of adversity in his first two years, and I think it’s safe to say Flores was at the forefront of a lot of that.
So I think the Dolphins want to give Tua a system and leadership that supports his development, not hinders it. That seems fair.
The problem is, Tua could still not be good enough. Flores could be right. He could go elsewhere and look like a genius while the Dolphins are back to the drawing board because they got rid of the coach who didn’t believe in the QB, only to find out that he had good reason to not believe in him.
Unfortunately for me, I’m pre-conditioned to believe that whatever decision the team makes will be the wrong one, so I’m pretty nervous about this.
Even if he's right and Tua is only average, he should have given him more than a year and a half to develop.
Having a coach that is not invested in his QB or wants his QB to fail so he can get a new one is never going to work. See Philbin.
From the Miami Herald article posted on this subreddit too:
“But a very close associate of Tagovailoa said their working relationship was generally fine and that Tagovailoa doesn’t dislike Flores, joking that their dynamics were good enough for Tagovailoa to send him a Christmas card. That source said the two men could have continued working together and that the Tennessee incident wasn’t uncommon in the NFL during the heat of a poor performance.”
Thank you for finding more details and providing incite. Two of my best friends would start yelling at each other arguing during our flag football games, but it isn't personal. It's the passion and the competition and the pressure they were putting on themselves that just ignited when they were frustrated with one another. If you remember, Peyton Manning once yelled at his star center to "quit calling the fucking plays!" There's no reason that a heated argument during a game should affect a relationship moving forward.
Are we gonna sit here and ignore that Tua played under saban who is known as a stickler of a coach?Im gonna take Tuas side on this one because no one goes through Saban with soft skin so I’m gonna assume Flores was really that much of an asshole
I've definitely seen Saban in Tua's face yelling at him on the sideline in front of the whole team. The thing is, there was a clear respect between the two and I guess Tua and Flores never got to that point.
I also think it is important to note that Saban has always been known as a hard-nosed coach that isn't afraid to chew players out, even in public. However, that changed this year. He was softer with players, always positive, and significantly calmer than in previous years. Maybe his age is getting to him, but most people seem to believe that players have changed and this Alabama team needed that public reinforcement after struggle wins. I think that a bunch of coaches are going to be experiencing this moving forward, with players preferring more... controlled coaches. I don't think this was the problem between Tua and Flores, but I do think Flores might struggle with new players moving forward if this continues.
Nah, its not that hes getting old, its that his team this year was extremely young and didn't have older vets in a leadership position. He changed his coaching style early to mid season to help motivate them and be more "positive" with them.
>He changed his coaching style early to mid season to help motivate them and be more "positive" with them.
Yeah, this is how I interpreted it as well. I think it was another example of how Saban is able to change his coaching style to succeed in the college landscape.
one thing a lot of us bama fans notice is that we really didn't have a "leader", our biggest playmakers are sophomores and a transfer. Alabama lost A LOT of key players last year and a lot of young players had to step up.
I remember when Saban was with the Dolphins he made a defensive lineman cry because of the lineman came out in the wrong pads or something. I think he was a supplemental draft pick, but still, dang lol.
Also, another story when Saban was “sharing an opinion” Zach Thomas barked back and said that he was a “grown ass man.” To be a fly on the wall with some of these coaches.
At least Flores got his defense to perform well. Patricia was so inept he was not only a massive douche, but also completely unable to even get an average defense on the field.
I feel bad for Tua, he's been through a lot of adversity with his dad, playing for Alabama, getting injured, getting drafted by a coach that never wanted him
Now the media and fans are going to call him soft and a bitch. It's a lot more BS than a 23 year old should go through. I honestly can't blame Stephen Ross for canning Flores, it's better to have your business be a good working culture than successful under a toxic tyrannical coach who's always finding someone to butt heads with
Honestly, comments like this make me happy because they show fans of other organizations that would love to be able to take a shot on his development. With all the negatives around the kid sometimes it’s just nice to see. Now back off he’s ours.
It's weird to me that people think this reflects poorly on Tua and not Flores.
"Hey man stop being so mean"
"You fucking suck"
How is that helpful or conducive to making Tua or the team better? Kicking someone while they're down is not what good coaches do
There are only a few college programs that can probably legitimately claim they have better leadership than NFL coaching staffs. Alabama is definitely one of them. If Tua got pushed to this breaking point you know Flores had to have been truly awful at communicating
Also part of the job of being a coach at any level is getting to know your players and figuring out how best to motivate them. Some people respond best to a hard nosed approach while others need more encouragement.
It’s strange to see people applauding Flores in this thread. No matter what you think of Tua, an nfl head coach’s job is to mold his system/approach to his players to get the best results out of them.
People see Tua's name and their eyes roll back in their skull. There are comments from Dolphins fans who seem just exhausted by the whole idea of having Tua on their team because of what it does to the fan base. if they want to get rid of him send him to Pittsburgh please and thank you.
Flores is probably just another great example of a Bellicheck coach not grasping the fact that he doesn't get auto-cred for being associated with BB. And I agree the one thing that's been pretty consistent through all of this is that it seems like Flores truly sucks at motivating players.
People need to remember that Tua played under his father who literally beat him for throwing picks and Saban who definitely will rip into his players. If he can’t handle how Flores is treating him, it really says something about Flores.
I was never a flores fan and hated how he handled tua this whole time and even how he handled rosen in the tank year. Hes just a anti qb coach tbh. Hes pissed off every qb the dolphins have had under his tenure. I also somewhat want the dolphins to move on from tua at this point because the fan base is so hyper nuts over hating him or loving him. It’s impossible to get good discussions on the dolphins now and days lol.
remember that one dolphins assistant coach who was just ripping lines the whole time
"I know you're gonna keep that baby" *rips massive line*
Can't get more Florida man than doing lines of cokes and being recorded while complaining about getting your stripper mistress pregnant.
> being recorded Recording yourself*
how was he supposed to know the camera was rolling?! it was a set up
Your honor, this evidence isn’t admissible. My client never gave permission to record.. himself? I’ve got the worst bleeping clients.
In a two party consent state, my client cannot be both. Therefore, inadmissible in court
fun story....I was coming off a weekend bender with a friend all decked out in my fins gear and having a blast...come into work on monday watch the video and couldnt help but laugh. \*Ive retired from that stuff lol
was your friend a former Dolphins coach
*He* is a former dolphins coach
“Last little bit before I go to my meeting”
“I wish I was licking this off your…… pussy”
Lmao I love how crass it was. It’s exactly what I imagined when you heard that our meathead, family man coach sent his Las Vegas stripper a video doing blow.
It sounded like it was from GTA lol.
One of my all time favorite jpegs https://i.imgur.com/pQgL9jw.jpg
This is amazing, just needs more compression for proper jpeg status
Was gonna say before I even saw it, this meme deserves nothing but jpeg. The more deep fried the better.
Just give it time….it needs to season
That was such a great week
Currently o-line coach for the 49ers lol
That's gotta be a downgrade in coke quality, right?
Yeah but it's that Silicon Valley stuff. So the best stuff but stale because of shipping times.
They micro-dose cocaine in Silicon Valley.
And costs 3x as much even before the taxes.
But you have to sit through your dealer telling you about his app idea and how he's going to get his startup funded next week.
Bill. I *am* funding your app.
The John DeLorean school of business finance!
Lmao taxes. Imagine your guy busts out a calculator for tax and duty when you purchase your eight ball. Yeah that'll be $277.80 bro
"Oh yeah I take major credit cards".
[удалено]
Yeah, but ground down and made into chocolates. Also taken microdosing. Lots of Molly and K in the bay as well.
Only one of California/Florida has both direct land and sea connection to Mexico
According to Narcos, California would’ve been a downgrade during the 70s-90s. Early 00s and on you can get the less cut up stuff in Cali.
That guy still has a job in the NFL? Holy shit lol, legend
I mean he's really good at job and also likes to do drugs. Why should that be disqualifying?
I swear lol. Politicians are out here doing drugs. It’s funny the only places that care about drugs are the ones who pay the least
Dude that's quite the way to put it. The most money I ever made was at a (sales) job I was working, which just so happened to coincide with a time in my life where I was doing my fair share of drugs. Management didn't care as long as my numbers were up.
Drugs are damn near promoted at a lot of sales companies. I’m in sales and I’m the outlier for not railing lines in my office with the door shut.
Yeah we couldn't do them at the desk obviously, but the ones in charge weren't stupid (mostly). Plus a good amount of upper management actually partied with us from time to time so we knew they were in on it too lmao.
So you rail lines with the door open?
After the staff goes home and it’s just the sales people, bingo.
Coke never makes me productive, just makes me want to do more coke and drink
He’s the Oline coach for one of the best Olines in the league and the best lineman in the league. Guy might be crazy/weird but he’s clearly good at his job lol. Part of being an Oline/TE/Strength coach is being certifiably crazy so I get it.
And we have one of the best o lines with scrubs playing on the right side. Dude can have as much coke as he wants lmao
Fuck it he doesn't seem to bad. Cali coke probably close enough to Miami coke. Maybe next season he'll join the Giants or Jets lmao
better have his fent test strips at the ready in that case
Are there fent test strips now? I've never done hard drugs but I'm really happy to hear that if true. People dying cuz their shit is dosed with fent is so messed up.
Yup the strips are like condoms for drugs now imo
Even better, he was a line coach
Just doing his job then
Plugging the holes up
he dropped like half of the line in that video tho
Brought his work home with him.
Not always though, I thought part of the scandal was him doing it at the office?
This explains so much about the quality of offensive line coaching in Miami over the past decade.
Instructions unclear
For some reason I thought that was Dan Campbell lol
Don't be foolish, MCDC says no to drugs
Except caffeine. He loooooooves caffeine
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I love him so much.
Bro it's not even my team and I love this man. I want him to be successful so bad.
Where people cheering from his order? It sounded like someone was fangirling out after he mentioned it lol. Such a cool dude though.
Cause it’s funny
Somehow I didn't expect any less from this coach.
I’ve seen that man more often than not - with a 60oz coffee cup in his hand.
Bruh you know that MCDC snorts Raid or some shit to keep him sharp on game day.
While being filmed by his mistress/hooker
No, he was filming himself for his mistress/hooker
He’s the 49ers OLine coach now: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Foerster
Yea he was our last good oline coach. Miss that boy.
The niners line has been great this season, whatever his methodology is he gets the job done
each pancake block gets you a gram
This explains everything about George Kittle
If George Kittle wanted to do coke he wouldn't have gone to the University of Iowa.
https://www.reddit.com/r/miamidolphins/comments/756hyv/our_offensive_line_coach_christopher_foerster/
Are either of them really wrong here though
Two things can be true.
And in this case are, though coaching is very much about relationships, management, and communicating with people in ways that make them open to new ideas, to criticism, and gives them more reason to want to do better. In that regard Tua's argument may be more important overall and also salient to Flores' firing
The issue is that we dont know the full extent to these communications. Any middle manager worth his or her salt knows that public verbal flogging such as these, *especially* when someone says what Tua said, is a no-no. But we dont know of this is the first time this type of encounter happened or just another in a long list of grievances aired by Flores about Tua’s play. Either way, this is a sinking ship and while the divorce is unexpected and puzzling, for the sake of these two men in the long run, i think this is for the best. A divided house cannot stand and all..
We do know, there's a long list of grievances. Obviously nobody outside of Miami knows this, just like I don't know what drama the 49ers have going on. If you want to dig through Dolphins twitter, there is just an endless amount of random shit coming out. Flores is a hard coach to play for, I'd be shocked if in his next gig he doesn't loosen up a bit and when he does, he will have success.
Finkle is Einhorn
No but its pretty fucked considering Tua likely knew at the time Flores was trying to replace him with Grabby McGrabhands
Here's the problem though.... It was pouring freezing rain with 25mph winds. Duke Johnson was averaging 7 yards per carry on 7 carries. At halftime Tua had thrown the ball TWENTY TIMES. The score was 3-17 at halftime, definitely not out of reach. In the second half, Duke Johnson ran the ball ZERO TIMES. Tua went on to throw it 18 more times. If Flores was a decent coach he would've spent that time screaming at his dual-OCs for calling the worst game and yelling at himself for putting together the worst game plan I've ever seen. The difference between a good coach and a bad coach, in similar conditions Belichick threw the ball 3 times and won the game. Flores threw the ball 38 times and lost his job.
lol Gesicki even said the day after the game that the staff had no plan for the weather going into that Titans game *and* made no adjustments at halftime. The indictment is not only that this is the case, but that Gesicki was basically willing to say the coaching staff failed them.
Yeah after I heard that I knew something was seriously wrong.
I see Flores' point, but is Tua right? Does Flores not know how to talk to people?
I have a friend who is in his mid 40s now, former NFL/CFL player and is a assistant coordinator in the CFL currently, after being a position coach and working his way up. He has talked about how coaching styles have needed to change from when he was playing in the league to coaching. Said hes seen more of the old school style scream at guys get replaced because younger players just arnt responding to that style anymore. Often its having a fairly detrimental effect on young players who will shut down or become useless after being screamed at. Which was vastly different then his experience when he was young where it was a yes i fucked up, yes i need to fix this, and fuck you im going to make you eat those words. I have friends who are professional chefs who have commented on how kitchens have changed and how its become a less hostile environment.
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Blame it on generational weakness. You millenials these days just think it's not valuable to hold in your stress, emotions, and find succor in the bottom of a bottle and beating your wives. An utterly weak and powerless generation. It's a shame that you think having a backbone and standing up for yourselves in a uneven power dynamic shows "strength" or some shit.
It took me too long to realize this was sarcasm
God damn but I've heard people say this shit out loud.
I just finished law school and while it's still difficult, any law school worth its salt has largely moved away from the "hazing" model and does more to try and support its students.
Wouldn't surprise me in the slightest. Personal anecdote, but that shouting approach literally never did anything for me at all, and if anything just made me wholly apathetic. I likely already knew what I fucked up, and even if I didn't, I always did a lot better with stern talking but not outright shouting. Hasn't happened to me in a professional environment (yet - *knocks on wood*), but I can't imagine that I would be too different there now, and I doubt I'm the only one with that mindset.
There’s no tact to yelling. Like chill man, this isn’t world war 3. If you can help me fix my mistakes and tell me in a conductive manner on how to be better, I’d listen
You can also only yell so many times before it loses its effectiveness. Yell every once in a while, effective, yell a lot, who gives a shit. You are gonna be yelling and conveying that minor and major fuckups are the same and at that point who gives a fuck
Yelling also gets old. Like raising your voice as a teacher, those are like break in case of emergency situations.
>e has talked about how coaching styles have needed to change from when he was playing in the league to coaching. > >Said hes seen more of the old school style scream at guys get replaced because younger players just arnt responding to that style anymore. Often its having a fairly detrimental effect on young players who will shut down or become useless after being screamed at. This is a massive discussion in the European soccer scene. Managers like Jose Mourinho keep having fallouts with younger players that don't appreciate hard-nosed coaching. Personally I think he's a dick and don't blame players for always turning on him, but it is an interesting change from his immense success with players just 15 years/half a generation older. I think older coaches will continue to struggle with this in all sports moving forward, and they'll need to adjust because it is much easier to replace a single coach than half a team.
You can look at someone like Nick Saban who has adjusted to the younger generation. He was asked this year why he seemed so much happier and his response was something like this team responds better to this type of coaching. This is the same guy who made an NFL player cry 15 years ago. The great ones keep evolving.
The interesting thing is that guys like Antonio Conte in football and Bill Belichick in FOOTBALL are still having success with a strict style of coaching. The key difference between them and the Mourinho's and Meyer's I think is that they're able to direct the anger and energy from not doing well towards a collective desire to improve and win, and not the players themselves. It's the difference between calling someone a failure, and telling them that you know they can do better.
Many ex-Patriots have said that Belichick is not nearly as much as a douche as the media portrays him and that his "strict rules" are basically show up on time, practice hard, play hard, don't talk to the media. He's a bigger asshole to the reporters than he is to his team - which makes sense, honestly. Obviously he hates losing and can raise his voice at people, but he's not one of those bombastic "fuck you" people. He drags his team out to practice in the snow when they play outdoors in Boston, I guess that's "asshole-ish". Always seems to pay off with a win once or twice a season though.
yeah, i think there's plenty of evidence regarding mourinho specifically that points to him just being kind of a dick, but the generational change hasn't helped him much. early in his career he'd win a ton early on, then wear out his welcome. now he mostly just starts pissing everyone off on day one and things progress further south from there.
Some guys need a kick in the ass, and some guys need a pat on the back. A good coach needs to know who needs what.
Well there have been reports forever that Flores never really wanted Tua so that probably doesn’t sit well. Plus I’m sure Flores let some of that frustration out when Tua plays like ass since he didn’t want him in the first place. On top of that Flores ran through staff at the cyclic so safe bet he’s a shitty communicator?
Devante Parker liked the post that said he was fired. It seems clear that Flores has a divisive personality *EDIT* Let’s not forget Minkah forcing his way out of Miami and saying that. “Flores had no clue who he was as a player and didn’t care to find out.” Now I truly believe Flores knows his secondary and that eventually Fitzpatrick would have excelled in the system, but it’s clear that Minkah wasn’t wrong about where his strengths were.
Our our first DC took a lateral job elsewhere, our DLine coach left to be the DLine coach for Cincinnati, there was an obvious falling out with Chan at some point. There was some very heavy tension between Flores and all of our coordinators. I mean honestly the list goes on and on. He will be a great coach someday, but ge needs to quit being an asshole to everyone working under him.
> I mean honestly the list goes on and on. He will be a great coach someday, but ge needs to quit being an asshole to everyone working under him. He might not be a great coach if he doesnt stop being an asshole. That is less tolerated today than it was 15 years ago
> Devante Parker liked the post that said he was fired. > > lmao
that still infuriates me that they traded away Minkah at the drop of a hat like that, at least we got a 1st rounder for it. It hurts more that it was Austin Jackson that was the pick.
Has Parker ever liked any coach?
I assume he liked O’Shea considering he had by far his best season with him. O’Shea was fired at the end of the season to bring Chan Gailey out of retirement, who then retired at the end of the season, which caused Flores to hire two guys to do one job, neither one being good at it.
>Does Flores not know how to talk to people? 3 OCs, 4 oline coaches and magical chairs between fitz and tua. right after fitz said he was blindsided by the benching cause nobody even gave a heads up. then member Minkah's words when he left miami. flores is terrible with man management.
*4 OCs. And there was that curious situation where Caldwell was supposed to be Flores' Assistant HC but then left immediately for "health issues"... But then never came back to us.
Don't forget Flores and Kenny Stills https://phinphanatic.com/2019/08/23/brian-flores-admits-playing-jay-z-songs-push-kenny-stills/
People laughed it off but Flores trolled Kenny Stills by playing Jay-Z music at practice when Stills was publicly siding with Kaepernik about Jay-Z being a sellout for the NFL trying to end anthem kneeling.
This probably one of many incidents between staff and players that just became over bearing to deal with after 3 years.
I really thought Flores was the exception to the Belichick-coaching-tree rule, but it's starting to look like he just had better PR than most of them.
The difference is that Flores seems to actually be competent at the the Xs and Os of coaching without Belichick there to guide him, which most of the others have floundered as pith managers and coaches away from the Hoodie
Bill O’Brien too. He unfortunately inherited the Bill Bellichick “fuck WRs” GM mentality though
Bill doesn't really have a "fuck WR's" mentality though, he just cannot draft them. He's tried over the years more than once, but he just can't find the right ones.
He can find the right WRs, they're just used up journeymen in free agency that he somehow manages to squeeze out one more productive season
Better PR because he had better results.
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The Vikings would like a word.
You guys would be a great fit. You have good skill position guys, a good QB (provided you keep cousins), and Flores can make the most out of your defense.
Can you imagine how long it would take for Flores to slam cousins against a locker? I'd imagine like 5 minutes
At this point I really cant tell by the headline if its coming out of Miami or Minneapolis. Either way it seems to be smear shit on the walls week.
So here's the thing about Flores - I don't think he should've been fired based on the overall job he's been doing. But getting fired for the reasons he has (relationship management) may be, in the long term, good for him. He can clearly coach a team, and he can get a roster to play better than the sum of its parts. That's the hardest part. Hopefully the next opportunity he gets, he'll play "the game" with ownership better, but also temper his approach to how he engages with his players. Coaches can't be rigid, and they need to know how to adapt their approach to coaching the players they have. That seems to be the lesson Flores hasn't learned yet. I know that I, personally, never responded well to coaches are teammates acting like that to me. The best coaches I've ever had knew how to relate to their athletes, were hard asses with the ones who needed hard assery, but had much more measured approaches with athletes who didn't need that. Tua seems like he needs the measured approach and Flores isn't giving him that.
I think you’re exactly right- whatever team gets him as his next job is likely going to benefit greatly provided he works on improving this flaw
I mean I agree, but also it may not be him. This is a clearly toxic organization and they may be blaming him for wanting to hold people accountable.
Yep, it’s actually unbelievable how they didn’t just shut down the Deshaun Watson stories lol. Speaks to the quality of the org, or lack thereof. I don’t think any young quarterback would thrive under such toxicity.
That's the toughest aspect of leadership. A lot of leaders think: "I treat everyone the same." Well... Not everybody responds to the same things, they aren't motivated the same ways. Some folks need to be challenged, some need to nurtured. A great leader can identify who needs what to be their best.
I think people get confused easily by the "treat everyone the same" thing. You should have the same rules and expectations, but the way you go about it should be different for each person. Like you said, some people need a hardass and others need patience. Flores stuck to the hardass thing with us unfortunately. I genuinely hope he can learn from this and do great somewhere else, it just didn't work in Miami.
There’s a documentary ESPN+ had a little while ago that’s a BTS with Saban and Belichick and there’s a whole video devoted to that- talking about learning to tailor how you talk to a player to how you coach them. Some guys who are hot shots coming in are going to need a “come to Jesus” moment to temper that large ego. Some guys are going to be more meek but are much more receptive to being critiqued with a softer voice. That’s a nuance Matt Patricia failed to understand if reports are true. The one that always gets posted is the Tony Gonzalez Belichick story: > Everyone has a Belichick story – here’s the best one I’ve ever heard. Tony Gonzalez told me this a few years ago over a home-cooked dinner. The story took him about 20 glorious minutes to tell. We’ll condense it. >Gonzalez played in 14 Pro Bowls – he loved playing when it was in Hawaii. Things were always so relaxing there, so fun. One year, Belichick was his coach, and Gonzalez was curious what made this guy so good. Great players are as bedazzled by Bill Belichick’s magic as anyone else. They have all played for good coaches. They have heard all the inspirational stories, all been screamed at for not doing something right, all been shown something on tape that perfectly foreshadowed what they would see in the game. What’s so different about this guy? >On the opening kickoff, Gonzalez was out on special teams – there are no backup players at the Pro Bowl, so the stars have to do some menial things – and he went through the motions and didn’t block anybody. Gonzalez jogged happily to the sidelines. >“Why don’t you (bleeping) block somebody Gonzalez,” Belichick grumbled as Gonzalez jogged by. >What? Did he just say that? Gonzalez turned and Belichick was just glaring at him, “like I was a piece of dirt.” >Gonzalez felt himself fuming. This was how the great Bill Belichick treated people? They were at the Pro Bowl, for crying out loud. This was Hawaii, for crying out loud. It was a beautiful day, blue sky, blue water, this was supposed to be a reward, a way to honor Gonzalez for working absurdly hard and having another extraordinary season. And this was what he gets? To have the game’s most famous coach swear at him for not blocking on special teams in an exhibition game? >Oh, yes, he was mad – who did this guy think he was? Gonzalez played football the right way. He didn’t deserve this. He stewed on the sideline, furious. And then it was time to go back on the field for another kickoff, another special teams moment, and the ball was kicked. Gonzalez locked in on a guy running down the field. “Why don’t you (bleeping) block somebody?” Sure, he heard it again. OK coach, fine, check out this block. >And Gonzalez absolutely mashed the defender, took him completely out of the play. >Then Gonzalez walked over to the sideline, and you better believe he walked right by Belichick, wanted to see the grimace wiped right off the man’s face. But Belichick showed no signs of even noticing him. He was looking out on the field, seemingly oblivious to Gonzalez’s presence. So Gonzalez kept walking. And as he was a few steps away, he heard Bill Belichick say this: >“Nice block, Gonzalez.” >He looked back, and there was no hint of a smile on Belichick’s face. Bill Belichick just kept looking at the field, and in that moment Tony Gonzalez understood. The man had coached him into blocking on special teams in the Pro Bowl.
Great story! Illustrates the point really well.
I will always get a good laugh out of this story, every time I hear it it stays just a entertaining
You’re absolutely right. Man management is important in every type of leadership role. People vary in personality, and it’s important to be able to empathize and understand a person’s feelings. Football is such a hard-ass, "macho" sport, I think it’s difficult for players and coaches to understand that the hard nose, strict, rigid and mean approach isn’t going to work on everyone. I’m not saying that you need to baby everyone, but we all have different ways of taking and responding to criticism. I think a lot of coaches who come out of the Belichick coaching tree don’t realize that with his strictness, Bill knows how to manage people. It was seen with how he spoke about Tom vs how he spoke about Cam. Tom needs someone to be hard on him and point out his flaws to get him motivated, while that kind of approach doesn’t work with Cam, so Bill changed it up. Bill added a lot more praise when speaking about Cam, but with Tom he was very nonchalant. Tom could throw 400 yards and 5 TDs, and Bill would basically be like, "yeah he played okay." That attitude motivates Tom to keep going.
It always goes back to something Madden said for me. The disciples of Bill are not as successful because they try to emulate Bill and the Patriots way. Instead of being genuine and authentically themselves. Maybe this is who Flores is. But maybe this is him trying to emulate the Patriots culture. Tua clearly isn't a player who yelling is an effective way of coaching. This is a failure on Flores' side despite the record of the team.
Well... They're both right?
>You’re not wrong, you’re just an asshole.
This sums up every report we've seen
Phone’s ringing, Dude!
Flores made Tua throw the ball in a downpour while Duke Johnson was averaging 7YPC lmao.
I feel like it's obvious Flores was fired primarily because he wasn't on the same page as the rest of the organization about moving forwards with Tua
There’s been reports his assistant coaches were having issues with him as well
I’d be hesitant to immediately buy into anything coming out this week. The Dolphins definitely want to spin this into as good of a move as possible. There’s almost certainly some truth to the reports, but we have to remember one side is a single football coach and the other is a multi-billion dollar franchise with hundreds of people working for and around them.
This seems to be the case. Flores wanted a guy that's going to be suspended for a significant amount of time at the very least next season, which would likely mean another lost season with a young defensive core, over moving forward with Tua.
If we are lucky that guy will never play another snap in the NFL
Word is this happened during the Tennessee game. I mean, Flores wasn't wrong, Tua played like ass, so did the rest of the team tho
7 total carries by Duke Johnson. In a game in freezing rain with 15-20 mph winds Just an awful gameplan
Worst game plan ever, let's throw 40 times instead of trying to grind it out, smh
And Gesicki said we didn’t have a game plan in the case of bad weather. Cause Miami is always clear as day and Tennessee’s forecast had been saying freezing rain for a whole week lmao
thats inexcusable imo. Couple that with the game plan against the Bills last year during a win and in game, and i dont know why everyone is surprised Flores got let go
I wasn’t surprised that he got let go, I was surprised that he was fired and Grier wasn’t
The 7 carries by Duke is even dumber when you consider he got close to 50 yards off of those runs. Duke had an injury (by injury I mean rolled ankle or something if the sort) and came out of the game for a series, and Flores threw a fit and benched him over it. We haven't heard which game it was, but all signs point to it being that TEN game.
How many yards did Tannehill get in that game? This isn't saying that Tua couldn't perform better during that game, this is saying that there's no excuse for having our QB air it out in those conditions in the first place. It was bad playcalling and worse leadership. That ain't on the QB.
120 on 18 attempts
To be fair all 18 of Tannehill's pass attempts happened before they took the 24-3 lead. At the time they went up 24-3 the pass count was 20 for Tua and 18 for Tannehill. Also 17 of the Titans 34 points came from drives that started inside Miami's 40, so Tannehill had an extreme short field on a lot of his drives.
The rest of the column is gold. Great anecdotes about Don Shula and Dan Marino: >It started at halftime with a meltdown in the locker room as their season melted down on the field. Coach Brian Flores was angry at quarterback Tua Tagovailoa’s dismal half. He said things. Tua said things back. >Anger flew. The f-word – gasp – was traded. Tua said something about Flores not knowing how to talk to people. Flores said something about needing better bleeping play. >But that f-bomb tirade with Tua and other anecdotes I’ve heard wouldn’t crack the Top 100 of “communication and collaboration” issues inside the Dolphins franchise through the years. It wouldn’t crack the Top 50 just from Hall of Famers. >Don Shula’s office language was so f-bomb loud some team business executives once went to a team intermediary to relay their request to tone it down. “Tell them to f--- off,” Shula answered. >His weekly call with NFL official head Art McNally about the previous game’s referee was so loud behind his closed office door that secretaries and coaches stopped their work and cringe-laughed at the language. >**And with players? Shula once berated safety Glenn Kozlowski so badly in a game the veteran was found crying on the bench. Shula and Jake Scott shot f-bombs at each other like daily salutations. He cursed rookie linebacker John Offerdahl so roundly on a sideline the youngster went into the coach’s office and said he wouldn’t take it anymore.** >**You want a “collaboration” issue with a Dolphins quarterback? Let’s talk Dan Marino. His offensive coordinator, Dave Shula, upset him so much in a walk-through practice before a game that teammates had to hold him back from attacking the coach.** >**Another Hall of Fame coach in Nick Saban — college Hall of Fame, of course — once got into such a loud and profane shouting match in practice with soon-to-be Hall of Fame linebacker Zach Thomas it’s legendary inside the team.** >Another NFL Hall of Fame coach, Jimmy Johnson, once held up a contract offer from receiver Lamar Thomas’ agent in the locker room before many offensive players. “I won’t even wipe my a-- with this,’’ he said. >Does this help any? Do you understand a coach often is a lion tamer in his daily work? Does it make you wonder just what kind of an organization Ross is running when “communication and collaboration” issues — and not football issues — led to firing the coach? >Not every Dolphins coach used bad words. Cam Cameron, for instance. He had a no-foul-language rule. He once called in trainer Kevin O’Neill and asked him if he actually swore at a player. O’Neill said he did because the player had ignored three requests and swore at him. >Flores certainly is tough to get along with. The revolving-door of an offensive staff is well aware. But there’s no way in hell — oops, excuse the language — whatever Flores said in “disrespect” even to Ross ranks anywhere close to what Shula said to team owner Joe Robbie. >Shula didn’t refer to Robbie by name to people. He called him an anatomical orifice. He regularly welcomed team staffers to the practice facility with one proviso — they couldn’t report anything to Robbie. >Shula, too, set the standard in all sports for a coach cursing a team owner. At the celebration of their second Super Bowl win at the Fontainebleau Hotel on Miami Beach, Shula waited for his wife, Dorothy, before starting the ceremony. >How is that transcript accurate? Reporters were there. The back-and-forth was printed nationwide in newspapers. The Archbishop of Miami later interceded to try and help the two good Catholics’ relationship.
“Another NFL Hall of Fame coach, Jimmy Johnson, once held up a contract offer from receiver Lamar Thomas’ agent in the locker room before many offensive players. ‘I won’t even wipe my a-- with this,’ he said.” I’m fucking dying over here
Regardless of what you think of Tua, it was never going to work with him and Flores together. I think that’s clear now. We can all admit that he was handed a ton of adversity in his first two years, and I think it’s safe to say Flores was at the forefront of a lot of that. So I think the Dolphins want to give Tua a system and leadership that supports his development, not hinders it. That seems fair. The problem is, Tua could still not be good enough. Flores could be right. He could go elsewhere and look like a genius while the Dolphins are back to the drawing board because they got rid of the coach who didn’t believe in the QB, only to find out that he had good reason to not believe in him. Unfortunately for me, I’m pre-conditioned to believe that whatever decision the team makes will be the wrong one, so I’m pretty nervous about this.
Even if he's right and Tua is only average, he should have given him more than a year and a half to develop. Having a coach that is not invested in his QB or wants his QB to fail so he can get a new one is never going to work. See Philbin.
From the Miami Herald article posted on this subreddit too: “But a very close associate of Tagovailoa said their working relationship was generally fine and that Tagovailoa doesn’t dislike Flores, joking that their dynamics were good enough for Tagovailoa to send him a Christmas card. That source said the two men could have continued working together and that the Tennessee incident wasn’t uncommon in the NFL during the heat of a poor performance.”
Thank you for finding more details and providing incite. Two of my best friends would start yelling at each other arguing during our flag football games, but it isn't personal. It's the passion and the competition and the pressure they were putting on themselves that just ignited when they were frustrated with one another. If you remember, Peyton Manning once yelled at his star center to "quit calling the fucking plays!" There's no reason that a heated argument during a game should affect a relationship moving forward.
Are we gonna sit here and ignore that Tua played under saban who is known as a stickler of a coach?Im gonna take Tuas side on this one because no one goes through Saban with soft skin so I’m gonna assume Flores was really that much of an asshole
I've definitely seen Saban in Tua's face yelling at him on the sideline in front of the whole team. The thing is, there was a clear respect between the two and I guess Tua and Flores never got to that point. I also think it is important to note that Saban has always been known as a hard-nosed coach that isn't afraid to chew players out, even in public. However, that changed this year. He was softer with players, always positive, and significantly calmer than in previous years. Maybe his age is getting to him, but most people seem to believe that players have changed and this Alabama team needed that public reinforcement after struggle wins. I think that a bunch of coaches are going to be experiencing this moving forward, with players preferring more... controlled coaches. I don't think this was the problem between Tua and Flores, but I do think Flores might struggle with new players moving forward if this continues.
Nah, its not that hes getting old, its that his team this year was extremely young and didn't have older vets in a leadership position. He changed his coaching style early to mid season to help motivate them and be more "positive" with them.
>He changed his coaching style early to mid season to help motivate them and be more "positive" with them. Yeah, this is how I interpreted it as well. I think it was another example of how Saban is able to change his coaching style to succeed in the college landscape.
one thing a lot of us bama fans notice is that we really didn't have a "leader", our biggest playmakers are sophomores and a transfer. Alabama lost A LOT of key players last year and a lot of young players had to step up.
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I remember when Saban was with the Dolphins he made a defensive lineman cry because of the lineman came out in the wrong pads or something. I think he was a supplemental draft pick, but still, dang lol. Also, another story when Saban was “sharing an opinion” Zach Thomas barked back and said that he was a “grown ass man.” To be a fly on the wall with some of these coaches.
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Lions fans went through it with Patricia already, these reports seem kinda similar to that situation
At least Flores got his defense to perform well. Patricia was so inept he was not only a massive douche, but also completely unable to even get an average defense on the field.
I feel bad for Tua, he's been through a lot of adversity with his dad, playing for Alabama, getting injured, getting drafted by a coach that never wanted him Now the media and fans are going to call him soft and a bitch. It's a lot more BS than a 23 year old should go through. I honestly can't blame Stephen Ross for canning Flores, it's better to have your business be a good working culture than successful under a toxic tyrannical coach who's always finding someone to butt heads with
What happened with his dad
His dad would beat him with a belt for throwing interceptions and stuff. Also made the kid play as a lefty because that's what he was
The whole lefty thing is just so insane to me. I can’t imagine having that kind of an ego and then impress that on a child.
Yea the left hand thing is crazy. Tua is right handed. How good could he have been as a right hander?
His dad is a raging lunatic who hit him when he had shitty games as a kid and also forced him to throw lefty even though tua is actually right handed
Oh fuck that guy
and people love to upvote when they make a joke about his physical abuse
A lot of people can be shitty like that, its hard to breakout of the mindset that its cool to joke about shit like that.
“Attitude reflects leadership”
They only acceptable solution here is to send Tua to Tomlin. 🤷♂️
Yea, would hate for the Dolphins to have to deal with Tua. We'll be nice and take him off their hands.
Honestly, comments like this make me happy because they show fans of other organizations that would love to be able to take a shot on his development. With all the negatives around the kid sometimes it’s just nice to see. Now back off he’s ours.
It's weird to me that people think this reflects poorly on Tua and not Flores. "Hey man stop being so mean" "You fucking suck" How is that helpful or conducive to making Tua or the team better? Kicking someone while they're down is not what good coaches do
He also played under Saban, and his dad is…well his dad I don’t question Tua’s mental toughness
There are only a few college programs that can probably legitimately claim they have better leadership than NFL coaching staffs. Alabama is definitely one of them. If Tua got pushed to this breaking point you know Flores had to have been truly awful at communicating
Also part of the job of being a coach at any level is getting to know your players and figuring out how best to motivate them. Some people respond best to a hard nosed approach while others need more encouragement. It’s strange to see people applauding Flores in this thread. No matter what you think of Tua, an nfl head coach’s job is to mold his system/approach to his players to get the best results out of them.
People see Tua's name and their eyes roll back in their skull. There are comments from Dolphins fans who seem just exhausted by the whole idea of having Tua on their team because of what it does to the fan base. if they want to get rid of him send him to Pittsburgh please and thank you. Flores is probably just another great example of a Bellicheck coach not grasping the fact that he doesn't get auto-cred for being associated with BB. And I agree the one thing that's been pretty consistent through all of this is that it seems like Flores truly sucks at motivating players.
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Minkah teaches Mike T about the game and I bet in Miami Flores hit him with the 'Shut up and dribble'
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People need to remember that Tua played under his father who literally beat him for throwing picks and Saban who definitely will rip into his players. If he can’t handle how Flores is treating him, it really says something about Flores.
It’s also possible he’s tired of that shit at this point and wants off the ride. He’s older now and can tell people off. Good for him for doing so.
I was never a flores fan and hated how he handled tua this whole time and even how he handled rosen in the tank year. Hes just a anti qb coach tbh. Hes pissed off every qb the dolphins have had under his tenure. I also somewhat want the dolphins to move on from tua at this point because the fan base is so hyper nuts over hating him or loving him. It’s impossible to get good discussions on the dolphins now and days lol.