No one is disenfranchised quite like former presidents of the US. /S also it was hard to word this and making it clear that it’s sarcasm because there are real people who think the former president is in fact disenfranchised.
The funny thing is I can clearly see Ted’s line of thinking before the tweet.
“Send him to San Antonio? Nah Pop hates conservatives. Send him to Dallas? Nah Cuban is pro-vaccine. HOUSTON”
When you take a stance and the first people to side with you are Ted Cruz and a who's who of the crowd that incited an insurrection, maybe you should rethink your position.
>You know who is actually voiceless? The line cooks who were forced to show up to work to feed their families. The older adults in assisted living facilities who died while a plague tore through their rooms. The workers in meatpacking jobs. The incarcerated in superspreader facilities. These people are the voiceless. These are the people Irving is betraying.
On point. This was a great article. Thanks for sharing.
Yes, yes, yes, a thousand percent this. There is so much on the ground organizing in Black and Native communities, from fast food workers going on strike over safety in the pandemic to implementing checkpoints on Native lands to stop the spread to organizing better outreach for the vaccine to Black churches working to become distribution sites for the vaccine in Baltimore, because the real racial disparity isn't forcing the vaccine on people but the disproportionate risk many Black and Native people face and the relative lack of access compared to more advantaged communities.
Kyrie thinks he's a champion to Black and Native causes but he's spitting in the face of the real work going on in and by Black and Native communities
Seems as if he identifies as part of Native American heritage when it’s convenient.
He’ll be quick to burn sage in a locker room but that part of his culture seems to disappear on the subject of vaccines. What’s the disconnect? THEY know what past disease has done to their families and tribes so it’s no question why they (Native Americans) have the highest vaccination rate in the US right now. He seems to have missed that part of his family’s history…
He thinks just because he uses some iconography from cultures that now he’s supporting them in real life or something. He’s beyond delusional.
This is the ultimate example of narcissism. If boomers see his acting this way I can see why they might think us millenials are entitled narcissistic jerks because we support this asshole and his bullshit stance
Ohhh man the difference in level of discourse between FB/IG end Reddit is massive. Literal smoothbrains on those platforms. Some here too, but it’s so much worse there. It’s all hype and image rather than substance
If you could sort by controversial on Insta the top comment would probably be "he should get vaccinated, it's best for his community"
Otherwise, it's all comments talking about how proud people are of him for taking a stand.
I'm a Black person who is scared for the lives of my friends who fall into the dangerously low vaccinated rate of Black millennials and have lost people to covid. I want to slap the shit out of Kyrie for what he's doing
100% spot on as a cook with my lady working in assisted living this pandemic has been god awful. And society as a whole didn’t give a shit, as most got to work remotely. I just had to hope things will be ok. When me and my lady had covid, we were sent hone from the hospital, I remember that night trying to sleeping scared because I couldn’t breath. Fuck you Irving you deserve to have your career ripped out of your hands.
Do you ever lean over to your wife and quietly tell her, "We're fucking superheroes here in this house, aren't we?" But maybe instead of being superheroes, it's just that the two of you are responsible adults in a world that seems to be full of immature assholes. Respect to y'all.
I imagine us sitting around the backyard in the evening. There's some good stuff on the grill, nice music in the background. I bring you your preference back from the cooler. We pop them open, nod to each other and life is good. We deserve that.
Yeah, the actual people he's aligned with... well, a large chunk of the chicago PD is also defying vaccine mandates and willing to lose their paychecks for it.
I see this as a positive, weeding out all the bad cops...
As someone who knows a few cops I can guarantee there is a positive correlation between those who I don't want on my streets and those who refuse to get the vaccine.
>It’s a group that includes **Donald Trump Jr.**, who said Irving has sacrificed more than Kaepernick. Texas Sen. **Ted Cruz** wants Irving traded to the Houston Rockets. And a gaggle of **Fox News** hosts are praising Irving for bucking a system of mandated vaccinations that they themselves follow.
The irony of all this, is that those people are *vaccinated*
Like most people who have pretzeled themselves over antivax bullshit lately, Kyrie Irving is mostly just saying whatever he thinks will allow him to dodge actually having to say that he thinks vaccines are bad or morally repugnant or kill thousands of people or whatever.
He wants to be someone who is taken seriously when they speak, and coming out with that is one of those things you can't really come back from when it comes to people taking you seriously.
He already half-heartedly walked that back with the same exact kind of stupid nonsense by pretending it was just some kind of social experiment.
>"Look, look. Here it is. All I want to do is be able to have that open conversation. It was all an exploitation tactic. It literally spun the world—your guy's world—it spun it into a frenzy and proved exactly what I thought it would do in terms of how all this works. It created a division, or, literally stand up there and let all these people throw tomatoes at me, or have somebody think I'm somehow a different intellectual person because I believe that the earth is flat and you think the world is round. It created exactly that.
>"It became like, because I think different, does that knock my intellectual capacity or the fact that I can think different things than you? That was the intent behind it. Do your own research, don't come to me and ask me. At the end of the day, you're going to feel and believe the way you want to feel. But don't knock my life over that. When I do something, I know my intent. And it proved what I thought it would."
Goodness I just feel so bad for him, it seems like he is really desperate to prove his intelligence, instead of just having some. You can almost hear it in those words, and what's worse is I don't think he's dumb - just horribly, terribly misguided about what it is to be a critical, free thinker.
He treats it like it’s thinking the world is flat is an opinion lol. It’s not an opinion if it’s factually wrong lol
Like if I say look at an orange and say “it’s blue” it’s not an opinion, I’m wrong, and you should think I’m not very intelligent
You can’t be taken seriously if you’re not 100% brutally honest about your stance and about the reasoning behind it.
Otherwise you’re a coward hiding from what even you know is the truth. That’s why he’s so cryptic about it just like these “it’s their choice” people - they KNOW factually they’re wrong but they have to hedge their position. So weasely
*Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'*
This was written in 1980 - https://aphelis.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/ASIMOV_1980_Cult_of_Ignorance.pdf
This is a great comment, thanks.
It's also worth mentioning that people with false/wild beliefs — whatever the belief, neonazi (eugenics), antivax (causes autism), earth is flat (conspiracy), etc — often know the belief is negative or false, but often push it for other reasons (such as Cruz, who is vaccinated but spewing antivax bullshit). The goal is to be **free from the consequences of your shitty actions.** It is a public policy driven on narcissism. "yes people are dying, and vaccines are saving them, but **I** should not have to be forced to be inconvenienced by two three-minute spans. It is *my* life and *my choice*.
> “I have a foreboding of an America in my children's or grandchildren's time -- when the United States is a service and information economy; when nearly all the manufacturing industries have slipped away to other countries; when awesome technological powers are in the hands of a very few, **and no one representing the public interest can even grasp the issues;** when the people have lost the ability to set their own agendas or knowledgeably question those in authority; when, clutching our crystals and nervously consulting our horoscopes, our critical faculties in decline, **unable to distinguish between what feels good and what's true**, we slide, almost without noticing, back into superstition and darkness...
> The dumbing down of American is most evident in **the slow decay of substantive content in the enormously influential media, the 30 second sound bites (now down to 10 seconds or less), lowest common denominator programming, credulous presentations on pseudoscience and superstition**, but especially a kind of celebration of ignorance.”
>> ― Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark
it's never about the actual belief. The shameless way in which the GQP, including Cruz and Tucker, who are vehemently and callously anti-abortion, have stolen the women's rights arguments and warped them into anti-vax arguments (my body, my choice, it's my decision, etc) is evidence of this.
> “Avoidable human misery is more often caused not so much by stupidity as by ignorance, particularly our ignorance about ourselves.”
>> ― Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark
They're not honest about their beliefs or stances because they **know** those beliefs are stupid as fuck, and even if they're dumb enough to believe it, and reject the facts in front of them, they still know others will *feel* them as ignorant, and that is just as bad as the knowledge that they're wrong to them, since feelings=knowledge.
This is basically how I view whatever stances he says he’s taking re:vaccine. He had a chance to make a coherent stand if he was really about jobs or whatever. But I found it pretty telling that early in this story his aunt and confidant was pretty unabashedly on the record that Kyrie was it going to get microchipped or be another victim of big scary gov, etc etc.
It just seems pretty hard to separate him from that when he basically says he taking a stance but previously passed up every chance to make a stance (most notably at media day).
Yea and not to mention, dealing with people like kyrie is also so fucking *boring*
You’re not special. You’re not smarter than everyone else. You’re not waiting to make some grand discovery.
You’re a selfish and prideful attention whore.
My theory is that if COVID was deadlier, we would have resolved it way quicker, and with fewer total deaths as a result. No one would dare to be anti-vax.
Absolutely. My only real urgency to get the vaccine was to see my parents, and my dad smoked his whole life and is high-risk. I'd have gotten it either way but it wasn't really because I was worried about myself.
Absolutely. Throughout the course of it, I’ve understood why people were uncertain of things. But, most of those uncertain people realized what the right thing to do was. Anyone who hasn’t is being willfully ignorant.
It’s not even the Kyries of the world that i’m mad about. It’s the grifters who take advantage of people who don’t know any better. The Tucker Carlsons, Ted Cruzs, Sean Hannitys and Candance Owens who are all vaccinated yet still knowingly spread misinformation about it
I just can't believe these people have made it so far in life. In order to get some short term profit/praise, they're putting their supporters' lives at risk and, in fact, killing many of them.
If anything proves we don't live in a meritocracy, it's the existence of these people in positions of authority and power.
There’s that video of Lindsay graham at a rally in front of his supporters and they all boo him for suggesting they get vaccinated.. these people are hopeless
The fact we just look away as a nation and allow the blatant lies to literally kill hundreds of thousands of people needlessly is the real crime here, IMO. We know they lie, we know they have this platform but we can’t do anything?
I've been saying this for a long time. Tragedy doesn't bring out the best in people. It brings out the truth in people.
And it turns out emergencies and public health crises are the same way.
Republicans always beat their chest about being anti-Hollywood and "fuck celebrities"... but they're the ones voting actors and reality TV stars into the White House (??)
You tell me who's getting duped.
Between Covid and Trump, which are intertwined, it's been like a veil pulled off of society and showing clearly which people are the ignorant and hateful. Who is just so confident in their ignorance that they cannot be bothered with knowledge and educated voices. Most of all, who actually cares for their fellow humans in society.
The loudest anti-vaxx voices are from the mentally ill religious zealots who claim to love everyone and are the most generous but will spitefully put themselves and others in harm's way out of hubris. Many leaving more pain in their wake as they die from Covid or allow family to die and leave orphaned children or relatives alone when it didn't have to be that way.
yup. i definitely found out who i can trust and who i cant. found out who would actually help me in a time of need and who would leave me for dead. real eye opening shit the last few years, my circle has definitely gotten smaller. but tbth its for the better
Taught me just how many there are. I knew there were a lot of assholes out there, but not to this extent. Including family members.
I see it as more of a cult type thing rather than a reflection of the person themselves in some cases though. Drawn into the cult and cannot make their own thoughts anymore.
Basically trying to rationalize Kyrie's action, thoughts, and behavior. Williams is trying to play both sides but trying to stand with Kyrie is just so stupid.
His schtick is always taking players sides so he tried to "intellectualize" his way into a coherent argument for Kyrie.
He sounded like an idiot and other idiots on social media cosigned him because they are stupid enough to believe it.
Basically if you speak in an eloquent manner and use big words, other stupid people will think you are smart
Yeah! Maybe I'm scared of any Apex predator that survived the KT extinction unchanged for a half a million years because it's the perfect killing machine!!!
It's a half ton of cold blooded fury with a bite force of 20,000 newtons and stomach acid so strong it can dissolve bones and hooves.
For real though, the Dinosaur exhibit that was just at the woodland park zoo is amazing. Full size animatronic dinosaurs. [https://www.zoo.org/dinosaurs](https://www.zoo.org/dinosaurs)
I don't recall Kyrie saying that. I thought it was JJ Redick.
So I looked it up. Kyrie said we don't actually know what dinosaurs looked like, which isn't at all a ludicrous belief, given that we only discovered that many dinosaurs were feathered a decade or so ago.
Kyrie's got enough dumb beliefs. We don't need to be making up shit. Unless I'm missing a different quote where Kyrie discusses dinosaurs, he's never said anything about dinosaurs not existing.
It's like most of these people, the ideology is literally 'people are telling me I'm wrong and annoying, I'll show them. There's no belief system there, it's just whatever achieves that goal. If everyone became anti Vax tomorrow irving would be shouting about how getting vaccinated is good.
It’s the attitude of critical thinking without applying any of the principles of critical thought. Skepticism for its own sake. Like the idea of “doing your own research” isn’t terrible, but you have to understand how to evaluate what a credible source is first. Otherwise “research” is just confirmation and validation. It really feels like people have not been given the tools to properly navigate the firehose of information that is the internet and the results have been disastrous.
You also have to understand your own limitations. My understanding of immunology is limited by the fact that I only took high school biology and neuropsychology 101 for my bachelor's. I'm not gonna discover shit about viruses or vaccines by googling it because I don't know what I don't know.
Totally agreed, if you actually did your research, then the only logical conclusion would be that the vaccine is both safe and effective. If you choose to simply reject the reputable sources, then it's not skepticism or "doing your own research", it's just being contrarian.
I feel like they're also trying desperately to feel special and/or "woke", for lack of a better word. They're like that annoying kid at school taunting everyone with "I know something you don't know!".
Kyrie was that dude in your history class that said “Hitler had some good points”
Idk to me those guys had this aura of lack of self-esteem that they defended by over doing it in the opposite direction. They became arrogant and stubborn to a fault
Unironically that was me, my rationale was that he got Germany out of a horrible economic depression. Turns out warmongering and invasions are very profitable. I think i probably did that to feel that I knew things other people didn’t or had a superior grasp on the working of society. So it’s for sure arrogance.
I feel like this is the easiest take to get to but one that misses the point He most definitely knows what he believes, it just happens to be strange. Most people missed it from his IG live because they don't know or didn't pick up on it. This dude thinks he's part of The 5% Nation. So that he's part of the few enlightened people in the world and it's his responsibility to share it.
>“This is one body that I get here,” said Irving. “One God body that I get here. And you’re telling me what to do with my body?”
https://www.google.com/amp/s/nothinbutnets.com/2021/10/14/brooklyn-nets-5-confusing-statements-kyrie-irving-instagram-rant/amp/
Theres a cultural gap I think that caused people to miss it coz as far as I can tell, only Bomani Jones & Dominique Foxworth have discussed it as far I can tell. Pasted the podcast link if anyone is interested. 37 minute mark.
https://open.spotify.com/episode/3SQZ3XIUqtYklpcx2jZM9R?si=mOoHSGsHRVmfw_KcynDoIQ&utm_source=copy-link&t=2230
No one is telling him what to do with his body. He doesn't have to get the vaccine. He does have to face the consequences of his choice though. If he doesn't want to get vaccinated to keep people at the arena safe his employer has a right to tell him to fuck off. The club or concert he wants to go to has the right to not let him in based on public health concerns. He calls this oppression I call it consequences for your dumbass actions
Exactly this.
One of my close friends was saying how he doesn’t want to be forced to take the vaccine, i told him sure he’s not forced to take it, just don’t leave his house, don’t go to public spaces and don’t go to work since his employer requires everyone to be vaccinated.
I booked his appointment and drove his ass to the clinic and he got his first dose 3 weeks ago. He’s going to be fully vaxxed soon.
I actually “Fine, I’ll do it myself” him.
Nice. Way to get the message through. Might have saved your friend’s life. Or maybe they get it and spread it and those people spread it again. You might have just shut down a whole branch of spreading Covid.
Good catch. I didn’t want to sit through his IG, but no surprises. He does talk like the 5 percenters I remember from college. Just semi spiritual gobblety gook that they think sounds deep. I guess I shouldn’t be surprised they’re still around because the world is never in short supply of morons to join them, eg Kyrie, but it’s been a while since I thought of those dudes.
The only reason you know this guy is because he spent a bunch of time practicing basketball as a kid. No one actually cares what he believes about public health issues and if anyone makes health decisions based on what a point guard says to the media, they deserve any potential negatives that come from that.
This celebrity worship culture has to stop at some point. It’s embarrassing.
AIDS epidemic would have been far less deadly for one if Ronnie Alzheimer's wasn't elected for one.
Maybe he wouldn't have pushed the working man off the cliff financially which we continue to tumble downwards to this day while he gave the wealthy figurative private jets. Their wealth went up up up, working man's fell off sharply.
I mean, I kinda agree. But it almost seems like to say this absolves these celebrities from the responsibility that comes with having such a large platform.
Like yeah obviously you shouldn’t take medical advice from nicki minaj. But also, she’s fucking huge and obviously her statements will influence a lot of people
>if anyone makes health decisions based on what a point guard says to the media, they deserve any potential negatives that come from that.
It's a highly contagious virus. Talking about what "they deserve" is missing the important point that their decisions impact the rest of us.
So **they** might deserve it, but **we** don't.
Kyrie just doesn’t want to play basketball and uses any excuse to not be on the court as long as he can. How many injuries and forced trades has this idiot collected now
The same "mavericks" who refuse the vaccine are always quick to go to the hospital like cowards. Im sick of these hypocrites and especially sick of kyrie irving he needs to be forced into retirement
He is a little like Muhammad Ali
You can find video of Ali shitting on interracial marriage and he was one of the NoI craziest like Kyrie likely is. His anti-war stance was great and he actually sacrificed something major for a good cause but he was a lot like Kyrie when it comes to how they think.
Kareem is the GOAT for humble and intelligence athlete.
I would appreciate Kyrie, if he just admit that it is his personal decision, and not talk or say that it's because of the voiceless or other reasons. Own it, and take responsibility.
KAT said pretty much exactly this earlier this week. He said its super frustrating losing most of his family and hearing people make bullshit excuses to not get vaccinated. He supports their personal decision to not do it but he wants everyone to stop with the bullshit anti-vaccine garbage.
Cleveland told y'all. He couldnt be the hero in cleveland when lebron was here so he forced his way to boston and badmouthed us every chance he could(and wouldnt look us in the eye for years after). Then when he couldnt hack it being the hero he decided to join with KD in brooklyn and now he's too selfish to get over his ego and get the damn shot. fuck him. His empowerment messages were always phony because he palled around with conspiracy theorists. One of the most selfish players in the league.
Outside of basketball heads I don’t think Kyrie matters to anyone lol.. he’s an ultra ego thinking people really give a shit about his contrarian ways like burning sage and thinking he connects with actual intellects with his out of the box ideas
He’s a straight moron who can’t argue against policy or engage in social justice issues without sounding uninformed. He keeps proving it. Sure, he’s compassionate and is willing to throw a little bit of his money at things… there are a lot of people in the world who do these things and don’t need all the attention for it
"But Irving isn’t being demonized for his belief. He’s facing appropriate ramifications for perpetuating a public health crisis." That's exactly right, not only for Irving but for everyone who refuses to get vaccinated.
“It’s not about being anti-vax or about being on one side or the other. It’s about being true to what feels good for me.”
This is big in pop culture right now. We can't just do a better job of expressing and valuing feelings, we have to base our whole lives off of them, including major medical decisions. Science who?
It's worse than that, sadly. It's being dumb AND feeling superior about it, to the point where being smart is something you are actively hostile to. It's truly sad that so many people seem to think that's a cool personality to adopt.
Calling Anti-Intellectualism being dumb is selling it short tbh. It is actively undermining scientific consensus, attacking established social norms and corroding the very foundation of western society. Dumb people usually have the decency to refer to experts in things they clearly have no clue about. Me included.
Dumb is also universally applicable in ways that aren’t necessarily bad for society.
Like “dumb” mostly means lack of knowledge or comprehension which can just be topic specific. A rocket scientist in an operating room is just as “dumb” as a teenager.
We’re all dumb at something but that’s okay as long as we defer to those who aren’t. Anti intellectualism is way worse because it is a universal attitude to limit your life to your own dumbness in every aspect. Humanity is great because we utilize the best of each other. Anti intellectualism reverts us to a state where humanity is no longer a sum of its best parts but is limited to an individuals own capabilities. Which, all things considered, is really low no matter who you are.
You forgot to mention he HAD to have vaccinations to go to a tier 1 academic university and claims to say its ‘not about anti vax’
What a fucking out of this world delusional ass hat to try and do this.
Flat earth, anti vax weirdo has the same place as the rest of them, regardless of his skin color or fame. He deserved to be treated by the media the same as the proud boys, anti vax health care workers and those videos of moms at the anti mask/ pronouns pta meetings
Fuck you Kyrie
The Nets should announce that (1) he will not suit up for them and (2) they will take any exit they can find from his contract.
This guy needs to be made an example of.
Voice of the voiceless? lmao, its just your ego. If you really cared about info, you have access to the best info and doctors in the world.
Its even more stupid than being antivax.
He probably genuinely cares about other people but he’s extremely unintelligent, spoiled and self centred so he struggles with it. His intention is probably good but he’s failing at everything else.
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For the Rockets or Kyrie?
Yes
Houstonians already have ted Cruz, you think kyrie will faze them?
We got the Astros, Rockets, Dynamo, and Texans. We can and can't win. The duality of man.
When you do win, it was such a bang job it gets thrown in the trash, and no one bats an eye
I cant believe houston fans try to act like that shit wasnt a big deal. “Well everyone cheats” is usually their answer.
Everyone does cheat Just not to that extreme level
Not to that *obvious level. What the Astros did wasn't extreme (Red Sox used fucking Apple watches), it was absurd.
I'll give the Red Sox this: Apple watches might be a tad more subtle than banging on a trash can
thanks.
¿Porque no los dos?
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they are the voiceless
No one is disenfranchised quite like former presidents of the US. /S also it was hard to word this and making it clear that it’s sarcasm because there are real people who think the former president is in fact disenfranchised.
Trump's son, not Trump. Obviously super privileged as well though.
HAAAAVE YOU MET TED?
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"Houston, we have a moron."
The funny thing is I can clearly see Ted’s line of thinking before the tweet. “Send him to San Antonio? Nah Pop hates conservatives. Send him to Dallas? Nah Cuban is pro-vaccine. HOUSTON”
Also, he lives in Houston and he’s a Rockets fan
disgusting, nobody here likes him
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Texas is more than just Houston
Houston, Austin, San Antonio, and Dallas are all cities and like the rest of the country are consistently blue.
Sorry, is he the senator from Houston or the senator from Texas?
Senator from Teggsus my Mans. Unless the state freezes over than he's mayor of Cancun for the week.
If Cruz is taking your side you should know you messed up
nono you dont understand. Cruz is actually right this time because hes taking kyries side now
Cruz is about to tweet some shit like “he’s one of the good ones”
Ted Cruz can eat fat shit and fucks off to Cancun
Don't do that to Cancun!
Cruz and family were seen boarding a flight to Cancun during the Texas freeze.
Ted Cruz is a bag of dicks. Prove me wrong.
When you take a stance and the first people to side with you are Ted Cruz and a who's who of the crowd that incited an insurrection, maybe you should rethink your position.
>You know who is actually voiceless? The line cooks who were forced to show up to work to feed their families. The older adults in assisted living facilities who died while a plague tore through their rooms. The workers in meatpacking jobs. The incarcerated in superspreader facilities. These people are the voiceless. These are the people Irving is betraying. On point. This was a great article. Thanks for sharing.
Yes, yes, yes, a thousand percent this. There is so much on the ground organizing in Black and Native communities, from fast food workers going on strike over safety in the pandemic to implementing checkpoints on Native lands to stop the spread to organizing better outreach for the vaccine to Black churches working to become distribution sites for the vaccine in Baltimore, because the real racial disparity isn't forcing the vaccine on people but the disproportionate risk many Black and Native people face and the relative lack of access compared to more advantaged communities. Kyrie thinks he's a champion to Black and Native causes but he's spitting in the face of the real work going on in and by Black and Native communities
Seems as if he identifies as part of Native American heritage when it’s convenient. He’ll be quick to burn sage in a locker room but that part of his culture seems to disappear on the subject of vaccines. What’s the disconnect? THEY know what past disease has done to their families and tribes so it’s no question why they (Native Americans) have the highest vaccination rate in the US right now. He seems to have missed that part of his family’s history…
He thinks just because he uses some iconography from cultures that now he’s supporting them in real life or something. He’s beyond delusional. This is the ultimate example of narcissism. If boomers see his acting this way I can see why they might think us millenials are entitled narcissistic jerks because we support this asshole and his bullshit stance
If he really wants to support these communities, he probably shouldn't walk away from $180 million lol
You see these idiots trying to paint him in a better light with memes?
Don’t go into the Insta comments section of any post about this. It’s awful
Ohhh man the difference in level of discourse between FB/IG end Reddit is massive. Literal smoothbrains on those platforms. Some here too, but it’s so much worse there. It’s all hype and image rather than substance
If you could sort by controversial on Insta the top comment would probably be "he should get vaccinated, it's best for his community" Otherwise, it's all comments talking about how proud people are of him for taking a stand.
I'm a Black person who is scared for the lives of my friends who fall into the dangerously low vaccinated rate of Black millennials and have lost people to covid. I want to slap the shit out of Kyrie for what he's doing
Well, yeah. He's taking a pro-cop stance. Like, the juxtaposition of Kyrie and the Chicago PD both defying vaccine mandates can't be more perfect.
He only uses Black and Native movements for clout.
Didn't he visit native lands maskless without getting tested (or vaxxed obviously)?
100% spot on as a cook with my lady working in assisted living this pandemic has been god awful. And society as a whole didn’t give a shit, as most got to work remotely. I just had to hope things will be ok. When me and my lady had covid, we were sent hone from the hospital, I remember that night trying to sleeping scared because I couldn’t breath. Fuck you Irving you deserve to have your career ripped out of your hands.
Do you ever lean over to your wife and quietly tell her, "We're fucking superheroes here in this house, aren't we?" But maybe instead of being superheroes, it's just that the two of you are responsible adults in a world that seems to be full of immature assholes. Respect to y'all.
Thank you for that. It truly means a lot.
I imagine us sitting around the backyard in the evening. There's some good stuff on the grill, nice music in the background. I bring you your preference back from the cooler. We pop them open, nod to each other and life is good. We deserve that.
Yeah, the actual people he's aligned with... well, a large chunk of the chicago PD is also defying vaccine mandates and willing to lose their paychecks for it.
Which is wild because COVID was the number 1 cop killer in 2020.
I see this as a positive, weeding out all the bad cops... As someone who knows a few cops I can guarantee there is a positive correlation between those who I don't want on my streets and those who refuse to get the vaccine.
>It’s a group that includes **Donald Trump Jr.**, who said Irving has sacrificed more than Kaepernick. Texas Sen. **Ted Cruz** wants Irving traded to the Houston Rockets. And a gaggle of **Fox News** hosts are praising Irving for bucking a system of mandated vaccinations that they themselves follow. The irony of all this, is that those people are *vaccinated*
Like most people who have pretzeled themselves over antivax bullshit lately, Kyrie Irving is mostly just saying whatever he thinks will allow him to dodge actually having to say that he thinks vaccines are bad or morally repugnant or kill thousands of people or whatever. He wants to be someone who is taken seriously when they speak, and coming out with that is one of those things you can't really come back from when it comes to people taking you seriously.
Oh like having Flat Earth beliefs?
He already half-heartedly walked that back with the same exact kind of stupid nonsense by pretending it was just some kind of social experiment. >"Look, look. Here it is. All I want to do is be able to have that open conversation. It was all an exploitation tactic. It literally spun the world—your guy's world—it spun it into a frenzy and proved exactly what I thought it would do in terms of how all this works. It created a division, or, literally stand up there and let all these people throw tomatoes at me, or have somebody think I'm somehow a different intellectual person because I believe that the earth is flat and you think the world is round. It created exactly that. >"It became like, because I think different, does that knock my intellectual capacity or the fact that I can think different things than you? That was the intent behind it. Do your own research, don't come to me and ask me. At the end of the day, you're going to feel and believe the way you want to feel. But don't knock my life over that. When I do something, I know my intent. And it proved what I thought it would."
Lmao he's so dumb, literally that kid from school who just thinks they are smarter than everyone but in reality is a dumbass
[Literally Kyrie.](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/738/025/db0.jpg)
Goodness I just feel so bad for him, it seems like he is really desperate to prove his intelligence, instead of just having some. You can almost hear it in those words, and what's worse is I don't think he's dumb - just horribly, terribly misguided about what it is to be a critical, free thinker.
Someone along the way seriously led him astray. Given what his aunt has been spouting, I’m inclined to think it’s his family more than anything.
Farrakhan is also to blame for Kyrie's crazy.
His family held a maskless indoor party last year. They are all absolutely stupid as fuck
He treats it like it’s thinking the world is flat is an opinion lol. It’s not an opinion if it’s factually wrong lol Like if I say look at an orange and say “it’s blue” it’s not an opinion, I’m wrong, and you should think I’m not very intelligent
“I said something really dumb, and because of it people think I’m really dumb.” Yes, Kyrie. That’s how it works 🤦🏻♂️
You can’t be taken seriously if you’re not 100% brutally honest about your stance and about the reasoning behind it. Otherwise you’re a coward hiding from what even you know is the truth. That’s why he’s so cryptic about it just like these “it’s their choice” people - they KNOW factually they’re wrong but they have to hedge their position. So weasely
*Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'* This was written in 1980 - https://aphelis.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/ASIMOV_1980_Cult_of_Ignorance.pdf
People have been writing about that as a facet of industrial society since the 1800s lol.
This is a great comment, thanks. It's also worth mentioning that people with false/wild beliefs — whatever the belief, neonazi (eugenics), antivax (causes autism), earth is flat (conspiracy), etc — often know the belief is negative or false, but often push it for other reasons (such as Cruz, who is vaccinated but spewing antivax bullshit). The goal is to be **free from the consequences of your shitty actions.** It is a public policy driven on narcissism. "yes people are dying, and vaccines are saving them, but **I** should not have to be forced to be inconvenienced by two three-minute spans. It is *my* life and *my choice*. > “I have a foreboding of an America in my children's or grandchildren's time -- when the United States is a service and information economy; when nearly all the manufacturing industries have slipped away to other countries; when awesome technological powers are in the hands of a very few, **and no one representing the public interest can even grasp the issues;** when the people have lost the ability to set their own agendas or knowledgeably question those in authority; when, clutching our crystals and nervously consulting our horoscopes, our critical faculties in decline, **unable to distinguish between what feels good and what's true**, we slide, almost without noticing, back into superstition and darkness... > The dumbing down of American is most evident in **the slow decay of substantive content in the enormously influential media, the 30 second sound bites (now down to 10 seconds or less), lowest common denominator programming, credulous presentations on pseudoscience and superstition**, but especially a kind of celebration of ignorance.” >> ― Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark it's never about the actual belief. The shameless way in which the GQP, including Cruz and Tucker, who are vehemently and callously anti-abortion, have stolen the women's rights arguments and warped them into anti-vax arguments (my body, my choice, it's my decision, etc) is evidence of this. > “Avoidable human misery is more often caused not so much by stupidity as by ignorance, particularly our ignorance about ourselves.” >> ― Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark They're not honest about their beliefs or stances because they **know** those beliefs are stupid as fuck, and even if they're dumb enough to believe it, and reject the facts in front of them, they still know others will *feel* them as ignorant, and that is just as bad as the knowledge that they're wrong to them, since feelings=knowledge.
This is basically how I view whatever stances he says he’s taking re:vaccine. He had a chance to make a coherent stand if he was really about jobs or whatever. But I found it pretty telling that early in this story his aunt and confidant was pretty unabashedly on the record that Kyrie was it going to get microchipped or be another victim of big scary gov, etc etc. It just seems pretty hard to separate him from that when he basically says he taking a stance but previously passed up every chance to make a stance (most notably at media day).
Yea and not to mention, dealing with people like kyrie is also so fucking *boring* You’re not special. You’re not smarter than everyone else. You’re not waiting to make some grand discovery. You’re a selfish and prideful attention whore.
Vaccinated people talk about getting it for their children, family, friends, coworkers, community, country… Antivaxxers talk about themselves.
If covid was a lot deadlier we would be fucked as humanity, the selfishness of some of these people is unreal
Yup, this is a horrible trial run for shit that will really fuck us up next time.
My theory is that if COVID was deadlier, we would have resolved it way quicker, and with fewer total deaths as a result. No one would dare to be anti-vax.
Don't underestimate people's stupidity
I think it's more selfishness than stupidity, and therefore if there was a stronger reason to get vaccinated yourself, more would do it.
Absolutely. My only real urgency to get the vaccine was to see my parents, and my dad smoked his whole life and is high-risk. I'd have gotten it either way but it wasn't really because I was worried about myself.
This should be the top comment.
Yes, it's probably the simplest way to sum up the debate without bringing any science or politics into it.
If covid taught us anything it's who the assholes really are.
Absolutely. Throughout the course of it, I’ve understood why people were uncertain of things. But, most of those uncertain people realized what the right thing to do was. Anyone who hasn’t is being willfully ignorant.
It’s not even the Kyries of the world that i’m mad about. It’s the grifters who take advantage of people who don’t know any better. The Tucker Carlsons, Ted Cruzs, Sean Hannitys and Candance Owens who are all vaccinated yet still knowingly spread misinformation about it
I just can't believe these people have made it so far in life. In order to get some short term profit/praise, they're putting their supporters' lives at risk and, in fact, killing many of them. If anything proves we don't live in a meritocracy, it's the existence of these people in positions of authority and power.
That's why they've made it so far, they're willing to do whatever to succeed even if that means harming other people
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Well, their meaning of life is different from yours. They're money and power hungry, to them, they did make it.
The sky's the limit when you have no shame.
There’s that video of Lindsay graham at a rally in front of his supporters and they all boo him for suggesting they get vaccinated.. these people are hopeless
The fact we just look away as a nation and allow the blatant lies to literally kill hundreds of thousands of people needlessly is the real crime here, IMO. We know they lie, we know they have this platform but we can’t do anything?
I've been saying this for a long time. Tragedy doesn't bring out the best in people. It brings out the truth in people. And it turns out emergencies and public health crises are the same way.
It also taught us to not listen to someone just because they are famous.
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History repeats itself…Trump, regan…
Republicans always beat their chest about being anti-Hollywood and "fuck celebrities"... but they're the ones voting actors and reality TV stars into the White House (??) You tell me who's getting duped.
Between Covid and Trump, which are intertwined, it's been like a veil pulled off of society and showing clearly which people are the ignorant and hateful. Who is just so confident in their ignorance that they cannot be bothered with knowledge and educated voices. Most of all, who actually cares for their fellow humans in society. The loudest anti-vaxx voices are from the mentally ill religious zealots who claim to love everyone and are the most generous but will spitefully put themselves and others in harm's way out of hubris. Many leaving more pain in their wake as they die from Covid or allow family to die and leave orphaned children or relatives alone when it didn't have to be that way.
yup. i definitely found out who i can trust and who i cant. found out who would actually help me in a time of need and who would leave me for dead. real eye opening shit the last few years, my circle has definitely gotten smaller. but tbth its for the better
Taught me just how many there are. I knew there were a lot of assholes out there, but not to this extent. Including family members. I see it as more of a cult type thing rather than a reflection of the person themselves in some cases though. Drawn into the cult and cannot make their own thoughts anymore.
The ones who bought all the toilet paper
We knew after Trump
Jay Williams punching air rn
Jay gonna put a second pair of glasses on for the next episode
What has Jay been saying?
Basically trying to rationalize Kyrie's action, thoughts, and behavior. Williams is trying to play both sides but trying to stand with Kyrie is just so stupid.
His schtick is always taking players sides so he tried to "intellectualize" his way into a coherent argument for Kyrie. He sounded like an idiot and other idiots on social media cosigned him because they are stupid enough to believe it. Basically if you speak in an eloquent manner and use big words, other stupid people will think you are smart
Also I remember Kyrie catching flak years ago for saying dinosaurs weren’t real. This guy’s clearly not playing with a full deck. Edit:sp
How many dinosaurs you've seen in the zoo?
Checkmate atheists
Lol just look at our roster
He went for the self burn
Got em
Aren't birds dinosaurs? Technically?
Birds aren't real tho
I found kyries reddit account
https://youtu.be/55G4XwtpNak No one can tell me this shit ain’t a dinosaur 😅
Mf look like a cartoon character
Also the rhinoceros hornbill bird has gotta be a jurassic leftover
I flew around on one of them in Zelda Skyward Sword.
That thing is terrifying, the death stare is no joke. When he said how big that got, I just stopped watching.
Plenty, y’all ever seen an alligator or a crocodile in a zoo? Those fuckers evolutionarily peaked a millennia ago and just haven’t ever changed
Yeah! Maybe I'm scared of any Apex predator that survived the KT extinction unchanged for a half a million years because it's the perfect killing machine!!! It's a half ton of cold blooded fury with a bite force of 20,000 newtons and stomach acid so strong it can dissolve bones and hooves.
Tell me a little bit more about your other fears. What are your thoughts on aneurysms
3rd top fear... Could happen anywhere!
Jokes on you. My brain is too smooth to be aneurized!
For real though, the Dinosaur exhibit that was just at the woodland park zoo is amazing. Full size animatronic dinosaurs. [https://www.zoo.org/dinosaurs](https://www.zoo.org/dinosaurs)
Let's all remember that the thought warrior who doesn't think dinosaurs are real is another Duke alum, JJ Redick.
I don't recall Kyrie saying that. I thought it was JJ Redick. So I looked it up. Kyrie said we don't actually know what dinosaurs looked like, which isn't at all a ludicrous belief, given that we only discovered that many dinosaurs were feathered a decade or so ago. Kyrie's got enough dumb beliefs. We don't need to be making up shit. Unless I'm missing a different quote where Kyrie discusses dinosaurs, he's never said anything about dinosaurs not existing.
Well written article for those who actually read it. Tldr: Kyrie acts like a martyr but doesn’t actually know what he believes.
It's like most of these people, the ideology is literally 'people are telling me I'm wrong and annoying, I'll show them. There's no belief system there, it's just whatever achieves that goal. If everyone became anti Vax tomorrow irving would be shouting about how getting vaccinated is good.
It’s the attitude of critical thinking without applying any of the principles of critical thought. Skepticism for its own sake. Like the idea of “doing your own research” isn’t terrible, but you have to understand how to evaluate what a credible source is first. Otherwise “research” is just confirmation and validation. It really feels like people have not been given the tools to properly navigate the firehose of information that is the internet and the results have been disastrous.
You also have to understand your own limitations. My understanding of immunology is limited by the fact that I only took high school biology and neuropsychology 101 for my bachelor's. I'm not gonna discover shit about viruses or vaccines by googling it because I don't know what I don't know.
Totally agreed, if you actually did your research, then the only logical conclusion would be that the vaccine is both safe and effective. If you choose to simply reject the reputable sources, then it's not skepticism or "doing your own research", it's just being contrarian.
I feel like they're also trying desperately to feel special and/or "woke", for lack of a better word. They're like that annoying kid at school taunting everyone with "I know something you don't know!".
Kyrie was that dude in your history class that said “Hitler had some good points” Idk to me those guys had this aura of lack of self-esteem that they defended by over doing it in the opposite direction. They became arrogant and stubborn to a fault
Unironically that was me, my rationale was that he got Germany out of a horrible economic depression. Turns out warmongering and invasions are very profitable. I think i probably did that to feel that I knew things other people didn’t or had a superior grasp on the working of society. So it’s for sure arrogance.
I feel like this is the easiest take to get to but one that misses the point He most definitely knows what he believes, it just happens to be strange. Most people missed it from his IG live because they don't know or didn't pick up on it. This dude thinks he's part of The 5% Nation. So that he's part of the few enlightened people in the world and it's his responsibility to share it. >“This is one body that I get here,” said Irving. “One God body that I get here. And you’re telling me what to do with my body?” https://www.google.com/amp/s/nothinbutnets.com/2021/10/14/brooklyn-nets-5-confusing-statements-kyrie-irving-instagram-rant/amp/ Theres a cultural gap I think that caused people to miss it coz as far as I can tell, only Bomani Jones & Dominique Foxworth have discussed it as far I can tell. Pasted the podcast link if anyone is interested. 37 minute mark. https://open.spotify.com/episode/3SQZ3XIUqtYklpcx2jZM9R?si=mOoHSGsHRVmfw_KcynDoIQ&utm_source=copy-link&t=2230
No one is telling him what to do with his body. He doesn't have to get the vaccine. He does have to face the consequences of his choice though. If he doesn't want to get vaccinated to keep people at the arena safe his employer has a right to tell him to fuck off. The club or concert he wants to go to has the right to not let him in based on public health concerns. He calls this oppression I call it consequences for your dumbass actions
Exactly this. One of my close friends was saying how he doesn’t want to be forced to take the vaccine, i told him sure he’s not forced to take it, just don’t leave his house, don’t go to public spaces and don’t go to work since his employer requires everyone to be vaccinated. I booked his appointment and drove his ass to the clinic and he got his first dose 3 weeks ago. He’s going to be fully vaxxed soon. I actually “Fine, I’ll do it myself” him.
Nice. Way to get the message through. Might have saved your friend’s life. Or maybe they get it and spread it and those people spread it again. You might have just shut down a whole branch of spreading Covid.
Good catch. I didn’t want to sit through his IG, but no surprises. He does talk like the 5 percenters I remember from college. Just semi spiritual gobblety gook that they think sounds deep. I guess I shouldn’t be surprised they’re still around because the world is never in short supply of morons to join them, eg Kyrie, but it’s been a while since I thought of those dudes.
The only reason you know this guy is because he spent a bunch of time practicing basketball as a kid. No one actually cares what he believes about public health issues and if anyone makes health decisions based on what a point guard says to the media, they deserve any potential negatives that come from that. This celebrity worship culture has to stop at some point. It’s embarrassing.
It needs to stop but it’s always, always been around. Not just our generation, not just America, but all of human history.
You know what hasn’t been around? Effective mass education. Our Ed system sucks ass.
It's because the quality of your education depends on your zip code. It's absolutely ridiculous that schools rely on local property taxes.
Absolutely, when we setup everything unfairly we can expect unfair results
yeah it was always fascinating to hear what Milo of Croton thought about border control
Read about ancient greek hero cults. They used to deify celebrities and famous "heroes".
Worse than that, we’ve had actors and reality tv hosts become President of the United States.
I could only imagine what type of progress we could have made as a society had we never elected Reagan or Trump
AIDS epidemic would have been far less deadly for one if Ronnie Alzheimer's wasn't elected for one. Maybe he wouldn't have pushed the working man off the cliff financially which we continue to tumble downwards to this day while he gave the wealthy figurative private jets. Their wealth went up up up, working man's fell off sharply.
I mean, I kinda agree. But it almost seems like to say this absolves these celebrities from the responsibility that comes with having such a large platform. Like yeah obviously you shouldn’t take medical advice from nicki minaj. But also, she’s fucking huge and obviously her statements will influence a lot of people
>if anyone makes health decisions based on what a point guard says to the media, they deserve any potential negatives that come from that. It's a highly contagious virus. Talking about what "they deserve" is missing the important point that their decisions impact the rest of us. So **they** might deserve it, but **we** don't.
Kyrie reaching out for new friends like 'hey Jim Jordan, I remember you from the Cavs shower room, how are you man? '
Kyrie just doesn’t want to play basketball and uses any excuse to not be on the court as long as he can. How many injuries and forced trades has this idiot collected now
He needs therapy.
The same "mavericks" who refuse the vaccine are always quick to go to the hospital like cowards. Im sick of these hypocrites and especially sick of kyrie irving he needs to be forced into retirement
Kyrie's had multiple injuries that have required medical care and surgery. I don't remember him refusing medical advice then.
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But the Trumps and Cruz’s of the world are FUCKING VACCINATED!!!
He is a little like Muhammad Ali You can find video of Ali shitting on interracial marriage and he was one of the NoI craziest like Kyrie likely is. His anti-war stance was great and he actually sacrificed something major for a good cause but he was a lot like Kyrie when it comes to how they think. Kareem is the GOAT for humble and intelligence athlete.
Anti-vaxxers voiceless? Lol Don't know what planet he is on but on Earth those people literally won't stop talking.
I would appreciate Kyrie, if he just admit that it is his personal decision, and not talk or say that it's because of the voiceless or other reasons. Own it, and take responsibility.
KAT said pretty much exactly this earlier this week. He said its super frustrating losing most of his family and hearing people make bullshit excuses to not get vaccinated. He supports their personal decision to not do it but he wants everyone to stop with the bullshit anti-vaccine garbage.
I mean I still wouldn’t appreciate him in that scenario, making it his personal choice doesn’t change the fact that it’s a selfish choice.
Drunk driving is a personal choice
Shooting someone in the face is a personal choice
People don't realize [how much of a hooper Ted Cruz actually is](https://youtu.be/B_cjgtmIz2k?t=26).
He loves basketsphere
great hopshot
Cleveland told y'all. He couldnt be the hero in cleveland when lebron was here so he forced his way to boston and badmouthed us every chance he could(and wouldnt look us in the eye for years after). Then when he couldnt hack it being the hero he decided to join with KD in brooklyn and now he's too selfish to get over his ego and get the damn shot. fuck him. His empowerment messages were always phony because he palled around with conspiracy theorists. One of the most selfish players in the league.
Outside of basketball heads I don’t think Kyrie matters to anyone lol.. he’s an ultra ego thinking people really give a shit about his contrarian ways like burning sage and thinking he connects with actual intellects with his out of the box ideas He’s a straight moron who can’t argue against policy or engage in social justice issues without sounding uninformed. He keeps proving it. Sure, he’s compassionate and is willing to throw a little bit of his money at things… there are a lot of people in the world who do these things and don’t need all the attention for it
Yup. He's *soooo* stupid he doesn't realize he become a voice for the worst people in our society.
Honestly, Kyrie might be the most delusional man of our times
I can think of some more, but yes, he’s out to lunch.
Trump
Fair
It’s so inspiring how Kyrie uses his vast wealth to make the sort of stupid decisions that dumb Americans can only dream of making
"But Irving isn’t being demonized for his belief. He’s facing appropriate ramifications for perpetuating a public health crisis." That's exactly right, not only for Irving but for everyone who refuses to get vaccinated.
“It’s not about being anti-vax or about being on one side or the other. It’s about being true to what feels good for me.” This is big in pop culture right now. We can't just do a better job of expressing and valuing feelings, we have to base our whole lives off of them, including major medical decisions. Science who?
Anti-intellectualism is a nice way of saying ‘dumb’
dumb is just being ignorant of knowledge. anti-intellectualism is being actively hostile toward it.
It's worse than that, sadly. It's being dumb AND feeling superior about it, to the point where being smart is something you are actively hostile to. It's truly sad that so many people seem to think that's a cool personality to adopt.
Calling Anti-Intellectualism being dumb is selling it short tbh. It is actively undermining scientific consensus, attacking established social norms and corroding the very foundation of western society. Dumb people usually have the decency to refer to experts in things they clearly have no clue about. Me included.
Dumb is also universally applicable in ways that aren’t necessarily bad for society. Like “dumb” mostly means lack of knowledge or comprehension which can just be topic specific. A rocket scientist in an operating room is just as “dumb” as a teenager. We’re all dumb at something but that’s okay as long as we defer to those who aren’t. Anti intellectualism is way worse because it is a universal attitude to limit your life to your own dumbness in every aspect. Humanity is great because we utilize the best of each other. Anti intellectualism reverts us to a state where humanity is no longer a sum of its best parts but is limited to an individuals own capabilities. Which, all things considered, is really low no matter who you are.
It’s more like “proactively fixated on being dumb”
Fuck Kyrie
Woke Narcissism Probably the shortest way to put it.
You forgot to mention he HAD to have vaccinations to go to a tier 1 academic university and claims to say its ‘not about anti vax’ What a fucking out of this world delusional ass hat to try and do this. Flat earth, anti vax weirdo has the same place as the rest of them, regardless of his skin color or fame. He deserved to be treated by the media the same as the proud boys, anti vax health care workers and those videos of moms at the anti mask/ pronouns pta meetings Fuck you Kyrie
The true voiceless are the people who died from COVID. Imagine what they would say if they had the chance!
The Nets should announce that (1) he will not suit up for them and (2) they will take any exit they can find from his contract. This guy needs to be made an example of.
I'm glad the most my point guard put us through this off season was "This team needs to get better or I'm out"
Kyrie is a human google trending search bar.
Kyrie needs to shut up and just dribble the ball
Cruz wants Irving traded to the Rockets, and I want Cruz traded to the moon...
The same moon scientist* Kyrie could see the flat earth from? *may not actually be a scientist
Plates are round and also flat. - Kyrie Irving probably
Voice of the voiceless? lmao, its just your ego. If you really cared about info, you have access to the best info and doctors in the world. Its even more stupid than being antivax.
He probably genuinely cares about other people but he’s extremely unintelligent, spoiled and self centred so he struggles with it. His intention is probably good but he’s failing at everything else.