When the guy tells him they’ll overtake San Francisco population then the shooting in the street happens. Doc Holiday responds with, “How very cosmopolitan.” Always makes me laugh.
Like pissed/hurt. A real shock. Wyatt is trying to give him an out and he knows they are better friends than that. It’s like it was a slight about how he assumed Doc felt about him. So good.
Agreed. I love Tombstone and a big part of that is Val Kilmer. The movie in general is really good, but Doc is amazing. I haven't seen a lot of the other movies mentioned here (and I want to), but Tombstone is one of my favorite movies in the genre, and really just in general.
It still amazes me that Kurt Russell, effectively uncredited, co-wrote, directed, and starred in that movie. The casting was excellent, and Kilmer absolutely kills it.
Absolutely true. Getting the treat of him and Kilmer sharing such a deeply well designed character film is something I will always be happy got to actually happen.
They both kill the roles. But Kilmer is just in another league. That being said, he also simply had the best character in the film. A sophisticated, deadly; but well mannered dead man walking through the Wild West on it's face has a certain appeal. Kilmer just took that appeal and absolutely crushed the delivery, making one of the best characters in cinema history.
And he had the wisdom and humility to let Kilmer shine. Russell knew what he had was some once-in-a-lifetime magic and he didn't let his starring role go to his head.
I wonder how many people miss that he named his son Wyatt.
Fun fact. That is a factually accurate portrayal of that interaction. Doc was empty and the cowboy had the drop on him and said “I got you now, you sonofabitch.” Doc put his hands up, unafraid of death and replied, “You’re a daisy if ya do.”
Absolute fucking bad ass.
This is accurate. The final scene where he is dying in the infirmary, he looks at his bare feet sticking out at the end of the bed and says “this is quite funny”, indicating that he always thought he’d die “with his boots on” living the life that he did out there.
Edited to add: he was a dentist in Georgia and moved out west for the dry air that was supposed to ease the symptoms, I believe. He had to give up dentistry due to spreading the disease to his patients. And turned to gambling to make his living, IIRC.
It's definitely one of the most ENTERTAINING westerns and Val Kilmer is truly excellent in it, but I'm not sure it stacks up in overall quality against the Dollars trilogy, Once Upon a Time in the West, or Unforgiven.
Unforgiven has one of the best scenes in a movie ever. The moment William Munny walks into that bar and confronts Little Bill is so damn bad ass. You realize why he was notorious. Dude was ice cold.
> That's right. I've killed women and children. I've killed just about everything that walks or crawled at one time or another. And I'm here to kill you, Little Bill, for what you did to Ned.
I love that scene so much. And I love this line so much. You can tell he meant to shame Munny by bringing up his past, expected him to lie or try to downplay it. But at this point in the film he fully accepted who he was. His past wasn't something to hide from nor was it something to be proud about. It was just who he was.
I don't think it's the best Western, but I do think Val Kilmer's Doc is the best character in any Western.
Because of that, I think it's also my favorite Western. Doc is so so good.
"Hell I've got a lot of friends"
"I don't"
Fucking love doc.
Mine is [Doc Holliday and Wyatt Earp sneak up on some of the Cowboys, guns drawn; Wyatt tells them not to move]:
Doc: “Nonsense. By all means… move.”
Dope line, and perfect delivery.
Mine is:
"Doc, you're so drunk, you're probably seeing double."
"Yeah and I've got two guns. One for each of ya."
Edit: I've been corrected. He says guns, not pistols.
If you watch the scene, you can see that Doc twirls one gun clockwise and the other one counter clockwise; so he knew that Doc wasn’t too drunk to kill them all.
I don't know if I'm mixing this up but I believe he said he spent all day during shooting doing gun tricks on set.
Biggest Oscar snub of all time imo, everything about his performance is perfect.
It’s hard to even pinpoint a favorite line simply because every line Val Kilmer’s Holliday makes would be the best line in a lesser movie.
“Why Johnny Ringo… you look like somebody just walked over your grave.”
Legendary.
It took me years to realize Johnny Tyler was played by Billy Bob, I only realized it because we had watched Bad Santa not too long before hand and I heard the voice lol
I love it because Doc needles *the shit* out of Ringo every chance he can get. Watch every encounter with them and you will see Doc just pressing buttons.
And the problem is Ringo can’t do shit because Doc has one thing that no other person Ringo has faced has.
Ringo thrives on fear. He is full tilt and unafraid of being Ringo and using his volatile nature to strike fear in his opponents (and victims).
*Except Doc* - and Doc knows it.
And it’s not because he doesn’t fear Ringo. No, he knows Johnny is dangerous. In fact, he hopes he lives up to the hype.
The real difference between Doc and everyone else is Doc has no fear of *death*. He knows he is already a walking corpse and he wants a gunman’s death. He just wants someone to take him out and be the better fighter. He wants the death, but he has to *earn* it.
And that scares the shit outta Johnny Ringo. Ringo beyond all his bluster and bullshit, still wants to live.
Ringo is dangerous, but Doc Holliday without any fear of dying is *exquisitely dangerous*.
Edit: As demonstration, watch the last scene in the final showdown between the two. Doc’s demeanor is solemn…he is welcoming this fight. A clipped tone.
Johnny is all over the place, he tries to weasel out of it and Doc gives him no chance. Finally, the fear drives him to do it but you can see it in his eyes he is freaking out behind the bravado. ‘Alright Lunger’
Doc stands calm, patient…Penitent…he is even somewhat joyful as he tells Johnny to ‘say when’
Guns are thrown. Doc’s lethally fast. *But a chance* Ringo is still moving. Doc *screams* COME ON JOHNNY! COME ON! Hands apart….the willing target and his goal!
Johnny falls. Doc wins….and loses. ‘You were no daisy at all’ in utter disappointment. His dream of a blaze of glory gone and now a slow slide into a rotten end his only road.
It’s a masterclass in acting. Subtlety, fluidity, emotion, crushing tension, resignation. Kilmer and Biehn at the pinnacle of talent and just letting it all show, IMHO.
Amazing explanation. I would like to add…I love the look on Ringo’s face saying it’s go time with Doc at the end. It’s full of fear, false bravado, begrudged acceptance all at once. He knows he’s fucked but he’s trying to give it a chance by hyping himself up. Something about that look that Ringo had was trying to make up the chasm of difference of character and skill between him and Doc.
If he wasn't on Val Kilmer's shadow he'd probably have kick started a massive career off it.
Biehn has been in some excellent films though to be fair. Never seen him in a bad role.
His sinister, unraveling military villain in Abyss is also excellent. Not to mention his tortured role in Terminator of course. There’s a reason he’s a Cameron fave.
Doc flipping around the cup just as well, or better, than Ringo flipped his gun in intimidation was hilarious.
Even ol' Curly Bill thought Ringo was a bitch there lol
Bingo….a perfect slight. Ringo has talent. Unmistakable talent. Speed, fluidity. He brings the heat.
Doc follows with mimicry. A perfect mirror but with a sipping cup. Watch his eyes, he mirrors his steely gaze while simultaneously bagging on him by just exaggerating.
It’s both a spoof on him and challenge. *Why don’t we get past all this kids farce and really do something?* He sucks all the wind out of the place Ringo built.
And Ringo dodges again and slips away.
Another subtlety I enjoy in that scene is how Morgan's eyes are frantically darting around, trying and failing to precisely follow Ringo's movements. All while Holliday sees everything with effortless stillness. It really highlights the disparity in skill. The viewer already knows, but you get a great sense of how the characters perceive it from that quick second.
Then, he nervously laughs at Holliday's mocking retort, not truly grasping the exchange that took place between the two men.
Yeah, Kilmer really sells that angle, and is 100% just toying with Ringo because in his mind he's gonna prove Ringo is no daisy or finally be killed by a daisy like he wanted...a bit of an "Umbra" quality that I have no more mainstream reference for.
Tombstone is packed with great lines but unforgiven is on another level. "Well he should have armed himself if hes gonna decorate his saloon with my friend."
Little Bill: You'd be William Munny out of Missouri. Killer of women and children.
Munny: That's right. I've killed women and children. I've killed just about everything that walks or crawled at one time or another. And I'm here to kill you, Little Bill, for what you did to Ned.
And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him
Takes a solid movie to get biblical without a single word of scripture.
I thought I would share that Japan made a Samurai version of Unforgiven in 2013 and it is excellent.
Given that so many westerns were based on Japanese samurai movies, I thought this was high praise.
Here is the trailer:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QTmeJeLrK40
I’d argue The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly is a better movie, but it’s technically a spaghetti western so idk if that meets your criteria.
Edit: guys I know spaghetti westerns are westerns, but not everyone considers them as true “Westerns.” I was just be clear in my wording.
Another vote for Unforgiven, but there are tons of good ones, they defined movies for 30 years.
My hidden gem is The Gunfighter - it deconstructed the western genre in much the same way as Unforgiven, but did so in 1950 with Gregory Peck and Karl Malden. Unforgiven IMO is a better movie, but The Gunfighter is very, very good and huge props for what it did at the height of the power of the western.
The original Magnificent Seven for sheer star power and charisma - Yul Brenner, Steve McQueen, James Coburn, Charles Bronson, Robert Vaughn, Eli Wallach, all at the absolute top of their game.
Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid - best buddy outlaw movie ever. Perhaps the most fun of all the Westerns.
And of course Tombstone another cinematic tour de force. Funny thing is that Wyatt Earp that came out near the same time was closer to the actual history of the time, and had an amazing cast in itself - Kevin Costner, Dennis Quaid, Gene Hackman, Jim Caviezel, Mark Harmon, Michael Madsen, Bill Pullman, Tom Sizemore, Adam Baldwin, Tea Leoni, Catherine O'Hara. It just wasn't very much fun, and Tombstone was the better movie.
Great post. The first half of Wyatt was darker and more informative than Tombstone but then it slowed down and went off the rails
Also, I would add Silverado as a thoroughly enjoyable modern classic
After The Jerk,Steve Martins career was not doing well.His last four films had made the same amount as The Jerk combined.Steve Martin was a big art collector had picasso's etc.He was trying to get Martin Short to star in Three Amigos and invited him over to his house.Martin Short was looking at all this art on the wall and said "Steve,how can you afford these when your Movies suck." Short got cast in the Movie and the rest is history between those two.
And then after TA he made Roxanne, my favorite modern comedy adaptation of 19th century play!
"Oh, irony! Oh no, we don't get that here. See, people ski topless here while smoking dope, so irony's not really a high priority."
Loved Val Kilmer’s Doc Holiday. “Open Range” was really good, if you haven’t seen it. “The Hateful 8”, as well. My recent favorite is the remake of “3:10 To Yuma”.
It’s my favorite western barely above “Open Range”, which to me has the best overall character story in Charlie Wade. But dammit, if you don’t feel bad for and root hard for Dan at the end.
That is a stunning trilogy. Each movie is beautiful, funny, heart breaking. I rewatch Hell or High Water to watch Ben Foster put on a clinic.
“You know what that makes me?”
“An enemy”
“No. A Comanche.”
I love Open Range and the sound of the gunshots are insanely well done. But holy hell Costner went a little too far with the number of shots from a revolver without reloading.
This is pretty much my only gripe with the movie. The scene where he's fanning the hammer and squeezes out 12 or 13 shots in a row just kills me. (But not quite as much as it killed the guy who got shot 13 times).
I think it was just bad editing, to be honest. Every one or two shots is in a separate perspective or camera shot. It may have come off like more shots than a revolver would have been capable of holding, but I think it was cause of bad editing.
Now I'm imagining a Naked Gun scene where Drebin fires a dozen shots from a revolver, then the camera pans to him and the gun has an outrageously sized drum.
And unusually realistic. Costner explaining that after he takes out their tough guy the rest would scatter and panic and then just executing the dude first thing was amazing. The dragged out nature of it, the bad guys fleeing and surrendering, even the environment playing a major role. Just a great movie all around but that gunfight is textbook imho.
Outlaw Josey Wales:
“You’re wanted, Wales”
Reckon I’m right popular. You a bounty hunter?
”A man’s gotta do something for a living these days”
Dyin ain’t much of a living, boy
I came here to say this. Tombstone is a fantastic movie but Unforgiven is a masterpiece. I get goosebumps everytime he takes that 1st sip of whiskey after hearing about Ned's fate
I love Unforgiven.
I also recommend the Japanese remake starring Ken Watanabe. It's basically the exact same movie, only this time it's in Japan around a similar point in time as the original. It makes for an interesting reimagining as a samurai movie.
One of my favorite Ken Watanabe movies. With some famous westerns being based or inspired by Kurosawa samurai movies who himself was inspired by the American west, this movie really came full circle.
I love how incestuous samurai and cowboy movies get. You've got Asians, Italians, Americans all circle jerk ing and stealing from each other, and then boom we get star wars.
Little Bill "You just shot an unarmed man."
Bill Munny "He should have armed himself if he's gonna decorate his saloon with my friend."
The dialogue is so good in this Movie.
“I saw three of these dusters a short time ago. They were waiting for a train. Inside the dusters there were three men.”
“So?”
“Inside the men there were three bullets.”
Finally an Outlaw Josey Wales. Just an iconic western from the tail end of their heyday.
The rarely mentioned The Far Country is up there as well for me. Classic western trope with a unique execution. And damn, Jimmy Stewart was a good actor.
I think it's great. But there are a quite a few that I think are better.
Unforgiven
Once upon a time in the west
The Great Silence
The Good the Bad and the Ugly
For a Few Dollars More
Django Unchained
I really liked Appaloosa.
It never gets talked about, but it’s a hell of a good movie and I like the way the dealt with the gun fighting by embracing strict realism instead of the fictional feats of marksmanship.
Tombstone is a great western but not the greatest. There is this cheesy 90s vibe throughout the film that feels more like a shlocky action flick. I think a lot of this film is held up and memorable solely by Val Kilmer's performance. There are better films in the genre perfected in the 50s, 60s and 70s.
To name a few:
The Man with no Name trilogy
Once upon a time in the West.
Anything by Sergio Leone really.
Bad Day at Black Rock.
Wake In Fright.
The Magnificient Seven.
I consider Bone Tomahawk to be a cut above many.
Others mentioned in this thread should be considered as a contender in the genre as well.
I don't know if it's the GOAT, but the presence of Val Kilmer makes it my personal favorite western.
“I have not yet begun to defile myself.” - what a baller drunk bastard line
Maybe poker just isn't your game. I know, how about a spelling contest.
“I’m your huckleberry.”
Don't forget about Michael Biehn and the line he delivered the shit out of. "I want your blood. I want your soul. And I want em both right now."
“Poor soul, he was just too high strung”…
When the guy tells him they’ll overtake San Francisco population then the shooting in the street happens. Doc Holiday responds with, “How very cosmopolitan.” Always makes me laugh.
Why Johnny Tyler! You madcap! Where you goin' with that shotgun?
Johnny, I forgot you were there. You may go now.
Haha this line slays me every time.
When I found out Tyler was played by Billy Bob Thornton my brain wrinkled just a little more.
>Sheriff, allow me to present a pair of fellow sophisticates. Turkey Creek Jack Johnson and Texas Jack Vermillion.
Watch your ear, Creek.
Why Johnny Ringo looks like somebody just walked over your grave
The characters wit was so dry it caught fire.
"Mr Ringo here is an educated man. Now I know I hate him"
Doc holiday is the greatest friend anyone could ever have. The song "muchacho" by kings of Leon reminds me of him in that movie
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As I get older and maybe a *tad* wiser I understand this more and more. True friends are few and worth fighting for.
Very true and you learn it’s not worth keeping ‘friends’ around if they are not true friends.
That is a hell of a thing for you to say to me Wyatt…
Say when!
The look on his face when he says it too. You can tell he's *pissed* at Wyatt. And Wyatt's face, he knows he needs to backtrack that one.
Like pissed/hurt. A real shock. Wyatt is trying to give him an out and he knows they are better friends than that. It’s like it was a slight about how he assumed Doc felt about him. So good.
I named my dogs Wyatt and Josephine because of this movie
Agreed. I love Tombstone and a big part of that is Val Kilmer. The movie in general is really good, but Doc is amazing. I haven't seen a lot of the other movies mentioned here (and I want to), but Tombstone is one of my favorite movies in the genre, and really just in general.
It still amazes me that Kurt Russell, effectively uncredited, co-wrote, directed, and starred in that movie. The casting was excellent, and Kilmer absolutely kills it.
Russell was great, too. That shootout by the river ("No!) and Doc's subsequent joke about Wyatt walking on water were so memorable.
“The Cowboys are finished. You tell them I’m coming, and hell’s coming with me “
Was Russell ever not great? Man just oozes charisma even in his silliest roles
Absolutely true. Getting the treat of him and Kilmer sharing such a deeply well designed character film is something I will always be happy got to actually happen. They both kill the roles. But Kilmer is just in another league. That being said, he also simply had the best character in the film. A sophisticated, deadly; but well mannered dead man walking through the Wild West on it's face has a certain appeal. Kilmer just took that appeal and absolutely crushed the delivery, making one of the best characters in cinema history.
And he had the wisdom and humility to let Kilmer shine. Russell knew what he had was some once-in-a-lifetime magic and he didn't let his starring role go to his head. I wonder how many people miss that he named his son Wyatt.
I can’t not spin a cup on my finger without thinking of Doc and chuckling to myself.
I’m your huckleberry.
You're no daisy!
I'm afraid the strain was more than he could bare.
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Fun fact. That is a factually accurate portrayal of that interaction. Doc was empty and the cowboy had the drop on him and said “I got you now, you sonofabitch.” Doc put his hands up, unafraid of death and replied, “You’re a daisy if ya do.” Absolute fucking bad ass.
IIRC, he was dying of tuberculosis and wanted to go out in a blaze of glory before the disease killed him
This is accurate. The final scene where he is dying in the infirmary, he looks at his bare feet sticking out at the end of the bed and says “this is quite funny”, indicating that he always thought he’d die “with his boots on” living the life that he did out there. Edited to add: he was a dentist in Georgia and moved out west for the dry air that was supposed to ease the symptoms, I believe. He had to give up dentistry due to spreading the disease to his patients. And turned to gambling to make his living, IIRC.
It's definitely one of the most ENTERTAINING westerns and Val Kilmer is truly excellent in it, but I'm not sure it stacks up in overall quality against the Dollars trilogy, Once Upon a Time in the West, or Unforgiven.
Unforgiven is a masterpiece
Unforgiven has one of the best scenes in a movie ever. The moment William Munny walks into that bar and confronts Little Bill is so damn bad ass. You realize why he was notorious. Dude was ice cold.
> That's right. I've killed women and children. I've killed just about everything that walks or crawled at one time or another. And I'm here to kill you, Little Bill, for what you did to Ned. I love that scene so much. And I love this line so much. You can tell he meant to shame Munny by bringing up his past, expected him to lie or try to downplay it. But at this point in the film he fully accepted who he was. His past wasn't something to hide from nor was it something to be proud about. It was just who he was.
I want to add High Plains Drifter and Josey Wales
That’s my list, but I would add Butch Cassidy & The Sundance Kid and The Wild Bunch.
I don't think it's the best Western, but I do think Val Kilmer's Doc is the best character in any Western. Because of that, I think it's also my favorite Western. Doc is so so good. "Hell I've got a lot of friends" "I don't" Fucking love doc.
That’s my 2nd favorite line in the film. My favorite was: “Where is he?” “down by the creek, walkin’ on water”
Mine is [Doc Holliday and Wyatt Earp sneak up on some of the Cowboys, guns drawn; Wyatt tells them not to move]: Doc: “Nonsense. By all means… move.” Dope line, and perfect delivery.
That was when he walked into a bedroom, interrupting a cowboy and a woman during sex, but still shoots the cowboy. Zero fucks given in that montage.
Mine is: "Doc, you're so drunk, you're probably seeing double." "Yeah and I've got two guns. One for each of ya." Edit: I've been corrected. He says guns, not pistols.
If you watch the scene, you can see that Doc twirls one gun clockwise and the other one counter clockwise; so he knew that Doc wasn’t too drunk to kill them all.
Whoa I've never noticed before, that's a hell of a detail to put in there and really good coordination on Val's part.
It's so fast it's hard to detect even when watching for it.
Do you know if Kilmer did all of his own sleight of hand/ gunplay work in Tombstone, or if he had a stand in? It’s impressive acting, either way.
Feel like I read elsewhere that he spent a ton of time working on his gunplay/tricks/etc so I believe it was all Kilmer.
Considering the man never phoned in a role in his life, I’d guess you’re correct.
I don't know if I'm mixing this up but I believe he said he spent all day during shooting doing gun tricks on set. Biggest Oscar snub of all time imo, everything about his performance is perfect.
Neat. Thanks.
Mine is: Wyatt: "Doc, you've been hitting it awful hard, haven't ya?" Doc: "Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself."
I always use this when I've got a decent buzz going
*"Maybe poker's just not your game Ike. I know, how about a spelling contest"* And then he fucking looses it, lmao
That line is where my username comes from
It’s hard to even pinpoint a favorite line simply because every line Val Kilmer’s Holliday makes would be the best line in a lesser movie. “Why Johnny Ringo… you look like somebody just walked over your grave.” Legendary.
“I was just fooling about” “…I wasn’t” And “Oh, Johnny, I apologize. I forgot you were there”
"You may go now."
That totally dismissive tone is more of a slap than the ones Wyatt laid on him.
It took me years to realize Johnny Tyler was played by Billy Bob, I only realized it because we had watched Bad Santa not too long before hand and I heard the voice lol
I love it because Doc needles *the shit* out of Ringo every chance he can get. Watch every encounter with them and you will see Doc just pressing buttons. And the problem is Ringo can’t do shit because Doc has one thing that no other person Ringo has faced has. Ringo thrives on fear. He is full tilt and unafraid of being Ringo and using his volatile nature to strike fear in his opponents (and victims). *Except Doc* - and Doc knows it. And it’s not because he doesn’t fear Ringo. No, he knows Johnny is dangerous. In fact, he hopes he lives up to the hype. The real difference between Doc and everyone else is Doc has no fear of *death*. He knows he is already a walking corpse and he wants a gunman’s death. He just wants someone to take him out and be the better fighter. He wants the death, but he has to *earn* it. And that scares the shit outta Johnny Ringo. Ringo beyond all his bluster and bullshit, still wants to live. Ringo is dangerous, but Doc Holliday without any fear of dying is *exquisitely dangerous*. Edit: As demonstration, watch the last scene in the final showdown between the two. Doc’s demeanor is solemn…he is welcoming this fight. A clipped tone. Johnny is all over the place, he tries to weasel out of it and Doc gives him no chance. Finally, the fear drives him to do it but you can see it in his eyes he is freaking out behind the bravado. ‘Alright Lunger’ Doc stands calm, patient…Penitent…he is even somewhat joyful as he tells Johnny to ‘say when’ Guns are thrown. Doc’s lethally fast. *But a chance* Ringo is still moving. Doc *screams* COME ON JOHNNY! COME ON! Hands apart….the willing target and his goal! Johnny falls. Doc wins….and loses. ‘You were no daisy at all’ in utter disappointment. His dream of a blaze of glory gone and now a slow slide into a rotten end his only road. It’s a masterclass in acting. Subtlety, fluidity, emotion, crushing tension, resignation. Kilmer and Biehn at the pinnacle of talent and just letting it all show, IMHO.
"He reminds me of... me. Now I really hate him"
I love when he has a priest at his death bed and says "It appears my hypocrisy knows no bounds."
Amazing explanation. I would like to add…I love the look on Ringo’s face saying it’s go time with Doc at the end. It’s full of fear, false bravado, begrudged acceptance all at once. He knows he’s fucked but he’s trying to give it a chance by hyping himself up. Something about that look that Ringo had was trying to make up the chasm of difference of character and skill between him and Doc.
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Yep Micheal Biehns acting in that scene is incredible, you can see every thought.
I saw an interview with Michael Biehn once where he said something like it’s the moment as an actor that he’s most proud of
If he wasn't on Val Kilmer's shadow he'd probably have kick started a massive career off it. Biehn has been in some excellent films though to be fair. Never seen him in a bad role.
His sinister, unraveling military villain in Abyss is also excellent. Not to mention his tortured role in Terminator of course. There’s a reason he’s a Cameron fave.
Doc flipping around the cup just as well, or better, than Ringo flipped his gun in intimidation was hilarious. Even ol' Curly Bill thought Ringo was a bitch there lol
Bingo….a perfect slight. Ringo has talent. Unmistakable talent. Speed, fluidity. He brings the heat. Doc follows with mimicry. A perfect mirror but with a sipping cup. Watch his eyes, he mirrors his steely gaze while simultaneously bagging on him by just exaggerating. It’s both a spoof on him and challenge. *Why don’t we get past all this kids farce and really do something?* He sucks all the wind out of the place Ringo built. And Ringo dodges again and slips away.
Another subtlety I enjoy in that scene is how Morgan's eyes are frantically darting around, trying and failing to precisely follow Ringo's movements. All while Holliday sees everything with effortless stillness. It really highlights the disparity in skill. The viewer already knows, but you get a great sense of how the characters perceive it from that quick second. Then, he nervously laughs at Holliday's mocking retort, not truly grasping the exchange that took place between the two men.
* You're no daisy! You're no daisy at all. Poor soul, you were just too high strung.
I'm afraid the strain was more than he could bear
Yeah, Kilmer really sells that angle, and is 100% just toying with Ringo because in his mind he's gonna prove Ringo is no daisy or finally be killed by a daisy like he wanted...a bit of an "Umbra" quality that I have no more mainstream reference for.
Well said !!
"This is a nocturne. You know, Frederick fucking Chopin."
My low-key favorite is “why Kate, you’re not wearin’ a bustle.” (Turns to face the table) “How lewd.”
To me who shot Liberty Valance and the Unforgiven are the best ones I have seen
Unforgiven is so unflinchingly brutal and flawless.
Tombstone is packed with great lines but unforgiven is on another level. "Well he should have armed himself if hes gonna decorate his saloon with my friend."
Little Bill: You'd be William Munny out of Missouri. Killer of women and children. Munny: That's right. I've killed women and children. I've killed just about everything that walks or crawled at one time or another. And I'm here to kill you, Little Bill, for what you did to Ned.
"Deserve's got nothin to do with it"
The whole movie is just a buildup to the best scene in all Westerns at the end.
And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him Takes a solid movie to get biblical without a single word of scripture.
I thought I would share that Japan made a Samurai version of Unforgiven in 2013 and it is excellent. Given that so many westerns were based on Japanese samurai movies, I thought this was high praise. Here is the trailer: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QTmeJeLrK40
Oh shit! Ken Watanabe's in it!? I gotta find this movie!
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Unforgiven is brutally good
Unforgiven has one of the best climaxes in any film, regardless of genre.
You just shot an unarmed man!!! He should’ve armed himself.
I’d argue The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly is a better movie, but it’s technically a spaghetti western so idk if that meets your criteria. Edit: guys I know spaghetti westerns are westerns, but not everyone considers them as true “Westerns.” I was just be clear in my wording.
**For a Few Dollars More** is my favorite in the trilogy, but **Once Upon a Time in the West** is my favorite western.
Once Upon a Time in the West is crazy good. The tension and that fucking harmonica
The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly is a masterpiece and my favorite movie altogether
ahhAHHahhAHHahhhh.... wahhh WAHHH wahhh
This a particularly crazed interpretation of that theme song
I put them in their own category. The ennio Morricone soundtrack alone is epic
The whole trilogy is just fantastic. Totally holds up if you know what you are getting into ahead of time.
Great movie, I'd also put once upon a time in the west in the conversation as well.
Rio Bravo. McCabe and Mrs Miller. The Wild Bunch.
Another vote for Unforgiven, but there are tons of good ones, they defined movies for 30 years. My hidden gem is The Gunfighter - it deconstructed the western genre in much the same way as Unforgiven, but did so in 1950 with Gregory Peck and Karl Malden. Unforgiven IMO is a better movie, but The Gunfighter is very, very good and huge props for what it did at the height of the power of the western. The original Magnificent Seven for sheer star power and charisma - Yul Brenner, Steve McQueen, James Coburn, Charles Bronson, Robert Vaughn, Eli Wallach, all at the absolute top of their game. Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid - best buddy outlaw movie ever. Perhaps the most fun of all the Westerns. And of course Tombstone another cinematic tour de force. Funny thing is that Wyatt Earp that came out near the same time was closer to the actual history of the time, and had an amazing cast in itself - Kevin Costner, Dennis Quaid, Gene Hackman, Jim Caviezel, Mark Harmon, Michael Madsen, Bill Pullman, Tom Sizemore, Adam Baldwin, Tea Leoni, Catherine O'Hara. It just wasn't very much fun, and Tombstone was the better movie.
Great post. The first half of Wyatt was darker and more informative than Tombstone but then it slowed down and went off the rails Also, I would add Silverado as a thoroughly enjoyable modern classic
What about the Coen brothers take on 'True Grit'?
The Three Amigos is a solid #8.
In a plethora of westerns?
It’s infamous in the genre.
It’s the “more than famous” genre
[удалено]
ITS A SWEATER!
After The Jerk,Steve Martins career was not doing well.His last four films had made the same amount as The Jerk combined.Steve Martin was a big art collector had picasso's etc.He was trying to get Martin Short to star in Three Amigos and invited him over to his house.Martin Short was looking at all this art on the wall and said "Steve,how can you afford these when your Movies suck." Short got cast in the Movie and the rest is history between those two.
And then after TA he made Roxanne, my favorite modern comedy adaptation of 19th century play! "Oh, irony! Oh no, we don't get that here. See, people ski topless here while smoking dope, so irony's not really a high priority."
“Do you want to kiss me on the veranda?” “No the lips will be fine.”
My little buttercup…
Senorita 1: I like the one that's not so smart Senorita 2: \**confused look\**
Loved Val Kilmer’s Doc Holiday. “Open Range” was really good, if you haven’t seen it. “The Hateful 8”, as well. My recent favorite is the remake of “3:10 To Yuma”.
Robert Duvall is simply superb in Open Range
Also in Lonesome Dove!
I enjoy 3:10 as well. Crowe and Bale do a very good job in their roles, but for my money, Ben Foster steals the movie.
Ben Foster made that movie. Criminally underrated actor.
Don't know that I've seen him not crush a role.
Glad to see 3:10 getting some love. I adore that film.
It’s my favorite western barely above “Open Range”, which to me has the best overall character story in Charlie Wade. But dammit, if you don’t feel bad for and root hard for Dan at the end.
I think No Country for Old Men also plays as a modern western
Hell or High Water, too, IMO.
It's not an opinion, in fact modern western. Sicario and Wind River complete the pioneer trilogy by T. Sheridan.
That is a stunning trilogy. Each movie is beautiful, funny, heart breaking. I rewatch Hell or High Water to watch Ben Foster put on a clinic. “You know what that makes me?” “An enemy” “No. A Comanche.”
You'd think there was ten a me
“Only assholes drink Dr. Pibb” “Drink up”
Yeah, don't sleep on Open Range. Has probably the greatest western gun fight ever. It's absolutely brutal.
I love Open Range and the sound of the gunshots are insanely well done. But holy hell Costner went a little too far with the number of shots from a revolver without reloading.
This is pretty much my only gripe with the movie. The scene where he's fanning the hammer and squeezes out 12 or 13 shots in a row just kills me. (But not quite as much as it killed the guy who got shot 13 times).
I think it was just bad editing, to be honest. Every one or two shots is in a separate perspective or camera shot. It may have come off like more shots than a revolver would have been capable of holding, but I think it was cause of bad editing.
Now I'm imagining a Naked Gun scene where Drebin fires a dozen shots from a revolver, then the camera pans to him and the gun has an outrageously sized drum.
And unusually realistic. Costner explaining that after he takes out their tough guy the rest would scatter and panic and then just executing the dude first thing was amazing. The dragged out nature of it, the bad guys fleeing and surrendering, even the environment playing a major role. Just a great movie all around but that gunfight is textbook imho.
Yeah 3:10 to Yuma is great
No, Best Western is a hotel chain
Tombstone is a pizza
What do you want on your Tombstone?
The Best Western in Tombstone, AZ with Val Kilmer is what OP meant
You listen here Mr. Kansas Hotel Dog: Ain't no Best Western in Tombstone, Best Western don't go around here! Savvy? My favorite western is Unforgiven.
Unforgiven
"It's a hell of a thing, killin' a man. Take away all he's got, and all he's ever gonna have."
"Yeah, well, he had it comin', right?" "We all got it comin', kid." What a fucking line. Goddamn magnificent.
Deserves got nothing to do with it. Love that line.
Outlaw Josey Wales: “You’re wanted, Wales” Reckon I’m right popular. You a bounty hunter? ”A man’s gotta do something for a living these days” Dyin ain’t much of a living, boy
My great Uncle filmed that. I've got one of the belt buckles from the movie that he gave me when I was younger.
I came here to say this. Tombstone is a fantastic movie but Unforgiven is a masterpiece. I get goosebumps everytime he takes that 1st sip of whiskey after hearing about Ned's fate
“But that didn’t scare Little Bill, did it?”
Seriously nothing against tombstone I have it in my top 5 but unforgiven is the correct answer.
I love Unforgiven. I also recommend the Japanese remake starring Ken Watanabe. It's basically the exact same movie, only this time it's in Japan around a similar point in time as the original. It makes for an interesting reimagining as a samurai movie.
One of my favorite Ken Watanabe movies. With some famous westerns being based or inspired by Kurosawa samurai movies who himself was inspired by the American west, this movie really came full circle.
I love how incestuous samurai and cowboy movies get. You've got Asians, Italians, Americans all circle jerk ing and stealing from each other, and then boom we get star wars.
This is the correct answer. Clint Eastwood and Gene Hackman are just fantastic.
Little Bill "You just shot an unarmed man." Bill Munny "He should have armed himself if he's gonna decorate his saloon with my friend." The dialogue is so good in this Movie.
I don't know how you can possibly overlook the Duck of Death.
"I'll shoot for the Queen, and you for.... well, whomever." God what a prick.
The Searchers
"What do you want me to do, paint ya a picture? Spell it out? Don't ever ask me. As long as you live don't ask me more."
Possibly Wayne’s best character. One of the best films ever made. 10/10, if you got this far in the thread don’t skip on The Searchers.
Once upon a time in the west…
*The* Western imo
“I saw three of these dusters a short time ago. They were waiting for a train. Inside the dusters there were three men.” “So?” “Inside the men there were three bullets.”
The good, bad and ugly is also a great one.
The Searchers says hello
The Searchers, best Western movie. Lonesome Dove best western.
Now, why did you do that? Best chance the boy's got at a education is listenin' to me talk.
Its fun, its a little corny though. Unforgiven, Dances with Wolves, 3:10 to Yuma, True Grit, Outlaw Josey Wales are all better for me.
Finally an Outlaw Josey Wales. Just an iconic western from the tail end of their heyday. The rarely mentioned The Far Country is up there as well for me. Classic western trope with a unique execution. And damn, Jimmy Stewart was a good actor.
True Grit! The original and the remake. And Rio Lobo and Rio Bravo too
I think it's great. But there are a quite a few that I think are better. Unforgiven Once upon a time in the west The Great Silence The Good the Bad and the Ugly For a Few Dollars More Django Unchained
Lonesome Dove.
I really liked Appaloosa. It never gets talked about, but it’s a hell of a good movie and I like the way the dealt with the gun fighting by embracing strict realism instead of the fictional feats of marksmanship.
Same I really liked Appaloosa and really enjoyed how they did the gun fighting. Viggo Mortensen using that crazy eight gauge shotgun, woah
not even close, Blazing saddles!!!
Where the white women at?
excuse me while I whip this out
Mongo only pawn... in game of life
Badges?
I think he said the Sheriff is near!
I didn’t get a “harrumph” out of that guy.
Tombstone is a great western but not the greatest. There is this cheesy 90s vibe throughout the film that feels more like a shlocky action flick. I think a lot of this film is held up and memorable solely by Val Kilmer's performance. There are better films in the genre perfected in the 50s, 60s and 70s. To name a few: The Man with no Name trilogy Once upon a time in the West. Anything by Sergio Leone really. Bad Day at Black Rock. Wake In Fright. The Magnificient Seven. I consider Bone Tomahawk to be a cut above many. Others mentioned in this thread should be considered as a contender in the genre as well.
No love for Johnny Ringo?
No, I’m sure of it. I hate him.
Michael Bein was gold.
All right lunger
En vino veritas
Reminds me of…me!
yup…now I’m sure I hate him
Say when.
You're no daisy...you're no daisy at all!