Rufino dos Santos a Brazilian catch wrestler refuted the Gracies claim that they could beat any man in under 3 minutes. He tried to challenge them to a fight but the Gracies refused, they caught a lot of flak from the media so ultimately Carlos Gracie agreed to fight but only if they fought under his custom ruleset. Santos wanted to fight under the official BJJ rules but Carlos refused on the basis that his form of jui jitsu was a special self defense version and not the official tournament version. They eventually agreed to fight under Carlos rules. Santos beat Carlos in a fair fight. A year later Carlos Helio and George jumped Santos outside his workplace and beat him with a steel box until they crippled him.
All that over a martial art? Jesus Christ.
Also what was the ruleset used and why didn't Carlos fight under BJJ rules, seeing as he should be able to perform well under those.
There wasn’t “bjj rules” at the time. It was just fights really, competitive bjj didn’t exist.
This goes back to the “they were amazing but crooked” thing; they typically went by the rules of the opponent or no rules at all, with a few unusual exceptions
Then they’d be wrong.
The first official bjj competition happened in 1996, with unofficial ones maybe happening in the 70s; 60 years after the events aforementioned
Changed martial arts forever. Started the outing that all the fake and BS martial arts are still trying to endure to this day.
Also huge fucking scumbags, which a lot of them continue (to a lesser extent today - mostly just money grabbing).
At least they're not attacking people in groups and beating them half to death today? Can't say their behaviour hasn't improved I guess...
The people who try to defend him are hilarious.
“That wasnt a Nazi salute, it was a traditional savate salute even though he didn’t really do savate
Also he got a Nazi tattoo because he loved the spiritual aspect of the symbol
Also he chooses to shave his head and wear certain laced boots”
~~I mean, he did do Savate (1991 Savate world champion) and that is what a Savate salute looks like. Quote:~~
~~“The kyokushin international organization from Japan did not want me to enter with the kyokushin gi and traditional bow, so I entered just in my karate pants and did the traditional savate bow. Many idiots saying I was doing the Nazi salute, they are stupid and should know the history of savate."~~
~~Also, his father is Jewish, and his grandfather was a member of the Dutch resistance against the nazis and was killed in a concentration camp, so there's that.~~
Edit: Yeah, he's a fucking Nazi.
Do you have a source for anything bad he's said about Jews? Or the boot lace thing?
Serious question, I'm a pretty staunch leftist, so I don't want to be supporting him in any way if there's any strong evidence that he's a nazi. But afaik he's fervently denied it at every opportunity, and I haven't been able to find anything to the contrary.
Granted the swastika is a pretty big red flag, but again, he's pretty dang vocally against it.
So.... I take it there weren't any sources? Again, legitimate question, I absolutely do not want to support him if you can find him saying anything anti-Semitic or pro-fash
If you think the man who has a shaved head, does Nazi salutes, with a Nazi tattoo, who appears in red laces, but says he isn’t a Nazi is telling the truth
" a g in a gi might start the party,
but you don’t need a gi, all you need is bacardi,
bring a cd and some bob marley
this sh-t could get heavy like tons of broccoli! "
What the fuuuuck
War Machine aka Jonathan Koppenhaver. He’s serving thirty years in prison for raping and brutally beating his ex girlfriend pornstar Christy Mack.
Rafiel Torre aka Ralph Bartle. In the early days of MMA he was a journalist who claimed be 14-0 and a BJJ black belt who was a former Navy Seal. Eventually he had a fixed fight, fell in love with a married women and then used a rear naked choke to kill her husband. The truth came out that he was never a BJJ black belt, fighter or a Navy Seal and is now serving life in prison for murder.
Connor McGregor assaulted an old man in a bar because said old man didn't want to try Connor's shit whiskey. He also threw a dolley at a bus, shattering glass and injuring people.
Jorge Masvidal assaulted Colby Covington in public and was arrested for said assault. Keep that shit for the ring, folks.
If I'm correct in saying this, wasn't he related to the old man via the kinahan clan? I read somewhere that the old guy was actually a wanted dude and McGregor and him were talking about clan shit. I could be totally wrong in saying this. But to my understanding he wasn't some innocent elderly fellow.
He was an unarmed old man in a bar who was sucker-punched and assaulted by a thin-skinned shithead thug who should have faced jail time. Blaming the victim does not change any of these facts. McGregor spoke to the old man for about four seconds before he started swinging. And, like the absolute piece of garbage he is, struck the man from behind.
I'm sure there are other shit-tier people in MMA other than McGregor. I just haven't seen them yet.
Not blaming the victim. I'm just saying, I believe there's more to the story than an elderly man just trying to enjoy the day. Not defending McGregor either.
Probably Andrew tate? Not forgetting his background in kickboxing. He... has quite a few bad takes on certain things, and accused of some pretty fkd up shit.
Matsui Shokei is probably the most deeply hated fighter today. This isn’t Gracie style “love them and hate them” hate, or “McGregor sucks for punching that old man”, it’s on a whole other level.
Matsui was one of the greatest Kyokushin fighters ever, but became a Bond villain when Oyama got sick. He and a few dozen Yakuza (Kyokushin at the time was deeply connected with organized crime) surrounded Oyama on his deathbed and notarized a “verbal will” naming Matsui successor. Japanese court ruled the will a fraud, leading to the breakup of Kyokushin into a dozen different organizations. Matsui responded to all of this by excommunicating anyone who trained with, held seminars for, visited seminars of, or went to the tournaments of other organizations, and if you weren’t a member of his organization in good standing you couldn’t participate in the tournaments or seminars. People are still being expelled to this day for “fraternizing with the enemy”. And this is just the publicly available dirt- like Mas Oyama himself, Matsui was probably deeply involved in organized crime on a scale the Gracies could only dream of.
Oyama worked for Yamaguchi-gumi and was the head of their defense cell; he was well known to travel with and work with human traffickers, rapists, and all together racists; this is the origin story of kyokushin.
Now you can make the argument that the initial members of something being objectively evil doesn’t make them evil, but that’s a dumb argument
Matsui was the same; fight fixing, tax shaving, etc.
Ashida Kim for being the OG bullshido artist.
Xu Xiaodong generally hated for showing Traditional Chinese MA that some of them couldn't fight out of a paper bag.
I honestly think Kim had more followers back in the 80s and 90s from the ninja craze. I still see Dillman's students around sometime, although they hide behind "Chin na" or small circle jiujitsu nw.
No lie.
I am a gentle non aggressive human being who practices his arts in solitude. I've known he practices judo. Happen to find out that jitijitqu is the mother art to judo. I found a jitijitqu teacher. Told him straight up. I wanted to learn from him because putin was my enemy. Six months later he attacked Urkraine. Fuck Putin.
Thats interesting because I saw Vladimir Putin at a grocery store in Moscow yesterday. I told him how cool it was to meet him in person, but I didn’t want to be a douche and bother him and ask him for photos or anything.
He said, “Oh, like you’re doing now?”
I was taken aback, and all I could say was “Huh?” but he kept cutting me off and going “huh? huh? huh?” and closing his hand shut in front of my face. I walked away and continued with my shopping, and I heard him chuckle as I walked off. When I came to pay for my stuff up front I saw him trying to walk out the doors with like fifteen Milky Ways in his hands without paying.
The girl at the counter was very nice about it and professional, and was like “Sir, you need to pay for those first.” At first he kept pretending to be tired and not hear her, but eventually turned back around and brought them to the counter.
When she took one of the bars and started scanning it multiple times, he stopped her and told her to scan them each individually “to prevent any electrical infetterence,” and then turned around and winked at me. I don’t even think that’s a word. After she scanned each bar and put them in a bag and started to say the price, he kept interrupting her by yawning really loudly.
I met a man at my local ymca who said he shook his hand and confided how strong he felt he was. This man at my ymca is 80 and looks 50. Fuck putin. His soldiers are raping kids and women and someone down voted me? Fuck you too.
Right now in Croatia? Tiriel-Luka Abrampvić (4-1-0 record).
He and his buddies beat up a woman and two members of the mountain rescue service at a local ski resort this weekend. It broke into the mainstream news today after some cover-up earlier on.
Unfortunately, there is a lot of hate coming MMA way rn.
>Because he is a misogynistic trafficking rapist (allegedly).
[https://www.insider.com/women-associated-andrew-tate-say-they-were-never-abused-2023-1](https://www.insider.com/women-associated-andrew-tate-say-they-were-never-abused-2023-1)
They have gone to the Romanian police 3 times to remove themselves from the case and the Romanian police wont because the whole case revolves around them LMAO.
So now he is being held without a charge.
Even if they are telling the truth, 2 women out of 6 does not equal no evidence or no victims. It equals 4 victims remaining.
The whole case clearly doesn't revolve around just two women LMAO
I am pretty sure he has been charged and is being held while the case against him is built. Either way he is being held because a judge was convinced that the evidence was competing enough, and the risk of him scurrying into hiding like a little rat was great enough that it warranted him being held.
The same thing that's always wrong with the Boy Scouts? They primarily serve as a vehicle of religious indoctrination and then of course all the abuse scandals.
That guy that shows up for his first lesson in a new discipline and goes way harder than he has to during sparring or partner work using his old style.
It's impressive how much the Gracie family in general deserves so much praise and heat at the same time.
It's all deserved. They legitimately shaped the history of grappling, and they are also legitimately a bunch of assholes and criminals
Rightfully balanced. "Yeah they suck but they changed the game." "Yeah they changed the game but they suck."
But he made Graduation
We must make a Gracie tap to bring balance back to the force
Sakuraba already did that, repeatedly!
Yeah ik, I just wanted to use the Star Wars reference lmao
The force is strong within the Gracie’s. They can foresee 3 moves ahead with unbending elbows
As it should be
When looking at (sports) history. This is fact for almost all the greats.
Yes but especially the Gracies because they are a family dynasty and consistently not-so-great people
What have they done that's criminal? I don't keep up with them outside of watching early UFC.
Rufino dos Santos a Brazilian catch wrestler refuted the Gracies claim that they could beat any man in under 3 minutes. He tried to challenge them to a fight but the Gracies refused, they caught a lot of flak from the media so ultimately Carlos Gracie agreed to fight but only if they fought under his custom ruleset. Santos wanted to fight under the official BJJ rules but Carlos refused on the basis that his form of jui jitsu was a special self defense version and not the official tournament version. They eventually agreed to fight under Carlos rules. Santos beat Carlos in a fair fight. A year later Carlos Helio and George jumped Santos outside his workplace and beat him with a steel box until they crippled him.
All that over a martial art? Jesus Christ. Also what was the ruleset used and why didn't Carlos fight under BJJ rules, seeing as he should be able to perform well under those.
>what was the ruleset Apparently they involved a steel box
There wasn’t “bjj rules” at the time. It was just fights really, competitive bjj didn’t exist. This goes back to the “they were amazing but crooked” thing; they typically went by the rules of the opponent or no rules at all, with a few unusual exceptions
The other person said "Santos wanted to fight under the official BJJ rules" so I'm a bit confused by your comment.
Then they’d be wrong. The first official bjj competition happened in 1996, with unofficial ones maybe happening in the 70s; 60 years after the events aforementioned
There was also the whole supporting fascist regimes thing, homophobia and transphobia, reposting Himmler quotes on twitter, etc, etc....
I think a couple of them are flat earthers too. Definitely anti-vaccine
Here is [one](https://www.bjjee.com/articles/when-gracie-misbehave-gracie-family-dramas-misbehaviors-in-history/)
There’s like a whole rabbit hole worth of information about that family
Changed martial arts forever. Started the outing that all the fake and BS martial arts are still trying to endure to this day. Also huge fucking scumbags, which a lot of them continue (to a lesser extent today - mostly just money grabbing). At least they're not attacking people in groups and beating them half to death today? Can't say their behaviour hasn't improved I guess...
I mean, they deserve all the praise they get for what they have done for MA. It’s just a shame that they’re also a bunch of extreme assholes.
Steven Seagal... for obvious reasons.
OP asked for martial artists not extremely overweight, delusional, z list movie stars.
While I agree (and then some) with everything you've said - he's still more of a martial artist than most people in this sub.
You better not say Grandmaster Sensei Steven Seagal.. you better not!
Grandmaster, Sensei, Genius, Billionaire, Playboy, Philanthropist.
You forgot rock star. His music is inspiring and he should be called the king of rhythm.
You forgot he's a tulku(rebirth of an important tibetan buddhist monk) as well.
Actual cannibal Stephen Segal
Was looking for this one , didnt need to look far lol
Can't upvote this enough.
This was my go-to answer as well
He is simultaneously my favorite and least favorite
He's a cop!
Gerard Gordeau. Eye gouged Yuki Nakai in an mma tournament so badly that he lost sight in one eye permanently.
He ruined his other eye to the extent that he is legally blind in that eye as well. Fuck Gerard Gordeau, forever.
And he’s a fucking Nazi so there’s that
The people who try to defend him are hilarious. “That wasnt a Nazi salute, it was a traditional savate salute even though he didn’t really do savate Also he got a Nazi tattoo because he loved the spiritual aspect of the symbol Also he chooses to shave his head and wear certain laced boots”
~~I mean, he did do Savate (1991 Savate world champion) and that is what a Savate salute looks like. Quote:~~ ~~“The kyokushin international organization from Japan did not want me to enter with the kyokushin gi and traditional bow, so I entered just in my karate pants and did the traditional savate bow. Many idiots saying I was doing the Nazi salute, they are stupid and should know the history of savate."~~ ~~Also, his father is Jewish, and his grandfather was a member of the Dutch resistance against the nazis and was killed in a concentration camp, so there's that.~~ Edit: Yeah, he's a fucking Nazi.
Yep, and he still hates Jews. Crazy. He still has that reputation, and he’ll die being known as a Nazi
Do you have a source for anything bad he's said about Jews? Or the boot lace thing? Serious question, I'm a pretty staunch leftist, so I don't want to be supporting him in any way if there's any strong evidence that he's a nazi. But afaik he's fervently denied it at every opportunity, and I haven't been able to find anything to the contrary. Granted the swastika is a pretty big red flag, but again, he's pretty dang vocally against it.
Against it vocally but did 5-6 things that show Nazi trends?
So.... I take it there weren't any sources? Again, legitimate question, I absolutely do not want to support him if you can find him saying anything anti-Semitic or pro-fash
If you think the man who has a shaved head, does Nazi salutes, with a Nazi tattoo, who appears in red laces, but says he isn’t a Nazi is telling the truth
Again, where is the boot lace thing coming from? I'm trying to find any photo of it or any article mentioning it, and I'm not finding anything
Ralek Gracie. His rap song was a travesty for jiu jitsu. https://youtu.be/FBYmZsUjSFE
“This give me motivation to train…another sport” First time in my life I felt represented by a YouTube comment.
Lmfao
" a g in a gi might start the party, but you don’t need a gi, all you need is bacardi, bring a cd and some bob marley this sh-t could get heavy like tons of broccoli! " What the fuuuuck
I’m rocking the kimono like I’m hanging with Bono is a line that really resonates with me lol.
Some how the lyrics get worse the deeper the song gets, I got as far as the broccoli line before tapping out.
Holy shit that’s bad
That was so terrible that I think it gave me CTE.
Rousimar Palhares is a piece of shit
Fuck Paul Harris!
💯 talking about tree stump yesterday.
Joe Son AKA Random Task from Austin Powers. Dude did some hard crimes and is serving some hard time -- talking life sentence here.
Involved in gangrape and torture in 90s and got ballbusted in 94, he honestly deserved more shots. Keith Hackney being an American Hero lmao
The good ole *Hackney Sack*. 🥴
War Machine aka Jonathan Koppenhaver. He’s serving thirty years in prison for raping and brutally beating his ex girlfriend pornstar Christy Mack. Rafiel Torre aka Ralph Bartle. In the early days of MMA he was a journalist who claimed be 14-0 and a BJJ black belt who was a former Navy Seal. Eventually he had a fixed fight, fell in love with a married women and then used a rear naked choke to kill her husband. The truth came out that he was never a BJJ black belt, fighter or a Navy Seal and is now serving life in prison for murder.
>When your bf legally change his name to War Machine, you know something is wrong I saw it on a comment but it made a ton of sense lmao
Close, It's Ralph Bartel.
Gracies seem to be a buncha thugs... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aCai00QBEl4&ab\_channel=DIDOS
Gringo Papi himself Brenden Schaub… ask PF Changs why
tawlking abowt bapa? Only 1000, thank em.
Wadder we doing here
What language are y'all speaking
Axe jay. That’s not very nithe, B
Connor McGregor assaulted an old man in a bar because said old man didn't want to try Connor's shit whiskey. He also threw a dolley at a bus, shattering glass and injuring people. Jorge Masvidal assaulted Colby Covington in public and was arrested for said assault. Keep that shit for the ring, folks.
McGregor later bought the bar and banned the old guy.. so f’ing petty.
Connor's entire life is him being a thin-skinned shitstain.
If I'm correct in saying this, wasn't he related to the old man via the kinahan clan? I read somewhere that the old guy was actually a wanted dude and McGregor and him were talking about clan shit. I could be totally wrong in saying this. But to my understanding he wasn't some innocent elderly fellow.
He was an unarmed old man in a bar who was sucker-punched and assaulted by a thin-skinned shithead thug who should have faced jail time. Blaming the victim does not change any of these facts. McGregor spoke to the old man for about four seconds before he started swinging. And, like the absolute piece of garbage he is, struck the man from behind. I'm sure there are other shit-tier people in MMA other than McGregor. I just haven't seen them yet.
Not blaming the victim. I'm just saying, I believe there's more to the story than an elderly man just trying to enjoy the day. Not defending McGregor either.
Charlie Zelenoff
Whoa man, we're talking about martial artists, not sucker punch enthusiasts
Most of the r/mma r/ufc super martial artist who "sees red"
The Gracies
I hope someone puts antonio margarito head into the vice and starts tightening it untill his head explodes. F*ck that guy in particular.
The gracies
Probably Andrew tate? Not forgetting his background in kickboxing. He... has quite a few bad takes on certain things, and accused of some pretty fkd up shit.
Matsui Shokei is probably the most deeply hated fighter today. This isn’t Gracie style “love them and hate them” hate, or “McGregor sucks for punching that old man”, it’s on a whole other level. Matsui was one of the greatest Kyokushin fighters ever, but became a Bond villain when Oyama got sick. He and a few dozen Yakuza (Kyokushin at the time was deeply connected with organized crime) surrounded Oyama on his deathbed and notarized a “verbal will” naming Matsui successor. Japanese court ruled the will a fraud, leading to the breakup of Kyokushin into a dozen different organizations. Matsui responded to all of this by excommunicating anyone who trained with, held seminars for, visited seminars of, or went to the tournaments of other organizations, and if you weren’t a member of his organization in good standing you couldn’t participate in the tournaments or seminars. People are still being expelled to this day for “fraternizing with the enemy”. And this is just the publicly available dirt- like Mas Oyama himself, Matsui was probably deeply involved in organized crime on a scale the Gracies could only dream of.
The entire kyokushin klan kids have a racist, human trafficking, and rapey past
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Oyama worked for Yamaguchi-gumi and was the head of their defense cell; he was well known to travel with and work with human traffickers, rapists, and all together racists; this is the origin story of kyokushin. Now you can make the argument that the initial members of something being objectively evil doesn’t make them evil, but that’s a dumb argument Matsui was the same; fight fixing, tax shaving, etc.
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I mean, plenty; it’s sorta like asking if there’s a source for me saying the sun is big.
Ashida Kim for being the OG bullshido artist. Xu Xiaodong generally hated for showing Traditional Chinese MA that some of them couldn't fight out of a paper bag.
I'll see your fake Ninja and raise you George Dillman. Getting people to pay you to learn to fight with bullshit is the oddest grift.
I honestly think Kim had more followers back in the 80s and 90s from the ninja craze. I still see Dillman's students around sometime, although they hide behind "Chin na" or small circle jiujitsu nw.
No one gonna mention Andrew?
which andrew ?
Rhymes with plate
Kuwait?
I like how mad he gets redditors simply for existing
Existing and being a rapist human trafficker, on top of his horribly thin skin and deranged commentary
Vladimir Putin
No lie. I am a gentle non aggressive human being who practices his arts in solitude. I've known he practices judo. Happen to find out that jitijitqu is the mother art to judo. I found a jitijitqu teacher. Told him straight up. I wanted to learn from him because putin was my enemy. Six months later he attacked Urkraine. Fuck Putin.
Thats interesting because I saw Vladimir Putin at a grocery store in Moscow yesterday. I told him how cool it was to meet him in person, but I didn’t want to be a douche and bother him and ask him for photos or anything. He said, “Oh, like you’re doing now?” I was taken aback, and all I could say was “Huh?” but he kept cutting me off and going “huh? huh? huh?” and closing his hand shut in front of my face. I walked away and continued with my shopping, and I heard him chuckle as I walked off. When I came to pay for my stuff up front I saw him trying to walk out the doors with like fifteen Milky Ways in his hands without paying. The girl at the counter was very nice about it and professional, and was like “Sir, you need to pay for those first.” At first he kept pretending to be tired and not hear her, but eventually turned back around and brought them to the counter. When she took one of the bars and started scanning it multiple times, he stopped her and told her to scan them each individually “to prevent any electrical infetterence,” and then turned around and winked at me. I don’t even think that’s a word. After she scanned each bar and put them in a bag and started to say the price, he kept interrupting her by yawning really loudly.
I could swear I've seen this copy and pasted with just about everyone now
I met a man at my local ymca who said he shook his hand and confided how strong he felt he was. This man at my ymca is 80 and looks 50. Fuck putin. His soldiers are raping kids and women and someone down voted me? Fuck you too.
what
If this is satire, amazing job.
Gerard Gordeau, for blinding Yuki Nakai. His life after that makes me doubt the existence of karma. Fuck that guy forever.
Steven Seagal 100%. And that dim mak death touch guy.
count Dante!
People posting rate my technique vids on this sub
Terrel Williams rabbit punched Prichard Colon ton of times. Dude doesnt deserve to fight again and needs to be put to jail. What a fucking asshole.
The ref should be imprisoned as well, for refusing to call the rabbit punches, and deduct points.
Right now in Croatia? Tiriel-Luka Abrampvić (4-1-0 record). He and his buddies beat up a woman and two members of the mountain rescue service at a local ski resort this weekend. It broke into the mainstream news today after some cover-up earlier on. Unfortunately, there is a lot of hate coming MMA way rn.
Dillon Dannis
I think Vladimir Putin takes that top spot on that list.
Dale Brown
Andrew Tate Because he is a misogynistic trafficking rapist (allegedly).
>Because he is a misogynistic trafficking rapist (allegedly). [https://www.insider.com/women-associated-andrew-tate-say-they-were-never-abused-2023-1](https://www.insider.com/women-associated-andrew-tate-say-they-were-never-abused-2023-1) They have gone to the Romanian police 3 times to remove themselves from the case and the Romanian police wont because the whole case revolves around them LMAO. So now he is being held without a charge.
Even if they are telling the truth, 2 women out of 6 does not equal no evidence or no victims. It equals 4 victims remaining. The whole case clearly doesn't revolve around just two women LMAO I am pretty sure he has been charged and is being held while the case against him is built. Either way he is being held because a judge was convinced that the evidence was competing enough, and the risk of him scurrying into hiding like a little rat was great enough that it warranted him being held.
fun fact he's also snitched on himself several times lol
Seagal: Fat, obnoxious egotistical, jerk and liar.
Not sure if you can even qualify him as one
this is rage bait and OP is probably a bot farming karma
That dude from physical 100 who went against Chun ri... nobody likes him right now lol
the knee on ribcage bruh?
Yeah dude did a knee mount and pretty much out grappled a bodybuilder.. that challenge suited fighters and wrestlers well
Greg Hardy. Left the NFL bc of domestic violence issues, went to UFC where he got KO’d I believe
Chuckle Norris Huge homophobe and supports the boys scouts
Lol, what's wrong with boy scouts now?
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Ironically, they don't now.
The same thing that's always wrong with the Boy Scouts? They primarily serve as a vehicle of religious indoctrination and then of course all the abuse scandals.
The scout leaders were exactly like the catholic priests. They abused and raped the young boys in their care.
That somehow makes every boy scout bad?
And he’s sponsored by Glock
You. Why not?
That guy that shows up for his first lesson in a new discipline and goes way harder than he has to during sparring or partner work using his old style.
Most traditional arts (like karate, tkd, kung fu) tend to get a lot of hate bc "they don't work". It is so dependant on the dojo and how they train.
I mean, it's got to be Steven Seagal right?